 It's Wednesday. It's 11 o'clock. It's August the 25th, 2021. Welcome to What Now America. I'm Tim Appichell, your host. Today's title for the show is Fox News Promoted Cow D. Wormer versus vaccine. You know, on Saturday, August 21st, just recently, the FDA, the Federal Drug Administration, had to post on their Twitter account a message, a message to stop a home concocted COVID treatment, a poison, a cow and horse parasite D. Wormer product, a product that you buy at your local feed store. And this poison has been taken by many people in Alabama, in fact, 21 of them to be specific, and also caused a 70% increase in cause of the poison control center in Mississippi. So here's the message that the FDA had to post to discourage this drug called Ivermectin to be consumed by human beings. The quote is the following. You are not a horse. You are not a cow. Seriously, y'all, stop it. That was a food and drug administration, FDA, right? Yeah. I mean, Jay, I like the kind of the folksy, homesy approach because they're talking to an audience in Alabama and Mississippi. So regardless of y'all, it's ridiculous that they have to post this in the first place. But how did this come to be? I'm going to read three quotes. How did this all start? Well, let's go to Fox and their most popular show host, Tucker Carlson, Laurel Ingram and Sean Hannity. And I'm going to read three quotes because you're something called cause effect. Someone starts something and it makes an effect. And I could show direct causal relations between quotes these guys make and advice they're giving on the show and the consumption of a poison, Ivermectin. Here's what Tucker Carlson said. Benefits of a drug called Ivermectin, which can and is used around the world to treat and prevent the spread of the coronavirus. Laura Ingram, we know our FDA has failed us by not allowing hydrochloroquine or Ivermectin, both of which are used around the world to ease COVID hospitalizations and death. My favorite Sean Hannity, Ivermectin, as well as other proactive treatments and practices, which is already helping COVID-19 patients all across the country. And with that, I'm going to go to my guests. Today we have Jay Fidel and Winston Welch. Good morning. Straight to you, Jay. Jay, the FCC, the FDA, in fact, the FDA was originally created to stop quack medicine. That's kind of why they were put into place the first in the first time many, many, many decades ago to stop quack medicine and the poisoning of Americans. The FCC and the FDA, why aren't they stopping these show hosts from recommending basically what is a poison and is putting people in the hospital, at least two or three at least. When is Fox going to be held accountable for their quack medicine recommendations? There's truly two questions there. The first is why aren't they stopping them? And I'm sure that there are statutes and regulations that will permit the FDA to stop them, write a letter at least. But we haven't heard about a letter, have we? We haven't heard that aside from that Siri you all thing. I mean, imagine a government agency sending a note like that. What was their justification, you all? The justification was they were talking to people who understood the language better in that context. That's why they did that, but that's ridiculous. This is the United States. Anyway, so they didn't do anything. They could have done something. They could have at least written a letter and maybe taken them to court, but they didn't do that. So what you have is hundreds of thousands, even millions of people being exposed to a falsehood about drugs. It's snake oil or worse because it has deleterious effects on people. And already we have people in the hospital over ivermectin. So that's the one thing. And so it's right now it's unanswerable. Maybe Joe Biden doesn't have enough time to initiate or cause them to initiate action, but somebody sure should. And the other thing, and it struck me when you raised the subject in the first place, Tim, if I watch Fox News and I take this advice and I take this misinformation as true, and I have ivermectin in whatever proportions they are suggesting, all deadly, and I get sick or I die, this is not really rhetorical. Don't I have a really good lawsuit against them? This is like the lies they were putting out on the voting machines not too long ago. They know it's a lie. They have no evidence. They could never ever establish the truth of what you read there, never. And yet they know also that their loyal base believes it, acts in reliance on their credibility, and does it all to their damage and detriment. It's at least fraud and possibly it's murder if someone dies relying on that advice. So there is no excuse whatsoever here. And we should be waiting on a lawyer, representing somebody who got sick or died as a result of this horse medicine. I suppose the defense would be you should have known that something built for parasites has no effect whatsoever on viruses. It's a completely different world. Why, you stupid guy, why did you do that even though we told you? I don't think that defense is going to work. I agree. You know, here's the hypocrisy of the whole thing is that Fox as a corporation requires all their hosts to be vaccinated. And you don't see a proactive pushing of the vaccines, even though Laura Ingram, Tucker Carlson, Sean Hannity have been vaccinated. It's kind of like Donald Trump, he's been vaccinated. Yet just recently, he was pushing that concept again about hydrochloroquine. Incredible. Let me go to another point on this, Tim, and that is it's the Groundhog's Day, the movie and the phenomenon and waking up every morning and finding the same movie as playing. This also came up in the Marathon Man with Dustin Hoffman, where he thought he was out of the woods and, you know, they drove him right back to work on his teeth some more. And what you have is a repetition of the same thing that happened last year with these phony medicines coming from Trump and people believe it and they try to take it and it injures them and doesn't help them in any way whatsoever. And I find it extraordinary that they, although he has said he took the vaccine, although he has suggested in very mild terms, they take the vaccine recently. What amazes me is they still reject that and they boo him for saying that. And he still, you know, talks about these snake oil medicines. Extraordinary. It's like, you know what it's like, Tim, like they want to be lied to. These people are inviting the lie. The lie gives them comfort. It's part of their cult experience. They're not happy unless people align to them. Well, Laura Ingram actually set the stage months and months and months ago, basically trying to imply that the federal government is tamping down hydrochloroquine and tamping down ivermectin because they don't want, because it's a cheap solution. And, you know, the pharmaceuticals have to make lots of money because, you know, they contribute to political action campaigns and political campaigns. And, you know, so we have to make sure that the pharmaceutical companies make lots of money and they wouldn't want to have a cheap and ineffective product like hydrochloroquine and ivermectin. So this cabal that this information has been suppressed by the government has led into this conspiracy that these kind of quack medicines, these poisons, were actually effective. And this is ridiculous. I got to stop because I'm going to tongue-tie myself and get off my soapbox. I'm going to go right to Winston on this one. Winston. Yes, sir. Good morning. Hey, you know, the FCC, in an unanimous decision, just announced a five million dollar fine for a group that was race-baiting in some robo-calls. A five million that the most finds that the FCC has ever imposed on anyone in history. And what also was rare, it was a unanimous decision to come up with this fine. Where is the FCC in stopping Fox News, in your opinion? It's the same question I asked Jay. But if FCC, are they starting to wake up, are starting to realize that what people say on quote, a news station, unquote, is actually causing damage and harm to the American public? Well, I don't think you're going to see the FCC cracking down on Fox News anytime soon. You know what might be interesting? I have to ask the question why, especially when they're promoting a cow and horse dewormer as an effective cure for COVID. Why? Why can't they do that? Well, I think what they're promoting is a distrust in the government and that someone's out to get you and they're not saying take two pills in the morning and call me next week. What they're saying is the government's hiding this and big farmers hiding this. So it goes into their narrative of where are the ones you can trust to bring you the truth here at the news. But Winston, let me add something that Tim said. These guys reported that everybody in the country was taking these medicines. That is simply not true. That is intended to get them to take these medicines, you know, go along with the huge crowd that's taking these medicines. They could never prove that. That's a lie. But if Tucker has a report that three people across the country were prescribed this by their veterinarian somehow who believes in all of this and they're actually taking it and he says there's people all over the country and that's three people that he had a report of somebody faxing into of taking ivermectin. And in fact, we have absolute many stories across the nation of people stripping farm supply stores of ivermectin and dosing themselves. That's why the y'all think I don't know about that. I mean, that was obviously a dig at people from the south. But do you think those same people that are taking ivermectin are going to believe the very people who the conspiracy is supposedly about? I don't think so. So this is, I mean, if you're taking this stuff and you're going to the farm supply store to buy your ivermectin, Fox isn't going to put themselves in a position where they're saying take two pills and call me in the morning. If they do that, then they will be sued by someone who takes two pills in the morning and then and then calls them. So they're not doing that. It's just part of this narrative. Believe us. I mean, even when the Donald got booed in Alabama, like you were saying, maybe people want to believe in the lie, I'm not sure that's it. But but the fact that he got booed to say take the vaccine, my first thought was, I wonder if he is bought a lot of stock in Pfizer or something at this point. That's that's what the only thing that made sense to me. Because otherwise, why would he be contributing to get asking folks to get vaccinated? That that one actually didn't make sense. And he was seemed to be off point there. So that's it. That's an aside there. But as far as the SBC goes, I don't know. I mean, when we have people, when Fox really is doing such a disservice to the nation, you know, our laws are set up such that I don't think that they're required to tell the truth about anything as far as I can understand from what's been going on these last few years. And the truth is it depends on whose truth it is. Is it real truth? Is it an alternative truth? Is it specific? Well, okay, let me go to that point to make a distinction between what what a lawyer does representing somebody who got sick with ivermectin. And the government has a harder time, you know, First Amendment considerations and all that. The other thing about the FCC, which you didn't mention is the FCC is evenly balanced, right? Of four of them. And there's two Republicans and two Democrats. I'm not sure who the chair is. The chair has a lot of sway in that. And that was one of the things that Rachel Maddow, you know, went into yesterday when she reported on this. She said, the amazing thing, there's not only the five million dollar fine, by the way, which is not final yet. They have to go through some process to make it final, not quite final. But it's that it's that they never agree on anything. And this is a politicized issue. So the remarkable thing is, they, you know, they agreed, there were not only three votes, there were four votes. And we have to sit here really the three of us and try to figure out why they did that, why they crossed this line and became non-political on this particular issue. As for a lawyer who represents somebody who took the horse medicine and got sick, if it's not true, and they knew it's not true, and they knew, and they knew, you know, yeah, and they knew this guy, this person, the client would rely on it. That's a good lawsuit. Yeah, I would, I would think so. I'd love to be an attorney and have that one. I'd actually use it as a class action, not just an individual lawsuit. Winston, to stay on this topic, you know, Facebook and Twitter, they have, you know, they have prohibited people's accounts, Donald Trump has been one of them, for stating untruths about COVID and the nature of the virus, and its cures or treatments. Now, I know Facebook and Twitter are not the federal government, but if they can block them off, why can't the federal government take a page out of that book and start getting tough? And maybe it is, Jay, that these four people on the board for FCC, maybe they've all come to an understanding that harm is being done by false information, and these news show hosts of promoting poisons for human consumption. Well, Jay, I mean, excuse me, Winston, your thoughts about Facebook and Twitter blocking people's accounts for the very same thing and the possibility of FCC getting stronger and more, more aggressive about false reporting. Well, Facebook and Twitter are not governmental entities, and we have freedom of speech here, and Facebook has the freedom of speech in its own corporate structure to decide what it will and will not allow. I thought, what was it, for fans only, reverse themselves on not putting on X-rated content when they realize, oh, that's what everybody was going there for. So these are private companies that can decide who they want to have on their forms and they have standards that they apply on. It depends on what day of the week it is, it seems really. But I've noticed that anything with COVID now comes with any post that mentions the word COVID has a disclaimer or something on the bottom of it that says, before you share this post, notice that this is related to COVID. The facts for COVID can be found here, and I think they're basically pushing people over to the CDC website just so they have their bases covered. You can still share the information, it may be fake, it may be exactly about hypermectin, but I think they're realizing that they have some culpability here if they go ahead and allow some of these things to move forward. The robo-call thing is something different. That's something where they're going into people's homes with a call, and it's something where you're not inviting it in on your own accord. It's coming to your home with a call about whatever information. I don't agree with that. You could hang up the phone. But the Fox is where people go for America's trusted news source. This is where they are actually going to find out the real information and to find out how they're being lied to today by the government, by Anthony Fauci, by George Bush, or Bill Clinton, or Hillary, or anybody else. This is a different story, but I don't think we're going to see any action on the FCC regulating Fox at all. Now people may pull out as subscribers, but I would think that pharmaceutical companies are actually major advertisers on Fox. At the end of the day, it's on some level about getting eyes before your product. I don't know. Does Merck and Gilead and Johnson and Johnson still advertise on Fox? It's an interesting question, and if it's not... Well, maybe they should advertise that ivermectin is a poison. I mean, Merck has come out and said, don't use this. Yes, they have. It's remarkable. If you watch cable, you get ads, and you get ads for all these miracle drugs, hundreds of them all the time, every day for minutes and minutes and minutes of advertising, and they always give you the side effect, and they say, this drug can cause this, that, and the other thing and can kill you. Here's Fox reporting it as news and telling you, now it's going to help you. That's a good point. Very good point. I mean, for the record, the Food Drug Administration, by the way, thanks for that correction. It's not Federal Drug Administration. It's the Food Drug Administration. The National Institute of Health and WHO, the evolved said, ivermectin, please don't take it. It's not going to help you and possibly make you very sick or even kill you. How did we get here, Jay? Going to you about Winston's point, Donald Trump is in Alabama. He's saying, I took the vaccine, take the vaccine. I mean, and then he gets booed by his audience. How often have we seen Donald Trump booed in a red southern state about a statement he makes? What was your impression of that moment? Well, Tim and Winston, I'm here to tell you, they weren't really booing him. What they were saying, you know, there's like dog whistle kind of thing. It's a message under the message where he's saying, I mean, I'm going to tell you this because they want me to, because the Biden administration is telling me, you know, to tell you this. So I'm telling you this. But in fact, I don't believe it. In fact, I'm really not telling you this. And so what the booing is about, it's not booing Trump. Don't you agree? It's not booing Trump. It's booing those guys who forced him to say that. It's actually agreeing with him on his previous advice to them. It's not the thing of lost confidence. Yes, that makes a lot more sense to Jay, because if you look at his actual statement, he vacillates back and forth. He says, yeah, I think you could get the vaccine, but I also understand about your freedoms. And you should have the right to have the freedom. And then the freedom, and I got the vaccine, it worked for me. It might work for you. It might not. If your freedom might work for you, it might not. This mixed word salad that's so, you know, I mean, all we can expect at this point. So it's a dog whistle. The whole thing is a dog whistle. Yes. Yeah, but this dog whistle unfortunately has been going on for a year and a half and Donald Trump started it. I mean, this is why this country is up in deep kimchi, because we have so many vaccine deniers. And not because they're concerned about what the vaccine is all about because of the research of FDA or the rushed emergency use of it, not because for religious reasons, not because of medical reasons, but because of their rights and freedoms. Those folks, those folks that refuse to get a vaccine that is making things very, very uncomfortable and very, very dangerous for all our hospitals across the country. Haven't they been listening to this dog whistle for a year and a half? And that's why we're at where we're at. Jay. Going to continue to listen to the dog whistle, Tim. They're committed to him. It's a cult. He's already established some kind of diverse relationship with these people, and they are going to continue to do it. Nothing that has happened has changed them at the core of the base of it. And nothing that he says now will change it. It's very strange. And, you know, we need to study social psychology more than we have to find out why people go along with something he said a year ago, and you can't pry them off that. But that's what's happening. What's the solution, Jay? We have people with strokes, heart attacks, all sorts of procedures that need to be done, but now they can't because of hospital capacity has reached its maximum levels. What do we do? I mean, what's the solution? You have to come down on them. You have to require the vaccine for everything. You have to require the mask for everything. And, you know, one jurisdiction after another is doing that sort of thing. Although the truth is, it's unbelievable that we have hundreds of protesters in front of Josh Green, Lieutenant Governor's house, his personal condo here in Honolulu, day after day protesting that he wants to make a vaccine mandate. But I think the answer is a vaccine mandate. Enough with this. This is not so. Make the mandate. Make the mandate unmasked. Let's get through this with a mandate. And if somebody wants to, you know, blow off the mandate, let's take action against that person. Let's arrest that person. Let's find that person. Big bucks. After a while, they'll stop. Okay. Well, you got it. There's places out on our Fair Isle where the vaccination rate is hovering in the 30% even today. Even today, with all the information that people have, obviously, they're getting different information than we are. And when you have a majority of people not vaccinated, we're leaving in an alternative reality. That idea of saying, and I agree with you, of course, that we need to say, you know, if you want to work here, if you want to shop here, if you want to enter these stores, I saw that Oregon now has even instituted a mask when you're outside and can't reasonably maneuver around people, say, on a trail. That's okay. But if you're out in the, you know, an open-air shopping mall and even here in Hawaii, we have, I was at one of our open-air shopping malls and it was mostly mask-free. And I would say the majority of them were tourists. I think the locals were by and large wearing masks. But if we're to understand what our current outbreak here in Hawaii is, which is dire, and I don't know if you saw the press conference with Mayor Balenciardi, but he looked like he'd seen a ghost. And I think what happened was probably the state health director and the CDC and whoever else they have out here came to him and said, Mayor, we know you don't want to shut down things. We understand that. But we are at 100% capacity right now. So if someone that you love has a stroke, heart attack, car accident, breaks their arm, they're not getting into the hospital. It doesn't matter which hospital you choose. There's no room at the end. And we're looking at numbers now from the latest modeling that says it's going to be five times worse here in a month or a few weeks. And so you need to immediately have activities being ceasing. So it's 10 people at an indoor venue and 25 at an outdoor venue. And when you're really looking at it, these are, there's some fear factor here that's real. And whether or not people are getting vaccinated or masked, there's certain things that they can do, which is crowd capacity controls inside of shops. And so that's what they're doing. They're doing what they can. But when you're dealing with the population, I would make it mandatory. We've had enough of this insanity. I would make it mandatory. And I put the police on the street to enforce it. And then I would arrest them and fingerprint them and find them for thousands of dollars. And after a while, this will stop any other way. It's not stopping. In my world, you guys, in my world, two people. Last question, you guys, we're running out of time. Two people in my world who had vaccines have caught COVID. Two people in the last two or three days, some of whom you may know. So I mean, it's really out of control. It is. Last question, you guys, because we're running out of time. This week, the FDA has approved formally through their approval process the use of Pfizer vaccine. Does that shift numbers as far as increase of vaccinations on this island and this state? Question mark or in the country? Yes, yes, it does because the military mandated it the same day. So automatically you have whatever a population percentage here in the military that wasn't vaccinated and it was quite high. What about non military? What about the folks in Mississippi and Alabama that are taking? I'll take Winston's point on that. There are two streams of information going on. There's this stream of information from the CDC and the government telling him the vaccine has saved your life and you should take it. And then there's this other underfoot stream of information coming from who knows where. I mean, I don't know if we really know. But there is a competing stream of information telling him to blow off the vaccine. This is very true. I just read three people on the show. It's called Laurel Ingram, Tucker Carlson and Sean Hannity. Got it. Who else has a vested interest in making sure that this country's in chaos and disarray? That's all you have to look around and as well. This could be foreign agents just as much as anything so that there's no unified front. We never had this before in this nation until a few years ago when it's just come out everywhere on every topic. If aliens landed today and started eating people, you'd probably have some people point to the other side and said, oh, they made an agreement with them. They're only eating the people that got Pfizer or didn't get Pfizer or God knows what. And I'm trying to think like what would bring people together today as back to humans. But you know what? Here's your hopeful thought that I want to leave you with is that if you walking down the street and you happen to trip and fall down and there's people around you that are normal people, they're going to say, oh my goodness, let me help that poor little old man or that poor little old lady or even if you're a young lady or young man, they're going to say, are you okay? They're not going to ask you, do you watch Fox News or did you get your shot or did you vote for Donald Trump or Joe Biden? They're not going to say that. They're going to say, let me help you up. And at the core of our being, we need to go back to that place of our common humanity and what's good and really think about our impact on other people's lives. Like you said, Jay, even people that are getting vaccinated, we know quarter of them from the Los Angeles study are coming down with COVID. So even though they're doing the right things and we don't know what kinds of new viruses are incubating inside of people as well. So we need to absolutely get out the message that this is a moral, civic, personal and interpersonal thing. This is your parents. This is your aunties and your uncles and the kid down the street that you're protecting. And we need to get back to that basic sense of common decency and humanity and stop with all the BS of my freedoms or my rights or, you know, ivermectin or God knows what. We have a good solution right now, a partial solution, which is get the vaccine. It's free. It's available everywhere. They'll come to your house. They'll even give you a lollipop or a gift certificate to Jamba Juice. So I mean, it's not that hard. So we just have to appeal to common sense, common decency, common morality and ethical behavior that seems to have been like a mass amnesia, but I think it's okay. I want a last word on this. Hang on here. Before we go to you, Jay, on your last word, first off, Winston, thank you for your thoughtful and sage comments. I got to tell you, Winston, these comments are right on the numbers here. And given this political climate, I agree with you to a certain extent, Democrats will be blamed for aliens eating earthlings. They will be blamed for it. And if it's not Donald Trump blaming for it, it'll be somebody else. Maybe it's DeSantis or Governor Abbott. Someone will be blaming Democrats for everything. So Winston, thank you. Jay, your last words. I just want to respond to something that Winston said, too much of what Winston said, you know. So it's nice that we know what we ought to do, but there are people in this country that have not been affected by our wishes and dreams and expectations, are begging and pleading. They haven't been affected, and they're going to continue to do it. And the only way in the human condition where you can stop that is you've got to disrupt that. You've got to disturb that. I'll go back to your original point. If Fox News is lying, you've got to stop them from lying. You cannot call fire in a crowded movie theater. The First Amendment is not absolute. Somebody's got to stop them. It starts with the government. And maybe individual lawsuits as well. The other thing is you've got to make masks and vaccines mandate. And you've got to enforce the mandate. The Honolulu Police Department certainly has the time and energy to do this. It's priority number one. We cannot afford to have 2700 cases a day, which was the expectation you mentioned, Tim. It's going to wreck our society. It's an emergency. We've got to act in an emergent fashion. We can't beg and plead. We know that doesn't work. All right. We've run out of time. I'll tell you one thing, gentlemen. One of the reasons I love doing this show is because we have great, great guests, great ideas and great comments that in this brief 28 minutes, just far above none are just wonderful to hear. And I think you guys are doing a great service for all of us. So thank you very much for your thoughts, words, and time. I'm Tim Apachele, your host for What Now America. Please join us next Wednesday at 11 o'clock. And until then, Aloha. Thanks, Tim. Aloha.