 There we go. We're up and running. A very good afternoon, evening and possibly morning in some cases to all of you out there. It's lovely to see you. Look at the map below. You can see we've got a good representation of the world with us. We've got four continents represented, which is fantastic. So it's lovely to see you. Welcome to this Eden NAP webinar about accessibility and inclusion in this pandemic time. My name is Alistair Creelman. I work at Linnaeus University in Kalmar in the south-east of Sweden. You can zoom in on the map and find out where that is. It's my pleasure to moderate this session, so I will introduce and I will leave it to our guest speakers who have a lot of important things to tell you. I can say also that you are able to post questions and comments in the chat. You can chat with each other. And yeah, let's go. I'd like to ask our two speakers to introduce themselves briefly. First of all, Antony Lepoche, who's a fellow Eden fellow and is an associate professor at the Department of Education at Universitat Roma 3. Tell us a little bit more about your background. Yeah, yeah. Thank you. Thank you, Alistair. Thank you for your introduction. I just wanted to say, I would tell something more regarding myself, but first of all, I wanted to introduce this event as one that is part of the network of academics and professional series. Eden has this possibility of promoting a series of professional development activities within the network of academics and professionals, which supports networking of individual members of the association, of course, provides a highly effective meeting and communication forum, and it's coordinated by a steering committee that has been recently renewed, renovated, and it provides information for members on the opportunities for professional actions. I have to build up a personal portfolio, including documents resources, but first of all, promotes communication and networking. So it's a good opportunity for all of us to meet also on events like the one we are going to have today, finding new opportunities for research, development, and growth. That's for sure. The idea is to have a large community where we all take part and being part of the Eden as member institutions can help you also participate in the different conferences, have reduced fees, and possibilities to really take part in this huge and important community. As we said, we have different kinds of events within the network of academics and professionals, webinars for sure, but also possibilities to have and to interact on social media. The other thing that I wanted to tell you, but maybe we can remind it also at the end of the event, Alisa, I think you agree with me, is to remind all of you of the annual conference that is going to take place this year online. It goes virtual, of course. It is hosted by Polytechnica University, Timisoara, and it will take place from June 21st to June 24th. The topic is human and artificial intelligence for the society of the future. So it's a very, very interesting and involving topic and I really hope you all can take part in the conference because lots of very interesting papers will be presented during the conference. That was my introduction. Yes, as you said, I teach Experimental Pedagogy at the University of Roma-Treb Department of Education. I've been involved in technology in education for several years now and I've been supporting the association for many, many, many years actually and I've been part of the Eden NAP network of academic and professional being the chair of the steering committee for the last Monday. As I said, now there's a new steering committee. I've seen from participants that some of the steering committee members are there. So I thank Vlad first of all and Francesca I think is there somewhere. Anyway, we can start talking about the topic for today. Could we just let Paul say a few words just because I thought you were going to introduce him. Paul is Assistant Dean and Chief Technology Officer at Stamford University in California and he hasn't got visual contact but we can hear him. So, Paul, can you just say a few words about yourself and then Antonella can start her session. Thank you, Mr. Antonella for inviting me to this wonderful seminar. I remember doing a keynote at one of the Eden events in Ireland. I don't know how many years ago that was but I wonder if any of the participants today saw me there when I was in Ireland. I saw you and I remember very well your keynote presentation. Many years ago so time goes by very fast. Well, at Stamford, I'm in charge of a few different programs. First of all, I experiment courses with MOOCs and then I also have a team of people doing attack solutions, developing attack solutions and experimenting them and then we also have an entrepreneur in residence program. We invite experts from the industry to come in and advise our faculty and students with attack innovations and inventions, things like that. So, I hope that you will enjoy my presentation later today and then I'll be happy to answer all of your questions. So, thank you. Okay, so, well, let's hear from Paul in a little while and I'll just let Antonella get ready for, I'll just move the view so that we can see her presentation and the topic is accessibility and inclusion. And one of the, we have enormous opportunities for online learning in the world but sadly a lot of the people in the world who need online learning and need open online learning don't know it exists or can't get on board because they lack infrastructure and there are other disadvantages that prevent them from taking advantage of this, what's on offer. So Antonella, the floor is yours. Thank you. Thank you, Alistair. Thank you very much for your introduction. Yes, this is one of the main issues that we have been experiencing during this lockdown that in a way or another really harmed all of us all over the world. And from what I see from the places where the audience is based today, I can tell that the problem that this kind of issue is felt all over the world in different ways maybe but it's a problem that regards us all. So, how we are going to discuss this issue today. What kinds of solutions are available to ensuring ongoing education for marginalized groups? This is a very hot topic. It's difficult to answer this question for sure. There are different ways that we can put forward to work on that to give a solution. There are open educational initiatives. Different kinds of projects are developed within this area. You can see here in this slide a logo related to open virtual mobility and this is related to a project that we have been working on. It's a European project coordinated by Bayard University in Germany and it's a project where, for instance, open virtual mobility issues are promoted and in a way supporting virtual mobility we can cope with certain kind of limited accessibility. Another possible solution to the question that I highlighted here is related to personalized and adaptable learning. So, building learning scenarios and paths personalized for specific kinds of targets. This is what we have been working on in another project that is called Inclusive Memory that was coordinated by the Center for Museum Studies that I chair in my university at the Department of Education. If you want to know more about that we can talk about it later and I can also give you some link to the project website where we worked on devising specific learning scenarios for specific marginalized targets. Always supported by cultural valued environments. So, museum and heritage are always centered as you know what I call frank zones where you know culture and can be supportive in helping accessibility. Always you know in digitally enhanced situations. But what is the risk that we have been experiencing during this time of a pandemic during this lockdown time? The problem, the issue is educational poverty. I don't know if you have experienced it. How did you experience it? But as you can see from this definition, educational poverty is defined as the impossibility for children and teenagers to learn, experiment, develop and freely foster their capacities, their talents and aspirations. The pandemic really made us face these kind of difficulties maybe in places of the world, especially in the Western world where you know we couldn't have the real dimension of what educational poverty means or at least not so directly. There are different areas also in my country where this kind of educational poverty is experienced is absolutely live and we should work to face and to contrast it. But the lockdown, the pandemic for sure, I lighted this situation and I lighted the difficulties of access education where you know limits to technology are experienced. I'm so glad that Paul Kim in a while will tell you more about their projects that are based on the subject in very remote areas, so you will give you a hint from that. Another issue is how do we handle situations where students do not have access to the internet and or to technologies further expanding the digital divide and this is what is actually related to what I was mentioning before. Again, different problems to be coped with. We need support from different stakeholders to find a solution. Of course, governments put forward funding to provide digital technologies in Italy. We had support from the ministry in order to give tablet devices, actually devices to our pupils who were not able to connect because they didn't have any device at home. Of course, that is one point but it's not the solution. Other possibilities are related to agreement with tech companies, libraries, museums and offline volunteers to provide sources and necessary skills to access to educational resources. But again, these kind of agreements can take time to be started, can face different kind of limitations. We need also to think of a bottom-up way to find solutions and cope with this situation. So, I thought that it could be useful to tell you about an experience that we had a few years ago that is still live and that could give some answers to different kinds of problems that are so strictly connected to educational poverty and the risk of educational poverty we are facing. The project is called Digital Innovation in Cultural Heritage Education, a European project as you can see is an Erasmus Plus project and it was actually the extended title is there, Digital Innovation in Cultural Heritage Education in the Light of 21st Century Learning. I will tell you more about it in a minute. Different partners for European countries involved, Italy with two partners, Loughborough University from UK, Netherlands and Belgium. There's a project website there, it's still working so you can go and have more information if you're interested in the project. What is the project based on? It's based on three main pillars, primary school but the model can be applied and extended to all different levels of instruction, digital resources, cultural and heritage education. So, the idea is to integrate in the current learning systems new methods and technological tools in view of the development of active citizenship skills. In particular, these kinds of skills developed by Trilling and Files model, critical thinking, creativity, communication and collaboration. Through this lockdown and actually attending different of the online together webinars program but also the NAP webinar programs, we have been listening to different experts telling us about the need to rethink education after the pandemic we have been all experiencing and focusing especially on the development of cross-sectional skills, especially critical thinking. The issues, the problems that we have been facing are very much related also to the impossibility, the difficulty to manage information in the correct way to be critical about the overload of information that we get from the NAP in particular but from all the channels, the communication channels that we experience every hour of our day. So, digital resources, use of digital resources in the current, in a critical way, cultural and heritage education, experiencing these new models in primary school but as I said we could extend it to different kind of different levels of school. What we worked on was a research agenda so a common theoretical framework, a menu of teaching scenarios. So we imagined a different kind of teaching scenarios where the use of digital tools and the use of heritage as a teaching and learning tool was foreseen and of course the idea was to improve in this sense teachers professional development to help them use digital tools within a a thick and important cultural setting. We don't have to think that this was meant just to teach heart or history of art or, you know, contents connected just to heritage. No, because whatever museum object you take into consideration can be used as an object to teach different kind of disciplines of subjects from chemistry to math to any scientific content. So not just history of art of course and of course a pilot phase was carried out but what I wanted to tell you today is that through that project we devised as I said a menu of digital teaching scenarios so imagine different kind of possibilities for our teachers that was a digital product of the of the project and we also devised a so-called new stack web app that was made to you know there are animations but I want to skip it is a web app is a web app so it's easy to manage it's a social hub where people could and can actually is absolutely active so you can use it you can also rate it and that's what we wanted they have to be it's an app that can be improved and it improves by itself it uses of course the project resources that were created in the menu of scenarios why we you we wanted a social rating web apps first of all because you know it's a cycle where we can improve and you can browse the web app use the teacher resources the project resources you can starting from that browsing and you know collecting the resources create a new experience and then you can share it and the cycle restart with a new browsing but especially an improvement of the app of course we we think that the social dimension allows final users to create new experiences which can be shared social here you have some screenshots from the app but if you connect to the link that I'm giving you in a minute you can have on your personal device the screenshots yourself you can have content of course these screenshots are in Italian but the app can be available in different languages here you have the link to the app and you can find a list of resources as I was saying in different languages Italian English and Dutch because as you might remember and as I mentioned the netherland component was was strong within the consortium and you can search specific resources according to your training and teaching needs just going through the search bar length if you this is this is a you know an image that can tell you can show you how to get the you know the digital tool that according to a certain series of keywords that are highlighted there you can get from from the app a description of the tool that could be useful for your teaching and learning session according to the keywords that you inserted in in in the lens bar you see here we inserted accessible and when you type accessible there the app gives you solution to where where to start using for instance the smart art application so what we did besides creating this app was also to assess the app to understand if the app was working and if it was interesting to in training primary school teachers that in a way tested this application so the research questions we carried out are there are future teachers interested in web technologies which kind of opinions and expectations in training teachers have about the use of technologies for cultural heritage education but again I want to stress these aspects not only cultural heritage education but the use of cultural heritage for education which is a very wide concept especially supporting cross sectional skills and 21st century skills we asked them to download actually to to work on on the technologies that were available to the the app and we collected comments from from them I give you just a few very few data regarding our survey but just to let you know how we want to be critical in the use of technologies and also developing a web app like the one that was carried out in in this project we really want to collect data and to reflect on the data to understand if that technology is useful or not so the music app was used in this first activity by 170 in training teachers and from them we collected some information of course the web app as you can see contains you know mainly two point zero three point zero technologies and the in training teachers commented on on those mainly according to the results we collected and we analyzed you see we had you know etymotic analysis and from what we see the focus of the interest was concentrated on VR app for android smartphones like cardboard or object-based learning and 3d printing most frequent words used in the comments are object interesting children sciences useful allows students to be so different words connected to the idea of using the digital application to develop certain certain skills and certain certain senses and teams that emerges are connected to ubiquity sensory experience immersive experience so the three teams are in line with the characteristics provided by the three point zero technologies so this means that in training teachers grasp the real meaning and potentiality of the technologies and there are some some comments that that I mentioned here related to the fact that the tool allows you to visit places that you thought to be inaccessible so technologies that can allow you to face the problem of mobility so absolutely actually absolutely you know up to date and relevant to the situation we are experiencing but I think that taking into consideration that those comments were given you know in a time where we couldn't even imagine what would have happened afterwards you could really be helped and supported by such an application besides the kind of technologies that were mostly appreciated by the respondents and the fact that when you talk about object based learning and 3d printing you gain best you know a better a better appreciation you can realize that there are different kinds of applications that can be used for your own wishes and why I wanted to present today this this this application this web app and why I am presenting you this project that actually ended a couple of years ago because I think it is it can be really useful practically useful for teachers for educators for all of us because it supports our awareness it supports our professional development in using technologies that we experience is not so widespread the digital divide especially in Italy you know was shown as a major problem during this lockdown the possibility to use free digital scenarios the possibility is provided by ITAT tools such as ubiquity sensor and immersive experiences the opportunity to discuss your ideas in a community of peers through this social web app so different kind of opportunities that this product that we devised in a time I was telling you in a time that was not that of the pandemic really could instead be revised and reapplied in this time we are we are leaving so as a solution to our first question related to the need to be more accessible from different point of view so before leaving the floor to Paul who I think will tell us about the solution they found at Stanford I know you're all there waiting for our VIP I'm asking if you have any questions for me of course I can give you all the the different links to our web app but the links are there in the presentation so you can access it later if you wish thank you you know there were Dorota wanted to get links to your articles that you quoted at the beginning of the session maybe you could do that when Paul's talking in the chat yeah yeah when Paul's talking I can give you the links yeah and the arena was wondering who is holding governments responsible when they do not provide funding that's a big one yeah I was I was I was reading and so sufficient funding yeah yeah yeah this is this is the issue so in fact we we as I was saying there's the possibility to work bottom up besides you know waiting for support from the government that sometimes come sometimes not and this kind of application is really bottom up I mean it's free is available you don't need to download it you know is just accessible by itself and especially is meant to be social so that you can share with other teachers teachers educators or you know people who are in the same need as yours to discuss together the the need the educational need you have and to find other free solutions because they have is organized in a way that giving them the problem as I was showing you accessibility it gives you back solutions with the kind of of digital tools that you can use here is the image that you can use to answer that specific issue accessibility in this case and the application gives you the answer to use smart art of course you can rate this application and you can you can comment on that together with other peers okay there are a lot of questions coming in now in the chat and I suggest Antonila that you answer them in the chat yeah yeah yeah and we we leave the floor to Paul I'm I'm looking forward to hearing from Paul who is a dear friend and I'm so glad that he is here with us today thank you so much okay Paul we hate the virus that we value the innovation trigger it created to our generation thank you all for your interest and effort to make a difference together can you restart the lecture please you're looking at a photo of Afghanistan girls in Kabul as many of you know the struggles these children had to face from their birth to today are unimaginable and they are still facing numerous challenges the one most disheartening problem they are facing as we speak right now is there a threatened right to education on top of what has been challenged for them for decades with all time uncertainty COVID-19 happened due to the current pandemic their access to education has been completely shattered when we complain about Zoom fatigue from so many Zoom meetings and classes these students in Afghanistan have nowhere to go to continue to learn because their schools are all closed in the midst of this chaotic situation I received an email from one of my colleagues at Stanford asking me to meet a student who might join Stanford University as a graduate student I learned that the student is an Afghanistan female who has been admitted to Stanford Harvard and Berkeley yet she has not made up her mind my job was to convince her that Stanford is the right university for her as I learned about her by having a Zoom meeting I began to be really impressed she has shown a tremendous interest in helping young afghans and girls get an education and in fact she has traveled to several informal learning centers in and out of Kabul and helped teach young students currently since all the schools are closed she's communicating with her students via WhatsApp every week she reads and records storybooks and shares her audio files along with the storybook files through their mobile phones what an incredible use of technology she has been providing the children with a basic education program to fight the crisis and she asked me what she can expect to learn from our graduate program so she can apply to her lifelong passion for educating children in marginalized regions like Afghanistan where these girls' right to education is threatened I ensured that she would learn the big picture of education inequality around the globe with international comparative data sets and seminar works by notable researchers and partnering organizations then she asked me what I have been doing in the developing regions so I began to explain what I have been doing in the past how I put together mobile learning technology for indigenous migrant children working in farms in Mexico also how I partnered with global organizations to expand my mobile learning projects such as pocket school to help develop entrepreneurship skills for girls in rural India and how I conducted research studies by traveling with graduate students and implementing literacy and numerous programs in Africa and also how I deployed mobile learning technology to assess executive functioning skills of children in conflict zones such as pastime and lastly how I developed an inquiry-based mobile learning program named SMILE with funding from UNESCO and other organizations to expand in different countries around the world she asked me how I handle the places where there is no reliable access to electricity or internet so I explained about SMILE-PIE.org project and its solution which uses a 35-dollar raspberry pie loaded with SMILE, learning management system, Wikipedia, Khan Academy, K to 12 desert curriculum set, four computer coding schools and STEM-related virtual laboratories the SMILE-PIE runs on portable batteries and it is your Wi-Fi, router, storage and content everything in one small box no reliable electricity or internet is needed in this case she then asked me if we could deploy SMILE over learning project in Afghanistan right now so I asked her you mean right now and she said yes right now because there is no schooling right now I said why not then she started to come up with plans to train local friends to serve as facilitators and line up weekly educational content with specific schedules as we speak right now she has been teaching her students and sending me progress reports every week I have to remind you that she hasn't even started her class at Stanford and yet she's making a difference already in the lives of many students in Afghanistan right now through a mobile learning model anyway she has decided to join Stanford over Harvard and Berkeley this fall I feel good about that but more importantly I feel great that there are individuals out there who want to make a difference for the children who are in dire need of access to education also I'm glad that young millennials are seeking to join universities because they have a genuine passion for making an impact in our society not because they want a piece of paper degree if you look closely at what happened here perhaps you may find a glimpse of the future of a higher education model where young students meet with coaches where knowledge and experiences are shared and solutions are designed and evaluated to address real world problems in fact this is not new at all while ago I taught a MOOC named designing a new learning environment which invited 20 000 students from 170 different countries to come up with a new innovative designs to solve numerous education problems in this massive class every student had to be working in teams to identify design and evaluate solutions that address real world problems did I evaluate all 20 000 students work no the platform had a machine learning algorithm developed to provide students with simulated evaluation experiences so they can turn around and evaluate their peers work as if I were personally evaluating everyone's work this kind of MOOC is a scaled up version for coaching young individuals globally this kind of learning environment is just one of the many things that people like me are trying to experiment as an attempt to innovate education in addition the rapid development of artificial intelligence is just waiting around the corner to add a whole new dimension to the education ecosystem I'm personally involved in developing an AI-backed coaching companion that can engage in conversations with the students and encouraging them to improve their personal inquiries the difference between a human teacher and AI coach is that the machine never forgets a single word or question a student has ever mentioned this is going to be revolutionary now let's step back and come to reality today regardless of COVID-19 many of the innovation attempts have already been made and many things have already been tried however these weren't valued much because there was always an offline option and people didn't want to invest time to learn new models involving technology or online environments when things seemed acceptable as always have been now with COVID-19 the all-time available offline model is no longer an ideal option as of today the use of online education environments skyrocketed in developed countries in developing regions a tool like WhatsApp is a dominant learning management system for now nonetheless there is an unprecedented level of training development and collaboration to launch and improve online learning environments rapidly a lot of earlier research studies around online education are now coming back to the main stage discussions it feels like we're going back to the future very fast if COVID-19 lingers around long the rate of development and innovation in education technology will probably accelerate at a rate we have never seen here's a word of caution though as more online education is becoming a norm schools and universities will have to figure out how to structure a better coaching system not a lecture delivery system coaching means understanding students much better at an individual level and guiding them and motivating them to achieve their full potential if you're still thinking of running a school or university by converting offline lectures into streaming videos and easing academic requirements you're on the wrong track you want to challenge your students based on their interests and skills with much more rigorous experiential education programs linked to solving real world problems this way we'll be able to involve students from Afghanistan to Rwanda and from Seoul to Silicon Valley to work together to address grand challenges in a global team and that's how I see the future of education I hope my presentation has given you some useful ideas to design future learning environments for your students we'll certainly remember this period in human history as one of the most invigorating times of innovation this time of now is a new Renaissance moment in education and we do not want to waste this crisis we hate the virus but we value the innovation trigger it created to our generation thank you all for your interest and effort to make a difference together okay so I'm sure people have questions I would love to answer them with that first of all let me you know I'll start with thank you as well but let me thank you first of all for your presentation and really for the inspiring you know hints and suggestions that we can get from your presentation there are different questions one is you know the one that I really share we have with Julian so what do you think what should we do where we don't have the possibility to access the band with where we don't have internet what can we do to support UPIS and to limit these educational poverty risks you have been working in so many places around the world where this problem has always been there so please tell us what to do we have to think of a few scenarios and conditions I suspect that this coronavirus will be lingering around for a very long time I don't think it's going away anytime soon and what I have been doing is I've been calling various partners in various countries to see what's working right now and what I'm hearing from Africa India and Afghanistan and many other countries is that they're all using WhatsApp and that's the main delivery system right now or the schools are completely closed in some cases in Africa I heard that the parents have to stop by the school to get some printouts for the homework so that they can take it home and kids work on them so in the developing regions the options are quite limited but right now if you can think of a technology based solution what that has been the incredible learning management system fortunately working with partners in few other countries I am introducing the SMILE project SMILE mobile learning management system so that they can have a more formally structured education program using SMILE for developed countries like Korea or US and Singapore we are using a lot of zoom we have like even if you are in first grade they are having 30 minute zoom sessions four times a day and using the zoom for live session and then they are using other tools like some sort of e-proportional system for students to complete their work and upload them so things are going I mean they are not ideal because everything just happened so everyone had to rush to creating something that works for now so it's a little chaotic and transitional but if the virus lingers around more probably people will have to think of more permanent solutions and those permanent solutions I'm sure will depend on the conditions that you are in in your region so if you're interested in learning more about fast practices for different parts of the world let me know the region and the conditions then we can probably help you figure out what would be the best solution that would be great I think that if you you know if participants today but also those will access this presentation afterwards because the recording will be put on our website and many people normally access it also afterwards if you have problems if you are based in far remote areas please contact Paul I'm sure that he will be glad to to to involve you in his wonderful projects and Paul they are saying here in the chat that the the site can be reached but I think it's strange because I know those websites and I access them previously I don't know Paul if you want to have a check and also oh yeah there's my project is there in the link Paul Capers another question that is here and that I want to share with you what do you think about using tv channel this is something that also in Italy has been promoted as a way to reach children and you know pupils based in places where where the the the connection is not working right so developing countries are deploying tv programs but some countries already have been doing that anyway so if you look at Korea Singapore and countries like that they have had the education broadcast systems for decades and even if you don't go to school at all you can watch tv programs and then it covers the entire k to 12 curriculum through the tv program so I don't think we need to worry about those countries that have all those resources but the we probably need to worry about the countries that do not have all those resources and then we probably need to innovate solutions for the regions that may not have a reliable electricity or internet the rest of the world I think they have some sort of resources that could be utilized so my concerns are for more for the developing regions exactly exactly and you have been there yourself can you tell us because I'm always you know I'm fascinated by your your experiences can you tell us about your your travels um I remember you told me different different episodes but can you tell me where can you tell us all of us at one one memory of your of your travels in paramount places to bring education there so these days I am working more with a large organizations like edify.org which has about one million students under their belt they're operating in 10 different countries I'm sharing the link below here so I these days I'm not traveling as much I mean obviously I can't travel right now but as soon as the the sheltering place lifts up and I'll probably begin traveling again but I'm doing a lot of lectures online I am invited for conferences like this in many different places around the world so everything is online it's kind of convenient in a way because I don't have to you know fly 12 hours 16 hours to get to a different place but obviously I miss the real people and then beating people on ground so right now I'm working with the large organizations because I cannot be there that's fine I just wanted to have a you know a memory of yours when you travel to these remote places where you brought education through you know small devices yeah so if you look at this smile pie.org website which I shared here there are it kind of explains how you can make your own smile pie with all the content that I mentioned it has not only the mobile learning management system but it is an open education resource smile pie.org is an open source so you can make yourself own smile pie today if you want to with the $35 red buried pie so that's what I'm doing I'm trying to share these open source products and services to places where where the resources are limited so that they can make their own smile pie if they want to like right now yeah that that's that's amazing and I really thank you there's a punk guy asking smile promote OERs yes yes definitely well we work with organizations that have the specific content from OER and they like to put them in in the smile pie then we help them do that as well wow fantastic so I really thank you Paul I can say and I really agree with Dalida was saying that you combine passion and knowledge and that has always been my my you know my thought regarding your your work so that's that's exactly uh what Paul is doing is working with passion and and knowledge thank you so much but it was very interesting thank you I don't know I'll tell you if you want to because we they are reaching the end you know if you're if you the thanks Paul that was really inspirational there were one there was one I think there was one or two people who were having trouble hearing it in the beginning but that solved itself in the end luckily so very inspirational and if you missed anything I think the link is in Paul's chat there so you can go back and hear it and you can hear the recording that will be released very very soon to everybody we're coming to the end of the webinar I just thought just below here there's a little poll yeah what if you is there anything you've learned that will be valuable in the future maybe write down some ideas just now just to write there and we'll see if there's what what you've taken from this also a lot of the open universities in the world in many developing countries visited the one in Pakistan and in Palestine and many other countries they work with a combination of local support centres where the students can go to get on-site support and they also work with us as you mentioned the radio and TV broadcasting many of them have their own TV stations and they get broadcast rights on air which is quite impressive so they do reach out so there's a lot of interesting work going on yeah there's a lot because as we said if this virus is not going to live as soon we really need to engage our brains and find a solution okay lots of food for thought thanks to Antonella and to Paul we're over there in California I hope you have a pleasant day the rest of the day the rest of us is heading into the evening for many of us in Europe and is there anything else we should say before we finish Antonella is it the the badges yeah yeah yeah you you need to sign for getting the the badges because every time you attend one of our of our events sorry you get a badge so there's a recognition of the work you've done with us and we have done all together actually and don't forget our annual conference that will take place from June 21st to June 24th hosted by Timisoara Polytechnica University and of course it will go online but we will have nice nice shots of Timisoara which is a wonderful cultural heritage site talking about cultural heritage and I really wish we will be able to all together to be online at the conference but also to visit Timisoara and Polytechnica University Timisoara which is a very up to date and you know innovative place to be and to grow so thank you to all of you thank you Paul again thank you so much have a nice day thank you