 How's it how's it everyone? So let's see. Um, yeah Um, I have no idea if this is coming through if I'm coming through loud and clear with my Let me know in the Should be should be fine how's it how's it how's it has a Gary has a Bradley So it's gonna be how's it spend and it's for a best Patsy kitty, cool Sounding name and who and this side towards screen. Yes Well, thanks for joining me. Yes, so so million a million views who knew right? That's that's crazy. Oh, Jim and Demorell Apologies if I miss counts somebody's name. I am awful Look at all these people about to tell you. Hey, man. How you doing and Demorell? I've been while I fit alone soon some names in the Eduardo gem David's awesome. Thanks you guys ever so much for joining me. Yes. How's it how's it? Um, so, yes I knew back in all wins it the end of November last year when I uploaded my first which video after taking I think must have been oh Oh Month almost to make that one video that here we will be sitting in the beginning of August with 35,500 subscribers and yeah million views and stuff and and and a whole big chat bar of You know listening listening to here being part of this this wonderful community. So, so thank you I mean really from the bottom of my heart So to all of you, you know for being part of this and for watching the videos and making we Feel like there is a point To making them because I must say in the early days, you know, this is when you started YouTube channel I think my mom Watched one of the videos and my dad, you know, what sort of things and and it was just yeah I would get like 10 video of 10 years on a video And And and and I would never have imagined that That the response would be so absolutely crazy and and it happened But I've just like almost just overnight, you know the beginning of the year. I think I have a hundred subscribers And then towards the end of March then the gods of YouTube they they smiled on us and they went I will promote your video to Somebody do you lovely people? And and and and there we go. So Finland has asked about a little Q&A And I think that might be in the office. I did one of the reasons I asked earlier on the chat whole thing about how new How recently people found the channel is that I You know, I've been going to November, but I don't know how much of a background so people You know people know about why I sort of started channel and this seems like a good place Seems we've reached a really cool milestone just to give you a bit of background in case you don't know and and so I thought for a few years now most of us, you know Oh And now photography and I must I really enjoy his his videos and we talked about talking to me and it got to a point where I The videos he was creating just weren't really fascinating with me much anymore, and I wanted to see You know, I wanted to Well, basically wanted to watch videos like he used to which is and and so I thought well if he's not doing You know, then maybe somebody else will come along So the idea was always on the back burner never to happen then of course C19 came along and and that kind of scuffled my studio work slightly So I gave me some sort of interest in time to do it So I basically just made videos that I wanted to see and took all my experiences from further school and The working and sort of just channeled them all into the videos. So so here we are You know, I see the pit says he's Suggestion from it from the Ted folks video and that's I think there's a lot of crossover Between and I think it's it's always helpful and that's why we said, you know, that's people who are Making these kind of videos. We're not really in competition with each other, so I don't see it It's been in competition Is it a bit muffled? I'm sorry. This is a very old headset And it's not particularly great. So if it is really if he then I'm gonna get a new headset So bear in mind. Thanks Daniel for the super sticker. That was that was awesome Yeah, I'm gonna get a new headset. So that's it. So one of the things is we're talking about to When people support me on about my coffee and through a Subscription to the channel one heavy it goes back into the channel. So sound as Keep pointing out is is my keys here? That is the thing that really has been a Real issue with it. So I bought a new thing using the Using some support from the channel. So so, you know, so that's kind of It all builds up and gets better and a new headset or new mic actually would be would be in order But yeah, so if you've got any questions Feel free to ask them comment. I'll see if I can get through to them You've got something very specific that you'd like answered that you may feel probably wouldn't come up Feel free to be like a super chat or something like that and that also stick in there And how's it John from New York City? Hey, what? Yeah, Robert D Unfortunately This is very basic setup in YouTube and I don't seem to be able to control over the The game for the mic or anything like that Which which kind of sucks. I'll put it as close to my mouth as is entirely possible But as I said, this is a first to me It will improve, but thank you for thank you for being here. Oh 3 p.m Lovely and the cat lady. Hello cat lady Thank you for all your help So there we go So, yes, if you've got any questions, um, you'll be just dropping in the chat Now Finland you are saying you like the specific photographer videos You know that I was talking about so that obviously doing kind of a showcase on Individual photographers and and I was I do like doing those two and and it's been actually very interesting and obviously I Like most people just tend to know about through, you know through books So it's kind of a selection of the books that I have and They don't really give you obviously too much of a background for person. So by putting together a You know an episode about a photographer and It's anyone that's there's quite a background on it's interesting because also then I need to sort of talk about it and they do say the best way to learn something is to teach and That's been a great thing for me to do to rediscover photographers who I am very Keen on, you know, who are like talking about and and to find them Nuggets and bits of information that I didn't know and then I can get to show you guys That's really fantastic You know to sort of see and I've seen we have somebody from Florida. Hey, I've spent some time in Tampa back in the day John's asking. What is my favorite photographic genre? I'm Interesting I Just before I went into photoscope I wanted to be a photojournalist that was kind of my bag It's in shape you want to call that And this is in South Virginia 94. So there was kind of there was lots of opportunity for photojournalism going on and certainly the first school was quite leaning towards photos and and Commercial heavily I then thought I wanted to be a landscape photographer and I Really enjoyed that. I don't draw that that quietness of doing all the landscape and and then For various reasons I specialised in portrait. I've been doing portrait So it's a great roundabout way of sort of saying that my favorite genre photography Um, I don't actually have one specific genre. I think like, you know, it's I like little bits of All things like this, for example, I like landscape, but I don't like all landscape Very obvious sort of thing to say and I like portraits and maybe I just Maybe it seems like a cop out to say I like all photography or photography is my favorite. Um, I think more than just genre It's more kind of people Who kind of the way that they speak Yeah, I don't know But it's this kind of thing where This this something that resonates with you and and and it reaches out and touches it And you can't really sort of say exactly why it's a bit like music, you know But if you look at my iPhone and my itunes and all that stuff, my music is is all over the place, you know I've got industrial trash metal and then Neil Diamond because you know, why not? So it's a very much of a broad sort of mix And so there we go My closet is so what message do you want to bring to the world? And how would I like to remember? It's I think the world's a big place. I I just this I want to share with with you guys and you see the joy What photography is it's such a cool great thing that I love talking about and as you Oh I don't like the gear the gear is It is what it is and it's and it's fun and stuff, but I want people to Realize that when they jump in that big Pool of photography and they swim around they get lovely and and warm and you know just just relax That it can make The enjoyment of the whole art and so much more right that it doesn't have to be a very fidgety pixel-keeping nuts and bolts very precise sort of thing that photography has a soul to it and and that really should just be Expressed in as many ways as possible and I really what I'd like to do if there anything is to help Kickstart this sort of feel in this movement on on YouTube, which I think is fun to come along where more and more people focus not so much on the gear but on That actual art from why we take photographs and the more that people can see that this is a A viable thing to talk about on YouTube and and what have you then I hope that the more that people are going to Be inspired to to make their own channels just as much as Ted inspired me to to make this one um, so In terms of having being remembered in photographs because Maybe I'll be the guy who'd went live by accident. That's been my that will be the thing that everybody remembers um Bobby, uh, Bobby canton. Hi from from Ghana. How's it's how you been? Um, yeah, you're asking about some african Photographers and in that book there. I don't know if you can see on the shelf there. It says the office companion for the photograph um, there's actually there's a huge section on on after photography and It I have wanted to to cover some Probably some South Africa photographers first because that's kind of what I'm most familiar with and one of the real Problems I've had Is trying to find information? Um about and that's always been a Bit of a stomach but the guy I believe I'm trying to do I wanted to do a bit about guy called Joe Kamala And there was so little Information about and there was so little office work available online Then it made it kind of it would have been like a 30 second video and and it's so hard to find so What I'm going to sort of try and do is actually go to that book. There's a whole bunch of stuff in there, especially about sort of East African Photography and there's like things like our, you know, there was a guarantee that studios in Uh, you know, something like an ambassador or someone like that. Um, you know in the 1870s It's it's crazy. I just think just you know a few years after photography You know got going obviously with the garotype Then it was across the world You know and and so it was it's a it's a thing that I would really like to to get into because people have sort of said obviously that predominantly the channel tends to focus on sort of western white male photographers and and that's I think just a Happened, you know circumstance that those be the tend to be the photographers who are most Prevalent the most I wasn't popular. That's probably the wrong word But they you know if you look through books those are the names that that crop up again and again So finding hey Ravens don't worry about some job of you from them. Um You know about finding People outside of that And and and trying to bring them to a wider audience So thank you for the for the reminder Um to to get some more of these these kind of guys who are, you know, so South America And you lost your first and what happened so so definitely looking to sort of bring some more of that And there's a lady. I don't know if that's how you pronounce it Hi from Brazil. Yes. Thank you. Um There's a spin the 60 second photo tips. Um That was way back when I was trying to find out. Um, what would be working? Working quite well for Working for the channel Um, and that's when shorts. I don't know if you guys middle youtube shorts That kind of got got going up. Um that I was experimenting with little things if it's something that people would be interested in in hamber and, you know, you know Sixth, then then said, oh rambler comes my nice white horse. Um A club in there. Um the You're having those 60 seconds. They're kind of useful, but I also feel that they sort of started drifting away a little bit from What I felt the channel should be certainly back then when I was experimenting with things And again, it's a it's a useful thing to put on as an idea To see what see what you guys are interested in in in harem and, you know, or seeing rather um Allu you're asking so like I said, um, you know, do you see like traveling? to places and to be According to to be a career and To be honest, I don't know if I'm necessarily the right person. Um to ask that. I've tended to just kind of work wherever I've found myself. Um, so I haven't necessarily gone places to try and pursue a photographic career Uh, I think if you wanted to be self professional proper or something like that, um Then you probably really should be around areas, you know, New York and that sort of thing where there is a Where there's a community that sort of thing because you can start to network and networking I think beyond anything within any genre that you're going to work in is is Absolutely paramount. So you need to be where the people you can network with are so in in that respect I think yes, you probably should consider moving, especially if like me right now you live out in sticks where there is actually zero Uh fashion industry, you know, if you want to be a fashion photographer Um, you know, so that's kind of sort of thing. Um Yeah, Finland. I know you keep the like wildlife and stuff. Um, and I'm I'm trying to think of who is that guy? um He does all the elephants What have you? um, there's a is a British photographer and his name completely Slips my mind. Um, if you drop it in the in the chapter in the cats Don't see it. Um, you know, they might be worth We're sort of looking at uh, and and certainly obviously The wildlife and you know, have you seen her book? That might I know some But those sort of things, you know, yes, they are sort of worth Looking at and I I have a list as long as as my Of people we could we could talk about and if if I didn't have a life And uh, you know another commitment. So we're moving house. It's a wonderful process of moving out um, I would just sit and make tons tons of videos nothing because in terms of ideas I have probably Um, uh, so sort of jam and so, you know, a lot of people are asking that sort of favorite. Um, you know, that's I don't have necessarily a favorite photographer um It tends to sort of shift There are there are some people I come back to again and again. Um, I don't know if you saw the recent video about, um over Alba how to He, um, he is one of my favorite photographers for a variety of reasons. Um, I think Photographically he's I quite like his style He he speaks to me Because I came to discover him at a sort of an important period in my life And so often we we we cherish the people that we um and the things that we discover at these kind of crucial bench in their university and What have it um, and also he reminds me of Of the times in South Africa and and as what he calls it the happy sad um, you know, so if I had to be put on spot probably obi and uh Yeah, I think obi now that I've I've now I said I don't have a favorite not it's obi Um, so the the favorite decade, um, I think That's 70s 80s period and that's probably because that's when I was younger and go go beg for that idea of That's what I was exposed to to begin with and when I look at those photographs, especially because they're so obviously shot on On slide film and print film that they have a very different feel to them so they have a very un In certain to modernize a very unprocessed kind of look to them then They just they just transferred me back to that time when I was sort of discovering photography and and I think that's kind of Again, it sort of cycles back to this idea of what's emotional and you know an emotional connection to you so that's kind of you know kind of Yeah, I think it's really an important thing to consider in photography is how we are moved emotionally by a photograph So we've got someone here, uh bids. Oh this side for screen. Thanks, man. I've that's I'm sorry I say man As a hang up from Um, so So this side before Especially once a couple of social media and and yeah, I think that's what you're talking about keeping fun um in in the process and And that was double issue for me. I after one video recently A photographer from America And just he emailed me and said, um, I really like your videos, but you're starting to become hot serious Um, and it reminded me that also, you know, I make these videos To to have fun to share, you know things that I find Fun and exciting with you guys. Uh, so it is It's useful. I think from from both things to to make with this as long as like quite often I'm actually talking to myself. Uh, and a lot of those things like social media See, uh, you know Thoughts about social media, um are kind of just a reminder to me also to not get hung up on on that sort of thing And and if it's something you want to do then I'll by all means do it and be Be active and be part of those communities and But don't don't think That it's it's Then it's kind of the thing that you must hang your hand up You know, a lot of people do find it useful and certainly from a professional, um, uh standpoint, um, You know that the instagram players have been exceptionally handy for people finding work or library But it's just it should be fun ultimately and if you start Chasing likes and if you start doing that and that's why you're doing things and that's when you get head up because Your image didn't get you know a hundred likes an hour or something Then then I think we should question why is that that we do things that goes the same for the youtube videos And you know some videos do do really well and some videos that I put a lot of effort into and I think everyone's gonna love this and this is like But that's not true because still, you know, there's this 24,000 people watch it and it's like wow 24,000 people watch watch me talk about something and I still find it's it's crazy And I was saying to my wife just before I went on It's like that. I have never been this nervous before doing Anything on youtube even when I sat with the Richard ebb in the video which was the first one I did and I hit upload And I was like, uh, um Yeah, you know Oh There we go, so we've got a whole whole bunch of questions here. Um, thanks, Jamie. That's Uh, what a loose Is his name loose loose? I'm assuming it's Dutch Someone like that Anybody know um Robert asking about mixing black and white Of mixing black and white in color and There's It Each of them have their face, uh, obviously, uh, it depends. I mean as a portfolio, you'd probably be showing Individual images at a time. Um, so don't think it really matters Much because you're sort of showing what so the biggest thing with with black and white and color together is When you're doing so like in the wedding album, for example, if you have a page and I don't have any books Um, so you have it yet. So there's more work So if you have a color image this side and a black and white image this side, they will start fighting against each other So on a complete spread you want either complete color or complete black and white. Um, so they're not Not jarring with each other. So so really that's kind of what you want to think about It's more this flow of how your images is going. Um, if you are doing single if you are doing actual print portfolio where you have a um We have a say in the how you know the images are displayed in what order Um, then one of the things I was I was told when I was quite younger is to have your second best Image on on the top of the top Then the weakest from this collection But what you consider to be the weakest Oh, sorry, sorry Put the best one first the weakest one second and then your second best at the end of the car Um, and there's a So there and if there's a specific order you'd like to have because the terms of narrative or something Then then do that. But if you do the best one first, obviously, that's pretty cool. Then they go Okay, but then it gets progressively better Again, it's it's something I used to do. Um, um, but I'm I'm not But it's probably something just considered do think about it as a whole All the way through. Um, thank you for asking about sort of, um, youtube channels Um, uh, well, obviously there's there's there's Ted Any any discussion about, um, youtube channel could be especially To be About talking about Ted There's there's a couple more that have sort of popped up. Let me just bring up the list of people Who Who do pop up and buy my who am I subscribed to let's listen. Um, so there's about photography Who I think is on here or he was on here earlier, but he's he's there. Um, David Yaro, that's it. Well done. Thank you, Iva Yes, um, so we got about photography. Um, Sean Tucker, he talks a lot about the the why between Why the photography? There's a couple of photos. There's a there's a guy called Peter fours guard and I don't know how to pronounce His surname correct. Do he is I mean is was a an Olympus Ambassador or something. I don't know what they're called. Um, and he has a channel is quite interesting. Um, folks is kind of on on gear And so but but again a different kind of Look as opposed to this is a new lens and got him by Yeah, so he's a bit more kind of into the totally aspect of things. Um, there's All these these people There's um, oh, I've totally forgotten her name now. I'm clicking through her book T hopper there we go. Um, so so she does some very good videos about Oh, you know individual photographers and and that's always quite Quite good. I like that and then I think this is you know, to go back to what I was saying earlier about how people are If we support each other if the people who you know, like myself who make these kind of videos Give shoutouts to other people say look go check out the video Then it encourages more people to do it because there's an awful lot of people who are Exceptional knowledgeable about photography. Um, you know massively so But I think that they don't think that there's an audience for what they have to say So, excuse me. Oh Yes, there's there's low alcohol group I'm getting old. Um You know that they They feel that there's no audience that there's nobody who wants to To watch What is they do and and maybe five years ago? That was that was true if you look up for a lot of videos Especially when I'm doing some research example, um, you know, you look a bit and they're from You know five seven eight years ago about famous photographers who have got maybe thousand views Uh, you know, so I think you will look at and I thought that kind of also originally that nobody wants to watch a video about There's a dollar or you know Or over the house Evidently, that's not true. So I think the more that we can support everybody that that we can then You know just look You know that we can we can sort of grow as a community and all enjoy everybody's take on on photographs because I think that's that's an important aspect to to remember is that that what I talked about is is it's my perspective on things and it doesn't always match with everybody else's and that's okay because it's not supposed to match With everybody else is just as much as your photography is not supposed to to be And you know be liked by everyone else you make it for yourself and and and you say this is what I make and if you like this Then that's fantastic But it's just my you know, it's your take on what you saw and and that's always the beauty about things that You could put three or four people in the same room talking about a specific photographer and get very different Takes on it because we all interpret it differently. We all put it through our own personal filters and and then Our personalities into the way we interpret that image and I and that's one of the the great things About watching people talk about photography on It is Adam's ghost ship Yes, well spotted Um, yeah, Dennis. Yeah, I think he is from from from health safety. Yeah um Yes, and and that's thing, you know, um I don't one of the things I because I see there's been a couple of people talking about here in the comments, um and it's It's I don't be like a bashing on gear thing because it because that's it this channel shouldn't be and I I really don't want to I don't really want to Be the sort of guy goes. Ah, yeah Um, yeah, and tell people that they're wrong talking about you because that's of course. There's not a case at all um, you know, it's Everything has its place everything has had a role to play. Uh, and it's just Gear Does feel like it's pushed on youtube is as as hit kind of sort of felt Um, mostly because it involves down to it involves that money, uh, you know, there's no Well, this is the phrase that People I think primarily come on to youtube to try and make Money from it and that that's fine because there's absolutely nothing wrong with it and and quite frankly, you know, I do too. Um, but Most people I think they're all would do photography because we can we can do affiliate stuff for lenses and it gives them also gives them something to talk about You know instead of sitting again. I how am I going to talk about that? What am I going to share with my orders? What am I going to do? Involve them with what what what sort of things would I like to share with them? I will talk about Uh, you know a great photographer or you know how social media might do sick a bit But for a lot of people they'll just go. Do you know what I'll talk about? Hey, we've got this test cam here today So I'm going to do a 10 minute video on the test cam dr Oh Good or is it we don't know we'll find out at the end, you know, is is that sort of thing? Um, and then there's the potential to be at least there So there's there's a proliferation of those and of course I don't feel those types of videos Talk to you around so it feels like those are what everybody watches Um, you know because they they just they used to get pushed The more that you start watching my videos and Uh, okay, okay, it's okay. Um, I'm sure tell yourself I'm gonna wear that pop top. Um, yeah, Ted Forbes and stuff. What have you that? And so if you hover that YouTube will start pulling out people From even they go You might like this person A lot of you found me because of Ted Forbes's videos, right? So and and you know most likely a Ted fork video where he's talking about Some some art of photography and and I also get some some traffic from some short Tucker's um Videos so that's the algorithm of the work. So say you watch this and you enjoy it Here's somebody you could try So if you kind of go and I go what try to hop and try zone zone try, you know, so about photography and all the solidize then It will start YouTube will start going maybe you like to this maybe like to try that um, you know, so so that's kind of where We're starting to chisel away at this thing where we just get shoveled gear review after gear review after gear review um, and and one of the little tricks that you can use or a youtube app Um is when on your browse home screen if there are videos that you don't like we have no interest in watching There's little little dots next to them if you click that and say Don't recommend channel not interested where if you start doing that you start telling youtube I don't like this video. So if it's somebody just going. Hey, I've got the new You know 0.95 you know 50 mil super big You know saying I'm not interested in lens reviews Then it will stop showing you those sort of things. So so give it a well, um, but I think that's kind of yeah um, so why this is proliferation of Gear um phasal west card never not heard but there you go. See now see see um phasal west card It says this typing um So there we go. You see I've I've never heard of them, but I've you know, then you go But but that's that's fine because what we're looking for is is people who talk about in a kind of More I say hi brown because that's certainly not not the way but the more the the why of photography and and I think that's that's That's what this channel I really wanted to be about talking about the why of photography and and if you have any suggestions about other videos Or other you know the other channels to talk about the why I just think it'd be a really good thing if I Leave them in the comments or drop me an email Um, my email is on the channel homepage. Um, I do try and get So to respond to all of them But yeah, sort of drop me an email and and let me know about channels to talk about why because if you put together a list At least then people can find uh, and hopefully give them some support and and speaking of support um To to get youtube to understand that these videos are things that you like Give the guy like, you know, if you if you enjoy tea hops videos Give her like let her know in the comments great video dig it right because what that does is it First of all tell youtube that you like them so she they will show you more of those kind of videos Um, but also it will help other people's channels Get a little bit more traction, you know, uh, I was exceptionally fortunate I don't know how some of my videos got some decent traction Uh, but it certainly introduced people to me You know who would never have found me so all of you guys actually you found me because youtube went I think based on your previous view You might like this video. So, you know Uh, so so that's what a little they'll think but yeah, it costs you nothing just to give people a little like or just You know comment and say, you know, great video There you go, you know, uh, which is pretty cool another person can go on that. Hey, um, that's that's awesome Which is which is lovely. There's um A bit of a perspective. Um, thanks mike scholarly I'm the world's worst student or at least I was the world's worst student I actually dropped out of college school Look at that little secret So with me to learn some of the things. Um, yeah, I was not a good student. I did I did three years there But like a lot of young people, um, I fell behind in a couple of A couple of uh modules Um, I got taken to third year. I went, oh, you know, I know so much. I I don't need So I took my ball and I went, uh It's just um Which which is uh, take fours. So, um, the The, um, uh, you know, so so so I'm I'm glad to think that you think it's like scholarly Without being stuck. I think probably because I I do read a lot and somebody would ask me I was asked um That um, yeah, it's Bible literature. You'll probably notice that um That and this is just a small collection That half of those Are not really monographs. They're kind of like this stuff very collections, um, and and various books. They are, um Some of them can be quite dry reading, uh, you know, uh, which is not Not always a great thing. Um But I think that's that's the thing that I'd like to make. I you know, I've read a lot of these books I'd like to make them accessible to other people. So that's kind of went I realized early on if I just sit there and read Regurgitate things and if you look at so not that I need a bit of video and which they ever didn't want Less so down to the point. So those are my first three videos that I ever did But they are a little bit more kind of, you know, Richard Avedon was born in 1925 and he got his best camera And then he joined the Navy and And they could that can be a very kind of Yeah, I don't want to watch this with just a biography um somebody So I've taken that approach of kind of trying to make things accessible with with the story German narrative and and put the concepts that are in these books into a format that people like yourself can enjoy Experience him, you know, as opposed to feeling like it's the lecture or something, you know, in a real world context You know, Susan Sontake talked about photography But I don't know any Being in a room where we've had a Real discussion Because it can be very yeah, it can be very dry. Um, you know, so by making things Interesting by making them accessible then It will be a way of We saying to to people who've maybe only just picked a camera or or don't know any of the tech I think this is an important thing that You know, this isn't some this isn't a highbrow exclusive club that you need to know things to be You know, you need to need the secret handshake Do you want to be emotional? they'll multiply some say but it's Yeah, it's just all those things that we had at photo school And in an educational environment and just saying Yeah, this is cool. And this is how you can get and this is why it's good for you and and I'm glad that it is accessible It's a bit of a waffle there, which is also why I scripted my videos But yeah, but as you know, I'm glad that you guys are really enjoying it and it is I Is still it makes me so Happy to see people in in the comments go This is really amazing and I had no idea that this point And thank you for introducing me to this photographer or or this kind of concept and and it's helped me revitalize my photography or we invigorate my photography and and we connect it and You know and and That's kind of what it boils down to is that I love photography and I I disconnected from my own Photography and I will talk about this in an actual video is coming out So I won't go too much, but this this channel has also not only helped You wonderful people, you know And I was gonna say most of the million people who've watched I'm still kind of Amidst people You know Re-energizing talk to Joe. This is this is great. I love photography and it's helped me As well, you know, I think 24 months ago. I was I was ready to Put down a camera. I did not like looking at any of those books because they just they made me sad And now all that's changed now. I've rediscovered You know my what what drove me to Drove me to pick up a camera in the first place and and I have also had emails of people going You're trying to bankrupt me And I'm doing the same Recently because I talk about the stuff in the videos and then I get reminded that I like this personal And then tassion tempt me again So, yeah, so it's it's been it's been really fantastic and and sue you've mentioned the guardian there That's that's very interesting because I was just looking up Some things on the day and it's the guardian And for those of you who are not in the UK the guardian is a a newspaper having online section, which I think is it's behind the pain wall That uh, there has some really good articles about photography And individual photographers and certainly going a little bit more off-beast So, you know photographers who remain rather purged on um, you know, and I I tend to kind of For the most part stay on a very very kind of middle of the road with there are some times I would very much like to to feature um and and one of those things is that It's it is tricky because again, we go back to us and about Trying to find information about the photographer. It's there's enough to make the the video interesting Because as much as like I enjoy talking about the images It's always nice to have a story Um, yeah, uh, yes, um, yeah, we do med Ted folks That's how, you know, you've made it Oh Yes Hey, man, thanks ever so much. Yes, I uh, I saw when you um, when you subscribe That's awesome. Yeah, so thank you. Thanks for being here. Um, yeah Um Yeah, it's one of these these sort of things that um, you know We talk about oh, hey Daniel. Thanks so much. Um It yes, you're right. He's talking about, um, sort of happiness as a new photographer. Um, you know, I wasn't shooting some things In case I didn't feel that they were interesting to share This is a question that I think a lot of people Come to you know, they get a camera and they're like, what should I photograph? I was like, what do you want? You know, it's what moves you You know, don't think that you have to photograph something if I if I think about the very first thing that I photograph with with my thing. Yeah, um It's was that no spider-man camera, which uh, sorry my three-year-old is going off with it Little toy spider-man camera Uh, and I photographed um, andrew from next door in front of our fun talk In the house of the UK, uh, and it was just him, you know, marking around Doing this doing this thing. Um and That kind of sort of stuck with me that you should just photograph whatever makes you happy, you know, whatever Whatever comes from from in here Because if you don't if you photograph something that everybody tells you everybody tells you that you should photograph three walls This video is not sponsored by three walls, but I do love them. Um But you don't like mints What the hell's the point of you taking a picture? you know, it's it's If I think about the photographs that I've taken in my life for things that I don't want to do or didn't really want to do They're not as good because I'm soon calling myself into taking pictures um So I'm glad that you saw that it is about the happiness in your photography Because if you're happy taking the pictures Then that enthusiasm for it will keep you going You know at the beginning of something the early days as the technical challenges to to get through and and you And you get these The sense of accomplishment by being better by being technically more proficient But is that happiness keeps you going and and if you haven't watched The video did recently about obi alberhauter then Please do go and check it out because obi is a there's a fantastic example of somebody who photographs for that for the pure joy and the pure love of doing And he has fun with it as well, which I think which is which is great to see Which which is really nice and you know and and yeah, thanks. Thanks. Um, you know thanks for that It's Looking at you know, so dg was was saying about you know, so the books um That Beyond words is that the guy who used to be in edinburgh? because there is there is a um um There was a guy, uh, I I lived in edinburgh for a while and on the on uh, Cowbird and street there was a guy called beyond words And and I think it's possibly the same that fortune. They they um as is the way with most photographic Specialist bookstores. Um, they closed and now as a harry potter rubbishy Which kind of tells you everything needs to know Up the modern a modern world. Um Yeah, oh, do you know why because it's it's a it's a it's a rubbishy webcam and every time I do this with my arm I think it looks and it's looking at all the different colors behind here. Um, so so kind of Um, yeah, so it's one of those things again. It is the early days. You will look back on this thing of tpe Web camming miss. Well, I said you won't buy this time. Oh my god Thanks for being here Bradley that was that was awesome and russian since then one down and get over to the to the west coast And then we get somebody from san francisco some more west coast people are coming up which is evidently down across across the road. Um Hey, I asked the kid to give a shout out to my son ross in ireland Yeah, hey ross in ireland today. We're not today Wrong island. Um, yeah, this is ireland. Um, yeah. Hey ross. Thanks for being here and shamrock island. So that's fantastic Thanks, it's always always love it. I go this is I was really nervous about doing this. Um, it's actually it's a lot of fun No, I'm gonna keep going um Yes, it's um, you know, um Yeah, go belongs. Um, yes, we were saying it is a bit of a run and drag and I was just saying to everybody because this is the first time I'm doing a Live stream that I sort of sat with Um, I want to try and keep it simple. So I'm doing a youtube's web cam live stream option. So there's no way of Spiddling with with the audio settings and stuff and I'm using my my old gaming headset So the next one I'm going to do, uh, I'll have actually some time to set up and give it them properly using obs Which is some other sort of software, but it was it was befuddling me brain a little bit. Um, So I thought rather just let's keep it simple. Um, for the sake of um, if you if you audio But yes, uh, it is my trademark Come for the pictures Um, uh, so where is it? Yes. Yes. Uh, where am I supposed to be? Yes. I'm in the UK. Um, I was born in the UK Grew up in South Africa. See that's the color balance. It's when I sketch my head. Maybe there's something about when I sketch my head It's just a chip in my brain. Um, uh, yeah, I was born born in the UK grew up in South Africa And then in 2012 my wife and I moved back to to the UK. So now currently in in South Africa Which is which is really nice I'm the countryside wasn't quite Which is cool, but it does mean I have really crappy Um, so this is actually for 40, um broadband with the 40 So get a decent decent upload speed because you know tpe is nothing but technically It's all just it's it's uh, it's he's robinson style here, which is Uh, which is some sort of thing. Um, thanks, David. Uh, my down to the video. Um, I I really you know, it's uh, As you can sort of see this is kind of more me. Um, you know, I love I love talking about and the videos I take it a bit Otherwise, you'll just be up in the house with me. Thanks. I need to have a bit of structure to Which is kind of hey some some some people in Canada Um, or what happened? Um, yes. Oh, yeah beyond words. Yeah, yeah, um That is uh, yeah, that was what I just love going in there. Um, and there was a Darkroom down the bottom of Korean Street. Um talking about the 2000 Which is which is pretty cool. Uh, Nigel you're asking about doing, um A photography degree at uni, um It's I think it's very much depends on the person. Um Did it did it help my career at all? Um Not particularly. Um, I think give me a decent grounding Uh, but there's nothing that I learned at photo school that I couldn't have picked up elsewhere um And also from reading or from talking to other people who are involved in in tertiary education My course, uh Which in the UK would be kind of like considering civilian guilds or something like that It was a national diploma Would be was with somewhat unusual in too much as we did both theoretical Excuse me theoretical technical and What was usually called sort of this column? So that's kind of Why you know happens to be visually so we did all of those whereas I believe So you kept a lot of Unicorpses that is either or very theoretical so like kind of Susan Sontek kind of stuff and I'm very kind of And no practical or it's completely practical with no Why uh attached to it so It would be useful to to go to study from from learning about who's getting some connections And you know and and becoming technically proficient, but there is nothing that I was taught at photo school that I couldn't learn the job You know you're willing to find somebody who's who that could actually teach you Uh, and and and that's always kind of a sound thing. You know It depends which where you want to go into Um, you know with the genre, but you may struggle to find people who want to To impart their knowledge or pass it on because photographers certainly work in progress can be very It can be very anti other other photographers Especially people with disabilities be a threat and this this is more so and from my own personal experience um Which is predominantly into the family portrait market is a very low barrier to entry That's a lot of people will be very all know you are I'm not But it Quite one of the things that I wanted to kind of bring in Is that Part of I did start that discord channel and one of the things about discord, which is great But it wasn't really kind of as good as what could have been Uh, could have been uh in terms of photo sharing I think that's important To share if you have a bit more of a discussion and I was finding discourse was getting very higgledy-piggledy It's a bit like this the the chat box here It's one continuous Of A discussion so very hard to follow something so with the guys who have been part of membership on on the Um On the youtube on the tpe so the people who are who have become members They have access to a um A Community effort together on on what's called mighty networks in fact But which is a bit more solid in regards to having a conversation Um having a chat With people and being able to follow things and share images and this is kind of getting closer to this idea of Of education and passing on the environment that I Experienced as a student, which I think is probably the most beneficial thing of going to photo school is to talk to other people to be exposed to other Photographers about ways of photographing things And that's what you're not going to get from doing things on the job because you'll get one person Observation Being in photo school you'll get exposed a whole bunch So that's why they're kind of I started putting together and there are links in the description Below and and the old rich. Hey, welcome. She's just just joined Part of that. So if you go then you click on that in the posts, thank you for joining as a member we'll see a link to the mighty networks Group which you're well-controlled if you didn't want to do Anything through youtube There is a link to go directly where you can get like a month to check it out to come and see what it's like You know, see if it's a place you'd enjoy being and and so you it's you get some of the conversations that we had You know are very The very interesting but very useful For the people who are there and the people who who just are happy to kind of just look and see and get Here what other people have to say there's no egos I don't know if you get we are in ego free zone. Um, you know, nobody is There's now these clicks that you get You know with camel clubs and stuff like that and there's no competitions We're not in monthly competitions. I think that's one of the things It's not about competition. We're not competing with each other We are all supposed to be supporting each other. We're supposed to be How can you tell me the best photographers that we can be so if you are into being close to me today as I said this month Uh, please try to say it's in the link. Um down below uh, also if you'd like to support channel through Um through the sponsor of not through the sponsorships through the through memberships Uh, also that would be fantastic. And then once you've done that there was also a link to join the tv community But it'd be fantastic to to to have you there which would be which would be really nice and uh, yes No, the Simon Um, you know, they are um, yeah the 4g ad window. Um, that's uh, obviously It's it's fun to that moved it into another into another room. Um, it's usually In this room. Um, we just blow you away the breeze Let's sit here. Um back to the coat Just Which is which is like, um, yes, it is different from the discord group. Um So the discord group, um, it is still running. Uh, it's still it's still up there. Um, most of my efforts are focused on the on the new tp group it's all a bit, um It's a bit all over the place and and things, uh But it's again, it's a sort of new trial. I'm trying to find some of the that works for for everybody. Um, and and it's The discord, as I said, it was it was good and it was a nice accessible sort of thing. Uh, and what have you But it just it didn't feel like it was the right platform to really To create that community feeling to create this this feel that there's people working together as opposed to just a lot of people shouting um, which is kind of, you know, sort of It was a thing and and I kind of made it the the decision to kind of keep it not as a free for all Um, but it's something that's worked for members that want to have you because I find is when When things are free and we've all been part of facebook groups and and all these sort of things that are there is no requirement to to to join That they peter out because do you want to have a an impetus to to not necessarily be part of a Of a crowd But they'll just dip in and out whenever they feel like it and eventually they'll just drift away because they're not they don't have any skin in the game as it works and This is kind of one of the when you even if it's just a little token gesture At least then you're sort of you're making a commitment to being not necessarily active part of the community, but you're kind of being there You're engaging in if it's just even just like oh, I like that picture or you know That's what that might but you know give me some feedback to people or just listening to other people's feedback. That's such an important thing because the people who really I think can give you Give you good feedback Are very rare. I'm not saying that There's only one person That's not the case at all. It's more that There are so many people out there who are gagging me saying me me me me me me help me help me help me help me And they're going I don't just what's wrong with my picture make it. How can I prove and they're not A asking the right questions. Um, but also when they are given feedback They they're not taken on board. They're either telling the person Talking about or they said the wrong thing or I don't know, okay, you know, it's I don't I don't want to stop. Yeah, I was about to start the fashion. I mean, I'm not good at because this is happy fun there and we're not we're not doing a detail you mentioned clubhouse and Uh, it's interesting. Um I did I got an invite to clubhouse. Um, and I never used it I'm on it But I'm not quite sure how it works and also is it clubhouse not just kind of um What's cool, um, it's not just this and again or something because I think that's always it's nice to have chats and and within the the tpe my tonight would say we can have Zoom chats and things like that and that's kind of one of the things that This kind of discussion this this back and forth even if it's about one photograph We have a little track is this is where the the the real magic happens How about reading stuff in the book? It's about somebody kick-sliding a discussion and having Round table that people talk about because it gives you perspective and it gives you Uh, you know a viewpoint Which of course is perspective Um about how things can see from a from a different way and how you can improve your photography by seeing what other people see In other pictures because it might just kick start something and that's really it's So I spend all day I think around I wouldn't get the chair Then I have to uh, I did my last my last day of sale in my studio today. Again, that'll be in my other video Um Thank you, Nicholas. That's very kind of you. Um, this is actually, um, again without this. This is a Yeah, it's a thing but no, thank you. Um, it is a it is actually an IPA. Um, it's it's um Edmunds, which is a very down on the toast near him Um, yeah, um, there's something. Uh, yeah, also, yeah, Paul was saying about to buy me a coffee And it's okay. So all of these things they are, um, you know, they obviously they help support the channel Um, you know that they they help, you know, buy better sound Stuff, um, you know I really do do so much appreciate it. So, you know anything You guys do it really it's it's every time I'm amazed it's like the first time Somebody paid me money for a picture It's that every time is that feeling is like Wow Somebody Somebody bought my picture That's amazing. It was it's a feeling it was uh Yeah, the same as well the first time I saw my name with it with a buy line in a magazine That's so amazing. Um, and it was in a knitting magazine So, uh, so, um, yeah, so not quite, um, you know the rock and roll What a thing I'm gonna do with a picture of somebody outside of a shop who sold knitting needles So, so there you go. Um, yeah, you I did not know But it's the first picture I've got buy on them. So it's it's like awesome. I love it. Oh Steve. Thank you ever so much Uh, yeah for joining and it's been that's absolutely Thank you. Thank you ever so much. Um Yeah, hi vintage click. Thanks for being here. How's it? How's it? Um, you know, and and Uh Sorry Um Thank you. Um, yeah, I love that See this is the kind of thing. This is why I do it because I you know, I love sharing with the You know the photography with you guys and then and then It's a romantic video. I love it. It's it's it's absolutely Wonderful. Um, yeah, I'll judge it is isn't it? It's crazy the first time, you know people People talk about these sort of things. Um, you know, so it it is It's been an incredible journey. Um, you know, I absolutely love the fact that that everybody You know seems to to really get a kick from you know from the from the from the videos That I produce And and it just it means so so very much to me, uh, I You know, I I can't actually Begin to tell you That my experiences with with tiki and the people who I've met and the opportunities that have Come away. Um So far, uh, you know have been amazing. Um You know, it's just like I can't It's like the uh, the the there's a dull one video. Um, you know, she was she said like She saw the video and and There's the studio got in touch with me and said, I really like the video and there's really was this So send you a copy of her book and said, oh, yeah, that's that's awesome. Uh, hey, thanks Mika, that's um, that's fantastic. Thank you ever so much. Um, and yeah, so that was really nice. I got a signed copy of of uh, Elizabeth Owens, um, exposures, uh, which which is fantastic, but it's a beautiful book um, uh, Larry Burrows is um, why? So his daughter and she reached out to me and after the video about her dad who was treasured for sure, uh in the teller of the bit number and and said how much she enjoyed Watching the video that I'd made about her dad and that's kind of Well, uh, you know, that is amazing. Uh, Bob Carlos Clark, uh, the studio of the gallery that represents him Um, saw his video and said that was a really, you know, great video and and the other old house video just just recently I'm friends with him on facebook and uh, I said to him I'm going to tell you about you and um, he said, oh, yeah, man. Um, Yeah, you're quite a popular channel. A bunch of people have said me Send me a link to your video. Um, so we had a bit of a chat and he's actually sent me a PDF of the book. There's really a lot to draw now I'm sorry. Um, but the the PDF of the book that he's has been struggling to get published um, you know for For some time. So that was I was like, oh, I got that. Well, thank you for this much And I hope that possibly me or maybe as a community we could do something to try and I don't know We'll try and get you know people like like opi who's who are They're deemed not financially viable as as photographers Um, you know to to help them get Things published or I don't know. I said to them we often I dare Andries has Andries. Um, it was quite late for 11 o'clock. Is that the boss? Yeah, my um, my father was always Always good. Um, and cast this funny enough. I was just listening to Uh, anyway, that's kind of coming off another sort of thing. Um, it's a great scale. Thanks, man. That's uh, again, I said earlier Man is a Hangover from my beautiful Um, so glad to have you. Well, thank you for being here. Um, at a vote. Um, I think I learned to paint through internet. Um Yeah, I I did find that it's interesting. You said a robot was saying about, um, learned to paint online and having good people Teach you help you. Um, but then said that was in 2007. I have Certainly felt because I've been on the internet since Oh god, like 28k days. So let's say 90 to 93 that back then until you up until 30 recently probably just prior to sort of Facebooky kind of sort of thing sort of the real proliferation of that That it did feel more of a community that it felt more supportive and that you could find Clumps of people who were like-minded Um, who weren't just like a big ego contest. Um, I'm trying to compete with each other the thing And that they would be very supportive and very helpful about giving you Well, what you need it, um, you know, and there was an interesting article that I read about how Um, oh, what was it? Geocity? Uh, sorry, everyone else is trying to step up Um, uh, yes, it is. Um, so, you know, Um, about how all those places felt Nick is the wrong word, but they felt welcome. They felt like a little your unique place in in the internet And you could you could be crazy and are the weird and just have this Place that you could do your own thing with and because it required just a little bit of coding knowledge That everybody was like, hey, you know, it was a very nice community. Whereas these days It just seems a lot of things and again, I don't want to deal with the whole thing. Um, but the internet has brought them has just become a place to be I've got a bit of a shouty with each other and and that doesn't that I don't think that should be the case and certainly that's that seems to be the case with um That seems to be the case with Uh, a lot of places that especially deal with with critique, you know, art sort of thing. Um, so hopefully, um You know, hopefully the tiki community, um, well because it's it's my house So I can tell you that we're not doing that here. I bet it. I think it's time to try and rekindle that and foster that that spirit of Supportiveness that that we should all get and I certainly got that at first It's quite the fact that you have never known critique until you've had your fellow students That's how I'm going when you have 12 of your peers in your room Yeah, yeah, anyway, um, yeah, as I say dolly Thanks. Um, uh, yeah, I was just saying this is um, very basic setup. Uh, this is youtube web Live streaming so I don't actually have any control Um over the audio but um, and I keep waving this Like this is going to fix everything. Um, but I am In the process of I'm trying to include uh, because I sort of put Uh, this web stream together, um, please for the last minute. I haven't got But next time much improved, but thank you for being here. Anyway, dolly, that's awesome and arizona all these people from arizona Um, yeah, let me just check some Um, because it should be audio. No, that's Um, I don't know this is Is it um one I'm trying to figure that out the great benzene. Thank you ever so much and that that is awesome And send to aragon. Um, thank you. That's very kind of that. I would have this Um, thank you. Um, yeah, the sound has always been a thing. It's it's like, um Uh, uh, what would people quote? Um It's it's my Let me just check here something Um, no. Oh, so what so you can't change the audio setting? Yeah, okay, so youtube right so next time I've got obs, which is I thought that's a broadcast system or something Um, let's hope I next time we're using that with proper audio Which you'll see, um And But thank you for being here. Anyway, um, I hope that um, uh If this has gone over to the webcam audio, I'll be very annoyed because I'll be aware of the sense of like Anyway, uh, also I can't hear the audio that's coming through. Um, Coming through the Think of youtube to give any any feedback about the audio I don't want to say the sound but it's it's it's possibly I don't know if um, because I can't change it in Uh, in in in stream. There's no way of changing the this thingy Because it could be that what that 4g Tap your mic. Yes. Let's let's do that. Okay. Look at that There you go Anybody? Yep. Okay. We'll see. Um, I think it's I think it's gone over to is um, I think it's gone over to the webcam audio, which is really You know, you can plug in the task into the pc. Yes, I do. Um, uh, what happened is that I was try No, it's it's gone over to webcam like Really really annoying Um, oh stream manage super good to manage. Um, now Yeah, okay. Let's let's go and see what we can do in pc setting. Um, because earlier it was on Um, yeah, it's it's weird. Let's just microphone If we If we do I don't know Who knows who knows who knows? Where it's more than sadistic they do. Um, I can well thank you for Bearing with me Maybe it's just it's just going to be my hallmark. You know Chuckie your sound sucks Sorry, my gaming nickname is truckie. Um, and And Yes, and now what happens is, um, uh, yeah, I did try there's a lot of broadcasting. Um, it's got a little bit Confusion, um, so the next one I'll do with coppermine and what have you now they've got the task I can actually plug in my Blackmine Be a lot better But yes, you know, we're gonna all come together and rather than talk about photographs. We're gonna solve my sound issues Um, uh, it's a it's a it's a dedicated port on the back but on the IO panel Um, yes, you know, yeah, um, yeah, as you said, uh, uh, women's work production. Yes, um, unfortunately one of the drawbacks of YouTube live is that yeah deal with it like It's like they don't give you any option to like do a test recording or Uh, or or just, you know, you know, like a Skype test call it's like Why not just let me do a test Um Yes, so we were sort of saying, um, you know about sort of, you know talking the journey and what I have to do and it's I'm still absolutely surprised and amazed. Um about how Responsive people seem to be about the very things that I enjoy talking about and and it has it's such a an absolute pleasure To to to get emails from people saying, you know, um Um, you had to say how much they enjoy the video. Um, you know, how much to share things with me You know saying about opportunities They don't come away. Um, you know, and and I'm surprised that how many people who are who are who are veterans who are who are experienced photographers of like 50 years also, um have reached out to me and said how much they enjoy the videos How much they enjoy You know the things that I talk about and and and feel like it's finally the things that got them into photography are being passed on somehow to to to other people that who are not in not in the industry or they're new to photography Uh, and there's a lot of people also who have come back to photography from You know, just from years of not doing, you know, they're kind of addicted in their 60s Um, and what have you and and it's so It's so beautiful to see that and and I just I I would never have ever imagined I thought maybe if I'm lucky I'd get like a thousand subscribers a year or something like that but I'd to to to basically have this channel for From essentially from the end of March. Um, you know, so so prior to March. I think very few of you We're we're here. There's been a couple of people who said that, you know, they've been with me since There's been there's a couple of names that I I've recognized From the beginning, but but this is a very new journey for all of us, you know, I Have only been making videos since November You know, the rich government took me two weeks Two weeks to put together Um, basically because I had to learn to which it was all And um Yeah, um It's You can do yes, you actually get good pull good point of pull. Um You know, it's It's it's a platform that I just I can't believe that you guys have have given me permission to to take some of your very precious time and and share Share the things that I I miss talking about it. I said to somebody This last year or something that I spent all my time or I spent a lot of my time at the last 10 or so years Okay, being around photographers Who don't talk about focus who talk about lenses and how did you take that picture and how Do you make this price guide? How do you find and stuff and and very few of them want to talk about new topographics or you know photographs that just Make you But you know and and and the the the great core of photography all those things that that got us into Picking up the camera in the first place. There's the magic of seeing but I think somebody asked, um You know if I still should film I I haven't shot film For a while. I do actually have Five rolls of triads. Um, which I find on the day. Isn't that lovely when you find random bits of flying around Um, uh, and when we've completed our houseboat, um, I've got space to put in my dark room So I will probably do dark room and now that I've older. I've got a bit more financially viable to to experiment with with wet processes. I'd like to try this and Uh, clothing stuff, uh, and what have you which would be quite fine. But this is the whole thing, you know, it's about finding things and all of us we're discovering You know these passions and and you guys have inspired me as much as I I believe that, you know, somebody feedback that you've been I've inspired you and and that's the great thing. I'm now more I am now more about photography than I have been in ages and And it's it's fantastic. It's I am rediscovering the joy like so many of of you guys are it's It's I just Yeah, it's so nice to see, um, you know, and and I you know, there's, um um Sorry to be some of the commenter, um, you know, and it's wonderful. And also, you know, I've mentioned a number of times that I was Really, I wish you students, um, and it's nice To be hey, thank you so much, uh, do we that's also a little Little dude doing that thing there. Um, you know, that's fantastic. Um that there is I've got a chance to to Show because because uh, the the head of my department at photo school, um is uh, basically on Facebook, and I know that he's watched some of these these videos and he sort of follows me on Chats and times times. Um as is one of my other lecturers and some other people who Opinions I really respect in in photography and and they have all said very positive things about The videos and that means a great great deal to me. Um, which I know is how we should do There's always nice that people whose opinions you do respect though That's really good. I like it and it's also, you know, it's nice for me to to say to to both lecturers who With the benefit of you know, so 25 years hindsight I didn't I must admit the life That I did actually get They got through to my big skull um You know what? There was something that got inside there and it grew over time. It's also a great idea to say all that I've been working Years or so To say like that. Look, you know what the time I dropped out of first school and you were very Anti at the time and and why have it but look none of this was it wasn't wasted It's only now that that flower with the seed that was part of that. It's been given a chance to to really flower to you know to to come up. Um And and and you guys have given me that That opportunity so I've been doing a lot of gardening recently So this is he'd be utilizing my so what my my growth um, but maybe it's just like we've fertilizing each other So that's um, forget that Um, but you know, it's but it's those other things. Um, that's uh, you know, it's it's wonderful to have It's wonderful to have you guys on this this journey with me as I think we all discover Um Um, maybe I should just get a t-shirt. It says I shoot small You know, and it's it's got you know, it's just you know, it's it's a wonderful Uh, you know, it's a wonderful experience to be able to do this and and you know, uh I just love the oh look at this. Yeah, totally lay it says and now we don't Um, but wet processes and he's in the process of building a 20 by 24 inch What can wow that's wonderful. See that kind of gear I find interesting. Um, you know, the alternative processes Oh But it's it's nice, you know Um Granny days, I've heard of granny days. I've also haven't watched many of the videos. Um, and if you're asking why the um If you're wondering why the the color balance changes every time I scratch my head I must have something in my head. It's connected from here to the Um, uh, was it full of land days? Um, I'm still No, go up. Um Because I must have not heard I'll go check that out But uh, but yeah, you know, it's um So you see it's a Jamage or j-mage so, um, you know and it's Thanks, um, you know, I think this is one of the things is that He's saying that, you know, when you found the job when we were searching in youtube Trying to start this new hobby of Of photography is that it is important. I think that people talk about, you know, how to Uh, you know, master the technicalities at least at least understand what's going on, uh, with the camera, but that's But you can only take that so far and then you get into this murky world of Uh, we get exposed to the right and then do this coming back and stuff. Okay, and it's basically it's That's really I don't know how much, you know, obviously it means something to a lot of people. Um, you know, they enjoy that aspect of photography But I have to say I have never I've never done it. I don't know what that that that you say that button focusing is I'm gonna have to But I don't think it really impacts my photography at all. Um You know, and I said you don't think for the majority of photographers that sort of thing makes any better type of photograph What does make you better photograph is is being in an environment where people say, look, this is very option Have you considered doing x1 z plans? But not in the case of going Um, uh, sorry really John. I'm sort of thinking ideally I like to do sort of one of months I think that would be quite nice on a on a Friday. It also means that um, it will give me time to iron out some of the Audio gremlins Which is quite good, but thank you ever so much for being here. Um, and have have been I have Yeah, you know we're talking about um People who are offering advice But not trying to make you them And that and the internet's full of those kind of people saying that I But you know, I would have done x1 z plans And that doesn't really help a lot of new photographers because They're trying to then be like The person who's teaching them You know, because they're trying to copy what they do exactly. They're saying buying a lightning pre-set Well, fine You know, I get it that there is it's it's the same buying a cookie book and people teaching me to make a dish like they make it um And that will take you so far but with If you're learning to express yourself once you've got the basics down Why would you start using bits of other people's work doing that? To talking about Things that are slagging off people. I don't like we're not going to slag Um, you know, which is good. Um, yes, it's a suit. Um, yeah, I was gonna say, um, I'm thinking sort of once a month On a Friday, and that would probably be um, be a good A very good level. Also, you have to trust it Set this out. Uh, not my tea. My tea for the top of Um, yes, I got um, yeah, I saw that the headset thing Which have you uh, yes, I said was the once month. Um, and if you were you know, I should do those You know, you know What camera is in my pocket when I leave the house? That's it. Um, if I if I do like to take pictures um I I just use um, I use my camera So I'll take a picture of you guys right now for my first live stream Oh, look at that very meter me take the picture But that it is literally that um, I do the majority of my photography on my iPhone Um These days simply because it is a camera that I have to have um, I also now have a usually a three-year-old attached to my leg and and Not the best accessory I find for taking photographs Um, so so I felt a lot a lot easier And also having grown up in in South Africa. Um, I I do feel ever so slightly uncomfortable walking around with a larger uh a camera in my hand All my cameras are Probably DS5 d-mop 2 and 5ds And they're all up on them. So they're actually quite heavy. So these days with especially the charts And I like issue square, so I like square. Um, which is quite nice Yeah, um chris. It's interesting. We mentioned so chris has asked about will I consider interviewing some of the contemporary photographers whose work I've looked at? um Yes, I do. I do. I am Hopefully going to have some of that in Say we're also this is now this is there's number one staff talking Um, yeah, I've There's a couple of guys mentioned somebody Um, so he's a he's a problem. He's been working in the in music industry since all A while, um, certainly probably 80s Um, so lots of of course, but like his photograph jam and you know Kill and sound guard and the whole shoot much. So yeah, I thought we quite interesting to have And interview with him. There's another guy. There's a Dutch culture who is kind of doing an exhibition and so we talked to him about his and then um, there's a company that makes backdrops and I've been communication with their owner about talking to some of their Their ambassadors. Um, so downwinders Is one of them and he's been asked around to see who would be interested in In having a chat. Um, yes, I think that would be a very useful sort of thing because um, You know, certainly we we can all learn so much from From listening to other photographers' perspectives of their take on things. Um, and I do think it's a it's a shame that the photographers We see they say last for 10 or 15 years or so. So where do you get Exposure to the mainstream Uh, we do at least in the UK that there was a period in the sort of the late 70s where there was a whole bunch of of Documentaries showing about about you know, about the old great photographers, you know, the old brands and I use some of those as Uh as Source material for some of the videos. Um, so by having a series of interviews would be would be fantastic So if you guys were up for that, um Yeah, by all means are you quite right now? I thought it's not a camera But it has it has a lens Killian is asking, um, do you smell a good photo around the corner? Um, now you just I don't know if I can yeah, I get what you can do like this idea. I've been instinctive sort of thing. Um, when I was waiting to talk Uh, I shot Documentary and kind of style and and you do get a feel you're gonna feel for when something's going to happen When when there's when things are coming together and and it A lot of the time it's come from just watching what's what's passing me by and I think That's kind of one of the things you want to walk if you look at if you're looking to do something is to be So, you know, what works for me is to be slow is to just kind of look around, you know walk around I'm trying not to to be too obvious about Is it the Gary Wong Don't Those don't insist on the flesh down. Um, yeah inconspicuous much. Um You kind of you start to get a feel you can read what's going on you get it, you know, you get it You're feeling Occupy And Sometimes it builds up in little increment Like you could see things and then other times it it it just kind of tends to Come like a wave and then it's it's gone and you're kind of you You've anticipated that wave coming and it gets it and quite often Your ears I think that's like that is a much Much I'm gonna say some pretty bad English are much unused. Um, a very unused and underutilized aspect of photography, especially documentary and so street chocolate is yours. Um, You know, it should be you should be listening. Um, you know you know wedding is a good example people cheer and they They get vocal that's something interesting that's happening. Uh, and that's kind of a that's a shoe There might be something behind you is going on. So, you know, um You know, so um, uh, yeah, these fears of my three rod. Um, I think I'm the one they need to offer. He's it He's currently at the um, the throwing thing So Uh, yeah, so he's kind of um Do you know what he's he He used to be really Good about having his picture taken. Um, and I don't mean like Standing there and and having a picture taken. I mean like he wouldn't would be fuss about the camera. He wouldn't do anything Um, and then you know, he's been going to school. He's been going to school and I have never told him what to say cheese Um, I don't like the cheese I don't want him going into the camera. Um, and I think they've been telling him to smile at school Whenever I like to push on my phone with my camera, you turn down the best tea Just a little part of me guys inside. So I have to be a little bit more so A little bit more sneaky about how I take pictures of him Yes, I think it's a bit a bit way off You know, um, how did I find uh inspiration? Um, you know to see the interesting enough, um, I For a lot of people I think there's there's an idea That that you need to travel you need to have something different To be inspired by things to find the great this to find the interesting person or have it and and so often we don't consider What is around us for photographs? with the opportunity for You know, if we take out if we take a step back And so fine. I'm not allowed out of this room I would force myself to see the potential for photographs You know, then that that's what that's something that the lockdown did for me not so much Looked at the potential for photographs, but making more aware of my immediate surrounding to take joy in in the smaller things Rather than they've just been something surrounded like this. This is a this is this is our favorite You know, and in here there is not too much. There's this bookshelf um And then there's some So rubbish cables and stuff, um So it's not particularly on the face of it interesting Unless you force yourself to look and and that's what I think a lot of people Forced to do to a lot down is look at the same four walls for ages I've just been really used for experience because Instead of going oh, it's something else is holding me back. Are you the lack of an interesting photograph? You realize what's actually holding me back is the fact that you are not Taking the effort to see What's around you to see the opportunity to be told that is constantly around it in in anything it just but you know, it's it's it's there so So that's kind of where you know, where I kind of knocked out was really actually very good at at drawing out this inspiration and helping me, you know, find Find more things to photograph by seeing how much more potential there was in the everyday And that's helpful because it suits my style But but you I said, I hopefully that will kind of sort of answer to see Or help you My william ableston Was a good I know But And apparently when he first started taking photographs, he was bitching to his wife, but there was nothing There's nothing pretty and to take photographs of And everything was ugly. So his wife said we'll go photograph the ugly things, which Of course he did So I must have missed this first comment about the bnh event space And I'm assuming that At least in the central videos where they've had uh life around space And we're just talking about their photography where they they cut a video Chats they're doing to sort of uh to photographers I'm gonna guess that it probably is Because that's one of those things that That I've seen a couple of those on on uh on site especially uh At bnh event I really like like the work Brian Smith, um It's interesting because there's nothing kind of like wow About his his photography and maybe that's a little bit unfair to say that but it's not Maybe it maybe because I'm thinking about it from a more modern perspective But there needs to be some sort of with bangery um that goes on especially magazine Sort of world and you know it needs to be painterly and it all needs to have some sort of Fancy pants uh life and set up or Something like that. So his work just seems to be more in the vein of what you would expect. So from sort of Uh late 1980s sort of mid-90s Of where it's it's less It's less high concept and more kind of just posture Which which is all which aren't always the same same thing um You know, uh, yes, so thumbs up for awesome. Yeah, I'm really I have says it's amazing. I thought I had a like I would have Which would just be me and somebody else who like, hey, you know Let's talk about So like that, um, yes, it'd be it'd be I mean one of the things um That's uh, somebody asked a little while ago About what would be interesting for For me, uh, what would I like the uh, the What would I like with the channel to be what would be my My goal, you know, what would you like to remember? And on on the the bookshelf behind there's a book by Aperture um, now after his magazine Um, and if you are interested in looking in videos of strawberries with with you know, within speaking, uh after having a quite a number of videos on their on their youtube channel Yeah, so this is going back quite well to sort of relate I think this is the 40 So 40 Anyway, so in there there is a an advert for a retreat to Some person So it'd be a week seminar Some hotel and and the speakers are people like episode my wife who's edited After time and for Adams Margaret Burke white Robert kappa There's uh, but it's a whole bunch of Holy crap Like massive massive numbers of names. Yes, uh, and stuff like that. Um, and it's like It's Wow Where are those events these days? I'm not talking about things like here in the uk where we've got the talk to show But you know comes everybody comes along has a speech, you know, they do speak to Or um, oh, what's it? What's place in Vegas? Um, you know And Not that when somebody gives up and gives a speech and then it fuggers off These work the quite clearly going to be because they have an itinerary on on And these are obviously people Coming giving a little speech telling themselves a bit about themselves But then interacting with With the people there into like your ground Chats and breakways and And palm tree talks and I thought how amazing would it be to have a retreat? Like that Pit thanks ever man. That's awesome. Uh, it's from Russell Russell. Let's see People whatever. I love it. I love it. No, thanks. Uh, pit has been really good time here. Um, and The I I think that sort of environment And I appreciate the time to change slightly. Um, would be amazing How great would it be because I've I've had what's improved my my photography The way you show them and my passion for is being around people have been having these these discussions will be on Far smaller scales. So imagine that that you had a retreat of not thousands of people You know Many people That's more than enough to still be But then have somebody, you know, like Alex off being there or Downwinders or, you know, all these people who are great photographers Today we don't know who I feel got got something also to say about And that and that book aperture and I know That book is really interesting to watch especially reading until Adams having to do it Photographers who are trying to make money Yeah, it's it's something's never changed. Um, you know, it's It's just one of the things but that's what I would kind of like to do, you know, and obviously It's a long term plan But I would really like to one day to be over sit With with a lot of you in a room in you know, in a hotel somewhere in the mountains, particularly Whisky or whatever you drink on maybe not the half Um, you know and and talk about talking have discussions really, you know Stick up teeth into the the wonderfulness that is the wire Um, you know, they're nice You know, maybe it's not a project. This was But you know, it's a it's a um You know, Gaston's asking me about your accounts becoming multimedia tools and stuff like that And I think the keyword there is a tool, you know, um, you can buy you can buy any tool for any job, you know drill whatever um, and and really you're not, you know Think about what it is you needed to do, right? Um With the camera manufacturers and I think tool manufacturers in in general anybody who makes something Add bits on to justify why they can keep making a new thing, right? Um, ultimately you know If you need all the bits and bobs on on on your camera, like if you're a sports shooter you need to have a surprise Motorcycle and and really hot ship and focusing um Get get what you need and what you need is just something that's going to capture my You know, it's uh, there's a it has a bit of a basic something but It's it's so easy to get round up in stuff and quite frankly, but the difference between a A A You know a photograph taken by one person or an act is the question taken from not Um, you know, I'll do something what we express yourself in a better way, but ultimately It's it is at all and if you need various functions to do the job at hand then Most of us This is a case of the point um You know, it's uh Um, yes, it's Simon. I I'm I'm a big yeah, I'm a big believer that I'm taking many pictures and I am there is an episode coming up about sort of family photography And I don't think it's a great change that people are Given the ability to delete pictures that they think are not Worthy Right now. Um, and in in my life as a as a as a family What really What really gets me there, um, which I did I did so I agree about is when mothers sit And I look at the pictures And they were not having that one because I look awful in it. Well, I don't like the way I look And you look at them, obviously it is not like What What what what what is the problem there? You look You know, I mean, um and and you and and They just delete photos Of themselves and then, you know, their children and stuff because they don't fit a certain amount of and Those photographs are then gone. That moment is gone. It's just disappeared You can't go back and Have it again and When that person is long gone And those photographs are the all that remain of that person There will be giant gaps in their life because that person You Their children their grandchildren don't give a rat talk about the side of that that bum or whatever They just they just want to see them or their daughter Um But that's a sort of Um, you know sort of thing about that. Um, yeah, it's just It's it's all sort of things. Um Alice is asking about so street photo contests. Um It Contest is very I don't know If you want to go in the contest then farmers, I think are you going to learn anything from from being in a contest or seeing Work I don't think necessarily learning from Being in a contest. Um, looking at the work of other photographers who have been in that contest is is probably helpful Inspiration for you to be able to see the work of other photographers. Uh, the biggest thing with with, um With Contests is that they are a giant effort and um, and that's always that's always the big Issue and it's the same at photo school the same wherever there is any element of Grading or competition or marking or anything like that that you will Have to conform to what the person who is marking you or grading you or judging you what And okay, they appreciate that they should be forming themselves But what happens is all the all the pictures to do well is because they take they take certain boxes You know, or you get in a situation like the trailer wasting um approach competition here in the uk so the trailer wasting is the um approach competition where um On the uk is it is quite times anyway one year I rate it one next year Most of the inches already Then it was a set of referee prints So what happened next the year after that? It And so on and so forth. So so this is kind of what happens and people see what one the year before And then there's a deluge of that kind of image And and you see it so often. Um, and so so competitions really are I He says because I have I do in a tutorial um But yeah, I think it's I if you're looking at them as a place to learn Uh, I see you get more traction from looking through books or going to a library or or just going online Um, and and looking up great pictures if you google great pictures of the whole list So look at it work See what you like see what you don't like And Uh So it's like um, yeah, I uh women's work I did um I would I would like to take a workshop. Um, that's certainly the the starting point with the tp community On the mitre network site. That's a little link In the description box below is is a step towards that. Um, I'm still finding my feet setting on the online sort of world and and and seeing What people would be interested in in in seeing Um, and and I don't want to You know, I don't want to disappoint you for some other sort of fun Right before I can walk And I would like to do the workshop. I have done some workshops Here at my studio in the past just In But obviously it's more of a worldwide thing and these days You know, the the ability to be online certainly helps Uh quite a lot and and and within the mitre network group, which is the background that we use for the Uh for the tp community that uh, there is the the facility to do that and have Zoom conversations and Stupid, you know stupid, but you know people submit work to they have a kind of a group So Time to your question. Yes, I am going to be doing workshop at some And I very much hope that you guys will be um, you know, if you have any sort of things that you think might be and make an interesting, uh Yes idea for a workshop. Then please feel free to, you know, drop me an email I do try to to respond to as I possibly can Sometimes get lost in Um, but also on the list of things to do because I'm very youthful It's actually their property for you guys just because You know, I like to get into the Let's just keep using my team more Um address, but uh, be a workshop Would be really nice Uh Yes, oh that seems like that authentic aesthetic. That's that's interesting that you mentioned. Um, this side to one screen Uh, Sasha going I'm going to search for that Um, uh, I don't think that uh, oh, there we go. Um Who are the sources who see that um start up a change. Okay. Well, I'll have looked at um, uh later on Yeah, it judging is always such a tricky thing really, isn't it? Um, you know I like something that You know, you might have It's a thing. Um, and I think as soon as you start making photography like the set of checkboxes like with the old, um Uh, uh, with codec judging criteria, which is like a whole rule book how you judge things um Well, then it's just like a maths problem As long as it's done properly you should win um so You know It's a thing. It's it's it's one of those. Um Yeah mobile photography, um Yeah, um there's Yeah, it's mobile. Um Alley you Um, yes, it's about mobile photography. Um, you know, and it says do do you see you'll take photos? And and do you find it to be some special the word professional in photography, um Hmm, it's thrown around a lot, doesn't it? What makes professional? um Who knows uh, uh, you know, we could say it could be a number of it Is it because is somebody who makes their living from photography? Or somebody just charges for photography or Is it a way that you behave? Uh, and I've always felt probably the third because I know a lot of people who are by definition amateur photographers who behave with professional work And then there are very many professionals who behave in a decidedly amateurish way and So Ultimately, I think is how you behave. I think it's bad It's not about whether or not you charge money for photography or um Again, everybody's gonna DM me DM me. Um It yeah, it's not sorry. I've been working with um, I just realized I've been in teams of god um um the Yeah, being professional um Is a statement. There's a way you behave. It's about how you think about the process about how you you keep medium photography with respect I mean, you know, it's and that's not to say you take it seriously It's up. But you treat this thing with respect that you you do as good a job that you feel that you can do The camera that you use does not make you a professional I think and I can't emphasize that enough It does not make you An amateur does not make you professional. So he doesn't make you good or bad um, the best wedding that I have a photograph and if you are interested because uh, it is on my facebook page my personal facebook page um, so uh, I'm not gonna give the link but um, I think you can find my long name Um, and my facebook page is just in public. Um, there's a wedding on there Uh, it was a very good friend of mine. Um, that wedding was photographed entirely on a plastic fantastic So the camera in 1.8, plastic, no um Most people most A lot of people would say that's a completely unprofessional thing for this. Um You can it's not it's not a pro lens um It's like so, yes, um, no, I don't I don't if somebody tells you just because you have a mobile You use a mobile phone to take pictures Isn't making any less professional that is, you know They're they're better now than they were you know, they If they went to school for coming in um 15 years ago or so properly, um The image quality is a better Yeah, um, so so I hope I hope they answered I said, um, you know, I answered your question. Um Yeah, it's um tgh It's interesting. I loved the conversations All all sorts of things like that. Um, you know, how the portraits She did survive in the area or something. Well, it's interesting because, um I just closed my hand, but it wasn't because it So uh, and I will get into it in another in a natural video. So I won't do too much Um on it on it now, but People do actually want to put a picture of yourself up in the wall That that is that is the Um, and they don't necessarily want to put a selfie um So, you know, I don't I in fact I got a pretty much to to photograph my family Um, and you did a very good job and and it was interesting to be on the other side of the camera And to go through the whole process and but Important studios, um, if you're thinking that's a Some of them do very well There are still many studios who who and and I know personally Um, at least just without even thinking about it. Um, who are doing You know Yeah, they they they have struggled last 30 months like everybody. Um, you know the prior thought of that Yeah, it's it's fine. It's It's so often a lot of people I think who struggle at business Will try and find the blame elsewhere. Um, I won't say that I am any I I was ever a Fantastic talk for more In my in my studio But it's it's still it's still good Yeah, please move money that you certainly kept me To keep your life. Um, yeah, give roof over my head so Bill's pay. Um, you know, I don't live in a I live in a Real area. Um, it's it's just how you present things. I think the biggest challenge that the people have got Is that The the ground has shifted under them a little bit And and the modern psyche where the where the modern family thinks about itself and and has changed And photography marketing hasn't evolved with it photography marketing now Is still the same as it was When the garatak studio's open So the so the family industry for most of Nothing has changed. Um The names the names have been changed for the most of it. Um, it's it is just Photographers there's been a bit there's been a shift in the way that that people Take on board marketing And and probably just haven't adapted how they they changed their their strategies about marketing Um, and instead have looked to to blame something else To blame digital to blame software to blame cell phones um Because they're using techniques to try and sell things um That that you can read uh, there's a For those of you in america you may have heard of getting a portraiture Um, and the initial giddings guy writes a story. I read an autobiography about his start And and he talks about the stuff that in the depression, you know going from Town to town developed philosophy Um, you're taking pictures on spec and that's basically what happens today and nothing has changed, you know So so all of a sudden is I think, you know, just people They they they they're not techniques the way that model people So it's them and and and see it and they're just kind of like hey, you know Get these memories now before they're too late because they're gone. They've just grown up and out the door And they're not speaking to they're not speaking to To the mother. They're not they're not pressing the right um I hope the right buttons which sounds Sounds manipulative, but they're just not they're not speaking To the mother they're talking Um, which is which is one of those those sort of things. Um, so I've been really I've been sitting here talking Two hours, uh and and ten minutes. Um, and and I have to say that I was really worried before stuff at this What am I going to what am I going to talk about? Um And and if you know talking about portrait studios if you want to be a successful portrait Most people actually I'm not Into talk with as a job This is the one thing That I wish that I've been taught taught that sort of story is to communicate people You just chat Getting to open up and if you are a portrait photographer or into documentary or any of those sort of stuff Talk to them Get just talk to them about anything find something that they're interested in and talk to them about it Because they will open up to you and they will show themselves And if you are a portrait photographer, you should spend most of your time doing this I've been talking to a screen and it's I knew it's weird because the the webcam's up there, but I'm looking at my eyes here So I've probably spent the entire looking down like this. Um But this is I could I've had a conversation with the screen Obviously guys are all there and and and I love it and it feels like you're here, but that's because We're all like a big big badminton, which is which is awesome. No. No. No. It's fine. I'm women's workshop So is it women's work production company? Sorry. Yeah, so Um women's workshop production Um, no, no, no, I was you find and it's something it seems because I am going to touch on it in a video It's nice to kind of work through some ideas, but it is a thing. It's a bit talking Um within any photography you deal with with people in any sort of work um To know we make them feel like you are listening that you see them That you understand you are and we look straight for you. Yeah, you out there that one talk to me, right? Talk to me. Just just connect me. I just you know We're all humans No, it's not long, but I just use that we should see someone wrong It's not something anyway, ladies gents it has been um It's it's been absolutely fantastic and I thank you ever so much. Um, for Um, you know for being here Um, there's and there's one last question. I see alexis before we Um, you know, it's We're tired up with all this. Um, how to value at your own skills. Probably find those two. Um it's Really, you know How to find You know You're gonna know if you look at one of your pictures, you're gonna sit down and go I don't like this or don't like that. I think that's That's the thing that that answers your two questions. You can look at one of your photos and go in after you've taken it So I can what don't I like about this picture? It's got positions a bit off Pick one thing One thing at a time and work on that one thing just Don't don't confuse your mind pick one pick one thing and You know, you will you will know about a better in these skills because ultimately if you're not happy with it Then that's all you need to know But you can you know to the to the most part It's here if you're not if it's not feeling it here it probably needs to be Improved polished until it feels better for you here If you really want to get input from somebody else Find somebody who you trust and ask them if you're being over If you're being overly sensitive to that one thing to deal with a problem Um, but don't ask your partner or your wife who has been doing like that um Because they're too close to you It's somebody who's who's opinion Who's not emotionally attached to you? Um, yeah, so there we go guys. It's been it's been awesome. And I think this side towards screen dude I have no idea. Sorry You've been here for the whole time. It's lovely. Um, thank you. Thank you guys all of it and and hopefully It won't be too long because it may then pay two million views and you know 35 Yeah, thank you ever so much have a wonderful weekend where you are if it's the beginning of the day if you have an awesome Friday and uh, yeah, so June I'm going to show you If you have enjoyed the live stream and you'd like to support the channel, please just drop me a little note below Use one of the options or whatever would be fantastic. I really appreciate it and uh, yeah, I'll see you all again soon Thank you for being here. It's been awesome