 I think if you were to make an investment thesis on Ethereum, it's that these new DeFi things, if they succeed, it will lock up a significant supply of the Ethereum, and that will be like upward pressure on the price because you'll have all this- It's already, 800 million's already locked up. Yeah. So, you got all this supply locked up so that it's just like the ICO boom, what happened there was all these- But it's no different than hodlers of Bitcoin. It's similar, yes, it's similar, and that's why I said if you were to make an investment thesis on it, you know, it's that the more supply that gets locked up, the less sell pressure there is, the supply shock kind of contributes to a price rise, same as the Bitcoin happening, but that needs users and that needs a lot of usage, and I just don't see that data showing that people are going to use it, and I naturally don't think that people are going to want to use an algorithmic stablecoin versus Bitcoin, which has a much easier to understand like thesis behind it, digital gold like makes sense to people when they hear about that. So that's why I don't own much ETH other than- I'll say if you're forgetting that Bitcoin has been around eight years before anything else. Yeah. Yeah, and ETH is like- Only three years now coming up. ETH has been following similar pattern of Bitcoin in its history. I'm not here as an ETH head, I actually have zero loyalty to anything. I'm just looking at this from like objective standpoint. Yeah, and I'm not like one of those people that are like, oh, ETH is a scam. I don't own any because I don't find it that interesting in terms of- I feel like if you're looking at cryptocurrency to get a return on your investment and you're looking for exposure to this new asset class, then just own Bitcoin because it's going to have a much higher chance of succeeding as a global money than any other cryptocurrency because it's the most decentralized and censorship resistance in the end is, like you said, the most important part of why cryptocurrencies have value and Ethereum has proven itself to be more centralized because of the Dow hack where code was law until code wasn't law anymore and they intervened and refunded everybody. But since then, I don't think that's necessarily a bad thing because there's a big huge segment of people that want to be rescued and want bailouts. Look at the global financial system, it's worth like lots of money and people don't care about decentralization there. So I'm not saying ETH is not a good value proposition to invest in if you know what you're doing and if you know how to analyze this stuff. And if you do think that Maker Die is going to be used by people in Latin and stuff and has an interesting use case and ETH will probably go up. It has an interesting use case. Like I said, I don't have any bags whatsoever. I have zero skin in the game when it comes to this. The underlining what excites me is the underlining opportunities or underlining new initiatives that people are building is exciting. Yeah. I agree with you there, man. Like I think it is an interesting concept to have an algorithmic stablecoin that is not centralized and that anybody can participate in that rewards you some kind of interest like an interest bearing account. It's better than Tether because Tether is centralized. You mentioned narratives just wait till Libre launches, if they launch everyone's going to go on that thing. Well, yeah, I think that's why I'm not as strong as a Die fan because in the end I feel like it comes back to Libre is going to eat everybody's lunch. Libre is going to be the only stablecoin that matters and Libre is going to then introduce people to cryptocurrency because they're going to search what is cryptocurrency and then Bitcoin is going to be the one everybody sees, not Die because they already have Libre and not ETH because ETH is more like whatever the narrative is at the year. I have no idea what the narrative of ETH is right now. Open Finance, DeFi is the current one. But it's also money. There's a real strong growing trend of Ethereum analysts and funds and all that stuff now that they're trying to push ETH as money and they're competing with Bitcoin as as a digital gold. They're trying to push that. And to be fair, who's to say what is digital gold? If a million people use ETH as money, then ETH is money. Like it's just I can't say ETH is not money. If people are using it as money. So, you know, even though I'm more on the maximalist side, we just have to wait and see how it all shakes out. But I got my bets on Bitcoin. Yeah, listen, like I said, Bitcoin to me is a censorship resistant. That's that's the only thing I care about is every ten minutes a block is mined and censorship resistant. Anything else to me is irrelevant. Yeah, and those maker die guys, it's not an Ethereum specific project. They can switch it to Bitcoin. Well, they just did. They just switched to multi collateral and their plans is to eventually get Bitcoin. Yeah. Yeah. So it's like it's same as the ICO boom. It was like all these projects launching on Ethereum. Well, this is going to give Ethereum value because look at all the uplift we're going to get from this. And it did while all this ETH was locked up in these token treasuries. Yeah, that's the other thing that's like a lot of these projects have big, huge treasuries and they're all competing against each other for similar niches of developer mind share. Yes. Enterprise and like DApps and stuff. Public and enterprise. Yeah. And it's like it reminds me of the the Bcash community, the RBTC community. When they forked off, it was mostly Bitcoiners arguing with BCH people who were the big blockers. And then when BSV forked BCH, it then became mostly majority of BSV and BCH fighting each other, which was like Bitcoiners got to outsource their trolling to the other communities because they just they just started to cannibalize each other. And it still goes on now. You go to RBTC and there's like it used to be that all the downvoted comments were from Bitcoiners. Now it's all mostly from BSV people. So do you think maybe that because of all these big, you know, transactions per second, enterprise, enterprise, blockchain projects coming online in the same time in the next 12 months, you think it's maybe going to like. Is there going to be an outlier? Do you think like one that does really well or are they all going to be like eating each other's lunch? So far from the enterprise, because just of mind share has been hyper ledger and Ethereum. Private chains, but they're hyper ledger is Bitcoin is Ethereum, right? Is a private Ethereum or no? No, it's different, but they have the same EVM now. So you can it's interoperable. They can use it together. But you have you have interesting projects coming up that are very focused on enterprise. But I, you know, for me is like, I'm sure there's a lot of interesting Fortune 500 companies out there building on other platforms, but I don't hear about it. It's not public. Do you think that any of these big projects that have these huge treasuries are going to be viable investments for an average person or for the sort of like an interested crypto person? Way too complicated for the average person. Yeah. Way too complicated. Even if Bitcoin is complicated for the average person, like just getting just getting a wallet and teaching them about a seed phrase and keeping that safe is complicated enough. Might as well talking about proof of stake and all this other stuff. It's like it's not for the average person. It's like when Coinbase started giving people zero X, like learn about the zero X protocol and get some ZRX tokens. Like, what the hell? Like people on Coinbase don't need to know what ZRX is. Yeah, those tokens. No, we're not even close to at least in North America, maybe Asia, Korea is a little bit different, but we're not even close to penetrating the mind share of crypto. It has nothing to do with the narrative is kind of actually kind of does. But it's just the ease of use isn't here. Yeah, I mean, like, yeah, the use, the eyeballs are not there. And even if they are, it's still. There's so much out there. There's so there's too much for people to choose. There's too many options. There's too many coins for the small amount of traders and small amount of users. Remember, we are market cap. Obviously, you see in coin market cap. What's that like two to sixty to seventy. Oh, it's way less. You're talking about total or Bitcoin? Total. Total is like 220 right now. But yeah, and I don't know if that's the accurate figures. Let's say, you know, probably like 150. Yeah, bro, the fuck is that? Yeah, it's it's not very high. Well, you know, like Apple is bigger than all of that. Apple's a trillion or something, isn't it? Yeah, 10 X that. Yeah. So, you know, we have a long way to go. Yeah. And like for me, we're still we're still building the pipes of the industry. It's like key management's not here. Identity from different chains is in here. So the interoperability, stupid word, I fucking hate it. But, you know, ease of use, I should call it. It's not here. You know, I mean, like you listen, you can't expect people to remember their seed phrases or if they lose. There has to be some mechanism of getting it, you know, or there has to be. And I think the whole listen, like at the end of the day, we're just really early within the infrastructure, even in Bitcoin's early, like Bitcoin has still a long way to go to build up its infrastructure. For that thing you said, I think it's it's important for mass adoption that people don't lose their coins. Yeah. And they have a way to access their coins. But there's two, there's two arguments for that that I've heard because I think about that, too. One is the Trace Mayor side and Trace Mayor says some people just don't deserve sovereignty. You know, if they don't want to take their own sovereignty. No, but there's no other but there should be options like a if you educate yourself and you're willing to take responsibility. Yes, you can take sovereignty by writing down your seed phrase or putting in, you know, you have it somewhere safe. You understand it. Then yeah, but it's like to his point, though, it's not as complicated as it's people like people figured out how to use the Internet. People figured out if you're talking about movies, if you're talking about mass adoption of crypto, this is why Libre will kick ass because it's literally built into Facebook and I click a button. Yeah. And I think like because it's centralized, right? But if you you're not going to be getting returns on your Libre coins, you're going to be just my whole my whole point like this is saying in marketing, teach them what they want, you know, give them what they want, teach them what they need.