 Hey, good afternoon everybody time Stuart here our guest today is Martha Woodward, and this is smart business moves Martha, how are you? I am good. I'm good. We're minus Liz Yeah, I think she's on a cruise. That's what you said. She's cruising away. So she should not be here I'd say she's drinking my ties, but she's not drinking. So but she's having fun Probably hitting those buffets and if they have like a casino there, she'll probably be spending a little time True boy. She can win in those casinos Well, I'm sure she can lose too. Yeah, I could do it if you play enough you're gonna win It's just a matter of the ratio win till it is right Yeah Yeah, and speaking of casinos that makes me think really the only time I ever gamble is when ISSA goes to Vegas and I've got a few blackjack buddies Dom Williams and then Kyle Walker those two are my blackjack buddies But they're willing to lose a lot more than me Right. Yeah, I win some too. You win some you lose some and oh, yeah Oh, yeah, they'd probably say they win more than they lose. I don't know What's your game Marathon? What do you play when you're in Vegas? you know, I used to play just the slots and I Never manage my money as well as I manage my money when I play the slots. I mean I literally I like the old days where You know, it would cash out into a bucket Well because I would have a winning bucket and a spending bucket and you could keep it separate but then they were on to us and Then make you put money in or the card or whatever and then You have to I do I sit there counting on my hands How many times I'm going to spin that thing Because like I say I never watch my money as well as I do as when I'm gambling So so when your spending bucket is empty and you've got money in your winning bucket Do you just kind of dump that in your spending bucket and start over? No, that's what I'm saying I'm I'm really good at trying that would be that's kind of what happens when it's on a card, right? You just right and you know when you had the buckets it was easy But I think they figured that out and then they made it all Just dump into one little total and so yeah, you have to keep track of How many spins but I'm sure the audience doesn't want to talk about casino other than I SSA is pretty fun and it's in Vegas and There's lots to do and I'm going to go to the residential.issa.com and you know arcsi.org still works, too, and I use that just because I'm lazy but Here's the link if you want to know more about Issa and they've got a pretty good education track and they have a lot of quality speakers and Martha you're going to be presenting in Issa this November, right? I am I'm going to be talking about accountability I Haven't done that talk before to the cleaning industry. I you know, I went to a few other unrelated conferences and talked about it but Yeah, and I'm talking about accountability because so many people have trouble Holding people accountable like you know and it's easy to do. I mean it's easy to be frustrated with your field staff or Management staff or whatever But at the end of the day, I always say If you're feeling frustrated the first question you have to ask is one Do they know what you're expecting them to do? sometimes they don't and to Are you talking to them about it? So And that's a lot of times we complain to the wrong people. Don't we right right? Yeah, if you're ever and I know this happens and I did the same thing like But I would try to catch myself like if I was ever complaining to say the office manager About one of the field texts or something that's going on. I'd have to catch myself and think Do they know? I'm unhappy You know because if they don't know and you know, you haven't set up all the clear expectations They don't know where they're at all those things then It's not fair. It's not fair at all. So I've spent I spent a lot of time working on that and I don't know exactly why or where my passion was You know, of course with quality driven having metrics Metrics were super important to me and I think the reason that I love Data especially in like a home service business is it takes all the emotion out of it you know, it's It's here's the numbers that I need you to meet You either met him or you didn't you know? So Yeah, I guess a lot of times when it comes to accountability We're not really good at that and you know, I guess what I'm hearing is part of that is we don't really Establish the expectation can't hold somebody accountable if they don't know what's expected, right? Right. Yeah, I mean most of us would say for say a field tech We want them to show up We want them to do a good job Um Provide good customer service, you know, all those things but at the end of the day, what's that mean, you know And your definition of good and the text definition of good are probably Different so if you haven't defined that then You're the only one that knows what you expect So and you may not have even defined it for yourself You just have a feeling that it's not good enough, you know, so It's a good. It's a good subject. It's One that could be Just it can make your life a lot easier if you do sit down and define everything really well You have to define it for every job role that you have But once you do the first couple, it's not as hard So this is going to be your your your topic and at convention So numbers are you know having having objective ways of Establishing expectations this is a cornerstone of this Is it is that simple though if I have a bunch of numbers then I'm gonna you know, all my people are going to be held accountable I Mean like the way that I would measure Doesn't necessarily mean that's the way you would measure and you're going to do it by whatever Tools you have available to you or that you're willing to have available And the other thing that I noticed like when I first started measuring this stuff We would measure it in the office and then like Put it on a platter and kind of show the text where they're at and It really is a problem like if they can't measure it themselves Whoever's measuring their job performance They need to be able to measure it themselves instead of you kind of retroactively coming in Measuring that and I would say that's true for Just your performance what's expected of me, but then also if you do pay for performance You have to know that too I remember once I had a Person come apply for a technician job and she had worked in a bank and I started telling her it was about pay for performance but really the same principles apply for just minimum expectations and She was telling me about how when she worked at the bank they had Bonuses monthly bonuses that they could get and she said she was really excited about that Because they were significant bonuses, but she said what would happen is say September came and gone and then she's in mid-October and they Kind of say who met the bonus and who didn't and she said It was it felt like a crapshoot because You know, you'd be told yes or no and you had no idea Why you didn't meet it or why you didn't meet it and it felt very arbitrary So when I was telling about how we did things, you know, she was saying That's how that came up because she was like oh good that I You know say I just quit trying Because I had no idea and it felt it felt like up Tom told me that He might get kicked out But we're still alive, so we're good, but anyway, she said that she just quit trying and that It felt like if her boss was in a good mood the night before she got the bonus If her boss was not in a good mood the night before she didn't get the bonus and that's how it felt and I think that's important story for us to think about because What we have in our head is not what our technicians have in their head So the story you're telling yourself the story that you know Is not necessarily the story that the technicians know so And I'll just keep going since Tom isn't here It may be short if he's not going to show up or not show up He's having internet problems, so he's probably trying to switch to hotspot Um Hey, Martha. I'm sorry. That's okay. I was telling the audience that You had warned me that you were gonna pop off So I finished that story, but I was about to say that When you go and set up these accountability measures for the different job roles You're probably going to measure that I mean certainly you're gonna have different criteria Yeah, I'll have different criteria for an office manager than you have for team member and but also we Also kind of did our check-ins differently and delivered the information differently, so You kind of had like a an ongoing process to facilitate all of this Mm-hmm easier. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. So, you know for for the techs really their minimum Expectations were outlined in our policies. So how many absences do you allow? How many complaints do you allow what? What quality score do you expect, you know those kind of things but Say for the field manager in the office manager They had different roles and so my field manager It was primarily about I always say she had an easy job She just needed to keep the employees happy and the clients happy And then the office manager it was all about sales mainly, you know sure Client satisfaction and so forth, but sales was her top measurement and With management, we'd sit down once a week and everybody came to the meeting with stats with the techs and the team leads etc they just They could access it and see where they're at and so forth So they would basically know where they were at in the disciplinary procedure, so Yeah Yeah, and for you guys listening. I think one thing I would ask yourself is When I terminate somebody Are they surprised? and if they're surprised then There's a breakdown of communication on what's expected and then you know the whole communicating where they're at and all those things so it that's an easy litmus test is Just Asking yourself are people surprised when they're let go for absences quality whatever Tom's gonna have a rough time And so at At ISSA at the session that I'm gonna do I'm gonna be talking about this stuff But then I'm also gonna be sharing like my spreadsheets and My accountability measures now. I'm not always a big fan of that, but I know People have problems with where to start but the funny thing about when when you share like when I share my My requirements and so forth for my company then Sometimes people will take that verbatim and put it in their company and it's not that I mind that it's just that we all have different cultures and Like I have a really great friend and she's like there's no way I could run your absence policy and have anybody employed But for me It worked it worked well. So you find you find those You find the common ground in your company Before Tom and I got on here Something he was asking me if I wanted to talk about quality driven. I don't want to talk about and You know, the only thing that I would say about quality driven is we have a place For you to track all these HR issues and put your policies in there and all those things And then we have reports that come to the admins and to the employees that For the admins we show them, you know, who's kind of in jeopardy and then For the employees we show them where they're at whether that be Just like, you know a verbal warning stage or further into the process but What I was talking to Tom about before we came on is I Was saying that you were asking me if I want to talk about, you know quality driven or something else And that I was saying that I had been working with who hire some and For those of you who don't know Dom Dom Williams used to own a company called hire who and I I mean that's hard I have to remember which way it is now and which way was it who hire Yeah, it was hire who that's when Dom owned it and then he sold it to these people Called perception predict and they kind of rebranded everything and it's called who hire So they have their little owl mascot and Reggie and he's very cute but Anyway, I was telling Tom I I've been You know informally working with them some just because It fascinates me. I'm I'm a data nerd, especially when it comes to employee systems and measurements and all those things and so Who hire is an automated applicant tracking system, but It has it started as perception predict, which was a Basically kind of an AI Applicant predicting system now, I'm sure I'm not saying that any of that right, but basically predicting an applicant's performance if they were to be hired and Artificial intelligence to do that, right? So I am not in any way the founder or anything so I will say that what this company does is they come in and I don't know. There's hundreds and hundreds of these psychogenic Characteristics or whatever it's not like a personality characteristic and I cannot explain the difference because like I say I don't work for them But What it does is they Through a bunch of research Will narrow down these psychogenic Characteristics for like a better term And they're unique for various jobs. Like if I'm looking to hire a bookkeeper versus a cleaning technician the Psychogenic characteristics are different. Yes and One of the ways that they do that is They know from other positions and like they started out in big big companies. They They can narrow it down on their side Initially and then they come in Basically at the beta stage and I think they would tell you they're still kind of in the beta stage because AI only gets better With data and more data the better they get. Yeah, is there a feedback loop after you hire someone? Yes Did they guess right or not? Well, that's that's where I come in okay, I Had a we had a mutual friend that wanted the two of us to talk this guy from what's now who hired and Me and Anyway, I think we both got on that call like All right, you know So-and-so wants us to meet and hi, you know and then we got to talking and as His name is Jonathan Wiseman as he was talking My I like I got chill bumps and I'm like, oh My gosh, I think this is why some of this data Exists in my world and but I've never had the opportunity to say to match it up, you know to a prediction and then the after and So anyway, we've you know, we've been kind of working Closely so he originally took some of the QDS users because they've got the data and And you know, they've We've got the data on absences and you know all kinds of things already, right, right, right and So anyway, it's still in the early stages I know there are some raving fans and then there are some people that Probably want it to be perfected sooner than it's gonna be perfected, you know, that are more skeptical. I Myself Look at it as it's learning, you know, and that and it's pretty impressive How right it is Considering the limited knowledge like It's gonna get better as time goes on though. Yeah, and I So I don't know how many people in the residential cleaning world know of a guy named Tommy Mello, but he He owns he found it a one garage doors and You know, I don't know his numbers, but I think he just sold for a Lot of money Yeah, whatever. I don't even know it might even be in the billion. I don't know. It was a lot a lot of money Well, Tommy has been using this company for years and He is using it for lots of his roles, but he started using it for his Technicians that go out to the house to install He needed them to also do upsells and So he wanted to predict not only, you know, the quality the attendance but also their ability to sell and So over the years like last year They were able to predict and he's shown me the data And within it's within something ridiculous like I don't know $25 For the year, you know, so with their prediction and but now the difference is When you've got a really big big company then You know, he has thousands of Employees To be able to run all these more data measurements through and then be able to hone down on the prediction so that's where we're at as residential cleaning company is You know getting all of these measures and then of course Everybody's individual culture is going to play into it some but I think that we would all say That there's some basic characteristics that will make Cleaning tech successful But yeah, it's really interesting like Have they figured out any of those or do they have? Yeah, yeah, and you know too bad Jonathan didn't join for this call. In fact, he's speaking at the isa isa Convention so I'm sure he'll be talking about this but one of the things is That You would think empathy Is a characteristic that you would really want your technicians to have yeah you would think but You really don't and I'm sure there's all kinds of like sliding scale as far as What you mean somebody is is empathetic high in empathy. That's a bad thing so You want really what it what I would describe it as is that you can't be the technician can't be too Tender hearted and that they you know how you've had technicians That just can't roll with the punches like if there's a The client is dissatisfied or something They just take it to heart and they just can't get past it Or Say Technician is out and You know the client is saying It You didn't you didn't get you didn't clean this you didn't do this whatever and if you have a Technician and I think it's under the label empathy um So it's not exactly how I would define it. But anyway, if you have somebody that errors on that side then They are not going to be able to Like oh, okay. Mrs. Smith. Yeah, I see that. Okay. I'll fix that They won't be able to do that and move on they will They'll they'll they'll they will feel the pain of Disappointing mrs. Jones and they won't be able to do their job or they'll wind up not liking their job because right You got it. Yeah, it's like being I guess it's like doing like outbound sales You've got to not take any of you got to be able to take no and you not take it personally and Right, right. Yeah, and there were several other But that was that was one that surprised me there was another one And I I can't remember it off the top of my head, but it was pretty interesting and But then, you know, my gut response was to be like No, but then As he explained it. I thought You know, that's right. I mean It is right that we would have excellent detailed cleaning texts but If they couldn't let that stuff roll off of them Then They didn't like their job No matter how much we told them They were doing a great job They just couldn't let that go and They just didn't feel successful and so It couldn't keep that job Because it it just ate it them. So You know stuff like that. I find that very fascinating and Yeah, I mean, I think there's I mean, it makes a ton of sense, but never in a million years what I have Looked at that as a criteria for somebody who's going to be successful in a cleaning professional role Right, right. I mean, you know, I would ask the questions about like their past attendance and you know What would cause you to call off and you know, I would focus on some of those things And they do ask about that, you know, it's The test the test the quiz whatever you want to call it if they give the applicants takes about 10 minutes many questions I knew you're going to ask that I don't remember I'll I'll I'll remember is it takes about 10 minutes for the average person now What I imagine A lot of people would say is it's so hard to find Help and you know I'd have nobody apply but at the end of the day For me, you know, if I have somebody who's not willing to do a 10-minute assessment Like towards the last step And you can put it at the beginning you can put it at the end But if they're not willing to do that 10-minute assessment at the end then they don't really want that job Anyway, and they were just going to job pop. So I you know, that would not be a concern for me um But yeah, and I think it's just going to get smarter and smarter I mentioned that as part of this funnel It's funny. I'm I'm talking about um Who hire not qts, but I could say It's really like qts too, and I still have a couple more questions about accountability But well, we'll swing back around to that. Okay. Well, I was just gonna say uh wrapping up about who hire so This is very much in beta, but as part of a feature that they're going to have for There, you know, anybody is using that platform um is a AI bot that will do a phone screening for you Now I did one. He asked me if I would do an interview. They have a little phone screening So I was the applicant and It it only Learned from 10 times. So it you know, this AI bot had only Had 10 interactions So that's not very much but it it was So it wasn't perfected at that time with like You know a few places that had too long a pause and stuff right here's where I was really impressed so um And again, it was really early stages, but so one question Reggie that had a british accent asked me if I What would be my ideal? you know work schedule and I said, you know money through friday Um, and I need to be done at five so I can pick up my daughter from school, you know that kind of thing and So the next question was So do you prefer daytime or evening and I you know, I did I just answered that question And I kind of go I go I just told you ba ba ba ba and This AI bot goes Oh I am so sorry. You're right. You did tell me and then it kind of repeated what I said And I was pretty amazed by that because it really did recover kind of like a human being, you know and uh and And I was purposely trying to test it on some things and and he had told me don't test it too hard because you know, it wasn't ready But uh, I I was impressed that it could respond to tone um So I think there's a feature and and like he was saying it's just a tool like if you wanted to do some knockout questions and do it through a phone call and um, and then you know the phone calls recorded So if you wanted to do that as part of your screening process, um You could but again my fascination with do they do they I mean, I guess you know, you're talking to a bot Did they tell you that? No, they don't tell you and if it didn't have the pauses I'm not sure I would have known you know, I mean some of the fast food places are using AI now bots to take orders at the drive-through And I believe they tell you up front that hey, I'm a bot And they've gotten to the point where they can do it all themselves about 70 percent of the time In about 30 percent of the time. This is something I read a couple of months ago So they might even be better now You know, somebody'll say hey, I've got food allergies does this you know milkshake have blah blah blah on it And hmm, I'm going to let you talk to my manager and I'm like kick you over to a human being But you know 70 percent of the time Can can you know save you a lot of time? Right and I would imagine that Just like anything else you make up the script and then Or you make up the questions and I'm sure you have the option to say it's a bot or not say it's a bot but Uh, and maybe it's going to say it's a bot, but since they were just doing beta testing on me it didn't right, but I I I was impressed with The conversational style and that for such an early thing Um, but then at the same token It is a little scary. You know, I mean all of there's two sides to all of that so And so you know Somewhere in the future Those bots are going to be you know giving quotes booking jobs Changing schedules you kind of Fill in the blank because no matter if it's a matter of when Right, right. Yeah. I mean I think about my kids and the jobs they have and you know um It's been a lot of money to go to be a ux designer and one of these days that you know who knows so It's scary. It is scary, but I don't see It's stopping. I mean we've seen already with the screenwriters some of the Legislation and stuff and I'm sure that's all coming but but anyway, you know getting off on a tangent, but Yeah, I I think there's definitely some positive and um For me My fascination is the prediction versus the results And in watching those things And I just see that it's going to get it, you know get to be tighter and tighter Because right now in the early stages all you can do is take your current employees and Have them take this assessment and then match up what they're saying with what the real results are, but then as you bring more and more people on then you're able to Get smarter and smarter about it. So um And I know One person that was using it that was going to try it where they didn't even do An in-person interview um And see how it went I personally thought it was a little early in the process to try that but uh, but But then you take out the You take out the bias, you know as far as I remember Liz I remember when Not that I ever perfected hiring but I did perfect For the most part getting people out really quickly But I didn't perfect hiring, but I remember Liz saying once she was like you don't Too many people are hiring based on they liked their personality And that there are a lot of good interviewers out there and I mean that was years ago But I remember that was at all. I was like I Do that, you know, like if I like them and if the interview went longer because I Enjoyed interacting with them and so forth I would tend to offer them the job And then you know Early on they may disappoint me and I'd be like What happened there? But along those lines, I also learned from so the else When that happened to go back and watch that recorded interview To see what you missed. Yeah And having a standardized process that you repeat for everyone with Some behavior based questions in it as always, you know a good practice as well But if you can then throw in You know questions that have like AI Analytics, you know built into it Getting back getting back to the empathy thing. Wow, who would have guessed that? Yeah, yeah, you'll need to go and listen to him I think Jonathan Wissman is on Monday the first day and you'll need to listen to him because it It's interesting. There's some that you're like, yeah, okay, we know that but there was at least one more that I was like Because he would ask and and I remember giving the wrong answer to two of them And because you know, I was thinking yeah, you need to be empathetic and there was another one and So it was pretty interesting and and then after he explained it. I thought Well, that's right. That is right. I had I had some great people that I just loved but man they just Couldn't get past any of the negative stuff So anyway, you know you were uh mentioning You know how AI is going to be changing the job market in the future and what type of jobs are going to be available I'm gonna kind of take a A quick detour for a minute because this is jolt's report Wednesday At least I will if my computer behaves if I uh Jolt's report came out today. This is the job opening in labor statistics and The number was supposed to be like 8.8 million job openings, but it came in at 9.6 and everyone's like, oh my goodness where did all these new jobs come from because The idea is I want the job market to cool off to stop inflation. So this is You know, kind of a mix bag here in terms of of how the markets are looking at it But if you scroll down here, this is the top line number like all of the jobs A bunch of job openings Good news for us that are like in the house cleaning. I look at leisure and hospitality is kind of a A proxy those numbers are still going down Which means there's fewer job openings competing for the people that that that that we might Might be hiring right If you go up here and look at like professional services wherever that is That number went from 1.4 million to like 1.9 million and this is like where some of those AI jobs are supposed to be replacing people So maybe it's going to happen. I think it will happen at some point in time, but You know, it looks like things are looking pretty good for those folks at the moment Right. Yeah. Yeah, like I mean if you were a uh, copywriter or something. I mean Not that I think AI can replace all copywriting, but I mean it's certainly competing Yeah, and you know if Being a development engineer writing code, you know, yeah, still people involved But there's AI tools that allow those people to be a lot more productive. So yeah Do you need as many of them as you used to? Right You and I are That part we're like bring it on. Yeah Yeah Back to the accountability for a minute. I love the part of Of having the numbers, but I'm just kind of thinking this through the implementation of that Because you know, I mean I've seen this happen And I know that you've seen it happen too where You're pointing out the numbers and it's like, yeah, but that house was really dirty or I was tired Or you know, I had to work late last night that how I mean Fill in the blank Right. So You know, I'm just thinking about what are the what are the things that get in the way of creating accountability and it's You know what I'm saying, okay. Yeah, I do I do and um, so being that we asked for rating after every cleaning and I also required my My office staff to keep us at a 60 percent response rate or higher I'm not Liz on 100 percent. You're not going to fire the customer if they don't give you a rating No, I will fire them if they don't give us a rating and then all they do is complain You know, but anyway, um So, yes, I absolutely broached that with our employees and the way that I The way that I explained it to them is that it all kind of evens out in the wash as far as You're going to have clients that Are very detailed and have very high expectations and of course We were only measuring them based on our scope So if somebody Gave a bad rating and they were like they didn't deep clean my refrigerator. Well, we don't do that, you know So occasionally we would adjust it, but for the most part Yes, you're going to have those clients that Are just never going to score very high But then you're going to have you know, I would just kind of Come back with oh my gosh, you know, and I could name like three or four clients I said, I don't care if you miss their whole bathroom. They're going to give you a five you know that I mean it evens out and And I found that it's just trends, you know, honestly, it's just trends and You get a feel for Because I wasn't I wasn't holding anybody to minimum standards of a 5.0 out of five so you build in Some of that variance on what's acceptable But you get to know What the Minute like I knew in my company if we dropped below a 4.65 We were in trouble with quality I just knew and And the same thing for if somebody got out of training And I was watching their scores and they Got out of training and then we were dropping I knew that But probably we're going to be around about two more weeks. You know, um, and so and and definitely um Definitely like when we would have a new hire And they weren't a good fit for the company they would argue The it's not fair, but For the most part the people who were a good fit for us With a little help could understand that yes, you're going to have those people But you're going to also have these people And it all works out in the wash And occasionally, I mean one thing that the scores do is way back in the day So when I first started this our quality was in the gutter I tell the story of If I was having to answer the phones and I saw on caller ID that it was a current client I did not want to pick up the phone and you know, it was like you knew what you were going to hear Yeah, if it was a reschedule you'd be like, oh You know, uh, but yes, I knew that most likely it was going to be a complaint and we were bad I mean like we were the equivalent of less than a four, you know on our overall rating And so when I started putting this in place We we just had to raise our minimums over time And you know, so what my minimum expectations were Over 10 years ago or whenever Um, was way different than it was Towards the end of when I owned the maid service. So it was Yeah, it was going to be hard. There's going to be hard discussions though. And you know, I guess part of the whole accountability thing is some people don't like to have the hard discussion Yeah, but you know, I think as As owners management, it really helps to have a lot of data and to know what's normal And so Let's say that you know, your normals are 4.7 ish or whatever And then you have somebody that's hovering in 4.4 or 4.5 it becomes a much easier discussion Because you know, I mean, it's like saying When you're developing like an absence policy, it's you figure out what is acceptable within your culture and then The discussions become easier And it like I say those scores We used to have to go check Like well not every house, but back when we were in the gutter I had a person hired and that's kind of all they did Were these surprise inspections when we were trying to turn everything around And then fast forward I could use those scores to say hey We're getting You know, this person scores dropping. I need you to go and check This team this person whatever And it helps you figure that out so Yes, you've got the data and then you can also go and Assess it inspect it yourself to validate it But like I say there were We would see just as often like Somebody who a client that would maybe always give fives fives fives and then We would go do we tried to go twice a year to do an in-person inspection We'd go do an inspection and that house was you know, sometimes it was horrible like Baseboards because I was happy though but that you know Whether it could be that the client was just Not particular at all, but more likely They loved their cleaning tech and they weren't going to give them anything but a five And then when you would go you'd be like, oh my gosh And so those were kind of some of the things that help you know that it balances out Okay, yeah, so you do recommend even with a Quality feedback system like quality driven that you would do some physical in-home inspections every once in a while. Yeah. Yeah, so We had a whole hierarchy list And again like in the beginning I had a field manager that's kind of all she did that in training um in our hierarchy list We would check all first-time cleans And that was because Back in the day um, we were giving such a bad first impression And so I I had every first-time clean checked Now we evolved to where we didn't have to do that at all but We we just had some criteria and once we got our quality where it was it was good, you know, and We stayed above 4.7 and etc then Really the only The only in-person checks that we did were To validate Complaints so if we had somebody complaining We might we try to go immediately, but Most of the time you get the oh, I fixed it kind of thing So what we would do is if we suspect like basically what we're trying to figure out is that the client Complaining trying to get a refund or something or Did the cleaning tech slip now when you have history it helps you to kind of start making some of those judgments, but We might go that next cleaning after a complaint to go check that house so that if they complained again We had seen it Yeah, yeah, we had seen it and then like you say We tried to go to every house particularly the bi-weeklies and the weeklies at least Twice a year for an in-home inspection Okay, yeah so you know, we're kind of kind of getting up at the top of the hour here and I'm not sharing what I thought I was I wanted to Make sure everybody could find your your website Martha because a cornerstone of A lot of this accountability Is is measurement and I agree 110 percent, you know, if you're Going to hold somebody accountable. You need to know the expectations and if you can't measure it You can't manage it. So you need to be having that discussion in the context of numbers You know what comes to employee performance You know, you've you've your data geek Martha. You got the numbers here. So Yeah More of a data geek with this stuff then I like I hate but keeping uh, you know by Good friend Megan likes the accountant. I just I just tell her you just tell me you just tell me One then then the dollars I guess I I get that If somebody wants to know more about you and what you're doing This is uh, go to uh, I dropped the url in the chat. This is the best way to reach you Martha uh, yes, and uh Martha at quality driven software.com And I'm on facebook you can send me a Private message whatever you need but Yeah, I love I love helping people with their accountability and pay for performance all of that I just think I honestly feel like it just takes a lot of the emotion out of it and It kind of release it takes that weight off your shoulders because Once everybody knows what to expect and what's expected of them And they've got full control over meeting that or not Then when you have to have those conversations You should not feel like You're doing it to them They made choices to get in that situation but You can't say that if you don't have The expectations clearly defined and that they have a way to know exactly where they're at If they've met them or they haven't met them and you have an entire presentation on this topic Right at the issa big show The convention the issa showed north america 2023. It's in los vegas The dates are november 13 through 16 if you haven't registered you really No, I don't know anybody it's ever gone to the show that that hasn't had a good time and and felt that it was a You know a good investment Right, I see here at the top the early bird savings have been extended until october 6 So today's the fourth So you got like two more days to get in on the cheap So if if you're thinking about doing this you want to uh Go to issa show.com. I'll drop the link and chat again and You can register with the early bird pricing if you do it before the end of the week you'll get to see martha I'll be there. Liz will be there. You get to hear uh, jonathan weiswin talk about using ai to hire people a lot of good stuff I went to my first Uh arc c conference. Um when I was in business two weeks Okay I was in business two weeks. I I remember it was way back in the day ordering from Um Lee what was the guy that He's no longer with us, but um, he had kind of a business in a boxing and Oh, I think I was ordering from speed cleaning from jeff cambell's group That's not gary gory. That's not uh, yes. Yes, gary gorison. Um, but anyway, I was like Is there I was realizing really fast. I had no idea what I was doing and um I opened my cleaning business because I liked having my house clean and I had had a married maid service when I lived in ohio So I Had no idea what I was doing. I said, is there any education? And then they told me about You know arc c and it was going to be in florida So I went and I probably stood listening to you. I remember lizz. I remember debbie. I remember lanzo And I didn't even know enough to ask but for those of you listening that have never been It literally changed I don't think I would have stayed in business if I hadn't gone because One you knew there were people out there that were doing it, right And had most of it figured out and two you found this was before the You know facebook days, but you found a community That understood and that could help you so I recommend you go Martha, I really appreciate you helping us out today sharing with us. It's an awesome topic and uh hanging in there with our You know technical difficulties, but I'm running off the wi-fi still so we're we're in business Hey, if I don't see you before I look forward to uh seeing you in vegas. I'll see you in vegas And liz we missed you Okay, so we'll be back uh next wednesday five o'clock eastern everybody take care. Bye. Bye. See you