 It is a very fine Thursday morning today, the 7th of October 2021, a very good morning to you. My name is Ram Maguco. And as always, it is a pleasure being with you each and every Thursday. This is Power Talk. And I want to appreciate you for being part of this show. Make sure that you stick around for what we have lined up for you today on this particular conversation. We are coming to you live from the broadcasting house here in Nairobi, Kenya. We are also live on our website at www.kbc.co.ke4-y254. Engage with us. The social media handles are at Ram Maguco and at Y24 channel. The hashtag is Power Talk Show. Today we want to talk about gumbling, youth and gumbling. Now, gumbling has been an issue that has taken us by storm. So many of us do it. It can be for fun. In the first instances, it always starts as fun. But at some point, as you proceed, you end up losing money. People have ended up being in conflict with one another. What on earth is gumbling? How can we handle this particular issue today? Let's empower you when it comes to gumbling. And in studio, I'm joined by none other to my extreme right by Antonin Janga. He is a counselling psychologist. Thank you so much. It's always a pleasure to be here. It is. The pleasure is all mine, my brother. I'm looking forward to today's conversation, which is gumbling. Because there is no issue in affecting my youth. People gumble. At school fees. I'm also joined by none other than Adan El Kibbet. He is managing director of the resource investments limited. Thank you so much. Salam. Thank you so much. Very cool guy. He is very good. But he is not good at it. Ensure that he is engaged with us. What do you think about gumbling? You think gumbling. How can we stop it? Are you addicted to gumbling? You can give us your story. Head over to Facebook and comment on our Facebook page. That is at Y254. Drop in your comments as you continue with this conversation. I shall sample a few of your comments towards the talent of this particular show. Even in the middle, also ensure that you tell us where you are watching us from. This is Power Talk. Let's talk. Let me start with you, Antonin. Gumbling. Before the show, I was trying to look at the numbers. I realized that gumbling affects families. I was looking at the rate of divorce cases. I realized people should even get divorced because of gumbling. And it has so many diverse effects. But I wanted to start this conversation from the beginning. What is it that you feel pushes people towards gumbling? I can say, Ram, thank you so much for that question. What pushes people to gumbling is, number one, financial pressure. If you go to a website and you are COVID-19, you will lose jobs. If you feel that you are doing something wrong, why don't I go to this website? I will put a link. For example, if you go to a website and you have a bed on football, there are people who have relied on gumbling to be their source of finance. People are even quitting jobs. Yes. What do you want to quit jobs? I want to earn $30,000. But I want to choose to gumble. So, I want to resign jobs and I want to gumble. I want to be a school face and I want to gumble. So, what pushes people to gumbling? Number one, the main thing I can say is financial issue. And even as you talk about this, I want also the parents to engage with us. Are you a parent? I'm sure you have a problem with maybe your son or your daughter who is gumbling. Tell us your thoughts about it and your experience even as you continue this conversation. So, you are saying one particular reason why people gumble is because of lack of money. Yes. They need money. And they don't know how to get it. How to get it. Dan. Yes, yes. In your view, what pushes people towards gumbling? For me, I think it's a way of earning a living. That's the reason why people tend to do gumbling. Because I really like comparing gumbling to like forex. You do forex, markets, share market and all that. It's the same way you do gumbling. The difference is, gumbling has different perspective from forex. But for me, I think the reason why people go into gumbling is as a way of earning a living. Oh, yes. Are you forex? Whether you forex or not, I'll tell you. I'll tell you in a brief. I'll tell you what I'll tell you. The key part of this is to react. The same as gumbling. Yes. It's only that people never come out out loud and say how they lose money. Yes. As we sit here right now, this amount has lost even 200 million. In a second. If you forex, talking of forex, I mean if you forex. If you forex and I talk, I lose money. Is it gumbling? Is it gumbling? It's like gumbling. It's almost like gumbling. If you don't understand. If you don't understand, come on to forex. Yes. If you don't understand the gimmicks of how to invest, then when to stop, there's something called a stop loss. If you don't understand, when should this forex extend stock? When should I stop investing into the forex market? Then you lose money any time. People have lost 100,000 Ram. Understand there's something known as candlesticks. If you don't understand how to read, at what point should I say invest? Should I buy the dollar? At what point should I buy the euro? If you don't understand the gimmick of how to invest, how to invest in China, at what point do you hit? It's the same thing. Gumbling is the same thing. If you don't understand, for example, if there's a game between Man United and Arsenal. Number one, if you're investing in that thing, you need to understand the past history of Man United and Arsenal. Exactly. Yes. How many encounters have they met? At what point did Man United win? Yes. At what point did Arsenal win? Number two, understand right now, what is the score that is playing? Yes. Is Ronaldo playing with, when he was playing, during that time when he was in Man United? Yeah. Did he score against Arsenal? So right now he's there. There's chances that he'll score. You're searching down and internalising a lot of things. I'm searching for that. Always the answer is that you say you come and bet here at football. When the two who say, I don't know how to bet football, we can let you bet. That's what most youth are doing right now. They don't research on those football matches that they do. But there are people who are not living from that. Yes. There's someone who right now, their tennis normally happens in the morning. So people normally bet tennis during the morning. So there are people who have invested right now, and someone has had 200,000. Well, just sitting and even sleeping. Because number one, he researched critically on what he's investing. Just gambled on one thing, on one match, and then invested heavily on that match. You've tried trading. Yes, I did trading. Last 2019, I was training from May, from May to around September. Then I got my account. Then I got 20,000. Then I got my account. Then you got your account. You got your account. What do you want to do? You got your account. You got your account. Number one, in forex when you're told that you do trading, you're given a demo account. That demo account, you need to trade with it at least like six months. Yes. Six. You do dummy currency. So you see, within that dummy currency, how am I thriving in it? You see, you just hit two, you know, one after the other. No, they even account that they have something known as algorithms. So they can trade on your behalf. So you come up with the algos that if something like this happened, a Kalea person. If something like this doesn't happen, I'll take a Kalea person. If you want to lose 20,000, stop it. Gambling. So gambling, for me, I always look it as a form of investment. It depends from what perspective you think. So would you encourage people to gamble? When you do proper research. Anthony, would you encourage people to gamble? It depends on someone. CSI would encourage, it all depends on you. Come away if you want to say, if you've done proper research, don't do it just for recreational now. Do it, the history. Come and eat football. Do it, the history behind. Why are you placing this bet? So are you saying people should not or people should? People should have their own choice on whether to gamble or whether not to. They should get the effects of not gambling. No, I do it. This is what you're talking about. No, no, no. If you want to gamble, you can do it. In a psychological view, it depends on how you think about it. Wherever you go, if you go to China, you'll lose the effects. If you lose money, you'll lose what effect you'll have on you. Now, again, how will it benefit you? So it's up on you after you place it over to China, you'll see the two of you gamble and do what you're doing. First, clear things up on China. Decide, you'll see the negative side of it and the positive side of it. Then decide. Come if it is right for you to gamble, then you may have a good and well-en-good. If it is not, you're not even going to say what a gamble is, Ram. If you're going to get the scale, you're saying, I gamble for more than 10 years in the Chinese side of it. If you're betting on a game, you'll have a lot of money. $50,000, $90,000, if you're going to win, you'll have $300,000. At what point would you say that somebody is now addicted to gambling? At what point would you say that now he is becoming an addiction? It is not longer a source of income, it is now an addiction and it needs to stop. At what point would you say it's an addiction? At what point would you say that someone is now addicted to gambling? At what point would you say that someone is now addicted to gambling? At what point would you say that someone is now addicted to gambling? At what point would you say that someone is now addicted to gambling? At what point would you say that someone is now addicted to gambling? At what point would you say that someone is now addicted to gambling? In any business, you can never have a 200% profit every time. The normal profit curve in any business is normally like 30%. So if you see every time I am putting 10,000, I am earning 2 million. Take cautious in that. It will never happen again. You can't put 20 bucks and expect 200 million. You can't put 200 million to 30 million. That is very impossible. Number one, the more the matches, the more the risk, the higher chances of losing. For example, if you put that 10,000 in one match, focus on that one match and earn yourself another 15,000. That 5,000 extra is enough. That's 50% profit. That's okay. Should you stop? The problem with you and I always repeat is you want to gamble and come up with exorbitant profit. It will never happen in any business. It will never happen. You can't have 200% profit every day. But now you are trying to get some money. At what point should you now tell yourself and realize that it's becoming an addition for me? When every time you are making irrational decisions, like you are betting on 13 matches, you are very sure you are losing and you continue doing that. Number two, you can never survive without it. You have lost today 10 bucks. I know my mother is a 10-buck person. She would go to Ram Ram and ask me to pay her 50 bucks. She would ask me to pay her 50 bucks. That's an addiction. Now you end up getting loans. You end up getting a loan from the government, you get a loan from the government, you get a loan from the Mumbai lenders. You are in debt. You are in debt. You are in debt. That is now an addiction. Betting on football for me is not a wrong thing. But on casinos, lotto, you know, you are betting on, I call it hearsays. Because if you've ever gone to casino, if you've ever been there, there are games that you play. You just press buttons, press buttons, and then ensure that three things align and then it will give you an amount. Jackpot, yes. That now is hearsay. But football, that's actually something that you are seeing. Some things, there are other matches that have something known as much fixing. But there are others that, especially big teams, on very rare occasions, will get much fixing. You get it. So if Ronaldo is meant to score, he will score. But on casino, if you press these things and then three birds align, and then you get 50,000, now those are hearsay. Now that one is very risky. Very risky. Stop that. You go to town. I'm sure if you are a true canyon, and I'm saying this very, very, I've said that those ones, true canyon, yes, yes. Yes. Yes. Yes. Yes. Yes. Yes. Yes. Yes. Yes. Yes. Yes. Yes. Yes. Yes. Yes. Yes. Yes. Yeah. High school, high. Yeah. Yeah. Okay. My royal relative. Okay. Yes. Yes. Yes. Yes. Noide. Yes. Yes. Yes. Yes. Yes. Yes. Yes. Yes. Yes. Yes. I got 500 I worked I got 200 I got 200 I got 200 I got 1,000 I got 1,000 I got 200 I got 300 I got 200 I got 1,000 I got 500 How did that academy hit you? I am a zombie. I know the pressure. The people around me are so much in the middle of things. They give me a lot of pressure. The people around me are so much in the middle of things. I know the pressure. But those things are too much to handle. You know you are curious to know how things are like. You have to be prepared. If you do not know what it is, I am a student. That's what I'm saying. People learn from situations come here. They learn from Uli Uli's best guy who can try something that will benefit you and benefit you. But they don't know what to do. They don't know what to do. They don't know what to do. But I would say it's a sure bet thing. You can say, you can say, you can get a bet. When you get a problem, it is a risk. It's a risk. When you're in a situation, you get a lot of pressure, you get stress. You get depressed and a lot of stress. Stress beyond extreme. So if you have stress, you can tell your students that you are a school teacher. I know that the family is a family. So, there's a lot of gambling. It's called impulse control disorder. Okay, let's start on this. When we started, we mentioned that the one reason why people gamble is because of lack of money. Poverty. This is the reason why people get into gambling. How do you fight poverty and at the same time you're trying to withhold yourself from gambling? I always say, the more idol you are, the more you will do such things. If you're at home, for sure if you're getting into a betting site, you know what internet is. So, there are things known as online jobs. Number one, most people who gamble are university students. Number one, they know how to operate an internet, how to operate a computer, how to type. There's online writing. They always say it's illegal, but that one is better off than even gambling. A page you'll get like online writing, a page you'll be paid like a hundred. A page. You'll do eight pages a day, a hundred times eight. That's about four thousand. That's good enough money to sustain you. If you do each and every day that you have enough money to cater for your rent, cater for your fees, and cater for any other things that you want to do. After that, when they would have to do online writing, they would have to do something. I always say you can do gambling. That's what you're saying. That's the proper research. Number two, don't take on too much. There's policy of life that is always, investments is always 25% of what you have. Poverty is a reason why people are gambling. It is. But at the same time, you get big people. I heard there was a senior governor who, when SportPerson started, he floated I think two million on SportPerson. He won it eventually. But as a senior governor, who is his husband, he doesn't lack anything, but he gambled. So this is another reason. If you go to Casino's, you'll get senior Chinese who are building these highways are there. They're not going there because the door of man. So what are the reasons? They're going there for fun, number one, and also to earn more and feel the need of their own. There's recreational gambling, Ram. Recreational gambling, nearly gambling for fun. And now when it gets to two extremes, what extreme is gambling? I'm not going to lose the house. I'm going to Casino's. The house is empty. And my wife and my children are here. And I'm not going to get back. My wife and my children are here. And I'm not going to lose the house. My wife and my children are here. I'm not going to lose the house. I'm not going to lose the house. I can imagine. Yeah, so what do you say about that? I heard there's a disability better be back. I want to be better than your daughter. The gambling is funny. The gambling is funny. The amount is poor but there's recreational. There's also the need of filling your own and the need of doing investment. Why? There's a lot of people who are in the car. There are 500 people who are in the car. Let's say 2,000. So there are 2,000 people who are getting more. So there are 2,000 people who are getting more. And mind you, there are 2,000 who are getting more. Now what I can say before I was saying there's something called impulse control disorder. What is that? It's a disorder whereby you have to control what you really feel like you want to. You have to control what you really feel like you want to. So gambling is what's in 2000, what's in that? Is gambling a mental illness? Gambling addiction? No, it's not that extreme. It causes mental illness. It causes depression. What do you want to do with gambling? What do you want to do with gambling? Because you don't want to spend money. You have loans, you don't have a house, you don't have a house. I want us to look at this particular scenario here. We have those who have gotten into gambling because they are the customers. But now there's this at the side. Those who now promote gambling. If you want to get into gambling, you have to. And as much as we are talking about people who go gambling, there are those who promote it. Yes, like us. Like our IT world. Yes, like IT. For us it's business. One of my friends is also running an IT company. The one who debates. And a good amount of money from developing those software. So that's what I'm telling you about to go gambling? No, no, no. That's not the reason I'm telling people to go gambling. But number one, you need to look at both sides of gambling. Number one, it gives us business. Number two is a source of money for government. I had last year from gambling, government earned 4 billion. 4 billion from gambling. In front of tax. So it's a source of revenue for our government, which is a good thing. But at the same time, on our youths, there's a social impact on it. Impact here. There's pressure. But those people who promote it number one, they have their own interests. Which is earning money at the end of the day. They want to earn money because they promote it. But at the same time, actually they're selling. I can say yes. They're selling it. But those who are buying it, who also want to earn money? And you wonder who among these two is going to earn? Both will earn. If you invest from the 4 billion, I'm very sure there's at least maybe 1 billion that got back to the community. Or to the guys who have gambled. I'm very sure there's 1 billion that came back. So not everyone will win. Even not every business succeeds. So if you're gambling, that's a business for you. It might fail. Or it might succeed. So is there something like gambling for fun? I just want to go gamble. Because I feel I'm free. I have some cash. Let me just gamble for fun. There's something like gambling for fun. Let me tell you around. In Casino Nambuan, if you go, I've been there. In Casino, if you go, you get free food and free drinks with your guests. Free food? Yes. If you go to Casino, you get free drinks. You come with your, given allowance of one guest. So if you're going with him now, he must be a gambler also. So I can come with you and then we'll get free food and free drinks. And then now we start gambling. So number one, people go there to get free food and free drinks. Number one. Number two is a form of networking. Gambling Casino places have high people. So you may even get the president over there. My goodness. Yeah, you can. So it's a form of networking. It's like golfing. So by the time I'm going to a certain casino, I'm very sure I'll come out with a network. That tomorrow I'll call and get business. So at times it's fun. At times it's a form of getting network. So guys, if you're watching us from home, we're talking about the youth and gambling. What is it that we're looking into here? What are the things that are covered in this spectrum? Why do youths gamble? Are there benefits? Are there losses? Are there profits? Why? Engage with us. Keep talking to us. Go to Facebook at White Forever Channel. Drop in your comment on the comment section. I shall sample a few of those comments as we continue with this particular conversation. Let me read this. I will only read this one, but then we shall read others later. Havana Bekana said gambling is among the major sins. The major sins? Yes. In the Bible, I think it was condemned. Do you agree with that? Yeah. Actually, okay. Okay. Okay. Okay. Okay. Okay. Okay. Okay. Okay. Insure and lose. You don't gamble. So it's a sin. Should discourage it. If you call it the religious part. Not everybody is religious at the end of the day, Ram. If you kill them because they're religious, it's a matter of you as an individual. You might be religious, but as you said, come in and pay a business, come in and pay a job. Then why not? You might be religious, but as you said, come in and pay a business, come in and pay a job. Then why not? Excuse the Ram. This is a thought, but at the end of the day, let me tell you something. Ram is a gambler. He's from a family. He's a buyer. He's a buyer. He's a gambler. There's no buyer who told me that he's a gambler. I bet. So it depends on an individual. You can get the two sides of it. So what some consider sin is actually righteous for another. Ram, I'm telling you, in business, 85% of startups always fall. Same thing as this. If you make irrational divisions, like I'm gambling on 13 games, you can expect to win. You will not gamble with one match, stay 10,000, win 20,000. That's fine. Tulia. In case of Tulia, you can't do that. I want us to look at the effects of gambling. How deep can it go and how badly can it bruise someone? Yeah, I can mention that. Let's mention about the family, which I just mentioned. Some of them, like the mom or the dad, gamble on the school fees. I'm telling you, I don't want to go around, but I want to open next week. So I'm going to gamble and see how he or she will get money to pay for the school fees. So if you have a mind-set and you gamble, maybe if you gamble, it adds to school fees and everything. So I'd say it has a negative effect in it. Too much of something ram is what? Poisonous. Poisonous. Very dangerous. You can do it too much, which will lead to a very bad and serious thing, but you can do it with control. Gambling pays for self-control. You have to gamble every time, every single day. You have to career to gamble. You have to work. You have to work hard because if you gamble, you have to gamble. You understand? Yeah. And maybe you have to win. You understand? My family is one of them. My family's break up. They want to divorce because they gamble. true course. No. 1, there's a structure. You can go to a job and work with someone else who wants to marry Kassino or Mahalis or Kubeh. Do you want to gamble? I gamble at home. So my wife is scared. My wife is scared. I'm just going to stay at home and see if she wants to get married. You're going to say, I gamble at a job and Kassino who wants to stay at home late, So you don't make time for your wife or your family. It's for the youth. It's for the youth. When you go to the house, you have to take two lectures to graduate. If you have money, you have to pay for it. That's the negative side of it. There's a psychological perspective that it may take to be the main thing that you push for life. You have to go to class. Maybe some students say, hey, I have to go to class. But this should not be the case. Because you're breaking families, you're breaking your own future. You're destroying it with your own hands. Yes. I want us to look at this. You have something about the effects of gambling before you touch on something else? I look at it from the positive side. Always. Let me tell you about the positive side. Maybe the positive side. The source of revenue for the company like ours. The source of revenue for people who gamble rationally. But at the same time, it has the negativity and then of it it causes mental health issues such as depression, suicidal issues. People have killed themselves because they have lost a lot of money. Anxiety. But I always tell people everything that is bad has the good side of it. Don't always look gambling as a bad thing. It also looks at it from the good side of it. That depends on an individual. If you want to write it down, I will write it down as a support. I will write it down on both sides. It's up to you to decide. It's up to you. If you're weighing it, it means we need to look at regulation. Correct? Regulations number two, companies should come up with things that also help the youths. Especially on the betting of football. Help the youths get information on a rational way of betting. Even the government should come up with the regulation. By the time I'm gambling, I should have gone for training or maybe I should have read certain things to get information of things that I gamble on. That will help a lot in reducing cases of losing money. Because if you have information of how I'm supposed to bet, chances are very minimal of me losing that money. Do you feel like we need to have... Before you go buy an alcoholic drink? No, it is not label. Not for sales to pass on Sunday of 18. Should we have such kind of words written somewhere in these gambling places? I've never gone there, so I don't know. Number one, when you sign up, you see there are you above 18 and then you tick it. I'm above 18. So it's always written. Even on terms and conditions it's always written. So these companies, do they regulate? Is it regulated? The companies that... There is betting at 2080 that has various regulations that guide the betting companies on how to maneuver in the ground. Number one, if you are above 18, you cannot gamble. Number two, you cannot stake above 20,000. Or you cannot stake above 20,000? How many days you can't stake above 20,000? So these guys who we are hearing, say you are the Alipotizer, 200,000 seeing gambling. In one stake, you cannot stake above 20,000. So you are the Alipotizer? You are the Alipotizer? Yes. You can stake even after 10 million. In one stake. All right. What about the government? I believe the government has a role to play in terms of regulation. If I come to you, Anthony, then you give a voice. The government, in terms of regulation, the role of the government, you can add your voice in regards to that. The government is playing a big role in regulating the gambling sector because number one, they have imposed serious taxes to reduce number one numbers of companies that are coming on board. Number two, now gambling sector is treated like an investment sector, like the forex sector. For it to open a forex company, there are certain licenses that you need to get from the government. Number two, you also need to have a certain amount of reserve. I think it's about, like, 200 million. All right. So that if, in case that you go bankrupt and people have won, assume that right now spot-pacer or maybe all debate, you have staked, and then they have staked a jackpot, and then people have won that jackpot and they don't have that money. So they've come up with things like those. But three, that have to reduce number of betting companies in the country. That's a good thing. There are so many. Now, as a counselling psychologist, as a psychologist, we need regulation even in our own setup as youths in the family in the societal setup. If there is a regulation at the government level, at the national level and in the organizational level, do we need setups that regulate gambling at the societal level and especially in the family? And how can we achieve that? I'd say we need regulations for families. You know, our youths when you're at home, I believe parents really play a big role in how you raise up your child. If you were a parent, you don't, especially when you're a kid, when you're a child, you want to watch and get into very dangerous stuff. So if you're a parent, you don't watch or you don't take much attention on what your kid does on the phone. When you're at school, when you're in class, if you don't check up on your kid what he or she does it will really impact. If you're at school, if you're above 18, if you're above 18, how will they know? It's a bit hard. Because you know our disabled kids have phones. Exactly. So you don't have to talk for 16 hours a bit. You see? So the parents need to like keep in touch or monitor. Or even bet in companies. You scan your ID and also take a picture of yourself. Before you're given access into the site, they have to verify number one whatever pictures in that ID is you. They give you access to the site. In casinos today, do you carry your ID? Yeah, you can't enter if you're below 25. You don't have an ID? No, you don't have an ID because most casinos are more of a high profile place. So you come and me, do you live below 25? Yes, I do. You cannot enter a casino below 18 or below 25. Below 25. But you know nowadays kids want to grow. They want to grow. They will confirm that with an ID at some point. For sure. There are people who are 40 and have small bodies. They look like twins. So for sure, they have an ID. They have an ID. I have a friend who is in school and I was I think 18. He was 28. And we went to a place and I was laughing at him. Because you don't have an ID. You don't have an ID? My parents will check up on what their kids do on the phone. When you're at university, don't get into something that you don't know about. Seek the information about it. Yeah. I want us to take a short break. But after this, I want us to touch on something here. Is it possible for you to know someone who is actually gambling? Parents are struggling outside here to get money. They are struggling all of a sudden. There is no money. You keep getting calls. At your mom's, you keep getting messages from your son or your daughter about school fees. There is no school fees. There is no school fees. There is a trip somewhere. There is no trip. At last, you won't get into a game. At last, you won't get into a game. So you won't get into a game. Dr. Nani, you can't steal the money. You're playing improves. You're just gambling. Your child is gambling. After this, will you tell us if it is possible for someone to know a gambling person? We don't know. We don't know. We don't know what they are. After that, He gambling. At what point can you stop it? To send it to E, you know, commission. Keep that channel going. That's like it's part of the show on Twitter. At RRMaguko, at Y2favor channel, is where you can find us. Keep texting, keep tweeting. After this, we'll be back with much more. This is Power Talk. Y254, imagine. Y254, imagine. A very good morning to you. Thank you so much for being part of this. Good afternoon. Thank you for being part of this show. You're just joining us. This is Power Talk. My name is RRMaguko. You're just now for the next part of this conversation. Before we went on that break, we were talking about regulations that have been set by government and institutions in regards to gambling. Today, it's all about understanding youth and gambling. And I want to see what people are saying on our social media handles. The hashtag is Power Talk show on Twitter, at RRMaguko, and at Y254 channel, is where you can find us. We've posted a post on our Facebook page. And show that you head over there and give us your thoughts and your comments. This is a producer Mugusta Babu. And that's a man I talk to from County 001, Mombasani, Santesana, Havana Baker. I'll just comment up with you. I read his tweets. Yvonne, I think this is Yvonne, wishy. And I said, I'm a victim of it, gambling. I mean, I make a little meme here, I'm a victim. So people are actually affected in this digital age. Young people are exposed to gambling more than ever before. So many are affected by this. And you're asking the question where as you talk about gambling, how has it affected you from wherever you are watching it from? I'm with Anthony Jagger and Daniel Kibbet right in the studio. So gentlemen, before we went on that break, we were talking about regulations. And before we move to another thing, the government had increased taxes on gambling. Yes. Do you think that was a solution? Has it actually helped in a way, Anthony? Anthony? I can say in a way it has helped because that's a come-away increase tax. I'm a come-away make a tax in the first place. So gambling is too much. And everybody could be doing it on the other hand. If it's a forex money, I don't know if you'll conquer it. Forex money is taxable. Yes. It is taxable. But not that much compared to the gambling side of it. Okay. So I'd say, yeah, that's the right thing. Mr. Sadiq? Yeah, Mr. Sadiq, because it's number one, when it was excess duty actually that was imposed. So what it implied is number one, if you bet on things that I think was below $1,000, it couldn't give you money. It was giving you a negative for something less than your amount. You have to take that $1,000, but you'll get $800. The stakes must be higher? Yeah, the stakes must be higher. So number one, you'll get people when you say, ah, if you bet on something, you'll lose money. And you get $1,000, but at the end of the day, it's about $800. You're saying you've not gained anything. Actually, you've lost your mind. So it discourages a lot of people from gambling. Because many people cannot afford a lot of money. Yeah, yeah, yeah. But about $500, $200, can be balanced. Can be mobs or not? Thaw. Thaw. Okay. It discourages a lot of people from gambling. So it really helped. Number one, number two, also, a lot of companies were shut down because of that. Because they couldn't afford. Now, them, their taxes were increased. There was corporation tax that was imposed on those companies and all that. So a lot of companies were shut down. So it didn't, you know, it didn't bother what it used to happen is, you know, gamble in different sides. Game of the new, you know, you'll get a debate. You know, you'll get a spot-pacer. You know, you'll get a jeep, a ticket. You know, you'll get an AP. So you know, you'll get a cariboo. $500 in a day. On one game or in one stick. So there may be like seven betting companies. So you may reduce your chances of people gambling a lot also. Yeah, yeah, yeah. So I think it's up to us as a society to find out how we can go to regulate it, especially among the youth. I think it's, for me, I think I always say, what is law? Law is the moral obligation. I always say, Ram, if I feel like if I hit you, that is wrong. Then that is, that is law. It is lawful for you. Yes. So it needs to come from you. You know, there are things that you're not even told by someone that those things are bad. There are, you know, people who say common sense is not common to everyone. But I think there's things that are basic that are common to everyone. I want us to look at a few things that people ought not to do when gambling. The do's and the don'ts of gambling. That he will see fine. For example, don't gamble your house. Don't gamble your house. I have a wife. I have a wife. She will see fine. She will rent your house. She will rent your house. She will gamble. She will rent your house. Anyway, when you find a job, you can do a land. You can do a jungle. And laugh when you are in the committee. You can gamble. You know, gambling started way earlier when we were kids. When we were kids, we used to eat in the desert. We used to eat in the desert. We ate in the desert. We ate in the desert. We ate in the desert. We ate in the desert. We ate in the desert. We ate in the desert. We ate in the desert. We ate in the desert. We ate in the desert. I'm trying to prove to you that Ita kushina. That confidence I will win. It started way back. That's a culture. It was corruption. Corruption led to the standard. We were learning it unconsciously. Ita kushina means, I must say, sometimes our parents would say How do you do it? How do you do it? How do you do it? How do you do it? How do you do it? By scaling By scaling? Is it gambling? Yes Kind of In a way In a way Unconsciously The do's and the don'ts of gambling Because this is where now To assume that we live Someone in the western side Zalibet Nibiyak Yes Yes I don't know Nibiyak is kind of Yes Yes yes yes Yes, this is so sad That's a bit To think of it I said that's really a bit Any bit is bit I'm going to say a bit But that's a bit After this show After this show That's a bit If you're going to say a bit You're going to say a bit If you're going to say a bit It's a bit A bit As if it's realistic Money is a sign That is always there Yes You have to be funny I don't know if they will say that I'm a shindal, I'm a shabby man, I'm a shabby man. I'm a shabby man. I'm a shabby man. Do you think someone is a bad man or a shabby man? Yes, I prove it to my social media and I will say that I'm a shabby man. I'm a shabby man. I'm a shabby man. I'm a shabby man. What do you think about this thing of people betting off their husbands and their wives? It's bad, for sure. Number one, we always say when you invest, you invest with 5% of your value. Yes. We biaque only more than that. Exactly. More than that value. Actually, since several people are betting their husbands away because mostly it's a way to scare you. Now, it's good you've touched gender. Very few ladies do gambling. Yes. Very few ladies do gambling and those that do gambling, I think it is more of financial pressure to them. And then they felt this is an easier way of getting money. But very few ladies bet. I think even it's no more than 1% of that gender. But those who do, maybe I'm a single mom. I feel I can call alone. How many bet school fees? School fees, no. What do you want to bet? No. What do you want to bet? What do you want to bet school fees? No. What happens is maybe while I was at campus, I bet school fees in 35,000. I bet it's 35,000. No, no. But I bet 35,000. If you give me your money, I'll say no. If I bet it's 8,000. If I bet it's 8,000. No. So I bet it's 5,000. If I bet it's 8,000. If I bet it's 8,000. You know, gambling made people become a fan of football. Automatically. Yes. So if I bet it's 8,000. If I bet it's 8,000. So if it's 8,000, wear it off. If it's 8,000, raise it up as it is. If you don't want to bet at all. If I'm brutallyintending to bet it's 8,3000. So if you get money at all. If I bet it's 8,000. I bet it's 8,000. If I'm investing my money in gambling. If I bet it's 8,000. And if I'm investing in gambling. l saved up most of the money. l lost in gambling since then. And nobody is any more depressed. How has that all changed? After that, even after that 12,000, I started offering credit cards. I spent that 3.5 million. 1,000. Forever. This game is a calm game. It's a game of money. It's a game of money. Rent is the end. I'm not going to argue. Because this is what I want to do. What I want to do is, as I mentioned, that is to gain a positive side. That is to gain a positive side. That is to gain a positive side. I do the risk side of it. Which is bad. Before you do anything, not only gambling, The next thing you know, the landlord is calling you, is on your neck, and he says, copy rent. What do you bet all the money away? Yes, yes. Your wife says, money is the end of the game. You have to pay your children, you have to pay your children's school fees, you have to pay rent. Your husband is betting. Your wife is a cheater. I think she will come up with a training model of gambling. Because gambling will never stop. As much as we will talk about it, day in, day out, government comes up with regulations, it will never stop. I think it has been there since even before Jesus. It has been there before Christ. So it's something that will be there. You will leave this earth and leave it. I think it's a matter of coming up with training. The same way people in Forex are trained, the same way there's entrepreneurial classes, the same way they'll be betting classes. The same way people in Forex are trained, the same way they'll be betting classes. They'll be betting. The people who are called are past actually, most people who do those modeling of gambling, they're called bookmakers. It's a very serious math that happened there, serious mathematics. By the time I come up with an order of 2.5, I've done a lot of calculations behind the scenes. I've come up with different things known as algorithm and all that. So we should train more people to become bookmakers. I'm very sure you can win. So you feel like enough is enough to come up with a curriculum? Yeah. Even if you have a bachelor degree in that, becoming a bookmaker. Because by the time you're a bookmaker, Ram, I'm telling you, chances are very minimal of you losing. Because you understand, then it gritties. My goodness. You know, I'm not a banker. Someone, a friend of mine who is in banking, he thought the reason he was in banking was the forex industry. It gave him the urge of not doing the forex market. Now, there are people who I'm not sure and I was not sure whether it is true or not. I want 2 million. I'm a watchman. I'm a watchman. I'm a watchman. I have 2 million. It's very possible. It's very possible. It's very possible. Is there any psychological perspective of gambling? Yes, there is. If you are at a level of addiction, because gambling you can be an addict. And it is so easy for you to be an addict of gambling. How do you put into perspective what are you doing? What is gambling? I want us to look at this perspective of realizing or picking up some of these. If we are talking about health, some are signs and symptoms. Let's look at the signs and symptoms of a gambler. You will be able to earn a lot of money. I'll give you the money. The money. I don't know the side of a gambler. Number two I'm not a big deal. I'm a big deal. The time I spend with you there is nothing that I can come out of. I'm not a big deal. I'm not a big deal. I am calling you. Number 3, if you see a killer, you will get 50 bucks. You know, the next time I am calling you, you will wonder who is the big guy. You know, the guy is a little bit red. You know, the guy is a bit cool. What? 50 bucks? I am not a big guy. If you see 50 bucks, you will care. You know, he is Gambla. He is science and symptoms, he is Gambla. He will get 50 bucks, but here, 50 books. Just because when you sign 50 books, it is not true that you do not sign so in fact you only sign 50 books, you only sign a gambling book I have a friend who only tells me that, whatever you come to the bank I will give you wait I am gambling I can tell you we are drinking gambling I am gambling I am gambling I think there was a site that used to stake 3 books I think it was a site, I forgot the name How can a parent know that their child is a company? Number one, if a child has money, it's weird and makes sense If a child has a lot of money, it's a good idea to sell it If the next time a child has a lot of money, it's good to sell it It's good to sell it all night I think there's a game that we can play How do they know that their child is gambling? Because they are gambling there. Your advice to parents, how can they know that their child is gambling? There are 50 people who are gambling at the same time. Same thing. There are two parties who are gambling. Number two, that guy is not even interested in looking for job. He is above 18. He is never interested. The person who works in the office is my son. He is a CV, he has someone who I know in this company. He says he is not interested in looking for job. I am sure that your son or your daughter, most probably your son, is a gambler. Allow me to be the devil's advocate. He says he is not interested in looking for job. He is a gambler. He is not interested in looking for job. It is all over. You wake up in the morning and check your phone, there is that text. You go on TV, you open the TV, the adverts are so many. You go to a town, you see what is going to happen. Are there also things that we can call triggers? And how can we prevent ourselves from, how can we resist? I think number one, the government should, you see things like you getting SMS from ODBET, SIDRI, BETICA and all that. Number one, government should cap that. There are things known as bulk SMS, bulk SMS guys, and the ones who normally give your numbers to those guys for betting companies. So number one what the government should do is cap that. Any betting company should not get a sender ID. By sender ID you get a message written there, ODBET. You should not get that access to your contacts. If they're doing advertisements, they can do billboards and all that. But you see, me getting SMS every day, ODBET, BETICA, is not giving me an urge by they say, can try this. Let me try this. You see, because you know most kids, most youths of nowadays, number one, they rarely watch TV. And if they do, it would have been Netflix. On Netflix, on a very rare occasion, will you get advertisements for betting? But these adverts are, sometimes I look at my phone, maybe I'm on Facebook, and then I see just a small thing, ODBET. Even if you're on your computer, you see that thing, it pops up and then you have to close it every time. It pops up, you have to close it. Adverts, are they also triggers? Yes, they are triggers because that's how kill a time to open YouTube before your video is played. They just add in a play. When I come here next, skip. In the end, I have to collect. I have to watch. So if you watch, if you watch videos, you will get that interest. You're curious to try it. What would be your advice to people who want to stop gambling? Adonis? Number one, I'd tell you this. Don't be idle. Don't be idle. The Bible says, and I don't mind the devil's workshop. Don't be idle. Get something you can do. Don't, it's not about money. It's not about work. It's not about money. It's not about gambling. Do it. Don't be alone most of the time. Just get something that the killer is busy and your mind is occupied. It's not about money. It's about money. And sometimes when people live and commit suicide because it's gambling it's not about money. It's about money. It's not about gambling. It's about money. It's not about gambling. It's not about gambling. And they end up even committing suicide. People who gamble live their lives. They gamble and live their lives. They say to me, I'm the one who's going to die. I'm the one who's going to die. They gamble and live their lives. Like, literally gambling with you. You know, there are some things in a psychological perspective that can feed your mind with. They can't even run. There are some people who gamble and want to lose as a cause of trauma most of the time. Because each and every time you go to jail, in a ring like India, you lose. You feel yourself as a loser. It's traumatic. And that trauma can lead to what we call PTSD. Advice to those who want to stop gambling? Number one, as you said, don't be idle. Number two, get a replacement for what you want to do. You want to do things on the internet. There are other better things that you can do. There's online writing. You can always be doing job applications. If you don't have jobs, because most people who gamble, most of them are youths that are unemployed. If you feel like you need to do something via internet, two more applications. One of these fine days you'll get job offer. Continue doing the online writing things. You'll get 4000 a day. It's not little, but something that is guaranteed you'll get it. When we have people who are addicted to drugs, we know we'll take them to rehabilitation centers. Those who are addicted to gambling do you have a gambling center in Kenya? No. Government doesn't work on that. It's an addiction. It's not an extreme addiction. It's the same problem with drugs. If it's an addiction, the government should stop measuring on these addictions where people know drugs, alcohol. They should now measure addiction. Gambling addiction is so serious. They should set up a rehab in Mahali. This addiction in Mahali, they call number. If you feel like you're doing too much gambling, this is the number to call. Guys, it's a pleasure being with you guys. I want us to wrap this conversation up. I want to give you 20 seconds. Very short time. Have a final word. Speak to somebody who is watching you today. Let me start with you, Dan. I'll say gambling is not a bad thing, but if you want to continue gambling, do it rationally. Get your facts right. Get information out there. There are various information. What is the need for you to gamble before you gamble? But if you do have the facts right, stop gambling please, because you'll lose money. Yes, so what I can say about gambling is, don't put 100% of your money or of your salary in gambling. Just have that mindset here. See how much you win and how much you lose. See how much you gamble. If gambling is wrong, it's fine. If gambling is right, it's fine. Take a video to a table and take a negative side of it. And once you've done that, that's what you want to do. Social media, official Antoni Njenga on Instagram, Facebook, Antoni Njenga, YouTube, Antoni Njenga. 20 seconds in Asia. I'm going to gamble in 20 seconds. That's what I want to do on social media. I want us to end with a quote here. Bring it up please, Ron. Now, Gumbling, you can tell me if you agree with that sir. Gumbling is a family disease, a family disease. Yes. One person may be addicted, but the whole family suffers. True, exactly, very true. You agree? Yes. Very, very true. Very true. Very true. Very true. This is the end of this particular conversation. Very big thank you to each and everyone of you for tuning in on what I want to watch from Gatanga, Mombasa, everywhere. Thank you so much for being part of Power Talk. My name is Ram Magukua. Very big thanks to Antoni Janga. Thank you so much, my brother. Welcome. Very big thanks to Daniel, Asante Sana. That's right. And a big thanks to each and everyone of you for making this show a success. Thank you to Ron, Paale, Konegalari, and Teemo, Asante Sana. I salute you guys, my brothers. Thank you to the whole team. A repeat of this show comes again tonight at 10 p.m. My name is Ram Magukua. May God bless you. May God bless the work of your hands. This is Power Talk.