 Welcome everybody to another episode of the non-profit show. We're really excited because we have one of our favorites here, Mukhi Kawaja, a trainer from Fundraising Academy, and really the man of mystery because he travels throughout the world and he always joins us from wherever he might be and bringing us a different perspective. Also, I think one of the most interesting things about him, and he's quiet about this, but he's the co-founder of the American Muslim Community Foundation. We talk about the Community Foundation system and concept a lot on the non-profit show. It's such a uniquely American thing in so many ways and it's changed as our country's changed, and so this is such a cool thing that he can bring this to the table. So I always love any time I get with you, Mukhi, and asking the answer is definitely one of those days. Again, I'm Julia Patrick, CEO of the American Non-profit Academy. We are delighted to have you with us today, along with our sponsors, and they include Blumerang, American Non-profit Academy, Non-profit Thought Leader, Staffing Boutique, your part-time controller, 180 Management Group, Fundraising Academy at National University, JMT Consulting, Non-profit Nerd, and Non-profit Tech Talk. So these are the folks that really allow us to have great rock stars on the non-profit show like Mukhi. Okay, my friend, before we get into the questions, and we have some barn burners today, I want to ask you to educate us and reflect upon the start of Ramadan and how it has this really interesting link to philanthropy that a lot of, as we say in my part of the country, Blancos, don't understand. Well, thank you for the opportunity as always. It's great to be here. And I also wanted to congratulate you on over a thousand episodes. So I've been fortunate to be part of a small portion of those and just really glad to see you hit that thousand milestone. So kudos to you and the team. Well, you know, I had, now I have white hair when I saw that I didn't. So that's why. But thank you, Mukhi. That's very gracious. And you have definitely been a part of that journey. So let's jump back to this issue of, I mean, I'm so challenged and interested and intrigued by faith and philanthropy of all levels of all type. But you're living it right now in Ramadan, the sacred holy month. Talk to us about that. And if you could back up for those of us that might not know what it even means, so then then we can figure out how it fits into philanthropy. Yeah, of course. So Muslims follow Islamic calendar that's based on the lunar cycle. So there are specific months and Ramadan is one of them. It is a time of fasting, spiritual reflection, increasing worship and good deeds, and an opportunity for Muslims to think through how they want to spiritually become closer to God. And Ramadan means something different to each and every individual's experience through the cultural influence, through the family practice and everything in between. So many Muslims like to increase their charitable giving in Ramadan because of the additional blessings that are involved. And the principle of Zakat and Sadaka, which is charitable giving, Islam has five pillars. So fasting in Ramadan is one of those five pillars. The second another pillar is Zakat, which is almsgiving, which is two and a half percent of your cumulative wealth annually. They have Zakat calculators out there so you can try to figure out if you owe Zakat or if you're eligible to receive Zakat. People who don't have the capacity to give or certain threshold of income throughout the year can be one of the eight categories of people who actually receive it. And those eight categories are listed in the Quran. So just a little lesson for those that are listening. And Ramadan is going to be starting around March 10th or 11th. So some people go by astronomical calculations for when the moon is visible. But some people like to go old school and actually moon sight with their eyes or a telescope or not like super technology, but being able to see it with your bare eye. So there are two different camps on days to start. So let me drill down a little bit on and it's help me out here. It's Zakat. Z-A-K-A-T. So Zakat. Zakat. Is this, if I'm going to use the word administrated through the specific community religion or religious organization, or is this something that you can do? Like could you give to, for example, your local art museum and or does this funnel in a certain way when you're doing these charitable engagements? In Muslim majority countries, there may be a government participation, some sort of program that is initiated. But for individuals like myself living here in the United States, we calculate it individually and distribute it to individuals, to nonprofits, to anybody in need. So there's again those eight categories that we would adhere to give to. Is this, I know you worked with the Red Cross. Does this factor in with the Red Crescent and in some of these other global issues? You know, we're in a terrible time of war in the Middle East. Plus we have famine in Africa in some Muslim oriented countries that's not getting, in my mind, not getting enough attention. So you know, how would the faithful learn about these things and navigate? Is it like a push necessarily or is it really more individualized as you were kind of intimating? Yeah, so food programs are definitely a Zakat eligible program. So when it comes to scarcity, famine, providing for those in conflict, people who are poor orphans, so on so forth. So again, I choose to do mine individually. Some people do it collectively. Some people, maybe they immigrated from a country overseas and they still have cousins and extended family that can help distribute it to people who are in more need where your dollar goes a lot further than here in the US. So some principles are to distribute it locally. So I'm a firm believer in maybe helping out the local food bank and other institutions, whether they're Muslim led or not. To me, that isn't of significance, but other people will want it to be given to a Muslim led institution because they understand the values and the principles and the distribution and sacredness of that. So again, it's a very individualized practice, but I think communally there are guidelines that you adopt when you distribute your Zakat. Now, and again, I know we have questions, but I got to ask this question because this is timely and I'm so interested in this. Do, is this a daily, I mean Ramadan is a 30-day process or sacred time? So is this something that you do every day during the fasting or is it at the end of the week or how does that manage out? Yeah, like for Muslims our holy day is Friday. So I know many people like to give weekly on Friday. Okay. There are other significant religious holidays and dates throughout the year outside of Ramadan as well and some people like to give on those days, such as when Hajj is another pillar of the faith. And there are charitable giving platforms designed for Muslim giving where some will do a daily transaction in the month of Ramadan or specifically the last 10 nights of Ramadan, which are even deemed even holier and more spiritual. So there are giving platforms catered to Muslim giving that are very specific and you can set an automated amount each day or those last 10 and things like that. So you see the technology and the need meeting the demands of the community as well. You know it's such a fascinating thing and it just seems to me that you know in the US maybe not so much in Canada, but in the and maybe it's because of where I live in the Southwest. This is just something that is not discussed in such a missed opportunity in the philanthropic spectrum. It's just a fascinating thing because we talk so much about December and Thanksgiving and Christmas and all that, but there's such a lot going on that you have to compete for those dollars. It seems like Ramadan has this really overt call to give. Yeah and I've seen organizations even like World Central Kitchen and I'm sure UNHCR and other organizations that are doing Ramadan campaigns that I've seen the last few years being active and I'm sure this year they will be too. Yeah absolutely and I think that it's just such a it's a basic concept that we've got to be embracing and really understanding what it means to give and how it's a motivation for such a huge population on this planet and so very very interesting. Well thank you, you know I witness to you all the time because I know I drive you crazy with my crazy little questions, but you know I would have been a religion philosophy major if I could have. I really would have because I think these things are so interesting, but anyway aside from that what's really interesting are the questions that come into the nonprofit show. So are you ready my friend? Let's jump in. Okay Jose from City with Health wrote in, we're being solicited by our local Chamber of Commerce to join their organization. They're a nonprofit right? I'm not sure if it will benefit us and could use some feedback on this. So I look at this more or so from a networking lens. Are there people involved that could join an event committee or join the board eventually? How can you cultivate some of those relationships? Because the Chamber of Commerce are typically people who are well connected, who are go-getters, they have their own businesses so maybe they'd be interested in sponsoring an event and although to my knowledge they are classified as a nonprofit there's still not a 501c3 in the traditional sense, but maybe you can share a little bit more on that as well. Yeah there's c6s because technically they're an association member-driven you know structure. I really like your point of view about how you know they can be a networking opportunity and a further engagement of what's going on. You know Jose joining a chamber for the most part it can be pretty pricey. So first and foremost I would ask if they have a nonprofit rate. There is no shame in asking if you have a nonprofit rate. I swear to God even if you go to like a big box store and you're checking out and you're buying things for your nonprofit, find out if there's a nonprofit rate. You will be amazed at how many organizations have this and so I would look into that and I also think too that you know sometimes chambers will have like a nonprofit partner of the mom through the quarter or whatever and maybe your organization can be that vehicle right. So but look into it and find out what they can do for you and at the same time what they expect of you right. You know what is it what is their expectation. What makes a good member because if you just write a big check and then you're like waiting for the money to drop back into your lap that's not how it's going to work. You need to kind of be a little bit more strategic on this and really understand how it could work. I hope this helps Jose because I think associations are good on so many levels it's just finding the right one for you. Very interesting well let's go on to name withheld from St. Louis. I took this name off I'm in a man up because it's a really interesting question and speaking with a new donor they had some truly awful things to say about another CEO with a nonprofit in our community. I know this person and I don't think the comments were fair. Should I reach out and let the CEO know there's an issue this donor is powerful and is probably spreading the story. It's what I mean high school still probably I was going to say movie this is like mean girls nonprofit edition. You know just the way that I personally would handle it may not be the way others think so you know I appreciate the what your insights would be as well but for me I would say it's worth having a direct conversation with the donor in getting more clarity and asking them why they believe what they believe and then if you do know this other person they're bad mouthing the CEO and you feel it's unfair you can share back with the donor I don't know all the details however in my experience the CEO has done XYZ I don't think it's fair to affiliate that with the organization's mission they are a separate entity and sure you know I don't I wouldn't know every single detail but I would try to still defend the nonprofit separate it from the CEO and me personally I wouldn't go to the CEO but I would maybe drop a hint anonymously to the organization that there is this feedback and see what they do with it. Okay wow mind blown I would have never gone there I really like I think what you said is magical and that should always be of an approach and that is separate the individual from the organization that should always be an approach no matter what I mean while this was while this conversation was going on that would have been the way to extricate yourself from that to say well you know I don't know about that individual but I know about the organization and they do this and they do that and their mission is that would have been that would have been the right thing to do because to your point Mookie we have personalities and we have individuals and then we have organizational structures you know and what's more important because people come and go but that organizational structure is what in my view we need to protect right so I really yeah that's interesting so I'm fascinated that you would talk to the donor because I immediately had like a fear of oh I don't want to piss off a new donor right fair and you know it's coming at it with not challenging them but getting more clarity okay so it shouldn't be like well I think you're wrong it should be like well tell me a little bit more about why you think that's the case and then you should be able to have a conversation with them and share in my experience it's been x y and z and you know I'm probably thinking about it with a little more grace because as a co-founder I've probably been on the side of criticism from donors and other people and I know how I would want it to be handled and you know in communities of high net worth individual word does get around about experiences and things like that so I'm always a strong proponent of even if it's a difficult conversation having the conversation yeah well I think that's yeah I think that's the right thing to have done and it's really interesting and I'd love to use the word grace because that's absolutely the right approach too you know we the nonprofit sector is fraught with emotion a lot of different ideas a lot of different opinions and perceptions and it's a journey and and I know that sometimes we think we're doing certain work with a nonprofit and then as we learn more about a nonprofit or we learn more about the the issue or the programming then our own perceptions change and so I think you're you're spot on and I I know I know you're a wise person but that actually even proved it so I say thank you wise moody that's what I how I'm going to start calling you okay Cheryl from norlands writes in we want to promote an event coming up but there are a few folks on our board who are anti advertising they think it is a misuse of funds I can't imagine how to deal with this tough because you got to sell your product which is your you know your event sure and you know as the old adage goes you got to spend money to make money yeah however what method of advertisement are you using is it traditional print radio tv online there's so many different formats these days news publications or social media think about your target audience and where are they beyond your email list beyond your social media what paid things will provide the best return on investment and you know I've had this conversation eight years running with the American Muslim Community Foundation about sending direct mail and you know we have a list of about 10,000 addresses across the country and it does get costly to send a pamphlet or a direct letter but we like doing postcards and we feel like it's the most bang for our buck it directs them to an online forum where they can then find out more information and it's brand awareness at the end of the day so I think it's worth it if you're promoting a specific event build it into the budget you know I think there's ways in which you can create it as good use of funds instead of misuse of funds I think that's a well I love the postcard concept I think that's genius you know we just did yesterday or maybe the day before yesterday I can't remember sometime this week we did an episode on what corporate sponsors want and and specifically for events and one of the things that we talked about was they want to know who your media partners are so secure those first don't just you know get go out and say okay we're gonna have this event you know I was thinking the old you know Judy Garland, Mickey Rooney my dad's got a barn let's put on a show mentality you don't want to be doing that you want to be really thoughtful about this and it should start with media partners so that they will do that heavy lifting for you you know they're required by law to give so much depending on if they're broadcast or radio they're required to give so many minutes of you know charitable promotion now it might be two in the morning but still you gotta you gotta think this outside of the the line item and you know it's an interesting thing about marketing because people just get so freaked out about the the outlay and I think you're right movie you've got to build that into your budget and look that it's look at it as a responsible way to build your business not just that event I mean fascinating well Cheryl I hope this helps let's go on to I never know if it's seen or Sean from Chicago Illinois what do you think that is Sean Sean do you think it's Sean okay Sean seen wherever you are Mr Chicago you make me laugh movies now I have the giggles okay we have a program that's in that another nonprofit in our community is replicating it is a duplication of service in some ways it seems like they've copied our program do you have any advice on how to deal with this I don't want donors or the media to confuse us with their work yeah you know imitation is the sincerest form of flattery I think there's always room for duplication or competition if it pushes you to be better at what you do that's how you need to framework it sure they may have more resources they may have other advantages but stick to what's true to you and I think that will shine through and I think that you know if there's duplication of service again the charity already existed beforehand if they are in the same line area it's not really competition because there's enough philanthropic dollars to go out and support you both causes so it's just a matter of like stewardship and relationship building and who is sponsoring their event get them to sponsor your event too you know like who can play that game so you know moji this question also kind of ignites another path for me and that is about licensing or you know documenting your programming in such a way that maybe you can sell it or sell the processes or whatever I mean if it was good enough for somebody else in your own community they must have seen something that was working and maybe that's an opportunity for revenue that is going to be a lot healthier for the organization at the end of the day and and there's that's I think such a missed opportunity in the nonprofit sector is we we we have the sense that we have to start everything over we have to create everything from the ground up we're in the for-profit world is much better if it's from franchising to just buying canned software right you know it just seems like they're much better at it saying we got to get get somebody else's product in here so we can ramp up might not be perfect but it's going to get us you know out the gate faster and so that might be something to think about in a way that kind of helps you navigate what you thought was a problem and turn it into an opportunity it seems like but yeah 1.8 million nonprofits in this country you're going to see some of this duplication so absolutely well moji kwaja one of the the master minds over at fundraising academy one of the trainers co-founder of american muslim community foundation thank you for coming on and sharing with us um you're really interesting perspectives and the things that are going on in your world for those folks that want to be able to meet you they're going to be able to see you at the fundraising academy event coming up at the first week of may right right cultivate conference may 2nd and 3rd come on out to san diego and learn more about best practices and trending technology you know we have great speakers lined up and it's almost half more than half sold out so limited number of tickets remain you know you sold out well in advance last year and that's powerful considering you know we're still kind of in that that waning stages of the pandemic and people were still very concerned about traveling and already you've moved through so many more tickets at this point so yeah if you're interested you probably need to jump on you can go see that get that information at www fundraising dash academy dot org and you'll learn more about who the speakers are what's going to be going on because it's really an exciting opportunity i know one of our co-hosts will be there and we'll be broadcasting i believe on friday from there we're just figuring that out you might be joined you might have meredith there from your team doing that so anyway moe it's always a delight to be with you and the other group that's with us that i want to make sure i honor and that is all of our presenting sponsors they include bloomering american nonprofit academy nonprofit thought leader staffing boutique your part-time controller 180 management group fundraising academy at national university jmt consulting nonprofit nerd and nonprofit tech talk these are the folks that join us day in and day out so we can do better with our nonprofit sector and moe as we end today we end this every day with this message in this mantra to stay well so you can do well we'll see you back here again thank you my friend