 What's up, everybody welcome to the zero to diamond podcast. I'm your host Ricky I'm on a mission to help reduce the failure rate in the real estate industry by helping you master your skills on the phone Conquer your fears and change in your mindset Let's get into the show. Oh Ready to roll What's up guys? Welcome to the zero to diamond podcast as always. I'm your host Ricky Coruth Uh today we got Chris Donaldson in the house man. How you doing? I am doing amazing my man I'm doing amazing. How are you and what's out there on the live stream? Check it out So a little bit of background I saw Chris do it. Um, you were interviewing Lee Brown or she was interviewing you I was uh, I was interviewing her we were talking a little bit When the Zillow instant offers meltdown was going on Being hard to know each other a little bit and I brought her on to talk about how that's not the problem and to focus on What's important because yeah, I was watching age. It's melting down all over Facebook And so was she ever like that's not the problem. You're worried about the wrong stuff. So, yeah Well, I mean, you know, that's a good subject Give me your thoughts there as far as like what it is and you know, why you think people are scared and why they shouldn't be Um, well, you know to me, I think a lot of us I think it's easy especially with the online world You know, we live in a world full of people that just love to to read headlines and get all upset about it And what me and Lee were noting is we were watching agents of all experience levels across the country spending more time on Facebook worried about Zillow instant offers than if they had just picked up the phone Done email marketing, you know the fundamental stuff their time would have been way more valuable It would have been way better spent but people they just want to get upset But my real point man is I'm not gonna find the next Zillow. I'm not gonna start the next Google I'm not gonna start the next Facebook. That's just me So I can either spend time worrying about what they're doing with their billions of dollars Or I could figure out how it affects my business make a plan and put it into action And that's really what we were talking about. I can't affect what Zillow is doing But I can affect what it does to my business. Yeah, that was really that was really our point Yeah, I think that like just to add to the Zillow controversy Well, I think that like voice-to-voice like communication with you know people is the key to all closings And so if you know the technology, I don't think will ever replace us because the thing is is that Like buyers and sellers like some of them might be savvy enough to negotiate their own deal or do their own thing and all that But most of them do not want to deal with negotiating and contracts and you know Lawyers title companies mortgage people inspectors so on and so forth So, I mean there's always gonna be a need for an agent a third-party You know broker now, I'm not saying that technology won't ever disrupt us some way Maybe maybe our low our commission gets disrupted a little or maybe we do a little bit things a little differently or something like that But overall man's real estate is such a Secure career, you know in my mind. I mean the way I see it Yeah, I couldn't agree more. I mean look in my position here. I am running an educational institution Real estate is by far our biggest division I would be crazy if I'm sitting here leaving into our next 10 and 15 years if I thought real estate wasn't going anywhere In fact, I think that the real issue is like for instance virtual reality I can't tell you in 2011 2012 you went to the National Association of Realtors conference They were talking about oh virtual reality is going to replace open houses and it's going to replace this and that I mean, I don't know about your market But I know nowhere that I'm aware of are people sitting at home Regularly attending open houses on a virtual reality headset So I think that headlines and all these things they capture our attention, but our business is about people It's about taking care of the process. It's about service. Those things are not changing So to your point the only way we get replaced by computers and algorithms is if we let them Right, I mean, you know, it's that simple and I don't think that's going to happen Well, even if people are looking or going through open houses with a virtual tour What does that do like that doesn't replace the agent that's going to negotiate the deal right the contract You know make sure that they're taking this is like a huge huge investment for them I mean they need some they need a professional that knows what they're doing that does this every day and I mean just because they can walk through that's the same thing as them Just walking through the house in real life, but at the end of the day They still need agent to help them through the process. So Man, you know as little as I know about you Why don't you give us a little background and kind of tell us a little bit about what you do and how long you've been doing it? Sure, sure listen, so I got my start when I was at LSU in college and I was going into my fifth year because four years just weren't quite enough and I made that famous phone call to dad. Hey dad scholarships running out. I need one more semester I need some money. Can you help me and then like a good dad did he told me no you're on your own So for better or for worse, I'd always been in the service business and these various things and real estate looked like something that That I could do You fast forward through the years of trials and tribulations there and here I am now running The golf sales largest still growing real estate school and Everybody here knows that first step. You got to go to real estate school. You got to go pass your exam We do a lot of that your post license you're continuing yet, but then where we're really pushing the envelope I think is what me and you are on the same page on is then the other stuff. So Business planning marketing the stuff that you really need to know as an agent and so the long meeting I just got back from up in Baton Rouge at our commission We are literally working on how we can get courses that really matter Approved for regulatory credit just a basic CE class because for so long at least in my home state They won't even let you teach marketing and prospecting, but to guys like me and you that's our advantage I don't care if it's CE credit if I learned so my background is as a humble agent trying to pay the college bills and now here we are At Donald's educational services and I love it man We it's it's an interesting business that we're in that is that is for sure So you got into real estate and you did that first I did that first. That's right And so my story with the school starts after the hurricane hurricane Katrina I know you guys down there in the coastal area all of us have our hurricane stories And you know long story short This was a family business that I wasn't gonna get involved with how many real estate agents could say that you know second or third generation and I wasn't going to do it long story short if I didn't jump in after the storm when everybody was was gone out of town Missing all these various things I had to figure out how to put the pieces back together Just this family business that I wasn't working on and then one thing went to another I started teaching classes, then you're like, oh, okay I see that then the online revolution happened and we've kind of been on the forefront of that That's really got what got me with both feet So you're a real estate agent, but your family owned the education business. That's right So I knew where I was going to real estate school. That was about it That was about it But if you're a third generation real estate school kid taking that exam y'all think y'all had pressure on you I had failed it had been it had been a nightmare. So okay, cool So so how did it go in real estate sales? Like what was what was your deal there? How long did you do it? You know and stuff and why did you get out of it? And why did you what was the reason? Well, I'm not ever out of it. Let's let's be clear But as the real estate education as the education business in general has evolved It needs a lot of attention. I mean, we're expanding across the country We have an insurance appraisal mortgage home inspection divisions All of those come with their own set of of issues What I liked about real estate what worked really well for me Was that it was the only business that I've ever seen where you got immediate results for putting in effort And I loved that. So I was never afraid to pick up the phone. I was never afraid to send the emails I was never afraid to follow up with people and I was just so amazed how few agents out there did that That with a little bit of patience and a lot of effort it started rolling it in waves So for me, I went from my first three months like a lot of new kids On the block as we call them kind of trying to figure out my way to where all of that foundation that I had laid I went from I don't know if I'm going to get listings to oh my god. I have so much business I needed assistant Yeah within six months. Yeah, and it was literally having a business plan and actually Performing the elements of it as basic as that sounds. It's amazing how few people did that So I loved it because you got gratification for your efforts and I still think that's more the case now than ever So I think it's very interesting because a lot of people in my market, you know, uh, let's take that back There's a couple of agents around my market that doesn't understand why I'm you know Trying to inspire agents and coach agents and try to train agents And to me, there's a bigger purpose. It's to help reduce the failure rate because it's so high And I really feel like I have a unique You know philosophy behind my success But it's like you just said a little bit of effort goes a long way and then you have more than you can handle Which you know and like that's why that there's not one realtor doing all the business because there's more than anybody can handle at all times And so, uh, you know, that's a big thing. So I'm glad you said that so a little bit of effort You know and keep going and then before you know it you have more on your plate than you can handle It's like I need an assistant So it happens fast. Absolutely. I mean, uh You know, look, I'd love to get it to to more details if you want what you're actually doing with that Effort like where you're implementing it how you're doing it. I mean, I'll go as deep as your audience and you guys want to go Um, but for me, I just like the fact that you got rewarded for actually putting in the work There's nobody that's come to me that's become I call it a statistic, you know Not making it in the real estate business looking to get out. That's actually Worked on it actually actively prospect and had a database that we're working on consistently following up It just doesn't happen. There's a million excuses why But it's never because they did all of that Uh, and I don't know about your market. I'd love to ask you because Everybody calls it the 80 20 rule of sales in real estate. Well, I say we're in New Orleans. So you can cut that half It's like the 90 10 rule So 10 of the agents doing 90 of the business and it's even worse than that And I'm sure it looks similar in your market, doesn't it? Yeah. Yeah. Yeah I mean, it's you know, and there's only a couple at the top and then everybody kind of trickles from there And um, I think that's just the way it is everywhere, you know, you got the people that really Understood long term You know business and put the put the business together for five year out 10 year out deal And let and let the the accumulation of clients snowball into a monster Which is what I did and then there's the people that just live deal to deal You know and they always just kind of are at the bottom just kind of trickling by making a hundred thousand or whatever a year And uh, yeah, absolutely 80 20 rule for sure Yeah, it goes back to what you want, right? So I agree with you and that's where me and you were aligned Is that we created our programs this other arm of our company here with the sales marketing and business training That you don't get credit for which I always said I don't take it if you want to make it And what's amazing is is that the reason we did that was because I think the same folks that are probably watching this and that you identified Everybody likes to blame it on the person why they weren't making it And I was blaming it on the process because they were getting out of school And then some brokerages didn't have training the realtor associations didn't have training these folks were not failures They were just hungry with no direction Yeah, and so that's the folks that i'm always talking to because if we can give you a map We can give you some direction if you're willing to put in an effort I will always be there to help you and I know that's what you're trying to do as well Which I think is great because this whole idea that they're failing because they're lazy not it's not true for everybody Yeah, no no no doubt a lot of people put forth a lot of effort like they're here every day trying to sell stuff But in six months they haven't sold anything and they got to go back to their nine to five So I definitely know what you mean there. So if you're training a brand new agent new agent comes in That's a whole different game plan than an agent who's been in the business three years who has a pretty decent database, right? In some respects absolutely Let's let's talk it so from the zero to diamond. Let's talk to the zero first, right? So when you first get your license like you first get started that first 30 to 60 days is the best time you've got and The reason is because you can almost not mess anything up because nobody knows who you are yet anyway Number one, right? So I'd love to ask you what your advice is But the number one thing for me is You can't be a secret agent when you get your license and wonder why you're not getting business Yeah, for me like facebook as an example you go to people that are wondering You know why they're not getting listings in this net and the other and I go to your facebook And I can't tell that you sell real estate for a living at all Yeah, it's not even not that it's not in my face. It doesn't even say it right right And if you don't have a website, well, then when people are googling you They're finding your facebook page and it says nothing about you selling real estate Well already you're putting out a signal to the world that you're not serious about this So, you know when you're brand new it's to make people know this is what you do. This is who you are And proactive approach rather than reactive the reactive will come in time right the referrals your reputation Those things but at first you got to be proactive. You got to you got to make sure people know who you are and what you're up to So what what uh, what what's the first thing like what if there was one thing? Just one one thing what would be the most important thing that a new agent should do You know over the first week or two of their their career In terms of in terms of getting business In terms of getting business like to get that role started. Yep to get the first deal I mean I use any tool that's free at my disposal So the first thing that I would want to do is collect every person I know friends family Everybody that I've done business with in the past fraternity brothers church group Whatever you got put them in a central place collect it all and build that first database and people get so In my opinion again, there's so word about which CRM to use Rather than just collecting as many contacts as you have Then figuring out what to do with them so I think collecting them all and then Doing something to introduce yourself to all of them. So I don't care Some markets a letter will work an email will work a facebook message will work text messages will work If people get caught up in those details, we'll try them all But make sure everybody knows who you are and and that you now sell real estate In other words introduce yourself to your market. You'll be surprised uncle jimmy may have a lead for you Mm-hmm and he's happy to help you. What do you think about that? What do you think is the first thing? I'm interested to hear your take Well, I mean there's so many different ways to look at it. Uh, you know, I um I think I think a couple things philosophy wise. I think that I'm not a bit. I'm not an advocate of for self-owners and expired, right? I just personally I just don't think it's the most effective way to build business I like circle prospecting But I think that starting out I think that for sale owners and expires gets you the most experience in the quickest amount of time You talk to a live prospect that may or may not do something you might meet them You might list something you might show property you'll do contracts Like there's so much experience you could get so fast With doing for sale bowners and expires Um, I think just start calling them and just start making contact and start meeting people But have it in your mind that this is not The long-term approach, you know that you're gonna do, you know, because I feel like circle prospecting people aren't really getting bombarded by agents They're more open to start that relationship for the future And uh and really get things going I see a comment about an open house when I was a new agent. I did open houses You know on the weekends, uh, and I would make calls when I was at my open house Nowadays see I started when there was no Internet basically there was no Facebook, Zillow, Trulia Dude, you don't look old enough for that to be true. I don't know. I'm not buying it 2002 Yeah, wow, we got in almost at the same time. Yeah, okay But uh, yeah, I'd go to open houses and I'd make calls at the open houses But I like what you said the the other side of it with sphere of influence Uh-huh. I like what you said like I think that they should do that But here's the other side of it for me and the reason I didn't go after sphere of influence first thing Sure, because I didn't want to feel salesy. I didn't want to feel like I was forcing something on my friends or family And on the second the the other side is they know I'm new and I figured, you know I need to kind of I felt like I needed to prove myself before I even had the audacity to ask for business from them and uh Also, I felt like if I couldn't sell people outside of my sphere Then I wasn't going to make it anyway So I wanted to go ahead and go to that next level And so, you know, now my spear just comes to me because of you know, who I am and what I've accomplished But that was kind of my thoughts going in. Well, let me let me ask you the the the follow-up question In retrospect, do you think that was the right move or maybe a mistake? I think with the right mindset and the right phone script Yeah, and then you if you if you're trained properly to where it's actually see there's a difference in hey You know, I'm a real estate agent You know, is just you know Do you want to buy or sell something and if not, who do you know? There's a difference in that And and hey, I got in a real estate. I didn't know if there's something I could do to help you You know, there's a big difference in those two lines Oh I'm an agreement a thousand percent. And so I wasn't even saying Specifically what the letter of the email would say Yeah What I would say to that is first of all the concern about being new so anybody that's out there on step one or very soon I have a really simple opinion on that and I think I come from a unique place Because actually when I finally turned 30 This is gonna sound silly But I was devastated because I loved being the young guy playing in the sandbox with the experience folks To kick in their butt. That was my identity, right? So when I became 30, it was like, I'm just another 30 year old I had to reshape that in my mind But the one thing that I never worried about was that new thing and I'll tell you why And I come from a unique perspective I run a large real estate school thousands of folks come in and out of this school When somebody gets their license Look or even if they've been renewing it for a few years I'm not convinced they know more about this business than you but I am convinced that it doesn't matter And more and more What consumers are showing is that your experience while it's a pillar of importance We're more worried about somebody asking us about that Then the chances are that they're actually going to ask you about that And that's just my opinion. So for instance, if you're worried about your spirit of influence not trusting you yet I mean heck at least they know who you are because the worst feeling in the world is if your best friend Or their mom or somebody that you're close to list their house with another agent And the reason they did that is because they didn't know you were in the business That's like the ultimate dagger in the heart. So Um, I see your point too. I think they're all good I like the all approach and what I mean by that is when you're new and you're hungry You got two things you could spend right you could spend time and money Or you could spend effort And if you don't have any money then you put in the time in the effort So if somebody's saying well, should I do this my answer is yes So like should I try the first sale by nose? Yes. Should I try the expired? Yes. Should I tell my family? Yes Should I be working on farming? Yes Because you don't know what you might be good at or your unique market or what might work So I don't think you should eliminate any doors. No, absolutely not. You need to try everything You can try and figure out what works for you what what you feel good about and what you feel like is uh See, I think there's the there's a lot of most agents I don't know what you teach right, but but I think most agents I really believe that most agents are good people. They care about their clients They have the greatest of intentions with their clients as far as wanting to give them that service They go over the top for them and that they really care about them. They really want to truly help them But I think that there's some there's training out there Where they have the greatest intentions in the world, but they don't necessarily convey that exactly to the the prospect because they've been taught you know phone scripts, you know that are Or scripts period or the way that communicate That doesn't necessarily sound like you're out for them. It's more like you're just trying to get a deal done And I think that that's one thing that I really harp on That's one thing that with with how I try to teach people to communicate really Use the right words to show Your your true intentions, which is most people really care and they really want to help and they're hard workers They're dependable professional, you know all that. They're a great agent You know, they just have to learn how to communicate that to people and and I think that's a big thing Yeah, I think that's that's dead on the money, man, and I think that You know Where me and you look we looked at each other and we found what was going on out there We know that on some levels we have to be aligned and one of those is Look in my business, I've seen every speaker every class every ce There's a ton of people out there that are peddling bad advice Right bad bad bad advice or advice that used to work and maybe won't now But I think at its core, you know, we're in the type of business. It's still a relationship So if I'm going to do something for you and I'm going to be able to help you I think it's incredibly important to be able to get that authenticity out in genuineness Because people will feed off of that and I think that's the biggest advantage of someone that's new because I think that wherever you are in the spectrum, they will respond a possible client respond to your energy enthusiasm and care Then they will your long track record that you may or may not have Yeah, that other agent may not look like they are enthusiastic. This is just another listing appointment. I don't care about you and so Yeah, I think that that's amazingly huge and that comes with practice, doesn't it? It comes not just with scripts with practicing your first time you answer these questions should not be when you're sitting there in front of a seller You should have practiced those already. Yeah. Yeah I mean that's just my there's there's two types of education There's education you learn through seminars reading books, you know Podcasts, you know classroom and then there's experience And a lot you a lot most agents want to go right They want to they want to get everything perfect go right to the top immediately And it just doesn't work like that you can learn everything you want to learn But then you have to put years of experience behind all that knowledge And actually go through it for real Yeah, where you really know guys. We are on the zero to diamond podcast with chris donelson man. This dude's a beast Um, if you guys have questions for him feel free to type it in um I uh, if you guys are watching this on youtube listening to it on a podcast somewhere out in internet world You want to tune into the live show every week? We're on the zero to diamond real estate facebook group. We're 5000 agents strong right now and growing So, um, be sure to go there if you want to watch these live q and a's every week So man, so tell me like where you go from there or what you think is the overall philosophy behind building like a long term strong business Sustained market crashes and downturns and and and out outlive all the naysayers Man look What I mean the number one thing is is that never forget what's important in a business and it's always Keeping the funnel the potential business going forward Always working on that and I think where people they get this wave of business They stop working on the next wave That to service this one then they close the last one and it's like uh-oh Now what am I going to do and I don't care You know that's just business 101 But in the real estate business you've constantly got to be working on where's your next buyer Where's your next listing going to come from whether that's a systematic approach or a proactive approach You know once you get to your stage where you've got referrals And you've got a large database and all of that it begins to take heed But you've always got to be proactive and it's the daily accountability activity, right? It's the idea of every single day When I clock in that I've got to be accountable that I've done the work that needs to be done to continue to build my business and You know one thing I'd like to offer and I want to hear your opinion on this But one thing that drives me crazy we kind of touched on it But is the whole idea of authenticity versus selling a character And I'm 100 of believer in authenticity because if you're yourself you can be yourself all the time And that person could be genuine and you never have to worry I tried to convince this person I was that and I tried to sell myself as this Then I was branding myself over here. So understanding what your value proposition is and like you said being able to Properly articulate that to others Is a huge start because really the hard part was getting in the door, wasn't it the hard part was getting that appointment The hard part was getting in there's almost nothing you're going to do to mess that up But you can constantly be better and better and better on how you're getting the appointment or whatever But I think authenticity is huge. I think the the market in general Those folks are going to get exposed like an avenue like facebook where we are right now with your awesome facebook group Like if I click on names and find business pages and there's bad reviews It's going to affect somebody over time Whereas if you are genuine about what your intent is you follow that up You actually act the way you say you're going to act then over the next three to five Those reviews and that online reputation is going to serve you Super well because the agents that are not doing that are getting exposed one by one Trust me, you know, it's happening and we just have to wait it out The good ones like us the people that are good to people do things the right way We just have to continue the course and it's going to come right to you Let's see Ronnie wants to know where you're at. You're in Baton Rouge. I am in New Orleans, Louisiana right now We're just getting over the Mardi Gras hangover. So we're ready to roll Yeah, I was uh, y'all have a good one. Was a good weather Uh, for the most part, well, I say that it rained a lot over the weekend So it was kind of touching go because we had a cold front come through But uh, all in all it was good, but it's a great example of me I like to have a little bit of fun, but work the most when people are having fun because I always get a one up on them Yeah, so I don't take the same holidays everybody else Man listen in the winter time when it slows down over here. That's when historically that's when I grow That's that's when I close the gap on everybody in the winter time when it slows down everybody's going to Halloween parties, Thanksgiving's, uh, you know Christmas parties and all that stuff It's historically man. I take more market share each year a little by little and I've caught up, you know And then I eventually surpassed everybody by doing exactly what you just said man I just when it slows when I'm crushing and that's when I work. I really dig deep That's when it's hard to dig deep because it's kind of the market's kind of slower And you really got to change your you know your daily actions change But uh, you just got to flip over from selling to prospecting or you know Selling to marketing and really dig deep with your ideas and focus on your goals and really take it to another level Dude, you could have said it any better. I mean look That's the difference between the employee mindset and the business owner's mindset as a real estate agent Where other employees be like, hey, it's slow I could just mess around at work and I'm getting paid to do nothing You got to have that little voice in your head goes I got to be doing something right now I got to be doing something right now because you could always take time off or do nothing But in our business, that's what will cost you three and six months down the line So where your friends and employees may be joking around about I don't have to do anything The office is slow. You should be freaking out when the office is slow and realizing this is when I need to be doing Things to set up for the spring and the summer So, you know, that's that's that's that comes with discipline and understanding what's happening when it's quiet I can go write the next Sales letter the next set of emails the next campaign go reach out to my dad. Whatever the case may be, right? I mean, yeah That's the reason I started coaching and doing this show and writing books and speaking and doing videos and writing blogs Because I had like like I built my business so big And now I was to a point where it's like, okay, you know, like I have a little bit extra time on my hands I've got to do something, you know So earlier earlier you said real estate was one of those things that you uh, that you saw that that if when you put forth effort You kind of got immediate Like uh results. Mm-hmm. You must have never roofed houses before Wait, what's that? You must never have roofed houses. No. No, I did not I waited tables and drove forklifts in a In a shredding factory, but I've never uh put a roof on a house personally. I would yeah My dad had a roof in business would I did roost for like five years when I was a teenager Oh, that's a good business when you're in hurricane country because there's always a Always a reason for some more. Oh look, we know that well Know that well a question here from jimmy kim He wants to know if you had a listing appointment at 9 a.m And that's your prospecting time. How would you handle this? Go for it I would go in the listing appointment because the whole point of prospecting is to get appointments So, you know, you can always adjust your prospecting time Right everything my grandfather had to say he used to tell me a lot And it was that everything I say is carved in water Which means you've got to be willing to adjust if the point of prospects is to get an appointment You don't want to lose that appointment because you know, it's in your window. You're still serving the client I mean that was easy to me. I I don't know about you. What do you think reggie? I think I think a couple things I think I think that if you can loosely change if you can loosely reschedule it for like one o'clock And then make those calls and it fits and it's okay and they're okay with it I think that's good because then you got your calls in and you got the appointment and if you if you say it right if you if you if you If you've made an impression that you're like going to be like a friend or family for the rest of their life Then and you've got that calm demeanor and you and you're not nervous You can say hey, is it okay if we if we do this at one? I've got a meeting In the morning and if they don't understand or if they can't do it It's like okay cool. I'll move my meeting and I'll be there at nine So you give it the attempt you make an attempt to to to manipulate your schedule around what's most productive And if you can't that's okay, but here's the part that messes people up If they get off their routine if they get off their schedule, they let it mess them up the rest of the week Right, so I think a big thing is is if you do have an appointment or you have to show property And it messes you up on that day's schedule Don't let it mess you up the next day get right back on schedule and start crushing it crushing it crushing it Yeah, I mean I don't disagree with that I like the soft approach to try to reschedule and if they give you resistance no no no problem kind of thing Yeah, I'm fine with that. Um, but I think if we're choosing between my prospecting window and an appointment I think that's that's an easy choice. Oh, yeah. Yeah, no Yeah, let's go get that listing man. You know you need listings. Good question. Jimmy. Thank you for that So what do you what like, uh, what's your favorite listing? Activity, what do you like to do to get listings? Um, well, I mean this is probably gonna be obvious But I'm a huge huge huge advocate fan of facebook in every possible way I think facebook has been the the biggest gift to real estate agents ever created And it's up to now and I think that using facebook all the ways that it can do for you Uh, is incredibly important and I mean there's a million different things for instance If you're looking to stay in contact with people It's free and everybody's there and it's just it's there and then when you're talking about The facebook advertising feature being able to micro target to promote open houses collect leads. I mean we could do this forever You know just in our business alone Back in 2013 In fact right now I feel that calls all day because she won't give up from the yellow pages lady When I've told her a hundred times We're not coming back to the yellow pages for what you charge when nobody calls. It's just hilarious to me Um, you know years ago. We moved all that money to facebook. So I think facebook's got to be a core pillar I love it now and into the future And I think that facebook Because they're a publicly traded company now and they're trying to make money They're loving on people that advertise as you know, and they've got expert helplines now They will show you what to do and all these various things I think it's it's incredibly huge going forward and if we think everybody else is doing it Look at the statistics only nine percent of real estate agents in the natural stations of realtors at their And that have realtor in their profile on facebook have spent one cent Only nine percent nationwide. So if you think everybody's using facebook, you ain't seen nothing yet Oh, no doubt man. I I spent a couple grand a week on facebook There you go And that's that's part of why you are who you are, right? You understand how incredibly valuable that is as i'm sure your your audience does I don't care what business you're in. It's the greatest tool. They have database partners Um, you know the connection between them and instagram just all of it. It's just huge Do you uh, do you uh run simultaneous ads on facebook and instagram? Absolutely Yeah, I mean because a lot of some people are on one or the other somewhere on both You know, so you're whatever works Whatever works, but I wouldn't knock something until you've tried it with an angle in mind to give it time It's kind of like buy leads That's always one of my favorite discussions if I buy leads from zillow or realtor What's the first thing people say they're crap they don't work You'll ask how long did you do it? Oh a month? And then how many did you call back or respond to oh two couple, you know, you got to give things time so Instagram or facebook you only know if it works if you but it's also the greatest thing for us even as a new agent Because you could spend five bucks. You can start a campaign for 15. It's not working turn it off Yeah, that's what you're doing wrong and adjust. I think it's an amazing tool Whereas if you had like postcards like back in a day, right once we printed those postcards and mailed them They were gone. That was a sunk cost. There was no pulling it back We're doubling down even uh in the moment. So I think it's beautiful I'm not sure what your opinion is on it. I guess every market is a little bit different too Do you uh, do you advocate postcards? I advocate tracking to where you know what actually works Right, right. So in other words, I'm not against any of it I think that you know if you're an orange beach over there and condos where you've got a bunch of Vacationers on an average basis your whole setup may be different than here where I'm in suburbia with single family homes everywhere But what I'm not is somebody to say no to something before executing it Sure, and I'm definitely not someone to say it doesn't work if I can't prove it with numbers Yeah, for sure, you know if you're not tracking it then you know conversion rate like for I mean ricky think about this I've asked people before if you could spend a hundred dollars to make 200. Would you do it? Oh, yeah all day About it. No, they don't they're like, huh? I'm like, okay. So 200 to make 400 Uh, no, I'm like y'all are not paid You know, so it's that that mindset that to be able to lean in but also to track, right? If you're not tracking, how do you know what's working or not working? Yeah, and that's where cmc rms come in handy and all of this stuff like At your stage when you're you know There and in our speech one of my favorite places and you've obviously put in the time the effort you've built a huge business I mean at this stage, what's something that's working for you? Uh, that you do regularly to kind of keep the the the machine going if you will is it postcards? Is it emails? Email emails my biggest thing. Yeah Yeah email email has always been my biggest thing I mean, it's just I mean, you know look 2016 I did I No social media was a part of my even life Wow, you know, I had a facebook account, but I didn't really use it. I didn't need it. It's interesting, right? Yeah, yeah, I mean, I mean that well that's interesting thing about real estate because like I said from the beginning Voice to voice is the reason why technology won't replace us You can you like whatever avenue you figure out to actually start the conversation great It can be facebook zillow. You know, it can be Cold calls it can be for sale owners door knocking open houses whatever your avenue is you have to start that conversation So mine was phone calls because there was no facebook, you know back when I was starting and stuff so I learned how to do it that way and following up through email And so what happened was last year I was like well in 2000 october 2016. I did a speech for remax in Biloxi And the response was overwhelming like there was a line out the door people want to ask me questions And I was like man, my my message really resonates. I'd already started writing a book I said I need to finish that book and I need to move forward with my dreams of helping agents and stuff because people Really like what I have to say So 2017 I started social media for the for the speaking coaching entrepreneurial business not real estate And so I started doing social media facebook. I learned facebook I figured out how to use it then I moved over to instagram now i'm doing youtube And when I like really dove in deep with facebook to really figure out I made a lot of mistakes and spent a lot of money and did this and did that I was like wow, I can do all that And so again, I turned around and I started using it against my already huge database You know, I made a custom audience of of my facebook, you know of my out of my Clients yeah, and then I'm running facebook ads against people that already know who I am And it just like it's just like pouring gasoline On my business, you know people are just like it's it's amazing, you know, uh, how many calls I get I see on facebook this and that so no, it's really big. Um, I haven't I haven't Messed around with the funnel click Put in your contact get the actual new leads Social media it's been more of a brand building extension Of what I already had going on but absolutely, dude I mean the possibilities are endless you and what I really have started telling people is do half and half Use half of your efforts on facebook to brand and the other half to try to collect new leads, you know Yeah, I think all of that is solid I mean i'm still amazed like it's such a testament to You'd built a business on what's working and as far as the social media world's concerned You were a late comer but look at all that's happened for you since Oh, yeah, it's crazy. It's amazing. And so for me it was youtube first and that's where things got weird It still gets weird with all the emails and all that which I love because me and you were aligned In that I mean I was sick and tired of having students I called on the boomerang They get out they get their license they boomerang right back now. What do I do right? They ask that question a million times and um So to your point I think that wherever you are in your business It's the constant tracking and reevaluation of what are your efforts and what are they doing? I I can't emphasize that enough right you saw that there was another avenue there facebook was going to augment what you were already doing Um, but I just I can't emphasize enough saying notice something till you've done it But furthermore on facebook before you spend one dollar. Are you using it for its actual intent? Like are you actually connecting with people? Yeah So let's separate real quick. There are lots of real estate agents that are so terrible at facebook It makes us all believe we're going to be terrible at facebook right right those the people that annoy you annoy everybody else too Don't do that But what you can do on facebook for instance is have private conversations through messenger Where you can catch up with people That you know like that know like a trust you that you know that you're related to your friends And it could be casual conversation you focus on them Eventually they'll reach back and they'll ask you what you're up to you remind them what you do You just have conversations if you do that every single day In other words get on facebook with admission not just because i'm at the stop light Right get on facebook with a purpose that i'm going to connect with this many people that i'm going to post on these Many walls and not spammy stuff Genuine stuff. Yeah go looking for life events. Yeah. I mean somebody just had a kid There that's a trigger for a house sale, right? But at minimum be be absolutely genuine and go tell your friend congratulations and how proud of you are You don't have to say anything about real estate Right, right, right when it matters to other people and then when it matters to you They'll be there for you. Yeah. Yeah, and that cost nothing And by all means don't go live and show people like the walls and underneath its table and Yeah, this thing gives a blessing in a curse, isn't it? There's no doubt, but uh You know like you said I think me and you I could agree the phone feature on this has made me more money than every other feature Yeah Guys at the end of the day all these different avenues are designed to either get me in front of you face to face Or get me on the phone people think they're supposed to be replacing it Well, we're seeing that that's not happening. Thank you our new avenues to get you in the door to get you on the phone, right? Use it to start the conversation not to close the deal Yeah Yeah, unless unless they beg you to close the deal then you do whatever they want sure. Yeah So so you have to sure like when I said what do you what's your favorite thing to get listings? You said facebook take me through how you would get a listing on facebook. What what would be your? Strategy what would you do? Absolutely. All right. Well first thing is I would want to Always go backwards reverse engineer of my avatar. What kind of listing do I want? Because you're saying I want listings. Well, there's a big difference in listening a billion dollar house down the street here A condo over there where you are You know, whatever the case may be because that's going to tell this tale of how i'm going to go back and get that person So if i'm a new agent and i'm in my mid 20s and we're dealing with first time home buyers Well, now i'm going to think about well, where are they they're on facebook and instagram, right? So okay now, I know where i'm likely to find them. So what am I going to do? Well, what are they curious about? Well, facebook has an audience you can market to that says people that are thinking about moving I mean it's an audience already built into facebook because facebook is crawling our private message conversations You're post everything out there plus extraneous data that they're bringing in So I could literally what's the first question that somebody's wondering that's thinking about moving What the first what's their house worth? Yeah, they're always thinking about that, right? But you don't want to go spammy. What if you hit them with an ad with a with a beautiful image or a picture That literally facebook's lead ads pre fills it for you with their information. So it removes resistance And then you actually follow through with what they asked What's pretty amazing about that is in other words, I can go straight at the type of person i'm trying to reach I could set up ab testing this video and this picture and this picture and this ad And I could see which one's working facebook will tell me within 48 hours I'll double down on the one that's getting response and then what's my conversion What if I get 10 people that click that form because they're curious what their house is worth you actually respond And then one of those turns into a listing. How often would you do that? Yeah, that really works for me Then the reason is is because it's not spammy and it's actually it's it's taking the google approach to facebook Which means you're hitting them with the question They're already going to ask when they're looking for the answer So rather than going to type in google, what is my house worth and they end up on a zestimate When they're thinking about it, you serve them an ad right there on facebook Right on their news feed. It really works And i'm not sure why more people won't do it Okay, so so you say that there's already a custom audience that facebook does it said people that are thinking of moving Yep Or people that are likely to move it may be called They trusted the name a couple of times, but it's an automatic audience. It's already in there. Nice Yeah, yeah, facebook loves real estate agents. They want your money They want to take the attention away from zillo and realtor.com. They want it. So they're helping you give it to them Okay, i'm gonna put together some facebook ads real quick man. Give me a second I'm putting together some facebook ads Well, like I said, I mean since we're talking about these are just things You know the google approach to facebook answering people's questions when you know they have it because facebook's telling you Yeah, that's that's beautiful, man. That is so beautiful. Thank you for that man, i'm sure a lot of people are gonna Enjoy hearing that Kyle brown says you can create a list of your past clients and when you open that list you only see their post Uh, then you just scroll through like com the like comment boom 20 minutes With 50 of your best marketers Absolutely, Kyle's obviously more on the diamond side probably if he's got that many, uh, that many past clients 100% By using friends lists on your facebook page You can pull up a news feed with exactly who you want to talk to So if it's for your past clients, you could pull up their news feeds and only be liking commenting and engaging I love that. Kyle. You're dead on that was okay. So you do that with their emails. You can create the list like that Well, both One is okay Let let's take a step back because you asked me specifically about listings But if i'm an agent and I haven't done this yet The first thing you do is take your database And you upload it as a custom off If we had covered that you that's like a no brainer. I've got video tutorials on that good beautiful. Yeah I mean you've got to do that. Yeah, so you go find those people for you um And then uh what what kyle was was augmenting what we were talking about earlier is as part of your prospecting time Whatever your window is that should include facebook with a purpose Which means you're not just scrolling around or whatever you're getting on there with a purpose I'm going to connect with 10 people. I'm going to whatever your list is I I use a three six and nine approach But whatever it is where you're starting conversations You're adding comments you are being genuinely interested in other people And it's just using social media for what it's for which is social But then the second part is facebook's algorithm is going to continue to help show you to them Because facebook has already shown us that they're emphasizing the personal side more than to shove things in their face side So if you're genuinely posting on people's things, you're more likely to be seen by them as well sure And yeah, and let me just add to to the conversation to To not only do ads to collect information and stuff, but to also bring some value in there somewhere about good restaurants events Uh things going on stuff like that as well And maybe even some inspirational stuff as well just to Drive engagement and then touch people on a different level than just the standard Hey, you want to sell your house or here's a listing and stuff like that. Is that something you would agree with? 100 i mean the biggest thing you can do as a real estate agent is be engaged in your at least your farm the place you want to do market so um On facebook that gives you the absolute opportunity to get in front of those people with stuff that has nothing to do with real estate Be helpful when people are looking for suggestions, right? Somebody needs a handyman or a restaurant or this or that Comment and help them out like you're just being part of the community So facebook's replaced, you know the neighborhood bar in some ways and you're having those conversations at scale And if you're doing that all the time it's going to pay off over time because for me It's incredible how many private facebook messages I get Whether it's I need a cc course or I did or My friend sell in their house or this or that or the other and you had talked to them in six months Or six years, but everybody can be found on facebook and then hit out through messenger so I think that's incredibly important and You know we could talk about bots and automating that but why when you could put 10 minutes of effort in and get a lot of return Sure So yeah, that's I mean that's that that's monster And I think the people get offended with facebook when they set up like their facebook business page as an agent And they post a new article and nobody sees it Yeah, I think you got to take your personal feelings out of it and realize you're branding every time you do that Don't stop Yeah, right. I mean it's important and over time you'll figure out what you get engagement But facebook is telling you right now You're gonna have to pay to put that stuff in front of people doesn't have to be a lot But five 10 bucks 15 bucks 20 bucks you post that blog and then you put it in front of your database Or you put in front of your farm now. We're getting somewhere So how what percentage of realtors did you say use use facebook? The last statistic I got now let's talk about not on facebook But actually have spent a dollar minimum on facebook ads facebook's own statistic was nine percent Only six percent of businesses in the world even have a credit card on file with facebook So Guys we we are nowhere yet Yeah, yeah, it's it it hasn't even begun Facebook's biggest concern is running out of space to serve you ads. They're already working on that. Right, right That's gonna be the problem. I mean, what are they gonna do double feeds? I don't raise the price Yeah, oh, yeah, oh, yeah the yeah the price is gonna go up. There's no doubt The price for conversion is gonna start to hurt You know amazon, you know google google's biggest client back uh back in the early 2000s or whatever was amazon amazon literally Built their entire like got famous basically on google using google adwords It's the same thing with facebook right now. You can literally use it I mean it's what i'm doing in the coaching world. I mean i'm spending I'm actually about probably breaking even but I'm gaining so much traction with people who know who I am what my message is and You know, it's it's definitely Hasn't even started so man. I love how you brought that into the conversation Yeah, well, I mean look just for me I mean i've had competitors that i've been waiting for since 2012 to serve up their first facebook ad And for the first time in 2018 one competitor. I saw their first facebook ad ever I was like you gave me a six and a half year head start you are in trouble And uh, you know, so fellow agents what I would say is There's classes. There's people like me and ricky the the the flood is not yet even here yet Facebook is still figuring out their real estate play. Let's be honest here They're coming they want your attention they want to take it away from zillo and realtor.com and they're going to figure that out So the biggest thing is if you got money to spend Use it on what your intention is like you you're at the branding phase of your career If i'm genuinely trying to generate interest But then what also happens is you have an open house And you could put a beautiful ad out there and you get a ton of comments and likes It doesn't have to sell the house, but it becomes a marketing piece You can show future sellers on what you're going to do. I did that. I did an open house and I ran a facebook ad about it I did a video with my phone of the house And then and then I ran an ad with the video and a video ad For like two days before the open house and I had so many people show up and so many likes comments shares The owner the owner saw it on his feet Like he woke up as like six o'clock in the morning He saw the ad for it on his feet and he called me. He was like, dude This is crazy You know, he was super excited that I was that I had done that so no it's and then I spent about 75 dollars You know on that So yeah, I mean look it goes back to the it's one of the core things I will say forever You've got two things you could spend you've got money or time and effort And if you refuse to do either you're not going to make it right So if you're not going to spend 75 dollars Then you're going to have to make up for that in the efforts. You're going to put forth at the open house That's way more efficient, right? And it becomes now a case study you could show future sellers and all those various things You know every market's a little bit different, but the one thing we know is everybody's on facebook, but you know Ricky the other thing I would say is is that let's not forget about the offline And I think that the most important thing that we need to remember is at the end of the day We're in a business where we're supposed to be serving and helping someone else And I think that where a lot of people even great agents get it wrong Top producers are starting to to to struggle a little bit in some areas Is because they focus all their marketing on themselves their entire message is on themselves It's all about how great I am look how much money I made look at my awards And while that could be an augmenting piece, why don't we flip it around and start making sure that the consumer Who's increasingly shopping around for all services and products including real estate knows that ricky and chris care about what you want And the way we do that is center our marketing our conversations our message around the other person And then everything else takes care of itself. So when people say I don't like the term sales Well, that's because you've been sold poorly to by a bad sales person But a great salesperson i'm not afraid to say i'm in sales Because a great salesman asks you what your problem is and then shows you how they can solve it sure Right, and I just think that there's far too much tell throw yell You know brag about myself and the consumer increasingly is telling us They care more about what other people say about you. Yeah, you say about you. Yeah, oh, yeah Absolutely, man. Hey when I became number one and stuff a couple years ago I started posting it and put it everywhere and what I realized was is that nobody cares at all Like nobody cares You know, it's something to be super proud of but the yeah the consumer doesn't care, right? I got the least amount of engagement. I got the least amount of people that said, you know, like it was just The first time I did it. I had a lot of congratulations and stuff But then year two it was like, okay ricky, we get it, you know, whatever So man, I'm gonna listen to it with this. What would you say in what? In in let's see in four words, you know, whatever less than five words What's the number one reason why? Prospects choose a particular agent well Let's see in four or five words I'm gonna go away from what the statistics say and all of that. I'm gonna say because they know and trust you What do they know and trust are the most important parts? What did the statistics say the statistics? Yeah, statistics say that 70 of the consumers work with the first agent that they actually have a meeting with So statistically the hard part is getting the appointment, which is I don't care about what happens as much within the appointment I think we get it's important, but it's not everything Right because most people don't want to if Ricky and me are both scheduled to go to the same seller and we're competing I want to be first Because there's almost no chance Ricky's going to even get there and that seller is going to be Not willing to go through that whole listing with another agent like that Consumers just aren't shopping for us as much as they think they need to know us And they need to trust us at the moment. They're making that decision Right. I like it man. I like it Thank you, man. Appreciate it No, I appreciate you having me on I really do and all you guys out there Yeah, of course, of course and everybody out there Look just keep doing the right stuff Keep putting in the work listen to what Ricky's telling you and look keep an eye on where you get your advice Getting advice from a guy like Ricky is valuable because he's done it and he's still doing it There's always people in your office that are going to give you bad advice tell you things don't work And I want you to consider the source be really careful where you get your info Good stuff, man This has been incredible man. I just appreciate it so much guys We're going to call that a day if you need something from me or chris reach out What uh chris tell I mean tell them real quick like how they can get in touch with you and stuff like that Absolutely. Yeah, sure. I'd love to um some this the owner and ceo of donaldson educational services The best way to find me is on my personal website, which is chris talks.com very simply chris talks.com What I'd love everybody to do is to visit the office hours page And the office hours page is the home base for my video podcast that we've been doing for two years now And there's hours and hours of free and tactical info on there. There's no hook. There's no catch So for instance, I've had the vice president of realtor.com on lee brown and everybody in between Ricky is surely going to say yes and come on soon So chris talks.com go to the office hours page and check that out and then i'm a big fan of twitter Come find me on twitter chris talks daily. I'd love to see you guys So ricky you are I think we're still live, but your camera is dark. So now it's my show I suppose um Is it really gonna let him keep pushing the buttons But all of you guys out there hit me up on twitter Or don't send me a message on facebook because just as as ricky can share I want to see the next generation