 Test test test test test test test test test test test test test test test test test test One two three check one two three check two check two check two check check check check Hello, good afternoon. Thank you all for being so patient with us It's good to see you. I know it's been a very rainy day So it's good to see all of you Welcome to a seat at the table women of color in public service Today's conversation is jointly sponsored by the students of color in public policy and women in gender in public policy Our goal today is simple to engage women of color change makers Policy makers and leaders right here in Michigan Yet, we all know that the pathways to leadership and prominence is anything but simple And that is what we hope to better understand and delve into today And I will soon introduce our moderator who many of you probably already know And she will tell you a bit about each of our dynamic panelists and guide today's dialogue I will note that we have one panelist who will be joining us in just a bit also caught up in the rain as well So I have to make sure she introduces her But later we will reconvene for a Q&A as a larger group and I'll make sure that folks have access in the microphone I know I see one here, but also be walking around in case you do have questions or thoughts that you want to share And before heading into the reception which we are so thankful that the Office of Communications and Outreach has sponsored for us and for all of us to engage in afterwards We want to make sure that Oh, I have other things to give to you. Thanks to Nana for where is he he'll be taking photos So make sure you've got your game face on he'll be coming around So we have some lasting memories and images of this kind of not just camaraderie But this type of event that we hope to see more of in the future here at the Ford School And so without further ado, I will introduce our moderator and we'll get started for the afternoon Afton Branch is a second-year MPP here at the Gerald Art Ford School of Public Policy She's a co-chair of women and gender and public policy and is a Center for Social Impact Board Fellow with nonprofit enterprise at work Before coming to Ford she worked in the nonprofit sector for several years working on immigration policy Organizational capacity building and women's rights. Thank you So to get started I'd like to introduce our panelists first all the way on the left is you've deep mess been Johnson She's the chief operating officer and vice president for strategy at new nonprofit enterprise at work. Yes She is my staff mentor my board fellows program She's a nationally recognized leader in business development nonprofit management and social entrepreneurship Fun fact. She's also the founder of lips and hips a social enterprise focused on women and girls leadership development And she mentors a young a group of young women from the downtown Detroit youth boxing program and launched with them a vegan organic lip gloss line Joel Jude Fontaine is a program officer with the WK Kellogg Foundation in Battle Creek, Michigan In this role she works with the education and learning teams to develop programming priorities Identifying and nurturing opportunities to affect positive change within communities She manages and monitors a portfolio of grants. She provides technical assistance To grantees and also leadership capacity building and development She has experience in improving the quality of care in early childhood education For children ages zero to eight and she brings that to her work at the Kellogg. I'm also going to introduce Rep Stephanie Chang who I here is getting gas and will be joining us very soon Representative Chang is currently serving her second term Representing Michigan's sixth house district which comprises the cities of e-course River Rouge and part of the city of Detroit Before serving in the legislature representative Chang worked as a community organizer in Detroit for several years With organizations including next-gen climate Michigan Center for Progressive Leadership and the James and Grace Lee Boggs school She's also a proud Ford School alum where she received a dual masters in public policy and social work. So those are our panelists Thank you for being here So to get started, I'd like to hear from each of you about the work that you do particularly projects that Inspire you to get up in the morning every day The biggest project that inspires me is motherhood actually I am the proud mama of her seven-year-old Tyson who is some second-grader here in Ann Arbor schools We just moved over from the Lincoln community schools So surprisingly, I've become an ed activist and I'm happy to be sitting next to Joel my new BFF So at night just getting Really oriented around that and I think that a lot of my leadership has grown out of my own journey as a woman and Most recently in the last seven years as a mom I think what gets me up is a commitment really to in a more equitable and just social sector I spend in addition to the hats I wear that Afton mentioned I also am the lead consultant for our diversity equity and inclusion work at new and This idea that in my lifetime We might solve for some of the deep and complex social issues that impact Particularly women of color, but also other marginalized women and marginalized peoples Good afternoon What inspires me so I think that What brought me to this work? So I always say that you don't I didn't have a path to philanthropy I just kind of fell into philanthropy, but what really feeds my work in philanthropy is really wanting to create opportunities for young people I immigrated to the United States and Living in the United States. It was really interesting because I learned very early on that there was this dichotomy in terms of what my home life was like and what my Outside world experience was like and then later on kind of realizing what my life had been and what Opportunities others had and so to explain that, you know coming to the United States My parents always made sure that we lived in the top neighborhoods where the top schools were located and oftentimes what that meant is that there was no diversity so growing up in Brookline in Newton, Massachusetts. I was the only one or two black girls in the class and What I found later on however is that when I started working with young people is that the education that I had received and the Opportunities that I had were just not afforded to everyone as liberally and so I really became Committed to ensuring that that just isn't the case because I think that you know a lot of the things that I overcame It was simply because of the opportunities that were provided to me I don't think I had any you know special talents that others couldn't have also accomplished these things And so how that shows up in my work is that you know philanthropy while I think that we have an opportunity To do an incredible amount of good the reality is that historically we haven't been as strong as supporting organizations of color Organizations led by women and so we have a lot of work to do in that and so for me I see that as my role as an opportunity to try and help and open some of those doors and provide some of those opportunities and so the work that we do in Kellogg in the education and learning team is that we're focusing on issues for children pre-birth to age eight While we recognize that you know children and young people across the continuum birth to 24 They have issues. They're all important But you know philanthropy can only do so much so we've decided to kind of hone in into this area because it affords us the Opportunity to not only help inform and impact the life of a child at the very early stages But also help to support families as well And so within education and learning we focus on family engagement Issues around effective teaching and also looking at broader issues around systems change And I just want to highlight that part of the reason we do this is that the underlying philosophy is how we approach The work is that we really believe that you know families are an asset I think that historically particularly in education and in early childhood education Families have been seen the way I often describe it is that you know quality early childhood is an inoculation from a bad Family and we really don't believe that we think that quality early childhood Childhood education is something the family needs to help support their economic mobility And so we want to work in partnership. So we want to support families and becoming leaders We want to support institutions in being able to authentically engage with with families We also recognize that you know teaching is an important It's an important sector an important part of a child and a family's life We recognize the challenges involved for the teaching profession And so we're committed to you know helping teachers to better meet the demanding needs of the current student Helping teachers to better meet the needs of families and really work in partnership with families We also recognize that you know the pipeline is you know in terms of particularly in urban settings you have Teachers who don't look like the children that they're teaching and so we're really focused on how do we change that and then finally You know our families we focus primarily on families who are living in poverty And we recognize that the systems that they have to navigate don't always support them And so how do we improve these systems so that they really can help support families? I'm gonna go back to you, Yodi. Can you tell folks a little bit about How new approaches capacity building That's the sort of buzzword for those of us who are trying to learn more about nonprofits who are interfacing with funders and things like that Capacity building is a big term, but what does that actually mean? And how do you guys approach that at noon? It's an all-encompassing and I think sometimes too broad a description of In fact just today as part of some work that Afton's involved in it new in our strategic planning We've been guided by and I encourage you to take a look at a national report written by the TCCC group called capacity building 3.0 and TCCC's assertion and I think we Support this thinking is that capacity building is Multi-leveled it involves individuals it involves Organizations if you think about this series of sort of concentric circles and then outside of that this sort of broader Ecosystem or broader community and so over the years and I've been in the sector now just shy of 20 years I would say the early part of my career there was a lot of emphasis on professional development on making people in Organizations more professionally adept at doing their work. So you a lot of focus on technical skills And increasing those competencies and then I think we've seen it more Into infrastructure. So at new we have a back office IT business, you know, we have a building with shared Shared space and below market rent, you know to make that piece affordable for nonprofits If they're building capacity We also have you know back office accounting and all of these things that are intended to kind of strengthen the Organization and where we're headed and it gives more Deeper understanding of the multiple actors that are involved in building capacity. So an example about three years ago It's interesting. You mentioned pipeline. So I think we have a pipeline challenge throughout the sector Including how do we Create succession plans for you all right before you even arrive in the six into the sector How do we help to develop you as our next leaders and and frankly the Present presently the sector doesn't really has not because professional development and leadership Development are often something that we have to pay for ourselves. They're not frequently funded through say a program grant and so We find that there is not a natural as in fact Pardon me while I elucidate this We're just talking about in perfect in business in the business sector There's a return on investment for investing in in staff and talent right because it drives you towards profit So you really have a motivation a profit I think that we still in the sector at least in individual organizations forced Our challenge to see that ROI in terms of being able to measure outcome or impact It's still something that we're we're working on it's a it's an area where we have some work to do and so as a result of that and A number of other external factors you have leaders who have stayed in nonprofit organizations much longer And you have now your generation starting to come into the sector with lots of options a lot more educated Lot more bills a lot more student debt right and so there's a lot of turn at the entry level and very of pretty much a thin middle management in nonprofit and so With that context in mind a few years ago we with our partners here at Zingerman's who also have a really Powerful and dynamic leadership development program We developed the first kind of public-private Non-profit partnership with them in the form of something we call leadership deli and deli is develop elevate launch and innovate And I'll tell you that early on it was really about we've got to teach nonprofits how to do act like businesses So we're gonna bring in one of the best businesses. I call them the 65 million dollar corn beef shop, right? We're gonna bring in the best business to teach nonprofits how you know to do what to do these things and we have learned so much y'all Not only was that not What needed to happen, but but it also was not what happened instead what happened is that when leaders had supportive space to be together to Develop their own skills to develop processes and systems and to learn new Methodologies and new ways of thinking about the work that they were doing they they thrived in that environment So when you ask sort of you know, what's new working on? I think where we see ourselves headed in the next five years is sort of doubling down on Developing leaders young leaders existing leaders leaders that don't have the titles and the Not the the traditional education track, right? So community leaders And we want to we see them as being integral in Those community-wide outcomes that I mentioned at the onset and so how can we make sure that we're creating space for that? And also I'm excited that we're starting to blur the lines of a nonprofit versus a social enterprise or an impact Organization and thinking that there probably is also space to create some collision for leaders in multiple sectors to interact in the in the leadership Program So that's like the good side of it the downside is I think we recognize that teaching seven workshops over seven months Isn't necessarily a leadership development program So what we're excited about is to partner with you know the Center for positive organizations here and other True practitioners of leadership methodology and leadership best practice to help us get better Thank you So one of the things that I'm job interviewing right now And one of the things that keeps coming up my interviews is relationship building everybody wants to know how do you build relationships? What's your experience doing it? So I want to know from you guys. How do you approach authentic relationship building in your work versus sort of transactional relationship? Okay So it's kind of layered in terms of how you you ask the question so there's so I'll answer it two ways I think that there's Maybe it's not layered because I'm thinking how I work inside the foundation versus how I work with potential grantees But maybe it's it's not really different. So I'll speak about that the grantee part because I think it's probably most critical For you guys to hear this part so What I've learned in terms of authentic relationships and particularly in this position that I have because I Recognize that being in philanthropy. There's a power dynamic and so I walk into the room and I'm well aware of the fact that It's not really Joelle Fontaine But it's WK Kellogg foundation that has walked into the room and the nine billion dollars that WK Kellogg brings into the room with it And so recognizing this power dynamic the reality is that you know when you get into philanthropy it's really hard to Have authentic relationships because it truly is about Organizations that need to get funding in order to do this work in order to employ folks And so I always walk into a room kind of recognizing that and knowing that no matter how great the relationship is that there is this Tension but given that I think it's really important for me to walk into a room Recognizing that I don't have the answer Because you walk into a room and I mean you guys are you're in graduate school. You're taking stats You're doing all of these different classes. I'm sure you've learned about so much about what are the answers that kind of ails The world and how to fix it And and I'm not dismissing that but the reality is that when you start to engage with people whether it be one-on-one in Larger groups Everyone comes with their own perspective Everyone comes with their own set of ideas and so when I walk into the room I recognize that I don't have the answer So what I have is I have recommendations. I have perspectives. I have suggestions I have ideas and they're all informed by my personal life experiences and so As a funder I walk into a room and the first thing I really want to do is I want to work on Listening I want to work on listening and not listening to see I mean and sometimes it's hard because you know You're you're challenged with okay Does it fit the foundation's mission or not even if you think it's great work? but nonetheless your you want to listen to really learn and to try to Understand what the lived experience of you know the individual the organization the community whatever and I think that For me is how you get to authentic Relationships because you have to be open to that because I pushed myself because I believe that you know Whenever I walk into a situation and I have made grants where I'm like, I don't really think that's gonna work Or you know based off of how I am I don't really think that's gonna go anywhere but I make these grants often because I love the notion of my own Opinions kind of being challenged because I do believe that if you're you stay firm in this notion that you don't have the answers Then you're gonna be opened to so much and in my responsibility is to constantly be looking for those Organizations those people who really are kind of bringing the change that's needed to the world. So That's kind of how I approach it is really just being open Appreciate all of your sentiments and I echo them the I think the only thing I can add is Something you said that I really valued is that we are bringing our personal selves and I think when I experience Younger professionals that there's a veneer or an expectation that there's a veneer because you've sort of been coached right to find a job to look you know to get a fellowship to get into this school or this opportunity and I've had the pleasure of working with lately to to really three with Afton what I think are really authentic and genuine and And also really talented women and I think each of us each of each of us humans is seeking a Response from the universe that I see you and so in building relationships through listening through Intentionality and through authenticity. I'm trying to affirm for another human being regardless of our titles. I see you And then I will say that the best relationships are those where I'm in a position to serve So I'm trying to think of how can I serve the relationship now? How can I take and that's not it doesn't always work out great? I mean sometimes, you know that people don't have that same intention But it works out wonderful for me because I want to serve I'm here to serve and the other two two values that I bring our trust and candor so I Hold in the highest regard the things that people share and talk to me about both in relationship as a consultant to them But also people I engage with in the community my colleagues my peers my family, etc I think you need to you need to be able to trust folks And I think part of how we determine if we can trust is always right there and available to us So for women in this room, it's your intuition. And so I always encourage I think the best relationships are guided by just our good old-fashioned instincts and the candor is I'm willing to Put it all on the line for the truth and so I I don't sugarcoat things with my clients and I try always to speak with love, but Being real as we would say so my clients count on me to give it to him straight No chaser right but out of a place of love and I think ultimately that those things combined with what I heard Joelle Say is just sage wisdom for building authentic relationships with anyone really but particularly folks you're meeting for the first time Sort of bringing you into this conversation Talk to us a little bit about one project you're working on in the legislature that you're really excited about And also as a legislator, how do you build your authentic relationships rather than sort of transactional Sure. Well, thank you and again, sorry Sorry for being so late. I ended up staying in Lansing a little later than I thought I would and then With rain and everything just took a little longer than I thought to so But happy to be here and happy women's history month So in terms of some things that I'm excited to work on right now There's a lot, but one exact one thing is that I'm the new chair of the Progressive Women's Caucus and the state legislature and I am excited about our work ahead Although it's an uphill battle because Although we have a small number of progressive women in the state legislature There's a really large number of women of color Which is I think the biggest number that we've had before and I also think that it's a really exciting opportunity to build on a lot of the excitement and new engagement from a lot of women across the whole state and In my district and in a lot of other districts and there's a lot more people who are Coming out going to meetings contacting their legislators about all types of issues and marching and doing rallies and like starting indivisible groups and You know, it's just really exciting so I'm hoping that we can draw on that to Make sure that although a lot of attention is focused on the national level to also try to bring some of that energy to State-level politics and policy because there's certainly a lot to push back on At the state level as well and a lot of really great proactive things that we can be doing is women legislators who You know are committed to things like equal pay for equal work and earn paid sick leave and And addressing domestic violence and sexual assault And of course women's health issues. So We've got a lot that we're working on and it's just exciting to know that The work that we're doing is something that we can try to really get a lot more of this excitement That's building up in the community to help drive Some of the action so and then in terms of authentic relationships This is sort of a tough thing to do as a legislator, right? Because I think authentic relationships with residents in my district Are a lot easier. I think than authentic relationships sometimes with certain colleagues but I think definitely with my residents, I try to Really, you know, make sure that people know all the things that I'm trying to fight for and and then I think Also trying to break down More of the things that I do and that my office does that is outside of the policy world So that people just see me like being a mom See me like, you know, help it helping to do tax that we're doing free tax prep With the accounting aid society to make sure that some of our low-income residents get their tax credits and especially our seniors You know, we're helping people save their homes from tax foreclosure And so we're engaging with residents on a day-to-day basis not a lot of needs and a lot of things going on At the really at the very grassroots neighborhood level Of things that they have directly mentioned to us about things that they would like us to work on and so it is The way to show that we are listening and And that you know, it's not just like Election time in terms of transactional relationship. It's not just i'm doing x so that I can you know Have you helped me get reelected? It's really, you know And honestly a lot of the people that we help in our district can't even vote so You know, because we do a lot of citizenship work and we do a lot of work with tax foreclosure prevention Which tend to be people who aren't actually active voters. So it's just a way to One actually do the best public service that we can But also show people that we are really committed To doing the work Regardless of you know, who they voted for you know Or what their political opinion is because we have we have some republicans in our district too and And so we help them as well and And so it's definitely not definitely not dependent on You know, because there's I mean, honestly, there's some people who Are vocally, you know, not so, you know supporting other people Who we've been able to bring into the fold and convince that you know, we really want to help and so Because of that we've been able to build some really good relationships As far as within the legislature There are definitely a lot of colleagues that I have Really good authentic relationships with where there's trust where we are Sharing information and sharing life stories and all of that But I think There is definitely a level with some colleagues where you don't have as much of the personal relationship where there is sort of like a Oh, you know, you should come to my fundraiser and support or you know by by your presence or in order to get X, you know in order to get my bill a hearing and And and considered and hopefully through a committee and hopefully through the whole legislature I have to play nice on certain issues and And so there is that level of politics, which is just part of the job But that's not everyone and it just depends on Who the person is and their own sort of personality I try to In my one-on-one interactions with some of my colleagues Let them know, you know, I've like really not a lot of ego involved in this and So some of the things that people People get people get really touchy about a lot of different things In the legislature You know, oh, you didn't give me a heads up on this or you didn't do this and And I really don't care about any that like it's just about good policy and making sure we're doing the right thing And so Even if something does something a little bit out of protocol With me, I really it's not a big deal. So So, yeah, it's it's a little bit of a challenge to to do to do the authentic relationships in the legislature But we try and I think that having this progressive women's caucus is one place where we're hoping that we can really Find some sisterhood with one another and Because I think a lot of us face the same challenges Being women legislators. So We're hoping that that will continue to be a place where we can do that for all of you. Um How do you think your intersectional identities sort of considering race ethnicity gender national status Have impacted your leadership style over the years and if it hasn't you can say it has it It's a big I'll try it's a it's a big question, right? And I think it also depends on I Think what comes to mind immediately is Having been in leadership Quote on quote leadership roles professionally at least a little bit longer you Your thin your skin thickens But I so it's difficult to be a woman in leadership It's difficult to be a woman in leadership at home, right? I mean like it The systems are not set up to support us in a way. I am often Challenged by I've actually given up on work life balance. That just doesn't exist So I do try to work for work life integration But I find that a lot of times it's me who Is on the short end of that stick in terms of self-care as an activist And I'm sure many of you are activists as well. It's really important to take care of yourself. I went to the doctor today I'm 15 pounds heavier than I was this time last year I have a bit, you know, I'm a year into a new role So I know I mean that my truth is that it's something I'm constantly navigating My faith is an important part and I think a central identity this this idea that I'm just being used right as a vessel, but But frankly it's challenging and then in all of the different identities that I have Including You know, I would say my Feminism is intersectional until you get home as a black woman and then you're more of a womanist You know, I'm recognizing the oppressive nature that or the oppression of black men and having to navigate that as a wife And the mother of a black son and having to navigate that and how I show up at home for them Those are really the areas of leadership. I think about the most my job is as I said, it's my job It's service. I also think about the girls I mentor and how to really As you all say keep it 100 with them, right? But to help them evolve Recognizing that it is that the work of developing as a leader is evolutionary And that you're never like, oh, I'm there now, right? You're you constantly strive I think that I'm still challenged as often the only woman of color in a room Certainly the only woman executive at our team and our team That that can be lonely at times So those are maybe some reflections Let me end on a positive I'm sorry. I will tell you that I developed lips and hips really as a response to this is my leadership a feminist leadership practice that I developed about six years ago and I it was it has this kind of tongue-in-cheek name and Our work is around working with women who are at these intersections these identities The most we center our work around women who are marginalized Really as an outlet. And so that's what I want to tell you is you own The the the outcome right you do have control over how your leadership unfolds And so that I wrote leadership curriculum to work with women around their own personal development And I host immersive events with women where we can go and respite together So there's this contrast of like the struggle And then making what you want and what you need and I feel Equally emboldened by both Gabby's question I'm still trying to process it Because I just think it's it's this notion of how they influence your leadership because when I think about each like when I think about Myself as a woman. I think of myself as a black woman. I think of myself, you know as As a Haitian-American I have all of these ways in which all of those identities influence who I am And I think what I'm challenged with is kind of how they influence my Leadership Because I have found this notion of leadership to be kind of tricky because you ask this question of Developing authentic relationships. And I think that where I have struggled is in Being an authentic leader because I think that sometimes You know the older you get and the longer you've been in this type of work The less patience you have because you've seen it And you just keep saying to yourself it's just not that hard And it shouldn't be this hard And I know I told you guys before that you don't have the answer but we kind of know what we need to do right and It just becomes really frustrating when time and time again you you don't see those changes happening fast enough um, and so I think that the way if I could Dress it at all is the way that it may be impacts my leadership in terms of I think how I Mentore others and support others is that All of those identities have always been kind of struggling to be heard and seen And accepted for just who they are Like don't put me in a box in terms of what it means to be a black woman what it means to be A woman what it means to be Haitian-American And so just allowing Me to be authentic and so I think that as I Mentore and support others. It's always with this sense of you know speak your truth You know really find a way to you know push through some of these Sticky areas that are unnecessarily sticky, you know, how do you navigate? Through situations Well, really what you want to say is kind of cursed and just say whatever but you have to be diplomatic and come on You have to think curse you have to think systems and you have to think long term and you know How do I influence the the structure so that therefore? No one else will have to go through what i'm going through right now because we will have agreed upon rules and processes That will eliminate some of these situations So I think that that might be how it comes up And ask you a question about Working in lansing. So tell us about being in a political minority. How do you get things done? You have tons of priorities from safe drinking water to criminal justice reform. How do you how do you get things done when working with others? Sure. Um, well, I think there's a couple things. Um, one, uh, when I introduced legislation, I sort of have There's like different buckets of bills So there's the bucket of bills where I know honestly isn't going to go anywhere But it's just really important to reintroduce or introduce because there are important priorities for my district and I need to speak out about these issues and And just kind of see where it goes and hold for the best and obviously work hard to Advance them, but with the knowledge that we just don't have the numbers And then there's a certain set of bills that is You know the bills that are a little bit more doable that you can actually get by partisan Cosponsorship for so the way cosponsorship works is that You know, there's a lead sponsor on the bill. So say you you know my cumulative impact study bill which is about air pollution I'm the main sponsor on it, but then I get cosponsors on it. Basically people literally sign their name And say you know support this bill And I have managed to get republican cosponsors on a lot of my bills Usually, you know like two or three or one Just kind of defend the bill And who I'm talking to And I'm going to the same couple of people a lot, but But I think that there is that bucket of bills where you can get more bipartisan support And I found that I think in the criminal justice Reform area that is an area where there is a lot more bipartisan work and agreement because when it comes to trying to address Fairness in our justice system From the perspective of also reducing our prison population There is I've found a weird combination of like Progressives who care about ending mass incarceration, but not necessarily always using that language in a republican led legislature and Republicans who are either Very religious and have been involved in prison ministry or Really believe in Doing justice and walking humbly And fiscal conservatives who are like we're just spending way too much on prisons There's like this weird intersection of people who Tend to right now. I think make up the majority of the legislature You know with those democrats and with those republicans To be able to get some things done So there are some bills that I've introduced or that others have Introduced that have made it through the legislature that are very much About criminal justice reform. So I think the approach there is to Understand that people come at issues from all different perspectives and while I come at most of these things from a basic justice and fairness Perspective if someone else is able to get to that same endpoint because they care about the dollars I will take it because ultimately it's going to help all of our residents So there's that Sort of like knowing that people aren't going to come at the same conclusion For the same exact reasons and just knowing you have to have those types of coalitions I also think that There are There are some things where So I have a bill that's going to come up in april in the house education committee Related to charter schools, but it's not like a anti charter bill. It's like a reform thing that I actually I won't go into the details, but basically I have actually I've been working with NAPSA, which is the lead one of the lead charter organizations and they Are so excited to be working with a democrat on a bill And it's it's actually it's a really good bill that you know, I think we'll probably go through with a lot of support on both the democratic and republican side, so Just trying to find unique opportunities and And then also knowing that people may have different Reasons to support but finding those reasons and trying to address them So speaking of politics, I want to ask you both At the end here a question about how do you think politics is going to affect the nonprofit sector over the next couple years? We don't know what's going to happen with the new administration, but are there are there ways that you think Changes at the federal level will affect your either your grantees or folks that you support at new Well, we're already seeing the some some impacts, especially with the Travel ban and immigration issues So the ways that it shows up for our clients now are the concerns over subpoena of data And how to protect data presently also Much of the immigrant population is kind of bunkered down in communities and so they're not accessing vital human resources So we're trying to figure out how do we redeploy those resources? How do we reimagine getting those critical resources food, you know basic needs met? When folks are scared to leave their houses and the structures are set up where you come to a food pantry But if ice is going to be at the food pantry, you're not coming, right? Also healthcare obviously Most of the folks in our office were pleased with friday, but we realized that there will continue to be Assaults on the affordable care act and as a result of that You know many many people especially because of the age of the population and the number of nonprofits in the health and human service field in fact Of the 50,000 nonprofits that are here in the state of michigan 65 percent of them have a mission That serves health and human service in some way, so We expect to see some implications. It was we were really excited by Your responses and the organizing that's happening at the street level Um, we are trying to respond by holding a series of public policy calls Just free calls where members of the nonprofit sector can jump on and at least learn what's happening from state state experts and national experts in in each of those areas Um spaces like education i'll defer but but um, so there's this this Multi-level approach, you know the rapid response to the things that are happening like you know Now its environmental is on a chopping black right and and what are those immediate implications? And then I would say longer term or more strategically is helping our clients to think about the Impacts of funding cuts for example, I sit on the board of a local housing shelter and we stand to lose, you know About 20 percent of our budget if um HUD has impacts So how do we redirect our fundraising efforts to Start to fill that pipeline with other funds besides HUD? So i'll pause there in the essence of time, but those are a couple ways You know, I I don't think I can quite answer it. I think that um We know it's extreme. So so I think in being in early childhood, you know, I feel that um I have been here before so 2000 to 2008 There were a lot of um monies taken out of early childhood and there are a lot of crises in the work that That I did so I know that this is far more extreme But I'll tell you it's it's challenging because on the one hand You want to know what's happening so that you can be proactive and you can try to You know address things head-on, but I think that sometimes there's just so much Information out there and so many connections and so so many possibilities Of what could go wrong that you know on a very personal level. I'm just like oh my god I I think I just need to wait and see for a moment, but I will say that One of the strategies that um That folks have started to take is that really seeing this as an opportunity to Um Ensure that the gains that we have made that we don't lose them Really using this as an opportunity to organize and to what I really hope Particularly in philanthropy using it as an opportunity to reflect on What we have supported in the past the particularly strategies We've had supported in the past and really taking a strong look at those strategies to determine whether or not They are effective because I really think that you know, our society has changed so rapidly in the past 10 years But particularly in philanthropy. I don't know if we have changed as rapidly in terms of how we respond to this change And so my hope will be that we'll take this opportunity To really reflect on those practices and what will come out of that are you know new strategies that will really be able to address the current situation But I don't know that's that's another big question So now we're going to segue into q&a. Um, if you can raise your hand if you have a question Gabby will come around with the microphone Feel free to give context to your question, but please ask a question Hi everyone, thank you so much for coming. My name is Carmen. I'm a first year's master student here So in public service and in progressive circles I have seen a pattern of white people heading Organizations or causes for people of color and certainly I have also worked in these types of spaces and when I have I find that I have trouble trusting the intention of these folks who are white and directors or leaders So as women of color and for us who are who are going to be moving up in our careers as leaders what advice you have for approaching that kind of relationship building and Do you have any suggested frameworks for viewing that kind of Allyship and especially white allyship with white women. Thank you So the question is is how to address that so Okay, well, I don't know if I'm exactly going to answer your question. So um Early childhood is particularly at the policy level Is very white if you go into early childhood and you go into a classroom Within the classroom what you will see is women of color who are usually with the children But as you move on in terms of the lead teachers the directors and then when you get into the policy work It is very very white Part of the reason that I came to Kellogg was even though I'd been working in early childhood For eight years I came to Kellogg because it was an opportunity To look at issues of equity in early childhood And so I think that part of what we've been trying to do So it's not really going to address your question because it's what we've been trying to do is really identify You know organizations people of color Who could also lend voice to you know this policy work that's happening In early childhood. I think in terms of what I will say in terms of working with allies I think it's it's really about assessing the authenticity of the ally and the the intent and You know where there's an opportunity to inform That intent if you think that it may not be exactly as it should be then you should take that opportunity and help to inform But yeah, it's tough because I do think that it is part of the problem in terms of You know the greater societal issues because You know good policy is nothing else and you all may disagree with me, but good policy is really good practice Practice starts at the ground level it starts with the people and starts with what works for people And so if you have people designing policies who have never experienced What the people they're designing policies for Then there's going to be a disconnect and so I think that it's you know for me That's why I think it's really important that we work on figuring how we can get more people of color involved In you know policy development, but also in terms of like the advocacy work That's happening with policymakers because you've got you know in early childhood You have a lot of white women talking for black and brown mothers and so Uh the lever that we pull and what I encourage you all to do is organizations are prospecting you Corporations are prospecting you is to ask them. What is your expressed commitment to equity and inclusion? And um often you will see that what that is it's it's tell tale It doesn't mean that you would opt not to work in an organization But then it becomes a place where we can The the what you're asking for what you're looking for can take root if it doesn't exist And so that really is the work that I do and in terms of dei is First asking nonprofit boards to make a commitment to express to write and to articulate a vision and a policy for equity for the work in their organization And um typically if you can plant that root that seed there then it flourishes throughout the organization Because then you can begin to look at the resources the donors the operations the policies etc So a great example of that locally is I sit on the board of united way of washtar county I've been invited to join the governance committee a few years ago Looked around it was very homogenous They also recognized that and I was you know invited as part of that kind of initial very Transactional diversity work we do anybody know a black girl that'll serve on the board. Oh call yo de You know, um, but when I got there they said this is our issue, right? We have this problem And so the governance committee first invited people of color to the table, right? Because you also cannot do equity and inclusion work without people of color at the table And then once we were there we named the issues that existed for example, the last seven chairs Campaign chairs have been middle aged white men. So if we have a It's an organization where the majority of donors are white and the majority of constituents are People of color there lies The chasm right and the opportunity for the board whose job is to advance that mission And use the resources wisely right to to to get involved and to to look at that So it looks much better on paper and certainly in in this quick synopsis But I think where the answer to your question is to begin by saying what is the express commitment of the to equity and inclusion on the part of the organization Okay, all right. I have it written down so As you next So this is a question that I often ask at Panels with folks like you. What's the best advice you've been given about making your way in whatever sector you identify with? And what advice would you give to us those of us who are looking for jobs internships? Looking for ways to build our leadership in the social I mean not without sounding cliche, right? I mean, you know I'll tell you what's worked best for me is To relentlessly pursue what I love To do work that I would do for free Right And to never compromise my values and I did that a lot in my early career I went to work for a fortune 100 company and you know I just I paid off some debt I get that right, but I feel like I sold my soul to the devil for those four years, you know So I wouldn't do that again And then create a vision for yourself I've been doing a lot of visioning work lately And I think imagining that future desired state is really powerful. What is it? What were you trying to go? So I wanted to be Oprah Didn't work out Didn't even get close This might be about close to it Um, but then like it's check part of that was it was just like big and broad So I would like to invite you to imagine what the next Three years look like or the next year And then look a little further out at 10 years and then use that like a blueprint You know come back to it not as a grade or a check. Oh, I did that I didn't do that But really like how am I advancing towards my best and highest self? I don't have a lot to add to that, but um, I guess what what I would say is Work in service too um, really, um I mean what has always driven me is is really trying to make the world better for primarily, you know, my audience are children and so I really stay focused on that. Um, and so it's never really for me been about, um, You know necessarily having to make a name for myself other than through my actions and in working in service to um This is gonna sound horrible, but I just I just thought it was a good piece of advice and because I think it It keeps you humble and it goes back to what I'd said about having the the answers and And part of the reason that I stress that is that I really believe that once you start believing that you have the answer That you then stop learning and once you stop learning you stop growing and I just figure you you might as well Not be here if you're not growing and learning and developing and so anyway at a very One of my first jobs in new york city This older jewish woman at this nonprofit. I was working at I don't even know what the context was Um, but she said and I can't I'm not gonna get the new york accent right But basically she said if you think you're indispensable, put your finger in a glass of water pull it out and see how big a hole you leave behind and yeah, and so What that said, I mean what it left me with is that you know I just have to work towards this level of excellence that I said for myself I can't come into an organization a community any place You know thinking that I am going to have the answers for these people or the people No matter how educated I am and that every day at this work. I can learn something new I mean, I love it when I go out there and I meet You know new potential grantees and there's just a completely new way Of doing things that can just make the world a better place for for folks. So So, yeah, I'll leave it with that So two things so when I was deciding whether or not I wanted to run for office There was like a six month time period of like No, I'm not gonna run when I was asked and then like yes and then no and then back to yes and back to no And then eventually ended up that yes One of I've met with like a bunch of different friends and mentors and one of the one of my friends when we sat down for coffee She was saying well, if you're In order to like help make this decision Why don't you think about you know, if you're gonna serve in the house for six years, but you're thinking Why don't you think about well, what are the what would you not? What would you be doing if you didn't run for office and what Is the level of the impact that you would be able to make for your community in that other route, you know, and so That is one of the questions that did help propel me to decide to run for office because Originally, you know, my plan was after graduating from the Ford school and the school social work Was to go back into the nonprofit fields and continue advocate, you know My advocacy on different civil rights and social justice issues, which I realized I can do Later too and it's always going to be my home to you know, go back to that kind of work and Serving in the state house for six years because we have term limits and you can only serve six years Is a great opportunity to try to make an impact in a different way and it's not a career choice It's it's a sort of a short-term Thing that I can do to try to raise the level of you know the voice that I can try to lift up for my residents and And so that type of question of you know, what is the best way If I'm not going to do this or looking at your different options and seeing well, what is the impact I'm going to be able to make To be able to help make that decision And so I think that that did help me figure out like, okay, I should do this because This is a way to make a bigger impact For a shorter amount of time. So but and I think You know just being persistent and sometimes also not having a plan. I think is is okay because You know, I had had a whole bunch of different plans that Did not really end up being what ended up happening You know when I graduated from undergrad, I had a union organizing field placement lined up It which would have taken me out of state and it would have been a great opportunity, but it was short term and um but then I so this was in 2005 I graduated from undergrad in 2005 and then At the same time, I knew that Wardell Connerley was likely to bring his anti affirmative action initiative to michigan and I feel like affirmative action has been a huge benefit to my education here and And so I You know decided, okay. Well, I do have this job lined up But this is something I'm passionate about and why don't I try to reach out to this organization to see if I can get Involved as a volunteer and maybe that might turn into a job And so I took a risk by giving up this job that was like for sure like actually a paycheck But I started volunteering with another with this organization To try to help you know educate folks about the benefits of affirmative action and While also doing something I actually worked in an after-school daycare part-time in order to be able to pay the bills and and then That volunteer work with the campaign ended up turning into a job So I think like having a plan is good and definitely try to plan but then also being flexible and then pursuing Things that you're really passionate about I think will lead you to opportunities especially when your work ethic and your commitment and your determination will show and then I think that just I guess The overall message is like try not to be too set on your plan Because a lot of things can change and opportunities may arise and and that type of being persistent and Finding ways to connect with people to explore opportunities that may not even exist on paper yet It's really important and especially opportunities with women leaders. So finding women leaders that That can sort of That you can ask and Who knows where the relationship may go and that you know turn into a mentorship type relationship And which might turn into a job and you know in the future. So Being open Oh, okay. Um, so my name is Essie Hutchful. I'm a second year MPP about to graduate and my question is in I'm observed in my own experience and and those of others particularly for women and particularly women of color that there's This sort of pressure that we We experience to sort of constantly succeed particularly because of sort of I guess the The saying that you have to be sort of you know twice or three times is good. And so there's sort of a constant fear of of tripping up or being wrong of Experiencing failure. So I wanted to ask, you know for whichever of you three you want to take on the question if you Could talk about moments when you did trip up when you were wrong and when you did, you know, feel that you failed and How did you contend with that? Every day Yeah, I Again, I'll point back to lips and hips and I'm so glad that you brought this up because I I wanted to make sure that you get all sides of of this work and of Choosing to to serve and I spent I would say in in that early part of my career and making some of those poor choices, right? And then it sits with you and it sits in your spirit and Also the multitude of identities and experiences and traumas that I'd you know that you bring to your job um I spent a lot of time. I think kind of suffering in silence Bouts with Situational depression and things of that nature and so lips and hips really was a A road to healing and And recognizing that failure is a part of the journey It's as much a part of the journey as success is And so I encourage women of color that that self-care piece is really a priority And I was when um, joel jude was talking I I Reminded kind of a tongue-in-cheek piece of advice I got which was if you um, are the smartest person in your crew You need a new crew So like Get some folk around you and um by having young people and um People from different identities and walks of life and mentors and mothers and and channeling for me the ancestors the women's whose Shoulders I stand upon right when I could get clear that I'm just a little itty-bitty part in a really big um Connected web right of powerful women from all walks of life, but particularly women of color who have carried country child Society civil movements right worlds globes on our back that you're never alone And that failure is absolutely okay So I literally do fail like every day like I was five minutes late here, right? I try not to do that And I have learned that that is as much a part of my success as my success Thank you So so it's interesting as you were talking and as I was reflecting on your question I think when it comes to your career, I don't I don't know if I believe in this notion of failure So when I think about Challenging times for myself the way that I would describe them more accurately Is that they have been periods of time where I have been in an organization or in a place in time that just did not Feed me or there was this relationship that just it just didn't work I mean being at work in your career and finding the right place is I have this colleague at work Everything comes down to a relationship with him. So I'm laughing that I'm talking about relationships here But it really is about a relationship It is about how within the context of the organization You know, are you able to be authentic? Are you able to bring your voice? Are you able to to really move on your perspective? And if you can't do these things and if you feel that somehow you have to conform to the organization or to the people Then I think that those are the moments where there's failure and basically what that is Is that you're not really being true to yourself and so I think that If there's any advice I would give around that it's it's that you try to make sure that whatever environment you're in That it is an environment where you that one values you but that also you think you can bring your authentic self And then I don't think you should be afraid of this quote-unquote failure because particularly in philanthropy You know I look for those because it's like we you know I find it really funny those grantees who want to write us a report and just say how everything went well Well, okay, but philanthropy doesn't really necessarily just fund everything going well We're looking for problems and and we're trying to solve those problems And so I think that you know, whenever you have challenges or failures. That's really an opportunity to learn It's an opportunity for deep reflection. It's an opportunity to grow. So I would look at it that way You know, I'm in the audience like I'm not around Mike, this has been amazing. No, but we have one more question before we head into the reception and Cherise Thank you. Hi, I'm Cherise. Welcome. I'm a first year MPP MBA I have a list of gems from all the advice that you just gave so thank you But you women are very accomplished in your fields and I'm sure there are people Like us who are looking up to you as models for our careers and social impact So at the level that you are now How do you focus on your professional development and career advancement and who are you looking up to in this space? I'm like a huge fan of Kamala Harris. I'm like, I've never met her I like follow her on twitter. I like constantly retweet her. I'm like, can I just be her? I don't actually ever want to run previous but that's like But I just like every bill she introduces. I'm like, oh, I want to do that too at the state level So actually there is a bit the very first bill she introduced as a u.s. Senator I'm looking to try to see if I can do a state level version. I'm not sure of it It will work with the Michigan statute But the bill is just by the way is to make sure that if someone's Picked up by a sur CBP that they have to have the right to counsel. So I don't know if I can actually do that but but I totally look up to her because I think that she's just such a great model of someone who is like fierce and progressive and Old and unafraid Unafraid to tackle really challenging issues and she's had a great career You know in california and now at the national level and hopefully there will be future I'm sure we're all really hopeful that maybe In 2020 that you know, she might be Somewhere really high on that ticket. So So she is someone that I definitely look up to I think there was an earlier part of your question, which I forgot because I got so excited about Oh, right Yeah, I am uh, I have a whole lot of so My predecessor, uh, Rashida to leave she was the first muslim american woman in the in the michigan legislature And she's a good friend and it's she's someone that I really look up to so she is someone that I Do go to for advice every now and then and but I also Um, I try to just ask questions and But also I try to go every now and then to there are conferences for legislators about different issues and So like in my work around environmental justice issues I recognize that I came into the legislature with really not a lot of environmental backgrounds But I've learned a lot in a short amount of time But I'm constantly learning and so I try to go to as many of those things as possible and then I also try to Humbly know that I am not the expert and so going to a lot of the other organizations to help educate me When I'm about to work on some legislation. So a lot of partnerships and so There's a couple of environmental groups that I always seek counsel from when I'm developing legislation Because they really are the ones that know everything So in that sense like building a partnership staying in communication asking tons of questions and just being humble and knowing that I hate, you know, there's a lot that I don't know and So my professional development is a lot of times just like asking a lot of questions I think I take Jody's advice is that I I try to You know get with a really smart crew. So I think that when I meet people who I think are incredibly bright and Really have a lot to offer. I try to connect with them and to challenge myself I think that within my own networks, I think just always trying to unpack the work that we're doing And assessing our impact That really helps to feed me professionally And then, you know, whenever we can I mean conferences so much. I don't think I get You know here and there there may be some conferences, but I think it's more for me being out in the field and really learning from The grantees that we fund. I think that that really helps me Professionally more so than anything else Yeah, all of what they said. I mean it just thirst for learning, you know I think the most effective leaders are constantly trying to understand the landscape the space they're in Listening a lot. I which I appreciate y'all listening And I you kind of had to but I agree about the conferences save your money I don't know that the design of a conference is as effective for learning I'm not an expert in this area, but I think like six or eight hours of information coming one way Although there are folks trying to you know work on the design there But I find I learn so much like listening being immersive, you know looking for The real um Folks who have a thumb on the pulse of what they're talking about So I think you'll find once you're out of the academia environment that getting in community is going to just Raise your consciousness and awareness So much And also from time to time Whatever sector you may be in Go and learn about something something else. That's completely different because I think that that's also part of the problem sometimes in terms of our repeating mistakes is that there's all of this knowledge that exists in other sectors that we Sometimes will tend to ignore it. And so I think learning about a different area is incredibly helpful And learning isn't like a one and done. So I think the other way that we honor um Other people other experts, etc. Is you know that we spend some time So when you know, I'm just really sensitive right now about the lgbtq community And I think it's become sort of pc to you know Go lgbtq, but there are so many layers in within the community and so much more that we should really know And the same is true to the Person's point earlier about working in communities of color Including those of us who experience privilege outside of our racial identity I think i've been most humbled by remembering that although i'm You know the child of an immigrant and I grew up in detroit and modest You know upbringing that that's not necessarily My experience today. And so i'm not authorized to speak on behalf of people in those communities still So to touch on the conference thing So it depends on the conference, but but also I think The conferences that I go to they have been the most helpful other ones where it's like an extended network of like So for right now legislators from other states where I can hear so like there's this quad caucus. It's like the asian-american african-american latino and like native american legislators from around the country It's not everyone, but it's actually it's kello funded. Um, and so thank you Um, but like I appreciate those because then I get to hear oh like this legislators doing this awesome thing in some other state I should like talk to them and like see what I can do here and And so I don't have been to a couple where it's the network really not the actual conference, but it's the it's like Um, you know, I've been to one where it was like young elected officials Around like energy and environmental justice so that I like oh, this is a really great idea I'm gonna follow up with that person so sort of like for me at least the learning about what legislators in other states are tackling is a great way to Be able to be like oh I should follow up with that person Well, thank you. Let's give one big round of applause to our panelists Thanks for coming in the rain. Thanks for sharing your experiences. Everybody continue the conversation out there There's brownies and lemonade and all that good stuff Very cool