 I think we should open the house, and if he's not around, he'll join us when he gets here. Perfect, perfect. And I'll explain that he's going to see the show. Rachel, what about this? I'm fine. Is that one there? No, no one's up there. Diane, the only thing we're waiting for is to wrap this. She just picked this. Yeah. Does he know it's there? Yes. He told him. Because I don't know who it is. Abby, go, have you seen Edwin? He's in here, he wants to. Security radio. Ask Edwin, remind Edwin about this strap that needs to be dressed. Okay, do you need it? Do you need it? Do you need to use the security radio? I was just looking for you, Diane. Yeah, they're calling them right now. Hey, Jeff, do you guys want to sit on your hands? I got my seat reserved right there. So you wanted it? I don't know what to do with this. I mean, I can hold this for you. Here, turn me off. No break? No break out there. I'm calling and I'm nothing through. Yeah, me either. You're not going to get it in your chair. It rinks and then it cuts off. Oh, well that's because you're in the home. Let me go over here. Maybe it's outside. Hi. Let me go in the lobby then. Will it work? Hi. How are you? I'm okay. How about Lucy? Is that tape? Yes, you need it? Yeah, go for it. Is it yours? Oh, it's James. I'll grab it from him. Have you talked to Javi? No, not since he's gone, but... You miss him? That's okay. He's really good. He's not even gone what a day now. There's plenty of time for it. Jennifer, do you know the sound here? I've been in here for a while. I didn't see him up. You miss him? No, I don't. You better remember me. Just give you a minute to talk to us. Oh my God. No, I'm working with you guys. Just for a minute. Oh, secret. I love your sound. Aw, amazing. Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. No, no, no. Yeah, did you give me radio? Did you have to remind him? Yeah, yeah, yeah. That's all. Thanks. I just wanted to remind him that we... because we want to open the house and we can't open the house until this is... Okay, um... It's probably downstairs. Can we just, like, flip it up? Spread the word. Don't break Salimas. I know, I didn't see it. So we can start. Yeah, we're gonna start with that. Yeah. Trisha, can you grab that orange strap? Can you rent it without hurting yourself? Yeah. And just kind of drape it over the... over the... that's fabulous. Yeah, we can open the house. We ready? Yeah. I just need one more research. Are you gonna use those for us? Center stage. Are you gonna use those for us? Do you need them? For Lucy and Sal. I'll do it. We got three. We've got three. How's Diane? She just got out herself. You got with me? You got a bar still. Thank you. You're welcome. Thank you. I'll have a drink. I'm gonna put this away. Okay. This is the best. Cheers. Cheers. Cheers. Cheers. Cheers. Cheers. Cheers. Cheers. Cheers. Cheers. Cheers. Cheers. Cheers. Cheers. Cheers. Cheers. Feel free to move that tape, I just don't want anyone to see it. Phone from James. And you know what? Just move this up your way. Look at that. Magic. And you're on the white one. Right there. Hey, we're definitely not in. Lucky Musa. Lucky Musa. Yeah. Oh, my goodness. Oh, that's a candle. Oh, my goodness. Here you go. So, where? Yeah. It's past. As a friend now. Yeah. Yeah. He's not coming. He's got just richer. He's got purple. Oh, yeah. Oh, my goodness. Good job. Thank you. Hey, what's this? Yeah. Oh, yeah. This is magic. This is magic. Yeah. Ah, ah, ah, ah, yeah. This is magic. Oh, you know what? This is magic. This is magic. This is magic. Yeah. We can't, we're so excited to be here and this officially kicks off our... They convene tomorrow morning. They have 19 companies, 15 from around the country for companies to be here for three weeks now. And this is the last weekend beginning tomorrow and then tomorrow another 100 and 8 artists are coming from around the country. So then we can do this five place play every night from Thursday to Saturday night and five matineses every day. So if you haven't seen the place, come there. Phenomenal from Puerto Rico, Chicago, New York, Arizona, from everywhere. Denver. Denver, yeah. Come on, come on, come on. This is the Atriaco Campesino. This conversation with Culture Clutch and El Teatro Campesino. The legacy and the future in moving forward. And how can we not have a dialogue with two great great theater companies who have created great legacy in Latino theater in the United States? It's great honor that we received them here and let me introduce to you the Associate Artistic Director of the Center for Theater Group and the President of the Board of the Theater Communication Group, Diane Rodriguez. This is in Fresno, California doing a show called Live. And he is not going to be able to join us. This is the last minute thing in tech, hard to get away. We're going to miss him. But we have two fabulous members, Rick, Richard Montoya, and Herbie Teflon. So we're going to have a culture clash that will be carrying it back. Question period for you all. I'm going to keep time out at 10, 10, 15. Not under the skin of audiences around the country with a unique brand of comedy. Yay! I think there is a trademark. They know that we're going to go into some areas that might be uncomfortable for the audience to hear. And we'll do it. And we'll do it either through satire, you know, comedy or drama. I never read Kafka! I never read Tolstoy! I don't even know! The entertained, going to see comedy, but also in our shows we're going to ask what we think are important questions about who and what we are as Angelenos and a multicultural Los Angeles, but also as observers of the world. Culture clash recently celebrated the 25th year of a trailblazing career that began in San Francisco's Mission District. Woo! Six of us came together with Angelenos in Ohio and created this comedy, you know, group. And it went over so well that, you know, we started getting gays on a monthly basis. And then it just turned into, one night turned into a career. And then the three of us, I think, together since 1988, we went through so many changes. I think we reinvented ourselves. We went from doing stand-up comedy, to sketching comedy, to writing plays. Did that have more meaning than just a slapstick or just a comedy stick? I saw them perform. And I don't remember that at the time. I was doing goofy jokes, like bullet kind of jokes. You know, I'm like, mom and my dad and that kind of stuff. These guys all of a sudden came together and I watched them and I'm like, wait a minute, they're making people laugh at political stuff and you could do that? You could talk about presidents as long as it's funny? Aw man, it's a whole new game for me. I mean, that play was so powerful, it cost a lot of production. And I might tell that president, every elected official needs to see this play. Don't chat about stupid things, range from historical adaptations to sad tires on local politics. But they also explored links between different Latino cultures, making people take a closer look. Thank you. We put a laugh for ourselves as a tricky situation because you will have to go there because comedy is safe and it really doesn't do much. It's the culture clash of being Latino, you know, to mainstream America, that there's also the culture clash within our Latino races, you know. We bring those out. We can be Latinos without having to be, oh, you're from Mexico, oh, you're from Venezuela. They've taken the vernacular of, like, the Mexican and the Puerto Rican, put it together and made something funny out of it. But it made us all look at ourselves in a funny way and go, you know what, yeah, we do do that. And all right, that's funny. And maybe not all of us, but enough of us. That works. In 1993, culture class made television history when they were signed to star in the first Latino-based sketch comedy show on a major network. Still, they are most proud of their groundbreaking work on stage at some of the country's most prominent theaters and performing art centers. When we travel the country, we go to these prestigious theaters. We see three Latino men who write their material, produce it, you know, and have a point of view that they don't really don't see. And what we've found in American theater is that an audience is really willing to listen to big opera, you know. An audience doesn't look like us. They use the tools of a comedy to say something very serious and valuable for the Latino community and for everybody in this incredible city which has such diversity. You know, after doing Chinese ravine and water and power, now Palestine and New Mexico, it's great to see how the audience changes. We get a lot of Latino, younger folks, people of color come to see plays, you know, that we do here at the Mark Tate Perform for the first time for many of them. We decided as artists that there's an inherent responsibility that comes along with being an artist for us. We want to entertain them like that. Yes, we want to make you laugh. Yes. But we also want to take a moment to think about some of these vital and important issues that affect every American as long as you're talking about it and thinking about it. I think we've done a great job. This particular stage is very, very important to our career. This is, you know, when we talk about a legacy and groups have to have a certain show, a certain moment in their history that, you know, projects into the next one. Right. This particular stage brings back great memories, you know, with us at least we did all the games. Right. It was a real, real life changer for us, a game changer for us, you know, it put us on the national map and I think it raised the bar for, you know, theater after that and I really do, you know. Yeah. And so we're really proud of that work. Um, the mics are for all of us. Let's take down that. We'll get into that. I think what Herbert's saying about, you know, being here at that moment, you know, and, you know, August 29th was just down the hall, you know. Right. And it'll wish now. But also there was a guy running around at that time called Risa Abdo. And I just thought that, you know, one of the companies that can connect young people today, young people that you went through with a cat and a Iranian cat like Risa, you know, because Risa's work actually impacted. So after Bolovin, Marsha got way more out there and the way that he was working, there's a bit of that in August 29th, the way August 29th worked. And that's a slightly different period than when Badges was here, at least was saying I remember at Tech, they remember this theater and we all have those memories and those goats, you know, at the Cedar, I remember the mission started in the small theater and there was that wonderful boom where you were kind of going down and we were doing the mission and the man, Gronk was doing sets on seven weeks and people were like, we're not, we might not be ready for these guys in San Francisco, right? But I remember one day we had to take the floor so we had to get everything out of there. So I was so happy, you know, I got drunk that night. And so he made that studio, all your heroes are moving your furniture so that Herbert could make the floor or Gronk could make the floor. And in that window, you just want that window at last forever because it was all about the companies. It was all about the work, you know, it wasn't about the distractions, it was about, we got to get to see that the players passed out guys like a dad, you know. What's been happening in the last month with the companies together and being, you know, influencing each other in some way and having a discussion about it's really great. It is. So guys, what, you know, just when you think about the 30 years, you know, and I know both of you have very different opinions, but when was it all working the best? When did it all come together for you? Well, I'll jump in because, you know, it was almost, again, another window where we didn't know we were. Yeah. Like we'd arrive at the non-special, you know, in the morning, you know, and that house in the house and, you know, my school is going to be there. It's with the Athro-Wheeler. He's in the East and we have everybody who's here to definitely come to see us. You were the young lions at that time. It was a little bit of that moment that echoes to now, you know, where you have to go over and all those things, right? But where there was auto-critica the next day. You have to sit down. We fell in this from the East Coast. People were, people that were proponous and people that were proponous, and it wasn't a pretty mix. And somewhere in the middle was us and we just didn't know better, so we just thought we just had to storm, you know, the stage. And I remember at the opera week, after I said, you guys have the right play or you won't be taking it seriously in this world. We had it very seriously. We put that very much part. What's interesting about watching the channel 7, we didn't use the word Chicano word and I said we were playing a little bit to an audience, but just working on Chavez and Riemes and it's, it's, it's, that the nostril movement was a very kind of Chicano movement. It made room also for group support where you go maybe more, maybe more. But we just didn't know better and you just did this phenomenally, like, could even have been atrocious performance, but it was, it was produced at a level or it had a part of the sketch of Diapro and it was a hybrid, as you just didn't know, we were grasping for what Diapro had left. It was already, people were pushing into the very late 80s or the 90s, so we were grabbing from all these themes that partly advised words, partly making it up on the spot. And it's interesting that in terms of the leader of the culture class, you know at that time there was absolutely no lead singer, no leader, no guy, you know, we just were like, like the Bursiado was still with us. Talk about how they got jealous, you know, that guy, you know, though we were in Chicago, we were in Connecticut, we were, for the first time, there was little babies out there and just saying kind of, you know, fuck it in a way, we got to go for it and bring our Chicanada and bring the Salvadoran thing and, and it was, it was a rough, it was a rough race. Right. What, what, why did you freeze it? Because was it bad? No, no, just, yeah, just curious because you're saying that you were sort of the young, the young group that came out and, and is that why it felt like a high point or... Just for you, you know, you could run in the process of sale. Right, right. And you know, you might do a little ball and you might, you should probably and you would be like, you know, they're not cheap people but you guys conners, you gotta get them. And yeah, and some of those guys, those men that brought us into Chicago are no longer with us. In Valera. Yeah. Ah, Valera. Rodrigo Reyes, I mean, he's with the bold and brave that brought this company into that world, you know, a little bit after the fact in terms of his late 80s, early 90s already and we just didn't know better. So we kind of armed with mascara and doing weird, buying a stylus and somehow we survived out with the people who guys helped with the academic guys and the feministas, but we learned about it, we never made those mistakes again. We learned them once, you get them once and then you start creating work. So that was that, a carelessness that was sort of... A carelessness that you reported like once in a while. That's right. You're not going to do that. Okay. We're not, we're not, we're not just the people. Now, now things got to be a little more thoughtful and, yeah. That's... I think one of our goals in the very beginning was to conquer LA, you know, we're from California and to us this was like the epicenter, right? So when we conquered the Coole-Bean with the very successful rug gear, it was like an alibi, you know. And we even got it, you know, we got the films for a back performance and a certain investment. And we could have, you know, written another two or three Coole-Beans But what ended up happening was, is that we moved away from that, not from the Chicano perspective, but we started now writing about, not ourselves, but we started writing about other races and other Americans. And that's when we started to do our site-specific work. And I think that really changed us again, you know, that reinvented us again. I think when you talk about monetivities, I was thinking about, you know, what's your next move? Because you can't write the same stuff and the same topics and the same style every all the time. And I think we had reached a, we had reached a, I don't know, climax, I guess, with all the beans. And then it was time for something new. And again, we didn't know, we did not have a plan. We just fell into this condition to write a play about Miami. And it turned out that the great Amon would be concerned about Miami. And so we thought we'd write the first version of that. And that really opened us up for another 10, 15 years, you know. And we started to write about America, other different races through a Chicano perspective. So that really opened us up as writers, as Americans, as actors. We just opened up a whole new canvas race, so I'm really grateful for that. We didn't have a plan because we didn't have a board. But it's every 10 years, you know. So the first 10 years coming out of the mission is the Pernay-Yanis, you know. And God, I hear about that. So Margo Gomes, he was a weird moment in part performance, part stand-up, part stage. I had already been to Pernay-Yanis as an intern. So I had done Korygos at Marie's Memorial with Luis. And as a young man, Gades, it was stupid because I remember that the hardcore theatres, but the theatres that were left in the mission, they didn't really take to Korygos that well. But it was a polished, beautiful, highly-studied vision of Luis. And I was just kidding. The drama itself, you did costumatic in the first version. I mean, I'm thinking of people, but... But every 10 years, you see the cycle, and then the site-specific work. And then somewhere 20 years later, you know, Gomes Pernay-Yanis says the cul-de-sac of naval gazing of identity politics. You know, the questions... The core question was, am I Chicano? Am I Latino? Am I Hispanic? The core question was, like, what the fuck am I coming into the world? Am I destroying the world? So we were on to a bigger question. But really in a kind of strong technical piece, you know, the semi-colonial diet got on people. We were just a phone call from our elders, you know, all the way. And then the site-specific event, and then 25 years after that, a kind of a conference to go back with our world view to the Chicano, like Chavez-Cabean, Waterpower, Zoro, Palestine, and Mexico. I think these are drenched in... I'm just really glad we're revisiting Chavez-Cabean, because in my opinion, that was our best play as a collective, you know? We're all... You know, all the tricks and the trade. Every human we've learned up to then is in that play, you know? And I'm so glad we're revisiting. And I've had to revisit the tape, you know, that Zutu is the granddad of all, you know, bar nine, no questions. Chavez is blacking out as a tiny little primus, you know? Well, because the Chicano legacy is kind of important, you know? And then the film world, Zutu's film is still a minimum thing. And then maybe something like Waterpower. I mean, we're still consciously aware, and we're defensive about that idea of, you know, how Chicano war is, and what you get in that movie. Do you think that, you know, you did Waterpower almost 10 years ago? I mean, not Waterpower. Chavez revealed it almost 10 years ago. Yeah. And when you talk about a period of real growth and real inspiration, do you feel that the time, the social times, have had something to do with the response of your viewers? Well, we did a reading today, you know? And there's some sketch moments, and, you know, there's a lot of Vince Scully and Fernando, and then it got to the moment at the very end of the piece, where can we disappear in a long-time collaborator and working there at the taper, you know? And, you know, the Zutu's poster's on the hall. Yeah. My dad did the person's poster. You know? I mean, the history, you know, you can see Evelina in that picture. You can see Roberto Delgado, you can see Daniela Perez, Eddie, you know, these are the halls that you want to be in. So, we get to the end of the damn play, and it's almost impossible to get through it. And it's impossible to get through it because of the hatred surrounding those immigrant buses, full of children, and it's hard to get through it because of all the things that are happening and focused on the people. And because Chavez-Ribin endeavors to tell the story of the early activists, right? Right where Zutu left us. Fred Ross, Salalinsky, Young Chikana, and Devlin to organize and galvanize unions in Los Angeles. Labor in Los Angeles. You know, we don't operate in the vacuum. We're kind of connected to all these things. And just getting to the final moment in the piece this afternoon was terribly difficult because of the 10 years. Because of the meta-performance of, you know, three guys trying to get together. It hasn't been for the labor program. We'll get to the worst day soon, but there are those moments where you're fragmented, it's functional, you know, it's not perfect. It's like on media, but we realized a few years ago that we had stayed together somehow longer than our parents had ever stayed together. And then we had all come from broken families. So we're trying to keep this brotherhood imperfect, as it is, you know, trying to keep it together somehow. And so that 10 years, I just felt everything forcing and we had the final moments of the piece today. And, you know, I just needed, I need people to pull us through. Right. I just could not get through it because lives have been lost, life had gone. People that were picking are no longer with us. And then at Culture Plash, I think the meta-thing that I'm proud of that makes me feel good and a good day is that we're getting out of the way for a Chicano protagonist. And we're saying your fields are going to, you know, we're all the way. There's the road and you're going to add your own thing to the road. So just casting in the last week for Chavez has been a night over. And the beautiful, strong Chicanas and Latinas that have come through. And I said to a second, Alina, their daughter, Espananza, her talent is bigger than any distractions that we might ever have. Any fellow we might have. And she grew this way. She's in pole position for it. Soon she'll come back. Whatever taper knows who she is and rightfully so. Not always perfect and good deals, but we were there. You're ready for this. You're going to do it. You're going to keep up the break. And think about all the Chicanas that have ever auditioned at the Taper. That's big time there. We deserve to be there. We should be there. We should be here as well. You brought up a whole concept of family. You know, when you talk about these two examples, you are a man. Literally, that's what we're going to see when we do the family business and beyond the family business. Family business. You know what? We're not going to go with brother. And what happens in families is it's a vortex of emotions, right? Good and bad. Love and intense love and intense hate. You know, I think that, you know, those are the things we'll talk about later. But, you know, it's like having a man. Talk about him now, Carnival. There's no later, Carnival. You know, I mean, you've got there's a lot of different situations in the group, but earlier in the area. So what has been the most challenging to date for you? And I'm sure there's more than one. Yeah, because that's recently just a story. Right. So there was that moment, you know, in our brother, Sean Sanchez, here through some of the C-Score a couple of something, brother. Just a collaborator. And that's another story about how we're reaching out in the companies and that sort of work. But there was a moment in 1989, I believe, where we were having a culture class meeting in the Mission District. And at that time, the mission wasn't the Facebook Google, Amazon, buses, driving out. It's brutal. It is brutal. It is absolutely brutal. You know, there are many young people in the Netherlands who are the last of the mission and they're out. They're out. They're done. And so all the murals, everything, the Latinos and Chicago's did to make the mission can no longer afford to live there. They can barely afford to live in the region. Even if it's not. But back then in the mission, you had the idea of theaters, you had galleries, you had all these things going on. We've got an idea and we're having a meeting and there was a production in San Juan at the time. So, Jorge Caban, Danny Harrow, we were meeting and Rick always had a front apartment Mission on Harrison at the point. Woo! You sat in the park, you did the run, and some quarter, I think, was in the area. It was a milieu. It was not Sacramento. Right. But it wasn't L.A. either. It was the mission. Yeah. Very different, man. It had salsa, it had afro-caridine, it had chileno, tahueras, gráticos, Malacías, Montoya, Rene Castro, and a great place to be in the early 20s. Subsequently, we were highly criticized because being the payasos of the movement, they weren't quite ready for us. The chilenos of Bertie were not ready for us. They were quite much in the bar at that time. They were like, let me give you a seventh year or so in culture class, and Phyllis Marza, putting this on the record. When you go to Chicago, sign a disclaimer, I don't want to, if you guys are pregnant, you don't want to wear it. Getting the license, Phyllis Marza, you know, I think in Nepal, they made them second-hand culture class to check. My brother's a banker in Chicago. We cashed to check. We're like, where's the check? We cashed it. But anyway, we're in the machines here, in Mordecai's area. Mission District, it could be dangerous at the time. There were housing projects everywhere. We're talking, Dalabena, and doctors, something's happening outside. We just went to the window, and sure enough, a pretty rough house in front of there. Two guys were, it looked like they were, they were killing a kid. They were about to finish. They were like, hey, hey, hey, stop it. And this young African-American kid, you know, trapped in Mordecai, and we had no idea, he had a saw-off shot, but he just turned to the student. Suddenly, this was in the door, so suddenly, this gets hit, short-range in the chest, Jorge gets badly hit. The lifeblood of our groups was seeping out of us, at that moment, and that's not an overly dramatic thing to say. Rick's some of them. Jorge is in the kitchen, and the kids get away, but the cops show up, and the cops just soon we shot each other, you know? And Rick goes up to SF General, Jorge goes up to SF General, and it's just one of those moments that I think every group, every capital has faced. I remember the kid from Los Pedros, if it was a peddler, that I saw in their finger, and traveled over the great vine. You know, we've lost people. And then she's certainly we're losing Rick's scene, standing there, you know? And then two years later, here we are on this stage. Right. So that's how it went. Yeah, so we didn't lose him. But it was the prayers of a lot of people. There were a lot of, a lot of people, I mean, just, you know, and it had implications, too. I mean, from the penitentiaries to the streets, people would piss, you'd just almost kill them. You know, these two guys, they would fall out. And that's just the way the mission worked at that time. Sometimes you had to know, you know, not everyone got the non-violent member from SF General. You know? Sometimes things had to be weeded out, and we weren't in that world. We were artists, but we were too busy trying to bring Rick back and Phil and Diablo is back on the road. And we got Francisco Fernandez at Diablo kid, Kenan's buddy. He calls for my kid and we called him for Rick. And we went and did ASU, and we, you know, we kept it. We kept it. But that wasn't my worst poem. I'm gonna go ahead. And this is the subject matter that comes up a lot among insiders and groups, is that, you know, I don't call it the evil shadow of a leader. It's right here in LA, you know? And I think that was really, really hard on us. You know, we came, we got all the success and all that. And then we started dealing with tools. You know, the agents that, you know, they, you know, like, we go, hey, I, I have a suit on me. You know, so there was like a, for a couple of years there, it was like, really, didn't we? You know, we would survive because we were getting, you know, we were getting seduced by cults like Hollywood, you know? And then when all said and done, we just spent a few years in a production deal that never went anywhere for a sitcom, a stupid sitcom that would have probably ruined our careers and wouldn't be here to be for the rest of that synthetic sitcom. So, um, so I can thank, I can thank, I can thank, I can thank you for your success with Hollywood. But then our dignity, our dignity, you know, kept us going and we started, we kept, we kept seduction and money and fame, blah, blah, blah, blah, blah, blah. It's all an illusion, but you know. And yet you have your show, here at Vogue, the Vogue show that you have that was, that was locally produced, right? Right. We were really proud of that because big difference, we were the executive producer. That's the big difference. If you don't have that, I don't, don't do it. You know what I mean? But then you don't have it. But it's interesting because for a lot of people, they see you and, you know, they're like, hey, you got used to the ITV and they haven't seen 20 years of theater, you know, and the TV wasn't, wasn't a huge ambition when you're in it. You're kind of going for it, but it wasn't, you know, people are like, what happened? You know, what are the guys doing? Are you going to see your citizens at home? What's going on? You know, I was sitting in the Sheriff's Office two weeks ago. It was shot on the day. I didn't want to know a Sheriff of Iowa. I'm at the, I'm at the, you know what I mean? The TV thing happened. It was 30 shows. I think the part is that, and we were doing, I think Rupert Murdoch came to one of the tapings was like, I got to kill this thing because we had people like, like zapping people with x-rays, out of his eyes, zapping them back to the corner. Again, it was, we were somewhat fearless and didn't know better. And we were like, well, we spent every dime on the TV show, which was much different than the sitcom that Herbert's referring to. And we did with Cheech Marin, which was kind of a heartbreak for Cheech to be the big, you know, Hispanic fuck shit, it's a shit come on my side. But I, someone did, my nephew in Chicago gave me the DHS of it recently, and I watched it and was like, I can't even recognize ourselves, you know? And that's, that's that mom-booking moment like where I, I can't really quite recognize that wavering picture. That's, that's not us, it's a version of us. But it's not as quickly, quickly, you can slap yourself like that, he's sad of creating a, the next body of work. So going back to the theater's always kind of helpless. Got it. And so what's your, what, you had another moment, another. I mean, you know, it's, it's interesting to have you know, we're, hopefully that you've gotten better as communicators and we now think of many, many worlds, you know? And that when we get into these, these on-does and these things where your idea or what you're trying to say and, and the way that you might even be saying and, and question and then I feel that the worst moment is sometimes when we feel we're so far outside of, of groups and acquaintances and, and as, as, as one of the innovators of devised, collected, site-specific work for our, our, you just want to feel that you have something to share and you have something to say. And we understand that the tragedy of selection committees and, and this and that, you know, but, but our, our thing with, with this input was like, we'll do characters in the basement. That's what we pitched. We'll do all our characters in the, because there, anyway, but, however it goes and we didn't fill out the right paperwork and all of that, that's fine. But when you're standing outside of it and you're looking at the scene and you know you can go support it and then come, we've come and sent people. I did a whole rate of things. I cannot and point, throw, and you gotta, there's so many young people who don't even know what culture class is and that's great and that's fine. But you want to, you want to feel the sting that across the board, academic, academia, theatres, nonprofits, that, it's, what we're writing about and who we're writing for. But it's not just an idea that we're hating on each other's work, that we're eradicating each other's work. And there are times I felt a methodical march that from the history, from your body and work, like that you still have to keep fighting for that. And some people say, hey, you don't have to fight. No, you do. You do because the respect that we get in New York, Samuel French, your communications group, all of our work being published, and then what we're doing, we just, when you're home, you just, all it is is each of us want to play that we're part of that extended family. For whatever reason, some really good, some legit reach out, we reach out. And something's just, you know, that we're master communicators and then you're still on the outside looking in. That's kind of surprising, but being from the north end that we are, from Sacramento and places like San Francisco, we kind of, we've enjoyed and we've taken advantage of that outsider status a little bit. And yet some people say, well, you're not an outsider. You're under eight production of the Martina Farm. And that's true. And that's one of the paradoxes of our lives as well. And I think that that's a really good, I think no matter where you are in your career, there are moments when you don't feel like you're on the outside and you're always trying to break in. And I think that that is a lot of this artist feel that throughout. So I, I appreciate that, I understand. I'm just trying to be honest today. I appreciate you having us in this moment, adding with or to share and to talk. I've seen many of these people on stage in the last couple of weeks and there's some tremendous work and you know, you're theos. And we're not ready for the old people, some of them. I don't know what we're doing, but it's pretty amazing that we're not just thinking that child is a being, we're doing a revival of ghostly haunted revival of LA taking into consideration the context of the 10 years in the past. And where we are just 10 years ago, we're headed to a pretty good place of suburban middle class Hispanics. And then, and then there is so much. And then we're, we're not that far away actually. Well, I just want to talk about, I think on the other hand, I'm going to decide the point is this, we've had this fierce independence as a group. Fears are in a ton of, totally a ton of, totally fearless and independent. And we've never been associated with anybody, a group, you know, Greek guys or anything like that. We're terrible at it, you know, going into meetings and following up, you know, feeling of, we're revenue. Yeah. We're not going to be administrators that way. You know, we'd like to, we're artists first and I think that's why we never have a board. I don't have any interest in talking to my board member about that. You know, it sounds a little neatest, it sounds a little neatest but it's not, you know. Right. The guy that, you know, he, you know, he makes pizzas in the day, you know. He's got a lot of money but he doesn't know what we're talking about. And so, board members, all that and organizations, you just really have not been into that. And I think that independence, that freedom, that lack of anchor has, in a sense, been in my mind, with us as always. There's a flip side, yeah. I want to talk to a customer. I know. That's it. What's in the future, what's in the future? Well, you know what, taking a water and power from the stage to the film world as a fiercely independent Chicago film, filmed in 12 nights in Los Angeles or in Bryce, it was an eye-opener for me and I can see what the lure is and the importance for our storytelling to be broadened and taken to the screen and the lease and even the Latino theater companies has made a few films, working very closely with people like Daniel and all this stuff. And just seeing what, something born at the stage and how it can play in Denver and how it can play in Chicago and have that moment where you're walking into the Chinese theater and it's your film. I remember going to two premieres, world premieres. I went to Suitsen at the, what's the arc like now, but sit around with them. And that, you know, I was telling Daniel, I was like, man, you had to fall and really turn up that night. But I understand why they do that. The flash bulbs, that brand, were like ear piercing, right? But it was powerful, something you'd never forget in your life. And then I went to La Bamba at the Chinese theater. And then your moment comes and your film's opening, you know, at the cinema or something and there you are at Universal or Chinese Man and it's one on power. It's something that I wrote for these guys and then it made its way to the search page. It still struggles as a small, independent feature film, but I think that's part of the future too, is not necessarily what plays in the tape to film, but what is our next film subject. And I'm really proud that with my producer, Mark Roberts, because people have said to me, don't do another one of those movies, which means don't do another. She got a film, which struggled to get in the film business by the way, which are unapologetically, you know, they're male and they're dark. Although I maintain the water and power tells the story greatly of how men have an absence of a strong man and then the man is actually in that film in many ways and the children and symbolically she's there, but I think what our next film and that future would be like the world of Chicano painters, you know, L.A., my dad's world from Sacra to Borosha de Badao, Erding Palomino with Carlos San Maraz, that world. We don't tell that world on film, it's like an explosive with color. Why I'm not us was trying to run over my dad's hand at Avocado Lake in Fresno. I wanna know, our place chased the ghost of Pinedo and my dad in Murciada on the street corner below in East Side after Tsutsu was at Schubert. We chased those ghosts for five years. I wanna chase these other ghosts and find out what the hell was going on. So the future is for me, is for dad continuing our work with culture flesh. I think we did a pact if you would tell a few more stories. I don't want to be mad if we hung up the clown noses after 30 years, but I think we've got a few left in us because people wanna work with us and they're interested in the Pone Quiva. But like Herbert, I wanna work with other companies like Sean's company, Camposanco, and we have yet to crack the big Broadway. And I check myself that I wanted to move for all the right reasons, but there's a few stories that I didn't know, are the words of Broadway. No, we took a, recently we took a force two-year sabbatical that my dad and Sandy have read, but I think it was helpful to move on. Maybe we'll develop as writers, as performers, outside the group, and then we'll come back with a whole fresh new take on Chavez-Rivino and the future. So yeah, but we can't just like, people say, well, we want the next culture flesh play. It's not that easy anymore. We've grown, it's harder to write as a collective now. And we just gotta be honest about that. Is that because you... We've grown up with the individuals now that wanna say something. On your own? On your own. I think what we said in Boston at that point though, that what a great joke that these three sketch guys turned into playwrights, because he had seen the river with Laquine and Camposanco that Sean had directed. And I'm excited that the future also leads Tini and I working this thing that we're gonna create this piece of project that we've submitted about Laquine-Tino relations in L.A. post-June or two to whatever that window is, Diane. And as comrades, we've said you're directing it because you've said we're writing the editor here. And we have to green light each other, guys. There's no other, you've gotta direct it now. We're gonna get in the room and we're gonna do this. Richard, this is a moment and we're, oh my goodness. What are we watching? Yeah, we're up there. Thank you. So, anyone have a question? Yes. The, what are, what were filming you say? What is that coming up? We didn't. We did a release in L.A., we did a independent release through AMC, but we are still hitting the bit of the festival circuit and we were still in Denver the other day. And it was a Sundance lab project, so, but oddly, never in Sundance film festival and on for an interesting reason, but it's a beautiful film that I'm very proud of it. Sundance is helping us do a Amazon iTunes release in January, so that it just, it just goes really, goes right to your phone, goes to wherever you wanna see it. And I, water and power making the film for 12 nights in L.A., and I realized what I was doing and we shot at night, so I wasn't sleeping in the day, I was just excited with what we were doing with the trunks and the guys who were there and a great cast including Jacob and Emilio and Roger and Bertrand and one of them is last films. And what we were doing in all of our madness out in the middle of the night in East L.A. and South L.A. is that we were chasing, again, what I thought was the Columbia ghost that haunted the continent, still in the jails and the streets and the prisons, that to me was the big one, the heavy lifting that we were, that I as a storyteller is not doing. So if you look for it in January, thank you. Are we doing? Yeah, yeah. How did you get lost in green light suicidal tendencies on the show? You know, I think they just let that one guy, suicidal tendencies was a punk band that we really loved in the center, you know, of the port of Cyprus. And so there was just a group of names and lists that would come and do a word of the day out of the cultural question you showed. We did one, Jimmy Smith's, a Dolores. What's interesting about when Dolores came to do a word of the day, that we didn't realize that all the cameramen and people in the group were complaining about the great lady, you know. So we were battling on almost every level. So they didn't go as far as they could. I'm just gonna do the third one. Yes. Remember, you made an interesting comment that you're no longer the old culture, the culture class, it's how it's timed. Two of you, I think you're part of the record. You have three playwrights that are trying to collaborate. Yes. I really do hope, I think you do have the talent to put something on Broadway and then we look forward to seeing that. And I really hope that you do. But it is a build. Talking about that, how three people try to write on the play? It's impossible. It's impossible. It's impossible. It's impossible. It's impossible. Now, but you know, we've done it. We've done it. It's not easy. It's not, you know, it's hard. It's really hard work. It's hard to do it by yourself. Yeah. And you have a few other guys on there. It's crazy. It's crazy. You know, that's what we wanted. That's why we wanted to do it, you know. So it's just hard. You know, I don't know how the next project's going to be. Whether Richard's going to be the lead writer, you know what I'm saying? We have to negotiate that, because I don't know. You know, it's funny, because I was, we used to joke, you know, that we don't really write a play without, you know, a yelling in the room or an action or for all the protests that you do at a game. There's always a yelling in the room or a yelling or whatever the case. And that's not, shit, we have Gilroy Garland Festival tomorrow. I don't know. I don't know what I'm saying. Just working with Lisa in the last week, I mean, we really, we really do check in, you know. Because, and she's not a referee and a moderator, but she's that voice, you know. It's a moonhead. She's there. And trying this, you try that and move that around. And I, at that, when you're writing it to take her level, you're not writing it back and you have to deal with a lot of people and you have to answer to a lot of people. You have to do that here at LNTC. You have to do that anywhere that you're at, you know. Days might be gone, you know, you can write a little something, write it forward, you write a little something where it doesn't take too long. But I think for a culture clash, having, having those people around us drawn into their genre and joining me, this is helpful to us, because we're not just in a room batting, you know. My dad used to call it a butcher shop, you know. We're not in a butcher shop hurting each other. Because I do this trick, because I asked August Wilson, I asked other writers, I asked Louise, I said, when do you write, when do you write this? It's, you know, because it's the opposite of ADD. It's permanent homework for any playwright and if you're ready to do homework for your entire life. And I think the nerdy that we love, that nerdy, like, I will go to the writer's guild in the Fairfax and I have to leave the stuff laying out, but I'll check all the way in my set of catalogs because I need that quiet place to go and have my dignity and a cup of coffee. It's the old union on, it's the old red union hall idea because you can go to the writer's guild. And if you're not a union member, you can go to the library next door and you can just shut everything out and you can really try to be a writer for a few hours a day. Because I know, I know in my heart when I've had an honest few hours of writing and when I have it, you know when I'm just emailing. Sorry. I'm sorry. With all the talk about the high-brow and fabulous things that you've done, how do you feel about being cameoed in the Canderville Comic's show? Are you even aware of it? Oh yeah, I don't wear a wearer, but I don't understand it, though. I mean, I know we're in it. He talks about our group, right? Wait, you show up all the time when he's reading the newspaper. There are times when his buddy's saying incredibly and he's reading the newspaper and says thank God it's for culture class. Yeah, I don't know. First would you sing a little Sandy through you? Yeah, it's great. I mean I'm glad you're a fan. Anyone else? Back down there. Yes. We asked a lot of people here, open it up. There was spending millions of dollars just for one week 20 years ago. The crowds are there but we haven't heard from them. I don't know. I live in New York and I don't know how expensive this is going to be, sure. But we have all these empty theaters on the wall. I wish these, but the force belt holds enough in the 20s so they can't even replace them. Put your much back in the lead. You see what we want. Good point. Good point. Good point. I don't care. I don't care. Yes. You guys have used this to say that you try a different way. You did stand up, stand to comedy, a TV show, a theater. What do you think is the biggest change of what we're doing? That's a good question. Great question. In our case, in our case we're the writers. We're writers and we've been fortunate to get commissions, writing commissions to write the play, workshop the play and eventually do the play. It is actors and they grow up without the play. It's a long process and that sustains you for six months, over a year or two. So if you're able to have a couple of those going on then you really cook it. I'm going to say that happens all the time but if you're able to do that, it's great. That's why I've always been a big proponent of writing your own work. Because I could not survive if I was not a writer. I could not survive as an actor. No way. No way. I need that work. I need that commission. Otherwise I would not be a writer. And you guys toured your own work as well. Sometimes when you were working at a theater you were producing your own work. There were many, many years of self-advocacy as well. You said in your opening remarks that you were lovely but you know we've never had a home. And it's been really interesting. And there have been efforts in recent years to get a space for you to order work with that incredible responsibility. Then you do need a board. There's nothing wrong with a board. I partied with LATC board all the time. I heard from them recent. They're a great mechanism. A great tool. To keep us a little bit in check too. Because that doesn't happen in my corporate world. So I had seen value in that. But we've been able to navigate to the sister's question. We've been able to navigate the idea of commission words, individual words. We'll be at Emerson for residency. That was following me when I was with David and Paulie and Jamie in this whole group. We'll be there for it. So we still got to pick up the steam truck and head out onto the road and do that part. And then like a lot of people pitching those television shows that you can stomach and do. What's your next film going to be about and then the new works. I'm excited about our work. We're going to go to Los Angeles. It was a math grant. So you're navigating all these works and managing them. Culture class could use an assistant. We're just stubborn guys that are doing it at a certain point. But we've been able to sustain some of them. And don't wait for the commission. I've written three plays on set and they've all been produced. So even if that's something that needs more freedom. It's mine. I'm going to take one more question. She's got a good one. I love that you talk about like, you know, as culture class. Like taking advantage of that carelessness and fearlessness. Which is like totally like mind-boggling for me. Because it's like, oh, that's really hard. Like how do you just put the blinders on and just focus on what you want to do. How do you harness that carelessness as an artist? I know that's super vague and weird, but I'm dying to know. Well, it's funny because you know that carelessness, that's a youthful thing. You lose a little bit of freedom. Because you don't want to be that angry old man. Angry young man is barely tolerable. But what you want to be always gives a fierce storytelling. I'm just fucking and go for it, you know, fearlessness. They talk a lot about that as a sub-dance institute when you go. I mean, I think records committed to that. I think the institute part, the past of the month, the institute, is committed to fierceness as a storyteller. I mean, I'm proud to sit in the grandmothers' home that lost a 15-year-old kid last year who found us. I'm doing my work. I'm there with shots I was able to do my work. What happened? My son was shot 20 times by a US police officer. You know, and we have to tell that story fearlessly. But I think what we've learned throughout the years is to almost tell it clinically now. Don't spin it too much. Sure, our pilot has a big sign on his neck. Racist, co-brother, tea party. But, you know, we sat with him for an hour and a half. He's a fascinating dude, man. He was in Korea. My dad was in Korea, okay? He had Googled me. His grandchildren love Nacho Lieber after three years of theater. I mean, for Nacho Lieber. He's an Italian Catholic. He knew my mom was heavily Catholic, you know? And it was like, hey, come on. Hey. You know, and so I think to tell his story straight, no chaser, be doing our audience's service and giving our audience credit, they can discern who the devil is. You know, should we place angel wings on the grandmother, you know, when the, the dead boy and put, and put horns on her pile or do you put horns on the cartel? And do you put angel wings on the blond feminist border activist that's leaving water for people that are going to die in the Sonoran Desert on the American side? And then there's, there's scientists at Notre Dame that are, have gotten permission from the Pima County Orner to study how people die in the Sonoran Desert. Unthinkable. We can't look at it, but what I'm glad the scientists are because my work now needs to be backed up with data, Diane. I can't just go out there and start talking about that. I have to know who we're talking about. What is that hate, that hate surrounding all those immigrant children? How many detention centers in Texas? How many in Arizona? You know, and when you travel those areas you see those detention centers. This is great, we're having a party, we're cool, we're good, we're articulate, we're having a discernible accent, but there's children locked up in a detention center right now all throughout the Southwest and this is post-racial and voluntary. We have a question from Twitter from Courtney Flores. She asks... Is... Which way are you? Is culture clash going more into film or is it going to be an extension of their theater work? If you can get the work and film, you know, it's interesting, but I differentiate, I think independent filmmaking is really cool if you could raise that money and make those films and what young people are doing in their films and cameras, you can get a million hits now on something that holds together and that can be quite beautiful. We're old enough to come from a world where everything's kind of got to be set up. What's that? Kickstarter is good for a certain... Filmmaker of a certain age when you're our age, you want to have the ducks lined up and go out. You know, a non-marass film that encompasses the world Chicago Air Force and all the artists. That's not a cheap film, that's a period film. That cannot be made or anything less than whatever it's required to do. You know, and I know that others are trying, but you know, if we don't tell that Marco Roth co-type story, that story about our own artists, then we will have failed storytellers as well. Do you want to respond? Do you want to respond to accusations or anything? It's like the Senate's democracy. I like talking about learning. That's for me. Yeah, uh... Can I be first, Roger? Yes. So, one of my friends is D. Gilgara. Oh, yeah. How about Roger, we're in that project. It was wonderful and I just wanted to find out if you're still doing work in Texas and just in other regional theaters. Yes, yes, yes I am. After that, I was like all the weekend with Pablo Picasso. Three years ago. And I'm currently touring with it before Travis Rubino will be in San Jose stage with that. Can we just say a few folks? Make it quick. When I first watched in the theater tonight, I just had an embrace of San Luis. He is the head of the UAs and it's, you know, we're a family and there's dysfunction. It's not always pretty, but it sure was all a little nice to feel welcome and to be here. I've been talking to Evamina for a week now. Things are good. We're familiar. But what that man has done and to be embraced and to see the recent movie here and you too, Diana. I think that tonight's a lot about your connect with tissue. The highly ethical and highly principled and we owe you a great deal of debt. Thank you. Well, he'll pay back. I really need to go into life. I'm going to work hard over there. Does he have a family? He's got a mother and a brother right here in the Long Beach. What about a father? A father? No. No poor man. He died in the revolution with Dion. He's dead. He's dead. You can see now your family outweeds with Evamina. It itself holds a lot of memories. In the continuum of the evolution of Latino theater, American theater really, you know, this building has memories for me, like everyone. The first time I walked through this building, there was no finish. It was in transition. I walked to the premises with Bill Schnell, who was the artistic director of the Los Angeles Theater Center, this building being converted from a bank. And we walked into the space. There were no seats. I think the concrete had just been poured. But we discussed doing one of my plays here. And so I wrote I don't have to always taking values in 85 that year. I was working on it. I was also working on the Bamba that year. We had just done corridos. We started in San Francisco, San Diego, came to LA. And then we got back. And again, it was a wonderful experience doing play here, being part of the inaugural season of the LHTC. That particular function or administrative group basically, I don't know if anyone has discussed those things, but I was glad to see that for a certain reason, I mean, I know that the Pacific Company was able to take it over and bring it back to life even more glad now that we're here. Is that good? Thank you. I couldn't hear. That's where I am. It's not in this particular juncture here. You know, I was in San Juan raising a family and I wasn't a participant as I was later on or at the beginning. So it doesn't have the same kind of I mean, I'm sorry. And they sat in the audience and they enjoyed the play very much and Bert invited us to his play to his theater in Jupiter, Florida. And my assistant director at the time of the theater with Tony Puglietti the Wisconsin class, you know, who just celebrated me with muertos and his picture was up on the altar in San Juan in our theater. But the thing is that Tony was directing, so he took the play to Jupiter, Florida and it was an amazing experience but it was because of the good will really of Bert Relin. I've never thanked him enough publicly for being such a man, for being such a co-artist, he's Native American in part, so those sensibilities went deep and I really appreciated seeing him play with also Ricardo Montalvan pushing behind saying, you know, we need to push Latino theater. And so that was a great help and that was in 1986 at that time. So we're going to jump in, right now our starting point is the mid-80s here in this particular theater. Here we are in 2014 celebrating a new movement that is starting to come back to life. We are now going to jump back and take a look at the Teatro Campesinos history. It was wonderful to see culture clash up here and bring up the notion of familia and also the notion of the fact that there are three co-artists and co-inspirators. But the spirit of the Teatro Campesino is such that we have a tremendous amount of artists, perhaps over 200, maybe even 300 over the span of 50 years that have claimed that name and call Santa Monica home. And so this panel here reflects a portion of that history. There are members of the Teatro Campesino current generations out here in the audience. I just want to acknowledge your presence as well. So what we're going to do is start with this particular glorious presentation. Even though I am part of the familia for a second, try to imagine me as an objective person. That's the question. So if I were not a son, I was not a son. And I ask the question what was the best times for Teatro Campesino? How would each of you frighten it? And let's go ahead and start with Diana on this side. Well, you know, I was with the company for almost a dozen years and I met my husband there. So I guess that was a high point. And, you know, we toured Europe for many years. We would go every other year and I would pack clothes with winter and then I'd send them back and then buy clothes in Italy because we were there for almost six months. Every other year from the late 70s into the early 80s. And we were on a circuit with these international groups and we were at that level. The aesthetic was so high and it was in part because the life led back to San Juan de Hista in which there was not a moment that we were not living in Seattle. We were in the morning doing morning exercises. Luis would come in and he had these notebooks that were incredible in which he would, you know, imagine different ways of moving, different ways of listening to your heart. We were really like athletes, always in training. And so living together so closely, breathing, eating the same food and thinking the same. We were able to come up with shows in which they were devised. We didn't know if that's what they were. We would improvise work at least with scripted. We did one show, Fina and Mundo, one of the first versions because we would do over five years, many, many shows of the same name. And it would start off very surrealistic and end up as a realistic play. That happened from Fina and Mundo to Mundo. And one year we went out on the road with absolutely no end. And you're like, oh my god, we ran out of time. So we would have to improvise our end. It was frightening. And the first version of many to come which eventually became very successful. And so we would go on these tours and we were influenced and we'd see other international groups. At that time Fina was on the road a lot with us. We were on the way to play the same festivals. And we were quite the toast of Europe. And I think those years I'm very proud of and I think the work that we did was universal and very classic. And I think that I've been at center theater group in January 20 years. It was amazing. Who knew the time would fly so quickly. And yet the almost 12 years that I spent in San Juan Baptista with the theater completely shaped me. Now there will never be the values that I learned what I learned as an artist the notion of being an activist the notion of making choices and acting on those choices has has shaped me. And it was because of the intense living that we had together. So I think that that remains totally in my life. And so in terms of the 50 year epic trajectory that is a different kind of scene of where we did that call, do you think? That happened in the mid-70s through the 80s. So the chapter was approximately 10 to 15 years old. And I think once Peter Brook came to San Juan Baptista I think that was a whole other and started another kind of research I think. He came with this company and stayed with Mrs. Summer and I think that was a transitional period for us I think. And so for you, same question what is the best for what was or is? Well you know it's like asking who was your favorite child. You know because I think that you know the reason I have been married 45 years is because history has been part of the demographic scene. I think when I first came into the company I fell in love with the politics before I fell in love with the man. And so that has shaped my life the whole time because I still feel like we're still fighting the cultural revolution and we our identity has shifted you know culture class is saying that at times they've been enticed by Hollywood yes we've been there. You know my life in San Juan I have a lot of spiritual brothers and sisters that are still there as part of our community and we still celebrate of one of the traditional things that we started from the very beginning which is the They Can Show the Pastorella we just celebrated the idea that we were we have people that have been in the company for you know 40 years that are still living there and Ruben's mother-in-law who's coming you know she's family who came as a young girl and is in state there and so to me the highlight of the highlight is that we formed this community of artists in San Juan and to me that is a blessing and I cannot say that any one particular time and movement or time and place is the epitome because you know what today is a perfect day and so that's perfect for me now well I think you have to measure your place in your lifetime I'm 74 years old and when I was 25 I went to César Chavez and Pidgey and I came to a theater up by more farm workers and he said fine but there's no money you can get in the delay and there's no actors in the delay there's no stage we're on the pick and light day and night we still want to do it and I said absolutely you know because I was tapping into the spirit of this movement that he had started it was in some way feedback because I was born in Delado and I had bitter experiences in Delado it was a very positive and normal experience in the learning market just nearby and so I wanted to go back and sell the score by that time I graduated from college I was a state degree in English although I started as a math and physics major and I got my scholarship just as I stayed based on my strength in the sciences believe it or not in the math and I love math and I was thinking about business and I became an engineer but I got tired of people coming up to me and saying and I found out that an older brother had already gone into the business that there was a big racism in the engineering business and so I said well this animal has to be paced directly and so I decided I committed to the idea of finding a racism but I was also committed to the idea of doing theater so I wanted to combine those and the only way I could do that is by combining art and politics and I went to the nearest place in 1929 in San Francisco in 1964 which was undergoing the Coastal Revolution that happened in San Francisco I was part of that on the airbie when Elvis Dean came out there on the bridge the thing is that wasn't the place that I needed to be I needed to be back in the lake and the valley in front of Demons and it's like going as far away as you can think of where we can go. I had a professor who had transferred from San Francisco to Brandeis University and he said come and we'll restage your first place from head up on to be at Brandeis to get an MFA and there's an off-roadway producer that didn't seem to be producing in New York this is 1964 so I saw this the road opened up in two different directions you know one led to New York in 1964 at Brandeis the other one led to Delano and sleeping on the floor and having my after it with everybody else I want you to delay I want you to delay there's been a private route that I needed to relate to and I have had many moments like that in over the 50 years of my involvement many happy moments incredibly joyful happy moments really not the fancy moments I mean the joyful moments of just working some of the moments I am talking about freezing our asses off in the old warehouse and yet doing creative work and really putting flags together so we can get a kerosene heater just to be able to get warm because we had no heat in this big old warehouse and we're still there we have a new warehouse but that has no heat I don't know that edge somehow you might ask you have to stay on the edge to do your work and it's not about the same it's not about the position it's about the joy that you get when you're doing it and you can always go back to that point it's a bit chaotic now but you always go back to that point you'll never lose it you will continue to regenerate whatever it is that you need to in the first place the word is commitment you have to commit to the act of doing theater castro or film or politics and put your ass on the line because that will keep you alive the other night last week we had just wrapped up a run of Valley of the Heart my last major leg of 10 weeks maybe we'll discuss it later but the thing is that we had transferred it from our little 150 seat packed house theaters to the world theater in Monterey Bay 450 seats a new set all done within two weeks a new set rehearsing the people getting in two packed houses tremendous response and the professional achievement the look of it was something that I was very proud of because I've always wanted that and then the next week we came back and we were rehearsing in the end of the week our act was for the street in our rehearsal room and then Esperanza by a dance group was on stage and then we had a group and then we were preparing our stage and it was a moment of chaos and it was a beautiful moment I felt so happy Lupin read it back then too I felt so happy because then to be part of that moment and the theater has had many of those moments you've got to age with it though I'm no longer the 25 year old from the pissing vinegar I'm the almost 75 year old young Maestro Vico you know what I'm saying but I find joy from the same act the group was working with Pinon and we went to the self-help graphic celebration and Pinon was leading a procession with Chaz from the Diacro and it was a really great reflective moment because back in someone we had begun with self-help graphics and Galavia de la Raza in the United States the celebration of David and to hear that it's still going on in someone this long after and the impact that it had in developing a holiday for the United States that is now taking over Halloween it's fascinating right and in Mexico they have the opposite Halloween is taking over the family and picking up the banner control of investments that we've done over the years and theater in this piece we really brought that to be like Galavia one of the standing figures you saw it in the film that first played in Central France it was an actor with these crude Calavera masks and connected with Mastarez but that idea that a lot of the theater piece comes a national holiday in World Sharing what a fantastic play so I have a question from this conversation we've heard that the politics has been important and then second to that this little town and so for the benefit of everybody here why a little tiny town of 1,800 people why did the ghetto move there and what is it what is it to be meant being there for over 40 years now 43 years yeah okay if you see the film the very book the vision where nobody takes a diamond that's our vision that's our moment in the class over there that's our moment there's still 1,800 people and we can't even drink the water on the class it's 29 years but the fact is that San Juan Bautista used to be larger than Puerto de los Santos Puerto de los Santos used to be smaller than San Juan Bautista San Juan Bautista is in the Central Coast area Monterey Bay area in land so it was taken over by the Americans not to say gringos very quickly and they came and imposed order and so because it was a seat of revolutions it was the military capital in California Jose Castro was the last military governor in California along with POP and some of the others but the thing is that he left he sold all of his properties in California until he was assassinated in the 1850s this house is still there in San Juan I wanted to be able to recapture our history I was tired of being like an alien in the place where I was born and everywhere I went there were barriers that seemed to be put away marginalized even here the people living in West LA had never been to East LA one of my editors had never been to East LA and he was born here he spent all his life in West LA but the thing is that the idea of patio is something that is visited in all our towns and San Juan has nobody San Juan is all Mario or nobody and it's got everybody there but it's working through its problems very slowly but it's like a kernel of history that's left there and we have been confronting the western mid there for 43 years we went through the mission because that was accessible and there they tell us we've been doing it for 43 years we're doing it again to revive one of the roots of Latino theater which is in the church and we also do the pastor area but we did it in the streets again with it but the idea then is to crack the knot of this little town crack the knot of this little town that opens up to us to the newer Americas we're not excluding anybody else as a matter of fact we're embracing all of Asians we're embracing African-Americans we're embracing Anglo-Americans doesn't matter what your background is we just want San Juan to reflect this if we want San Juan to be green you know in this election yesterday we defeated Fracti because they were sending open in all kinds of money to come in and frack the fuck out of San Diego County you know there's only 50,000 people but we beat them and the press conference was looking at the other country but I call it the Iod Hurricane the Hurricane being California and so we have had culture class there Diane knows we've had roots over the years you know the Cal Jader Lidia Mendoza we've had fantastic artists it doesn't matter how humble your house is it doesn't matter so if you're in some little barco or if you're someplace in a store fine, beautiful you know we have a running joke every time I see a storefront I say there's Jeff and Christina with videos they're very marvelous you know but because I love the fact that San Juan is out of the way that it seems like a backwater because that's where the power is that's where the power is you know when we went tour it was a great place to come back to and there is a kind of calmness and peacefulness about the area that allows you to create and so when you're thinking about work and devising work in a big city Basalma's here she's sitting in the bar they're creating work in an area that is just bustling and we did the opposite you know we created in a city in a town that gave us peace and that worked for us we still have that romantic truth that's placed in New York and comes once a year and they're directed about being with one of our plays and the first time he came back a couple years ago he stopped at the other and he kissed the steps he was coming from New York City and the thing is that they came to reverse the piece in San Juan and they brought Leap Brewer you know again you may know his name to direct them and so we're running rehearsals in one room and Leap Brewer is working with the Flamengo's in the other rooms really you can make it happen you can make a soul for it you can cut through all the other money problems and the personnel problems and whatever the training problems you just have to keep pushing because you're committed to the idea Do you have any reflections on San Juan Bambista or what is that part of the best of times well you know my mother I used to always say because we used to do all our shows free and especially in San Juan and she, of course in Spanish where she didn't speak English said when are you going to start charging one of the things I do get we're back to my mother he said you have to find yourself you have to own your own place we bought that building back in 1978 very nice and you know we we always say that it was a house of YouTube built because it was crazy we had a balloon payment in two years and at that time it was $175,000 which is nothing now but at that time we were making $100 a month you know that was a lot of money so we ended up buying the building in two years because of the royalties and fees and that's why we own that building and at that time we did that so we learned from we have our mentors we have our family we have our parents my mother taught me how to economize so we keep our dog pretty simple in someone but we own our building it's leaking right now but you know but I think that has rooted us in someone I think Diane can remember the time when we performed at the inner city cultural center here in Vermont and it was raining then too and it rained and we had to get out like with the mobs because the seeds were wet for the island and so in character like on media that's why the ghetto went out and mobs the floor and uh oh it was just doing just fantastic you know so on the identifying a couple of challenges right in some cases infrastructure reviews what are some of the challenges that you faced in the 50 year trajectory of the ghetto capacity I haven't faced I mean this is a group that you know it's twofold this was an ensemble I was part of an ensemble and then police also had his career so there was a double a double whammy here you had the moments in which we had to create a show and uh police was uh you know reversing the suit and we were in Europe and so you began to see that we were a title ensemble and then police had aspirations and rightfully so and so he began to uh you know write much more he started to do films and there was a change there was an evolution in the company and we had to adjust to that and it wasn't easy I remember uh Europe uh in the late 70s we were doing a show at a immigrant housing and it was a tough show and I was sitting in the back of the police and we were having a hard time in the tech and he turns to me and probably doesn't even remember and since now I I gotta do all the things do you remember that I'm sorry about that I'm sorry about that and uh we have had a very bad uh incident where we were reversing and our lead actor was in a terrible accident uh and he was there actually never the same after that the best one not that's never the same after that I had to perform here in LA to go for and then turn around and head back to someone the same night and in the intersection highway five and 152 uh we were broadsided by someone out drunk never be on the road after 2 a.m. or if you want to be very careful a lot of lunch it was a terrible literally broken space and it was a terrible terrible accident and we were reversing for Europe and uh we just had to step in and believe me the police was he had young kids it was a crazy he was not prepared but he had to do the role and uh and it was a it was hard for you I mean it was uh you know you had to readjust because you had a planned employment test and we're rehearsing a moment where we come out and uh I'm playing the skeleton and uh I'm holding a huge cross and we're like you know it's interesting you see it it was a part I thought it was terrible because I was like well because we were all in the show we ended up having to be in it and uh I had 2 young children I think he none at the time was 3 and uh now I was 5 and uh I remember that uh we had trained them to sit on the side because I was in the show we were they knew exactly the moment when the show was over because they were run on off they had a blackout on the side it was run up to uh well I think you know he would jump on his shoulders and he was like it was wonderful and that's what I remember also I mean that that particular well one memorable performances with the guys the children was at the John Weaver Rose the Kent Rose which is the old uh in Paris by the Senate and uh we had audiences of Japanese tourists that was rather intimidating to be able to respond to I don't want to make something that everybody would know they really very enthusiastic and went for likely a planning at the end you know the Kent Rose was a real ally and the Kent Rose was one of the heroes of the theater you know and I became aware that we were really part of this large family that included Peter Crook and included others you know uh Augusta Boa and so many names that come to mind but the thing is that that's really important because the overview okay the overview you got a lot of young favorites you got to understand now 50 years ago literally 50 years ago I was a young but even playwright there was no place to exist I had no place to be there was no place for me I did have that professor there and I did have that opportunity to go to uh New New York you know up front way and that would have been an interesting possibility but I took this other room but the thing is that I realized then having studied theater in college we needed a lot of apparatus in order to make Latino theater happen we needed an audience so part of what we were doing was developing an audience just an audience obviously we needed actors so part of what we were developing actors Ro-Hop man, crudels you know up to that no training whatsoever but they jumped in and did the thing I tried to become a scene host of course and then went on to include other people students in Chicago we had no directors none my only antecedent before I began to write before I wrote this one I had a bunch of that back in my early play was the post-1930s who wrote back in the 1920s and 1930s and then my other antecedent that I worked at college was Rodolfo Seigli and Mexico okay so I had but then I began to realize and I had other antecedents in the American theater, in the labor theater in the 1930s you know then William Soroyan came to the Schrodinger and John Howard Blossom, the founder of the writer's deal during Hollywood playwright, also Broadway playwright who was one of the blacklisted Hollywood tan you know we see him in the old newsreels but the thing is that these people these two guys, these two men saw my first play in Schrodinger and said this is dead, you're on, you're on a crack so I felt accepted on that level but there were no other like these so we had to create a reality that you have been with me for 50 years we continue to develop and this is why I was overjoyed that this enguento was happening here with such a high level of participation and such a high level of commitment to that I have a sense of what that history might be I'm just using the disc and the future would be but let's, if it's not the future then what are the hopes what vision do you have of the future or in death or death business after 50? well, I would love to see have a partner you know, Kenan is the artistic director and I feel that he should have a partner who helps him run the company you know, that would be my one if you're going to continue thank you so much and there would be thank you very much he's a little pirate yeah, it was a friendship and it really felt like that should be the next step and I still hope that the future and how about you, what do you say, the future or the death business you know you know, you had told me 45 years ago that I'd be here today that I could foresee the future where I would be would not be here I don't know what the future is really I'll be honest with you for me you know things have a beginning and an end and all of us have a beginning and an end I don't have a crystal ball I can't see what the future is I can hope that they will survive us one of the things that the plan that we that Diane helped develop with the view how can the Diapoca be seen or survive without somebody named Valdez at the end and that was a perfectly honest question because it's difficult to answer that I don't know can I be just I don't know what the future is I know that I love today today is the most important thing to me and that if we continue you know we do have a work and sometimes you have to make decisions that are not people are not comfortable with it but I'm in a program that says say what you mean mean what you say so thank you and we have to speak out but we can be still we can be kind to one another and if that is the legacy that Jacob Abasino you know to be able to welcome people when they come there I hope that will survive that you are all my brothers and sisters we all call cultural revolutionaries working on the same thing because otherwise you wouldn't be here and you know I think that that's the legacy and that I hope that that will continue with whatever happens to the company well I think you know in the past I've been laid off for quite a while I've acknowledged by a long time colleague and compañero who is in this enterprise now for quite a number of years almost 50 years you know but I was very glad to see that and you mentioned the Encuentro you know in 74 the Tez Latino Chicano Theatre Festival in Mexico City and the first Encuentro Latino in the Italian it was 40 years ago this year and 300 guest guests from the United States went to Mexico City plus the census commenced and we encountered our colegas from South America and it was an explosion as we understood because I was a year after Tinochet and there was Tena Chino and they took the Aegean you know government and dictatorship which was having an iron grip on Latin America and that's what Latino people wanted to respond to in their own way they couldn't do it openly they did it the other way we were coming from the United States La Panza del Monstro called Panza Chicanas talking about identity problems they said how are we are we how are we they said who are you who are you and then when we speak Spanish right so we had a really good all the Latinos to do was buy their pumps and so they saw the actors the Latinos saw the actors and they said but this isn't theater you know this is there's no training this is crude what is this so it was explosive and there was a lot of misunderstandings it personally took me 30 years literally to get back to Mexico City and when I did I went back to teach a workshop for the same people and glad that I had cracked all of us you know in Mexico City but we got there again thanks to the mascarones who were paid to me by this time and they were able to set up this among ourselves I went and gave workshops and we talked everybody apologized everybody but then I was also invited not so long after to meet with the Sofeira the Sofeira Minerales that had a session for me and then we had an acquaintance in Puebla sponsored by Sofeira to discuss my work in the Tieta Co. and then not long after I was invited to direct the revival and world premiere in Spanish of Sucu with a companion of the Tieta Co. and this was in 2010 it was a tremendous hit they said don't expect me to react to that L.A. we got to react to that L.A. it helped that the Arizona was going to shit and we were responding but the CDS said that we won the critics award the Mexican musical of the year it had that qualitative but the company had to continue to do the play and revive it twice in Mexico City they took it to Bogota, Colombia and on December 15th they were coming to the Central Cultural Center in Iguana so for me as a Chicano playwright to be able to go back to Mexico and deal with my professional contemporaries to meet Google and Pastón Banda you know and like Peter Panpaí was one of the great ones you know a playwright and we consider Mexico same time in America and we affirm by Latino consciousness but in Spanish we also have in the language of our ancestors and also to be able to write in that language but directly with translators because our work with these words has to be written in Latin America and the future for me is a living future we are talking about in Mexico the city of Mexico is like the Central Capital Latin America and for me it was like New York I decided to be here in New York in New York and I came from the city of Mexico and I had success in Mexico and I feel more Chicano than ever I was in Spanish doing it in English, doing it in French and Gino it doesn't matter doing it in whatever language but reach out there's a theatrical casino who are sitting down here so please stand up and that's our sacred duty to pass that on to the next generation I just wanted to add Gino and I think there's another category of all of us who are doing theatrical because of the theatrical oh, you know I'm so enamored with your whole existence and everything else but one thing that I find so fascinating in the history of the theatrical is your experience when you went on a flatbed truck of actors to the war of the UFW could you just say a few sentences if that was about you because that was captured in the movie it captured throughout the history of it I saw, we've all seen that sort of heart wrenching thing and it's brave and courageous and I just wanted to hear from you a little bit about the theatrical well, I mean it was direct it was like Cesar was right there was no time to rehearse we had to do it on a picket line after a couple of weeks then the company's elected picket cast so I could run the picket line so we started welcoming so you get bored out of it being 8 hours a day standing out there so I get some chance going and the thing that I've learned in the movement already the civil rights movement anti-war movement and then songs, I was team leader the first member to join the theatrical played with the car, it was very good and we played with Innu and what I do and then we started writing songs based on the labor movement and we sang those songs out on the picket line that kept us amusing for a while it was always happening talking to the campersinos the objective was to get them out of the field so we used to climb the top of the panel truck and do outrageous things now, we're facing danger we're facing daily danger I had a gun put to my head on the picket line what can you do to dispel that what can you do on any picket line on any political confrontation well, if you're an actor you're part clown you can dispel the fear now, it may kind of much as much as you're supposed to do this kind of stuff that was a little weird you know, me, I had my mustache people thought I was dangerous but then I do stuff like this she was like it was good night and one guy even said no sense here, it's men's school can do but, you know, we're doing improvs so you do that the real flatbed truck the real flatbed truck was a march of Sacramento the union really provided us with a flatbed truck to run the rallies, the nightclub rallies 25 nights in a row and that became our stage that became our signature stage at the beginning and it was wonderful because again when you're forced to perform on a tiny little stage you have to really move your body so my training for the San Francisco Mindful the mind came in really handy the use of maths the use of science all of that was because the space was so small and actually last weekend we took the trailer out to the streets of San Juan we had the calaveras out there performing on a tiny little space and it was refreshing again to do that you know, it's like you're emanating your roots again you're saying this feels good from an active standpoint it's a tremendous challenge but it's wonderful because you're out there in nature you're out there in the open we were there we made there happen there right there where we were and you can do that with the theater that's the wonder of our art you can make life happen instantaneously on a street corner or in a bar view you can turn a storefront into a majestic playhouse that's the wonder of it that's the beauty of it it's empowering the poor they don't have to have any money these companies didn't have any money you can get out there and do stuff and the audience has popped them for and just seeing that large state was tremendous good question one of my in like 72, 71, 72 I did my first workshop with you at the board theater from a marquee performer we were doing the impromptu you and Mark loved it now exercise that you did from the Aztec some, I don't know right after my mushroom day so it was they had to wear it I remember number four with the chair but do you have these exercises in in a general kind of workshop book that people can get yes we do it's called the vibrant being workshop in the book the vibrant being work book vibrant being is a nice to get the setting we've developed in the last 50 years is rooted in Mayan thought we need to means vibrant being in Mayan that we are all vibrant beings you know we're not we're not we're vibrational and so working out of that we broke into four columns which is the sacred calendar racing to four columns of five steps each so the first five steps relating the body the next step is the heart the third column is the mind and then the fourth column is the spirit or what we call the vibration is not and so all together we we right so we do a workshop with being the now there's only a few people that can teach this members of the theater a few members can teach it so the workbook is for further yes I agree it's not published yet it's the greatest exercises that I've ever done in my life that was three no wonder you're so young no wonder you're so young you look great you mentioned that audience development in over the 50 years you've probably seen a lot of audience members now that we're reaching this new America what should we keep in mind like as young producers as we move forward towards audience development well once again my little friend Gali the heart deals with two families one makes it the america and the japanese-american family it's a love story but it deals with the japanese concentration camps from which you've done a point of view the story tells her that she's gone and falls in love with the japanese department's daughter and then he sees they have a son and he sees that family going to the concentration camps the most expected audience development packet for us was the asian-american community they came screaming me to someone about this time they have donated funds and reading what they are the reason they do that is because they appreciate the story that we're telling in the play and these are realistic characters and yet they're archetypical and the fact that we're telling a story that exists in their mentality and in their pain and as one minority to another you've looked across and said we're going to tell your story for a change and see ourselves in the mirror when I was writing the play I felt that I was seeing myself in the japanese-american mirror and that was refreshing and also I had to take it took me 10 years to decide to do this without help because I wasn't sure that I could go into the japanese-american experience but I did research and I based it on all of my experiences and it seems to have garnered enough respect so that we have a lot of support in the japanese and asian-american community now audience development is about who's on stage is reflected in the audience and I remember walking into the table when I entered Uzu the first time and I saw the play and then I looked at the audience and I said man these people are angles the place is full of angles and then later when we get Uzu I remember looking out at the audience and realizing half are angles this is my audience I never claimed them but because of the paper they came and they're my audience so it is my duty as a playwright to respect them as human beings now very often there's a lot of anger because your class mentioned when you're young you're full of anger and the angles are great because they need to be but over the years I have deepened in my understanding that there are no villains ultimately reading there are no villains we just need to understand what the relation is and the way that people can understand it so audience development is about who are you touching and I think that the new American audience has to reflect America has to reflect who's here who's in the country and I don't think the regional theater is doing it yet I'll enter Sudan she did a wonderful job defending this point at the table but it's not just the tapers all of the regional theaters they don't need to create a category for us then we go into one slot it's going to be a lot of people playing or an African American player because that's smorgasbord what we need is just to be acknowledged as human beings you know why aren't we in more place why every time they ask one of our politicians an interview one of the talk shows it's always about immigration but we have no thoughts about Iraq we have no thoughts about the crowd we have no thoughts about anything else and women's rights we can talk to all of those issues and that's their lesson for the theater so audience development if you're broad enough in your pieces you will attract more people I just jump in that is inspired by all generations of the theater if people don't go to the theater then theater must go to the people that can be in terms of the content but also the places and that is something I'm going to go upstairs first little question I think it's so because I'm getting married in six months and I'm lucky enough to be working with my fiance that our whole small theater company and just some advice on how I can make sure that she doesn't kill me is we create a long life together creating our together what is your advice you know I think you have to be kind to each other you know if there are highs and lows in any marriages people that have been married a long time will testify to that but I think the bottom line is respect if you have respect for each other you can survive anything and you know we talk about being mirror reflections because we are to each other and I think one of the things that has sustained our marriage for 45 years is that respect for one another and right from the beginning we have words that are not public we respect each other in that sense but you know I don't have my voice I can still say what I mean but I don't have to say the meaning as somebody who's had a front line seat today I can say keep creating together because the moments that I've seen them joyful and sense the bliss that they share with everybody is when they remain collaborators recently my mother the costume designer has been a collaborator my father's new work Ballet of Heart and that is a beautiful thing to witness that type of collaboration both creating a family and a company and as artists together also I think you need to know that an artist especially an artist who goes into the zone and may not pay attention to some of the essentials needs a partner that will watch his or her back at those years when we were creating the process and Lupe has been my life support for 45 years when we've been married 46 years since she came into the company and the thing is that I couldn't I couldn't do what I do without her help I never could have done Zuzu could not have happened she was pregnant with our youngest son Lucky whom you may have seen back around you know he was born actually I was later I was two weeks overdue and she was two weeks overdue and she kept saying you got to have to you got to finish the play because I got to have good babies and I had long stretch 72 hours for no scenes and I hopped on a plane to the paper she called and she said my water broke and then the phone went dead and I had no choice but to turn right around and go back to LA I said fly back and I sat on the plane and they made my way to Solina's recently a friend picked me up and he took me to a hospital and my wife had just had laquine and laquine was born to this worker and it's great if you can do it as a family it's great and I said you know who's our friend I said a lot of people hold back because there are artists and I can't afford to get married he said don't wave he says do it if you have a partner, somebody that you love you can support each other and that support will help you to do your work I've been thinking a lot about when I'm going to be taking back I'm here with people on nature so I'm thinking what am I going to take back to New York what am I going to take back to the Bronx so I'm asking you because people there might be artists here who have been out of that chair 20-30 years from now so what is your expectation of us when we go back to New York and to Denver what would you want us to take to New York are you asking me asking everybody love for you all to be leaders I continue to be out there as a leader and I would love to be a full time artist but I have a responsibility to my community to you all to keep the door open until there are more of you ready and primed to lead so I am waiting and to go through the entire struggle it is a struggle being an artist is not easy and as we heard tonight you have to diversify what you do in order to survive and you have to do more than one thing just to be an actress it's not going to be it's hard to sustain you have to do more of what are the other things that go with that so that would be my advice I had experience in New York in a pricier building I did an interview live in New York City and I was really impressed because the two hosts were kind of reflective of two ends of the Latino world and the host test was very blonde and blue-eyed kind of a Spagnola but she was Latina and the other host was very African-American looking but he was a poor reader or Dominican also very very Latino and then there was me an Indian Joe and we were speaking to New York, the greater New York area and people calling me in Spanish, and Latino and I just took that memory and put it away like a pressure because it seemed to me that day that morning I was talking 12 of Latin America in New York City the thing that I expect from you is to develop the image of America we are not recent arrivals we are America and it bothers me when they talk about people coming from Mexico to America or from Puerto Rico or Cuba or Latin America to America America, the United States is not America it is the United States of America but we need to share that now the challenge before you is evident if you saw the electoral map last night it's all those red states in the middle New York is relatively blue California is blue you have Oregon, you have areas that are blue and blue kind of means more consciousness but it's those red areas yet they have a lot of promise yet those are the people who go to New York and see plays on Broadway I don't know if they get to the front I don't know they get to Pregonics but my thought is that in the future, in your life there will be people from the Midwest going to Pregonics and Pregonics will be wherever it needs to be it's on Broadway, Broadway but I think we need to transform the country America is an unfinished song America is an experiment that needs to be completed and we are now participating as full partners in this evolution and we now have the power of theater and the power of literature and the power of film at our fingertips to make more change happen more rapidly with the benefit of everybody