 Welcome to figments the power of imagination. I'm so excited about today's episode because I'm not talking about gas prices, or the Ukraine or coven, or any of the other myriad of things that have us. Don't want to press these days. I'm going to talk about something phone with somebody I like about hot gun member can give a fighter pilot review with my good friend Dallas Thompson retired major general Air Force type and fellow fighter pot. And we're going to review this movie without spoilage just so you know you feel free to watch this if you haven't seen the movie. We're going to not ruin it for you so let me say aloha Dallas and welcome from, or should I say howdy since you're in Granbury, Texas. Howdy aloha goes means the same thing here. Yeah okay. Hey this can be funny you just saw the movie two nights ago I think you and I have similar past we worked together some we talked about things that matter to us. serious things. But basically we're just fighter pilots in our paths were similar and converged at a certain point I got a few pictures to flip through to talk about us and then about you. So we both went to pilot training the T 38 jet there, and everybody's got to get their picture like that. Those are the days on. Yep. I looked at you when you sent your picture I saw the Air Force issue hack watches we called it because you could hack the time very easily, extremely low tech. And then they made you wear a name tag that just had your name on hat on half of the delta row, waiting for wings, and you looked like the dork student that you were compared to the guys who had a nice bright shiny pair of wings to top it. So that brings back memories but then in 2003 are passed across directly in Bahrain, quite and Iraq. When we were both air component coordination element directors during the invasion Iraq operation Iraqi freedom that brings back some memories doesn't it. Yep. And the reason you were the ace directors it was called to the Navy was you had a Navy background in your Air Force group that I'll share with them. That got you to fly Navy airplanes through friendships that you'd made maybe. I on the other hand made my friends in the army and what did that get me a, an all expense paid road trip about to Baghdad. I should have chosen better. Now I enjoyed my time with the army that yours was a little more pleasing to a fighter pilot. So you were an F 15 fighter pilot in your first fighter assignment after being an instructor near training command the mighty eagle. And we might have time to debate which airplanes were those kiddos with you. You probably can't see. Well they were both, those are my two oldest granddaughters, and they were both at the movie with me on Saturday night. Which is very cool we'll get to that in a bit the mighty eagle, a great airplane. After that. After you want to fight a weapons school which is analogous but not the same as top gun. You went and flew the F 18 and the F 14 with the Navy. What's going on here you get a nice cool drink of water after a demanding sortie in the F 18. When, when I was offered the job by the skipper out at VX for I said, hey, can I go to the ship. Will you send me to the ship. Even though that wasn't necessarily part of the duties. I mean, it was, it turned out it worked out. They worked it into a test, but we had to take an airplane to airplanes to the ship to do a viable test. Before I took the job, the guy that offered me the job said, absolutely I'll send you a ship. So there I'm just just got back from two days on the ship, and my Navy wings are at the bottom of that mug of champagne. So I had to chug the champagne to get my Navy only one way to get him. And that's a big deal because to go to the ship doesn't just mean you take a little robot or something. You have to carry your onboard delivery and you have to actually be able to land on the ship and planning and the catapult takeoff is really something to experience. So you have to fly, fly both the Hornet and the F 14 and both featured in top gun versions, actually, both of them in the latter version. So that gives you a unique perspective viewers what I'm doing you're setting the table for why Dallas Thompson is the ultimate commentator on this, because you're also a graduate of fighter weapons school, and got a picture you and your fighter weapons school class whoops that's your viper time there. Hopefully we'll get your fighter weapons school class up here. And if not we'll just say you went to fighter weapons school which is like top down only different what are the differences between top down and fighter weapons school. Now, very few. Then, completely different. And the difference was when, when I went to fighter weapons school my instructors were instructors in the F 15. We flew with them were paired with the fighter weapons school instructors. In those days, the instructors were the adversary. It's just like they were in the original top gun movie. Over time as a matter of fact towards the end of my time at weapons and flying F 16s that the two schools had regular exchanges. And the Navy moved to the Air Force model. Right. Which was, which was more robust, frankly, I mean, the top gun, not to denigrate it was largely a flying experience. And the fighter weapons school in the Air Force was and remains really doctoral level. It's a fine thinking writing, leading program. And now that they are more similar. So you will have some guys that I know Rick gone be on Birkbelt, Tim Fida, other folks in your class may but where you are we're not the top graduate in your fight a weapons school. I was not. Tim fighter. Distinguished graduate. I was a distinguished great Tim fighter. And he was my closest buddy in that class, so that brings that's exactly what I want to come a visit. Is it a nice man Maverick kind of a rivalry. I don't think I mean there were, there were guys. There were guys that, you know, wanted to, wanted to kind of chip at the at your, at your shoulder, you know, kind of peck at you a bit. I didn't, I didn't take the bait, most of the time I got most of the time, most of the time. So, no, Fido and I were, were great buds. I got he won the flying trophy I won the academic trophy. At home, we were stationed in Germany at the time that my wife was staying with my parents. And we went to graduation from weapons school we came took a Southwest flight home very early the next morning and I walked in and show them the trophy for the academic trophy. And my mother looks at me says why didn't you win the flying trophy. Yeah, way to go mom. And I said because Tim flight it was my class. But there is, there is competition. And sometimes it takes on a bit of a personal note. When we get deep into the movie reunion about two minutes before we'll talk about how that was what you thought of, or if they did it in this movie, the, it did bring back memories for me. And I was on the elliptical a day or two later at the gym, and just thinking do I have any, any top gun like memories, and I did not go to weapons school, kind of a little late to the eagle and it's a, you know, the only the right people go to butter weapons and I know the right one. I think I was damn good but but but anyway, I thought about a training sorry. My I stand with at the time briefly for this moment was a guy named frog field did you ever know Clark frog field was an egg one guy before that f fours and f fives at Clark as an aggressor. Excellent fighter pop but somebody that you'd love to shoot. You know I'm saying frog was leading the 12 or so adversaries. Maybe more against my bullshit of f 15 down in the pretty protecting a bunch of that fours and a big mass force thing. And we went on did pretty well I was the mission commander. But the moment was when I was looking for the last bad guy alive and an f five popped up over ridge line. And I went to the radio frequency where you make a call directly to the bad guys and said, Fox do kill lizard f five right turn Eva Valley. And the radio call frogs dead was one of the greatest moments of my life. So, I'm sorry for sharing that with the whole world but. You're a great fighter pilot and shooting you was a lot of fun. Okay, so speaking of frogs and ice men and we know we'll talk a little bit about movies later. Were you always Dallas and where does that call sign come from. But back in those days, I imagine it was the same impact as it wasn't you safety. Yeah, we all had we all had to have a personalized call sign so that when we let a flight. It was Dallas flight or whatever so it had to be de conflicted throughout the theater. So as part of in those days I was a big Dallas cowboy. I am so sorry to hear that. It's harder now than it was. But anyway, anyway we the first squadron party that that we were at on base housing there at Bitburg. I wanted to be cowboy but a guy in the sister squadron the two was already count. Yeah. So anyway, we had a squadron party and I was kind of set up. And I was introduced to this drinking game with a beverage called Stroh's rum it's an Austrian rum, like 120. Excuse me, this was a drinking game with butter but it was. It was, and I, and it was also the first time that AFR TS was televising a live football game and it happened to be the Cowboys and the Redskins. The overseas TV service for unfortunately personnel for those. I got a little I got a little fired up. And the next day I walked into the squadron that was a Sunday night next Monday morning I walk into the squadron. Squadron commander was a guy named Jim Vegas Cox. And he had his feet up on the ops desk. And he looked at me and he says you're dealt with how kind name is Dallas. And so it was, so you never had one before that I actually had something other than pig from pilot training guy named Tony method the late Tony method sadly passed away lessons. Yeah. pilot training up for you classmate. I won't share that today. I have part of what happens and if you ever walk in folks to a fighter squadron heritage room which may look oddly like a bar. You might notice a really nice TV or stereo that was probably purchased by somebody who bought their way out of the call sign they didn't want. So that's why it works. It is part of the culture who is the original ice man. Alice, I told you. You just gave me the answer to that. I did. It's been years since I've watched the hunters but it's my dad flew at 86. Oh really. Yeah. So that is for, you know, sentimental reasons that's one of my favorite movies. I had forgotten completely the Robert the Robert mission character was ice man. So he was an NFL what a great movie but we're supposed to talk about top gun Maverick which is a huge ship. And not just with fighter pilots like us it's a huge yet a bit of escape is that I think we all need. Did you like it. We did. I liked it very very much. I liked it. Why did you like it. What, what did you like about them. I think it was a more serious. Okay I think it was a more serious. It was a more serious script. It was a more serious story. I think the flying, even though there was a lot of CGI intermix with it. I thought the flying was was generally more realistic. I was impressed with the way that they worked. This may be a spoiler but the concept of mission reversal. Yeah, I was thinking about that as we got ready to do this. And I was impressed with that. I was impressed with the notion that old girlfriends never go away they can pop back up at any time. Not going there. I hope that's only in the movies. And you said the flying was more realistic wasn't totally realistic. No, was it. I shared a comment from boa straight, another great fighter pilot, you know, and other weapons. The boa flew at fives in the original top ground and what did he tell you about the evolution of the flying in the original top gun. It was a couple of years after the movie had come out and we were at a party at Langley and and boa was there and we just got to talking. And he said you know the producers came in right up front and they said they want this flying to be completely realistic. Everything all the tactics, everything to be just as we would do it in combat. So early on, they came in and we're watching the rushes of the first aviation film with the producers and the producers look up on the screen at the gun camera film and they go, What's that. And the guys go, Well, that's the target that's that's the a four out in front of a little spec. That's a spec. And he goes, Well, how far away is it? He says, Well, I'm hard of the envelope. I'm 6000 feet hard of the envelope through for a heat seeking missile shot. So the producers kind of huddled after all that they looked through that and they came in the next day and they said, Forget everything we said about the flying being realistic. We want you up tucked in real here and real close so you know we can see the other airplane and and so that that part went out the went out the window I thought the second version. It was not completely realistic, but it was much more than the original and I, I took note of that. Yeah, I thought they did a great job and I haven't found a fighter pilot who really took on bridge with the poetic license that the producers had to take to make it watchable. Because, you know, as we know we're flying two miles apart in our tactical formation, and that isn't right up there filling up the big screen so they have to do it I thought they did an excellent job of it. I thought there are two elements. Dallas have like your thoughts in this, and I'll break them into those two elements and address each separately that were totally unrealistic. Number one, the whole and I don't want to spoil it, but the notion that a fighter pilot would enter a bar not knowing the rules. I found that offensive. That's the movie, but yeah, come on man. But I thought that I thought the, the post, the post to the to the original faux pas was very realistic. Yeah, absolutely. And it was, it was fun and, you know, it's hard to capture. It is hard to convey what we experienced as fighter pups and I what I think young fighter pilots do today it's a special world folks and I'm not going to apologize for having been blessed with getting good or the fact that many of you wouldn't like elements of it to that get over. I thought they captured that the camaraderie, the spirit with one exception really well. How about you do that. Do that feel right to you. No, and actually I felt like it was more. The whole teamwork. As opposed to the competitive aspect of the first movie. Yeah, I thought that that was a much better vehicle to show mission, the primacy of mission, the primacy of the best, the best pilots get to fly the mission, regardless. Yep. I thought that was a good story. And as a leader of a winning William tell team another thing you know that I was a spare on a cadena Willie tell team and we got our butts kicked, frankly was not the most fun three months in my life. William tell being there for worldwide weapons competition, but performance matters and really nothing else matters more than that. And so, but the best people that Dallas I thought they did a real good job in in that sequencing and teamwork, even though it wasn't technically perfect. The idea of somebody designating for somebody else and the timing having to be perfect and well I have done that in combat in. And it was it exactly like that. No, is it really hard. Yes, do you count on everybody. Absolutely. When it goes right. It's pretty good feeling. It doesn't always go right. So, I thought that was really, they did capture the team work very well. The, how did it how did it make you feel when you walked out of theater, you know, what are you a young fighter pod again in your own mind what, what was the dealio. One of the granddaughters that was in the picture of the city eagle that that was taken at a museum Peterson Air Force Base. When we went in she said granddad I want to sit next to so all all through the movie she's leaning over and she's asking me questions is this real is can this be done whatever. And I felt like I was a technical advisor to the, to the audience, you know, I love it. Yes, I felt, I felt great I felt great at being able to help her understand better what it was that I was like you say very privileged to get to do. Yep. And kids. There was a little bit of discussion, taking all the grandkids because it was a PG 13. We ran it up the, ran it up the approved family flagpole flagpole and it was all approved, and they all had, they all loved it, they all had a blast so great. That was probably the thing that made me feel best about the whole experience. I hundred and I were blessed to watch it in historic hangar 79 Pearl Harbor Aviation Museum with a huge American flag blowing the breeze there in Fort Island. The first building attack, the attack on Pearl Harbor with a hornet and a Tomcat behind us. And I've got goosebumps right now thinking about it. That was a great environment. But I hundred didn't know me as a young fighter pilot, she knows me now and she's heard the stories and she's running enough of my friends that for me the, the best thing was, and again, I'm aware of not spoiling movie for folks. Was it illustrated something that she's come to know about me from from hearing me and meeting a few of my flying friends. And that's it. I was always a stickler on discipline, calm radio communication. And my mantra had four words two of them were shut up. There might have been a few words, a couple words between them. Time is so important. And if you're not disciplined in training, I'm sorry, you're not going to get more disciplined while you're being shot at my validated that three later by getting shot at a bit. Yeah. So that isn't the way Hollywood does it okay there's got to be drama, because it's a move. And that's fine. So we walked out of top down Maverick. The first thing I did was turn to Alejandra said me more. What did you learn. She smiled and said, Chuck. Yes. So it was I just thought it was a great movie and really something the audience needs because it hasn't been much fun lately. It was a fun movie and it illustrates folks who will sacrifice for their country and give something back. We didn't risk it all. We did. We're lucky. We didn't have to pay the piper, but we know folks who did. And you know that's sad but it's not tragic tragic would be not having people like that they were willing to pay that price in my mind. So, anything else about the movie, other than go watch it people go see. My very first impression, that's the first movie I think I've been to where the star of the movie leads off the entire presentation, and thanks you for attending. I had not seen it. Now that maybe is a little spoiler. But that that set me on the right frame of mind. Right off the bat. My another thought that I had getting ready for this discussion with you Dallas is there were there were things that weren't quite right from a tactical fighter pilot perspective. The movie moved so quickly, you didn't have time to dwell on one of the real beauties of it is it's just a boom boom boom, not so fast. If you blink you miss it sometimes spy throwers are like that. Wait a minute who was it. This was a well paced and rapidly paced movie that kept you flying right to the finish. Great. I really enjoyed it. Well Dallas, it's been great to review that people go see the movie. I know that, as I said the tragic thing isn't people we lose. It would be not having people like that. You're one of the folks who flew fighters and could have retired comfortably but you stay actively involved in security matters and I know that because you write a lot. I tend to write a lot. How did, how did that happen how did, once you finished flying you were later the chief of staff at norad north com and had other key jobs within the Air Force Reserve hierarchy but what are you doing and why are you doing it. When I was the chief at norad north com. And again I retired 10 years ago this July. A lot of the things that are out in open source right now. We're still behind glass five doors. The concern, especially with the development of cruise missiles. And the improvements to specifically the Korean intercontinental ballistic missiles. We're causing my commanders, all three of them. We were deeply involved with the missile defense agency, the whole time I was there so if I can shorten the answer. It was at the very top of my boss's problems. And so I became, and the rest of the staff became deeply involved in searching out solution sense. Things became unclassified through the years, and I could speak to those issues because I had just seen it in James come out, you know, the day or two before. I am, I'm very concerned about the defense of this country, not just the homeland, but Hawaii, and our forces in the Pacific. In Europe, their ability to defend themselves against missile attacks. And it's not I don't feel like I'm on a, I'm tilting it when meals, but I do want to help elevate the discussion level so that specifically members, staffers, decision makers within the department and the administration may have a completely agnostic view. There's no agenda, there's no policy, and there's no politics. It's just the facts, and hopefully a thread drawn for them on a solution, a way for. Yeah, and that's why I like talking with you working with you. This is kind of a spoiler alert Dallas and I have been working on a thought piece about about nuclear blackmail. We think there's been a very significant transition and thinking on the nuclear weapons around the world, and we're worried about it. We care about our country, we didn't care about our country in the world we wouldn't have done what we did. Yeah, it was a hoot. Yeah, we had fun at the bar and Friday night and the love flying fast low, doing all those things. The basic motivation was to defend the country. So, Dallas, I really appreciate your friendship and, and the chance to work and think with you. And today to talk the movie. I got a heavy back then you passed, you said baby I wouldn't want but we have to talk your flanker story and being the first Western pilot qualified in the suit 27 flanker way back in 1994 right. We had a couple pictures that I kind of skipped over that. I think I can find it here of you and a cockpit in a flanker. We'll see. There you are. And you did this in Russia with Russian support and being Russia was what it was called was fair picture. So will you come back and talk about that with me. Absolutely would love to. It's been great. Let me close with the, what would fig do, and what fig would do is go watch the movie top and give yourself a break. Then go find on YouTube. The hunters I'll be back on the 27th so another thing to do is join me there. I have no idea what I'm going to talk about yet because the world is provided too many options. So please join me for pigments with power of imagination. You can find both pigments and pigments on reality. The other version I did for a while on YouTube Spotify, etc, etc, or at the think tech homepage. And with that, let me thank think tech Hawaii, our platform that gives citizen journalists a chance to pontificate will be whatever rate but today just review movie Dallas Thompson major general retired. It's a green fighter pilot. It's been great having you aloha brother. Thank you sir.