 What's going on everybody? Welcome to Friday, the, was it 12th? Today's 12th, we're halfway through March. Oh my gosh, that means we're getting to be almost a quarter of the way through 2021. Doesn't seem like 2020 lasted like 10 years. I mean, this might get with forever. So if you're new to these sessions, what I do is I go live in the morning and I try to answer your questions about starting running and growing online businesses. So you're welcome to ask any questions that you want. James, thank you so much for letting me know that you can hear me. Sometimes I forget to ask and then I'm talking to nobody. So I got to make sure that you guys can hear me. Don't forget to subscribe and of course ring the bell. Turn on all bell notifications so you're notified every single time I go live or I upload a video. And I've been doing, well I've been uploading Monday through Friday. So you get five videos a week and I've been going live Monday through Saturday. So you get another six videos there. There's 11. There's 11 a week. That's a lot of videos. Well, I thought it was. I looked at one of the guys that I follow and it's Gun B Publishing. If you get a chance, check out his channel. And he does four to five videos a day. 45 videos a day. So he works really, really hard. He's got like 2700 videos and I think I got like 800 and something videos. So my goodness. I mean, it's hard to keep up with some of these people. They're such hard workers. I think I'm working hard. I try to work hard. Okay, so today we're gonna talk about hiring freelancers and Paul's got a couple of really good questions in there. And this first question Paul, I wanna get to. It says, when you're looking for an art cover, would you look for a digital artist or a graphic designer? Now, I'm not quite sure what you mean by art cover. You may wanna clarify that a little bit. But I'll tell you this. Don't worry about what their label is. Don't worry about what they called themselves because some people will say I'm a graphic artist and some people say I'm a digital designer. I would worry more about their portfolio. So let's say you're doing a paperback book. I would look to see if they've done paperback books before and look at what they've done in their portfolio. And I certainly would never hire anybody for graphic art if they didn't have a portfolio. I really wouldn't. I don't care how good they say they are. You gotta see the work that they've done. And I would look for somebody who's done what you want. So if I'm looking for graphic art on a website on Magento, which I just hired somebody for this just recently, I look to see if they had done graphic art on a Magento website. Okay, that's what I was looking for. When I did my book cover, I had a really good book cover person for Great American Food Shortage. And I looked for somebody who'd done paperback books. The size that I had. And I had to find one that I liked some of their stuff. So that's what I would do. I wouldn't really worry about the label and what they call themselves because that's just a label. It doesn't matter so much. What matters is, did they do something like what you want? I mean, that's the real big key to this. It says, when hiring a VA, do you prefer an individual or an agency? Wow, you got some good questions there, Paul. I think I prefer an individual. I think they have more personal responsibility than an agency does. Not that some agencies aren't bad but I've dealt with agencies in the past in different things. We had an agency that was helping us with infusion soft a few years ago. And it was like, I kept getting different people and they didn't know what the other person did and then they would waste time trying to figure out what the other person did. I really like dealing with individuals. I really do. And I think an individual, as long as they've got some experience, I don't hire anybody who doesn't have experience. But as long as they've got some experience, I think an individual, it's gonna be a little bit more attuned to you. They're gonna care a little bit more about you because they are an individual. They know that you're the client, you're it. There's no barriers between you two guys. So if you get an agency, the agency could say, well, hey, we're gonna build you a website and it's gonna be 10 pages. And then when you talk to the individual that works, they're like, well, I didn't tell you that you also need this, you need this. So there's a lot of, you can have a lot of miscommunication, I'll put it that way. And I do wanna show you guys today how to hire on some of these sites. It's gonna be a little bit difficult because I gotta reach over to this keyboard. This is kind of far away from me, but I think you're really gonna enjoy it. I think you're gonna like what you see. I can kind of show you the kind of stuff that we're doing and how I find people and why I use particular sites. So I think the three I'd like to go over today are Upwork. I think Upwork is a really good site. I like Upwork a lot, I've used it for years now. I also like Fiverr, I've used Fiverr for years. It's a good site. I like onlinejobs.ph. Onlinejobs.ph is if you wanna hire a full-time person in the Philippines, okay? So that's what it's for. Fiverr, I think, is like one-off-type jobs. If you want a logo made, if you want a book cover made, if you want whatever, one thing like that. I like to use Upwork for ongoing projects. So on Upwork right now, I have somebody hired that is working on designing all the pages in my website, okay, it's thousands of dollars. It's very expensive to have done. But I have somebody doing that in Magento. On Fiverr right now, I've just finished a couple whole projects, and I have another one where they're putting my face on dollar bills, not dollar bills, but they're a $100 bill, $50 bill, and a $500 bill, and I'm gonna send those out to my customers and they can use those as discounts on purchases. So I have somebody working on that. And then of course, on onlinejobs.ph, I have several people I have hired that do work for me full-time, ongoing basis, that type of thing. So yeah, let me look at some more of the questions. Malina, Malina, what's going on? Good to see you here. And of course, welcome everybody who's a regular here or new. I'm looking down, I apologize. I have an iPad. Let me show you guys what I'm doing here. I have this iPad that is like right here that I use you for all the comments and to type back to you guys. So if I'm looking down, that's why I'm looking down. Let's see here, what do we got? Is color important when creating a book cover? Most definitely. And you're gonna find most book covers that pop are either gonna be dark with white lettering or they're gonna be red and yellow, that type of thing. The colors are immensely important as far as standing out on the shelf. Otherwise you're gonna blend in with everybody else. I've seen some really bad book covers. I just, in no offense to Fladlin, but Fladlin was Jason Fladlin. I just did a book, I read the book years ago. I just read it on webinars and I read the book and the book was excellent. Book covers sucked. I mean, no offense, Jason, but the book covers sucked. The only reason I bought the book is because I knew of his work and what he did and he had good stuff, but I would have never bought it for the book cover. I just bought Daryl Eve's book. If you don't know Daryl Eve's, he's a huge YouTuber. And his book cover was amazing. I mean, just amazing, it was beautiful. So I really liked that. Let's see here. Have you used 99 Designs? I know of it and know I haven't. It's really cookie cutter type stuff, Paul. And I know some people use it, but it's very cookie cutter. So you're gonna get pretty much what everybody else gets if you go to 99 Designs. Not that they're anything bad with NFS, which you want. I like original stuff and I don't like the feel of that templated stuff. So I don't use it for that reason, but they've been around. Some people like them and I am familiar with them. So yeah, what else? Do we have any other questions in there or should I get over to some of these sites? I guess I should get over to some of these sites here. Let me go to Upwork. First, Upwork.com. Okay, I'm gonna go to Upwork. And when I go to Upwork here, guys, what we're gonna do is I'm gonna show you how to find somebody and hire them and all that type of stuff. And let me see here. I'm going to... There's a couple of things you can do in Upwork, okay? You can post a job or you can actually search for people. Now, if you're searching for people and you wanna hire them, you have to have a job to send them, okay? It's not like you can just go, hey, I got this job, you wanna hear about it? It doesn't work that way. So what I'm gonna do is I will... Let me share my screen with you real quick and then I can go back and share all this stuff with you. So yeah, let me pull this down just a little bit. Okay, I'm gonna put me in the corner here. And if you can see that screen, let me know. James Breen, how do you select a book title? The same way that you would select a title for a video on YouTube, it should basically say the result of what you're gonna get, okay? I like that format. I like that format because if you do that, people would be looking at the book and go, yeah, that's what I want. Okay, so you can see my screen now. I do see that's popping up. So let's go back over here and I'm gonna go to Upwork. So here's Upwork right here. And this is my account for survival cave food. You can see it right there. You can see I use it. You can see there's a couple of active postings I have. I have an expert graphic designer from Magento website and I have an expert graphic designer from Magento website. I have a couple of postings there. But what I wanna do is I wanna come up here and let's say, okay, you guys have been talking about book covers. So let's do that. So I'm gonna put in here book cover design. Now, I may or may not use Upwork for a book cover design, but I'd probably go to Fiverr first, but let's check out Upwork. There may be some good ones in here. So there's a few things you wanna look for here guys when you're in here. Let's see, have you ever hired a video person to shoot when you're not in the office? What should I expect from them? Yes, I have hired people for that. I've done some corporate stuff. I literally had a billion dollar company hire us for marketing and they brought their entire team over to our conference room and I had a video shoot of all that. And I had a marijuana card company hire us. They brought their team in and we shot that. So yeah, I've definitely used that. They're gonna cost you probably anywhere depending on how many people, 500 to 1,000 a day, something like that. So it depends on how many people you've hired from that company. Hi JR, my eyes are saying that you didn't stand close to the razor this morning. I did not, I did not. What do you think of that? Think that's okay? You think I can get by with that today? My wife loves it. I have no idea what she does. You know, I look like an old man with all the great hair here and she's younger than me. She's like 23 years younger than me. So, you know, but she likes this for some reason. I don't know. Anyhow, let's get back to this design here guys. So book design. So a couple of things I'm gonna look at. You could look at all these different categories over here if you want. If you care about location, you can put that in there. I never care about location. I mean, this is a digital job. Why would I care about location? Talent type, freelancers and agencies, freelancers or agencies. And somebody was just asking that. Do you wanna hire a company? Do you wanna hire an individual? I'm gonna go with just freelancers here. I don't want an agency, okay? So that's gonna resort everything in there right now. And it's just gonna give me individuals. Hourly rate, what do you wanna pay? You can do a drop down here. Do you wanna go $10 and below? 10 to 30, 30 to 60 or 60 and above. I usually like to go on a high end. So I'm gonna go right here and I'm gonna say $30 to $60 an hour, okay? Job success is immensely important to me. Immensely important. If you do a upgraded paid version of Upwork, you can get top rated and rising talent. Rising talent means they're brand new. I don't know why you'd want them, but anyhow. I usually go with it's 90% and above. And as you see, every time I click, what's happening is the results are changing up in there. James has let it grow. How long? Am I talking like ZZ Top Long or what are we talking here? How long? All right, so earned amount, hours build. I do like to click on English level here and either pick fluent or conversational. So I'm gonna pick conversational. Hours build, I do kinda like to put in there that they've got some time. So any hours would be in a brand new person. I don't want that. I'm gonna say 100 hours plus. And notice every time I put one of these filters in here, it's changing my results. So now I've left with all of this here. Paul says I'm looking to do a book cover with a split cover of a rich person and the others stuck in a McDonald's type job. Thinking one based on American Gothic picture, surviving or a thriving theme. So what I would do with any book cover is I would have like five, six of them made and then I would run an engagement ad on Facebook for all of them and I would see which ones get more likes and which ones could click on more. That's what I would do. I would not use my, and that's what I did for my book covers. So I ran an engagement ad to Pakistan, India, Philippines and I saw which one got more likes and that was the book cover I went with. So that's how you do it. You don't make the decision yourself because who cares what you think? You care what the market thinks. Now, as I scroll through here, the one thing I do look at is I look at this job success rate right here. Like I have to have probably 95, 96%. Now, if you notice over here, I could have selected top rated if I had done the paid program, but I don't need to because look, it already shows me top rated. I don't need to pay that extra amount to get those. So when I'm looking for somebody in there, Paul says, awesomeness brother, thanks. Yeah, let the market decide on that, Paul. Let's see here. And this is where I can post a job, but now I can look through here and look at some of these people. So this guy's earned over $200,000 and he's 98%. And it says here he does art direction, corporate brand, identity, logo design, illustration, six more. Let me click on it and see what he's got going on. It seems like he's spread a little thin. It seems like he doesn't really specialize in any one thing. That does tend to bother me a little bit, but right here we do have an ebook cover creation that he did in June. It was a fixed price for 120 bucks. So you can also get an idea what he charges. This here is updated ebook cover template, $100. Designed ebook cover template, $405. I don't know why there's such a variance in what he charges, but it looks like it's all over the place. And then what I would probably do, these are all related jobs here, but I would go ahead and click on him and just look here. Let's see what else he's got going on. That's anything on a flag. You know, I mean, he's got some jobs in here. Here's his portfolio if we want to look at that. So I would go in there and I would look at his portfolio, see what he's got going on there. I don't see a lot of book covers. I see a lot of other stuff. So I may take him out of the mix just for the fact that I don't see a lot of book covers there. I want a book cover person. I want, you know, if I'm doing a book cover, that's what I want. And I see he's done some, but it doesn't look like that's what he concentrates on. This guy here's a web designer, illustrator, Photoshop, he does everything. Print designer, let's see, creative designer, graphic designer, web. Of course, book cover may be a little too niche for this, but I am getting a lot of top-rated people. Print and digital email, Canva, graphic designer. Let's see here. I still, I don't find what I like yet. Top-rated expert graphic designer, 100% job success, 60 grand. So I'm gonna click on this one here and I'm gonna look down and kind of see what they've done. What's in their portfolio? It looks like video editing is a thing, t-shirts, brochures, branding, logos, posters. I still don't see any books. You know, and if I'm looking for, there's book covers, okay. So let's see what he's done for book covers. I don't like that book cover. I think it's very washed out. This one here just looks like some type of templated thing. These are not good-looking book covers, in my opinion. In my opinion, these are not good-looking book covers. So I probably would not go with this guy here. The colors look washed out. I don't like a gray background. This should probably be a white background in my eyes. So I would spend a lot of time in here, guys, before I really picked who I would do. Now I'm gonna upsize my screen because I wanna go over to five or now and show you five or so. Let me kind of upsize where I'm at in here. What might you pay for a book cover? Well, it depends on, gosh, how intricate it was. It depends on if I had some ideas of my own. It would depend on what the market is because I did a book cover a few years ago, but maybe the market's gone way up. Maybe it's gone way down because a lot of people are working from home. So I would have to really check the market first. I would say if I had to shoot for my hip, I would say a hundred to 500 bucks would be a good starting point. And let me put fiverr in here. Five, eight, nine, eight, nine, eight, nine, eight, nine, there we go. So I'm gonna go to fiverr now and I'm gonna check out a book cover design. All right, let me put it in there. Book cover design. And you know, you need to spend time looking through here. And I know I've spent a lot of time already just on Upwork trying to figure out some of this. Oh, I didn't put the eye in there. I'm a terrible type of guy, just bear with me. Especially what I'm doing it from this angle. Okay, I got some book cover people. Okay, so if you notice, that's remember I said in the beginning I would probably go to fiverr to get my book cover done because people are more niched down. Like this person here, they've got 52 reviews, 4.9. They don't have a whole lot of reviews, but they're a 4.9. High quality book cover design right here. See, these are more niched down. When you go to Upwork, you see a lot of people that would go a whole bunch of stuff. So when I want a niche thing like this, like a book cover, I'm gonna come here and like this guy's here, it pops. You know, this stuff kind of pops here. It looks good. I like his book covers here. Let me look through here a little bit and see what he's got going on. Give me a little sip of tea. And you know what? It doesn't hurt to hire two people. I mean, this guy here's doing a ebook cover for $15. I might hire two or three people and get the best designs out of it that way, you know? But I mean, I would start with a budget, probably 100 bucks. So I'm looking at what you get. The basic, and this is the thing I really like about Upwork. You don't have to negotiate this hourly thing. What's gonna happen is you're gonna go in here and they're gonna have their packages, whatever their packages are. So for example, on this particular one here, and let me make sure I'm still sharing with you guys. Okay, I'm not sharing. Oh, oh, oh, excuse me, I apologize. Let me go down here a little bit. I was talking about it and not sharing it. That's not gonna help you much now, is it? Okay, there we go. Okay, you guys can see it now. So I found this guy here and I've already been talking about him, but I haven't shown you. So this guy here is where I found, let me just go back one. So when I went in here and I put in book design, these are all the people I came up with. And as you can see, these are a whole lot more targeted than it was in Upwork. Upwork is more for longer term type jobs. These are one-off jobs, but they're very targeted. So I've got all these book cover people and I selected this first guy right here and let me go over to so you can see his stuff. I like his book covers right off the bat. I mean, if you look, Live Edgeless. I don't know, it just pops. The Dotcom Playbook. The book covers look like they just pop a little bit. Let me click on this and look at some of his other book covers. Failure Rate. Let's see here, he's got the same book cover in there. Some of them are a little dark. I like a more bright book cover. 10 toes down mindset. Don't know what the heck that is. Some of these titles I think are horrible, not necessarily the book cover. How to Sell on Amazon. I don't like that, well I don't like the title because so what, you know how to sell. How do you make money on Amazon? You know, how to profit on Amazon. Would be a much better title for that one, but I'm getting into marketing now. But as you see, he's got these book covers and over here he's got the packages. So you can pick a package that's gonna work for you. James Breen says, how would you select a ghost writer for a book? I do it the same way I'm doing this right now. I would do it the same exact way. I would see what they had written. I would read what they had written. I would look at their ratings. I would look at how they charge in the market. I would look for if somebody like, I had somebody do some editing for me or my book. And that person knew all about survival and survivalist stuff. So that was a good match. Find somebody who has written within your niche. So let's say somebody writes on sports all day long and you're doing a cookbook. That wouldn't be a good match. So you'd wanna find somebody who writes in your niche. This takes time guys. It's not like going in there and looking at one or two people and just hiring somebody. You may have to look through 50 or 100 of these people to find some good matches. And then I contact like 20 or 30 of them to see how they are in communication, to see if they get back with me. I mean, it's a job to hire somebody, but think about it, this matters. This is long term for you. So let's look at their packages here. So for $15, front cover design, including license, stock image and fast delivery. Now the first thing that stands out to me is front cover design. There's a back to every book. Now if it's a e-book or a Kindle, no there isn't. But if you're gonna have a paperback book, which why wouldn't you print some out because somebody would buy them? You're gonna want the back cover printed out too. So I would not use that package if I'm doing a book. Let me see what standard is. Standard is print ready, cover design, front and back, and spine included. That's where I would go with this, okay? Because I want front, back and spine. Today delivery, unlimited revisions. I like the unlimited revisions. I like that a lot because if I don't like something, I wanna be able to change it, okay? And then let's look at premium here. I noticed there's no source file and no audio book cover or ACX. I'm not quite sure what that is. So the print plus e-book plus audio cover, I like that one because why would you not have a book with an audio nowadays? So many people want audios. And I understand you may wanna go on the cheap, but the first package was $15. I came in with the second one, it was maybe $30. Why not go ahead and spend a whole $45, right? Because you're surely gonna sell some audios at $7 or $10 or whatever you're gonna more than make up for it. Why not have all these things available? Nowadays, when you do a book and just so you know, it should be in Kindle form, it should be in paperback form and it should have an audio. You should have all three of those things, okay? So if you haven't done a book, that's what you should do. But as I look at this here, that's the one I would probably go with and it looks like it would give me everything I need. I can go back through here now and I can look at all the different things he does. I can certainly look at the seller right here, average response time is only one hour, so he works hard. Yeah, I mean, it looks good. It looks like I found one right off the bat right here. It takes about three days, which is expected. You gotta give him time. Do you really want somebody to design your book cover in one hour? Probably not. So yeah, any questions you have about this guys, put that in there. But this is how I would go about it. Excuse me. And I think it's a good suggestion, Paul, because everybody should have a book and let me talk to you about books real quick. Because we've talked about hiring freelancers. Oh, let me go, a couple of other things on freelancers first off. They don't work for you. You don't own them and you can't treat them that way, okay? Stop that, stop that silliness. When you hire somebody to do a job, you work with them. You wanna do everything you can to support them. You want them to be happy. You want them to feel like you're polite to them. You wanna treat them well. And if you do all those things, you're gonna get a better product, okay? If you go in there and you're all cocky, like I paid you money and I want this right away and you need to do this, they're not gonna wanna work with you and they're not gonna do a good job for you. You gotta treat everybody with respect. You are no better than anybody else. This is the one message that is consistent throughout all my videos. You ain't no better than anybody else. I don't care if you have more money or fancy your car, a bigger house. You're no better than anybody else, period, period. We all end up in the same spot and that's in the ground, okay? Unless you're gonna be in a mausoleum. The bottom line is we all end up dead, okay? Why cause anybody any turmoil in their life? Why cause them problems in their life? Why not make people feel good? Why not once somebody walks away from talking from you or conversing with you in line, walk away and go, man, I feel good. That was a cool person. I really enjoyed talking to them. They were really nice. They were really polite to me. They were really kind. Why not put that kind of vibe out? I don't understand these people who wanna bark orders at people because they're hiring them or they're giving them some money to do something. You don't own their souls. You own some of their time and you don't really own that either. You know, they're nice enough to give you some of their time. And let me just go back and see if there's any more in here that I would have interest in. This one here starts off way cheap. It bothers me at $5. But it could be you don't get much. This one's got 170. And you could sort here too, guys. But let's say, what would I wanna sort by? Budget, maybe? So maybe I wanna sort by a minimum of $50 on up to 100. So I put that in there and I can apply that filter in there and then I'm gonna find people that are gonna do something within that area. How do you do your print on demand? I do it through Amazon. Amazon does my print on demand. So if you went to Amazon right now and you bought my book, Great American Food Shortage, you would actually be buying a print on demand book. You just don't realize it. That doesn't mean that I sell a majority of my books here. I don't sell hardly any books on Amazon. That's not my market. I sell it more to my list. I sell it through ads. And we've sold thousands of books to an app, but that doesn't show up in Amazon because I buy them at bulk and we actually ship them out. So interesting in here, like this one here does kids books cover. So that's very niche down. I like that. So if I was doing a kids book, I would definitely hire somebody like that. But you could look through here and see what you get. This person's done 700 of them. This is catchy, even though it's not bright. So I'm gonna click on Rose Miller here and see what she's got going on. She's got her standard e-book one for $55. Excuse me, that's a basic one. Full book cover design for print and Kindle cover plus professional stock photos. So she's including the photos. That's another key guys. If you don't have photos for your cover and you want photos, you're gonna have to pay for those somewhere. So in this case here, she's giving you the photos also. So that should be factored in. This one here, you're gonna get the back and spine designs whereas the basic you did not in a 3D mock up. And then the premium is 95 bucks, back and spine designs, source file. Get the source file. Believe me, because if you wanna make changes in this book cover on down the road, if you don't have the source file, you won't be able to do it. A source file could be a photo file, something along those lines. Make sure you get a source file. Definitely I would do that. See here. Okay, I'm just, I'm making sure I'm staying up all the questions that are in there right now. So she's got some cool stuff. Let me just see what some of her other book covers. Yeah, I mean, this is, she's got some really good looking book covers. Escaping the pink unicorn. I have no idea what that's about. I don't like these. Well, if it's a fiction, I get it. But if it's not a nonfiction book, it better tell me what's going on. It looks like she doesn't let a love stuff and mystery stuff, a dead stripper. You should get your interest on that. She's trying for civilized, the sex lies. It doesn't tell me about the book, but that's on the author, not her. She's designing the covers. But it looks like she does a lot of fiction stuff. So if you're doing a how-to one, you may not want her because that's not what she does. So you gotta look some more. So this is a time consuming project. I've seen Guy Kawasaki has used a contest feature on 99 Designs for picking a book cover. He also printed the ones not chosen inside of the book cover. Yeah, once again, the way I test book covers is to the actual, you know, market. I mean, the market is gonna tell you what's best. You know, whatever's gonna get the most clicks. I had a couple of different book covers for my how-to-find-profit products online. And I had one that was really cool. I thought it had a black background and I was real serious in it. And that went to terrible when I put it up against one with this red background and I looked kinda silly and I'm smiling on it. It did a whole lot better. So you may look better on one book cover but it may not get as much clicks. And the other book cover got four times as many clicks. Four times as many clicks. I didn't pull that up today because I didn't know we were talking about book covers. But let the market decide. I mean, don't you decide. You're not the all-in. Okay, the market is the all-in. Definitely is. So yeah, let me get back down here to my screen. And the other thing I wanna talk a little bit more about freelancers before I get off through this today. And the way I think you should hire freelancers is you should look in the market and see what the going rate is and then pay more than that. Yeah, yeah. Don't try to pay below the market because a freelancer knows what the market is. If the average price for a book cover is 100 bucks and you're offering 75, they may go, yeah, I'll take that job and I'm just gonna knock it out real quick because it's not even paying what the market's paying. Is that what you want? I mean, really, is that what you want? You're gonna save 25 bucks and get them in fear of your product or have a hard time finding people and spending a lot of your time sorting through maybe you spend two or three days doing it and you save $25. I had a situation with employee the other day and we were talking about, they were trying to get something worked on. And if we didn't get this thing fixed, it was gonna cost us like 2% of whatever this bill was. And I said, well, how much is that? And it came out to $18.11. And I was like, well, you make more than that per hour. If you spend a day trying to get this fixed, it's a total waste of our time and money. Just go ahead and pay the 2%. So you need to kind of think about those things when you're hiring people. Is it really worth your personal time? And don't say, well, it doesn't cost me any things I'm doing it myself. That's like saying your time is worth a zero. That's not true. It's not true, right? I mean, if you went and worked at fast food, you'd expect $12 an hour or whatever the going rate is. I don't know. So when you're doing this stuff online, don't sit there and say, if you do it yourself, it's free, it's not free. Okay, you have value. And you gotta pick whatever that value is. That's $20 an hour, $15. You know, I consider mine $2,000 an hour. So if I can hire somebody to do something, you know, for less than two grand an hour, then hey, you know, it's a win for me. Now I'm not gonna pay somebody two grand to do a book cover, because that's not what the going rate is. But I will pay a little bit above it, because then they're gonna all kind of jockey for that job. And when I post a job on Upwork, and I'm paying a little bit more than everybody else is, the top people are gonna look at that and want that job. So I'm gonna hire the top people. So I would pay a little above the market, whatever the market is. And then if you're hiring somebody long-term, which I do, I have a lot of people that hire long-term, make sure every six months you evaluate them and you sit down and you say, hey, I really like working with you. These are the things we need to work on. Overall, I think you've done good in these areas. It's a sandwich. It's good, things you need to work on, and then good again, and then I give them a raise. Or I let them go. That's it. You either give them a raise or you let them go. Because if they're not doing a really good job to where you feel like you should give them a raise, then you need to get rid of them. It's that simple. If you can't give them a raise every six months, if you can't give, now I'm talking a decent raise. I'm not talking, you know, 10 cents an hour. But if you can't give them a decent raise every six months, then you should get rid of them. That means they're not doing a good job, or you're cheap, or you're really cheap, right? You gotta give people raises. You gotta give them an incentive to wanna keep working for you. And if they're doing a good job, they're making you money anyhow. That's how I look at it, you know? People that do my design stuff, people that work on my website, people that do editing for me, whatever it is, they're making me money. So I should be paying them money, all right? They're making me money. Now, is it like those people make me money immediately? I hire a video editor, and he edits it, and I am instantly making money now. I mean, my YouTube channel is growing. When I first had my video editor work on that, I made no money a month, zero. I was not monetized. Nothing was coming in, and I had to pay him for a long time to even get monetized. I think it took six months to get monetized, and then it was a small amount. Now it's growing, and now we're looking at brand deals. I'm a few hundred subscribers away, so please, if you're watching this, please subscribe. I'm a few hundred subscribers away from using FameBit. FameBit is YouTube's branch that will match you with brand deals, and then I can pick and choose brand deals and actually make money off that. But I had to pay him for a long time to get there, and that's what you're gonna have to do. If you can't pay somebody for six months or 12 months to do a job without them increasing your income, you shouldn't hire somebody. Shouldn't do it, unless it's a one-off job. I'm talking about somebody who's full-time, you know, works for you hours a week, that type of thing. How did you split test the covers? James, what I do is I run what's called an engagement ad on Facebook, and I haven't done this in a while, but this is what I did before. An engagement ad is an ad that's sent out to people to get them just to click on it or like it. And then what I do is I pick Pakistan, India, Philippines, we use one other country too, and I can't think of it off the top of my head. Oh, where was it? I can't remember. But these are lower-cost countries to get clicked. You can get a click for .0006 cents per click. And then I would post that book cover out there, and I would say something about the book, whatever it was, and I would see which book covers got the most clicks, which book covers got the most likes. And that would cost me like $10, $20. I mean, it wasn't a lot of money. I would spend $5 a day, something like that. Maybe I'd spend $20 or $30 overall. But by the time that three days was done, four days was done, it spent me 25, 30 bucks. And I would have thousands of likes or clicks on particular book covers. And ultimately, it would narrow down to one or two book covers. And I may use six book covers. And then once I knew which book cover was good, that was the one I went with. It's really simple. You let the market decide, because understand, when you're advertising that book, you're gonna be showing your book cover. Don't you want the one that people like and click on the most? Yeah, but how do you know? You do an engagement ad. That's what you do. You just figure it out. Is there a way to program books for smartphones? Well, yeah. That would be Audible. You can get an Audible app on your phone and you can listen to any books you want. I have it on my phone right now. I have Audible right now. I found that it is important that they are licensed to use images. Oh yeah, oh yeah. Yeah, you wanna make sure that all the images on your book are licensed images. And if you're concerned about that, just go to iStock Photo or one of these places that sells images and just buy the images and then provide them to the person who's gonna do your book cover. That's super important. It's a good thing you brought that up, Paul. Paul's always good in there. He always thinks of good stuff. Guys, do you have any more questions? Anything else you'd like to know? We're gonna do our Friday lunch today. And Paul, we did that last Friday and we didn't take pictures. Can you believe that? Can you believe we actually went out and had this awesome lunch and didn't take pictures? Today we will take pictures. Guarantee it, take pictures and I'll let you know we're going to a really nice Italian place. I think you guys will like it. If you are friends of mine on Facebook, you'll see those pictures. You gotta look for me, of course, because Facebook doesn't show all this stuff anymore. I don't know why, they pick and choose what they want and choose it just adds. I'm slowly inching away from those guys. But that's what you'd wanna do. And if you're not friends of mine, look me up on Facebook, J.R. Fisher. You'll find me in there, friend me and you'll see some of those pictures from today's lunch as we go out and we have a really good time. I really appreciate your all's time and being here. I really do, it means a lot to me. I will be here again tomorrow. When I put the subject for tomorrow, and where is it? Where is it? Where is the subject for tomorrow? I know I have it somewhere. Let me see if I can find it. Subject for tomorrow. Anybody know that? Post that in the chat if you do. I have it prepared somewhere. I swear I do. Let's see here. Home and J.R. Fisher training and just playing something. Who knows the subject for tomorrow? Put it in there. Look it up for me. Look it up for me. I would love to see if you guys know what the subject for tomorrow is. I'm doing the freelancers right now. And then I can't find it. I can't find how my phone is the problem. You know, if I was on another medium, I could probably find it. On my phone, I'm having a hard time. Let me move that over there. My channel. Oh, here it is. Here it is. How to create engaging content. So that is scheduled for tomorrow, 313. How to do engaging content. Thanks for the info, James Breen says. See you tomorrow. Peace and blessings as always. Thank you so much, guys. But any other questions you have in that chat, if you're watching this after we're live, put it in the comment section. I have a lot of links in there. A lot of free stuff. A lot of downloads. There's a course there. There's a $97 course you can get absolutely free by just clicking. I really appreciate you attending today. And I hope you guys have an incredible weekend. I hope you have a great day. Love each and every one of you. Thank you so much for being here. And I'll see you next time.