 Council meeting. We'll first open up the call of order with the Pledge of Allegiance will be led today by acting Deputy Mayor Eric Covey Okay, sorry, I wasn't sure how you got stuck at least here Okay, first up today is agenda review This is an opportunity for council to weigh in on any items around tonight's agenda and their order If there's any concerns about items on agenda or their order any questions concerns from council regarding so Jenna Okay, so seeing and hearing none will move on to public comment public comments an opportunity for members of the public to address the Council about anything that's not on tonight's agenda You'll find an agenda in the back if you're curious as to what's on tonight's agenda We would ask if you could if you were here to speak about something that is on the agenda that you hold off until we get there But this is an opportunity if there was something that someone wanted to speak to the council about it's not tonight's agenda to bring that item up Yes, ma'am Good evening this tipson Best of all pumpkins We're hoping that either the city or some side arm of the city or some group in the city will take over It certainly is a very popular event enjoyed by thousands perhaps You know, and we certainly will be willing to do whatever we can to move it forward with another group But I wanted city council to know first before We'll let the city now another people, but I thought it only right since we came before the council You probably don't remember We have started this year's Best of these we did do the roundabout over the weekend and the new outlets at the city put in Are being put to good use we appreciate them We have more lights in the park now than we ever have Which will it's my opinion of course looks good And well, I mentioned again pumpkin carving this year will be on the 20th and 21st We are moving the festival of pumpkins to a Friday and Saturday more coincide with what's going on downtown So it'll be the 20 20 by 26th and 27th Friday Saturday night Thank you Well, I'm not gonna let you go without saying obviously Sally that there There's no concept. I think anybody that doesn't sit in your shoes That understands how much time and investment you put into it specifically But everybody at seasons greetings over the course of not just a week or two that they see the activity But the entire year and how much effort energy you've put into that for over a decade To make that possible and it is one of those visual Cornerstones that people think of, you know, we were just at a conference today speaking about vibrancy and Winooski And talk about something that really denotes and marks an alive community that event has meant so much to the community and city and has been a rallying point for Halloween for a long time and now you're seeing Halloween become an even bigger thing, but it really started with that. I mean, you know from my perspective anyway I'm sure somebody could point to something further back than that, but Can't say enough in terms of Gratitude and appreciation for all you have done through the years for that Sally Yeah No, I didn't expect you to take a compliment And I saw somebody from downtown Winooski with a big smile on their face, so who knows maybe there's a there's a partner there Sounds like there's a negotiation to take place Great and so folks then the 20th and 21st you said for the for carving great Picking pumpkins coming up soon, too Okay, great Thanks for all you do looking forward to doing this year any other items for public comment Opportunity for folks to address counsel something inside tonight's agenda So seeing and hearing none will consent agenda. We have three items on tonight's consent agenda We have the city council looking patrol minutes from September 17th 2018 also the warranty payroll for the 9th of September 22nd of September 2018 that we're ending in 928 2018 in the subsequent payout for August And we also have the headworks phase 2 final design loan agreement that was discussed in more detail in the previous meeting Any questions or concerns in regards to consent agenda by council? Any questions or concerns from the public? So seeing and hearing none that entertain a motion for approval of the consent agenda as presented Second motion by Eric second by how any further discussion? So you can hear none all those in favor, please say aye. Aye. No as opposed motion carries city update Great. Thank you So quite a few updates and heads up tonight So just to start Winooski's had I think a really wonderful week seven days It's been a real Pleasure and a source of pride for me to be the manager in a week that we've had so much recognition Across the state for the things happening here. So just to tick those off quickly I'm hopeful that most of you have seen these but obviously today there were I counted 12 people at the making it happen Vermont Council of Rural Development Conference about how you build communities within Vermont within Vermont cities and towns We had a great panel Councillor Colston gave a just I don't tear jerky keynote speech at lunch. So thank you so much for sharing your story with us And we did a panel that I'm sure others will talk about as well There was also a team of young leaders there from Winooski High School. That was really lovely to see as well So really great day last one day We hosted as part of a Chinden County capital for a day event with the governor and his Cabinet for different events here in Winooski to showcase what we're working on in our partnership with state and federal funders we hosted a team from the agency of commerce and community development agency of natural resources and Department of Environmental conservation as well as USDA focusing on our main street room vitalization project and the funding we've Re-perceived for that to date the governor and his staff visited the Winooski school district We had an opportunity zone briefing meeting with about 25 people at attendance Interested parties developer state officials people looking to figure out how to use that Tax opportunity for investment in Winooski and then twin craft also hosted a session with the governor's cabinet as well So it's great. And then last Friday. We had the official groundbreaking of 268 East Allen, which is a true mixed income Or mixed income development 268 East Allen With summit properties and the digest company and VHFA as a funder and COTS as a partner as well So really great week in Winooski. Thank you all and thank you especially I want to call out Paul Sarn and Jana and Carol who Did a huge amount of behind-the-scenes work to make capital for a day work Just I'm saying this is what we want and all of a sudden turn around and there's this great setup So thank you to the three of you for making it happen a Couple of city updates as I hope you saw on his public record now We jointly filed the litigation stay with UMB Bank last Friday This is a temporary stay under a negotiated agreement on the lawsuit about spinner and parking As we work through next steps to come to a hopefully a litigation settlement by the end of November Burlington Airport held their first Stakeholders meeting as part of their master plan process last week as well There'll be two more meeting similar meetings throughout the process and they have committed to publicizing those really focused on What is the next 20 or 30 years of their port look like and how do we? Articulate a vision that then can be implemented over a couple of years. I did talk about governance They also had lots of conversations about community outreach some logistical changes They could make at the actual facility and the ridership they anticipate over the next 20 or 30 years The police department our police department last week held a training with all of the liquor license holders in the city around It's called place the last drink that they're doing in conjunction with the state partners chief correct me if I get this wrong really focused on how the professionals in our city who serve alcohol prevent Negative situations for people in the bar. So specifically around training for Preventing date rape and other assault things. So thank you for the chief Hebert for taking a lead on that in our state partners as well and then we have two Project teams working with our middle school with two different middle school teams right now So with the journey team Ray and I are working with them. It's three classrooms of Six and seventh graders on what the lot to the future of the lot to park and what that could look like and Then Paul and Heather and I are working with the Nexus team on a storytelling project that is using our branding and as kind of a inaugural kickoff to the legacy campaign about the stories they tell about who what Winooski is to them and who they are To Winooski, which is very exciting About halfway through good Good so a couple of upcoming housing events We just want to call your attention too So as we've previously talked about the housing policy panel discussion will be next Tuesday October 9th Here in this room from 68. This is a special meeting of the housing commission and the public is invited to attend Mike Monty, Erhard, Brian Pine, Eric, Pogstra will all be here giving us guidance on housing policies the specific tools We're looking at what they can achieve what challenges are and some things we should be thinking about as we look at those policy options So again, that's next Tuesday night here from six to eight. It is here CCRPC is also hosting the next convening of the housing commission housing committee members throughout Chittenden County They have held a series of these conversations over the last year or so This one will be on Monday October 29th And we'll specifically focus on housing trust funds and how those are functioning in all of our communities and how we can best leverage them and then last thing on the housing front is VHFA and other housing partners are hosting this statewide housing conference on November 13th and 14th in Burlington Can go to the VHFA website for more information on that This year, they're specifically focusing on municipal tools. So if anyone's interested, please let me know We we have a training we can use municipal training budget money for that. Absolutely if people are interested in attending And then for the fun stuff, we have a bunch of fun events coming up This Wednesday night will be our last Winooski Wednesday of the season We featuring tender bellies here in the rotary come out Enjoy the nice fall air This Friday downtown Winooski is hosting their Winooski art walk So a great opportunity to come out take some self-guided tours visit with neighbors and support our businesses Sorry Kelsey. I'm calling out all your fun stuff The best pooch in the news informal dog shows second annual, correct? Is this sunday at 11 o'clock at the that's part of the farmers market. It's a great event And then a save the date you heard it from Sally about pumping and carving earlier But October 27th will be the official kind of Halloween in Winooski With events hosted by the community services department as well as the haunted mill pumpkins in the rotary Etc. And that will be our portion of that will be held at the besack community room as it was last year So those are the events for your calendars at this point. Thank you all Thank you. Okay. Um, next up is council reports No Eric's going to come up and do a more formal update on Where things right with the master plan update? So we'll hold off on planning commission for now From the housing commission side the housing commission did review draft language for replace it ordinance and started working through some of the more detailed items on that in consultation with Regina Mahoney from ccrpc with her assistance and support as well You know some of the major items discussed was the number of units impacted And the the area that would be covered by it I'm sure there were it was a long very detailed discussion on it, but Put it succinctly there's going to I think real movement and really positive progress on that policy proposal in addition to that to Just reaffirming that they're working through a couple questions in the housing Trust fund side too, and that's kind of going to be the next Big thing coming up in addition to those conversations. They're going to support their next discussions on inclusionary zoning as well. So Christine attended that as well. So if you have any reflections by all means and then I just want to take a second and note that in our next meeting we will also Be finding an opportunity for council in the city to Tip its cap to somebody who's served the community for 50 plus years In clintonette with clinton's decision to step down from the legislator He's behind a massive legacy of service to the city of onoski and certainly The city was kind of waiting for everything we got the letter today That's the official stepping down letter From the legislators. So we'll be taking actions to ensure that clinton has a great send off the next stage in his life But clinton if you're watching at home, uh, surely the city would not be where it is without all of your efforts time and dedication to this community in decades of Sometimes thankless service that required a lot of time investment and extraction away from your personal life professional life and everything To make the community a better place to live So kudos to klim for all this time and service on behalf of the community and we look forward to finding Ways to acknowledge that further. So if you see klim on the street, make sure to give him a hug high five or handshake Yeah, so I also attended the housing commission meeting Just some small things to add they the discussion around the replacement ordinance also included like monitoring and accountability, which I think is important to This is something that they have looked at as well as a discussion about Trying to work from the framework of incentives versus barriers when it comes to development and then as Seth said The housing trust fund was the next priority. It sounded to me like they might be reviewing draft ordinance at the next meeting potentially so Progress there and then I also Had a meeting again with Jesse and Seth and this time also Paul Sarn to talk about the communications ideas I think we landed on some Like what are the best next steps to take versus like a just a list of ideas? And so it should be bringing something tangible from that forth soon Great. Thank you Okay Next up we have a public hearing scheduled that was a 605 start time So we'll initiate and open that public hearing The public hearing is for discussion of potential approval of consideration for repeal of section 6.14 municipal ordinances Which relates to aggressive begging and panhandling So we talked about this briefly at your last meeting There was a interest in repealing section 6.14 of our municipal cold and the code in its entirety We heard from chief Hebert to say that this would not negatively affect how they Do business and there was interest in moving forward with the repeal so Your work today is to hold a public hearing and after that public hearing you can decide to move it forward to approval or consider other changes Great, I think this was discussed in questions concerns in regards to this item No Okay and Do we need somebody to introduce in the public hearing? Do we need a counselor to sponsor or introduce the hearing or does the full body vote on it? Since it was how I interpret it is this since you had a discussion about it at the last At the last meeting it was introduced in the public hearing dates for today. So I think you've already done that Great. So really today you need to open the public hearing Here testimony then decides course of action from there great So with no questions from council, um, you know just to summarize for the public the discussion that took place last time This is essential. This this is a rule that globally has um inspired some legal contestation from the outside and there were questions about whether or not it was Uh Really an operational benefit to have this ordinance on the book or not and how useful it was Versus the potential quite frankly Whether or not it was number one negatively impacting people's ability to Go about their lives and then free and untethered manner and number two whether or not It was frankly worth the potential legal headache In addition to that and whether or not there was enough cause to keep the rule on the book And what we heard back was essentially operationally removing it doesn't really change anything in terms of how the city does business and What it's like from the experience standpoint for our residents So at this point in time we'll open the public hearing to any public testimony and that's just comment from the public So if anyone has a question concern thought on this issue now would be the time The questions are concerns from the public Okay, so take it easy on people who are visiting the pumpkins though just because this rules off of the uh Okay, any other questions or concerns from the council? No Good, so seeking hearing none I annotate a motion for approval of the repeal of section 6.14 your aggressive begging panhandling ordinance so moved Second motion by house second by christine any further discussion Seeking hearing none all those in favor, please say aye. Aye and those opposed motion carries Thank you. Thanks for your work on that chief. Thank you for your work on that And just for the record for our charter the repeal goes into effect in 30 days Okay, I know this is out of order But just want to say too they did a great job with the street closure and bouncy house party on saturday. That was great Good job Next up is chitlin county The regional planning commissioner ccrpc annual report to address some of these key issues and core issues So since those plans have been done We're taking the approach to this master plan update At more of more macro level and trying to align the the state's The statutory Planning elements there's 12 required elements from statute and the 14 planning goals and align them with the with the city strategic vision statements so Aligning those areas with the economic vitality the municipal infrastructure the housing And the safe healthy connected people so that we can streamline the master plan update to more closely align with What the city's vision is so it's It's taking a little bit of work, but we are fitting each of the the required sections into that that framework Really what that's going to allow us to do is then more specifically Be able to to react to different different topics that come up or to kind of Kind of shift the direction that we need to go from a master plan perspective without having to do An update if if the the goals don't align because we're referencing all those other planning studies and specific studies So the work on these on this update started back in july Really specifically in july we started we contracted with the ccrpc Through a through municipal planning grant to to provide some support on that and it really does go without saying that without The ccrpc's help and and specifically Regina down there this this wouldn't be happening right now The we've worked through a first a preliminary and a secondary draft of each of the of the sections so far So we're we are making good progress. I think we're expected to have a complete draft probably around the end of this month For the initial review and then completing the review of that draft in mid november Sometime for the planning commission to hold their required public hearing Right now the schedule for early december which then puts it on track to come before you all In january potentially so The the current master plan is set to expire in april of of 2019 So that's our our deadline for for getting all this work done, which we the schedule we have outlined should put us squarely on target to to meet that deadline so Yes, so you should expect a draft for for your review sometime in january and with that i'd be happy to try to answer any questions I just i would say too it's if I would highly recommend When you're up One evening soon right hanging out with nothing to do pop in and take a peek at some of those chapters And getting a little bit of flavor for that the links been provided here for you to be able to do so I mean, I think there's a lot of common threads and themes that we've all heard and seen working around these issues They're being expressed, but we do have a lot of conversations going on in the community in the city. So Certainly as that group's working through things We try to stay consistent with all those other conversations There will surely when we get to the end of it be some threads to tie it together and tweak around But Eric regime and I think I've done a really great job of building off all those other The work that's been done previously and and sort of the tenor of where the vision is right now So but highly encourage folks to poke in they're not long to read It's very accessible too So it's been really impressive with the writing is I think it's going to be something that provides enough structure without being too directive And they've done a good job of staying out of operational weeds and operational This is what we're going to do exactly versus it being this aspirational that they talk about aspirational document Yeah, one of the one of the One of the pieces that we're working on now is the implementation program Which is really going to try to tie together all the All the specific tasks that we hope to to accomplish or the direction we hope to to take Over the next eight years or six years as we work through this plan before we need to update it again So that's going to be kind of the the key area to to bring everything together Just kind of to to the mayor's point In previous In my previous career with the regional planning commission in Montpelier working with our municipalities Most of the plans that that I looked at Would range anywhere from 150 to 250 pages long We've we've got this draft document down to about 60 pages right now. So it's That I think goes to speaks to the point of trying to make this a very accessible very easy to read document That's not going to get into too much of the specific information and really reference those other Studies that that really do get into into the level of detail that that might be needed And I think the interesting thing is going to be to come behind this and look at some of these other plans The the spoken hub model of it and really when those need to be updated and when those issues need to be readdressed You know 2014 even Sounds weird to say is getting further and further away every day, right? So it's Anything that needs to be updated over time and re-envision although that's a bad example Spent a lot of time re-envisioning the main street corridor, but You know the city just quite frankly let a lot of stuff get really out of date And didn't invest a lot in its plan other than to get funding for the downtown. So that's why we're where we're at I should also mention the link that's included for the master plan Should include a crosswalk of how the state's Goals and and elements align with with what we're proposing or what we've set up for for this master plan So you can see the various parts and pieces and where they fit into the to the overall document as well Questions or concerns from council I'm curious to the same thing that you made actually about updating those other assessments, I guess Is that part of Like is that part of the master plan and like we will readdress these issues in the next amount of time So it's I don't know if we're explicitly saying that but the that's the idea that the master plan because there are specific statutory requirements for For how and when you can update a master plan in the process that it takes We're trying to leave the detail The the specific project detail to these other studies so that so that they can be updated They can be updated when it's when it really seems appropriate and when it's timely for those updates to occur and not have to focus on this this I don't want to say cumbersome but this cumbersome statutory process that It's it could be a little bit more nimble with how they how they get how they get updated and reacted to so We're we're writing the math. I guess that's a long way of saying we're writing this master plan with the expectation That those plans and and other documents will get updated at some point during the during the span of this of this master plan Thanks, and I think just the other larger question is I know in the Materials we do have a plan to do public outreach and public sessions when the drafts are ready Yeah, actually, I'm glad you brought that up. We did We had a table at the farmers market last I think it was last sunday on the 23rd To get some public outreach and input just to let people know We're also planning to have a table at the at the Halloween event as well. So We'll be we'll be there doing outreach to the community at that event also And then we still some other items that we've got have identified For other outreach activities as we get that as we get something that's more substantive to to present to the community Perhaps just to state the obvious here I think one of one of you know, my mind's full of this conference We went to today and one of the things we heard from A lot of communities is what makes hard conversations possible in communities What makes communities vibrant what makes communities successful is a shared story a shared vision of who they are And I think that there's because we have that articulated the planning commission is reviewing that language Of the strategic vision and you know checking in on that This was a document put together in 2015. Is this still our are these still our community values? Is there adjustments that need to be made? But the strategic advantage of having that that set of Goal statements so ingrained in the work we do already and continuing on in this master plan Perhaps with modernization or further detail. I think is a huge community advantage and something that other communities Quite honestly struggle to articulate And so I think while, you know, nothing's ever perfect. It's it's Pretty close to who we are and who we want to be and aligning the master plan to that Is going to be a real strength of this plan And it's continuing those public conversations that that have been happening in The commissions and in community dinners and in other visioning processes Questions for Eric or Jesse? Any questions comments concerns from the public So seeing hearing none, I appreciate you doing a much better job in 10 minutes than I have done in 30 or 40 minutes of rambling over the last couple months and giving updates on that. So thank you, Eric Thank you very much. Appreciate all your work Are you having fun on muski? Absolutely good. Eric's been with us now for two months three. Wow He's awesome Uh, all right next up is the marketing branding and website update I will turn this over to heather and Work this really In your packet, I gave you kind of a brief overview of where we've been so far with marketing and branding and website development This is one of the 2018 2019 policy priorities that were set at our meeting developing those strategies for this upcoming year So it is a priority to implement the marketing plan. It's also a priority to implement the new website, which is part of the marketing plan I'm happy to walk through the memo with you I'm just so the audience and people watching at home kind of have an idea of where we fit We completed a marketing and branding plan in july of 2018. That's when we received the deliverables The plan involves implementing the new branding developing a new website and establishing and launching the legacy campaign Which I'll talk about a little bit later The branding initiative resulted in revised city seal a legacy logo a brand position and brand story These are all illustrated and explained in this live presentation that falsely give you so I'm going to further them in that Development of a new website is underway and we last reported to you in june Just to let you know that we had selected civic plus to develop the new website Since then we've had three meetings with civic plus and we are moving right along in the process of developing the new website When we have a little bit more we haven't yet done the design content meeting So when we do a little bit of design, we'll come back to you so you can see how we're moving with that legacy campaign Is a lead up to the wanouski centennial in 2022 and what we're developing is a campaign structure That's kind of a story core structure that builds on a common shared narrative about wanouski So it's about 100 years of welcoming strivers It's about a tight knit community of neighbors and a culture of always trying to do better as a community and this campaign will be um A partnership between the city and a wide variety of stakeholder partners We've initiated outreach to some of the key stakeholder partners. We have a lot more to get in touch with It's our plan to have a steering committee ready and having their first meeting about november So over the course of the next month, we'll probably have that advisory committee together So if any of you have suggestions for people that you feel should really be part of that Please feel free to email that to me directly as i'm building that and developing it I've also included for you a timeline and next steps of what's coming up If you have any questions about that i'm happy to answer them and i'm going to turn it over to paul So if you can show you basically where we are with the website development What the results of the branding study were and how that will work with our website? Thank you, Heather Keep this pretty brief for you. Just go through We just slide Just a brief overview. So the the two Vendors we are working with right now. So for marketing and branding our partners engage strategies that process is now completed Mike bento from engage strategies was an absolute pleasure to work with he was he was really great I think a lot of our community members really enjoyed his outreach Again process was was very well Civic plus is our website development partner that process as Heather alluded to is ongoing. That's been really great They have their own sort of workflow to get into that That that whole process That's been really good to sort of be a part of It would normally be kind of chaotic, but they have a very structured process. That's been very cool It's the combined rollout and implementation for both of those things is february 2019 which Sounds a little farther away than it is. It's pretty close So deliverables from engage strategy include as shown here revised city seal. So that's for our general internal and external use You can see it's it's pretty close to what you're used to seeing as a matter of fact, it's it's very similar In both shape and design You know, we we wanted to keep pretty close to what people recognized as As the seal of musky. So again, that's sort of your general internal and external news You see it on the new website. You'll see it on all of your documents The other piece of that is the marketing initiative legacy campaign logo. So you see the musky It says 100 years there So that whole package basically includes a dedicated logo and implementation recommendations Just to sort of show you what that looks like operationally, so the sub and co branding these are examples of how the city will use that Will be co and sub branding with existing departments and programs So, you know an internal press releases and other things that the city uses You can see how the co branding works for the police and fire departments You know, we wanted to maintain use of those seals that they've been using the community for years now Works really well Some of the sub branding as far as interdepartmental stuff goes you can see it'll it'll you know Remain next to the seal is a community services department. None of that is recreation and parks So on and so forth some of the other deliverables allow us to begin work on stuff That we have It's been really great to put some of that stuff together Like a branding and style guide a social media usage guide that whole packet, which i'm currently finishing now Will include Guidelines for use of the city seal and the legacy campaign logo when we're ready to roll that out There's a special writing for multimedia section, which i'm super proud of That's pretty great And a social media guide that's sort of your your general ins and outs of rebranding. I think for any organization This is a snapshot of the legacy campaign. I think Heather pretty well rounded you out there So that begins in february coinciding with the new branding and the website launch The trademark registration is in progress. So that's exciting for the revised seal the legacy logo And the grand position which is Vermont's opportunity cities. You remember back to mike's presentation He went over a good chunk of that so i won't read you the brand position, but it's there for you It's in your packet Again the development of that is still in progress. So if you have any ideas or want to get involved in any kind of Larger way you are here for Deliverables from the website development process are kind of split up into two Factions so civic plus is the parent company The products that they provide are civic engage, which is your basic website package and then civic rec, which is your recreation management software you can do facility rental stuff and program registration It will effectively take over the current Platform we have now, which is my rec So sample features in Civic engage, which is your basic website package. You get a new and improved agenda in minutes center That's going to look amazing. We're really excited about that Searchable news and document archive Integrated online forms improved apartment pages professionally managed security and data protection. That's huge The way that we sort of manage that right now is with our fingers crossed i would say We do have we do have some securities in place and of course working with sim quest internally offers us a number of those services but this is An all-inclusive package that i feel really good about Obviously mobile friendly layouts. That's something we don't benefit from right now, but we will as you can see There's this little sample image there. It's not going to look exactly like that obviously but Are excited about that and then the easy to use facility rental and program registration platform You know you get those those easy one-click registrations through that through that one platform Does how about um access to online payment options? I mean I'm assuming you have to use a different widget for that anyway, right? So it's but easily easily integratable into the new size So there are there are a multitude of payment options. It's all it's all really vendor based and they're Their their platform is very modular in the way that they can work with either vendors. We have or vendors that they suggest But there there will be that great When you see vt.gov has been acquired so mission accomplished there And then just to give you a snapshot of the progress through website development the way that again Being in their system of management is another thing that that certainly Guided us to february. They have a really great Program to use called maven link. I won't worry with all of it But it's been really cool to go through that project process So the six stages you can see them there. We've gone through the initiation stage. That's great We are currently in the analyze slash design and configure. There's overlapping stuff You know, we have monthly meetings and check-ins and emails and there's a whole platform in which I Work with their team. It's basically its own messaging platform So just at those staff members and that's been really cool to go through that You can see we've been through a website content review and some of the other configurations Our design discovery meeting went really well. This is just kind of a snapshot of how they took Our color palette from the the marketing branding initiative. We were able to You know integrate that into the new site. So it's all going to look really great and really concise So two quick things to underline that paul just said that I think are important the Moving from when you ski vt.org to when you ski vt.gov is a professionalization and modernization approach Most government agencies have that dot gov Code I'm sure there's a word for them what that ending is And so our email addresses will also be changing to that as we change the website They will continue to be migrated over from org for a year plus So we won't we'll have that continuity but they will merge And then just as a reminder One of the advantages of going to civic plus is that they are An off-the-shelf municipal government website product. So they have Systems in place that have been tested and proven with municipalities across the country And regular updates that we have regular access to through our contract with them. So hopefully this process While it's a big overhaul now will be easily updated over the years of the contract Yes, civic plus has been the industry leader municipal websites for a number of years now and they were the clear choice when we went through the RFP process been really happy with The work that we've done with them and to just piggyback one other thing off that Similarly, we've been working on the the internal switch to the outlook exchange from the google suite As we're doing that, um, there is there is a change over from where all of the publicly more meeting documents Sort of our house now, but that'll all be sort of seamless and behind the scenes Each transition that will be Paul says it will be seamless because he is doing hours of work right now to ensure that it is And we continue to meet our open meeting law requirements even as we give up the g-suites Platform great. Well, that's certainly and it will benefit the public greatly having easy access Not just to those but to all the services and information options. So thank you All very much for your work on this too I don't think it can be stressed how important this can be for a municipality in the way we outward face the people that we serve. So Excited about it And an idea when they might have a beta site I would say Probably get to a process similar to beta testing through november How accessible that is to the people other than myself and the team? We'll have another update then for sure Yeah, I think It'll be an interesting process to see how they how they suggest we go through beta testing the website And we saw the legacy Logo before this how many people have seen this new one on the right? I would say this is the the first unofficial But but the steering committee has some key Partners in that logo has in the in the current logo. Do you want to talk about the steering committee and how this was considered if you could please? Yeah, um, we had partners stakeholders and I don't recall the entire list But some of the people we very specifically reached out to where the people would help to develop the previous logo So we wanted to be sure that that was developed in 2012 So we wanted to be sure that we weren't straying too far from a fairly recent planning process and that we were Holding on to the things that were most important to the community So that group gave feedback all the way through the process So both on the legacy campaign logo, but also on the revised city And that's part of the reason that we very much stuck with keeping the onions in there As it was an important piece of it and we had heard that repeatedly from people in the community So we just basically refreshed it so that it goes along with the legacy campaign logo as well Still the onion city underneath there questions comments for heather paul jesseon This has been something you guys worked hard on for a year plus now and took a lot of public feedback on there A lot of impotence. I thank you very much for I think taking all that and transforming it into something that's going to operationally have a big impact. So awesome Questions concerns comments from the public Yes, Ron For the record, Ron Stortan, chairman of the community services commission Paul, I saw an element that identified the community services department With the subterranean recreation of parks My concern probably relatively small is that that phrase is a bit limiting To the actual school of the department You know from my position as chair of the commission You know, I recognize that we have a much broader scope And I wonder if there's some way to modify that sub title a little bit to indicate the broader scope So if I could fit half fit every single one of the sub departments on here, I would have but obviously there will be The community services department and then there will be you know, the Winnieski Memorial Library So that'll be a different that'll take over that that that belowheading recreation in parks The senior center will have their own. It's just an example of how how you know, basically be So so this is specifically referring to the recreation and parks department So that's the branding for the recreation and parks department So it's speaking to it Additional elements for the other areas, okay If it was coming straight from from raised ask and it just said community services department, there wouldn't be I was you know Particularly interested in In knowing that there's going to be something to identify that I heard Absolutely and the senior center, of course, you know To important parts of our community So that's great. Yeah, thanks Thank you Yes, sir. So in 2012 that we govern the onion and we put scallions in there Yeah, yes Yeah, there was a there was a like marketing branding group five or six people got together back then and That's designed by a resident in town. She does the school newsletter and other things to the the current seal That's used most often So it's the scallions I believe it's wild release. Yes, they're actually wild leaks. They're not Who's going to be using the website because right now just you guys do the website, right? No, it's publicly available. So this is going to replace the venuskt.org So the the large public website where you'd go to find Somebody's information that's going on the community calendar The name of the department person you might want to contact if you've got an issue If you wanted to learn where dog licenses are due all that good stuff Okay, you bet Are there questions comments concerns? Good. Thank you guys for doing this update. Appreciate it. Look forward to hearing how things continue to progress. We'll be back. Thank you Yeah, uh, so next up is an annual tradition resolution for small business Saturday Yeah, so the city of honuski has been invited once again to participate in Demonstrating our commitment to our small local businesses by establishing November 24th, 2018 is small business Saturday small business Saturday Draws national attention to the important role that small businesses play in boosting our economy Creating jobs and maintaining our neighborhood character. And we've been participating in this for years and generally The downtown organization partners with us and Basically sets up shop and the hands out swag bags and really encourages people to visit our local businesses So and this is for the friday after no saturday after Thanksgiving. So after black friday small business saturday It's great and they recognize when you ski on their site too And like I said, they get a they give a lot of branded material that help help promote local businesses So that's great and our businesses have responded really positively to this in the past I'll do a reading of it and see first if there's any questions or concerns from council Any questions or concerns from the public When acknowledged downtown onuski and all your work calcy and your organization's work to support the business community And thanks for your help and support for this as well Is is the holidays approach? Um, it's a good thing to bring up. So the resolution reads whereas the governor of uh, When you ski rematch celebrates our local small businesses and the contributions They make to our local economy and community according to the united states small business administration They're currently 30.2 million small businesses in the united states. They represent 99.7 of all businesses with employees in the united states Are responsible for 65.9 of the net new jobs created from 2000 2017 We're a small business employee 47.5 percent of the employees in private sector in the united states and 90 percent Of consumers in the united states say small business saturday has a positive impact on our community And whereas 89 percent of consumers who are aware of small business saturday say the day encourages them to shop small year long And whereas 73 percent of consumers who reportedly shop small independently owned retailers and restaurants have small business saturday They did so with their friends and family and whereas the most reported reason for consumers who were Aware of the day to shop and dine at small independently owned saturday was to support their community 64 And whereas when you ski vermont supports our local businesses that create jobs boost our local economy and preserve our communities And whereas advocacy groups as well as the public and private sector organizations across the country have endorsed The saturday after thanksgiving a small business saturday Therefore i seth learned mayor of when you ski vermont do hereby proclaim November the 24th 2018 a small business saturday And urge the residents of our community and the communities across the country to support small businesses and merches on small business saturday and throughout the year I can do so by proclamation only with the support of the city council So with that I entertain a motion in regards to the resolution establishing November the 24th 2018 a small business saturday So Motion by howl second by eric any further discussion So you can hear none. All those in favor, please say aye. Aye and those opposed Motion carries Thank you. Thanks for your work. Kelsey. Thank you for your work Right item e discussion approval mires pool engineering services agreement So i'm gonna Have john come up. This is really the first This is the next step in the mires pool project and just want to acknowledge that this is really kind of the transition point of this project from Solely a commute or not solely but a community services driven project to a capital project therefore sitting with dpw and our city engineers So john's now taking the lead but very much with rey and community services as kind of the client representing the community's needs So this is for The next phase of design and basically all the way through construction for the mires pool renovation project So it covers five main tasks design development work Which we'll get to sort of final design document construction documents that will be used for bidding permitting task for All the permits required for the structure pool And then of course going out to bid And then construction administrative services So and that covers all the way through to the end of construction So the total price to warm some costs for engineering services is 305,000 and then We do anticipate there will be a Three to five thousand dollar administrative costs for the bond anticipation Just to say a little more about that so To move forward with this project now The team has come to the position that we really do need to do a bond anticipation note The earliest we could bond for this would be with the winter bond issuance in january Which means that next month we would have to be setting the total amount of what to bond So are we going to raise the you know the 300,000 dollar challenge you've given to the fund raising committee You're going to hear a grant application following this. Are we going to get that? If we wait until july for the summer bond issuance We'll have some answers to those questions if we can bond less Our debt entry our debt Costs lower over time So to do a bond anticipation note will allow us to have funds to cover this work that we need to do now between now and in july While still being reimbursable by the bond. So if you remember the bond resolution you signed It was a bond and reimbursement resolution. So it allows us to pay ourselves back for costs We incur before we issue the bond And if Obviously if the if something happens the bond's not done then then we pay we have a 300,000 dollar bill We'll have a Okay, we'll have a payable that needs to be addressed Okay How well So the reason we're bringing this forward now is in our past conversations back I think the first meeting in september and thinking about how to move forward We heard that the intention of the council was to continue on the schedule to enable the pool to open as the public understood In order to do that we need to keep moving forward with engineering So we are so the risk we take as the mayor just said is that 300,000 dollar Cost for this now if for whatever reason we decided Not to go forward with construction the construction element of this Product if this contract would go away We wouldn't have incurred those costs. So while we would have to pay the debt service on it for the life of the ban We obviously wouldn't have to Pay for the construction cost of this contract That's what I was just trying to ask is The staged payouts and whether or not I mean I see those 1.0 point 2.0 but So we um We would so for example if we went through Two construction documents and then that was it We would not be required to pay those last three tasks If we weren't we're going to go to bonding construction and it seemed like that They just kept using the word lump sum which Was interesting to me instead of staged progress payments. Yeah, it's sort of lump sum per task. I guess you can say okay But are they gonna ask To me it looked like it's it's payable up front and then they're gonna do the work. Is that am I wrong about that or is it Tasked upon completion because work will be billed to the performance should not exceed with a prior approval But then it's got Again this lump when I hear lump sum it usually means up front lump sum period the end right is is am I reading that incorrectly? So the way um, just because I've I've sat on the other side of the table as an engineer, uh, typically what what you would see from From the proposal is you'd get a bill for okay your 10 percent or 25 percent through design development So you'd get um, you know monthly payments based on their progress and they would be up to that lump sum amount Say 62,000 I'm just asking a different way So the difference is the lump sum means this is what we're going to pay for as opposed to a time and materials contract Often you'll see some if it's not written like this It's written as We think this is going to take a hundred hours, but you're going to pay for it on time of materials So if it takes 120 hours, you're going to pay for under 20 takes 80 hours You're going to pay for any the lump sum just means this is the amount you're going to pay for that phase Okay, and I guess just in the course of this too I think for this body to know how those expenditures are going at a pace so that They can also use that as a benchmark to help them understand when decisions And final triggers really need to be pulled. I think would be helpful That's on right Just so the decision is not made a week late that you know would have $100,000 So I think this is probably a question for us is Why we couldn't have The total amount by january So jesse was saying the bond anticipation note because we Won't know by january what the total amount is we want to bond for so to to get a bond closing in january We have to file the application in november So we'd have to know in a month the total amount we were going to bond So the and you're right. This is a question for you all in theory we can bond We have authorization to bond the entire amount in january I think it's my perception is that it's a hard community lift to go back to the fund raising committee and get a guaranteed Dollar amount from them in the next month, and we won't know about this grant application. You're about to hear next So the question is we could bond that full amount With the information we know now we'd essentially need to bond the full amount in december or in january knowing in november what the number was Or we can go through this process and know more definitively in May for the july bond issuance what that actual number will be and therefore lower our debt service costs over time with a build to The build sorry the build grant Yeah, that's on main street. Yeah Oh the impacts of the bill grant. Yes, absolutely. Mm-hmm. Yeah But you're right christine in theory that is that is a policy question for you all of do you want to go forward with the The winter bond vote in which case we likely wouldn't need to do the span The bond anticipation though has the fund raising committee offered any Feasibility figures. I mean What might be possible? What's the market? um The short answer there is no um met with them It's about a month ago. I guess now And they're continuing to do kind of in person asks one-on-one asks But they haven't for me sophistication level haven't gotten to that point now. Okay And I don't want to speak for them I know they do have some funds committed or say that they do but I don't feel like If that's their story to tell at this point, um, and honestly don't know kind of where they're at But I think it buys them some time which is a which is possible to kind of this approach And Jesse said that we don't bond for money. We don't end up needing So the impression that I had after we discussed this last time is that we had reached some consensus that That dollar amount would I can't remember exactly what it was for those certain items like Community room and slide and stuff that those were contingent upon fund raising and we would not bond for that Or put that as a city obligation If that is something that we Have consensus on Then I think we do have an idea of What the final number is um I don't know what the impact is if we get grant funding then to You know, if you do an early like a large early payment like with by the laws Not Yeah bondholders like their Money on time, but not really I mean in theory we'd have to talk to the funder about this if we were to get that grant in theory we could Put that money into account that we used to pay debt service over time And pay that down so we don't have to allocate other dollars to pay it You would encourage it So and Am I correct are there other I guess liabilities with doing the ban Other than if for some reason the project were to not move forward being on the hook for that amount of money I'd like to any timeline concerns any financial impacts I mean there there is interest we pay on the short-term note. That's the three to five thousand dollar Costs that we wouldn't otherwise incur I would be inclined to absorb I I appreciate and I I don't think that you're incorrect. I think that that to me That we said we were going to do that baseline amount. That's what it was I I do think that given some of the other balls in the air that If it's not an overly absorbent administrative burden from a functional standpoint that Paying the three to five thousand dollars to keep that flexibility is worth it Because there's still a lot of unknown balls in the air and those two projects merging together and frankly we've had one Really in-depth conversation in regards to how The staged implementation of the project would look on mainstream conjunction with the pool and That sort of larger global financial picture And how we might stack that or stage that tax impact over multiple years So I think it's a I think it's a worthwhile cost the three to five thousand dollars But I but I don't feel I I agree with you. I don't want to make that clear from yeah Yes, that decision was already made And I don't like throwing three to five thousand dollars away, but I'm concerned that if we make a commitment there could be something that backfires in doing so Because we haven't I don't it doesn't feel like we've wrapped up all especially the tax staging conversation Well, couldn't it be that the amount we would pay in interest If we were to bond for the hundred and fifty thousand that we wouldn't need if the grant comes through would be significantly more than three to five thousand Yes Yeah I agree with the sentiments around the table. I have a less related question um in this the In the memo here it says um Goal to have a construction budget that will be approximately 3.4 million I can't I don't have The budget details with me that we've seen them before but I was under the impression that like this work here Is part of that 3.4 million versus an additional 300 000 for like this pre work Am I mistaken? Correct. So the the engineering proposal was uh, I think a percentage Yeah Okay, I just want to make sure we're not looking at there's not an addition to you What wasn't this 3.4 plus the 300 gets you to 3.9 I mean that math doesn't totally work out the way that there's another Yeah Did we because we're at three points. So the bond for was for 3.9 million So of that 3.9 what was in samson is now is saying is 3.4 of that 3.9 million is construction This 300 000 is part of that delta and then there's another is there another I don't know where that two delta comes in that 200 000 That could be the VE options the value engineering options potentially the value engineer proposal was 3.582 and then the The reduced the really low one was 3.293 And then the original was 3.913 that's on crack So we were going with the 3.582. Yeah I don't have the big sheet from the last presentation. This is from the promotional material slide that we used the last one but But I think to christine's point then Do we just walk through with the 3.4? in coordination with the potential 300 000 plus would be The approximate 3.5 is based on strategic interface the gold out of country would be probably 3.4 So the you're talking about the full scope for this proposal. So when we spoke with weston sams the scope Was the VE option Basically that the option I think we're just trying to figure is there The 3.582 Was value engineered and then the additional 300 plus thousand was going to come from the community fundraising, right? So the 3.4 to 5.82 Is the 180 thousand dollars just that get worked out or is that In some additional costs somewhere outside of this contract in relation to the pool What's in samson or that with a different number? Okay. Yeah. Well, it's less than the the 3.5 eight 3.582 so If that's the case, that's not a bad thing. Is it I'm sorry Right if it includes this 300 000, but if it doesn't then we're we're talking about 3.7 now It also I mean it's listed in in task number one to present potential value engineered options And so then now I'm curious is that Not included in 3.4 already or is it? So one of the pieces in this proposal is Is The community fundraising so it's going to be designed assuming Community fundraising goals and then once we get to say bid document phase those items will either remain Or get pulled out. So I think That's what's referred to as sort of the options And also careful to there's a goal for a construction budget. It's not similar to the construction construction budget is Yeah, until until we get bids, that's That's my rule now for sure Okay, and This feels like the question asked every time if we don't fund until July What is the impact on our? You know the opening schedule for the pool So there wouldn't by by starting engineering working now there would not be an impact I mean if we don't if we don't do this and we wait until July to even start the engineering work If we wait until July then I believe that's That's a pretty significant just lost in time in engineering Um, I don't know exactly like How it would impact the construction slide. Yeah, well, I think we would not be starting construction next summer Yeah, this probably won't be starting connections construction next summer. Anyway, we would be starting construction. Maybe the fall of 2020 So we would be opening the fall of 2021 or 2022 So we'd lose a summer season But to the point of why we chose to go this route. This is not work. The age is out This is work that once invested upon could be used for the project A year from now two years from now So the I think the the decision Fronting this cost the reason we made that decision the rationale reasoning part of it was We know this is going to get done at some point So we could go ahead and do this keep and try to keep with the ambitious Timeline if it doesn't work out that way because of other decisions. This body makes that's fine But the general sense is eventually at some point We're going to build a pool whether it's starting in the actual eye or the one after that or I don't want to get into that but right This is a transferable non aging Work. I mean at some point it ages out, but other questions comments concerns I think circling back with clarity on the numbers and that 3.4 and what that means in relation to those other things is a big takeaway on this So we are I am comfortable with you tabling this for tonight and we can come back to you at the next meeting with specifics on those numbers if you would like Yeah, this tabling slowing thing down It went not for two weeks. Yeah Okay, you can work out here. It sounds like there were a couple other term details that you guys were gonna poke at anyway. Yeah, we just had some uh, not scope related, but general terms and conditions stuff And obviously staying with weston and samson versus going out abroad or they've done the previous work Okay, there's not like a ton of people in this field anyway. I just What else anything else to bring back on that? Um, I mean I was looking at like the exclusions list It mentions hazardous analysis and geotechnical testing. I I believe those already happened with the previous. Okay. I just wanted to confirm that um And then I note that it says No changes to pool program which involve adding removing or altering size um Similarly for bathhouse building changing footprint or layout. So we're not talking about changing the footprint or layout of the bathhouse, right? Like that's already part of this print. Yeah um and I would just say to your point about this being like doesn't age out If there was um for the discussion around Like the pools themselves This is just like really committed to what the exact thing that we see right now But without with only those things that we've already talked about value engineering Potentially out So is your concern that other items? I just wanted to be to make that clear that like what we're saying like this is a committal to What the proposal is as it is with only the value of engineering that we have already discussed Yeah, it's the ve model and that's that's what was just Said I think clarifying that dollar amount. It will be helpful Okay, that's that's it If you think of other questions too since it's coming back to as you look through it shooting to jesse and john Uh questions comments concerns from the book Did we already wrote on the pool? He did We took uh Yeah So the full the full I'll say ideal build out for the pool was 3.9 million dollars So council decided to put forward a bond proposal that would cover that entire amount Um Concurrent with that conversation. We also had some value engineering done basically we said What would it take to? Rebuild a similar structure without the same type of components that were being proposed namely a slide and some other things We basically looked at those and said okay, if we if we remove those items We can get it back down to a little bit more of affordable level So we got down to 3.5 million instead of 3.9 million There's been a group that's expressed interest in fundraising So there's been a conversation back and forth. Well, how much should we raise? So we said we removed these kind of value engineered items If you guys want to add those back in to get back closer to that 3.9 million dollars Here's your fundraising goal, which was three hundred and sixty eight thousand dollars I'll talk to you somewhere around there So we turned back to them and said here's your goal Good luck And we're committing at this point in time to building the structure With the value engineered items removed like the the large slide is the biggest item help me out Community room was another big one cool heaters just want But I think just to be clear as we're doing the design work and engineering work It's easier to design the full thing and go back and peel stuff out at the end versus design The sort of shortcut version and then add those on after so we're going to work with the engineer to do the full design And then as we get closer to the funding decision if the money's there Depending we'll take things off the design accordingly if that makes sense I just want to reconfirm what I recall that we discussed last time was the value engineering version Plus the fundraising items reduction. So it would have been less than 3.582 The total that we were talking about So that could be where the 3.4 comes from I don't know I believe the value engineering was more in like material selection things along those lines Right. Yeah. So there is that included like, um, you know Something about like I just remember there were tiles in there that were fancy for no reason So the so the total if I can jump in the total original was 3.92 Yes, that's what was bonded for up to um that amount The value engineered version that again took off some of the surface treatments the extra materials Like you said the fancy tiles that maybe we didn't need got us to about 3.6. I think it was that 3.58 number We were I think for sake of easy math saying 3.6 Um, there's also another iteration where if you peel back the community room the slide And I think the heaters was the third big element that gets you to a number of about 3.3 So that's where that three hundred thousand three hundred sixty eight thousand dollar fundraising goal came in So my you know, I think to to reflect back. I think this word said, yeah 3.3 In that area is where the bonding level comfort is That additional three hundred three hundred sixty eight thousand would need to come in as fundraising dollars to get those pieces kind of Retained in the design. So that's my fault. I looked at the wrong one and referenced the wrong numbers. Okay. Yes Yes, this is exactly what I recall Right So now I'm not going to restate that what he said was correct Any other questions comments concerns, okay, thank you guys appreciate it Uh, all right next up from outland conservation fund grant mars pool renovation project So, um Excited to bring this opportunity forward. Um, definitely wanted to discuss it here and kind of get council's take but this is a federal pass through opportunity that at this point cycles through every two years now with the state of ramon through the department of parks forests and recreation, um, so interestingly, this is one of the major funding sources that Funded the pool when it was originally built back in 1972. So you got a grant for just over a hundred thousand dollars at that point Unfortunately at the time that covered most of the cost of the project Times have changed. So that is not the case now, but we are hopeful that we can go for Up to a hundred fifty thousand dollars within the the grant pool this year. It's Looking through the last sort of 40 years of grant awards. They range everywhere from $10,000 to I think the high water mark was $260,000. So it's really all over the board Realistically the number of projects funded in that 40 years span that exceed a hundred thousand dollars was pretty scant More more of the mend in the sort of 80s 90s 70 thousand dollar range. So I think 150 is an ambitious ask, but I think it's worth going for But just to be clear, that's an up to amount. So They may welcome back with partial funding or recommend that because again, they try to spread that funding around the state From a process perspective, there's a pre-application due on october 15th. So that's Largely what we're here tonight to seek permission to go ahead and submit That triggers a site visit with the staff from the state That manages the grant they'll come on site and kind of walk through the facility make sure there's no whammy's there for us And then at that point would would invite a full application. Those are due december 17th One other piece and we talked about this grant a couple years ago in relation to the dog park But just important to note the land water conservation fund funds come with Requirement that the land that is funded Is retained as recreational facility in perpetuity For us because that's already the case given that this was funded by that funding source 40 years ago It's not an additional requirement on the property. But just so that that's out there clear You know, we talked about the dog park. Ultimately, we decided not to go for that grant because for the money We would have gotten that's a big commitment for a long time. So Again, they're just important to call that out Great and good luck. I hope it goes well And if this body needs to do something to support this being a but for funding stream, if you know what I mean Please let us know if that puts additional That additional clarity is needed For the body that makes that funding decision because they like to be about for money Um Other questions concerns comments from council I have a technical question There's I can't remember exactly where it's at, but there's some some requirement in here that All of the property is supposed to be outdoor recreation related and I wondered if Having a community room on there fits within that use or if that is a conflict actually So good question. So this has definitely funded a number of swimming pools over the last 40 years Unfortunately, the list just has sort of their project title So it doesn't get into the nitty gritty about did it fund the slide or the bath house or whatever Um I would say I don't think that that's going to be an issue I could certainly check through the pre-application process and again That's where those kind of details get teased out. Um, the pre-application is a one pager It's just a paragraph summary of the project and a funding request and then when they come on site That's really where you can hash out those details. So I'll definitely make sure to ask that question Um, but it's a good point. I think especially Seth with the but for a piece That's one of the pieces that Would be I think potentially about four if if this grant doesn't come through that may or may not happen So I can definitely ask for some clarity there Thanks. Yeah, good question High leveraging of municipal investment taking place. So hopefully that helps us score Other questions comments concerns any questions concerns comments from the public Yes, Ron But it's probably important to go after grants like this Wherever possible it will help to satisfy the community public That the council is trying as best possible to reduce the overall impact on taxes So I think it's a good thing to try for these grants Thank you You know, it's just it's a tough field. There's not a lot of federal dollars available for swimming pools. It's just not Not something that has the same amount of funding available as other recreation stuff. So It's a tougher field, but thanks for finding them and pursuing them Other questions comments concerns from the public Okay So seeing and hearing none Uh, I would entertain a motion for approval of the submission of the motley and water conservation fund grant miles of Myers pool renovation projects Second motion by Eric second by christine any further discussion Seeing and hearing none all those in favor, please say aye. Aye. And those opposed motion carries Thank you All right. Next up is uh, FY 20 budget goals So, um, at your Um last week You approve the schedule of the FY 20 budget process Angel has been hard at work starting to build out The basics of the FY 20 budget and tomorrow the department heads get their individual budgets and start working on them before that happens, we wanted to come to you and See if you would be willing to set some FY 20 budget goals and our key questions. This is in the memo outlined For you to consider tonight is Are what is the council's tax rate goal for FY 20? What are your priority areas to fund given that we may need to identify cuts to reach your tax rate goals? What are your priority areas for service reductions? And are there any new initiatives or programs that you'd like us to consider as we build the budget? Related to these questions is our recommendation that the operations budget be built um outside of consideration of any in any tax rate increases we might be seeing as a result of the capital Capital projects as we've talked about through those bond votes In preparation for this discussion, we put together some data for you about what our Current municipal tax rate is and how it's increased over the last couple of years as well as what tax rate impacts mean So just a reminder In FY 19, which we're currently in A one percent increase in the tax rate equals One penny and 1.07 of a penny. So almost a penny. It's almost a one to one ratio in the and the Equivalent to that in general fund dollars is $50,300 of non-tiff related general non-tiff related general fund growth This year a million dollars Of additional grand list growth. So if we see a project a new project go up in the city That's valued at a million dollars assessed at a million dollars That equals 10,700 into the grand list. So you see the how those two things equate So just to throw out some initial f y 20 assumptions we are making so several of our contracts as well as our practices have Um staff getting cola increases annually cola is running as you may know because unemployment is very low And a variety of other economic factors cola is running quite high right now. So we are anticipating a 2.8 percent Increase being built into the budget which has a value of about a hundred and thirty two thousand For the f y 20 budget. So that's not great news. That's you know, almost three and a half percent increase unto itself Um Better news is that we got very good news about our health insurance increases Our projections right now are showing only a 2.5 percent increase Which if you've tracked health insurance increases over the last A couple of years we've been seeing 8 percent increases 12 percent increases 9 percent increases So 2.5 is great news and calculates to only 13 thousand dollars increased based on our current enrollment in benefits We anticipate moving forward with our non union wage adjustment plan. We are seeing workers compensation increases Across the state driven by claims also by changes in firefighter workers compensation Rate philosophy changes We are contemplating as you heard talk at the last Meeting about the spinner lawsuit about the reduced wcdc payment to ourselves Which we implemented for f y 19 and our living within for f y 19 So we anticipate coming back with a similar recommendation for f y 20 We also Contemplate coming back with a continued commitment to the community outreach team Which is was an ad last year or at this current year that we're in and what is proving very successful There are a couple of other f y 20 budget ads that we perceive a need for Those are around The gender county public safety authority, which our community voted to enter into on town meeting day So there are two ads as we consider potential implementation of that in f y 20 One is the capital and operational investment. We need to make to stand up that new entity And the other is any potential local staffing changes. We will need to see Given that we will no longer have dispatchers sitting here 24 7 We have also had conversations about expanding the rental registry to include the wunewski housing authority units Currently, we don't inspect those and the as you know wunewski housing authority is a Amazing community partner provides a lot of housing stock in our community and we'd like to bring them into the rental registry fold And then as last year we built a salary contingency into the budget and anticipate doing that again this year Below in the next three sections of your memo, we've bulleted out other areas for potential Funding that we've heard in conversations over the last Year or other conversations we're having internally and i'm happy to kick through those or let you read them and then Other items we want you to keep in mind as you think about f y 20 are You know moving forward on town mean day with a conversation about local options tax or or multiple with just one Um, as you know for f y 19 We brought the o'brien community center into the general fund the continuation of that with leasing The leases we've put into place or we'll be putting into place And then the potential of a parking garage bond vote for the tiff district With the idea that that hopefully is a net neutral impact to our tax It is that it will absolutely be net neutral To the tax rate It will still be a public bond vote that we will have to consider as part of the town meeting day ballot so I think it's important to call out As part of this conversation, but you're right no tax rate impact Just doing people thinking wait we're building a garage too with tax dollars So lots want to come on that um Do you want to quickly talk through any of the ads? Uh, since we maybe haven't seen or yep um, so the um So we have a section here called f y 20 budget ads for consideration So these are things either we've heard from you or we've been thinking about um So we've had a lot of conversations as a team about Affordable housing and standing up on affordable housing trust fund Often municipalities will allocate dollars to trust funds as either seed money or to demonstrate a community commitment Um, so that's what is meant there um, we have some concerns as a staff team about taking on um, main street pool a parking garage General cip improvements and our capacity especially if we are going to leverage significant state and federal dollars And have to do grant reporting with our capacity to do that between public works and finance We also sadly are losing our very part-time accounting clerk um, and so there might be some to make that a more Retent uh position we're better able to uh retain May make some sense to expand that role to do some of this grant moderating monitoring if we're running You know multi-million dollar cip projects all at the same time Our camera system and server system Citywide is very dated. Um, it needs replacement We anticipate that downtown wanouski will be coming in with an additional funding request Um, we have had a conversation between staff team and council about engagement and breaking down barriers to participation in the council and commissions So we were brainstorming ideas of how We do that and if there are financial implications, for example, we've talked about Realigning the commission meeting structure to be the same night and providing dinner and child care and that would come with a budget ad Other communities I have worked in have considered have purchased technology for the council right now You all are using technology, but it is your own technology So that may be perceived as a as a barrier to entry for somebody who wanted to serve in a council role And of course we're having a conversation about increased training for the commission and council um, the fire department is having a conversation with the State as well as going through training for themselves about plans review So right now we contract or the state provides Building plans review after projects are locally permitted for building for zoning Uh regulations so then once we finish it gets transferred over to the state There are communities that do that internally with their own folks And as we become as we continue to develop and continue our professionalization That is something we may want to think about pulling back into the city The fire chief is looking at an assistance to firefighters grant Which is similar to a cops grant where you can get funding to support fire staffing As you know, we continue to Um make work but struggle with the Reality that we are not a full-time fire department and have folks who are solely on call to us responding There are difficult hours of the day to cover specifically the work day when most of our firefighters are Often other communities responding and is there a way we could build some capacity To provide that coverage We are looking at a shift in our hra fsa benefit, which would have a $1,200 cost It would be solely for the purposes of improved customer service to our employees The superintendent of schools and i and christine and sath have been having a conversation about communication and how we best Leverage the school newsletter which goes into every mailbox in the city to communicate about what we're doing And talking with a superintendent about that that certainly is a Very important tool in our community to get the message out about what's happening And if we're going to be using it as a city newsletter in conjunction with a school newsletter Could we contribute some amount to making that happen every month currently? We do not And then we currently budget about $2,000 a year for tree service and maintenance. We're actually spending um More than that. Um, and we have seen this year with john's leadership a number of pretty problem trees that have Resulted in an emergency treatment needed as opposed to kind of regular maintenance that may have prevented that So really believing that our urban canopy is important Um and needing to budget some money for that So those are our Current considerations for ads um, okay, um Because angela's here, um angela, you want to come up? No, I Just I would like angela to come up. I can you remember where we sit on current fund balance just for a total picture 360 000 So remaining on a sign from fy 17 is 368 thousand I've not yet finalized fy 18's numbers, but it's looking at an additional 150 right now So just to point out to the you know, the reason I'm asking that question is there's a number of these these are operational items and um, you know, we've taken a stance the last couple of years anyway, um to not use one time money to um pad the budget and That's generally the smart wise practice To take but I do want to put that number in there from a context standpoint because I do think that we're going to probably end up having to have a conversation about how that could play into Lower and long-term debt service on some of these large capital projects. Um, I Due to those amounts And that's That's something I think is You know, we can't have that conversation obviously on the fly But I think what would be interesting is to hear back I mean the hard part is is that's that's what addresses things when they come up and opportunities Um, so I think it would be good for us to have that conversation about what a reasonable structured amount might be Um from your perspective jesse in terms of keeping something back potentially So those amounts, uh, do not count the council's policy for fund balance So that 30 days cash on hand is not included in those. So you do still have some great cash available Yeah, for some operational It's more of you know The fire the fire station roof goes out right and we need $40,000 on the fly to take care of that I think it's the shift in thinking That we've done in the last couple of years from uh, you allocate out the fund balance to it becomes the savings account for the things that emerge You know the massive roof leak for example, or a grant match You know often grants will come with match match requirements that we don't actively budget because they're not purely operational their one time costs So leaving ourselves some ability to have be nimble With that savings account. I think is valuable beyond just the cash on hand You know ensuring that we have enough to make payroll for a couple of months, etc right I just I think it might be interesting to throw back into that conversation to potentially if if that reduction somehow gives us some operational Revenue breathing room by reducing debt service on long-term debt I could never Do it. I could never spend that money on operational costs and good cautious. I think that's just fiscally wrong um on an annual basis I could see potentially investing some of it towards a capital project that then reduces the city's long-term debt service Obligation, but I don't want to have that conversation without you guys having time to really think through Okay, if you're going to do that or think about doing that we would recommend at least leaving this behind Um out of those dollars, so it's not You know totally leaving the covered spare but if we're at you know I mean those two Numbers combine half million There may be some flexible. Sorry. That's nimble. I don't appreciate that If I believe just looking back in the other document before tonight's meeting We were guesstimating when we had the initial tax conversation around four percent, right? was kind of the stated goal going into the conversation about What operation would be necessary to maintain and sustain operations for this year and that seems pretty reflective of this document too Uh, I will share with you guys, uh, nicole did submit formal written statements on two items Tonight the last two items on the agenda. Um, that she did want shared um, and then fy 20 20 budget nicole gets to speak first Um, she said I need I I believe we need to limit growth the tax rate to main street and pull projects costs Plus the lowest amount necessary to cover increases in salary benefits Do not think we're in a position to expand programs or services at this time Unless we can propose potential cuts to a program we're shifting around Um, and then I think she's got another offline item to talk about with you about specific program outcomes I'll have her connect on it's It's not really relevant since Sorry, Seth. Can you just read that one more time? I got blanked out there for a minute Well, she was basically saying the project cost so the new debt service on main street and pool plus salary and benefits And was just saying, you know, didn't see room for programming Unless there was shifting of programming like we're going to cease doing this and start doing this I was unclear about the the capital and the salary benefits of that. That's helpful. Thank you Anything else I could share some reflections about this, you know in the past In the past we haven't given to staff a hard cap To work with going into the budget season um, you know last year where it was Our first foray into that kind of general conversation and we were kind of like one to two percent ish Going into it, but I think guidance this year Is a lot more important and needed and necessary and fairness because we've got the debt service That's also going to be hitting the tax rate at the same time I would be curious to hear At a high level how like in 16 17 18 We were able to float around one percent increase Which I believe is like below coal every single year alone The only one here for these budgets, okay Yeah, so the way we've done budgeting in the city for quite some time is that we've asked for a net zero impact budget the net zero impact budget. It was basically to the staff Do everything that you're doing To the best of your ability keep that intact in the budget while Proposing a budget that's a net zero impact to the tax payers So what we then did was we created a list of items that were this is what we had to remove To get to that budget And we would decide are we going to restore any of those items and then staff Would bring back, you know the things we discussed previously about what might be added to the budget So there were a number of things over those years that were cut out cut down I'll say that, you know, we really took a scalpel And got down to the bone when it comes to padding the budget by and large So that it really, you know, we took things down lower and lower and lower So and there were a number of things that were just eliminated over time that were just cut out So that's how we ended up getting there You know, the discussion has always been we're we're bleeding a rock at this point though You know that now it's there's no more padding to cut out And so that when there's just natural inflation or increases and things There's nothing else to there's nothing else to slice. There's nothing else to to get out. We can't lower You know the ten thousand dollars that's actually only using, you know In office supplies that we're only actually using two thousand dollars of that line And doesn't exist with that level variance anymore And that's why when we review things like the fund balance where it comes from the fund balance Right now is almost solely from staffing, right? It's almost solely from Usually staffing vacancies or use of health insurance less than anticipated And for that for folks to understand at home when we say fund balance It's the amount we budgeted versus what we spent and when we've got money left over at the end of the year There's fund balance if you've got a big fund balance of 700 thousand dollars at the end of the year and it's Padding in budget. That's not good. We've gotten the point where now really all of our stuff is not padding. It's operational Does that make sense? I mean I said relatively in the same boat as the coal that if we are Anticipating this pool of mainstream these very large projects That we are not in a position to add additional programming to the city You know if we're looking at four percent just for these assumptions And we've already floated Another four percent for main street and I think the pool is like six Like that's too high and that's a number. I'm not comfortable with Obviously we have a lot more work to do with main street in the pool But I wouldn't want to put us in a position where we are already talking about the six percent just for operational costs That really doesn't leave any room for that work that voters have already said they want us to move forward with I think like When I'm looking at the ads needed I wonder about that like you're talking about the unassigned funding for one-time costs if that's applicable to this The initial investment for the transition for public safety Um, so maybe that is would not be a factor here I wonder about Inspection on the Lewinsky housing authority units. Is that something that they're not already doing themselves? No Are these just I like what is then I'm wondering what is the need there or if it's something that could be There was a there was a lack of understanding on parties' behalf that they do fall under the jurisdiction of the city's inspection program They get inspected by other entities and their assumption has long been that that satisfied their fire requirements It actually does not so Um, I let their board know that that was an issue last month and flagged that for them so And I I think the point this this is a laundry list of things that we're going to hear much more detail on Um The point of including that in this list is likely that would not be a tax rate Impact likely the fees we would newly charge to wha would cover that increased Operations having said that it is Quite a significant ad in our community So I wouldn't feel comfortable doing that without you all Knowing that that was our intention for service delivery and kind of blessing that new service delivery Does that make sense? Yeah, totally I would I would say that um Like even with these assumptions even with just the four percent Before operation costs doesn't leave us in a good position Yeah, well It's going to cost more to run the city every year than it did last year So that's reality. So you've got one or two choices You either do that or you Tell people what to cut and that's And that's that's what it is Other concerns thoughts comments questions for jesse Yeah, I I guess just to try to kick off You know tomorrow is I I think the message has to be we just don't have a lot of room this year We're just not from a debt capacity standpoint going to be in a position to to be As a reactive and open to new requests as we have in the past And that anything or one seeking funding from the city should be aware of that and think of Creative solutions You know and that that's You know, I look at the downtown in a ski request You know sidewalk fee hasn't changed in how long, you know, and that's a Again, we're talking about one person increase. We want to be mindful of what we're passing on to our business owners, but that's That's maybe an alternative methodology of of addressing that issue But No, that's what he's saying. Yeah. Yeah, so I'm saying that might be that might be an alternative to address Yeah, I think the position I don't want to be in is to see service or program cuts and I because of these bond items that we've decided to Move forward with and I think I've been pretty consistent in saying that from my perspective as we went through those bond votes Um, so while I agree that there is not Much or perhaps any room for growth. I don't want to see I'll start to roll back What I think staff already does an amazing job providing considerable amount to our community With the resources that we have and I think that I would not feel comfortable restricting those resources Do we want to say Instead of net zero level services is a more fair approach That's what I feel comfortable with I'd like to see that Yeah How are we doing city manager net not net zero but level services That is lovely and I think you know if there is something that you're feeling really passionate about That is somewhere on one of these lists from a staffing perspective and there's room to Shift around prioritization within that department or whatever that might be. I'm still really open to that Yeah, but I like the concept of level services And that's that's exactly what nicole had placed in hers too is if it's a adjustment of Service provision to better meet the needs of the community totally understandable but in terms of creating growth and Land expenditures, that's a challenge without the coming from somewhere else because I think there are of course still areas in need of growth in services we provide to Residents but there's just not the room for that this year considering we have to be Good stewards of the public And the impact that this has on people's walls Thank you very much The other thing I I did not say out loud that I should have said in my intro is that this is also outside yet of the process of Eric and john oddy sitting down with our city assessor and coming up with some very Based in reality assumptions about grand list growth, which obviously is the other half of the this equation So that's what you don't have in front of you yet And that's what we'll do in the next couple of weeks. So if that changes significantly then we've been averaging between A half a percent increase and a point eight percent increase if that changes significantly We'll come back to you and say we have more I don't believe it will But we'll certainly call that out if that becomes a reality But this was very helpful. Thank you and you know The other thing that I would like Just to turn back towards us just to ensure that You know, we don't let our Hands off the hook is that You know, this council also needs to we need to be Swift and decisive in making decisions about revenue generating things in this and making Very clear choices and decisions when it comes to things like property transfers that the city's holding on to but Whether or not we support something like the one percent tax or sales tax, which I think we've all expressed Appreciation or support for as part of the funding package for main street, but I think there are nuances there Yeah, I think that I think though that we're going to have more of those decisions and opportunities to move forward with potential revenue sources revenue generating tax stabilizing Projects in the future and that we need to be really mindful of that as we move into those discussions that we are dealing with a financial reality that You know to keep up with growth. Just the growth in basic service provision We better be prepared to be about four percent per year, which if you do the math on you know, what you need from a just a growth standpoint in your Grand list 10,000 per million and if you're at four percent at 200 thousand dollars doesn't take Too much math to say you need about 20 million dollars in growth every year in your Grand list to satisfy that that need So I just flag that as A backdrop to this competition too is you know being financially responsibles part of making those decisions too So sorry, no, I think I was responding specifically to what you said about the local options sales tax And saying that we've all spoken in support. I think I've spoken in support of Um A form of a local option sales tax for me. It was not the one that was included in the most recent projections. Okay. You sure? Yeah, I'm sure there'll be discussion about that to come Other questions comments concerns from council Thank you very much questions comments concerns. Yes, ma'am I speak as chair of the commission Services commission, but only for myself At this point, I don't feel that I could speak on behalf of other commission members Our last meeting Just last week. We had an opportunity to work the schedule for the development process And my personal opinion is that The commissions appear to be on the schedule rather late in the process And my concern is that we will not be able to do a really thorough And informed Comment to council What I mean to say is that In the past couple of years We've had a pretty good voice in recommendations And advising and so on and so forth, especially about ad drops And and now it appears that It will be difficult for the commissions to do that Because we won't be party to Many of the decisions that will already have been made It seems to be the case The way the schedule is laid out And I would Personally hope That the commissions will be enabled again this year to provide You know a fairly considerable amount of input to the system And advising To council to help council make good decisions Absolutely and I you know the dream and vision of the Of the commission system too is not just that it's a one-time comment on a budget But that you're helping to develop the priorities in this the strategic approach of the the area that you cover All along the way and which the budget is just a number that we use to try to support the vision work Right that's being done in the strategic the strategic goals Um, so absolutely, you know, that's it's it's in the process for a reason I know we kind of have tweaked it each and every year as we've gone along I don't think anybody thinks we found this perfect balance Um with interactions with the commission the way the structure works quite frankly, so I think um, you know, they try to be thoughtful and this year's schedule and trying maybe a little different, but Um by and large we do still feel like there's a great opportunity and window there for that engagement Other questions comments concerns Okay So seeing and hearing none. Uh, we'll move on to tonight's last item, which is the charter process regarding all resident voting Um, let's take this one. So following the vote in the last meeting We're bringing back as promised next potential steps on the consideration for the community of um, of of moving towards, uh, a public vote On some timeline, um in regards to all resident voting put together a memo that structured I guess the the way that the conversation appeared to go and what the key decision bottlenecks were that were before the council In hopes that we could get some feedback tonight to keep this item rolling at a pace that's Grew up with what your goals are as a body. Okay so, um starting off, um you know first um I want to note that this is a This is really the policy perspective the policy creation perspective In the timeline and in important key pieces of this I wrote this right just taking from our conversation What we did not do Really very intentionally is go to staff and build out a combined policy or a schedule And the thinking there was that the potential charter change process the content and then the outreach efforts Those things are going to feed into what the timeline should feasibly be and should be done Perhaps in consultation either with this body if we're going to continue to own the issue Or potentially by a committee that should vet that with staff closely and thoughtfully and not have it be Just a schedule or a policy that's just implemented based off of a deadline That there should be an exchange there where staff can say hey, we need to do this this this and this As part of that and they can also overlay whatever goals we've given to them if it's the committee or again If it's us and we can come up with a more a more complete schedule So I just want to flag that that this is from a policy perspective either So the the main bins of decision Criteria that I put out was potential charter change process options and by process options This goes back to the concept of whether you know, there's a There's history in monewski of opening up a charter committee a committee that considered changes and then passed a recommendation back to council That then would get the air and air adjustment from council when we took up this issue the decision was to To keep it with council essentially I'd say and we really act ourselves as the the charter committee in that case So decision there the second item is content direction and next steps So we've got a couple options there continuing to focus on our all resident voting is a singular item being proposed in the charter change update Include a direct whether or not that includes consideration of voter checklist protections or any other items And then option two open the charter to a broader review of other operational or political structure items So this is a should we Keep this a focused issue only on all resident voting or should we broaden it to Open the entire charter up for review with any other operational items that might be on there And then the next item was outreach efforts And this was that put together the four points one for performing targeted outreach Directly the impact of community members for feedback And then also putting parentheticals given the limitations we have in staff capacity right now Recommended parties that would take those items on scheduled public information sessions and forums And formally engage the school district for feedback And formally engage basically political entities the governor's office VLCT key legislators and legislative committee members And then finally we've got timeline options and opportunities and again For scheduled proposals and work plan to be developed Um The thinking here was if there's a committee Path that this body decides to hand this off to that at least starting them off with a target outline would be ideal Um, usually when you establish committee you try to give them Hey, this is what we'd like you to do in the timeline. We would like you to do it in Um, and then they get an opportunity to say Hey, you gave us this list of stuff you want us to do We think that's reasonable or not or we think we can get it done then or not. Um, and so that's That's uh, what the timeline options were so I think I was Trying to get to the point of at least getting some instruction on this in terms of next steps and phases if there's feedback on especially The first item which is the structure of it. I think we could move relatively expeditiously if it's the, um Council's desire to either start preparing things to come back here for the council being the operational policy development body or posting for a potential committee um, so The document goes through a couple different options I don't know if you guys want to just talk through each one. Um, and maybe start off with the Charter change process options first Make sense Does yeah Last time I thought that I heard in rewatching it too that there might be more interest in a committee approach Yes Okay, yeah, okay, uh, I'm also gonna okay, so it sounds like that's going to be And I'm trying to bring up the coals Okay, that one sounds that was easy. I was also in a coals expressed interest Okay, so in terms of the composition of the committee, are we comfortable with the full proposal there in terms of what that might look like for um Composition being the joint committee being offered participation to the school Um, and any other composition comments in regards to what it looks like. I had two counselors on there Two members of council. Does that make sense? I think yeah, my question would be I like the idea of including the school district I think my question would just be figuring out. What is our process for? community members On how we are finding and appointing individuals who are interested in the committee So Thought I thought that question might come up what I would ask is um You know historically we've either made We've done it in multiple ways We've done targeted outreach and brought specific individuals in because we thought that they brought a particular We recruited people on the committees because we thought that they brought a particular Perspective or capability to a committee that was specialized Um Sometimes we've done that through public with public posting sometimes we have it sometimes We've just said we're just going to like the committee. These are the people are going to be on it. That's what it is Other times we've opened it up to a public process that anybody can apply for the position Um, you know, but here are the qualifications and then we're going to make uh decision based on qualifications I think it's just important if you're going to go that route that we'd be very defined about what that looks like um and what if any What if any identifying factors could be used to help people understand if they're qualified or not that makes sense So so as to not set people up for disappointment if they're not selected for whatever reason so, um Jesse from a capacity standpoint um Create creating a um an outlet for applications to be deposited From a commission standpoint, that's not a huge ask. Is that right from running that process of yeah, we've got a good process I mean, I would look to you all to set what what do you want that? Solicitation to look like what do you want to say? What are those characteristics? We have a good process for taking in applications for those things. That's I think and i'm open to hearing one of those here to say I think because this issue is pretty focused pretty specific And I think based on what I heard at last meeting We'd all be interested in including people in that process who are directly would be most directly impacted by this I think that a council appointment process might make the most sense And I don't know if we are going to Put aside two council liaisons to serve on the Commission it might be a first good brainstorming activity for the two of them to think Put together some ideas and come back to the council I think that that would be fine and that would be something that is actually that's exactly how we handle this city manager search committee For example Myself and somebody else went and we said we would like to have these people brought them back to council And said these are who we think should participate. This is why I sort of disagree I I agree with the step of having You know the two council representatives brainstorm on what it is that we're looking for But I think given the sensitivity of the issue And the broad impact it would be nice to open this up to anyone who wants to apply With with some clarity on like we're going to have preference for or I don't know if requirements the right word but somebody who is You know, for example, if we want somebody who's got some representation for new americans or something But I don't want to see this committee contain Two council representatives two school district representatives and three non-citizens I would like there to be a citizen resident there to bring that from the view Yeah, I agree. No, we can say that That is the part where I think it's harder to appoint somebody to that role Here's a potential alternative. You could you could have it as a public posting a public opportunity And the two counselors review the applications And if people have particular individuals, they think are really qualified and would be really great candidates Yeah, you poke that person and say, hey, we'd really like to make sure you fill out an application for this Does that work? Yeah, i'm comfortable with that. Are we comfortable with um I mean, I think we can use Really almost this summary um As the posting to explain to people like what's going on what this committee will actually do I think too, I mean interest because the the purpose of the committee is to move this forward Ensuring that there's a dedication to moving that work forward So that people aren't Joint coming with an intent to join the committee and help work And I don't know if there's a way to encapsulate that I hear I hear what you're saying. Um, I think council members it's something to the The effect of Um, you know council members expressions that I consider how the city could move the issue forward Being a key piece there. Okay. I think we can I can work that out in terms of the posting We can figure out I don't know. It's that don't worry. Um, that's not on you guys. That's um Okay, in terms of the school prior to Making that public posting um I think it would be good to offer it to the school which has had no communication on this since our last meeting Haven't reached out in any way shape or form didn't feel authorized really to do so So we'd like to offer that to the school Um, are there any thoughts about any we can still pull those other individuals in that should You know, no clue how the school district will or won't, you know, reply or not reply. So Um, I guess we'll just cross that bridge and see With this reaction. I mean, I think they would obviously elect their own representatives to participate Okay. Yeah, that would be tough to coordinate, but I hear what you're saying um, and does the council have a commitment to Moving forward with a committee as well should the school district Not participate I would want the Whoever the members of the committee are To then include somehow try to include the school district into this targeted outreach area Yeah Okay. Yeah good I'm trying to ask all the questions to make sure that we can react in the next two weeks to whatever And not be stuck not being able to move Okay, all right. What else on process I guess I have a clarifying question, you know, based on previous charter committees, um What's the commitment in terms of time? Well, that's going to be determined by number two Well, no just the content because if you open up the entire charter, right, uh, you know, we met Last time we met once or twice a week for a while Um, because it was fast unfolding. I mean the We spent about 12 12 14 thousand dollars on legal fees on that, didn't we? Yeah, I think it was 12 or 14 thousand dollars In legal fees. I bring that up because it gives you an idea of how much back and forth there is um with I'm saying hey, this is what the committee is trying to achieve passing that to the attorney and say can you please put this into Charter and opening up the entire charter and having it reviewed is Is that is a thing? With that being said, I think that there have been some items identified that from an operational basis You could narrow that scope and say we're not going to do the whole thing We're going to address some of those operational items that I think, you know, have been identified over the last couple years if you want to say anything about any of those in terms of What's popped up in your minds in the in the past? Yeah, um I think I mean I so I have a list of things I would like to change operationally in the charter. Um, I think it is Very much incumbent on you all to define the parameters of this if this is really for the purposes of a public process around all resident voting Then that is a very different process than having a community conversation about governance and who we are and how our city operates um You know just to say a little more about what Seth was just saying the charter commissions. I've worked on before it is an intense process because the between the commissions the staff and the Legal counsel you go through a process of saying what are what's your value as a community? What are you trying to achieve in governance? Then the consultant often goes back and looks at how do other charters achieve what you're trying to accomplish Feeds those options back and then narrows down to what's the language in the chart So it's kind of a three-step iterative practice going from community values to best practice to language of your charter um That's a that's a very different process than what you all have been talking about um, the things I specifically Have identified just about what city operations would like to see this isn't about what the community may want to see from the values perspective You know, you've heard me say I'd like to take the word citizen out of the charter I think it's a misnomer of how we're doing business our charter refers To our volunteer fire department, which we don't have we have a paid-on-call department as we try and Modernize and professionalize that department. I think language clarity helps Our charter also and similarly in a professionalization vein our charter calls out that the Manager is the personnel director The manager will always have hiring and firing authority so that doesn't Necessitate the need to hold that title with the manager I think the manager should be able to delicate out that title still holding the hiring and firing power I think that would again build up our Our staff those are very operational in the weeds wonky things. Those may not be the thing You know, if you think about I think the way the mayor outlined this about Process next step outreach timeline is a good way to think about it If you're committed to moving quickly to march there may not be time to do that full process If you want to have a real open broad-reeling conversation about who we are and how we govern ourselves Then that should drive What you know those other questions? and I think That is a very That's a very Staff time intensive thing to open up the entire charter just it is So I just flagged that But then there's this phil soft question that should you change anything in the charter without doing the whole You know looking at the whole thing and that's that's a fair That's what we try to walk it in this direction versus saying what's your timeline first Some people Prioritize any of these things is the most important part about what we're doing right some people will say Well, this timeline of getting it to march is the most important thing to me Checking all these outreach boxes are the most important thing to me and some people think well I think it's most important that the process and content is The most is done right and then we back into what the timeline and outreach looks like Understood there's going to be varying opinions on that uh, so Yeah, I do think that the next question would be um You know whether or not If there's a desire And I I will say we are hindered in I don't know that Should completely understanding that because by not having a call here today, you know, and that's Whether the council takes on the account or not, but the If there's interest in who would comprise the council delegation to the committee um, because I think you know if you want to move this At You know the quickest possible speed you could potentially open up the posting and try to have recommendations for a committee by next time you could also take the two weeks Have um, you know have the posts and go out give people a chance to file those applications Choose choose the composition of the committee at the next of the council liaisons and the And potentially have word back from the school district as well Uh by the next meeting which would help inform the Rest of the composition I would assume. I just want to make really clear that's That means that we might not have a full functioning committee though for a month um because I know as a I know where i'm sitting is if we're delegating that authority to two of the people Um to look through those applications I this council is going to appoint the body and I'm not interested in having two people just make those They're there to vet the applications and make the recommendations back to council Well, this is a month where we have three council meetings, right? There's one on the 29th This month I I will say that if we needed to we could we could pull a special You know a special meeting in response to the need Um, I think it would need to be very limited and very, you know Quick to that effect So these are the time things that I've had trouble, you know wrapping up perfectly Here is that because that's Given that there is a lot of community interest if we're able to get a posting up It I mean it you know, it could be possible that That council We oh yeah the the hiccup is if we're waiting until the next meeting to fulfill the council liaisons So I guess yeah depends on what the What we're all comfortable with the appointing council liaisons if we have council liaisons tonight Then I think we could probably um Have those council liaisons come back with some recommendations to the council the next meeting if there aren't enough applicants Or that work is not fully done. Then it can be moved back immediately. We could kind of see where we're at But I guess that first question is going to be answered first Are there counselors who are interested in participating on the committee? I don't think it'll be any surprise that I am I would turn the giant Eric You're not you're not russian you're not russian volunteer Did Nicole and her written testimony for the record say anything didn't express didn't express it and I I will say that Unfortunately, we did not get a chance to connect today Um, because I was going to try to make that point clear that that could come up tonight to see if there was any interest um I've got I I because this has been such a big issue. Um, I I do feel Slightly conflicted on that that she's not here to be part of that selection process Not because I have any particular inclination that she would or wouldn't want to Be part of the body, but she did You know express interest in the committee. Well, I do nothing. Yeah, I mean we do have I know we all have lives too, but we do have these council meetings at a certain time We've got to make decisions. Yeah, we're here I definitely hear you but um, one of the things that I do think is important from my perspective is that on the council and us our last vote on moving this forward There was some fracturing in the council And so I think it would be really Important to include people who had more reservations with moving it forward from the november timeline so that we can have representation on the committee So I think, you know, I'm fine. If hal is really interested in this. I'm fine I'm stepping back so that a counselor from The other perspective could be willing to join because I think that would just be a lot healthier As we're making this decision collectively and as we're working on the committee. How about this? They who do not come get volunteered I would like to nominate nicole. Um, if she has the capacity to do it Um, I support that Give me an issue with that I'm fine with that. I mean if nicole doesn't want to do it If she's against it, we can we can take somebody else next next meeting If if she um, if she declines the opportunity I will I'll reach back out to everybody to see if we want to do an ad hoc Um, you know one person here phone meeting or whatever we need to do to make sure that this selection takes place To keep this on track. Yeah The thing that I would ask though Given that that body is going to you're welcomed any documents I have I would just ask that that group take lead in writing the post for the For the positions It makes sense. I mean, I'm happy to provide again anything that I've written That's helpful to Take yourself on both dates Okay, I can do that. Um, the one thing I will do is, uh, like tomorrow. I'll send something to Sean and Mike, um, at the school district For that Okay Are you moving on? Yes, nicole and how? From this agenda item, or are you? No, right? No, no, no We just didn't we just didn't number okay number one Um, uh, okay, so next up is content direction for next step So we have option one which is continue to focus on all resident or number two open the charter for borrow review So I think that as jesse also expressed that these those are two different conversations this non voting issue and then operations in general And also that if we are kind of choosing a body around an issue Does it make sense to also have them reviewing something operational if they don't have the background for I would agree. Yep So am I nicole reflected interest in option one? Uh The next piece though is this, um consideration of voter checklist protection. Do we want that item tackled? I think so who knows if they will come out with a clear yes or no, but I think it's worth having the commission look into if it's possibility Other thoughts comments concerns the way that I've been thinking about this is kind of as a continuation of questions. We have already raised and that is an item that is included there So can we agree that those are though the two limiting things at this juncture that if there are any other Items that arise during the review that we would like that body to bring those back to counsel before Chasing them down the road too far. Okay So those are the two limiting items of authority for the group It is all resident only voting only and the voter checklist protections Any other items we've brought back to counsel for clearance before spending significant time the investment of energy and legal funds on this On that item jesse Anything you want to add there? I just don't want to skip if you had a comment on um Does that include the citizen change that has been discussed or no? Is that a bring it back to you? I do think that that was included in the list of things that was That was addressed. I mean that was proposed in the proposal we saw right is removal of citizen So thank you. Oh, yeah, I think that that's It seems like a functionally very extensive conversation either. Yeah What's missing in outreach efforts instead of us going through each one? and our if if completed would these satisfy The council in terms of efforts and energy to engage the community Nicole just said looks good I think this address hasn't The ones that we were concerned about in our previous discussion I and I think there's a lot of room in target outreach too I would say that the I think an important thing for the committee to Is to look at these and provide feedback to ensure that they're getting they feel like they've gotten opportunities for that information because ultimately the feedback is going to them before it's coming to us Does that make sense? So that they get to weigh in on this but that these are at least the prescribed Soup to start Just skipping forward Without comment on the timeline That we have not gotten to yet. I just want to call out that the that I think this list of outreach efforts is great Other Between now and the end of january. We will also be doing public outreach and Public hearings on the budget a bond vote for a garage potentially the master plan Charter and housing policy ordinances. That's a lot of community outreach So we may want to think about how we tell that story to make some threads between those things Um, or I think the committee is going to get really tired So just Also, yeah from a capacity standpoint too, I think the benefit of having a committee is that it hopefully can take Doing a lot of that outreach off of staff's hands in some ways I'm not saying it from a staff perspective I'm saying it from a public how much can the community take in at once perspective Um, I think there's a way to do it. I think it's just telling a comprehensive story rather than five individual public hearing processes Can you write those down for us? Sure. Thank you Yeah, so given um, you know, and we'll hear back maybe from the school district too in terms of Feedback on our process and what this is I'll just share this document with them Um, and say You know share your thoughts they might have some input in terms of what they think is or when if What makes sense in terms of their their work And whether or not they want to specify that outreach to the school community specifically um Okay, uh, so if the group's not starting until You know, if we're not selecting a group until next time, I think this the potential timelines less important Um, but does anyone want to make a comment in regards to? Um, I think so first off I understand like we do need to give them guidance and timeline But I don't want to be in a situation again where we have Express support for a certain date and then we find ourselves not ready to move forward with that And then we have a lot of folks feeling Like jilted about it. Um, I would be very I would not be in support of committing to option one for the timeline Also given all the other things that are going on that jesse just mentioned um And Frankly lean more towards option four like I would like to give them a timeline of like We would like to see where you are at this date um With this information or you know, can you get through this by the state and then from there With the expectation that like if we have not Resolved everything we need to if we have not had all the public outreach We need to that this could extend further I think one thing to think about in this that I was going to bring up to especially the individuals who Helen Nicole, hopefully Nicole um For recruitment pieces is the time commitment Is very contingent upon this so if somebody asked what is the time commitment if if you were to say option one Hard and fast and that's it um They better be ready to meet every other week um And really rock and roll and expect those to be full meetings And in addition to that You know, make sure that the outreach piece is conducted So I yeah, I feel I'm in support of option one. I do think there's a lot of time I think when we were first discussing whether or not to move forward with november With the decision being that It was too soon to move forward with a november timeline I think that putting it off past march of 2019 Is an even bigger pull to swallow. Um, and I also think extending it out past that um a runs the risk of The work kind of languishing But b also runs the risk of the committee potentially scattering In that, you know, if you have a dedicated group of volunteers for my past as an organizer and volunteer manager The one thing you don't want to do is not, you know, not continue to push them or give them opportunities to engage So I could see if it continues on for a long time people falling off And then we've got to go back and revive the committee and so I just worry about that process I think there's ample time, but also in a way Right now this is something that a lot of committee member or a community members even are really in tune to and engaged with We all heard from people From different perspectives on the issue And I think for them this to just disappear off the map for a longer period of time past march and then pop back up But also be kind of jolting for the community I got I I follow that reasoning. Um I think using that date as a Timeline for work is okay as long as we are very clearly communicating that we have not committed To putting this on the town meeting day ballot that we are investigating the option to do so But we this is not a commitment to do that Yeah, well, I think that's with our You know similar to the last time we discussed it that we can say this is our goal We we would like for this to be on the march ballot But obviously there are a number of process steps that need to occur in order for that to happen Like that could be the goal But just like last time if we don't go to the votes on council actually move something forward that it can't happen Nicole expressed written uh interest in number four My perspective would be to Convey to them that we are open to having it on the march ballot have them look at the schedule and give us feed I My my thinking was that they would give us feedback as to whether that was feasible or not Based off of their first Maybe second meeting I do think that the reality is that That's going to be You know, that could be no mid november Before you get that response back Yeah, I think it could be valuable for the committee to really Come up with a work plan, you know, what's really feasible and See where it lands, but you know just to get the wisdom on the other committee members to weigh in So and ask the question for example if they want to know Well, what's the implication of us of it being a special vote versus Those are the questions I could see I would want to ask how much is it cost to hold a special vote Like what other votes are occurring next year that we could potentially piggyback on if that was the case I don't think there are any Yeah, and then I think to hear the political implications of going past march And watching I haven't paid attention to what I'm actually just doing but You know that I think the biggest thing though is We haven't we can bring this issue back again next time Because there's no pressure on that decision right now Sound okay. Yeah, and and to the point about getting feedback from committee members is being able to share with them These are the items that we need we want you to investigate This is the timeline to do so because of public hearing scheduling so that that's clear Right, so we're not saying we want you to have all of this ready by march. It's actually before that And then you know, whatever the You know if this means like meeting we clear So that that's clear to them I'm open with tabling the timeline discussion Okay Great really quick. Can I just so that we don't get hung up? Uh, you know for a timeline doesn't make sense now that I'm thinking about it in the council Liaisons to say if there are people willing to serve as backup For each of the two council liaisons if people have to decline That way we can just have that in the offer and we can appoint as backup in the case of declination Sure I'd be happy to be one I have deep concerns about my time Availability to do this. Oh, yeah, I can be backup I need one more meeting so So how how and uh, Nicole are the 18 I reckon I are the b team Great um Could I also recommend actually now that we're thinking about this that we also elect a alternate Um resident So we're talking about a body with a composition of seven I'd recommend that we do four residents and specify one of those individuals specifically as as an alternate Make sense Okay, so just so i'm clear what we're helping to move forward with Um how and cool being point on is Sometimes this week put out the posting for the commission members for the next council meeting bring back Sorry for the bureaucratic talk the charter for the charter commission I think we should do a traditional charter for that commission if it's going to be a publicly appointed charter is going to follow up in meeting laws or that Um and potentially appointments Yes, yes, and if we could just if if it's not too much trouble, you know, sometimes those are live streamed and looking for paul but He's usually the point person on those coming in, right? Yeah. Yeah. I think if they could just be shared with them You know periodically throughout the process. I don't know. Well, you know what you guys can work that out Do we want to establish a charter committee for the charter committees charter? I'm being a little tiny and cheeky No, but yeah, no the charter pieces to spill out that it's a public Entity, yeah I think my intent though I know you're kidding that would be to share the charter With howland and coal to make sure it's capturing what you guys intend before it goes right And so is it the intent Just so I know how to support you all is it the intent to actually interview candidates And if so we should really block off some time like next If we can get the posting out tomorrow for applications due on tuesday to schedule interviews on thursday of next week to get appointment names by friday for the agenda I guess that's up to the or Okay. Yeah, I mean I To be really blunt. I didn't involve staff in like the City manager I just had people send me the applications and I followed up with You know, I set with the applications with the other person selected We went through them and said who do we want to contact for a follow-up And didn't make it a you know Right didn't take it any further than that Okay, I think the important piece You know when it comes to public recognition of the fact is to say To and note that you know, this is the process that we're all adhering to I can guarantee you with a thousand percent certainty that there will be somebody who will submit an application Who will not get selected who will be Upset about that and we'll have preferred that there'd be some additional public process Of the section of committee. So I just want to bring that to council's attention. It happens each and every time we Do that At the end of the day, this body has to appoint some bodies to do things and having an open application process And then a calling by two council members You know in the past has been a good way of doing it You know, I and if you guys decide you want to consult with You know somebody else if it's just in there, you know, I get that but I don't think You guys have to take ownership of like the scheduling interviews or anything like that That would be I would think we would want to limit the impact of staff as much as possible on that Anything else? What do we miss? What's calling the call? I'll do that. We're gonna talk tomorrow morning anyway I wish she's watching somebody Um, okay, you need public comments questions concerns Okay So seeing and hearing none. I don't entertain that complete science regular jinn. I entertain a motion to adjourn Say I wish my eric seconded by christiney for the discussion Seeing and hearing none almost in favor, please say aye all right and those opposed Motion carries Well, you know, there's actually a thing