 You were a researcher, weren't you? Yeah. You started off? Yeah. Yeah. Um, which is 15 years ago. A summer. How many? 15. Ha ha ha. You see the other day, isn't it? Yeah. Yeah. They were playing, um, they had, um, records playing in the car. You know, it's like, um, the top 40 pick of the pops. Oh, yes. From that year, and it's like 15 years ago. Oh, yes. What was it? Oh, Jean went to see Priscilla in the week, at the palace. Who's Priscilla? It's a film. Oh. A musical show, a music show. Yeah. It's all about transvestites. Oh, Priscilla Queen of the Deserts. Queen of the Theatre, yes. Yeah, yeah. I think it was the Queen of the Palace. Oh, no. It's at the Palace, oh, that's me. Ha ha ha. And she said, um, it was 1988 music. I was like, oh, you know that? She said, yes. She knew the music, you see. Yeah. She heard. Her time, you know. It was from writing music. So, um... I got discharged then. Well, when you were pregnant with... I don't know. What was that? My dad had just got forms for me to be a... to be an officer. Not just a leading aircraft... leading aircraft woman. He wanted me to have a commission because he'd called. Yeah. What happened? Well, I don't know where to start, really. Um, but, um... Actually, I was in... I was called up in 1942. And you said you were at the Overtine factory? Well, I was working. That was working in the Overtine offices. And they were called Wanderers, Swiss firm. Yeah. And then I had papers in and they got me... Hmm. Called up. Yes, well, I wasn't... I was called up, but they got me delayed for a while. That they needed me, you know. What, the Overtine factory? The Overtine offices. No, in Kensington. Oh, okay. What did you do there? Well, I was learning short-hands. I was doing short-hand type. I was getting to be short. Because once you were married then, you had to leave a firm, you know. I didn't write that. You couldn't stay on. So a woman left because she got married, so I got the job. The man was your short-hand typist. And this was in 1939? Yes, it was 1939-40. Yeah. So did you start working there before the war started? Yes, yes, I started before. And then wars declared? They declared in 1939. And I got the call-up papers, you see. And they deferred me. They got me deferred for a while. And the company managed to do that? Yeah, they did. Man, this must have done. Because I got deferred for a while. Yeah. But then I was called up and they couldn't do any more again, you see. They deferred me for a while, which I don't know how many months. Yeah. And then I was called up. Because first of all, I went for an examination for the ATS. And they wouldn't accept me because I have war specs. What's the ATS? The Army Girls. Territorial Army. Right. Yes. They wouldn't accept me for that, but they accepted me in the WAFs. And did you choose to go to the WAFs? No, I didn't choose anything. I just said what I was to do. I didn't choose anything because I didn't want to volunteer. Yeah. So when it was at WAFs, I didn't mind. Yeah. So then I went to Gloucester, called up and went to Gloucester. And the family saw me off at the station. Yeah. And I got kitted out there. We laid it in. Oops, these Army Sheds. You know, these Army... Well, they're the same parts. They're the same parts. Thank you. You'll have to come to my rescue. I stayed in the night with a listen hut with lots of other girls, which wasn't used to that sort of situation. Yeah, yeah. So where were you living when you were working at Oval Team? Oh, I was in Ealing. With your mum and dad? Yes. I used to sometimes cycle there. And what were they doing at the time? Who? Yeah, your mum and dad. Oh, my dad was a printer. Right. And I don't... Mum, I think sometimes... Mum did the making jam. Yeah. Two teachers retired. And they were... They were private schools, I think, and they started making jam. And Mum must have seen a note somewhere and she was helping them. Well, she took their dogs out for a walk. Yeah. And she was buying us a... Was it a piano or was it something? She did jobs on that to buy a piano and for us some music lessons. Yeah, yeah. So... And this was in Ealing. Can you remember where you lived? Because I don't know any of this. Do you know where in Ealing it was? The address or anything? Oh, no, I don't remember where because she used to go when they went away. She used to go to their house and take the dog out for walks and things like that. Yeah. And I can't remember the addresses. Yeah. But you... So you lived in Ealing. So you commuted into the Oval Team. To Kensington? Yes. Every day. And you were there before the war? Before the war, yes. And then... Do you know how... Do you know roughly when you joined the WAF? Yes, in... 42. 42. Oh, so it was a good three years still in the office. Yes, I must have been. I must have gone there at the 15. Yeah. I must have done. I went through different departments until I got to be a manager's type, the shorthand type is. I know I cycled and yet when I first bought a bike, well, my dad bought me the bike. I pay you back, but I never did. It was only about 30 bob, you know, then. I used to go out with granddad and with Eric. And we used to go riding around somewhere. I wouldn't go right, because I couldn't go right. I had to keep going round to the left. What, because you were... You were scared to turn into a tram ride? Scared to turn right, yes. Scared to just keep going. And then in the end I cycled to Kensington. So I got over that. When did you meet granddad? Oh, 16, not 16. Evening glasses. So that was in around 1938? 1940. 21, 21, 31, 31, 31, 32, 30, 30. About 37, wouldn't it be? Right. I'll be about 16. No, it was before 16 I met him. I'm sure I wasn't 16. What was I doing? I was doing learning short-hand, you see. Right, in evening classes. In evening classes. He was doing everything. Like, countenancy, drama, everything. Oh, different lessons. Oh, yes, we weren't going to say it. Yeah. Because he said, he saw me. I don't know whether the principal was probably acknowledging us all for going and coming and doing this, that and the other. I can't remember what we were told to do. And he's supposed to have seen me in the ring. He must have said to someone, who is that over there? And they said, they thought it was somebody else. He didn't know it was me, my name at all. He must have got to know me that way. I don't remember all that. I must have met him there and got chatting. He proceeded from there. And what job was he doing at the time? He was working in Hoover's at that time. That was his first job. Hoover's in the curry bale. Do you know what he did there? He did an office work, I should think. That was the next job. Then he went to Hayes. Hayes, that's what, the borough council. Then he went to Breenford. Borough council. That was all to do with the Ealing borough council. Was that in cleansing? Must have been, yes. I don't know if it was called cleansing. Yeah. Yeah. And then of course when he was called up, when he got this job, he did all the exams for engineering. Because he couldn't get to, he wanted to go to university, but he couldn't pay for it then. I don't know if they were taking their adults in just after the war, do you know? I don't know that. He did it at home. I don't know, it wouldn't be like the open university. That's where he did all his exams. In engineering, he passed in two lots of engineering. I threw the certificates away when I moved from Castle Dore. Yeah, yeah. So when you were working at Oval team, Granddad was working in... Hoover's. In Hoover's, but was he immediately called up? No, he volunteered. Right. I guess knowing you at your Granddad, he would volunteer for something he wanted to do. He wouldn't want to be told what to do or what services to go in. He went to the RAF. Yes, the RAF, volunteer reserve. It's called volunteer reserve. Volunteer. See, I've forgotten all lots of these things. Yeah, yeah, that's okay. Volunteer reserve, I believe. He was a volunteer first of all in the RAF. Okay. And then, so then, so that was in 1939. He went straight away into the RAF. That was 1939, I guess. And was he basically a North Hulk then? No, he went to North Hulk, West Dayton. Right. North Hulked. Okay. And then Uxbridge. Right. And then of course, it was the year that I was pregnant. So that would be 44. January, he was called abroad then. Right. So... That was when I was discharged at the Christmas. Yeah. In the RAF. In Christmas 42. Yes, 42, but I was married while I was in the... Waps. Yeah. I first went to, as I said, Gloucester to get Kettedale. Then we were sent to Walkham to do our training. Yeah. And then after that, I was just sent to Bournemouth. Yeah. With the Canadians. Stayed there for a few months and then we were sent to Brighton. Right. With the Australians. Right. And I was a stenciled tiger then because they asked you when they interview you. Yeah. What are you doing, you see? Yeah. When I was in an office, naturally, they wanted me to do the same sort of thing in the wafts. Yeah, yeah. I would have liked to learn to drive, really, because that would have got over my... I would have had to do it, wouldn't I? Yeah. I would have got over my fear. Wouldn't they provide the training for that kind of thing? That's right. But so that... And then I was discharged from Brighton. So it was not exciting at all. Yeah, yeah. The Maoris were there, you know. So we had part, you know, the concerts and dances. Yeah. Naturally. So how does that work? That they had, like, different nationalities in different towns. You know, you said that Australians were in Brighton. Is that... They just used that as a base for the Australian Air Force. Yes, I worked in the... I think they were all waiting to be sent somewhere abroad, you see. Yeah. And I was doing officers' records. Right. Sentling them. Right. They had to be run off. And it was in the hotel I worked at. Maggie Thatcher was in. You know, it was Bond. Yeah, Grand Hotel. That's where you worked. I worked in that one. And our hotel worked. It was just a few doors down the road, not the hotel, the small one. Yeah. So when you were working there, could you... Was there any flying nearby? Or is it just, like, an administrative base? Just administrative. That door. Did they clear the people out of the town then? No. So it's a normal town? Normal town. Because I used to go get the station from Brighton to... Oh, my gosh, was it Victoria? Yeah. Because your granddad was still at... That's pretty. He used to come up and meet me. And then he used to take me back when I went on Sunday night. So you'd stay there during the week in Brighton? Mm-hmm. And they'd pick you up in a hotel? Sometimes you have to stay there, you know. Yeah. Yeah. You get to... You work so many weeks. And then you have to have a week on duty, as they call it. Not doing anything, but you're there, you know. Yeah. So did you live in Brighton then and go home for the weekend? At the hotel, yes. All week, and then I used to go home on Friday night. Was it run like a hotel, or was it like a sort of WAF thing? Well, I think it was more like a WAF, not like a hotel. Yeah, yeah. It was a hot place hotel, but it wasn't really... They just used the building? Yeah, just used the building. So yeah, what sort of WAF rations there? Five inches, you know, water, and all the bars were painted. We had three in our room, and you have to make your bed every day. Yeah. Well, the waterline was painted. On the bar, yes. So you couldn't put more water in? No, you know, look, the five inches, I think it was. Because the showers weren't even conceived then, weren't they? So you had to fill the water up to the line that was painted on? Yes. And... Just going back, just because it's interesting, because I don't know how... You just bring it back to me because I can't... Yeah, no, no, it's just to follow the story. Grandad went into the RAF, and you were in Kensington initially for three years. That's right. And so did you meet Grandad at the weekends then, because he was in... Well, he was working on his motorcycle over at night. You used to see him most days. Oh, okay. Because you were living in Ealing, and he was living in... Greenford. Right. And he was... Or with his mum and dad? His mum and his dad died. It was while I was going with him. He was over with me one night, and his uncle came and a friend to say that his dad had died at work at 40, I think it was just 42 or 47, I can't remember. He had a heart attack. Oh, no. And Eric remembered the night before, the day before, that he'd got pains in his shoulder. Oh, no. And this was Alexander Mosse. So then he must have collapsed in the lavatory, I think, on the cloakroom at work. I think he worked at... Oh, God, where did he work now? I can't remember. Yeah, I can't remember what he did. I think he was at some sort of an engineer. Yeah. That one company. Quite local, really. I think Paddington area. Westbourne Park, was it? Okay, yeah. I think that's where he worked. Oh. To do with the railways. Yeah, yeah. And then you went to Gloucester initially? I called, I had to go kitted out. Somewhere in Gloucester. Innsworth, I think it was innsworth. Okay. I can't even remember the name. Yeah, that rings a bell. I think it dribbled past that. Not far away. Yeah, yeah. And what was your rank? I don't know the terminology. Just an ordinary leading... Is it leading aircraft or something like that? No rank. Yeah. Just the lowest of the low. And did they train you for a particular... Just for marching. That's all we had to learn marching. And the first day we were there, I just didn't... Don't know how it was. We were just sent round to the command that we were with. The Vera Lynn was on the theatre. Okay. So we all went along there. You should make friends with people, don't you? Yeah. How did it feel going to Gloucester? Were you in Gloucester for long? No. Was it a week? Just a bit of marching. And that half a sec, you know? Kit bag? Did it feel odd? Because you left home. Especially living in the Nissenhub with all these other girls just for a week. Yeah. Got used to it, though. Would you have stayed with these girls? No. You just kind of... I don't really know them. I don't think I went with any of them. They were all doing different things. Some were cooking, some were... I don't know what they were doing. But it was just like a sort of orientation week. It was just to get your kids... What was that about? Did you get your uniform on the first day then? I can't remember that. Must have done. Must have done. And you did some marching? When we got to Morgan. And we had passing out parade. What, at the end of the week? I think we were at Morgan for months. Okay, so you went from Gloucester... To Morgan. And what was that different bunch of girls then? Oh, I think so, yes. It was only when I got to Brighton that I was in with Ann Dobby and Georgina that her husband was in Tanglia. That's how we got friendly. Then I got friendly with the girl and she was in the office. Yeah, yeah. And she recommended a place in Torquay. Do you have a honeymoon? Granddad and I went to Torquay. Yeah. So, she went to Morgan, but that was for a month. Yes. And was that more marching? Just marching. Any other training? And how do they know what you can do? Do you have to tell them? We had interviews and they wanted to know what I was doing in private life. What did you do the rest of the time? What did you do the rest of the time? I don't know. I know it was a blackout and all of this house we stayed in was just gloomy. Do you know how I can't remember the meals? I know someone had gone through my case and took a collar. It must have been one of the girls that were there. I can't remember those at all. So you were staying in a house in Morgan rather than in a sandwich house? Yes, that's right. I suspect the woman was paid, you see, to have us there. I don't remember making friends there at all, isn't it? We did so because we got to Brighton, I did. So at the end of the Morgan month you were told? We all had to get to Bournemouth. Do you say you had a passing out parade or something? Was that in Morgan? Did your parents come to that or it's just for you? Just for the us wefts. And then basically they tell you where you're going at? That's right, I can't remember how I was told or anything like that. Were you the only one to go to Brighton, do you think? I don't think so, I think a group was must have gone. I can't remember that. And when you go to Brighton, do you know for how long it's going to be? No, we know that. Because it was Bournemouth, we didn't know how long we were going to be at Bournemouth. Because I bought my wedding ring there. It was a jubilee as a long name. We could only get that number. So when you went to Brighton, were you still coming home to London? I didn't get home as put from Bournemouth. I can't remember how long we were at Bournemouth. If your dad was here, he'd know. It's funny I can blot out things, but I do blot out things. Some things you know really clearly. Yes, I can see it. But other things I can blot out and forget it completely. So when you were in Brighton, you were working on the sea fronts? Yes, in the Metropole. Was it odd? Did you see planes flying over? It was worse when I got back from your dad. I was in Queen Charlotte so we could watch the doodle month going across. You know who doubled the flame outside the back of it? We knew it was going to drop it somewhere. It didn't have anything like that. We had all barbed wire across the front, of course. But nothing else to... Just make sure I haven't got it. So I want to ask it again. Dad's quite hazy about... the later years of the war. But basically it was quite... It sounds like quite an office job. It was office work. Yes, office work. The same as I type in, the same as I've been doing. He said it was like stenciling for... The offices, the Australian offices. Some have died, you know, and some have got illness. It's all on there. So all the information would come into Brighton and it would be typed up and it would go off to different records. I suppose it would, I don't even know. I think we had a sergeant in charge of us. Was that a WAF sergeant? No, it was a man's sergeant. Was he Australian? No, he was English. Yes. It feels odd that, you know, all the British organise... Yes, we are organising all this thing. And this girl and George, you know, George with us, she did their laundry. She purchased the Australian's laundry that needed to go out. So the... were the Australians invited? Yes, they were actually in the hotel. In the rest of the hotel? Were they just the officers? We were just... not no. No, they weren't only the officers. There was other airmen as well. I think there were flyers. And this was their base? That was their base, I think. And then they'd send them off to an airfield? They would send them to an airfield, yes. Okay. I just had some fun with those. They'd come in the office, you know. They must have been really far from home. Yes, they were. So sorry, you said you had a couple of friends. One of them did the laundry. Yes, I can't remember what Anne did now. She wasn't with me. It was the other girl. She lived in Southampton. She recommended the place. She went to be a bee and talky for our honeymoon. She'd recommended it. I think she kept well-wedding. I think she kept well-wedding. You think, really, they're quite selfish, aren't they? Because I think my dad sought her. I'm sure he did. I don't know whether she stayed the night at home. My dad didn't even ask how much. He didn't ask how much you know of the wedding cost or anything. I looked back and thought, how selfish I must have been. Oh, that's the whole point. As spoiled as my sister would say. But that's the whole point, isn't it? It's supposed to be a family event. Oh, I don't know. I think Caroline did more, didn't she? Yeah, but she'd been... Yeah, I think she's a bit older. Your mum had to go on insurance, I believe, for that wedding. Well, I think that's what Jean told me. I didn't even know that. Because Jean said she doesn't know whether she would have done that. I think you can buy them off the shelf, can't you? Wedding, I don't know what it covers. Of course, Kirsty's going to get married, isn't she? Yeah, yeah. Is it when she can afford it? Oh. So, yeah, because I haven't even got to the wedding yet. Can you remember any of the Australians? Can you remember what they were like, or who they were, or anything? No, just a bit of fun, you know, when we'd meet up. I never went out with one. I'd go to the Canadian in Bournemouth. Yeah. And one of the Canadians taught me how to play snooker. Was this in Bournemouth? That's in Bournemouth, yes. And we didn't go out with any of the Australians. And what was your day like? Was it a nine to five, or was it quite military? Yes, it would be like that. I can't remember the time, but that's what it would be like. Because it sounds like... Yeah, to be in the office time. Yeah, it sounds like it was organised like an office rather than a military. It was a military camp, as it was office-like. Yeah. Because I didn't like the sergeant, that male sergeant. I had my ring taken off, because they had to be made smaller. Because he'd make jibes then, or you're trying to leave a wedding ring behind, make out you're not married, these sort of things. He wasn't a very nice man. Yeah, yeah. There was other things he probably said that's why I didn't like him. Yeah, yeah, yeah. Were you engaged at the time? Yes, I was engaged. When did you get engaged? Was I 21? I think I was 29. So it had been 42 when you went to Brighton? I think it was before then. Yeah, yeah. It was probably my birthday, before I was called up. So you were called up after your birthday? I'm sure it must have been. Probably towards the end of the year. Right. I think it must have been November. Right, oh gosh, you were in, like, Morecom in November, December. I can't remember when I came home that first Christmas. You can't remember if you did or not? I can't remember. Yeah. I'm sure, yeah. I can't remember that. When you were working at Overteam was, I mean, was London taking a hit for those three years? No, no, because not until, was it this 39, was it? Yeah. I used to go up to London and the platforms were full of people who were using them as shelters and the smell when we got off the train. Yeah, yeah. Used to go to Gloucester Road. Yeah. And, well, South Kent. Yeah. From Ealing Broadway. Yeah. And they were, no, because then we didn't have anything at Ealing, but we could see all the fires in the distance that were over at East End of London. But Kensington wasn't particularly... Yeah, you were all right there, you see. I don't remember any, any, you know, have to go into the shelters or anything there at all. Because you think, yeah. I did have to go to Nightwatching, Nightwatching, one night. Oh, yeah. Was that an official thing or a volunteer or...? No, I think it was official. I had to do that. And how did that work? Did they give you a uniform or...? No, you just had to stay there overnight. And where was this? Kensington. At the office. Officers of Wanda. There were, what, Swiss firms of Wanda? Yeah. They're called Wanda, really. We all said the Wanda offices. Yeah, yeah. So you had to basically raise the alarm if... Yes, if there was anything, that's why we were there, in case any fires dropped down, I suppose, onto the place. Yeah, yeah. Was it a big building or...? They're nice. I don't know whether you know Southskins. I think Anthony Laurel Thompson's got a rest room in this Queensgate, it's called. Queensgate. Queensgate. Lovely old houses they were. Yeah. Yeah. Because Becky want me there, so we used to... Yes. Walk around. Okay. So the years have got confused, really. It sounds really clear, though. It's just funny. Because I didn't know any of these. I didn't know. No. So then after... Were you at Bryton for long? Until I got to... Just yours were being pregnant. Oh, so you were at Bryton the whole time? Yes, just at Bournemouth for a while, I don't know. Oh, sorry. So you went from Bryton to Bournemouth? Yes, to Bournemouth first from Walkham. Oh, sorry. And that's where the Canadians were? Yes. And then to Bryton? And then to Bournemouth. Oh, sorry. I stayed there until... Oh, just yours? In Bournemouth? Because I don't know anything about your time in Bournemouth. Were you in Bournemouth for a while? Yes, I was at... Do you know I can't remember where I slept? But I worked in the Exeter Hotel. So you remember that still? Yes. I just off this work again. But you know, I don't know where... Is that on the seafront? Well, it's not far from the seafront. It's just around the back. Because I went there with Uncle Stan and Moira. And I tried to find it, which I couldn't find in the hotel, but I couldn't remember where I stayed. That's flat up completely. I can't even think back to it. I remember walking to the office, the Exeter, in the morning, but I don't know where I came from. And I can remember buying my ring along the parade of shops. And there's a jeweler there with that ring in the window. Is that in the high streets? Yes, I don't know where they were. Because there's some... If you go to Bournemouth, there's some gardens, isn't there? Yes, yes. It was just behind those gardens, the jewelers. Yes, yes. Where I lived, I can't remember. And sorry, you bought your engagement ring there? No, we bought the engagement ring in Ealing. But you bought the wedding ring? He couldn't get any more to me to do it, because of size, but then it was too big. Oh, see. And then the work there was that quite similar to the work in Bournemouth? Must have been, yes. I wasn't typing, I don't think, then. Oh, okay. Was it admin work? Just admin. Oh, yes, it was all office workers, I'll call it. Did you have friends in Bournemouth? No, I can't remember any one special. I must have been with someone or two there, because we'd go to the club, the Canadian club, and I said I must have been with someone, but I wasn't so pallious when I got to Bournemouth. That's funny. And is that what you did in the evening then, go to the Canadian club? Yes, went to the clubs there around near our Hopliss Hotel. No, it wasn't Hopliss, Hopliss was Brighton. Exeter Hotel. I tried to look for that where I stayed in the hotel in Bournemouth. Yeah. I couldn't find it. Well, in Brighton. With the Stanamora. Yeah, oh, right. Yeah, yeah. And... It wouldn't be far away, because we wouldn't have a long... We could walk to the office, the Exeter Hotel. Yeah, yeah, yeah. And in the evenings, you said there was a Canadian club or clubs? Well... Just a club. A club, yes. And is that like a military bar or something? No, I don't think it was. I think they'd taken over a hotel probably down in the basement. That sort of situation. No, it wasn't a military at all really, where I've been. So after a day's work, you just have some way to go? Yes, we finished, we'd go home and go to the hotel and have a meal. Yeah. Whatever it was, I can't even remember that. And that was provided for you? Oh yes. You'd get your meals provided. Yeah. And did you travel back to London from Bournemouth to visit... Do you know what I can't remember doing now? I don't know whether I did. Yeah. Yeah. And was it... I mean, did you have a pay packet? Would it be a salary? I don't think so. I think I did. I mean, did that feel different? Having a... We'd have to meet up somewhere. Do you know I can't remember, really? Yeah. I must have had a pay packet. We probably had... They must have had to call it a day in that one company. What they called it. Yeah. You'd have to line up for it, I'm sure. Yeah. Being a hotel, I think. Yeah. Well, was that different from the Oval Team work? The Wonder work? Yes, you know, I can't remember Oval Team, how I got paid. I must have had a pay packet. Yeah. Because it wasn't monthly. I do now, and the checks in there paid in to... Yeah. You had a check. No, it was all pay packet then. Yeah. And were you still seeing grandads while you were in Bournemouth? Would he come to visit you? I must have done. I must have done. I probably kept in contact either with the letters or the phone. Yeah. And did you see each other? I mean, did he come to visit you or did you go to... Not at Bournemouth, so I must... As soon as I'd go to Ealing, he'd be there. Okay. It was when I was in the office in the Wonder Oval Team. He used to ring me at lunch time nearly every day. Yeah. Well, were you near a phone because you were in the office? Well, I was in the office. Yeah, typing in the office. And the supervisor should be at lunch, you see. And we were in Bournemouth for long, do you think? I don't think I could have been there very long. Yeah. I don't know. I'm sure I wasn't there long, but I don't remember. Yeah. Because you... It would only be a month or two if that before we were sent off to Brighton. I don't know why. You see, you just don't ask things like that. You don't ask why we're going. Yeah, and then you just go where you're told. Just told to go. Do you have a... were you supervised by an officer then? Or how did that work? I was thinking of the Sergeant with a crown. I can't remember what they're called. Right. Sergeant. What? Then that's a WAF. There's a man, a man with his stripes. Right. He was a crown. Right. So the... How does the WAF work then? Is it that you were in a regiment or in a... Perhaps I was. I don't know. It wasn't you. Yeah. I think when you... When I was sixteen or more, well, I'd be older then, wouldn't I? Yeah. Twenty-one. I felt I was doing what I was told to do and didn't question it. Yeah. So when you... I just wondered if you remembered how you'd be given orders when you're in Bournemouth. Well... You know, who your supervisor would be. Yeah. Probably someone from either the Sergeant would tell us who you're going on. And they didn't come with us. Those who were in Bournemouth. Right. So this was an RAF Sergeant? It's an RAF Sergeant, yes. I don't know. Who's... The baseman as well. I knew he was in charge of us in the office and he was very nice. Yeah. Hi. I quite liked him and he's got a wife. Not far from Ealing. Yeah. She was a nurse. Yeah. Different to the other one in Brighton. Yeah. Very different. Yeah. And... Because I can't remember. It must have been Bournemouth where I went to the Don's. You see, that was at the seafront. Where Brighton was right on the seafront at Brighton. And I know in the next hotel New Zealanders were in it. In Brighton. In Brighton. Mm-hmm. So is it a similar setup? Similar setup, yes. But you worked on the Australian? Not for the Australians. I don't know who worked for the New Zealanders but... Yeah. I know who went to a dance. New Zealanders were doing that. They'd do rugby matches, don't they? All bent down and jumped up there and they did that. That's the first time I saw that done. Ah. There's lots of things like that. I just can't remember. My friend, Green, he got married. And that was around the same time. Yes. I'd come home. Well, I got your dad then. Yeah. And Renie said, Well, you bought, you bought Ian with you. I can't remember it at all. Because your dad wasn't... Your granddad was abroad, you see. Yeah. So he didn't come with me. But she said, Marjorie and Bob came. My sister, you know. No good Renie, I can't remember any of it. I don't know whether I can blot out some things that I don't want to know. But that was quite pleasant to blot out Renie's wedding. Yeah. Yeah. I'm a bit like that. There's probably something I don't like or don't want to do. Perhaps I can blot it out. I don't know. Yeah. Yeah. And... Do you have another cup of tea? No, I don't. Thank you. Crazeman, probably in the November. Granddad went abroad in the February. So he never saw me with a swirled tummy. And do you know where Granddad was? In... Was that in 1943? Oh, God. Because I think he went to Algiers first of all. I don't really remember. I got rid of... I regret that. He wrote to me the most days abroad. I had a case full of letters. And I got rid of them. Never even saved one. You must have felt you needed to get rid of them. I don't know why it was I did that. I forget them. Why didn't you save one or two? Oh, you are immature. I've turned to myself. I call myself all sorts of things. This is when you moved? That's when we moved out of the city to... Oh. That was when it was. I've done that until then. I suppose you thought there was no need. It's five-year diary, you know. Yeah. Because it worked during the day, naturally, and do all the... Yeah. Because I remember when... Didn't he used to... When he wrote a letter to you, didn't he used to put... Have a code for... He did, yes. Every paragraph. Was the first letter... The second or the third letter. Yeah. Didn't you... But I'm wondering if they took... I mean, people... They must have known some lesson there. And what did Granddad do? What was his... What was his rank? Well, he went from pilot officer. I didn't even know he was an officer until he came. We got to... Came down to get married. He was in an officer's uniform. So you never told me. And I was a surprise. And he went to, you know, pilot officer, flying officer. Yeah. And I can't remember them. In the RAF, based in Oxbridge. That's right, yes. Okay. Well, I see. That's why I put him... Ian was... When he had to scarlet fever. I didn't know Dad had scarlet fever. Yes, that was when we were at Wallace's. That's why I've dropped him down here, scarlet fever. He was about to be in five. Yeah. And then Cos Jean called it. So they were in the hospital. I didn't see them. I dropped them for six weeks. They just take them away. They were in isolation. And let me... I see them. In fact, he was all right when he came out. His hair was all blonde and long. That's the person we have cut, didn't we? Not like we do now. And Jean didn't want to come with me. Jean screamed. She didn't recognise me at all, you see. She soon got used to it. Oh, because that's what I'm putting. Left for Oldham, 1957, I put a query there. Left for London Golden Lane Estate, Jean 8, Ian 13. I've jotted all this down. This is just a note in the diary. It was my memory, you see, so bad. Yeah, yeah. Because wherever we visited, I was probably naughty about this because I knew your grandfather would tell me. So I probably didn't bother to remember. It was very bad for me, I know. Because I knew where we'd been because he'd know immediately where we'd been. I remember we had spaghetti bolognese once and he said that he was in Italy, that he'd been based in Italy and that he couldn't quite cope with the spaghetti because it was too long, so he brought scissors. Because we weren't used to that, were we, spaghetti? So one day he took scissors to the table with him with the people who were there. Some of the officers misbehaved, yes. Told me how some of them behaved dreadfully. Yeah? Like what? Especially if they were out drinking. And we said, smart to catch it with it as well. Oh yeah, well that's like Ian, isn't it? When he was a boy, he shook it in bologna. It all went down the wall. Then what I got? Oh that's what boys, he's jotted down what he was doing. It's wintery, 43. Then he went to Wheaton, 43, 43. Cosworth, that's the officer's place I think. Right. Then Uxbridge in 43, up to 44. Blackpool, 44. That's where he did his training in Blackpool. I should be dribbling with these two. Oh yeah, you don't get it on the ink. Then he went on the Highland Princess, 44. 12 years, yes. Oh I did remember the right thing. I thought he went to LG as the first one. Then Naples. Naples in 44. 44. Then Malta. Yeah. I don't know where in Talfaris. General Hospital. And he goes into hospital. I forget what he went into hospital for. Something with his eye. Did the plane crash that they got when they landed. It wasn't very serious, I don't know. Where was that? It sounded like it was... I don't know, it was Malta. Cos then he's got AHQ Malta. Yeah. That's still 44. So there's nothing else then. That's the finish I think. Yeah. And what's the mug on there? Is that because it's the... Oh yes, he had that made when he was in... Perugia. Perugia, that's Italy, isn't it? I think that's Italy. 1945. Yeah. That's when he came home, wasn't it in 1945? Yeah. That's when they made him an un... I can't even say that now. Unpaid Wing Commander. Which he wouldn't like at all. Unpaid Wing Commander? Yes. What's that mean? Some of the troops were getting home. He wouldn't like that. Especially if he wasn't paid for it. Grand Elder wouldn't... I don't understand what he was made... He was given that. What was it? I have to look it up in the book if I want to see what the ranks are. Yeah. And it was made Wing Commander. Unpaid. That's not the word for it. Something Wing Commander. I've forgotten that. Yeah, acting. Acting. Thank you. Acting Wing Commander. And I remember him saying he's supposed to see some of the troops because they were all disbanding everything, you see. Yeah. And he wanted to get home, but he had to do that first of all. Which was what? What would he have to do? Well, he'd see some of the troops that they'd been sorted out, you know, to come home. From Malta? No, no. I can't remember where he was based at the last. Oh, it was somewhere in the UK? It could have been, yes. No, I've forgotten that. And he ended that in 1945. He wasn't involved with, you know, Japan or anything. He came home because he was not quite two, was he? Yeah. So, 44, 45. Yeah. Yes. So, I think it was the May. And then he's got HQ 214 Group as a base area. I don't know what all that is. Yeah. That's where he went after Malta. Yeah. And after him, really, because that seems as if I'm speaking to him, you know. Yeah. He didn't like Egypt. He stationed in Egypt. Yeah. And I think he had someone to look after him, cook for him. Oh, yeah. He'd do a lot of pictures, you know. What? Because he doesn't put down in here what he was doing, who was sent off somewhere. He doesn't put that down. Probably not allowed to. Yeah, yeah. In case it fell. But he's been to the pictures, you get all that. What? Sorry, he's been to the pictures. Yes. Met chambers when Commander Headquarters went to the Odeon, so they dare not love with Jeff, somebody, and Paul Lucas. What makes is that? That was June 23, 1944. He had a shorthand class. I don't know. He'd ever go anything that man. Yeah. He'd do the shorthand class. Yeah. He'd never waste a moment. He'd be doing something. So when you fell pregnant, how did you find out? Did you have to go to the doctor or did you just feel? Well, I must have known a Mr. Perian. Must have been the first sign. Yeah. So then down in Brighton, I would see probably the medical officer there. I don't remember that. And would you have to tell someone or the medical officer? No, I would have to go and tell them. Yeah, tell the medical officer. Yeah. I'm not sure whether he was in our hotel or in the hotel where I worked. I can't remember that bit. Yeah. And... It was something I didn't want. I really won't expect anything. No, it was my dad who said, well, you see, Granddad came home much more each weekend that I came home. Yeah. He said, what else do you expect? So you left Brighton in December before Christmas? No, December, something like that. In 1943? I was home in January. And then you stayed in Eving? I stayed with Mum and Dad, yes. And you just stayed with them? Yeah. Took some money over to Mrs. Mossy. Oh, yeah. Every month, I think, from Barclays Bank. You would? Yeah, I'd go and draw it, you see. Draw what your Granddad wanted me to give to her. Okay. Because I got... I didn't get annoyed then, but I did eventually, because they... Sable, his sister, got married just before her brother, Eric, was discharged from the RA. She knew when he was going to be discharged, but she wanted to get into this 633 Greenfield Road with her husband, new husband. Yeah. I didn't worry at the time. It was only as I got older, I realized what they'd done. And they... The money I was... They'd paid the rates, and I don't... By the way, I was giving my mum, and many money I'd talked to Sable. Yeah. Your Granddad's money was going and helping them out. Oh. Because when Mrs. Mossy died, Sable, she'd got another job, and I didn't even know where she was. I thought she was a... I think it was Heinz, where I thought she was. Yeah. She wasn't. Oh. Because the mother left the money to her, and the house to... No, the money to your Granddad, and the house to her. Oh. But fortunately, she became pregnant, and she bought a bungalow elsewhere. Yeah. Yeah. So I think what your Granddad was doing, you know? Yeah. For them. Yeah. What was... Do you remember Mrs. Mossy's name? This was Alexander Mossy's wife. Sable. Sable. The mother. Oh, married name, Sable. She's out in Australia. Oh, this is... Her sister, his sister. Eric's sister, yeah. But Eric's mum's... Guide. Well, she'd be a Mossy, wouldn't she? Yeah. If I go what she was before she was married. Actually, I had a phone call the other evening about four to nine. I didn't know whether it would be your hazel. Yeah. And he said it's your cousin from Australia, and it was Alan. And is this Eric's brother? No, no, that's his cousin. Oh. His mother's sister's son. Mrs. Mossy had a sister. Oh, right. And Alan's in Australia. She moved to Australia with her husband. Oh, okay. And Alan. Yeah. And I said, if you don't usually ring me at this time of night, if he rings me, it's usually half past eight in the morning. Yeah, yeah. Because it's their time before they go to bed. Yeah. So I said, what time is it now in Australia? Then he said about five o'clock, six o'clock and I can't sleep. Well, after a while, we're talking in there, you know, nothing, nothing. And then he said, I'm waiting for a call to bring Betty out of hospital. She got breast cancer. Oh. And a 24-hour, and then I thought, that's why you couldn't sleep and rest. You only wanted to talk to someone. Yeah, yeah. It happened to me. Yeah, yeah. Well, he's got to, he's been married before. She's, Betty is an Australian lady, that Anne, his first wife, died. Yeah. And they had two children. Yeah. Gary and, I forgot my other girl's name. Yeah. Now he's married Betty. Yeah. And he had a, a daughter with Betty. Yeah. So I'm not the daughter. I know. And so I've got his phone number, but I've got to get the Australian code, because you have to do that before your number, don't you? Yeah, yeah. I couldn't even ask how she is. Yeah. Because they're doing everything in the 24 hours, aren't they? Yeah. Because Ben had this co-pattern. Yeah, yeah. This keyhole. Yeah. The little holes in his tummy. Yeah. So, there was Mrs. Mosse and, and Alexandra. So you went home with, with your, to the state of your parents. Yes, but then went after a while. Eric said he thought he'd better go, go to, contribute to the house. So they found us a bedroom there. Yeah. And the front room. So we had two rooms there. Right. And you, Sib was there married, you see. Right. And so you, and you got married in the previous summer. Mmm. Of 43. That's right. So you were married, but you weren't spending, you know, that much time together. Yeah. Because you were in Brighton. That's right. No. Oh, you're actually, oh. Were you, were you married when you were in Bournemouth? So you just, you chose the ring in Bournemouth. And then you got married in Torquay. Yes. Uh. I was married in, in England in Ealing. And I had my honeymoon in Torquay. Oh, okay. That's right. Oh, where, where did you get married in Ealing? Well, the church, the Methodist church is gone. It's not there now. It's not there now. It's the shops are there now. Right. And the Muriel knows it. You know, I found out I got talking to her with Hilda and her. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. And her son lives in Hamel which I know, of course as well. Yeah. So there's lots of places that I talk about in Ealing. Oh. Oh, Muriel is? She came from, well, she's a Swindonian really. Oh, right? She just knows the area. She just knows, you know, with her son living there. Yeah. Yeah. Well, she's next door with something. She's a neighbour. She's just over the road. Oh. They're a protein. Oh. And it was Hilda who was very friendly with her and went to choir practice with her. And it was Hilda who recommended this place to her. And Jean didn't know this existed, neither did I. So it was quite a nice little area really. As Jean was saying, there ought to be more of them really, not sheltered accommodation but you don't pay anything there. It's quite a nice little place. I've heard one of the drivers who come pick me up at the taxi says it's a nice little area, this isn't it? Which it is. So you got married in Ealing and then... That will be 43 years. And in 1944, we were just living at home while you were pregnant. Yes. How were you supported financially? Well I took the drawers and some money out of the bar please you see, it's your month. The granddad's put in, Eric put in. Yes. But he was also paying for his mum and dad's. Oh his mum, of course the... I just had his pocket money. Right, and his dad had died in a couple of years. Yes, when he was about 41. When he was 17. Oh, okay. He was young, yes. Especially even before the war. And the dad was only about 41, he was 45, he was 97. Right. He was a heavy smoker. And did... He was a Scotch man, he was very Scotch. Oh really? Yeah, he came down from Scotland from Inverness. Air. Air. I always thought it was Inverness. No, that's where he went during the war. He did the granddad. And he was so impressed with the people that, you know, had him for a while. I don't know now why he went to Inverness, he must have told me. Because he wasn't in... We went there after the... When he came home after the war for a holiday. Yeah. And...