 name is will metaverse build the society for the better? So I want to start with you know the crypto thing what do you think will it prove to be a game changer in the metaverse? Take that so first off very good afternoon to all other people who have taken out the time to attend the session. I am Srinidhi the co-founder at Flippi and I just want to take a different angle towards this question as to if not crypto what's the solution instead of trying to plug crypto into this entire ecosystem right so let's think about what metaverse enables in the first place it's sort of like an extension of a real-world experience or a real-world interaction virtually so you're facilitating or you're enabling interactions with people without any physical or even virtual boundaries for that matter so when you talk about an interactive space like that obviously they're going to be multiple people and they're going to be businesses built on top of it they're going to be experiences built on top of it how would you power those experiences purely from a transactional perspective what is going to power this new economy that is going to that is going to be created and this is an economy mind you that is projected to be around at least like three to five trillion dollars by all of these major banks and all of these major players in the space so one of the things that crypto enables is it's obviously it's borderless you have like instant settlements and your assets are not tied to your identity right so these are like very fundamental factors your assets need not be tied to your identity so what crypto enables over here is a very seamless and it's sort of like a seamless way for people to transact within this economy and it's a technology that already exists it's something that need not be built from the ground up for this technology to grow for metaverse to grow but then again you know there are multiple other factors that come into crypto there are multiple other aspects of crypto that could be beneficial for example ownership of assets physical assets are something that you can own and something that you can transfer either in person or in value to other people metaverse will also come with its own set of assets and with its own set of like valuable things that people would like to own NFTs are something that could enable that in the metaverse as well so yeah that's primarily what I think crypto could do in the metaverse and purely from like a transactional perspective purely from an economy perspective this three to five trillion dollar economy needs to be powered with some kind of a currency or some kind of like a transactional economy that is something that the blockchain and the entire crypto ecosystem could help with in the metaverse definitely the game-changing aspect will again be something that crypto has already proved to be it's this there's a there's a potential to create value or transfer value over the internet which is something that Bitcoin started off with and this potential to deploy applications and own unique assets on the internet something that cannot be copied and pasted and it's like you know most fundamental manner so that's something that will be very valuable and that's something that's going to help scale metaverse so yeah that's going to be the primary application of crypto. Anke that come to you if you talk about AI how do you see it is beneficial for metaverse and okay thanks Pya well before we begin the implications of AI or the applications of AI in the metaverse most of which is going to be covered by Ganesh but anyway I think I would like to mention that the first VR headset that I purchased was six years ago from Xiaomi for 999 and very recently I purchased in Oculus for in access of 30,000 bucks right I wonder how much the ecosystem has evolved right from the from the times when the VR had headset was only used for viewing educational lessons with a more immersive experience wherein you can literally visualize the concepts of physics and chemistry in front of your eyes while being a part of the 3D environment to the evolution into what we now call as metaverse you know where the involvement of characters and brands have come into play right so there is a lot of evolution that has happened in terms of use cases right I now I see many startups attempting to create interview you know a place for interviewing candidates or place for doing group discussions etc within within the metaverse basis right I think these these experiences are helping us in removing the biases from our minds right when we have a face-to-face interview or let's say a video interview there are biases around the color of the person the gender of that person the facial features of that person and whatnot I think all those biases get removed when we replicate and create a parallel environment in the metaverse space right so and that is why I think as startups many people are figuring out multiple use cases the other use case that I can talk about and which is very you know phone to me is a startup attempting to create Mandir in metaverse right wherein people can have that authentic spiritual experience without the noise of the real world right wherein you can literally focus on meditation or getting that peace of mind it's such a beautiful use case I'm sure there are many more use cases they're going to come up and just like in real world in in in in softwares we try to implement AI to make it more intelligent make it more powerful and efficient I think it is the very early phase of metaphors where I think even the data collection has not yet began the user base is not at scale there are only early adopters who are spending time there or youngsters who are playing games there right as and when these use cases will evolve more people will start adopting to those use cases then the data collection would happen and and organically naturally engineers will think about using the data and creating more intelligent systems right through the use of AI so I think there's a lot that is yet to come and we are only at the beginning of this journey in fact I remember at Bobble we we have been approached by some of our clients a condom company want to create a met a space in metaverse to create sexual health awareness right a ride-hailing company wants to create a space in metaverse where they want to do things for women empowerment right there's so many brands who have entered into the game to leverage the engagement which is getting generated in those spaces right and these are deep immersive level exp engagements which is hard to find in traditional inventory or traditional social media properties where people are while watching TV they are also doing WhatsApp right so there's always a division of attention but when it comes to metaverse when you're wearing that we are headset you are completely involved in that experience and this is where this is the gold mine for brands and I see many brands attempting to create many multiple use cases with time the involvement of AI will also begin I think Vishal has joined us hi Vishal we are discussing you know how metaverse will build a society for the better so Ganesh will speak now yeah so the subject is very interesting like I'm pointed out we are in the very nascent stages in the metaverse still a lot of people are still figuring out what needs to be done and a lot of experimentation is going on but you know really a great potential your huge potential that is awaiting in front of us you know people say this is the next internet it's going to be three times bigger than internet so what does that mean so a lot of people are still experimenting and trying to figure out so with AI you asked a question how AI is going to have an impact on this metaverse right so that's a very interesting question way too early with the combination of AI on metaverse AI has been involved in certain aspects in in time in games probably like bots and things like that you know AI is one of the player that plays in the games you know certain we are used to chat bot trying to interact with the user collect the data and things like that you know that kind of a thing maybe it will be in metaverse once people get into the metaverse there would be AI players coming in trying to collect trying to collect the data and figure out how the user experiences right so it's a way too early but to answer your question on metaverse how it could impact the society I think that that has a huge potential there are multiple ways to think around right so metaverse on education what benefits it can bring in right so right now whatever we teach in school is I think I can relate it as more of a 2D kind of thing can you make it more immersive right you do your chemistry chemistry experiments physics experiments can you take them into a digital object can you make them try right first society right so depression is one thing right can you solve depression through a digital world you know fear of things you know fear of height you know can you solve things like that through the digital world right give them an experience slowly take away their fear right so people have fear for animals you know certain pets you know they fear the dogs how can you resolve this so these things are the benefits that you can really bring through the digital twins are in the metaverse so the scope is so huge so many areas that you can work on right so he touched on certain assets and certain NFTs and values that can be brought in to the metaverse and the commerce that can be built the economies that can be built so that the scope is you know such a large thing so very nascent at the moment and that's where we can we shall I would like to ask you what do you think like how metaverse will shape the future of technology if you want to like if you share your thoughts on it so I think you know there is a lot of misconception about what is a metaverse and a lot of people think of it as VR and 3d and all these things the problem is that metaverse is actually way beyond all of these concepts because this is just a way to access the metaverse I think a lot of people just think that because there is a 3d avatar and you are in a virtual world and you're wearing a Oculus suddenly you are in the metaverse absolutely no I think what is really happening is and you know and as you know we are working closely with any mocha brands on the concept of not just metaverse but an open metaverse I think what has happened is currently the world is dominated by five platforms Facebook Google Amazon Apple Twitter and of course bunch of other smaller platforms and all of us as users are locked into these platforms our data resides in this platforms our profiles reside in this platforms we are the one generating data generating engagement generating content but we have no say no ownership no rights of any kind on the platform Facebook Instagram can decide which account to shut which account to block there is no recourse you know everybody here has had some of the other experiences of their accounts getting hacked and all kinds of things happening so I think the fundamental thing about the metaverse and web 3 is for the first time and we are saying that can users of a platform have the control and have a say in how the platforms are run so think of what democracy did to the world you know previously I mean of course there are still monarchies and dictatorships but what the concept of democracy came in and that's how we as a country and there are rules and we all able to vote and participate I think that same concept is going on to the web 3 platform and these platforms are not apps they are all called metaverse so metaverse is actually a broader definition of defining a space where all of us are collaborating together now the user interface can be different I can access the metaverse on my phone using a 2d interface I could be using the Oculus I could be using a monitor I could be using augmented reality those are just different ways to access the metaverse and similarly your profile currently our profile is one photograph with your name that's it but that profile will become a 3d avatar and that 3d avatar will now be interoperable I think that is the bigger fundamental thing that just like if I travel from Bombay to Delhi to Bangalore to Boston I can take my bag with clothes in it which I purchased from five different places and I can carry my clothes my books my things with me anywhere I go and I can use them but if I buy a digital object inside a particular app like if I have an image inside Facebook or if I have uploaded a video on Instagram it's not interoperable because in the first place I don't own it I can't take it anywhere and suddenly the copyright and everything belongs to someone else so I think NFTs are going to become your digital assets which you will carry just the way how you put a painting in your house once I buy you know Akshaya's NFT which is so beautiful I can decide to put it on sandbox I can put it on the central land I can put it in my own house or tomorrow I can decide to just not put it anywhere and just leave it in my wallet so I think what we are talking about from a metaverse perspective is a much broader context and I think it's very good that we are having this discussion because there is a lot of confusion around what metaverse is and lastly the whole concept of cryptocurrency actually is not at all relevant in the metaverse discussion because you could decide to not use a currency you could decide to use a currency you could decide to use a subscription model you could decide to use a premium model so once you decide a user interface and a community guidelines you can then decide what is the way the community is going to transact so it's a it's a it's of course a very very evolving evolving project but I'm saying that in the next five to ten years most of the large platforms will not exist or we'll become very small because we'll all be wanting to use platforms where I get compensated for my data and I have ownership on the platform very well said I think I would like to compliment no right now metaverse people relate with VR headsets you know well pointed out no that's and to add to what we saw said you know a lot of times we are just thinking consumer market on metaverse it is beyond that no even industrial use cases you know if you're looking at no chemical plants you know pharmaceuticals health care you know how can you create digital you know twin of it you know maybe you can you know put in a created digital twin of an oil and gas plant and then how can you utilize that so all these are part of the huge ecosystem that we are looking at I would also like to know from you you know the potential of NFTs huge so where do you see that in the metaverse so like we saw pointed out no and you know it's all if you build everything based on blockchain and the NFTs are you know if there is real utility you know that's that's you know I would say the real utility NFTs would carry on the values you know if you own a certain asset inside a metaverse and if it is an NFT attached to it and then you will be able to trade that and then the value goes up and you know that's that's maybe I can add to it I think in today's time an FT in the digital format might have certain value but its value gets unlocked when we link it with some tangible aspect in the physical world as well I can give certain examples recently we have an award partners for some event 30 under 30 and each of the award winners the physical award got replicated or minted as NFT in bubble storefront wherein they got access exclusive access to that particular ownership of that particular NFT which also incentivize them for a lifetime membership and discount for certain certain things right so that way we were able to appreciate that winner or the one who won that award in tangible format apart from validating it through a unique identification in blockchain via NFT which they can cherish and keep for their lifetime right I think such use cases will keep coming in where that validation is required I remember one of the use case from another startup I was talking to which use blockchain for validating the student degrees right they are trying to create that database wherein they can validate student degree in very quickly and efficiently without actually talking to the university right or for that matter doing background what modifications for employees all of these data points which are which needs to be stored in a decentralized manner to give democratic access to all the stakeholders plus which the facts which cannot be changed later on right I think such use cases will keep coming up and that can be capitalized through NFTs yeah I think great points being made from all three speakers and panelists so just wanted to touch down on one of the points that we talked about earlier as to what will help us scale this technology better right I think we already talked about interoperability which is something that Vishal pointed out one more thing that we have to take care of is something called composability right while it's possible to take assets from one space to the other or like one experience to another experience it's also important for us to think about how can we build on top of each other's work a simple example would be what GitHub did to code or what open source did to code right now I can download any piece of open source software open open source code base and build on top of it for example what Android open source project is in the operating system world where people can just download the source code of Android and build experiences on top of it Samsung is building its own custom experience on top of Android it's very important that we think about it in a very similar fashion because there is so much talent and there's so much centralization of talent and code and development it's very important that it's made accessible to the rest of the people and the rest of the developers so that you don't need heavy investment or heavy upfront investment to build your own experience or to create your own experience or to build on top of someone else's work so I think that is a very important aspect of it and again coming back to the first question right I think this something that we were discussing discussing yesterday as well which is how do you ensure that for example how what is the main how do you ensure that everybody gets access to it right one of the points that you want to discuss about is the democratization of this technology it's very important that like Vishal and Ganesh and like obviously all of the rest of the speakers have also mentioned it's very important that we don't think of it as a purely VR and 3d kind of an experience it's very important to understand how do we define the min spec or like the minimum specification of hardware required to access something like this the min spec should not be like an 8k VR headset with 120 FPS so that we don't get a headache it could probably be as simple as accessing it on like a 5000 or a 6000 a piece phone so that you know while the technology develops with the needs of the people you know there's a path that is defined based on the kind of users that participate in the ecosystem if it's premium and if it's rich and if it's highly sophisticated hardware which is going to give you access to this technology it's not going to progress towards catering to like you know five six seven or eight billion dollar eight billion people that would technically should have access to the technology it's going to be the select few with like high spending propensity and you know it's not going to be a shared or like a democratized experience for everyone I think I just disagree on that one part right I think it is not really about it's already democratized I mean we are already the whole world every person in India uses WhatsApp today the only difference is WhatsApp is central lives I mean your data is stored in you know I don't even know where it is stored or what encryption it's been used but yeah WhatsApp today controls your data Facebook today controls your data you will now have another app where for the first time you would know where your data is who controls it when you delete your data it actually gets deleted and if somebody is using your data you will know and maybe you will even get compensated for it right so I don't think so it's about access everybody has a smartphone and I think people who only get more powerful smartphones and all of that right it's really about these apps and services and these products getting more popular I think that's really the question I don't think so it's anything about access per se okay all right I come back to you Vishal again I you know to I wanted to ask you you know if we talk about the benefits of Metaverse where do you see it will help solve you know real world issues do you think it has the potential or it's too early I mean just think about what UPI has been able to do in India from payments think about UPI is a public utility right it's the government who created a platform said no MDR today you know there are billion dollar corporates like Visa and MasterCard who had a little monopoly in this space and today a public utility like UPI which is created and now you know the whole system is open anybody can connect to it has suddenly created a payments industry which is completely different very very democratized I mean all of us have access to it the poorest person to the richest person can use UPI and similarly the smallest merchants right from a street vendor to the biggest store is able to use UPI I think that is what is the power of blockchain and Metaverse and Web3 applications in general that today think about all the apps we are using where we are contributing data all of those apps will change imagine all the millions of people who upload videos on YouTube and then we are the people who see videos on YouTube but who is making money Google is you know showing now 10 ads in one video and taking all the money away the producer the content creator is making patents a very small share as a user you are not making any money and just think about entrepreneur magazine I know as a as a media house you know you are forced to give your content away for free to these platforms and you are not making any money or very very small money in terms of advertising now if there is a new platform which says that hey instead of YouTube upload your video on my platform and I'm gonna reward you with tokens and similarly every time an advertiser is coming they are going to use tokens the consumers who are viewing these videos will use tokens and suddenly and there is a right distribution you know what percentage will go to who and so on and so forth suddenly you are creating a business model where the content creator and the content consumer is the center of it not a third person who is the content mediator today that is what is happening that content mediators like we say right it is the Dalal who is making more money than the the you know that same thing happened in farmer also right the farmer is the producer and the consumer and the middleman is taking away everything that is literally what is happening in the world of internet data as we say is the oil imagine all the data today is sucked in by these five or six large companies and that is what the web three and metaverse is going to change and we are all going to be part of it the best part is this is already happening so I'm saying that in the next three to five years you are going to see real applications starting to use this so this is really the next this is internet 3.0 right you know internet 1.0 was all about you you know yahoo and it was all that kind of more information led internet 2.0 became social where everybody was contributing and there was Facebook and now internet 3.0 which is web 3 what we call is all going to be about the participating economy where the two sides of the marketplace of content creators and produces the same thing even in the enterprise space we change okay all right you want to some insights solving real world issues yeah absolutely and I give some examples you know how it could solve certain real issues with right so those are some of the things I think I see real value in it you know like we saw pointed out as well and you know and also pointed out this lot more opportunity here you know social media changed how people consume content so this is a platform for the content creators you know and the content consumers like rightly put so we had if you see yeah we had radios and then TVs then internet came and now this is the new diamonds and that we are looking at so beyond the internet the much more immersive how can you keep people engaged right so keep keeping the people engaged and that's going to be the next diamonds and how can you provide customized thing that people need exactly what they need how to how to give them access to them so these things are the new ideas that would be coming out of the meadows one thing one sector which is coming to my mind is education if you want to talk about how you know metaverse will change it I think I already gave a couple of examples around educational interfaces that can be created in the metaverse well if you look at the core of it I think it's just like an artist lives in fragmented reality and you know creates a narrative an alternate narrative of the reality and and portrays it to a medium here the medium is metaverse which is an open canvas right now for people like us to sort of create real state which can solve certain real problems right and one of the problem areas is of course education I think the accessibility and the immersiveness of metaverse is going to definitely help educators as well as students to get deeply engaged with solutions out there now having said that the challenge still remains the infrastructure or the current infrastructure that India has I think it's at the very early stage where the infrastructure needs to penetrate in order for people to take advantage of the metaverse solutions around education secondly I think the shared experiences needs to be more empowered within the metaverse things like the feeling of senses you know the senses like seeing touching smell what not right all of those senses needs to be recreated and for those reasons there's a need for research or more deeper research around haptic technologies that that can help us get similar feeling in metaverse like the way we get in the real world I think that would lead to metaverse becoming more emotion driven and senses driven than just graphics AR and VR yeah these are a couple of points from my side on the on the education front I just want to add that you know Animoca has invested in a very interesting company called Brainy Tap I think you should look up Brainy Tap so Brainy Tap is going to be its first metaverse focused on education with an amazing concept of what they are calling study to earn so just like how play to earn which has come in the gaming world the idea is that can we create an ecosystem where teachers and students as they are either teaching or studying it gives them an ability to make money so that is one very big team around studying to earn and that Goki we are also taking the same team to help and we are saying can you be healthy to earn and make that a livelihood by earning tokens so I think this whole idea around education help and a few other domains where motivation is a big challenge right so literally we are telling people that hey please study because just the act of studying itself can make you money forget about the education which will of course make even more valuable later yeah I just want to touch upon like you know the points that were put forth earlier regarding how data is going to work and how interoperability and composability is going to work so a thought just crossed my mind so like you know basically it's known now how important data is for you because it's very simple right they drive ads or they drive certain interactions from their users which will drive to certain purchases or certain kind of transactions which is going to end up making money so the more data you have on a user the more the more you the more money you can pull out of their wallet and yeah so companies don't need to know you they just need to know your vector representation that's all they want to do right they want to create like a bunch of zeros and ones that's going to let them know what exactly you're going to purchase or what exactly is going to make you transact so from that perspective I do believe that there will be a lot of fight between centralization and decentralization even in metaverse I do not believe that directly all of the big money that is going into metaverse is going to give up ownership over data there needs to be an active or there needs to be an active development and an active fight by the overall community to take back the ownership of their data so metaverse does not inherently enable data decentralization or data ownership of the data producers so if we produce data if we have certain interactions we do not inherently own that data there needs to be layers or protocols built on top of the metaverse experience or on top of for example something like a blockchain which enables like you know permissionless access or like you know signed access to data something like that would be more beneficial towards the data that is produced and the assets that are owned in the metaverse than inherently expecting data to be decentralized in the metaverse so yeah Any questions from the audience any questions Hi good evening to everyone so my question is to Ankit Hi Amit from Plants Karidu I'm using your product an amazing product you have now hope the entire India and Bharat you'll use your amazing product so a question you thought we are very enthusiastic or energetic about the foreign products or US market which are distantly built that's cool okay yeah Chinese products if we are very enthusiastic so can we expect if we landed in the London or we are Frankfurt or Amsterdam then how can we get okay you are from India and the product we are using from bubble AI from your country so can we expect that type of expectation from you guys that's what the dream is and I'm sure you and I and many many of us will do that and will achieve it make it happen yes indeed that's the dream of the startup community today in India that we while we solve for India and this is saying I remember when I was in the Euro trip like you mentioned during my college days they used to say that if you solve a problem for India you are automatically solving it for the world because there is so much diversity here that if you are able to create that level of personalization that level of inclusion then it automatically includes various parts of the world right so for those reasons I think we are we are in the right market at the right time with the right set of resources and mindset if we can't do it now we'll never be able to do it but I'm pretty sure that the startup community in India today is all prepared to take over the world we have seen instances like by Jews sponsoring that FIFA World Cup and so on so forth right so the day is not far then you'll start seeing many such products out there when you land on Amsterdam all right any other question hi please pass on the mic my question that just a very straight question like how metaverse is going to help in agriculture sector and health sector when I ask health like I'm typically asking the question like our doctor if doing a surgery then how metaverse will help in that and agriculture also if you throw some light yeah so I health sector is one of the major places that metaverse definitely can bring an impact so which is actually already happening with certain companies so what they have done is in they created digital twin of human bodies this is to if you want to give a training for a doctor and you can use this digital twin of the body instead of you know actual but no rats or things like that so this is one area and another area is now with metaverse you know they are able to digitally you know come into the digital world even though you're sitting across your specialist doctor is seeking across the world and you are able to connect to the patient and the doctor nearby him and provide assistance through using the digital twin of a body so you can show this is exactly where no you need to this kind of a procedure and things like that and especially the doctor sitting next to the patient he needs advice from a specialist doctor so certain things like that is how already starting to happen and how it is going to help agriculture agriculture agriculture so I would probably leave it up to you guys to answer the agriculture bit but just to answer the insurance sector insurance part of the question better I feel my opinion would be there is a need for an oracle what I mean by an oracle is something that provides a continuous stream of access to a continuous stream of data from the real world into the metaverse or like you know we already seeing like technologies build technologies being built something like a chain link that provides access to real-world events and real-world data to the blockchain we need an analogy of that or like we need an equivalent of that for the metaverse to prosper as well as you know the insurance sector in the metaverse to prosper so we're already seeing examples of connected elements or like you know things like blood oxygen monitoring continuous blood oxygen monitoring and if you think about like you know vehicles you know there there needs to be a better way for you to translate or you are transferred or have an analogous element of your real-world assets in the metaverse as well so that there are elements of your let's say health profile or elements of your driving skill or like your driving let's say ability something something of that sort needs to be translated into the metaverse something that could be continuously tracked and be visualized right in front of your eyes so that you can course correct yourself as well as the insurance companies will have a better visibility into what your risk profile or your health profile or overall what is your vector representation like for them to be able to make better risk related decisions but I will leave it up to so I think I just want to add one thing that you know it is the right question is not what will happen to health in metaverse or insurance right nothing is going to be different metaverse and vectories more around the use of data where data is stored who owns the data data security it's largely around those applications and how is the business model of people's compensation so it's not that metaverse will suddenly be something new in agriculture of course the same application will have a different business model and that is the key differentiation between the metaverse and anything else it's not as much about something new because for example today there is a place called fortnite game where you can do a lot of these things online the only difference is fortnite is not open it's a closed system owned by a particular company so you are able to do virtual surgeries robotic surgeries even today with or without the metaverse the question here is the data that is really what you need to think about and what happens to your digital assets which you are purchasing today in any ways in these apps and what happens to them it is largely around those questions thank you thank you very much look I'm not sure how an insurance company can build a core use case in metaverse but I'm definitely sure that any company beat any sector can at least do marketing and advertising on metaverse right and that's what we enable at Bobble happy to talk thank you just one more question from that lady yeah hi to everyone here I am Betty Nangia the owner of the brand Betty skincare so the questions just now did give me a clarity but still as Vishal mentioned like a person like me who has to popularize my brand and reach to every person so our platforms are naturally Instagram Amazon trip card right now I want to know is how metaverse is going to help us in our brand people are going to see us there or it is just my locker that I have there so I just needed a clarity there what is the category of your skin care or personalized skin care products basically and I'm into wellness also energy one one big difference in the metaverse is that it is now going to be how your brand can embed inside the experience so think about it there's a virtual character can this virtual character apply your product in the metaverse and become younger or their skin can glow it is no longer about showing an ad and saying click here which is how the current advertising model works where they interrupt you you are seeing a program or you are seeing scrolling something and suddenly there's an interruption and there is an ad which is shown and then you are supposed to act in the metaverse if you see a lot of experiences and I think the best example is you should look at sandbox sandbox is integrating a brand experiences within the product itself so for example they are creating Times Square inside the metaverse so when you go inside Times Square you will be able to see these buildings with holdings and stuff or there is an entire beauty street where there are brands where your avatar can go and try the the latest cosmetics and so on so I think it is going to be a lot more experiential marketing rather than the current form of marketing how are the people going to come to be open platform like Amazon and Flipkart and Instagram so think about it like a like a mall where people will be coming in with their 3D avatars typically I mean if you if you can Google some of the Unilever campaigns and Unilever is also having one of the categories of skincare Unilever has launched multiple metaverse campaigns and I guess there is one for skincare as well wherein they create experiences so why whether you use your smartphone or you use your VR headset to enter into that space and go through that experience during that experience they highlight different USP's of the product that experience could be as simple as a game right you're running around and finding out things it's like a puzzle or something right wherein you are trying to figure out the nuances of the USP's of the product that you are selling and at the same time you are enjoying that experience right so your product becomes an integral part of that experience and therefore creates a deep impression in the subconscious mind of the player right so this is how bigger brands are already attempting to create experiences around their products and categories and be you know and create a deeper connection with the end consumer which is otherwise not possible in traditional channels like Instagram and Facebook where then you can just display your thing but you cannot actually make them interact or make them deeply engage with your product right yes the characters have been added emotions have been added and people are living that world right so they are living that your product but anyway so your category itself is quite contradictory to the concept of metaverse wherein people want to remove those biases right whether you are fair or you are dark or you know whether you have got a pimple or you don't have a pimple I think all of those biases are getting removed in the metaverse but yes there could be innovative campaigns and yeah it's something that needs to be brainstormed based on upon and it is going to be impactful thank you Vishal so much it was a valuable insight you did and thank you panelists