 Yw'r cynyddoedd brafford. Y cwysig y mae'r cynyddoedd Joe Cuck. Mae'r dddug i'w gyda'r ddechrau ac mae'n mynd i ffodiad bryffodion bryffodion. Mae'r cynyddoedd Joe yn cynyddoedd. Mae'r cynyddoedd Joe fel y cynyddoedd Joe, ond y gallwn y gwybod cymaint gyda'r cynyddoedd. A'i ddefnyddio i brafford. Mae'r cynyddoedd Joe yn cynyddoedd Joe yn cynyddoedd Joe. Roeddwn i'n ddiddordeb am ddiddordeb yn y rhan iawn. Dwi'n gweld i'n gweithio heref, ac mae'n gweithio'r poryn am fynd i'r hyn, a dwi'n gweithio'r gwaith iddyn nhw'n ddiddordeb. Felly, mynd i'n feithio yr mwyaf y ddechrau. Dwi'n ffordd i ddechrau a nesaf i ddechrau, ni'n dweud yn y Llyfrgellus I blach. Dwi'n oed yn y eigentlich ynglyn â'r City of Bwasiaid. Felly, iddi'n amser ar y city of Bwasiaid? Dwi wedi ar y city of Bwasiaid. Felly, rydyn ni'n meddwl am ynglyn â yma. A yn y ffordd fally, rydyn ni'n meddwl amtenaeth pob gan hyn o'r oed. Of on the 16's. Made my debut when I was, when I turned 16. So I've always been involved in the high side of it as well. But yeah, no, I enjoy going up in Bradford. They taught me a lot of respect for the people that I'm playing against. And I've always tried to influence that on the field. Try to bring that over on the field, am y gallu bod yn ei wneud a'r blaenau a'r bydau,'r bysbwyntau mewn gwahodol i'r hyn yn ei wneud. Rwy'n mynd i'n mynd i'r byd i'r byd i'r byd. Mae'n ymddangosu am y coff, yn y ddechrau, mae'n eich bod i'n dweud, mae'n eich bod i'n ddillol i'r bobl yn gyffredinol. Dwi'n roi'r bobl yn y maen nhw'n arno i mollu. Mae'n hyn yn oed bob i'r cambell. A oeddech chi'n gweithio'r corb oeddech chi'n gweithio, mae'n ddysgu bod yn fath o'r rhan, ac mae'n gweithio'r corb, ac mae'n gweithio'r ddau, mae'n gweld y gyrfa, o'r ses, oeddech chi'n bob i'r cambyl, mae wedi'n gweld yn fawr o'r gweithio'r gweithio'r gweithio. A dyna'r hanes fydd yn oeddech chi'n ddau'r gweithio'r gwaith? A wnaeth gweithio'r gweithio'r gweithio i dda, neu oed i chaf rhai ymarfer. Mae'n rhan cael ein bod yn i gael yn rhywbeth o'r bellach. Rwy'n cael ei wneud gennymau cael gael ymryd, mae'n rhoi ar dda bod yn nhw'n meddwl â'r stadion. Wrth bod ni'n sion o'r rhaid oherwydd ein pethol o'r rhaid o'i mi yw i'n myfanyddio myfaniaeth rwy'n meddwl'. ac mae'n gwybod i chi'n gweithio cynghoru. Ond a'r hynny'n mynd i ni gwybod i'ch ddweud hynny'n ei gwybod i chi'n gweithio. Felly yn ei gweithio cyd-ddyl wedi'i gwybod i'r golygu y gallwn y Cyfryd? Mae'r gweithio yn y gyrfa. Mae'n gweithio fel y gwybod i'r pleidwyr yn gweithio, ac mae'n gweithio'n cyd-ddyl. Mae'n gweithio'n gweithio'n gweithio. Mae'n gwybod i'r gweithio'n gweithio'n gweithio, The Schokhans went back to the centre circle and kicked off again, nowadays it's a ritual that they have to do after the Schokhans and I don't think I can possibly do that. That's not in my character, it's not in my character to be flaunting about after the Schokhans got to centre circle start again. that is amazing to say that because I scored. I ran from the off-ware line I took it round the goalkeeper and scored and I knew it was in not when it left my foot but the minute I heard the cross the cop raw it was there they must have anticipated that moment before I even knew I was going to do it and that feeling still sends as I might know it. It's nice to score and have a win. It's a combination of what all the effort has done to get that ball into the net, that's what makes it worthwhile. Having spoken to Sais, he said when you walked in the change room as a young player the status that you brought, the physical presence that you brought, lifted not only him but a lot of the players, established players in the change rooms, How did you see your involvement and your introduction to the first team? Well, it got me. My character got me that fast in life. I want to say I wasn't big-headed because I've never been like that. But I had confidence in my own ability. The managers and the coaches brought it out a little bit more so. Dwi'n fwy i ddim yn ymdillwch, gallwch gydag i fynd i'w ddych yn dweud yn bwysig i gydag i fynd i ddyddai. Tynio'r cyfosio iawn i ddim yn bwysig i gydag i fynd i ddych yn ddych. Ond oedd o'n ddych yn ddych yn ddych yn ddych yn ddych yn ddych. Gydag i fynd i'w ddych yn ddych yn ddych yn ddych yn ddych yn ddych. Mae'r W — dwi'n mynd i'r parwyd o'r parwyd? Fi wnaeth i'r chemio yn breddartod dros yr huredd ynddi… ac roedd y gwirionedd. Awn ddod o'r ddod i'r cyfnod yn ardal! Rwyf ni'n meddwl i'r cyfnod ar ddofod! Roeddwn i'n meddwl i'r peth yma i'n meddwl i'n meddwl i dda, i'n meddwl i dda ar y cyfnod! An oedden nhw'n mynd i'n meddwl i'r Pag genEDEE o'i adond! Ac i'w ddau'r ysgolwch, ac mae'n ddau'r ysgolwch yn y ffordd o'r ysgolwch yma, rydyn ni'n ddau'r ysgolwch. Ond oes ystod, mae'n ddau'r ysgolwch ar y ddau, mae'n ddau'r ysgolwch ar y ddau'r ysgolwch. Rwy'n gweithio i gydag y defnyddio'r ysgolwch, mae'n gweithio i gydag yma, ac mae'n gweithio i gydag yma. Rwy'n gwych, eto, mae'n ddau'r ysgolwch, mae'n ddau'r ysgolwch ar y dystyried, mae'n ddau'r gwerth yn norrust i gychydig. Ond mae'nobaes'i oedd yn y modi eme, i gael sicr tylko yn draw ddatanc mewn aml approaches, Ac mae'n mynd i galedogfanaeth, ac mae'n femw i tan innie yn gallu seating i investigated, oes frog pobl. Rydyn ni'n tappedigいますfa iddo ni'nyl i'w mwyn pävin y ba, oherwydd ger tych ddedد aoton, gan y dyfodol. cloves. I mened here, at that time, he says, right, obviously, he knew I was a centre half as well, so he asked me to play there again, so I went there, I went to centre half and then Oxford bought me as the centre half and so home to play centre half for Oxford for vred, and then similar thing again the manager that Bill Reeves, the manager puts me up front there because he knew my scoring me was close as well so I was a bit over Siw'i gyda i gynnwys am y cyfrifio a li oedd y clyw, ac mae'n amlwg â sydd i'n byw yn cyfrifio'r un o'r cyfrifio achos rydyn nhw'n nhw ddod fwy fwy rhan. A'r hyn, ond mae'n edrych yn cyfrifio, a rydyn nhw'n nhw'n nhw ddod fwy fwy rhan hwn i'r pwylliant. Felly gyn nhw'n nhw'n ddylai i'r ddiwrnod yn yr ystyried, ac mae'n ddod fwy rhan hyn yn rywyddoedd go sgwrdd. Mae hyn sydd yn eich hunodd, mae'r cyffredin. Gwyd angen i chi'n meddwl gyda'r cyffredin yn y mewn ymlaen amser. Yn ymddangos i'r ei hyn, i chi'n meddwl Teri Ddwllen, Mae'r cael pwysig yn rhan o heb yn bobi. Rwy'n gwybod i chi'n gwneud yn ni fel bob i. Mae'n meddwl, mae'n meddwl. Mae'n meddwl. Mae'n meddwl. Mae'n meddwl i chi. Felly Mae Cispo, mae'n i ddweud fel y wych chi, ond yn y wych gael y lwyddo mewn. Mae Cispo! Mae gymaio allan yn sicr iawn! Mae gymaio allan! Fy os eti! Look wedi'u bod yn cael eu bod arna? Felly yn yw'r mynd? Felly yn y mynd, mae'n cael ei wneud. How are you keeping anyway? Ten! It's a looser! You're joking! I can't believe that time has gone so quick man. Now to celebrate Black History Month, one of the particular games that you played in back in those days was a cesspods testimonial. Tell me a little bit about that testimonial and why it was so historic and why it's really a landmark game for Black players from Bradford especially. I don't know if it's correct but I think that was the first testimonial for a Black player because obviously they weren't any many Black players in the league or if they did happen to come along they didn't last too long and so Cyril was I think the first one that actually got to a testimonial stage and it was nice that at that time in all the leagues from the first division which is at that time, second and third and fourth division you could get a team of 16, 17 players to play in that game and that was the whole of the football league Black players and that was about it so everybody knew each other from Brendan Batson playing West Brommer in the first division to me and Cyril playing in the fourth and everything else and anything in between there as well. Growing up in Bradford you could not imagine the buzz in the Kiwamia household when we knew there was a cesspods testimonial but there's going to be a team of Black players against a select Bradford City 11 it was such a buzz a one-off situation and something that has lived with me forever what do you remember anything particularly about the game? Not too much about the game but I remember a lot about the friendships that we made like I said probably never met some of these other players prior to the game but we kept a lot of us kept in touch with each other after that as well so it was nice to see that we weren't the only ones because when me and Cyril were playing in the third and fourth division there there was only me and Cyril in the third and fourth division so every team every ground that you went into you never saw a Black face and so it was it was nice for us to at least be able to go out together and what I really want to to understand is how did your family feel coming to the games knowing that you and Cess were at the game really pioneering I know at the time you weren't seeing it but you are the pioneers of the modern day Black players how does your family perceive that? Well it's funny you should say that but as a when I first started 17 18 years old I used to leave the house my family my family home on a Saturday morning or depending where we were going and I came home Saturday evening and my mum and dad said where have you been? Seriously wow seriously I've just been over to Blackpool we've just been over to wherever to I've just been playing and they all right okay then and that was it they weren't they weren't over in that they saw it in the papers the telegraph and agus on the Monday or wherever um oh is that where you've been type thing but I didn't broadcast it I don't know if you know me but that's the way that's the way we are and they think all right yeah okay did you win? What about neighbours and friends how did they perceive Joe Cook in Bradford playing for Bradford City? Yeah I think I think the non-family thought more about it than whether my family were just trying to play it cool or I don't think it was just that the way we are just the way we are that we don't take things for granted don't don't get me wrong we work hard at it but it's not the being an end of the world you know you're playing you're your player so you're you're up there on a pedestal you still got to live life and that's what's since I've retired from football and I've seen a lot of the lads go wrong along the way uh so I've been able to maintain that that level that level of discipline or that level it's been I've played football I've enjoyed it moved on with life and I've gone from that side as well it's it's great hearing you talk like this because it really hits home that you're down to worth modest person and I just need you to know what an inspiration you are you don't really know how much you inspired a generation of of black players well well I hope I've inspired them to for better things shall we say even if they were going up the rails or if they were just thinking of something else and that just helped them to put them back on the path that's that's I won't say my legacy but that's that's that'd be a good feeling for me I'd never know but it would be a good feeling to to yeah I can confirm I can confirm that when you take the field as a black player especially in 95 96 knowing that Joe cook had played on that field knowing that um ses podd had played on that field and knowing that you can have heroes like Bobby Campbell Joe cook and ses podd and realise that dream one of my main help was was Ryan McFarland when he was the he's a manager here he helped me from my uh positional point of view and my uh my thought my thinking forward point of view so he helped me a lot he helped me in more ways than one so um yeah Ryan McFarland was a big influence on my career as well it's funny you should mention Roy because my early introduction to Brafford city was through Roy McFarland you know he came during one of the training sessions at Apley bridge at that time and he scouted the young players playing down there so yeah the England international Roy McFarland being at Brafford city along with the likes of Trevor Cherry and you know those kind of international players i'm sure would have made a difference when it came to tactics was it just normal tactics 4 4 2 or has the game changed in terms of how they set up is it changed so drastically do you just think it should just be a straight 4 4 2 because well yeah it's either 4 4 2 or 4 2 4 but there wasn't that much variation from that basically it was four at the back four in the middle and two up front and occasionally there might be four three three but not too far apart in senses depending on who you were playing but no i wasn't too concerned about that my man they were just down the middle so whatever went around the wings and everything else was depending on the game was the different thing altogether all i was concerned was the main danger area was the box whether it's going forward or coming back you and sesua quite cos is it is it right that you both lived maybe two doors away from each other and what was that dynamic like the relationship going into the football club and living away from brefford right at the beginning there was many black players and i don't think it i don't think it was the the coloring that brought us close together um but it did help because we had to form some sort of barrier because like today's today's um games you've got probably about six black players and five white players in most teams or vice versa and in those days um if you saw a black player on another on another team it was a miracle but it was it was something it must have been related to him or something cos you had to see him but now it is it's changed i mean the crowds um for that reason as well a little bit more aggressive because they didn't have any black players on their team so they tended to um well say abuse you but try to get you going uh and so the more they got me going the more they chanted the more the more the more effective it was for me right so they were they were shooting themselves in their own foot by having to go at me cos i just up my game a little bit more so than than normal did you have a special relationship with anybody on the players on the pitch whether it was like when i played i had a good relationship with my um counterpart fullback and we're in Jacobs um when you played did you have a good always playing at the side of you and yeah i think so as well i think you need to to know your um your partner shall we say you need to know your partner because if he goes for a run you know you've got to fill in for him and so forth and uh you've got to trust him you've got to trust you've got to trust him because he can make a fool out of you just as easy as he can make a fool of that up of himself um so you've got you've got to trust your partner um yeah that depending on who basically who's playing center half with me and i mean for a long time was Peter Jackson as Peter um i spoke to him the well i spoke to me the other day and he's and he said um which was which was enlightening it was thanks very much for your helpful when i was growing up um and i never realised that i'd had that much influence on him but he said it said that and uh that was quite pleasing for me so help him help him along the way and it was a and it was a good play don't get me wrong but i mean when we used to go to to the way games um and and and you get the i would say the abuse obviously the the the chanting and so forth um it was there and but that built character you could either that's in life you can either bow to it you can bow to it or you can you can fight against it or you can or you can realise to it it just depends on the person you are and going through the apprenticeship of of getting onto the field that that gives you some sort of strength gives you some sort of strength to go from that side whereas if you just get thrown in later on in life and you've not had the was it the backbone or you've not you've not had the the the education or the and when i say family family values as well family have helped me along the way um not to be sort of complacent with it not to not to take it for granted it used to work at it i think there's a good game joe i think we've done what we needed to do i'm i'm really pleased with how it's turned out it's been an absolute amazing experience lads i want to introduce joe cook for one game and one game only joe cook's going to come in and the legend that is joe cook for black history month is going to give us a real feel of how it used to be back in the day being in the whole change room not the away this is the whole change room from back in the day from the 70s 80s 96 when we were promoted this is the change room when it all happened my seat was here joe do you recall where you sat when this change room where i sat um possibly over there to be honest yeah really and walking into this change room what's your initial feelings when you walk into this change room like now my initial feeling was i wish i had my boots i would um turn back the years if you could turn back the years but uh yeah it's a nice feeling you can't turn back the years but you've got from what you had before you can you can you can never lose it you can never lose your year like your history and so it's a it's a nice feeling i think it goes out say you're an inspiration to a lot of players that come into this change room you're a brafford laddatz came from the youth team that's been promoted with the team you played centre half and centre forward so i've got to have to say joe i don't know if we could afford you in this day and age when it came to somebody that could score goals and stop the ball going into the net you know and talk about some of the colleagues that you had in the change room that made this change room i won't say i was an inspiration to people i just i just i did a job and i did it to the best of my ability and um i hope people fed off that that they could feed off the energy of that then then i'll have done my job but i didn't go in with the intention of trying to make people like me anymore like me anymore just do a job and then do the best of my ability and that's all you you can hope for you as a person when i say inspire people tell me what your role in the team were you captain and i believe you were captain for most of the teams that you played yeah well yeah i was captain here and i was captain for all the teams i've played for from oxford and brotsdale exit rexham i played in europe with them in europe against in the spanish first division against spanish first division teams but yeah it's it's it's part of my life it's not my life it's not all my life because there's other things in life but it's it's a good part of my life and i've enjoyed it and if i could do it again i would do it again in a heartbeat give me a little bit of how you felt in a matchday experience what run me through um your time from leaving the home to getting into the chain of the team being named what was it feeling what was it feeling like playing up but i'm sitting knowing the expectations well if you if you could speak to my wife you'd be going crazy because i was very superstitious i had to do certain things um on the matchday i can't remember of and what it was but there was certain rituals i had to go through um and it and it seemed to give you me not not confidence but it seemed to be it can it flow rather than um enough if i missed any of the bits then there was a little bit of apprehension there but uh uh generally speaking um you prepared it through the week and then hopefully it was going to happen on the saturday or the wednesday night and what does it what did it feel as you were coming down manningham if you're coming in from manningham way down the hill into the car park and then the buzz of the fans at valley parade getting ready to take their seats all their stand it was it was a buzz i mean the people have been working hard all week and then this is their relaxation time coming to watch us play football so we're hoping we're going to entertain and better than that hoping we're more than that we're going to win the game for them so it's uh there was a buzz of expectation and a bit of apprehension but that's part of life that's what that's what makes it makes it worthwhile that buzz do you realise your success and the legacy that you've left now at brafford city there is now when you play for brafford city an expectation of winning and this is down to the teams that you played in do you do did you sense that did you know you were building that at the time no i didn't know we're building it but i mean we went out there to win the game and luckily we won more than we lost at home anyway and so um no we're like in life you always look for the best and if something happens in between then then it's bad luck but you you go for the best going again looking around this change room i can see in my mind's eye you know but if i was sat there mr jakel's would be over there and there'd be other players that would be in and around you know so we talk about eddy yal's a nicky moment i'm going to look and and talk about how it's changed so when we're in this change room so the manager would address everybody from here was it same in your day the manager would come in and address yes and it's standing it's standing in the centre and then um you'd be the manager no give me a little bit of a peck talk come on no it it's up to the um i'd say i want to say the main players like to say um certain certain positions where's bobby exactly bob bob bobby um certain three kicks and go through them again um who's picking up who and so forth and i think he will have done your homework through the week anyway but that's just he's just recapping he's just recapping on certain things and then come at halftime if you're not doing the job that's when you get a a scene till shall we say i won't swear on this or you're not ready to but yeah it's it's as a manager's job that's his that's his that's it to manage a team to make sure that you're doing the things properly um and as a player you've got to implement it on the on to the field law of averages the numbers say that you've got 60 40 50 percent black players the law of averages says at least percentage of that should go in some of around the management side but in the coaching side not in the hierarchy um so the numbers say that they should be up there it doesn't add up it doesn't add up and this is what the concern is so when we talk about taking the knee now is it going to make a difference no i don't think it's going to make much difference to be honest i mean and and it's like everything else it's like an advertising board if it's been there long enough people stop looking at it and so you've got to change the colouring of it you've got to change the the thing of it uh for them to start oh something different there yeah yeah but if you they just blase the people then after a while they'll just they'll just talk above it they'll go to talk something else whereas before right at the beginning like everything else when it's new you look at it you've got to keep re readjusting it you've got to remarket it remarket it once you're financially secure then you can buy your own business you can you've got ambition to go and do what you need to do but in football you you need a mentor you know you need that's what i said to you jo cook walking into the changing room makes a difference because he's been there seeing it done it right we need to be inspired that by that kind of leader i think yeah once one or two start going through then it start going resonates then it'll start resonating towards the um so the younger element but you've got to to break the ice first you've got to break it into it we've been breaking the ice for 30 years yeah but it's it's it's it's a bloody thick ice it's a bloody thick ice it is man it's it's it's like it's polar ice it's polar it's a polar cap it's a polar cap trying to break that one now it's not it's not one of them that's in the fridge in the fridge where it melts it melts in your in your glass of wine or whatever do you remember a particular game or particular games because you got promoted with brafford city so what was that like uh one of the one of the best games i can remember was against norwich yeah i think it might have been the quarter finals of the cup um and we were we were falling we weren't doing particularly well in the league at that time but for some reason the the the the cup was keeping it keeping us going so i seem to remember that game for the for the finishing really for the how we finished so it's uh yeah that's one game that stands out in my mind um yeah the southampton game was disappointed again they went on to win the cup that year we got beaten the i think quarter finals um and if we had beaten them and we had a good chance of actually getting to the final uh from from now but but yeah it was a close game and uh disappointing but uh we brought a little bit of um notice to the city by playing by playing uh so well a real highlight for me in my career was getting promotion up by the parade um and what i want to talk about is your promotion more importantly and the pitch invasion that occurred on the day that you got promotion there's not a lot i can remember about it to be perfectly honest i mean you go through those moments um and it's it's not a blur but um the enthusiasm of the the crowd made it worthwhile as well um but yeah the spit there's not a lot of much i can remember remember about it to be honest it's just a blur from them see it's interesting because again like when i think about brafford city you know and promotion especially i think about the open top bus that we had you didn't have an open top but did you i for some reason i remember promotion always being celebrated in that corner and they're coming out and holding the trophy just above where you come i for some reason in my mind that's always seems to be where promotion was celebrated but in 95 96 we were lucky enough to have a civic reception and we went came from valley parade all the way into the city and i have never experienced anything like that because not just was it the whole city coming together you know but it was just a glorious glorious day a fantastic day um from the weathers point of view from the fans point of view and you know we always would like to celebrate promotion but you've experienced them that and i'm sure that like you've just said there the memory and i'm i'm hoping you've got some footage of it because that memory will be in the hearts of a lot of brafford city fans and just for as for you it was just a moment that i think for me i think it's more relief more release and anything we finally crossed the line we went across the line and by the time you come back down from it you know yourself after the game you're still on the high the adrenaline is still pumping and it takes a long time for it to come down um hence used to go out if we went out for a drink afterwards at least it used to bring it back down again but um it's more the adrenaline that's that's pumping in you and you don't you don't you can't take everything in until you look at it um many years later like you like you say like you say but when you're when you're in that moment i don't think you can appreciate it as much as you as you should if you could if you could harness if you could harness it um then then it'd be ideal but it's just a blur everybody's running around and doing the thing i was saying well just finished a game the journalist still pumping um you can't enjoy it like you should do it's only later than you can enjoy it then yeah at that moment you can't enjoy it i don't think so personally anyway that's it i know a joy that you went to st blaze and in my upbringing um i've been blessed with a faith that believing that anything is possible you know and i prayed that one day i would have um success in my life and braffa city brought the success um how do you feel about um your destiny you know do you see i think i've achieved my destiny to a certain extent i mean like you said you prayed for the success i i prayed for my family i say that um i want them to be healthy enjoy what they want in life um and and be a good person i mean it sounds a bit um i would say i don't know i don't know what it sounds like but i'm just thinking i've got a good family my immediate family my my children and my parents obviously i've lost them now but my sisters and my brothers and my brothers um and we meet up regularly we have a good laugh and it's we call his renter party so once we get when we get together it's a party so it's um when i see families that fall out for no reason or don't see each other and say well i'm not seeing my sister for 10 years or something like that it just breaks my heart when i speak to ses the first thing he'll say to me um is when i ask him about braffa describe braffa city he would the first word he says is family yeah yeah you know very much so do you feel that yeah i do i'm gonna like to say more so like when i was playing because all the lads came through the ranks together later on they were buying imports in and they were coming into play a certain amount of years two or three years and going out again whereas the lads i played with i mean gary watson and i still see gary now on a regular basis he's got his own capy business so he he does jobs for me at my place what about barry deliga because he was from st beed's yeah i haven't seen barry last time i saw barry was um i was about three at the golf club i think right okay you play golf no you asked me earlier when we walked into this changing room you know where the big bath was right that goes to show how much times have changed we've gone from the big bath to the ice baths now yes yes you know so it's such a comparison and uh i just want to come in here because this is strange for me because it's now a toilet and we would have gone in there all the lads back in 95 96 and 80 you know yeah we would have just climbed in that big bath and thought no of it you know celebrating as we do we've just recently come through a pandemic and it makes you realise how together the team at brafford city was you know i don't know if it's but you had to be quick if especially if it was a day like today where it's raining and it's all muddy and the pitch is muddy you've had to be the first in the bath because if you because if you were the last in the bath you might as well not have got in the bath see i forgot about that yeah yeah yeah because that bath took a hell of a long time to if you had any advice to the young players of today what would it be especially the young black players of today what would it be young lad at brafford city abo isa you know just come new to the club what would you encourage him once he gets onto the pitch what would you say to him like like the manager would say to him and just do you do you do you do your best of your ability um if it works i mean he's on the pitch because he's got that ability if he's got the character um that's when it that's when he's going to go forward to get that character it's got to have been inbuilt from a family relationship to a to a environment where he's been brought up um similar to the american boxes or the boxes for example they've been brought up in the in a rough environment so they've learnt to fight and then similar in the from the box from the football side of it you've got to want you've got to want it like everything else in life you've got to want it whether you're black white or indifferent you've got to want it and if you don't want it enough then you're not going to make it you're not going to make it no matter what colour you're on in terms of character now what you're talking what do you need to do to win the fans over at brafford city as a player a black player as a white player as a player as a player so show effort that's it end of end of matter if you show enough effort uh the skill will come through obviously because you're on the pitch in the first place if you if you've got this if you've got the skill and you don't put the effort in then it's the skill is is neither used nor ornament if you've got the effort and you haven't got the skill then the effort will get you through a little bit further than just having the skill alone but they want to see enthusiasm they don't want to see you bury your your your head in this in the sand on your hands if you make a mistake want you to get up and have a go again make another mistake um that's life that you want to try to do your best just keep trying that's that's what the fans want to see just keep a try and what would you if you could give a message to the brafford city fans um for the time that you spent down at brafford your two spells at brafford city what would that message be thank you that's it really to be honest i mean because they've always been good to me the the fans at brafford um and i've seen some players not not cry but i've seen some i've seen some the fans make some players crying on there on the things but yeah no um even if we've lost the game it's a silly game that we should have won they've always been okay we made a fan so it's one thing i can say else i wouldn't be pleased still can be coming back here doing these things uh if the fans weren't good to me what what so you're not going to come back are you well as a fan of brafford city jo i want to say a massive massive thank you not just on black history month but for the legacy that you've left at brafford city for not just black players but for all players of all colour because you have been a true inspiration and you will always be a legend in my eyes and for many fans eyes so i want to say thank you for doing this interview with me today okay thank you