 Think Tech Hawaii. Civil engagement lives here. Aloha, and welcome back to Talk Story with John Waihe. We got an interesting show this afternoon. My special guest is a colleague of mine and a regular here at Think Tech Hawaii, Jay Fidel. And we are getting together, as we've done on a number of occasions from time to time, to do a program that we call Politics Uber Alice, which means politics above all or politics in general. And just talk about the state of politics in Hawaii, the world, and in general. So what you got today folks are two wonks. Two wonks, you know, a little bit more than nerds when it comes to politics. Nice to be here with you, John. Oh, it's always great. I mean, I've invaded your shows for the same kind of thing. So here you are. Okay, let's get started. Hawaii State Legislature just ended. Depending on who you talk to, you know, the grades are as usual mixed. There's nothing that was really big, but look like nobody is particularly sad. Except, and here's the thing, and I wanted to talk about that, except that there were a couple of bills, something very unusual happened. There were a couple of bills, one that had to do with the airports and maybe making it more efficient and privatizing it. And one that would have updated the tax credits for energy, for energy, you know, and we can discuss more of what they are because what was unusual about all of this was these bills were in conference, which meant normally that there is an opportunity for the House and the Senate to, you know, come out with a compromise that everybody's happy. And I guess all the people, there are an awful lot of people supporting these bills. Supporting it felt that it would, that's the course would happen. And yet it didn't. Yeah, it didn't because the Speaker of the House decided that the members that were part of the conference committee, he would be called back. So I, we don't know what happened or why it happened or anything, but I thought it would be fun. Jay and I thought it would be fun if we ask the Senate chairperson, Senator Lorraine Inouye from the Big Island to tell us, at least from her point of view, what happened to those two major bills. We're really interested in hearing what she has to say about it, John. Have you heard about it ever happening like that before? There was a time a few years ago where the conference committees collapsed. It was late in the evening. I don't know exactly what the mechanics were. Usually they collapse from exhaustion, though. I think it was exhaustion. Yeah. In this case, they were pulled back, as you said. And that's different. And we should find out why. Okay. Well, anyway, you're much better at this mechanical stuff. Okay, I'm going to dial. Okay. We are folks, we are now dialing Senator Lorraine Inouye. We're just hoping this telephone does work. Hello, Senator. This is John Whitehead. And I have with me Jay Fidel. Hi, Senator. Nice to talk to you. You know, and we were just laying some of the foundation for our conversation. But first of all, tell us what there were two bills that we are interested in, which you were involved with trying to get out of the legislature. Both of them sound like there's important things that we should be doing. Maybe we'll start first with the airport. There was a bill to, what was the bill about the airport about? Okay. Well, first off, let me make sure I have my phone on speaker. So can you hear me well? Oh, yes. It's fine. We can hear you very fine. All right. Otherwise, you tell me if I should take it off speaker. Anyway, the bill relating to the airport cooperation is SB, which is the Senate Bill 2996. Okay. 2996. SB 2996. Correct. And this was, as we all know, was establishing the Hawaii Airport Corporation and to assume all of the authority, which includes of course, the powers, the functions, the duties, the responsibilities of the Department of Transportation relating to aeronautics and the airports. And so this would have been a landmark decision if it passed, because, and you know that as well, this would have been the first time that a high powered airport under the jurisdiction of the Department of Transportation in the state that would sever its ties from government operation. And this would be a step in the right direction, as well as creating a mechanism so that we can speed up processes such as construction and have a nice airport like we do on the on the mainland as well as throughout the world. And so this actually was a big, my biggest step back. Okay. And then Senator, I'm sure that you just didn't think about doing this, you know, just out of the out of space. I mean, you got you actually spent some time studying it and it was our third try. This was our third try. Okay. And you went to you visited other airports in the in the world really, that had been privatized. Exactly. And not only including just myself in the Senate, but accompanied by my colleagues in the House relating to subject matter in the House Transportation Committee and the and the chair of the Tourism Committee in the House as well. So, you know, there was so much enthusiasm, you know, that we can then proceed with working on legislation, which ended up with Senate Bill 2996. And what happened? It looked like from where we are that everything was going well, they look like you were about ready to come out of conference with a some kind of compromise bill that would accomplish the idea. And I'm assuming that you're doing this to make the airport more efficient to get things built quicker. Yeah, exactly. And it and at the last minute, the conferees from the House were pulled off the committee. Is that it? At the, I would say the day of the last day of conference, not knowing, well, we thought during the final week that no indication whatsoever that the bill would die, because the House asked us to consider the House draft, which would take out the procurement 103D out of the measure. And as we got to the towards the end of the conference, that the Senate felt in my discussions with leadership, perhaps because we have a three year trial and the three year initial start of this cooperation, that that then agree with the House that we include the procurement portion in the bill because of the three year that the authority. Right. So that that's the normal process of adjusting the bill. So but nevertheless, the never, nevertheless. So the Senate did agree. And we offered that as well to the to the House that the Senate will agree to the House draft, which would have put back the the language so that the authority could look at it within the three year period. And so nonetheless, it was a big surprise at the last minute when the House decided to give them perhaps another hour because the clock was ticking and you know, Governor, if there's a final time, a limited time at the six o'clock deadline that in the conference committee by the Senate at the request of the House chair, the and the committee conference committee to delay it for another hour to iron out something. So low and behold, when the clock started ticking, about 430, I believe that indication from some of the House context to myself as well, that speaker of the two nine nine six and dispensed with the committee. Which, by the way, meant that you that meant that you were that was it. I mean, nothing was going to pass. Now, let me ask you, let me ask you, though, it seemed that there was a whole lot of support for the bill. And oh, yes. And in fact, just some limited opposition, mostly from people who got government contracts. But this is not the only bill that that happened to you also had a second bill that was dealing, which I thought was a move in the right direction was dealing with moving some of the tax credits around for energy. And it's built to one 2100, which would be the tax credit for the you know, for the solar and wind. Now we will. Yes, we would move in the direction of the industry to another level that where it's at in our country as well. And so this was also another disappointment. What the House ended up doing was they watered down the complete bill. So at the end of the day, the only the only language that they agree to was relating to the energy storage only for residential. And there was a cut off date of seven years as well. So I guess that the reason why I'm bringing up both of these bills is they both seem to have a lot of popular support. And yet and yet these committees were dismissed. Exactly. Now, no, not with SB 2100. Okay. We did between representative Chris Lee, the energy chair in the House, when this was watered down to only looking at residential energy storage system and everything. It would not work. It would not help the industry at all because we cut off the the energy storage tax credit for the commercial side as well. And so it would be deemed not worth the effort. And so between rest Lee and I, we decided, you know what? This is not going to help at all. So let's defer and and come back next year again as well. Senator, we want to thank you for taking the time to to talk with us and we want to, you know, keep up the good work. We just so you know that they are people who are watching what you do and we appreciate what you do. We hope you put those bills in again next year, Senator. Both of them. We weigh in people that they are many of us at the legislature who are there to do the people's work. Well, thank you, Senator. We appreciate your time and your commitment. Thank you, Senator. No way. Aloha. Aloha. At this time, we are going to take a short break and we will be right back to talk more about politics. Ubalis. I'm Pete McGinnis-Mark and every Monday at one o'clock, I'm the host of Think Tech Hawaii's Research in Munna. And at that program, we bring to you a whole range of new scientific results from the university, ranging from everything from exploring the solar system to looking at the earth from space, going underwater, talking about earthquakes and volcanoes, and other things which have a direct relevance not only to Hawaii, but also to our economy. So please try and join me one o'clock on a Monday afternoon for Think Tech Hawaii's Research in Munna and see you then. Good afternoon. My name is Howard Wigg. I am the proud host of Code Green, a program on Think Tech Hawaii. We show at three o'clock in the afternoon every other Monday. My guests are specialists both from here and the mainland on energy efficiency, which means you do more for less electricity and you're generally safer and more comfortable while you're keeping dollars in your pocket. Welcome back to Talk Story with John Wehe. We just got through hearing from Senator Lorraine Inouye from the Big Island, who is the chair of the Senate Energy Committee in the Hawaii State Legislature in talking about two important bills. Remember these numbers, folks, follow up on Senate Bill 2996, which would have privatized the airport, and Senate Bill 2100, which was there to improve the tax credits for the delivery of solar energy. Now we get to play, okay? So here I am with my buddy Jay over here. And Jay, what's on your mind? What do we go with all of this? It's politics, Uber, all this. What about the common good? Both of these bills have been knocking around for three, four years. A lot of research and a lot of lobbying has gone in, a lot of testifying, a lot of work has gone in to advance them, and they were right there at the cusp. Yeah, you know, it's such a, it's a bad thing to do, obviously, because, and I'm talking about it just from a process point of view. If you're going to oppose something and you're in the leadership, and you're going to agree with a lobbyist that maybe against the weight of the testimony, it's better to do things earlier, you know, first to try and get the parties to find a solution. But you're not supposed to cut it off at the last minute. I mean, that's not a good thing. I can't imagine how people could like what happened. Whatever side of it you're on, you question the process. Yeah, well, it's like the national scene. Okay, okay. I know I was hoping that we could have one conversation, Jay, when you and I don't go into our favorite subject, but it's not going to happen today. And that is our president. Talk about not looking out for the common good. I mean, we got a president and this Michael Cohen thing. I don't know. You've got to tell me. I don't know where this is all going to go. The great disappointment for me is Rudy Giuliani. I thought he was a pretty good mayor. He helped bring law and order to the city. He was well liked by pretty much everybody. Even when he was US attorney, he was, you know, one of these guys who upheld law and order. Yeah, yeah. And now he seems to have lost all of that. He couldn't give a rip about the common good or law and order. And he is actually part of this effort to lie to the people and confuse the people, which from the president, from the White House, obvious lies left and right. And Giuliani's right in the middle of it, participating and actually making it worse. Yeah, you know, and there's this whole thing about what happens if the president gets a subpoena, you know, is he above the rule of law? What he shouldn't be. But I don't think he is. I think Giuliani's wrong. Well, you know, this is the crazy presidency. And what is, well, look at, look at Senator McCain. I don't want this president to come to my funeral. Right. That's saying something, isn't it? Oh, yeah. I mean, people need to realize that McCain was a war hero. And the exact thing that Trump said about McCain was that he's famous because he got captured. Me, I prefer people who aren't captured. You know, that sounds cute. But in my case, for example, my brother-in-law was a POW for over three years. I mean, it didn't make me feel good, you know. And he said that. But this is the president that we have. And the constant undermining, Rudy Giuliani is now part of a team whose job it is to undermine the very institutions that he upheld. Yes. How could he do that? How could he live with himself? He's, you know, if he went down, he would have gone down well in the history books before he is not going to go down well in the history books now. No, no, not at all. And well, I don't know. You wonder what corrupted him this way. I suggest, John, that Trump corrupted him this way because everybody around Trump gets corrupted. There's no exceptions. And they don't get supported. Yeah. I don't know what to pale. In the end, Giuliani will be fired like the rest of them. Exactly. And then he'll be, he'll get his, he'll have his, you know, he'll have his career tarnished. All of this will happen. And for what? For what? You know? And this is a self-destructive stuff. Well, look at like some of the others like Kellyanne Conley, you know, and she's in there and she, she tries her very best. When they hired her, when Trump hired her in the beginning, I thought, well, at least maybe somebody can make some sense out of all of this. And it turns out she's as lost as everybody else. She did a lot of lying, too. Yeah. And it's refreshing to actually get a tweet from her husband, who disagrees with the guy's a staunch Republican, by the way. It's not like he's, you know, what about Hawaii? See, the sad thing about what's happening, and I'm going to be heretical right now, you know, sad thing about what's happening on the national level is that it influence what will happen in Hawaii. And right now, people in Hawaii are, for the great part, very much in disagreement with what's happening in Washington, which means that the Republicans in Hawaii have a tough role. They do indeed. It was tough enough when, by the way, I am for a two-party system. I mean, we need one in Hawaii desperately. The first part of our show demonstrates why you need it, you know, because all you have when you don't have a two-party system in Hawaii, what happens is basically you get run by factions. Right. And factions are like the magnet for lobbyists. They'll play the factions against each other. And there is therefore no cohesive policy, you know. And there's no sunshine either. It's a back room operation with factions. Well, that's the thing about it. But it's making it harder for them. Look at the Jew, Charles the Jew, is probably one of the most conservative Republicans we have ever had run for office in Hawaii. I mean, you know, he's definitely not a Hiram Fong. He is definitely not a Pat Psyche. But he felt that it was important that he changed his party membership, not change. He just left the... Dropped it. He just dropped it. And if that happens, you see, there's something wrong with all of this, you know, especially for those of us that that really believe and hope that government can actually be a tool for good, you know. Now, that might not be what some real conservative Republicans think, but in Hawaii, for the most part, people like to believe that government can be used to do good things. Well, you know, I'm open about these things. And there's a lot of people who might vote Republican, might have voted Republican on a given measure before. But what's going on in Washington? It's not just Trump. It's all those Republicans who are well into the right. That's the real sickness. Yeah. That's the real sickness. The regime, the Republican regime. And they would rather be in power than do with CIA. Operating on self-interest. Realizing self-interest every day. It's really sometimes nauseating what they do. And supporting Trump when he's obviously wrong. And taking measures that are obviously not for the public. And doing things like undercutting the FBI, the CIA. Now, I'm not one of these guys that say we ought to protect an institution right or wrong. But it gets to be really dangerous when we start criticizing our institutions for political gain. Just so we can maintain power. But hopefully the upcoming elections will be a change. Maybe we'll have a change. Maybe this whole thing will change. I mean, after all, this is a country that survived the Civil War. This is a country that survived the Great Depression. Survived the recession. What you're saying, though, is it's a big challenge right now. Oh, yeah. And our survival is actually threatening. All right. Yeah. Well, anyway, it's always fun to talk to you. And politics, Ubalis, is our new phrase whenever you and I get together. So folks, thank you. We will have another show for you in exactly two weeks.