 Come on in Good morning. My name is Randy Zadra, and I'm director of international programs here at Carlton and I'll serve as your as your moderator and emcee this morning I'd like to start this morning's Session by introducing dr. Rosanne Rante who's the president of Carlton University and I'd like to ask Rosanne to come up and and welcome our guests Roseanne I'm very pleased to thank you in the University Carlton This year Canada and Mexico are celebrating 70 years of bilateral relations and This is just two years before Carlton University was founded. So we're the same vintage a wonderful time Carlton is committed to supporting and enhancing the Canada-Mexico relationship and In 2012 the Norman Patterson School of International Affairs published as part of its ongoing series a book called Canada and Mexico the Unfinished Agenda and that was our 70th anniversary So it was a very fortuitous action, but the book even its title gives us a challenge for today So I'm glad to reunite many of the authors. I see in the room today To take the agenda set in that book forward It is particularly timely because our three Prime Ministers and Presidents got together for a trilateral Submit recently and Our bilateral agenda is still very complex Much less with three We would like to deepen the academic relationship between Carlton University and Mexico and see our student and faculty exchanges Multiply see the research Grow it is I believe very important that we have Enlightened policies and enlightened policies come through better knowledge and better Understanding and that happens through the work of great scholars like those at Carlton University And it's obvious that a university president gets to brag So how can I help but brag about the Norman Patterson School of International Affairs? Known around the world for its excellent work. How can I help but brag about our? Political science department former chair is sitting right in front of me, and I know she's participating in the program How can I help but brag about our school of public policy? Which is about creating good policy not just for Canada But for the world and if we do support education and bring our scholars together I'm sure that we will build the bridges that will make a better future. I Really appreciate the leadership of our ambassador Suarez He arrived recently in Canada, and I think one of his first stops was at Carlton University if not he diplomatically led me to believe it was and and He has been most supportive, and I'm glad to see this event happening here at Carlton University I hope it's one of many and It is my great pleasure to welcome dr. Sergio Alcothair Mexico's undersecretary for North America in Mexico's secretary at a foreign relations to us today It is really extraordinary to have a diplomat who was the Equivalent of the provost of the university that means that he understands the importance of academics He and he was coordinator of innovation and development those are two big words that are lighting everybody up today and To be the coordinator before those became big words is really prescient I think he should be really at home at this university, which is indeed Canada's most innovative university just ask our students When our students go out and talk about innovation, they don't just talk they compete They put their ideas on the line. So the most entrepreneurial Student in Canada the award went to a Carlton graduate student this year a second year chemistry student and In Canada there's an ideas contest and Carlton submitted a number of teams And they announced the first prize in Toronto Carlton University. Everybody applauded. It was really great Second prize Carlton University everybody applauded. It was really great third prize the last prize Carlton University and all the other universities said well, they're no more prizes and we said oh gee You've got to learn a little bit of innovation from Carlton University So we are an innovative institution. And so it's really appropriate to welcome you here today It is also a great university the University of Tonomaika that that you have led And I think that there are many links with Carlton University Secondly our speaker is an engineer and when I think of engineers the first thing I think about is building bridges and What better? Occupation could a diplomat have than building bridges of understanding just move the metaphor a tiny bit engineers translate science into practical outcomes and I would like to see some practical outcomes today that we move from the theory to actual Accomplishments and do change the world engineers are known for being efficient economical and innovative and what a pleasure to start a freezing cold morning with someone who's going to be innovative and economical and efficient and then engineers have the Quality of working in teams. They work together to create good projects and I think that could be our motto for today and for the next 70 years as We celebrate working together Canada and Mexico to create a better North America in a better world Ladies and gentlemen, please join me in welcoming our speaker Good morning everyone and of course the first thing have to do and this is not only because of good manners but also because of Of the nice words that the president run to mention and thank you very much for this very kind introduction Indeed, I am an engineer and engineers are good in terms of giving very short speeches because We are not very good at writing and talking so we're much better at numbers perhaps So well, thank you very much And I'm thrilled to be in Carleton University as president run to mentioned I'm an academic only from the university So I'm just for some time at the Ministry of Foreign Affairs and of course as the president Peña pointed out when I was appointed by him the idea is to indeed build bridges between Mexico and Canada and Mexico and the United States, which is the the purview that I have to look after the North American region Why Mexico and Canada are so important to each other? Not only because now we are on the 70th anniversary of our relation, which is indeed very important 70 years ago the relation was marked by the end almost the end of the time of the Second World War Which we didn't have too many things in common perhaps being in Bretton Woods Together at that time, but not so much 70 years later We have increased our trade dramatically just in 20 years and past the trade has increased eightfold The the North American Retreat Agreement have helped to integrate the economies between our countries so we don't only See each other we manufacture together we build things together and We manufacture cars, which is the most obvious and evident thing that we do But one thing that we need to do now is to innovate together as Professor Runty mentioned These are the the key words for the future and the key word. I will say for the future is Knowledge and we need to build this and I'm very happy to be here accompanied by three outstanding scholars from Mexico Professor Sylvia Núñez and Teresa Gutiérrez as is both from the National University of Mexico Susana Chacon from the Monterey Tech and who will give you an Outline on where we are in Mexico. What are the prospects of these very interesting relations that we need to to build? much stronger and I'm very happy that our ambassador to Canada and Francisco Suarez Davila Was very instrumental in putting together this this seminar that I as President Runty mentioned Is looking forward not only sharing experiences and ideas But also to getting the feedback from you on where we need to move this relation for the years to come I'm very happy that several our friends from from Canada are here Jennifer and Duncan and I'm sure that we were learning from you throughout the seminar today Our country's phase interesting challenges in the next few years as President Runty mentioned our leaders will be meeting in Few days we'll be happy to host Prime Minister Harper in Mexico City and the 17th and 18th of February in an official visit We want to highlight his presence in Mexico because both from Mexico and Canada from Canada for Mexico and Mexico for Canada is the third greatest or larger partner in terms of trade and We exchange ideas we exchange people we don't exchange as many students that we are to Mexico is number eight in terms of the number of international students in Canada and Canada is number six But it's long ways to go. We have four thousand or so Mexican students in Canada and about four hundred Canadian students in Mexico and I think there is a room for an ample room for for increasing those kind of Exchanges but one thing that we'll be discussing on February 17th and 18th and more in the 19th We're President Obama joins the two leaders from Mexico and Canada is how can we make North America the most competitive and dynamic region of the world is 70 years ago ago the Competitiveness or the captains of between countries was the key issue that drove the economy and politics Right now it's not globalization. It's regionalization is is we we we compete in in terms of regions And certainly North America is one that is responsible for producing about 28 29 percent of the of the world the world of product Whereas in Asia similar amount about 30 percent is produced by 13 countries and in Europe that amount is produced by about 28 countries, so I just have only three countries that take over about a third of what the world is producing every day and If we want to to be as competitive as we have been of course We need to to increase our exchanges and we need to be more innovative and and certainly now the new paradigm and energy place or will play an important role in in a new wave of industry industrialization in the region and Giving or attracting industries that will really make a comparative difference between our countries so I'll thank you very much for for having this seminar and I think to Carlton University to be a great host and I look forward to the results of this meeting I think that what we need to do in the North American region is to to have a structural study and methodology methodological assessment of where we are and where we want to be and in order to have these scholarly research and an Exposure of the of the opportunities of North America and this is this can be done of course in a university like Carlton and having this Prime Center for international studies certainly helps and certainly is a Key guarantee that a good result can be attained We're very fortunate to have Ambassador Radetzky who is ambassador from Canada to Mexico who is an alumni from Patterson and She she brags also for being an alumni from from from Patterson And I'm we sure that they have in these background again can be very helpful in Understanding much better between our two countries and also understanding the region by itself So again, I will thank you very much and move forward for the for the results and Well, thank you very much Thank you very kindly dr. Akoset and dr. Rante for Setting the framework for today's discussion We have an important morning this morning. We have a number of very distinguished guests Which we'll take this very These very ideas forward and so we look forward to this and and thank you all for coming It's it's wonderful to see the room full and I think I believe that's indicative of the interests that exists in taking this relationship further So with that I would like to ask my colleague Laura McDonald who many of you know Laura has done a tremendous amount of work and really leads our initiatives at Carlton with respect to Canada, Mexico Relations she's worked on many many different things. I don't have time to go through it all but she is going to moderate the next panel So I will I would like to ask unless you would like to introduce the panel Maybe you could do that and then and then we can proceed to the first panel session Laura Okay Okay Thank you. It's wonderful to see you all here today. Welcome to dr. Alcocer and His Excellency the ambassador of Mexico's ambassador Suarez and many many familiar faces in the room On this cold snowy day So he's thinking globalization is supposed to be about the death of distance And the fact that we could bring such distinguished Invitados to Canada and such extremely short notice I must confess is really a testament to some of the marvels that globalization has wrought in our lives and Really thrilled to welcome you all here today. Of course, we may discover that we haven't entirely conquered distance in trying to forge new relations with With Mexico But there are many important things to discuss. I just like to put in a plug for the idea of more academic exchanges I myself have led about three. Yes, three North American mobility program grants that brought to Mexican students to Carlton and sent Carlton students to Mexico over the course of some 15 years, which was Fantastic to have that wonderful exchange and to have Mexican students in my classroom was just amazing for the other students So I hope we can continue to do more of that. So it's my great pleasure to introduce this panel, which is going to discuss Sort of an overview of the state of the relationship over this past 70 years between Mexico and Canada and we have a very distinguished group indeed So each panelist will take about 15 minutes maximum and Perhaps I should just introduce each of them in turn so that So that people will remember who they are when they're speaking So first we have a great friend of mine Maria Teresa Gutierrez Ases And we've been working together in fact for quite a few years. So it's a fantastic to have Teresina here with us today Dr. Gutierrez is a senior researcher in the Economic Research Institute of the Intonomas University at UNAM and Distinguished member of the National System of Researchers in the National Council on Science and Technology Conocita. She received the Governor-General's International Award in Canadian Studies in 2007 for her outstanding analysis on North American relations And she's really a pioneer in analyzing Canada-Mexico relations She has participated in many international commissions for the governments of Canada the US and Mexico in 1995 she was invited to participate in the Steering Committee of bilateral relations on Mexico-Canada by the Ministry of Foreign Affairs of Mexico She's currently a professor in the Faculty of Political and Social Sciences at UNAM and has published many books on the subject So welcome Maria Teresa Oh, they don't need Okay, good morning First of all I would like to thanks the Mexican Embassy in Mexico and Cartoon University for this wonderful invitation Thank you. I was here when we celebrated the 70th anniversary of Mexico-Canada relation And 10 years later I am here again and that is absolutely great Je voudrais aussi remercier l'ambassade du Mexique au Canada et l'université du Cartoon. Je voudrais aussi remercier les professeurs qui travaillent ici à l'université de Cartoon, les universités francophones Je suis bien content d'être ici But I'm going to present my paper when Ambassador Suarez asked me To be here, he asked me to make something like an overview of the historical relation I will try to do my best It's impossible to talk in 50 minutes about 70 years of relation, but I would like at least to present some important highlights in the in the relation Toward the end of the 1990 When Mexico and Canada decide to negotiate a trilateral free trade agreement with the United States They suddenly had to confront an undeniable fact During the past 50 years Neither one had advanced it in their knowledge of the other Throughout the negotiation process Those who were in one way or another connected to NAFTA try to gain expertise In the shortest time possible regarding the most relevant issues of Canadian economy and policy In order to define a strategy for the Mexican negotiating team Which in most cases I would call defensive rather than complementary Although much data was collected and many documents were drafted The information that was gathered on Canada and Canada was mostly Related to issues considered important in relation to the negotiation itself and did not focus On those aspects that could that would lead to a greater knowledge of ununderstanding between the two societies Now with the standing alongside the negotiation Another process developed One which in my opinion was no less important Toward the end of 1990 a growing number of person an Organization in Canada began to study Mexico from their own professional and political perspective also Canada this phenomenon Continuous and counter of two societies was An is a process in which in most cases Was free from control or regulation required by official agencies Mexican or Canadians Thus there were two parallel movements towards the mutual discovery One began and grew as a need of groups directly involved Basically civil servants at all levels of government from those secret areas Secretariat which considered themselves more involved by the negotiation Commerce and industrial development for an affairs agriculture labor mine and natural resources Among others at this level in my opinion the Mexican negotiating team Hesitated and decide to concentrate its energy on its strategy regarding the United States Not much time was spent on creating a Canada file Which could later serve as the basis for future negotiations Since the main worry was the agreement with the United States This attitude clearly reflects what was and will continue to be the Achille Hill of Mexico-Canada relation The overwhelming presence of the United States in its neighbors political and economic affairs During the Canada US free trade negotiation in 1987 Canada commit a great deal of its human and monetary resources to the bilateral agreement When the time came for the tri-lateral negotiations It felt that it was necessary to repeat that effort as Regarding Mexico the Canadian focus on protecting a quiet interest and trying to obtain new Advantage from the tri-lateral relation At the later moment the official Mexican group which included representatives from the government and business community Felt that it should rectify its strategy and pay more attention in Canada to Canada This change came about when groups opposing NAFTA and trade unions began a debate Which addressed the need to answer at least two important questions Why was the first free trade agreement unpopular in Canada? What lessons made Mexico learn from the Canadian experience and does avoid making the same mistakes during the negotiations? Towards the end of 1990 Two important conferences in Mexico became the watershed between the old and the new attitude towards Canada The first was organized by the National Action Party Traditionally a middle-class party political right wing and historically the pre-main opposition Whose members for the first most part come from the private sector and has an enormous influence in industry and commerce The main purpose of that gathering was to take advantage about the Canadian experience in this matter Before to officially take and stand about the negotiation of NAFTA 18 renewed Canadians were invited to discuss the impacts of CUTA in the Canadian economy The diversity of the speakers reflect the diversity of contemporary Canadian society Various political opinions and parties were represented Government and private sector representative as well as dissident attended representatives from the different provinces, academics, etc Since it was an event organized by a center-right political party The public was much larger than that which would have attended a conference sponsored by a left-wing organization The conference brought in its wake important consequences entrepreneurial groups learned much from the Canadian interlocutors, the co-exec entrepreneurial export council which represented the Mexican private sector during the negotiation Was directly influenced by the Canadian business council on national issues experience The Mexican negotiating team prepared a good deal on its strategy starting from the Canadian experience and agencies such as Pemex, Petróleos, Mexicanos Listened attentively to the discussion on CUTA negotiation related to the energy sector and the proportionality clause Which required Canada to maintain its current share of energy exports to the United States even if Canadian experience short days During the second conference, which was held only a few days after the first More than 40 Canadians again from various social organizations and trade unions spoke out against the bilateral free trade agreement Their statement came as a surprise to the Mexican public who of the Sudan who of Sudan became aware of important aspect of the Canadian situation and some of its problems This conference to lead to important consequences It spawned the Mexican Action Network which encouraged critical debate regarding Mexico's role in the negotiation It also had an impact on the Mexican labor movement because it uncovered the huge disparities that already existed between the two countries as regards salary, social security, labor rights and union practice Another important result was the current opinion that Internally to the creation of the NAFTA side agreements or labor and environmental issues However, during the 1992 and at the beginning of 1993 The pressure exerted by the US government and certain civil organization who were concerned about election and human rights in Mexico forced Mexicans into seeking a closer relation with Canadian political organization The creation of Mexico Federal Electoral Institute Received significant support from election Canada like was the Institute became interested in Canada 1992 constitutional referendum and 1993 Canada Federal Election and Mexican Legislator attended regularly the conservative party convention and also the Quebec Party and the Liberal Party conventions The relationship of this institution narrowed over the years and the large number of if a officials were training in Canada Thanks to the advice of election Canada Observers of the election were trained in this sense the democratization of Mexico has a great depth to Canada All of these elites to conclude that over and above the trilateral agreement It is a fact that civil society in both Mexico and Canada has cleared away The smoke screen that separated the two countries in this way the human flow between these nations Will not easily be stopped nor will it be dependent on commercial exchange or investment ventures The parallel agreements the side agreements together with the NAFTA have given rise to a new Relationship which will compel both Mexicans and Canadians to exchange Knowledge and opinions and above all a citizens of the North American region to coordinate their policies Although the most immense part of the negotiation has been the debate concerning us interests We cannot deny that the Canadian Princess and initiative regarding Mexico has been greater than that of the United States I would love like to discuss Briefly and discuss what had been the nature of this relationship between 1994 This relation does not begin in 1990 nor in 97 When true door foreign policy look to Latin America as an answer to the third option the relation That's back to the end of the 19th century in 1865 before Canada was a confederation representatives from richest colonies Canada Nova Scotia New Brunswick and Prince Edward Island met in Quebec To discuss the possibilities the Mexican market offered as a commercial Alternative to the US market This point to the fact that both Mexico and Canada have lived through similar though not always Concurrent process the relationship to the United States share a common past which yields an instructive lesson Since they're beginning as independent nations both were interested in established Alternate markets to reduce the excessive weight of the US economy What were the Canadians who traveled to Mexico in the 19th century like? We can speak of a significant Canadian presence at the beginning of 20th century When a group of venture some entrepreneurs Invested in the modernization of Mexico infrastructure This business pioneers who came to the fore during a period of great economic prosperity in Canada in 19 considered Latin America did the ideal place to increase their capital and make fantastic deals Everything seems to come together in Mexico for video the regime was characterized by his Energetic rule foreign investment was considered necessary to the modernize the country and a certain amount of Ill will towards the United States Favour the presence of other countries in Mexico Canada with it ties to the British Empire and its moderately moderated independent Stance vis-à-vis the United States was an attractive alternative Or video Diaz knew that without railroads Modern transport efficient ports telegraphs and electricity the modernization process would be impossible Those who had built the Canadian Pacific Railroad were looking for new markets This convergence of interest couldn't have been more favorable The Canadian were convinced that the profits they could make in Mexico would be greater that any they could make if they remain in their own country Those Canadians were not so much different from their 21 century counterparts They thought that Canada economy set limit is which would sooner or later affect their gains Furthermore the business pioneer of the early 90s We're confident that the market niche that they were going to establish outside Canada couldn't not be Contested there especially was technology applied to utilities in the service sector and to transportation and communication Canadians in Mexico were the first to apply management Principles convenient with the state of the art technology and an efficient administration of earnings That originally came from Canada they profit from the commercial roots The British has opened in Latin America Conscious of their advantage over Mexican Brazilian or Argentinian entrepreneurs They decide to exploit the benefits offered then by the international conjunture a British and pie That's was retreating from Latin America an economic sector That was not controlled by the United States and Urgent need to modernize the infrastructure of many Mexican cities that were anxious to be linked with other cities both Excuse me in Mexico and abroad Those turn of the century Canadians constantly repeated that market Interfections only made local economies more interesting those Canadian invests in Mexico focus on the transfer of major technology to marginal really regions Where the foreign investors and engineers who build the country spreads hydroelectric plants where acclaims as gods technology Logical expertise managerial skills and the repatriation of capital from Canada to Mexico Came together in the building of an impact of urban services that grew up gradually connected Mexico economic arteries In 1902 Fred start Pearson went to Mexico and visited the water for The waterfall formed by the necaxa river he outlined a project to the Mexican government and His financial backers in Canada the construction of a hydroelectric plant Shortly after with capital from Montreal He found the Mexican life power company which competes with the German owned Mexican Electric works until the later is both in cash by the Canadians Pearson Then signs a contract whereby his field will will supply electricity to Mexico until the year 2012 Pearson company service not only cities a street, but industry mines trains and trolley cars In 90 OCS Pearson was president of the Mexico City a streetcar company Canadians held 75 percent of the shares Existence of the light and power company was obviously some problems for the Mexican government when negotiated exceptions or energy in after in 1911 Canada and Great Britain accounted for 89% of foreign investment in telegraphs telecom water electricity and hydroelectric plants Why the United States controlled only six percent the same year 38% of total foreign investment in Mexico Corresponding to the United States and 30% to Canada and Great Britain foreign banks Abiding Mexico together with the above mentioned investment Among them the bank of Montreal and the Canadian Commerce Bank both always were established To guarantee to guarantee and regulate the use of Canadian capital for the business pioneers The first trade commissioner from the Canadian government was sent to Mexico in 1905 Don't leave the explanation introduce a new stage in Canadian foreign policy The new found economic space in Latin America was of interest Not only to a few Canadian businessmen now it was a matter of concern for the government as well Here we can close the first stage in Mexico-Canada relation But no without mention the following points which will help to us understand subsequent stage Initially, there were two different types of actors in Mexico-Canada relation The first is made up by investors and entrepreneurs who decide to venture into Mexico on their own the second type Consist of those few government representatives that since 1905 have been sent to Mexico Both are a reflection of the Canadian society at the beginning of the 20th century When private economic groups were not as identified with the government strategy as was later the case Canada's official presence in Mexico reflects not only the development of the Canadian Ministry of Foreign Affairs Created only in 1909 both the debate on foreign policy diplomatic relations and international trade policies in Canada In 1920 Canada's trade commissioner in Mexico was severely reprimanded because he had interviewed several Mexican government representatives regarding investment opportunities in Mexico This attitude changed radically after 1946 when Mexico and Canada signed a reciprocal trade agreement The first one Canadian entrepreneurs past and present are interested in an investment strategy Focused on transportation telecommunications services related to natural resources such as water, oil and mines Possible the great difference between the first Canadians in Mexico and those that began to arrive during the 1940 Was that the later lived according to the parameters set by the Cold War for Mexico and Canada This situation was especially important because their proximity to the US Overrode any political or commercial decision that make try to the mutually to mutually establish a future new examples illustrate the the climate that prevailed between 1940s and the 1990 Canada first established diplomatic relations in Latin America with Argentina Brazil and Chile Surprising not with Mexico with whom it had commercial ties since the early 90s The answer to this must be found in the US Hemispherical policy the United States felt that Canada should support them to prevent South America Forming alliances with totalitarian governments the United States always Compile Mexico and Canada to support its political and commercial positions as regard the former Canada has long been pressured into sharing us your political projects Respecting the later US free trade and entrepreneurial position where an important influence on Canada Who was co-founded with the United States of the gut the IMM? Excuse me IMF and the NATO Mexico did not accept free trade as part of its economic policy until 1986 and live until then through a period filled with conflicts while Canada Adopted this policy since the end of the 1940s Both Mexico and Canada Built their Industrialization with protectionist tariff policies Mexico maintained those policies from 1944 to 1982 Canada until 1979 Possibly one of the greatest difference between the two countries lies in the decision regarding foreign investment and state control of natural resources until close to 1970 Canada Officially considered that foreign investment was a great asset for economic development While Mexico held a stricter position and put obstacles in the way of its entry to the country Mexico began to nationalize its natural resources in 1938 when its expropriated foreign oil companies Canada didn't start the process until the 1970s These are some of the elements that condition the relation between Mexico and Canada Now with a Sunday in 1946 a Canadian trade mission to Latin America lead to the signing of a trade agreement with Mexico a Code of conduct was established based on the principles of the most favored nation a Position based on its status as the developing countries that Mexico also wielded in its commercial relation with the United States Starting with this agreement the relationship began to flow through diplomatic channels The rival of business man or trade mission was handled by the Canadian embassy which opened its door in 1944 In 1953 the possibility of creating a Mexico-Canada chamber of commerce was discussed By then economic conditions in Mexico were stable and the country was interested in doing business with Canada But it was not until 1969 that entrepreneurs found the Canadian Association for Latin America in 1959 Adolfo Lopez Mateos Became the first Mexican president to make an official visit to Ottawa a few months later Prime Minister John Defei Baker the Defebaker Returned to the visit. This was the first time that the proximity between the two countries was mentioned It was also Mexico first attempt to appear on the international scene specifically in North America These two heads of state ended a stage of discreet diplomacy and began a period of moderate International activism which included looking for economic space that would be supplementary and alternate to those offered by the United States. These two visits Were the immediate president of the third option policy Remaintaining by both countries on their prime minister Trudeau and President Echeverria The high point in Mexico-Canada relation before 1919 NAPTA came in 1968 with the arrival of the Canadian ministeral mission Their report lead to the famous white book foreign policy for Canadians Which contains Mitchell Sharp road outline of Canadian foreign policy The Canadian international development agency SIDA and the Society for Export Expansion Were founded that same year the former to coordinate Canadian participation in developing countries and the later to finance Canadian export Shortly after still 1968 a joint ministerial committee was Established in Mexico to study issues of common interest to the economy and politics politics of both countries The year between 1980 and 1995 where a rise in cooperation committees in various economic sectors energy agriculture, environment, finance, tourism, etc In 1980 more and a decade later the two countries create a committee for co-operation on energy Because of the particular relevance of the energy sector to each country and to the balance of trade between them in effect During that period and until now the balance of trade-favorite Mexico Mexico increased its exports of manufacture goods to Canada Counting Canada as one of its 10 trading partners Finally since 1985 to 1994 the Canadian Export Development Corporation Financed more than 10 lines of credit in Mexico more over the Canadian International Development Corporation SIDA Supported until the time when Mexico access to the to the OCD more than 25 projects involving investment Development and Canadian technology transfer to Mexico Today the Canada Fund from the Canada also continued to support Marginal to support marginalized communities although less founding since Mexico ceased to be a subject of development aid when became Full member of the the OCD This avalanche of agreements resolution memorandums and Presidential visit leads us to believe that the official intention was to place the bilateral Relation within a framework framework that was closer to the new international economic reality Today Canada economic presence in Mexico is apparent at various levels as Indicate part of Canadian state strategy as part of the specific interest of certain provinces Some like Quebec, Ontario and Alberta have a great presence in Mexico than others as private Individuals the number of a small or medium-sized business involved in young painters in remote parts of Mexico is astounding as part of Transnational films with main offices in the United States that have been relocated from Canada to Mexico to Mexico Mexico today offers Canada a promising opportunity for investment if it were to cater to Mexico's new needs Canada could reproduce the all-business pioneering strategy and take advantage of a demand for services related to the environment, pedrochemical, telephone and computer industries, geology, topography and biotech Finally, I believe that today the real challenge Canada face in Mexico is that of building a more dynamic trade strategy less spontaneous than those built in the past Based on the supposition that the reshaping of tax or production on the international level We give it an opportunity in the Mexican service sector The very dynamics of the commercial opening in Mexico is forming a new economic Structure whose needs today cannot be fully most met by Mexican alone There is an enormous technological gap part of which Canada can truly feel It will be utopian to think that Mexico can confront the impact produced by NAFTA on its own Without any kind of support from abroad There are great vacuums in Mexico in the areas of technological knowledge and professional training Which put it at the at this Advantage as it faces the great change imposed by the globalization process in this context Canada can play an important role as innovative partner. Thank you Yeah, thank you, Teresina. I'll just stay here for the next part So our next speaker is Duncan Wood who's also a long-time student of Canada, Mexico relations Duncan is the director of the Mexico Institute at the Woodrow Wilson Center International Center for Scholars Dr. Wood was a professor and the director of the international relations program in the Instituto Technológico Autónomo de México y Tam in Mexico City. He's also worked as a researcher in the Center for Economic International Rights Law, sorry, in at ITAM and he's a member of the National Research System of Mexico a member of the editorial board of Foreign Affairs Latino America and has been an editorial advisor to reform a newspaper He's also worked as a technical secretary the red Mexicana de energía a group of experts in the area of energy policy in Mexico And his current research in addition to the great work. He's doing coordinating the Mexico Institute Focuses on Mexican energy policy including renewable energy and North American relations He studied in the UK and Canada and received his PhD in political studies from Queen's University in 1996 welcome Duncan I Thank you for having me here today. I'd like to thank the The Embassy for organizing all of this and of course Carlton University for hosting I always begin these sessions by saying that I think I'm the perfect NAFTA citizen. I I got my PhD in Canada. I married a Canadian. I moved to Mexico. I had two children in Mexico I worked there for 17 years. I got divorced mex while I've moved back to Canada my Mexican children now live in Canada I'm here every three weeks. I just married an American. I work in the United States now I travel to Mexico every three weeks. I travel to Canada every three weeks and I'm a citizen of none of the three countries Which makes me a peculiarly impartial observer. I think and For 17 years when I lived in Mexico, it was one of those wonderful twists of fate that I arrived in In Mexico and my boss at the university said to me said Duncan. We've just hired you from Canada You can be our head of Canadian studies and I said, okay I took a PhD in Canada, but I never took a course on Canadian politics or society I know very little about Canada apart from how to marry one and He said it doesn't matter. You know more than everybody else in the kingdom of the blind etc etc and So I I dedicated myself to studying the bilateral relationship between between Mexico and Canada And I have to say that it's an extraordinarily interesting and complex story But it's also a hugely dysfunctional relationship And that's really where I'd like to begin is that throughout the time that I studied that relationship There were ups and downs. There were fits and starts There was a jump ahead it seemed and then reality set in and every time that we got enthusiastic that something was actually happening in the bilateral relationship very quickly that enthusiasm died away Because the essential question. I think that there's always been with Canada Mexico relations is where's the beef? What's really there is there a there there? I guess and there is a there there as as Maria Teresa just described the economic relationship has gone from strength to strength Particularly over the last 20 years the impressive growth in trade and investment is one thing But in terms of the actual relationship and understanding between the two countries and I have colleagues here today Who'll be able to talk about this with much greater depth of knowledge than I do But the fact is is that Canadians really don't get Mexico Canadians don't understand what Mexico is and I think the Mexicans don't really understand Canada either I think partly it's because of the distance and I don't just mean that in a in a in a geographical sense I think it's partly because of the the cultural distance between the two It's easy for the United States and Mexico to develop a closer understanding just simply because of the demographics There's a border there. Yes, but throughout the United States I mean in parts of the northeast of the United States you see enormous migrant populations there It's becoming a lot more familiar and that familiarity sometimes breeds contempt absolutely But that's a process that we're going through to gradually get to that understanding. We haven't seen that in Canada I remember a meeting about eight years ago up here in Ottawa with folks from from Defaith who were saying maybe we need to just import a lot more Mexicans into Canada in order to understand I said isn't that putting the cart before the horse in some sense But this was a genuine proposal from somebody who was working there say we clearly need more Mexicans in Canada I actually think there's something in that and we'll see that change over time But it's not going to happen anytime soon. I Want to say a few words about the NAFTA because I was asked by Fernando Gonzales Saife who thank you for the invitation for me to come here today to talk a little bit about the NAFTA and of course, you know in the in the mark of the In the framework of the 20th anniversary of the NAFTA We have to say that NAFTA has been an unqualified success if we measure it by its original intent The goal was to increase trade and investment between the three countries and that's exactly what it's done They were very limited goals there. Remember this was a 20th century free trade agreement The idea was just simply to increase economic ties. It wasn't to create any kind of super structure It wasn't to create supranational Institutions. Yes, there were the side agreements and yes We have real potential at this point in time for a North American development bank to really work on a number of Infrastructure and environmental issues along the US Mexico border, but we need a lot more than that I think to face the 21st century We're moving from NAFTA, of course into the TPP and I'm delighted that both Mexico and Canada are in the negotiations for the TPP As controversial as that is going to be that is the next big battle that's going to take place in Washington Is can we get a trans specific partnership approved there? And how will the three North American countries work together one of the crucial questions in the TPP that very few people talk about is Are we going to identify? Rules of origin on a regional basis as opposed to on a country-specific basis the three economies in North America are so integrated as Sergio Jose said earlier on we don't just trade things we build things together How do you actually separate a? Canadian car from an American car from a Mexican car an American plane from a Mexican plane from a Canadian plane when you have these Integrated production processes across the region we need to think about how North America goes out there into the world And those are discussions which are taking place right now between the United States and Mexico But I don't see Canada there at the at the table on a regular basis I assume this is going to be one of the issues that is discussed in the North American leader summit But the key question here is we live now in a globally competitive world We are a region and we're an open region and we need to be an open region, but is that enough? Well one of the things about the Canada Mexico relationship I think is that we've never really got to get beyond we've never managed to get beyond the trade and investment agenda We've talked about lots of interesting things. We have the season agricultural workers program We had the Canada Mexico partnership which I got very excited about for a small while Before I saw that it wasn't really anything really happening there. We have the Canada Mexico joint action plans and nice words And we had the visa problems The end of Canadian studies funding if there was a short-sighted or more short-sighted decision in Canadian Public policy history. I don't know of it that you cut a few million dollars from the budget and Essentially cut off understanding of Canada around the world It decimated the Canadian studies community in Mexico I remember that people just basically said well if there's no money, I'm not going to study it And if you actually did the economics of Canadian studies funding in Mexico It more than paid for itself just simply by people coming back to Canada and spending their dollars in Canada on research trips Etc. So what have we seen now? We've seen that the Canadian government has basically said we're not particularly interested in Mexico and We don't we're not particularly interested in Mexicans understanding who we are either Part of this I believe stems from what is essentially Canada's zero-sum approach in Washington DC I've said it many times over the years But I think that the Canadian government and this is not just a conservative or a liberal government but Canadian governments in general have a very very Insecure approach in their bilateral relationship with the United States whenever anybody is mentioned ahead of Canada as being the America's best friend You remember after 9-11 when Tony Blair was George Bush's best friend people here in Canada rent their clothes They pulled their hair and said what about us? Didn't we take in all of those American travelers on 9-11 when the planes were grounded and we took them into our homes Aren't we sort of you know brothers and sisters in North America? Whenever Mexico is mentioned ahead of Canada in Washington, there's an enormous amount of anxiety at the Canadian Embassy on Pennsylvania Avenue The fact is is that over the past few years Mexico has done a much better job of having its message heard in Washington and The Canadian response to that has been to say well We're important to travel to Washington right now and you will see a Public relations campaign all over the city about the Keystone pipeline absolutely But it's about Canada is is the United States biggest energy partner Canada matters more than any other country For those of you who have been to the Canadian Embassy in Washington You'll see when you walk in that big map that's on the wall Which has all of the trade and investment ties going back across the border How many jobs in American states depend upon trade and investment with Canada? Etc etc. Etc and that one of the nicest features of that map. I think is that along the border it says we've got your back As if to say we're protecting the back door here You can trust our border and it caused to mind immediately in the context of these conversations About after 9-11 when the Canadian government refused to talk borders on a trilateral basis because they didn't want to see the Mexicanization of the Canadian border that was the term that was actually used and I thought that brought to To the forefront many of the concerns and the real dysfunctionality of the relationship in North America from a Canadian point of view What I'd like to say here is that it seems to me that we're lacking a long-term vision the long-term vision simply isn't there Mexico is going to grow much much faster than either the United States or Canada in the future The potential for growth in North America is there south of the real brother The potential for growth is there the potential for real development is there Mexico will surpass Canada in size at some point over the next 20-25 years That's going to be a big moment for Canada in terms of the readjustment Canada will then be by far the junior partner in the North American trilateral Relationship if it isn't already and the reason why I say that is because look at what has happened over the last 13 months Everybody in this room is aware of what's taken place in Mexico the extraordinary reform agenda that has been put in place by President Enrique Pena Nieto and the Mexican Congress Let's give them their credit as well that they've managed to get the job done and I was just reading some some Journalistic notes this morning That the Mexican Congress has just committed itself to working extra sessions during this spring session of Congress in order to get The impressive list of secondary legislation passed so that the reforms that were passed last year actually means something this year And the United States has recognized this and you look at the way that the bilateral relationship between the United States and Mexico has changed We have a high level economic dialogue that's underway between Mexico and the United States that actually has substance We have a CEO dialogue between Mexico and the United States which is in parallel with that Unfortunately the two things aren't linked in quite the way. They should be but I think we're we're working towards that We have the signing of the for Bessie a bilateral fund for higher education innovation and research and I know that there's a lot of wrinkles that need to be ironed out in that and in circular works You know 24 hours a day or 25 hours a day probably trying to get this to to work out and part of the problem There is you're dealing with a federal education structure on the Mexican side and a state level education structure on the US side But everybody recognizes that this is the kind of initiative that needs to take place because let's face it As Sergio said in his introductory notes the future of competitiveness is not necessarily about natural resources It's not about manufacturing. It's not even really about money. It's about human talent. It's about human capital It's about innovation and it's gonna be about mobility as well One of the good things about the Canada-Mexico relationship is that a few years ago an agreement was signed on youth mobility between the two countries And that's something that I think we have to grab on to and make sure that we develop in the future But if you look at all three countries in North America today and you look at where their human resources stand It was a very interesting survey that was published by a firm called Hayes recruiting Recently which identified a thermometer for each of the countries of the OECD essentially to see how well Sorry, how much demand there is in their economies for human capital and how their education systems are supplying that and in all three North American countries There are challenges But Mexico is by far the best place to satisfy the demand that exists in North America Look at the Pisa rankings The OECD's education rankings all three North American countries face very serious challenges at the moment Mexico probably the biggest of all just simply because in comparison with the other OECD Nations it does very very badly But if you look at what's happening in Mexico in fact Mexico is advancing more rapidly than almost any other OECD nation in terms of improving its education system Human capital matters and as as Laura said my area is really about energy and the the project that we've Undertaken at the Wilson Center's Mexico Institute this year is to actually look at the demands for human capital in the energy sector in Mexico Everybody's talking about North America being the new Middle East in terms of energy resources. There's this new abundance of energy that's there Yes, it's the the oil sands in Canada. It's the shale and tight oil resources in the United States It's Mexico's energy reform and the enormous resources that still await under the Gulf of Mexico and of course in Mexico's own shale reserves And there seems to be no limit to this but there is a limit and the limit is human talent Everybody knows that you need human beings to actually make this work You don't just need the dirty oil engineers who go out there But to mention that do you know that Mexico produces more engineers every year than the United States? That's something which we need to think about very very seriously. It's not that you need engineers to go out there and get the oil out of the ground you need People who are experts in in seismic mapping you need people who are experts in information technology You need people who are experts in management of the oil industry and Mexico has the potential to do that because of the Demographics of the country think about how many young people are coming through the education system right there in order to do That well we need to adopt a regional approach There are huge opportunities not just in energy but across the board for improving competitiveness and prosperity in North America As I said the future is going to be determined by knowledge and education human capital All three of the NAFTA countries face this challenge and it requires a cooperative response So I think it's timely that we have a call for a North American education and innovation fund What's happening between Mexico and the United States with the for Bessie the bilateral fund for a higher education Innovation and research is something which should be happening on a trilateral basis Canada should get on board. This is something that would benefit Canada in the long term much more than it would benefit Mexico This is something where Canada needs to change the chip in its head and to say, okay Mexico is really the future. So let's go to get on board with that. Thank you very much Thank you so much Duncan and our final speaker on this session is a Susana Chacon Oh, yes, I did notice there are chairs here if you guys want to feel free to come sit up sit down at an actual chair Sorry, Susana Chacon is currently editor-in-chief of foreign policy Mexican edition She's also professor at the Graduate School of Public Administration and Public Policy and at a guy they business school at the Technological de Monterey University in Mexico City She is also secretary general of the Club of Rome an editorialist of the Mexican newspaper Universal and a member of the World Academy of Arts and Sciences. She is the author and coordinator of eight books she has numerous book chapters and articles in different journals and Is an active participant in international discussions related to the issues we're talking about today. Welcome, Susana. Thank you so much, Laura Different problem with the microphone then Duncan. Thank you so much. I think it's much later Well, first of all, I also would like to to to congratulate the Mexican Embassy here the foreign minister for Undersecretary is her cousin and of course to thank you very much The Carlton University for hosting these events today I'm very very happy and I feel really very honored to be here with you today And I'm gonna try to to make my presentation divided in two different parts One the first one will be focused in some highlights on the current history I'm going back a little bit to history, but just in the 20th century and then I'll focus on eight ideas that I think that There are some of the issues where we can start building up in the Considering this this point of how to build a long-term relation bilateral relation US Aside from the US a Canadian relation. So in The general overview I would say that Mexico was one of the first countries with which Canada established diplomatic relations 70 years ago Just as Canada was coming of age as a sovereign country with with An autonomous foreign policy Canada and Mexico a relation extended even further than 1944 and and we know very well that we were allies during the Second World War and People-to-people exchanges had existed ever since the the beginning of both countries Since 1944 The relation has taken off in in a new dimension Reflecting on our share heritage and and also common objectives 1956 it was it the first summit of the leaders of North America took place This was with Dwight Eisenhower, Ruiz Cortines and Luisa Loran 1960 a John different banker makes his first visit as the Canadian head of state to Mexico and And then we had a very strong relation from the 60s to the 90s and There we can see that as Teresina mentioned and I would like to Reconsider that idea that president a chevrilla where we had a switch off from from a Pacific or Not very dynamic foreign policy to a very dynamic one He made a first visit to Canada in 1970 and then a prime minister Trudeau Went back to Mexico in 76 and then in 1982 Mexican Canada signed the of course the Agricultural worker a treaty 40 years ago in 74, but also in 76. There was a very important cultural agreement With with a lot of fellowships that I think that we have to reconsider again as Duncan was mentioned in Just in the case of the US-Mexican relation in terms of fellowships for for Mexicans and Canadians to go back a We since 1975 we have the the interpandemic parliamentary meetings that's been on place a basically almost four years as well and By early 90s 25 Canadians departments and agencies were participating participating in irregular official meetings with Mexicans Over 80 bilateral agreements had been signed covering different areas our culture transportation justice consular affairs communication education health tourism human rights labor and environment We know very well that since NAFTA in 1994 20 years ago this marked a High-vital moment in the Canada-Mexican relation and and it helped propel trade and investment between both countries With unprecedented levels, but it's still a lot to go and we have to do many things Even if it would now from a have a very complex and deep relations in since 1994 Canadian and Mexican economic relations are reaching new heights Evolving from from beyond a mainly export-oriented trade relationship to integrate it to the 21st North American production platform There's something very important, which is the people to people exchanges That are also flourishing with almost a two million Canadians visiting Mexico annually and there is also a very important number of Mexicans coming to Canada But they're visiting Mexico and and also they are staying in there as you know very well for at least this season, which is not the best season For Canadians they are going either to San Miguel Allende or to Ajijic in Jalisco, so they find a place where to stay at least six months during the year As Duncan mentioned, I mean in 2007 with with a joint action plan The bilateral relation was focusing basically for four different objectives First of all a fostering competitive and sustainable economies Protecting citizens and he's in people-to-people contacts and projecting partnership globally and also regionally We can talk about different institutions, but we still have to work on many others in the coming future The foremost most important we can say of course is the Canada-Mexican partnership, which now also takes 10 years And and these a unites public and private sector representatives Also the the other institution, which is very important is the military to military Dialogue and the military to to to political dialogues that ensure coherence between the many direct interactions between our representatives security agency and and all the the the political issues that are taking place the other institution is the the Canadian Mexican consular rapid response mechanism established in 2007 and a Range of international fora such as the UN OAS TPP G20 And others that allow us to work together and project our partnership regionally and globally If we see that the current situation we can talk about the The Prime Minister here in Canada Stephen Harper his last visit was in two years ago 212 to the G20 meeting in Mexico and And Penya Neto came to Ottawa just two days before his inauguration So it's from the very beginning. It seems to me that there is a good chemistry between both of them and We are in a perfect moment to start building a new relation in the coming meeting Which will be take place this coming month Mexico 61st and then the trilateral Area with Toluca the Toluca so much Canada and Mexico have great potential to build a strong stronger bridges between us and Not just in in the bilateral terms, but also in the trial in trilateral and multilateral Arena, so I think we have to start thinking in a different way How to build the bilateral relation and how to start working together in those areas, which we have common interest in the international arena We have an excellent level of understanding politically socially and culturally And we have many different mechanism of cooperation But it seems to me that as as Duncan mentioned We still have to learn a lot about the Canadians as the Canadians have to learn a lot of about Mexico And of course There are many different kind of of exchanges bilateral trade and investment between the two countries rich 35 Almost 35 and half billion by the end of two years ago and in July last year, Mexico exported 34 percent to Quebec 5.4 to to Alberta and point one to Ontario and and this increased from from the from the other year But also it was reduced in British Columbia and Saka Chowan We can see that it's been like a very very tough relation some years But some other times it's reduced either because of the the economic crisis or because there's no Enough interest on how to deal with Mexicans So we I see that there are many different challenges now that we have to face the first one is that We should build an a renew Canadian Mexican partnership first of all and starting out on a trilateral basis But just a bilateral one and do much more to encourage labor mobility investment promotion and an academic mobility between both countries a Unleash the the potential synergies with the growing people to people linkages providing the lifeblood of the relation and Adding the human texture to institutional framework We have an opportunity now to reflect with this anniversary on the their significance to the future of those two great countries and the bilateral relation Revitalizing the Canada Mexico relationship would also strengthen cooperation in North America and other settings There is an urgent need to build a shared perspective between the two countries Which will allow us both countries to to better assess the bilateral relation and the future a potential Mexico is an important partner in North America and multilateral forum However, the strategic definition of the relationship remains a work in progress. It's not done While belonging to North America is what has made Mexico important to Canada And it is also I mean this these last past years And it is also critical that Canada be able to to to visualize the potential of the relationship with Mexico and Assess its strategic value in other settings as well But it seems to me that there are problems of perceptions on how to deal with the other and first of all Is Canada has identified Mexico as strategic? like-minded partner in in the implementation of the Americans a strategy a strategy alongside Chile and Brazil and Particularly in the area of security But opportunities are often missed because of the lack of knowledge about the successful experience of bilateral relation that could be transferred to the region and because Mexico's leadership in the region is not fully known or understood While Canadian Sees Mexicans as relevant partners both in economy and political terms It often puts it behind other emerging powers such as the so-called bricks Brazil Russia India China and South Africa Who attract more attention in terms of promoting greater economy and political alliances in the eyes of the Mexicans? Despite the fact of NAFTA has fostered greater commercial ties and and some investment a lot of it It's still a puzzle as as to why it has not been possible to maximize The benefits of the relationship with Canada and why the country is not considered more essential to Canadians Since both countries are partners in NAFTA There is an expectation that the relationship would or should be deeper and much more dynamic There is also concern in Mexico about the emphasis on economic Suspects of the relationship and ensuring to the future of the relation Not to be limited to the dynamics of the market to other to all of those other issues, which are also important and Now to start thinking about the future as I mentioned I would like to focus on on eight ideas, which I just Gonna point here and leave you probably to to work on them in some other Seminars or events we've been working in with some of them in in Comex in Mexico City, and I think they're they're like some Nuclear ideas which might help us to start building the the relation in the future The first one is in haste in movement of people and improved competitiveness And here I have a couple of questions What what are the technical and regulatory requirements and an approximate cost of more viable of the two options listed above Which industries and sectors would be the the the more beneficials Could this be a model that could be applied to other areas such as academics moving developed the bilateral trade agenda forward Institutional coverage of free trade agreement with with third countries would be possible as well The second one will be the the understanding and enhancing of state provincial linkages Mexican states and Canadian provinces are engaged in a growing number of diverse state province agreements that expanded Amplify and in some ways shape the overall bilateral relation Subnational linkages are also a source of dynamic examples of Cooperation while having many benefits this relation also poses new challenges and potential for for the unintended complications My questions here will be what what linkages currently exists by actors and by type What are examples of success that can be used to inform or improve narratives of the Canadian Mexican relationship? Essentially, we have took two examples a Hallease Cuanalberta and also caretaro What have been the major problem problems impeding and an issues as well as emerging best practices? And which are the ideas for removing impediment in hesitate linkages and establishing best practices and The third one will be some some some idea which for me is very important Some some Canadians on Mexicans and so on Americans. They don't like it at all Which is the idea of North America the North American space idea this idea Which was pushed very much by by Robert pastor in in the US But also by the Canadians in the 19th century and the beginning of the 20th century with portfolio Diaz Definitely we have areas of common interest such as energy climate change trade competitiveness technology Automotive air a cars, of course human security regional security and and these all Different areas need the new North American mindist that respond to the current challenges There are some mechanism that we already know like next to some century, but we can start building a new other kind of Mechanism and instruments that might help us to build this idea of North America Which somehow we refuse to to understand it in a very well way The fourth one will be sustainable growth and competitiveness There are many initiatives to reinvigorate Sustainable economic growth and competitiveness in the original level seems to me still long way to go exploration of opportunities in Biotechnology sector to develop business linkages and join research initiatives And the best practice to improve the market and financial resources access particularly in both countries Another one which will be the the the area of energy security and environment which to me which is one of my main Research subjects as well is very important Of course there are exchanges on clean technology and generation of alternative energy sources But we have to work much more on there recuperation of the oil fields of course a Albert and oil fans What what we have in terms of shale oil and shale gas We we have to start working in a different way in terms of research production and of course trade There is definitely a good number of agreements bilateral agreements between the US and Canada And there are no agreements between Mexico and Canada So it seems that to me that it's urgent to start building those agreements. Otherwise, we will we will not be part of this region in a very competitive way Not just us Canadian agreements not just trilateral agreements, but both Mexican Canadian agreements And there are three more Issues where I think we can build together which is of course investment and financing flows security which we have already a long way Built but we we continue working on intelligence and so on and the and the final one with will be Which is health where we also have many different agreements But we there's something in that in as part of NAFTA and as part of the bilateral relation We can start building together many different mechanism and instruments. Thank you so much Thank you again to all our panelistas for their excellent presentations I'm afraid we're short of time, so I'm not going to be able to take questions if we were going to save our coffee break So I just want to thank the panelists again and also thank all the organizers of this event. Thank you Okay We're going to get started with the with the second panel and I'm going to change the format a little bit I know that a lot of people in the audience want to have the opportunity to be a little more interactive and ask questions So I'm going to make two suggestions in terms of format one is I will introduce everybody at once secondly, we'll all remain at the table and the panelists have agreed to tighten their presentation so we can have more of an interactive experience because Let's get behind the numbers Let's get some behind some of these issues that have been raised this morning and I know there's a lot of interesting ideas here So with that, let me introduce everyone again. We have a very distinguished group of panelists this morning for the second panel To my far left is Jennifer Jeffs. Who's the president of the Canadian International Council? Jennifer is a member of the editorial boards of the International Journal of Foreign Affairs for Latin America She's a director of the centro de estudios y programas interamericanos director of the world of wildlife foundation of Canada member of the advisory council of the Canada Mexico initiative and Some of her former positions include deputy executive director at the Center for International Governance Innovation And was the founding director of the centro de estudios y programas interamericanos Based at Itam in Mexico City, which a number of you know very well To my right is Sylvia Nunez Professor Nunez is a director of the Center for Research on North America at National Autonomous University of Mexico where she also holds the position as a tenured researcher on US-Mexico relations since 1989 and She teaches US and Canadian studies at the School of Social and Political Sciences at Unam and has been a visiting scholar at Georgetown University and Michigan State among others so She's a distinguished member of the US-Mexico Fulbright Commission as well To my immediate left is Andre Plurt who is the dean of the faculty of public affairs here at Carleton University and Andre has a very distinguished background in economics After joining Carleton before joining Carleton in 2011. He worked for more than a decade at the University of Alberta He has worked at the University of Ottawa in 1997 He undertook an assignment as a director of economic studies and policy analysis with the federal Department of Finance And then went back to the University of Alberta and he also Had an assignment in the government and was appointed Associate Deputy Minister for Energy he is a leading energy economist which is a Particularly interesting sector to look at and hope we will have some discussion about and He's of course served on a number of numerous advisory committees in private companies and within universities and he's also been involved in a number of very detailed aspects of energy economics such as Royalty reviews which are of course not Inconsequential when you start going into the details of energy policies So with that I'm going to ask Jennifer Jeffs to kick off And then we'll see how we move along and and as I promised we will have some interactive questions as we go along So Jennifer great. Thank you very much. Thank you and thank you for the invitation Thank you to the to the Mexican Embassy and and welcome to the the sub secretary from Mexico City I'm so glad to to see you here I guess I'll just start by saying that Internationally the image of Mexico under the new president under president and Richard can any penny and yet Oh seems to have undergone quite a transformation in the recent in the recent months in the short time He's been in office Internationally with the image of Mexico seems to become much more positive. It's becoming a leading emerging country to watch It's a it's it's a country with a good story the emerging middle class the young people the good demographics The modern Mexico is is a really it's a great It's a compelling story, but it's a story that we're not hearing enough of in Canada Unless you read the Financial Times You haven't really noticed that Enrique Pena Nieto has made a big effort to be to be photographed with powerful people with With the Premier of China with Obama at the G20 meetings He seemed to be taking every opportunity and that was great to see Mexico as being a power an emerging power to watch In Canada we hear a bit about the growing middle class The the 40 million strong growing middle class, but we hear about it mostly from people who go to Mexico Doing business starting business adventures and who are surprised to come back and say wow They have this amazing sort of growing middle class So I think there's stories to be told in Canada that we're not that we're not hearing our press is Unfortunately, the media seems to be obsessed with the gruesome stories and not focusing enough on the others And I think there there's there's certain things we can do about that We need more attention to Mexico town Mexican talent a talent away from the stereotypes Canadians just don't know enough about Mexican architecture for example Mexican design Mexican industrial design another thing That's the business people come back saying wow those factories are amazing Then Mexican films Canadians are crazy about film festivals Do we have a Mexican film festival in Toronto that Toronto film festivals become huge? Hot dogs big thing Mexican film industry is producing really cutting-edge Films that Canadians should know about we should hear more about them literature Mexican literature I was I had the good fortune to be invited to interview Carlos Fuentes one of the last interviews He did at the Royal Ontario Museum in Toronto, and it was completely sold out No surprise the executive director said she could have she could have sold it out for a week And it was it was a wonderful interview and he was covered by the media and you know afterwards I said to her so what's next you know who are you going to bring next? It was obviously very very popular so there are lots of opportunities for soft power Culinary festivals There's so many things that we can do to tell a different story of Mexico a different story and a story That's much more more compelling than than the violence What's missing so what the Mexican entrepreneurship is something else that that we don't know enough about and that goes hand-in-hand With the emerging middle class and the younger population And what does what does the what does the entrepreneurial class need? They need financing and they need facilities in other words They need partners good partners, so there are huge collect possibilities for collaboration with Canada And how does one get to the sort of the political will to make that happen? What is the most politically resonant issue jobs job creation future jobs? What are the future jobs? How do we know what's going to create jobs and prosperity in the future? These were topics of intense debate at Davos at the World Economic Forum last week What is it? Is it going to water gonna be the drivers technology? What's the next wave? What are the most salient issues? Two years ago. I did a report the Canadian International Council did a report on the international intellectual property regime in the course of that I visited the World Intellectual Property Organization in Geneva, which Overseas which sort of guides patents and licensing for countries particularly developing countries who are starting to work more closely with innovation In the course of the research, I met the fellow who runs a sort of a sub-secretariat of Waipo Who runs the global challenges secretariat? And I thought that was it was very interesting So the three global challenges that he has to deal with that those being the challenges that are basically Challenging humanity global health global food security and of course climate change As these challenges become more serious, they're going to become big drivers of the economy Future jobs are going to spring from these issues Few and those those jobs are going to be found in industries and and initiatives that that we don't know anything We don't we can't even imagine yet These are going to be these are going to be new areas that we haven't thought of how are you going to figure out what they are? through research So both of our countries are working on issues of climate health food security those three global challenges The knowledge and knowledge creation mobilization partnerships are important. These are priorities of both of our governments Why are we doing it separately when we could be doing things like this together? These are opportunities that we can find as Canadians not just I mean I that the whole foe Bessie thing I have to say that just drove me crazy when I found out about this big first of all the high-level economic dialogue being accompanied by the high-level Education dialogue and and the partnerships that are growing between educational institutions and the big push To send Mexican students to the United States and that the sort of the numbers that the forecasting numbers that they're putting out I mean it's it's wonderful and we have in Canada We've there's been a lot of press about the Brazilians and the Brazilians are sending out a hundred thousand Students in the next five years out into the world twelve thousand of those are going to come to Canada Which is fabulous. We have great absorbative capacity not only in our universities, but also in our community colleges, but The whole foe Bessie thing took place without Canada even knowing about it I was told about it by a journalist in Mexico City who called me up to say do you know if Canada's involved? You know, I called people not a lot. No, we're just we're not involved in that There are some initiatives to bring more Mexican students, but they should be coordinated It would be great for Canada to get involved in the foe Bessie initiative more coordination Those that that's the start, but I think the the joint research programs are part of that joint research programs So one can flow to the other So going back to the joint research program innovation innovation on on global issues Wealthy in small country a wealthy country like Canada small country small population again the growing middle class in Mexico is bigger than the entire population of Canada and In emerging developing country with great potential What what great what great partners to work on global issues if Canada came up with some some Suggestion for what to do about climate change or what to do about food security You can imagine it would be that you know the farmers lobby or there would be accusations of self-interest somewhere in there You can't accuse two countries with such different populations and different needs of self-interest their common need or is is attacking those global challenges So opportunities for partnerships in Canada the National Research Council NRC the Natural Sciences and Engineering Research Council and CERC and the Social Sciences and Humanities Research Council are all now Very strongly urging international partnerships. This is relatively new in the past partnerships. We're with the US and with the UK IDRC has been really pushing partnerships with developing countries They they they've actually identified Mexico was as a good partner for particular global health initiatives, which is great But there are so many other possibilities that could be followed through Potential partners in Mexico include connoisseur public and private universities think tanks in coasts CDAC There's so many opportunities that we could take advantage of there's so many we need some sort of institutionalized partnerships to make these happen the So leveraging so if we're leveraging resources resources and research creativity and talents it just makes sense Especially for innovations in agriculture in medicine in energy. There are some examples of this already, but we could do so much more By doing this we can produce patents and licenses that actually produce Prosperity we haven't we had this terrible example in Canada that that that's sort of a An embarrassing secret about the development of canola in Saskatchewan it was the Saskatchewan farmer that developed canola and he couldn't somehow get the support to to produce the to produce the patent to to actually to carry it through and Ended up selling his company to the Americans So our Western our Western farmers now are are needing to get licenses to produce canola from the state from the company in the US that it got sold to so Canada has experience in these things Mexico has less Canada can help Mexico has the potential. It's a great Partnership that only makes sense when you think about where where the wealth creation opportunity is going to come in the future They're going to come from the biggest problems that we're facing and the the efforts and the investment that gets put Into dealing with them So examples, I mean, I'll just go through these very quickly to to keep my time short Energy obviously I think my other my other panels are going to talk about energy So I won't really go into it But it does provide really rich fodder for energy research clean extractive technologies We have and here's a net here's an area where industries and universities can work closely together We do have an intellectual property sharing consortium amongst oil companies in Canada that was put together a number of years ago Why don't we include some Mexican companies in that? We're all dealing with with so many common common Issues now within the energy industry whether it's whether it's clean extractive technologies whether it's shale gas There there are numerous opportunities there sustainable ecosystems Mexico is one of the most diverse Ecosystems on the on the on the face of the planet We do have the the World Wildlife Fund in Mexico and the World Wildlife Fund in Canada have a cooperative Arrangement dealing with the butterflies the famous monarch butterflies that migrate every year It's a lovely arrangement. There's financing for it And it's just one example of this is something again on the soft power side Let's tell Canadians more about the ecosystem in Mexico the conservation agenda The conservation of the genders of the two countries have a lot in common health Mexican health professionals so many of them have been trained abroad. They have international experience that it's a large population and They're dealing with so many of the same issues as Canadians IDRC has been funding a Program dealing with childhood obesity in Mexico. Why not have a Joint program childhood obesity childhood diabetes big problems in Canada as well again Legitimate partnerships legitimate solutions particularly legitimate because of the differences in the populations the the SARS epidemic There were examples of Canadian and and Mexican strong examples of cooperation H1N1 same thing Canadians were they jumped in as soon as Mexico had that big issue global health issues pandemics Medical medical networks are really important, and it's a natural one So there are lots of health cooperation examples, which I won't go through food security food security is a The price of corn obviously affects Mexican society very dramatically There's a there's an initiative at a university in Manitoba for a corn substitute Made from barley so barley is very as plentiful in Canada. They've been working on this It's just a small group of researchers to make the a healthy tortilla barley is much more healthy than corn lowest cholesterol does all these things This is you know, it's a it's a it's a good example Here's somebody being innovative and it could be it could be a moneymaker So Canada has shown a commitment to research cooperation with other large Developing countries emerging companies with large populations the Canada India scientific and technological cooperation agreement Promotes promotes research into alternate energy sustainable environment technologies biotechnology health and disaster management We don't have something like that institutionalized between Canada and Mexico We need to institutionalize cooperative partnerships the Canada Brazil framework or agreement for cooperation on science and Technology that's relatively new. We've managed to do it with Brazil, but we haven't managed to do it with our NAFTA partner There's something very ironic about that. So I think again going back to the Getting to know each other better. The education is is is fundamental And I would say the the influx of Mexican soft power. Bring us bring us your films bring us your architecture Bring us your your your poets. We we need to hear more of them in Canada And I ask you to Be the next speaker, please. Thank you and Thank you for for inviting me to come here and thank you to the Mexican Embassy for helping us to organize this I'll have a much more much narrower presentation I'm really gonna focus on energy and when I say energy. I'm gonna largely focus on oil and gas That's what I know a little bit better It's been over the years very difficult for Canada and Mexico to have very close energy relationship and Some of that has to do with the different perceptions of what the of the role of energy within the national consciousness of the two countries So some of you will know that to to to Mexico and to the Mexicans Understanding of their nation and of their state energy and oil and gas in particular plays a very important role Right down from the Constitution to the petroleum law to setting up Pemex and Pemex's role within the country It's something that really has no parallel in Canada and given the very different structures that have followed in terms of the Activities of the energy industries. It has proven very difficult to have a relationship Because it's it's it can't be of equal partners at some stage because the conversation has to be so different Historically, however, we have had the privilege and the less than privilege of of both being neighbors of the United States and Therefore having a huge energy consumer and it's and a huge energy producer next to us and historically Mexico has been an important supplier of crude oil to the United States and So much so that if you go back, I'll say 20 years There were basically four key suppliers of crude oil to the United States and it kind of rotated as to who was important and all that and those were Saudi Arabia Venezuela Mexico in Canada and in any kind of combination of the two you could probably Account for something that looked an awful lot like 80% of US crude oil exports by the sum of these four players What's happened since then is That Venezuela has effectively disappeared quotation marks as a major supplier of crude oil to the United States Saudi Arabia is still present and most of you would think is the largest supplier But you know as a Canadian it hurts a little bit, but that's okay But Canada has grown both in terms of volume and in terms of presence Share Mexico has has not done very very much If anything the the importance of Mexico is decreased both in terms of volumes in terms of share of imports This is despite the fact that the share of imports in the US has been falling over time in crude oil And this is widely expected to continue over the next while So there's something different going on in the two in the two countries The story of natural gas is a bit similar in the 1980s and early 1990s Mexico was seen as a Huge potential supplier of natural gas the United States and there was a pipeline built that that essentially connects markets and production areas in Northern Mexico and the southern United States and the intended flow of natural gas in that pipeline Was that it would take Mexican produced gas into the United States? Well, what's happened historically, right? Is that the flow of the pipelines reversed? Mexico is now and has been for many years an importer of natural gas from the United States One could say indirectly from Canada since basically right long story. You can see I'm a good Canadian and all of this occurred before shale gas in the US and So the potential is still to change Part of this I think it's important to understand the role that Pemex has played in In the in the Mexican state in the federal state of Mexico But also as an energy player within that the country as you know Pemex has been a very important source of revenue for the federal government of Mexico And what has that has meant is that has not always a lot of cash available for Pemex to actually do things like explore and develop resources and Historically Pemex has had a clear focus on crude oil and not natural gas And so essentially if you look at how the structure of the industry has been in Mexico much more focused on oil Much more internal looking because the growth in the demand Locally and really focused on the activities of Pemex, which is chronically short of cash to do what needs to be done if you want to expand production and chronically short of access to Technology will come to that in a minute So basically all of this kind of sets us up that NAFTA arise Mexico chooses in some sense to become part of the North American economic space But chooses not to become part of the North American energy market so effectively that was the consequence of of NAFTA and Kind of the predictable essentially happen Until about 2013 and well, I'm sure you've no doubt talked about this already There'd been some tentative steps to open up the the Mexican energy industry industry and to bring it closer to the North America to its North American partners and that has Perhaps happened even more in electricity, which we want which I won't talk about because that would take a lot longer but there's been One thing I want because it'll come back in later is to mention the creation of service contracts in the natural gas industry a Lot of hope a lot of hope a lot of hope not a lot of action came out of all of this They were seen widely as too restrictive by foreign investors to complicated to insecure Not much has happened as a result of them So overall however, what's it? What's interesting is that Mexico has a huge potential in terms of natural gas Crude oil reserves. We don't know a lot because there's not been a lot of exploration In Mexico, so there's but the firm There's nothing in the Gulf of Mexico for example that says that the hydrocarbon formations follow the border Right Essentially, you know, it's not just to say well, you know, it's okay on the US side But there's really nothing on the Mexican side. We don't know what there is on the Mexican side Not been a lot of action. The potential however is quite important But Pamesh has no cash. It has no access to the right technology And so the industry continued on this decline. Now, this is a social choice And you know, you can keep the resources in the ground you can restrict access to the Mexican state You can do all of that I'm not trying to say that one way is better than the other. It is a choice that a society makes Societies have the right to make these choices. There are consequences and that's the way it is But now what seems to be happening in Mexico is that there are efforts to change the balance a little bit with the views of And I would argue perhaps to integrate more in the North American energy market The constitutional changes that have been discussed Eventually proposed the changes to the petroleum law that would have to follow and that sort of thing and effectively to allow non-state including participation in the oil and gas industry including foreign investment risk contracts We can talk about that later production contracts that sort of thing Would be our part of what people are considering now So will things change is this going to be the natural gas service contracts all over again of a long story Put it in place not much happens because not much really is meant to happen So I think that's going to be an important question of the future now again I'm not questioned in Mexico the right of Mexico and of Mexicans decide not to be part of that game This is not the point. I want to highlight three things before I pass on first one is that there are two Largely unheralded successes of the on the energy aspects of NAFTA Which I bet you most of you have not heard of which I think have been quite important and or interesting The first one is that shortly after NAFTA The federal energy regulators of Canada the US and Mexico started talking to one another That was revolutionary Between Canada and the US the FERC and the NEB it always had a bit of a conversation never involved The regulatory agencies a federal regulatory energy regulatory agency in Mexico Completely revolutionary they actually talking to one another Trying to understand imagine if you're going to get natural gas for example from Canada Down into the US down into Mexico or the other way around it be kind of nice that The pipelines are built to handle the same quality of natural gas For example, so those types of things really important the second thing Which is you have to be an energy policy walk I supposed to care so you have to understand that is that that very early after NAFTA was established There was a committee that was put together of high-level officials in the three areas one of their first Project was to put together a picture of energy statistics in the three countries For the first time they actually sat down and made sure that they had comparable measures of things Across the three countries they produced a report. I still have a copy It was fabulous Because it allowed this compare all of a sudden you had a picture of all of this it included Where the natural gas pipelines were where the oil pipelines were with electricity transmission lines were that kind of thing? Absolutely valuable to researchers to policy analysts to industry to government officials I don't know that they ever produced the second edition. It was a great piece of work finally Within NAFTA. I think as has been highlighted before there is a lot of potential for much closer cooperation between Canada and Mexico on environmental issue and especially on energy and the environment and I think I Wouldn't be working too hard on getting our in energy sectors lined up too closely But I think we have a lot of potential to work together on Energy and the environment. Thank you Thank you Andre and I think everyone looks forward to coming back and and having some Interactive discussion on that but first let me turn to Sylvia Nunez and ask her for comments Thank you very much It is a great honor for me being here and have the opportunity To give you my comments about how do we see the relation with Canada from the center of Research on North America from on them Firstly, let me begin by thanking Mexico's Foreign Ministry Represented here by the Mexican ambassador to Canada and the undersecretary for North American affairs Who were invited invited me to for this very distinguished? Commemoration I Would also like to extend my gratitude To the authorities and faculty of Calton University for their kind welcome I will begin my comments with an Arabic proverb proverb that I think expresses the reason that brings us together The proverb the proverb says that for every every glance behind us We have to look twice to the future After 70 years it is imperative that we take advantage of the opportunity to reflect on the journey We have taken together Pondering the achievements and difficulties that undoubtedly point to important Communities between our two great nations that stem for their vocation for peace and cooperation while the facts of The economy tell us that trade Have been the area that have concentrated our attention in our relations from my perspective The negotiations and entry into effect of NAFTA two days two decades ago Showed that the ties between us have become more complex because of the influence Ambissibility of new actors in the public sphere this Together with government and business Have contributed since then to Stimulating the interaction in key areas like the academy and civil society organizations Not to mention the interaction among subnational governments Allow me to say that I'm a hopeless optimist These comes of working day-to-day With young people at Mexico's National Autonomous University The largest public university in the country with more than 300,000 students this contact With young people forces me to recognize the diligent critics of our bilateral Relationship when they say that it has lost Dynamism and to emphasize that the framework of institutional cooperation must go much further My comments today will focus on looking at the specific issues that illustrates a positive alliance between Mexico and Canada As well as others that I think we should pay more attention to Regardless of any differences or those thirst upon upon us by the asymmetry in our levels of development and the demographic contrasts between our countries in today's world both of our countries are known for the opposition to protectionism their support for free trade and Particularly for the dedication to strengthening democratic governance from these flows among other things the importance our respected governments give to access to information and and that we agree on the need to work together on issues of security and justice to promote development human rights the protection of personal data and Cultural and educational exchange in order to achieve multilateral cooperation Based on a constructive Dialogue, I think it is important that all of us who are directly involved in strengthening relations between Mexico and Canada should be capable of the familiarizing the familiar and Making familiar what is unknown as the Polish scholar Sigmund Baumann says This means that beyond agreements about the economy trade and politics Deepening our social and cultural interaction is indispensable for continuing to cultivate trust between our nations The 2010-2012 Mexico-Canada joint action plan has emphasized sustainable development of our economies as a model for fostering competitiveness But clearly giving the relevance for improving the well-being of the population of both countries issues like public health and gender equality Should be pushed forward through many more actions than those carried out until now With regard to these Canada's collaboration can be particularly significant in helping to close the gender gap in Mexico Just as an illustration We should know that Canada occupied the 11th place on the 2012 Human Development Index and Mexico 61st in Terms of the gender inequality index Canada is in 18th place and Mexico 72nd our respective adolescent fertility rates were 11.3 for Canada and 65.5 for Mexico in 2012 Canada Canada's legislature included 28 women and Mexico 36 In terms of women in the workforce 62 out of every 100 Canadian women had a job outside the home and in Mexico that number was 49.6 I would like to insert a parenthetical comment here Opening the way for promoting the study of Canada in Mexico has been a rocky But highly gratifying road At the Center for Research on North America at TUNAM We have never ceased our efforts to broaden and strengthen our research projects about Canada Recognizing the restructural weakness 19 years ago when we began We have designed mechanisms to systematically Evaluate our progress and have managed to carry our 25 academic activities Over the last over the last four years linked to initiatives that include the study of Canada as one of the cross-cutting teams We truly understand how important is our is our relation with Canada and we are convinced That only with a long-time vision. We will see that our seed has bloomed Right now for example We are working with dr. Jonathan crush from the Balcili School of International Affairs on a joint initiative on migration and food security The emphasis we have put on the study of Canada includes research Teaching and dissemination This has been think this has been thanks to several factors among them The successful Canadian government efforts to obtain funds from the development program grant in some years Which gave us the opportunity to enjoy the participation of several renowned Canadian academics? Another factor is the trust placed in us by the former Canadian ambassador to Mexico Guillermo Erichinsky and current ambassador Sara Radecki who have participated directly in some of our activities This is an was also favored with the collaboration of the filmmaker because the film is one We have a research project on film the filming industry in Canada When we hosted the Honorable Jan Daniela font who headed a forum at the NAMM on the importance on the importance of art and diversity in contemporary society who organized with the Canadian Embassy in late 2009 in the framework of the official visit to Mexico of then governor Mikael John Without any doubt allowing our audience of professors and students to get to know these Public figures has been very stimulating for them and for all of us Based on our experience. We have been able to verify that despite its contradictions NAFTA spark at the interest of Mexico's researchers Professors and students in learning more and thinking thinking more about Canada in the framework of the agreement This was decisive in multiplying intellectual exchanges with our Canadian peers who felt the same way It is in this context that with the support of the Canadian Embassy Our institution created the Margaret Adwood and Gabrielle Roy chairing Canadian studies The chair has created a space of academic excellence to foster high-level teaching and interdisciplinary research where literary issues and reflection about the Transcendence of translation have been the outstanding notes However, the sharpening of today's economic crisis has surprised us with Canada's Distancing itself from the model of cultural diplomacy that used to characterize it We think that both our governments should go back to that model as one of the strategic axis for relaunching our bilateral relationship Because culture includes language for the new generations of Mexicans Learning English is one of our educational systems priorities Not only because of its importance in today's knowledge Society, but also because speaking it will speaking edit will strengthen our ability to interact with our northern neighbors Promoting the learning of Spanish based on our geographical proximity Together with the growing number of Spanish speaking immigrants in Canada Gives us a glimpse of the horizons for reaching the language gap In a global world characterized by increasing insecurity Mexico and Canada are forced to face the challenge of deepening our ties in the search of mutually Beneficial answers it is here that is essential to bolster education as a key for building the future Today Canada is one of the three main destinations for Mexican tertiary level students following the United States and Spain Let us not forget. However, that motivating young people is not a simple task That's why I am continually asking myself What capacities we must reinforce in teachers and professors at the secondary and tertiary level So that the young people of Mexico and Canada can grow to truly know one another What tools do we already have to do this and what other should we create together? If we take into account that the dynamics of our era are stamped with the velocity of events of the visual media and with how we cannot only move from one place to place but even communicate instantaneously Using a kind of micro language Twitter We have to recognize that we are experiencing a scientific technological and cultural revolution Some thinkers today are already warning that the new generations tend to disregard the past Defining themselves mainly by the road they want to take but without asking themselves Where they came from and how and how it is that they arrive where they are From these stems the importance of returning to the historical Significance of our bilateral relationship beyond these seven decades Decades taking the moment to propose that this task be carried out by a bi-national research team I am sure that with more joint education educational research and dissemination projects We will contribute to creating synergies among the new generations Even though they come from different cultural medias They will be nourished through their interaction to move toward building empathy Reclaiming this shared history Regardless of its length and knowing the history of the other situates us at the center of humanist thought as a result Those of us who have the good fortune of being able to contribute to the formative education of young people Interested in the study of international relations in general and in particular In the ties between Mexico and Canada have the obligation to fight ignorance of the past Since it is not only the result of a lack of information, but of indifference This makes it essential that we move ahead to what a future that must be better than the than the what Than what we have known before I Think that Mexico and Canada on doctorly have unfinished business in terms of exploring new formulas and stepping Up our commitments forging a strategy so that the new generations of both countries Can learn about the other and understand each other better More scholarships for students or new internship internship programs will always be important but never enough To solve the imbalances between both countries if they are not accompanied by policies that encourage a larger number of young Canadians to go and study in Mexico and Guaranteed that Mexican or Canadian talent can swell the ranks of the human capital Mexico needs for its development. I Could not close my remarks without saying that any plan for continuing to positively broaden our relation Relationship has to take into account the United States since geography trade and human mobility Have accelerated our interdependence in many ways many of which are irreversible however It is worldwide Underlining the premise that the relationship that is about to celebrate its seven It's celebrating today its seventh decade has one from the fundamental attribute in this context The boon of having a rise and without being darkened by the shadows of power and domination of One over the other or the shadows of resentment or discrimination We Mexicans and Canadians share common values like hard work and solidarity Enough for ordained by our proximity to be unable to turn our backs to each other. I Think congratulations are in order because Mexico and Canada find themselves at a decisive moment to be able to deepen Relations in the framework of such a significant anniversary Regardless of the agreements that the leaders of both countries and the Kepena Nieto and Stephen Harper come to Canadian and Mexican society most demand firm steps forward toward the construction of prosperity and We must also not forget as Billy Brown said that International cooperation is too important to live exclusively in the hands of governments. Thank you Thank you. Thank you very much Sylvia I would now like to open the floor for some questions and Interactive discussion and I would like to ask the previous panelists if you could come to the front and Laura so that everyone can participate in the In the discussion. I think there's some chairs up here as well so I'm going to trying, you know, if you can keep your Questions to sink so we can maximize the number of interactions that that we have So, please I see there's a first question in front of me Stephen Clarkson from the University of Toronto En tant que citoyens d'un pays en voie de sous-dévelopment je voudrais surtout remercier le gouvernement du Mexique pour son aide financière à nos autres pour organiser ce congrès et je dois dire que j'ai honte de prendre note du fait qu'il n'y a aucune représentation de mon gouvernement ici I just got a comment and a question if there is seen as coming to the front I want to ask her a question, but the comment was just The two-fold one is I'm very happy to hear the second panel Saying positive things about possibilities in the relationship, but I must say I'm more of a on the wavelength of Duncan Wood in Feeling how Disasterously the relationship has been handled at the government level and I just like to add to what Duncan said something that wasn't remarked on because it didn't happen but in the year 2000 Robert pastor was mentioned in the year 2000 President Fox with Castaneda and with the Intellectual support of Robert pastor proposed a solidarity some kind of solidarity initiative for North America Canada then under Cretien gave that idea the back of his hand Mr. Martin later liberal Prime Minister also rejected that idea and So I think we have to acknowledge that there's a bipartisan Capacity to ignore the importance of Mexico to Canada My question is is has to do though with an aspect of the privatized relationship Which is the interesting fact that Canada is a? dominant exporter of mining capital to Latin America and my question for Teresina She's there is because this is her area of expertise is to what extent the privatization of international economic law in foreign investment protection agreements Encourages good corporate behavior or bad corporate behavior on the part of Canadian companies Investing in mining in Mexico would anybody like to address the mining question This is tricky question When I was preparing my paper, I start to think a little bit if I have to say about it or no but thinking that the finally this is a Gathering organized by the Mexican Embassy makes it quite prefer to skip a little bit the subject because I Understand that it's quite controversial The problem is that an academic as me this and I am an academic so I'm sorry, but I have to answer Okay, and I think the Mexican diplomats could understand my my situation Okay, first of all, I think this subject Canadian mining companies going and invest in Mexico is a quite new experience for us first of all because only until 1996 The Mexican government makes some change about a foreign investment and secondly about You know a mining sector not all the natural resources only a mining sector. I Remember when the NAFTA and negotiations that in fact the Canadian companies were knocking the door and insisting that It was very very important to open the the energy sector at home In that moment the Mexican government decided to say no and wait for for a another moment The point is that the form all these 20 years The Canadians always insisted in that point In fact, the can the Canadian companies were Particularly interested in the energy sector because In that sector they have a very important skill finally the Mexican government open the open the door and The Canadian companies entered quite quickly now the most important In foreign investment in mining sector is Canadian more than US investment and Chinese investment and so on so It was something interesting that finally it was a Second recovery between Canadians and Mexicans because it was absolutely new We never had Canadians working in that field and it is I think it was a quite hard on other hand the The Canadian government start to be worried about the the behavior of Many companies in Mexico and so they introduce this subject about the corporate social responsibility That in my opinion is a shame Sylvia mentioned a little bit, but I take advantage and I and I would say something It's a shame that the that Canadian government take so much money that Was always going to economic development not only my country in many Other countries and so all the money from economic development and for public policy that it was support Canadian studies abroad all this money move to the subject promote Corporate responsibility, I am not against corporate Corporate responsibility, but Just think about it For so many years this country by taxes invest in it, you know in the promotion of Canadian identity abroad Because people like me are here thanks to To this investment it was you know a investment about knowledge about culture and like me like Susana and like Sylvia there are many many foreign people people people that work on Canadian studies since the last 20 years and Suddenly the government decide to take all this money and In good as the the Canadian mining activities And it is a big confusion because this is not economic development Okay, I'm going to move on so others can ask some some some other questions. You ask me. Yeah. Thank you I I just I'm conscious of the time It's not I have the hard job of trying to open the floor to to a number of others as well So it's a question of time not of interest believe me So I we I see there's a question at the back of the room and I'm Fernando from the Embassy of Mexico When we think of governments getting countries getting together we governments usually think about strengthening or creating institutions But Duncan and Jennifer Pointed out something that I think was quite interesting Duncan said let's build human capital and Jennifer said let's use soft power Let's use culture and it seems to me that after 70 years the message is we should start to get to know each other a little better So I want to ask both Duncan and Jennifer What do we need? Looking at the future looking at the next 70 years to have a Mexico-Canada 2.0 relation It's clear that NAFTA was great to create economic growth But can we think about a new North America in the next years to create growth, but also to create jobs and inclusion I I'm gonna add a supplement to that question which flips it in the economic sense We've talked a lot about North America now we all know in this room that There's a neighbor called the United States where Canada exports 70% of its product Mexico more or less the same and as well We rely on the US for FDI in the case of Mexico some 50% in the case of Canada I'm not exactly sure what the number is anymore, but it's it's the first country So my question is in terms of the you know the the commonality and I hear there's a lack of policy willingness from the government side to take this Trilateral relationship further Let me be provocative. Isn't it because we put Canada and Mexico both? Both put our economic interest first and what we really care about is exporting to the US Both countries and getting foreign direct investment from the US So I just kind of leave that as a provocative question to kind of stir things up a bit Okay, thank you Jennifer. You wanted to take one or two or all of those on so go for it Okay, I think I think we do we do need more Institutionalization of partnerships definitely as I say we don't we need science and technology partnerships We need institutionalized research partnerships. I think that that's that's really necessary And I think those can be those can be pushed by universities In terms of what we need To get to know each other and the Canada Mexico 2.0. I like that I think that's a great way of putting it two things I think we need two things that come to mind Immediately to the top of my head Mexican studies programs. I don't think we have any we may have one very small one We need them. We need them in major cities. We need them in Ottawa. We need them in Toronto We need them in Calgary. We need them in Vancouver Absolutely necessary. That's also a way to bring in visiting scholars bring in visiting lectures bring in cultural figures The other thing that I think we really need and I've been trying to to push this in Toronto is we need I was in I was in Washington a few weeks ago and there was a dinner I was a guest at a dinner at the Mexican Cultural Center and it was Fantastic, what a beautiful building. What a great what a great piece of architecture What a great placed venue to have events. We need something like that I know there is some kind of a center in in Montreal. We need one in Toronto It's the business people you want to capture We need somewhere for for visiting artists to come for shows for talks for people to rent out to have events Mexican art full of Mexican art I think that's something like that would go a long way to making Mexico more than a land of Drug cartels and beheadings in Toronto Duncan Just to respond to to Fernanda's question your agent provocateur role I think there's that I mean we can all come up with a long list of things that we could do to actually strengthen a relationship and get It to 2.0 or maybe we should actually just jump straight to 3.0 because 2.0 is kind of last decade, isn't it? Let's face it. So, you know and thinking about that, you know, I like the idea of Caterers of chairs in Mexican studies. I think that helps in universities, but let's face it a lot of What happens in the world today isn't about physical presence necessarily There are many ways that we could actually create research networks and And joint programs across borders without actually moving people around too much One of the exciting things I think is going on in the US Mexico relationship right now is you know looking at student mobility But not just student mobility in the sense that they go to study for one semester or two semesters in the United States or in Mexico And then go home. They go for a short period of time. They make the contacts. They establish a peer group They go back home and then they continue the conversation through social media through webcams through, you know Skype conferences, etc. Those are things that we can do But we need to have somebody to actually take the lead on that to set them up in universities across the country in terms of having Funding for higher education exchanges between either Mexico and Canada or Trilaterally in North America I think that's where that the three governments need to come up with a seed capital to make that happen But then the private sector needs to kick in and there's never been a better time to ask the private sector for this kind of thing Because as I pointed out in my remarks the private sector is seriously worried about where they're gonna find the talent in the future Look at what happened in the debate in the United States last year over comprehensive immigration reform Who were the private sector firms that were leading the charge? It was firms like Google and Facebook Because so much of their daily activity is focused on finding the human capital from around the world Just to satisfy the the needs that they have on a daily basis have a friend in in Austin, Texas Who's dedicates his his his days to recruiting Mexicans? To work for Google and that's his job He sits in Austin, Texas and he goes through the resumes and he calls up and he calls up headhunters And he finds them but that he has you know counterparts throughout the company who are doing the same thing in India in China Etc. Etc. These are things that I think we really need to you know to focus on is to say, you know the private sector needs people and Where are we gonna get those people and they need to now put up their money? But they won't do it on their own somebody needs to facilitate and we've seen this time and time again and in response to your To your provocation Randy Yes, the United States is gonna take up a lot of the attention. It should do let's face it But we talk a lot about China. How important is China to Canada versus Mexico to Canada? You know, I mean how much do we sell to China versus how much we sell to Mexico? How much do we sell to invest in China versus how much we invest in in Mexico? This is a much more important relationship and we ignore it and we have a completely one-sided semi-xenophobic Perspective on Mexico, I think in Canada and it's the responsibility of the Mexican government the Mexican Diplomatic Service to change that I think but you know, we need to get over this It's that you know this idea that Mexico is just down there and it's a great place to go on vacation It's a powerhouse and those of us who have visited and have traveled around the country That's just so impressed listen to what the head of Bombardier says about when what why he invested they says I went down there because it's cheap Labor, I'll be honest with you when I got there I found incredible human capital there people who are innovators people who changed our management processes and our production processes not just in Querétaro in central Mexico, but throughout the world That's what Mexico has Thank you Okay, I'm gonna give any students in the room a last chance to ask a question Thank you. Here we go. Here's one of our fine students in Political science great go for it. You step up to the mic Okay, sorry better. Okay So a few of the speakers emphasize the importance of increasing exchanges of ideas and culture and people between Mexico and Canada So that being said How likely is NAFTA to involve evolve into a set up more similar to the European Union regarding freedom of movement across borders Good question. Thank you for that. How likely is NAFTA to evolve into a European Union like model for movement of people across borders who wants to tackle that one You want to tackle that one go for it Thank you. I Work for the Mexican embassy and I wanted to answer that question thank you for the question and Where's the beef The beef is how can we become competitive together in the region? By the way, this is gonna be like let me tell you Yeah, one person. Okay, you get the beef is in competitiveness The competitiveness is not thinking in three labor markets or three energy markets or three Technology markets. It's one single labor market across the region So because there is we have many engineers and economic historians, but the economists have a theorem When you have in the condition of retreat Cost of factors of production tend to equalize If we can equalize the cost of factors of production include including energy, which is a very important relevant factor of production in the 21st century If we can have one single labor market that implies your question for you freedom of movement if we have freedom of movement of of Labor that has some value to the economy then we equalize the cost of production then when become competitive and that's where the BV is Becoming competitive a piece of it the rest of the world not amongst ourselves. Thank you. Thank you for that Now I'm afraid we're running a little bit short on on time, but speaking of 3.0 and Digital economy I find that since Ambassador Suarez has arrived here in Ottawa an energy That is going to take us way beyond that and you know, I think we're going to get into plasma energy beyond 3.0 with With the kinds of efforts that he's been making in such a short time Not only in bringing this together, but many other types of initiatives and he's been sitting quietly But he isn't he and his staff in fact have been instrumental in pulling this together So I want to ask Ambassador Suarez to to come up and and and say a few final words if you if you can't ambassador Thank you very much. I know it's lunchtime and I think there's very little to say after All the great speeches that have been given here Nevertheless, I do want to to start on behalf of my colleagues who work very hard at this to start by expressing our sincere Thanks to Carlton University for hosting for hosting what I consider the first Very double intellectual feast. It is the first to initiate the celebration of the 70th anniversary of our relationship Since I'm a bit of a frustrated a material story and I looked at many of the books And I noticed that some of the pioneers who have written on this topic Published books here under the name of Carlton University Mr. Do de la mr. Dosman Stephen Randall of he's from Calgary Professor kept kept luck as far back as 1995 and I regret the professor Conrad is no longer here with us to speak together with our with our friend with his asses I Think thank you president run T for your hospitality and to Dean Andre Blutter or plural day as well as to Laura McDonald and to you to Randy who helps so much in putting all these intelligent people together Today we appreciate those I would say we particularly appreciate Those that have accepted the invitation to warm from warm sunny, Mexico To the fight in truly Spartan fashion the time the challenges of this most severe auto winter I must say that one of the main obstacles to the relationship between Mexico and Canada are the very few airflights and the horrible Airflights that connect Mexico. It's really it's really something really Appendance to take part practice the only flight which is a air Canada to come to come here Not to mention the lack of competitive prizes that they have I Would like Particular to appreciate the visit of my very deep good friend on a secretary for North America Sergio Alcocero who really comes here to be with us today But I think to work at the forthcoming agenda of the bilateral visit. I'm sure he got many ideas here today In noting the unfortunately, I'm a I'm a Morgan economist and an engineer I was thinking that engineers build bridges and makes it and the economists spend a lot of time in this dozen Discussing what is the reason for the bridge? never and they never get They never agree not to mention the funding of the bridge, but anyway, so my envy to the engineers Well, he was a great keynote speaker Well, it's a great pleasure to see again. Professors. He'll be a noon is from the very prestigious North American research center of our Now and Dr. Gutierrez has is which I have not had a pleasure meeting personally I've heard I read you and I have learned very much from from reading your articles and listening to hear you today Susana Chacon is both a very distinguished professor and researcher and I must highlight that there's a director of the of the prestigious foreign policy Mexican the Mexican edition of the of the foreign policy journal She has published and it's very attractive the first for this issue for this year has a very attractive coverage of The 70 years of the anniversary. It's over in there with very interesting very interesting Articles I was delighted to hear professor Duncan Duncan would Okay, I will make three final reflections one on the past one of the friend one of the present and another on the future On the past I think it's the one point I would like to highlight is that the years 1944 are important 1994 is also important But our relationship we can many many years before I would like to underline three periods I have spoken a lot with our friendly Spanish ambassador who is who was here today And I think it's not worthy to speak about the role of the Mexican explorers Along the Pacific coast of Canada in the Vancouver area captains Narvaez and Perez When the 1780s predated and in fact gave technical assistance to captains captain Vancouver particularly in given in laying out Maps for him and who traded with the first nations particularly Highta nation I would like to highlight also as we mentioned the degree of activity during the or feriatto Obviously was really a great in the sense of golden age and energy finance and infrastructure the same topics that are obviously here today But I came across something which I contribute to history Who's to the history which is really something remarkable and I somebody that's really the the son of somebody that's actually saw this in in in in 19 in 1922 There was the establishment of what's called in 1922 the real conscious hydraulic dam in Chihuahua Who was the project manager of the hydraulic a real conscious dam in Chihuahua? None other than prime for what was then later Mackenzie King Mackenzie King was the project manager of the real conscious hydraulic plant manager in 1922 I think that probably made good luck for him to later become the longest-serving prime minister I will hope but also I would like to highlight, you know That you know asylum is a topic and social tolerance and social help well president I present over the gun again in in the 20s Showing a great deal of religious tolerance Welcome the men nights in Chihuahua also giving them full benefits in religious Education and marriage rights probably we are something like 200,000 I think they have contributed somewhat to the political landscape in the United States and probably also here the third area is obviously the the area from the Second World War to 1994 and here I would highlight the era in which we actually shared Very closely with the Canadian foreign policy on hemispheric policies I think we should not remember that Mexico and Canada were the only two countries that Established relations with the government of Fidel Castro all along Without interruption and therefore contributing in the in enlightened sense to the long to long-term to long-term vision But also Premier to don't work very much in this third way policy to get good meeting the contador of peace efforts on the present In the 20 years since NAFTA Obviously the economic relationship in trade tourism and investment the figures have reached a phenomenal Plateau there. There's There's there's no doubt about it. I Think here I will go a little bit my wife somewhere around here And so I like very much the academic forum in the academic forum I tried to stretch to the limit becoming less of a diplomat and more of a of a Condemnition well in doing this I would say okay It reached a great a phenomenal plateau But increasingly it is clear that the relationship has lost dynamism dynamism it has become stagnant Scholars and big scholars scholars here today and businessmen have pointed out this is you spoke here of the unfinished agenda I think I can certainly commemorate NAFTA. I think it achieved a lot But I must say it has entered into a mature into mature Dignified old age we would say in Spanish tercera with flaws limitations and increasing wrinkles on their face You can say it did not generate growth Very noted Mexican scholar Jaime Ross mentioned well, it's fantastic. We we had for 20 years export lead growth But with no growth It did not correct inequality between regions the north the south Skilled versus a skilled large firm versus small and medium-sized firms It is highly concentrated in a few sectors mining agriculture energy Automobiles and the aeronautics although it is true that that very successful real production chains have stopped have been stopped the future The 70 on diversity I think should serve as it has done here today to give food for thought and Reflection I think the real challenge is to achieve and define a long-term strategic vision that is both deeper and broader I think this new vision can be launched in the forthcoming visit by Prime Minister Harper and later on this year by President Pena the conception of a dynamic and competitive North American region oriented towards a underlying growth employment generation Greater equity Converges between income levels the unfinished agenda, but such a vision requires I think very much Intellectual support from the academic community to think tanks and universities have the substance and the credibility to do it It's clear that it we secretary Schultz place or the freezing the road is it make it's in North America's economic power Hello, let's let's let's give the substance to it New sources of dynamism. I think they're enormous Obviously the North American energy revolution that has been mentioned here particularly in gas And I think gas it's has been mentioned I think the property three of the largest future producers of gas three of the five or six potential gas producers are in North America is that that changes the landscape completely. It's make it in Canada, Mexico and the United States among the first six Obviously this has enormous possibilities for for grids Pipelines, there's a Canadian company that already has five projects pipelines to more than 2,000 kilometers. It's there Cheaper energy to mention renewable green energy. I would take a bit of I would be more optimistic than than a very interesting comment Professor Pruitt made it is I would say with all confidence. It is not like a step in the right direction I would go more more than that. It's not a step in the right direction It's a major revolution in the history of Mexico I think after 1938 that went one way was what happened in 1913. It's a major revolution. It's done Okay, you have these the major obstacle was to was to have a two-thirds majority. It's done now obviously you have to make the the laws but To to come to the constitutional agreement in the sidelines or not in the sidelines I think the the PEN together with PRI had to look at the more difficult issues Which are in the transition articles and there we changed what was a great limitation We changed the fact that it was not a good idea to have made no sense to have profit sharing That was I would like like this shit like this shared contract I mean no sense we moved to production sharing and I think the our friends from Norway very intelligent said you know You're debating about concessions concessions about working Mexico, but that's not so it worked invite invent a new word Licenses and permits and now will we working at licenses and permits? I think that that will that will really create a normal revolution in Mexico and cheaper energy Renewable energy Pemex has said we're not interested in shale gas that the Americans have 90,000 wells Pemex will not be doing 90,000 wells. Who can do the night in 90,000 wells Mexican private sector? Texan tech well some mixing companies are Drilling in Texas visa so you and certainly I would say you know the antennas of the of the Alberta firms I think it should be put because that offers I think great possibilities in shale gas Second revolution in infrastructure. I was somebody was saying yesterday Well a few a few weeks a few phase before the expansion of the port of Veracruz is the greatest Since the perfidy or Firiato times a doubling or tripling of the capacity of Veracruz. That's a great change I think the railroad projects are almost as large as a for Firiato. Now you're having a Transponential or railroad the road from Mexico to Keretharo to Leone and then to Jalisco the there's a you know For the fact or dry channel in the in the easements of the one the pick. It's really a an infrastructure revolution We have to work at ports modern efficient borders not physical or bureaucratic walls with our two friends The drive towards in this reindustrialization of the region with at four dollars are four dollars the price of gas The possibilities for reindustrialization in the region are absolutely immense There are many tasks I think it's mentioned here Canadian tourism in Mexico The Canadian tourists to Mexico has to move from Sun and beaches to culture to the baroque to to the Colombian to bring Colombian art We have to move from Canadian investment into Mexico to make some investment towards Canada We have now a major project that we think will go ahead And that's the bimbo bimbo the bimbo acquisition will become the largest bread producer in the world It is already the largest in the United States It will come the largest one in Canada and now the worries that I'll say well, let's hope that the the equipment to our old Canadian foreign investment Commission does not put hurdles in the way. Okay, as it has happened sometimes That's enough that the things have changed upside down I Think well Mexicans there are the figures that were mentioned by on the secretary Mexican students coming to Canada are Very large. You open the program. It's flooded by Mexicans, but you open a reciprocal program to Mexico and You know 400 students why we have to work at Spanish at the teaching Spanish Innovation, I'm sure that in this great project. I think it really Push forward by on the secretary I go said I think there are many ideas I think for Bessie, but it's a pity that for Bessie. I wasn't a meeting last week or the America They were enthusiastic about for Bessie everybody from the US academic community were there the State Department people They were very enthusiastic about for Bessie. No Canadian participation. That's that's really it's really a pity So I think we can identify some obstacles some obstacles Misperceptions and problems I Think some of the problems that we found to enlist Canada to a meaningful trilateral relationship in 1994 are still there In some quarters of government business or public opinion, I would say to borrow a recent title There is also a nostalgic view That goes by 20 years a nostalgic view that is that still looks in Anglo terms Either to the British Empire to Britain or to the special relationship with the US in this nostalgic view Mexico is not existent and is not part as was said by professor Duncan part of North America This nostalgic view I think loses sight of the transformation that have occurred in 20 years I think was mentioned here in a decade or two Mexico become the seventh largest economy We're six or seven hours away from Canadian or US ports huge location advantage. We're not 30 years 30 months or several weeks I Think the middle class. Well, it's not a dream. We have 50 million middle class That 50 million middle class has the wealth of the Canadians, but we're 50 million not 30 million. I think that's That's important. I think another change The the US will no longer be dependent on Canadian energy So that part of the special relationship will be gone in a few years. So that that Canadian energy is broken And I think politically well the weight I this is fair to say the weight of 10 to 30 million Mexicans in the United States I think gives us a significant political plot. So I think you know, we should not compete in establishing special relationships I think we're not we should not play there. Our other obstacle is not nostalgia, but economic fashions The trade agreement with Europe is a great success. We really congratulate you thought the Canadian thought is for it TPP is very promising Mexico is also looking both towards the Atlantic to To reinvigorate our existing trade relations with trade agreement with the cure and we're also looking to the Pacific I will highlight the Pacific Alliance. I think that really holds great promise. We hope that Sometime Canada will join The North American countries countries together can really strengthen our negotiations and some Very good writers friends of ours have said the European agreement is good, but do not forget NAFTA and your existing friends It was hinted here trade within North America now is twice the trade of North America with all of Asia And and trade with Europe a trade within North America is three times that of North America with a whole of Europe Mexico is a young population. I was underlined train in Western values and culture The academic community always brings the knowledge of objective history constructive criticism criticism and And and the analysis of the present as I was seen today very fresh ideas for the future I think you can contribute usefully and I'm sure here are colleagues in the embassy certainly In Mexico, I think it's been done by very efficiently by undersecretary And I would lastly say because the topic came here. I think to put in a sense, you know concrete actions I would very much think of the possibility that for the forthcoming meeting of president spainia and Prime Minister Harper It will be possible to set up the model of a Mexican chair in In Canadian universities the Mexican chair there's some and this Mexican chair can be I think the advantage is very cost effective Initially a Mexican chair also requires a good technical committee that you know get together People that you know in themselves will be networking you set up a Canadian chair You pay a plane ticket for the Canadian chair to the to the presentation You come here and you go back you pay hotels Of course nothing in terms of the of the value The Mexican chair can become a Mexican seminar of a week and the Mexican seminar of a week Can become a center for Mexican studies. We have to get a private sector involved. I think all our governments are very very Reduced in mud And I think this can be I think we would love if Carlton could be one example of this a Mexican chair in Carlton Obviously had to be mirror Mexican chairs in So Canadian chairs in in Mexico as already to some extent exist and I think it would be a great step forward in the soft hours range Thank you very much for your Thank you very much ambassador Suarez and thank you Undersecretary for participating in this event and This closes our session, but I would say Feel at home come back to Carlton We're open to take this dialogue further as you saw this morning. It was a very enriching discussion and lots of issues to think about and Let's let's move forward Where and we're happy to be involved with you and in taking this forward to the next step So, thank you everyone for participating this morning. Thank you