 Good evening, my name is Estie Glasson and as you know the private property gang brings you amazing content every night this week We start off with Zaman Tungua Kumalo every Monday to Friday at 7 p.m. with the private property podcast and of course Mbali comes to your screens every Tuesday and Thursday at 8 p.m. with the farming podcast and last but not least it's Chad every Monday and Friday at 8 p.m. He goes around Mazzanzi and travels amazing mansions and amazing apartments But also stay tuned to Chad's show because we're gonna travel the rest of South Africa very soon And this is something you do not want to miss and this evening I am sitting with an absolutely amazing financial advisor when it comes to property as well as Writer author Gavin Mukabele. Good evening Gavin. How are you? Good evening, Estie? Thank you so much for having me. I'm good That's good. I love the story and the conversations that we always bring to this platform It's just a pity that we have most of the deep chats off camera Yeah, but tonight is gonna be a little bit different and I'd like to bring that to the screens of our people and we talk about Money management right and you know you within the financing field of managing property and managing your money when it comes to making these big investments Yeah, and you you obviously couldn't all your life money management was not What you could handle and what you could do well so on that note I want to talk a little bit about Cuz and I hate starting the show with the downfalls, but you said you came to a point in your life where you lost everything Yeah, tell us a little bit about that journey. Yeah, so I think going back So I was working for one of the major banks So I started off in home loans fine enough In the you know, so I started in the cancellations department. I went to credit So I was that guy that called you to say hey look your your house is about to go to the under the hem so to speak and The funny thing about it is that I used to get the repolished every week And but I didn't know about this property investment thing and I used to like guys Please stop giving me these things, you know But I didn't know and at the time the repolished had everything you need as an investor It had the account number it had a name and say name of a client It had the outstanding bond amount and back in the days the banks will sell or will auction the house for the outstanding amount And it had an address and the telephone number. So it was easy for I mean to really get in there But yeah, so it started there and then But I got into Into financial difficulties and my funny my financial difficulties really started on when I actually went in and got a lease Agreement I signed a lease agreement when I I just started working lease agreement my it was a girlfriend and She she couldn't she didn't end enough. She didn't have a credit a good credit profile I did just got permanent staff member bank signed the contract I didn't know about the lease agreement and You know things just went sour. She didn't pay. I ended up now taking credit cards I got into revolving loan and that sort of snowballed And you can imagine when it's just starting to work and then all of a sudden you are now introduced to debt but not good debt and Everything just spiraled out of control Fast-forward resigned at the bank Started a business business fell apart and that's where everything just went And I lost everything I was engaged at the time just got a new baby and Yeah, I was just depressed. How did you come back from that though? It took me a while It really took me a while because you know through that transition. I went back home Luckily I had this the family that I have that were very supportive But I think for me that was a turning point Because throughout that journey while I was down. That's where I started, you know loving the whole aspect of personal finance To every actually to you know, the book itself the first book that I wrote, you know came there I mean I wrote it while I was really down Fine enough, but it was more around the stories how I got there and I was talking about how I'm gonna get out Well, I'm still there, you know, but it was all about you know, starting to understand what you know Wealth creation is you know what value is and through that I started to pick myself up I got a job, you know as like look get a job pick yourself up And that's how you know gradually, you know things started to turn around and did you obviously you've got it You've gotten yourself out there. Yeah, when you were writing this book. Did you take your own advice like in the moment? Not at the time Because I mean I was down How do you you know take yourself and for me? I always say that period was a firm mind period You know because nothing came right every time I would do something. I mean I did everything I could hold you I sold stuff and nothing was coming right, but you know, just when I was just about to give up and yeah I got my my first break and Things just turn around from there, but it took me a while to understand because sometimes things happen Or you start writing what what I've seen is that you start writing stuff You don't even know what you're writing about and then all you know how and I read I wrote all of that But actually that there was a message behind it And yeah, you kind of have to look back to see the exact because you're right once you in that space in that Spot and you you spoke a lot early about like depression in this very dark. Yeah at the time It's hard to take your own advice. It's hard to read what you're writing and be like how Kevin You're writing these things giving people advice But you don't do it and your your book is financial planning for what yes, so yeah What you know yeah Yeah, I think you know obviously when I thought about the title and When you when we always talk about finances, you know people always but for what for what? Why should I plan? Why should I budget? Yeah, you know, why should I invest? So it was pretty much taken from that context And then when obviously you take it from there and when you read it it becomes a total different story Then you start to understand why liquidity is very important. Why should you save? Why should you invest? You know and then from there on it starts to to build up because that's the basis You know, I always say that the way we sell financial literacy in this country And I think in jail around the world I feel that is flawed because we always especially in this country put savings as the in thing like it's the thing Yeah, my mom's I remember when I started working she's like you need to have a 32 days account And then I'm like, okay now you realize like 32 days account was not really investing You know, it was not yeah, so but everybody was doing it. It was like if you're like you have arrived You have a 32 days account. You are the man, you know only now when you're old and realize but I mean that That wasn't really it. Yeah, it's not investing You just get 4% below inflation Yeah Because you're right we taught to save and just in the show before this I spoke about because I was reading a case study Right, and they were talking about how South Africa is in a pandemic. Yeah a pandemic called financial illiteracy Yeah, because we illiterate Yes, yeah, and that's a lot. Yeah, and that's why we have these shirts And I want to go deeper into that book financial planning for what yeah Because you say that you write in a way where you share stories. Yes, and I'm very big on real-lived experiences Yeah, give us one a moment a story a time where you felt that No, we need to fix our financial literacy around the country and even within your own circles Yeah, I think it's actually started when I started to understand about you know issues of like property investing Because I wanted to learn more. What is this property investing? OPM. What is this OPM, you know, and then you start to understand man There's this the exposure aspect of it We know we're not exposed to a lot of things because if you look at our communities you look at our backgrounds It's again, you go to the daily two days account. My mom doesn't know about you know investments Yeah, I mean I'm right now. I just bought a house for investments, you know What's this for like no, there's a tenant you'll run it and then so that I don't have to give you money You know, this will be your money your monthly amount and these are the things that they don't know You know because they were they didn't get that from their parents So we also don't know about these things even with all of the information that we have and which is said, you know so but I think my my turn around was when through that journey of You know trying to pick myself up and then obviously you start to read, you know Books like your Robert Kiyosaki's and you start to understand. I'm there is actually there's a method There's a method. It's not just people wake up, you know, you you you there's there's a transition that you need to go through You need to know. Okay. Now I make hundred rent. How do I multiply that? You know, how do I bring a veil for example? Like if I did these days when I talk about personal branding That has a big thing around making money because your name is actually a very very important currency You know, yeah, you are a brand yourself and then money follows and a lot of the times we follow the money Yeah, you know where the money must follow your name, you know, and then you just sit there And like people like we'll pay for you to talk how you get out and say and it just comes But we don't know that because where we come from it was not taught and I think that is why we're making these shows So that people are fully aware of look, you know, you need to there's a there's a language Exactly. Yeah to everything. There's a methodology. Yeah to that to the madness Excellent. Now you said your first book you wrote when you were really down. Yeah, your second book. Yes Can we expect a different? Yes, yes, that one is gonna be fire First before you tell us about the second book. Why did you decide to write? Why did you decide to put your stories in a book and share it with the world? Yeah, I think the second one is actually also very not these books. They come very strange So the second one came actually last year. Okay when COVID started. Yes. Yeah So when COVID started, I remember the first lockdown How like the first three weeks I was paralyzed. I didn't know I Think I felt like a lot of people I felt like the world was coming to an end. Yeah I mean I I deal with property who's gonna buy property who's gonna invest in property I just felt like the world was coming to an end And then after three weeks I just sort of like shut down. I didn't listen to the news. I just like, okay, you need to Bring yourself up, right? And the first thing that I started to realize that the people were locked down So they were the whole what did they do at home? They were on the phone What did they do on the phone they consume content? So I said my content needed to be consumed as well. So I started being aggressive in terms of writing So I would write about budgeting outright. Don't don't worry. We are in this thing. It's gonna be okay I started writing about property different types of property how to finance it, you know So obviously people at home and that they're consuming all of this and people started to say preach brother. Amen. Amen I'm like, okay. So there's something there. Yeah, you know this amen thing. So I'm preachy. So give financial Semons. That's how it come on. Okay. Yeah, and then then I sort of hold a logo there. Yeah, and Voila, yeah, the branding started and then then I started posting almost every day around different topics budgeting Financing relationships and finances and then of course then people started following me like that and that's how the book came Up and my next question was actually going to be how you've seen your books change people's lives. Yeah It it it's been amazing. I think obviously look looking at the feedback that I've been getting And as I said the first one pretty much I was writing it for myself And and just the feedback that I've been getting say Kevin like for example, I talk about the tour con system there whereby I realized when doing research that a lot of the times we get into financial troubles because of having one bank account Because if you check that everything comes in one bank account, that's where we even have David order anxiety I call it that way. Yeah, but if now you split your accounts But obviously first thing you need to budget understand what's coming in your fixed expenses Then you have a surplus surplus then you split it, you know Then you have savings liquidity investments and then then you have an entertainment account because that's where the money comes out So entertainment account then you have a budget every month to sell spring 2000 This is my me money, but you then take it out put it in a different account And that's why you get accountability because every time I swipe I know that I'm left with a thousand You know, so then people say given I did that Wow changed my life You know I started to budget I started having conversation with my with my spouse or I mean I have a chapter around my tenancy how to plan for my tenancy. Those are the things that we don't think about You just have a baby like you know, the baby's very expensive But you could have planned, you know and all of these things so yeah It's really a change and of course the blogging aspect has also been you know, the positive feedback Yeah, and I also did like the the financial fast that we did Jen, which was like amazing people were like Gavin You know things have changed for me financial fast. Yeah I thought about this thing like, you know, we talked about you know people talk about fasting More in a religious aspect and I'm like, but why don't we also put a spanner into it and now be more concentrating on Finances so for a week we did that and there was different Prayer points or focal points every day. So we spoke about you know Profiles like clearly profile. There was a day we dealt with pretty profiles I asked the guys go and check your credit profile. Yeah, see what's happening there because a lot of the times We are so scared to look at it. Yeah, you know, so a lot of people's like you're giving my score It's actually not bad. Yeah, I can actually buy properties like yeah, you know And I don't we talked about giving financial giving because those things we also don't realize how important They are as much as we receive we need to give You know, so there was a lot of things that we did and I love how you linked it to the religious aspect of yeah And that I guess it helps us to some extent because Worldly things is what we're living with. This is what we need to deal with right now But if you link it to a spiritual level, which most of us kind of resonate with it helps us a little bit Exactly makes the road. Yeah You talk about your second book. We just spoke about you know, and you said it's gonna be fire What's the what's what's different you said the first one was mainly for you. Yeah, the second one Yeah, what is different about the two books? Yeah, so I think the first one was more introducing things, you know I introduced the budget. Yes, there was You know, obviously things that I propose people could do that could change the finances Like property investing at a time. It was I didn't really know the in-depth aspect of it Yeah, but I knew there was something there, you know, so it was introducing that so this is more in-depth So we talk about what is the cash flow driven property was a capital appreciation driven property What the location I talk about the psychology of an area and introducing terms that yes We don't know like compound interest, you know opm. What is it? A lot of people they hear opm What what exactly is it? Yeah, you know when it's talk about stock fell crowdfunding. Yeah, what are the things we're talking about? I mean today I was talking I was writing about black text Yeah, you know and the first book it was more in you know Highlighting you more around what people should do now. It's more on more of a generational wealth kind of setup Yeah, you know how do you bring it? Yeah solutions about it. Yeah Well, how do we now make it more progressive than before? Yeah, you said you were talking about black text. Yeah What about black text? Yeah, it's a little controversial So look, I mean, you know black text on itself I think we because a lot of people are advocating that we shouldn't talk about black text The word itself. It should be banned. Yeah, I don't really believe that Because I believe there's two sides to black text and which is great because it highlights a lot of things Because there's somebody that you know grew up very well For example, the mother father was there and they don't have the pressures off now I'm waking the money must go home, right and and they don't understand it But there is somebody who's sitting today and says Gavin look I Yes, I understand my mom took me to school and then I started working But now I now have to give back but now that thing can turn into a burden Because now all of a sudden I'm over indebted. You know, I can't do anything there's a lot of people that I've spoken to they're depressed because They can't do anything with their money. I have my mother I have my siblings and it's just too much, but I understand that it's my duty Didn't have to happen to me, you know Yeah, so and we need to talk about it, but now to say how do we fix it? For example, I had a client that Way back when I actually, you know Started around financial planning because I was a financial planner once in my life Yeah, and he came to me said Gavin. I can't save I can't invest Why because at home there's certain things that I need to take care of and it's just getting too much I'm like, okay, let's come up with solutions. What can you do? What's happening at home that you can actually provide? What service can you provide said? Yeah, but I come from Limbo It's very hot. I'm like, yeah, and there's always such age around ice I'm like, okay, why don't you get an ice machine and it's like, okay So we worked around it. He got an ice machine right the ice machine gave back to another ice machine to a point That they actually started distributing to filling stations and all of that like today It's a fully fledged business. Yeah, even quit work and they're running the business full time So there's certain things that we can do there. I'm not saying that it's a one-sided. It's a one-feet approach Yeah, you know, obviously there are siblings that won't want to do anything no matter what you can do But there's some that we just start to educate them to say look but you sitting here every day, mommy You know, I mean we are in the main road. Why don't we sell something? Yeah, you know while you're chilling there I don't know what to do. You could be selling something and then that could be able to help us and and again A lot of the times it's a pressure, especially when we're professionals You come there with the Audi A4, but they don't know that actually you are in trouble. Yeah, you know But my child is a doctor. Yeah, so I wanted double story You see it's a problem. Yeah, but now we need to be able to they need we need to sit them downs like mommy This is what I'm having. This is my income. This is my expenses. You see it's a problem So work with me. I'm not saying I don't want to You know Provide for you guys, but you need to work with me. What can we do? My siblings? You guys are not working. How can we upscale you guys? You know, maybe let's put rooms and then then we can be able to rent them out You know, maybe let's get a taxi and put it on the line then we can be able to get money You know, we start having different discussions like that fear of talking to our parents talking to the others about Yeah, yeah, because then and you're right. It's it's overwhelming It's sometimes a little bit scary because what happens is the expectation grows exactly from you Yes, the child that now has to give back. Yeah, so it's about opening the conversation No watching yeah listening to people like us having these conversations and opening the platform to talk about this at the dinner table Yeah, I mean I mean to also give you some perspective There's a couple of families that have said Kevin, you know, you talk about these things Can't you come and let's have a discussion and I've done that Yeah, we come they having like a cheap kitchen party Do a kitchen part? Yeah, and then I come and then we have a discussions and they've been very well because people are like How that's actually we can talk about these things. I'm like, yeah, we can talk about property We can talk about investing we can talk about a lot of things management of and then I come with my My body I write and then they start to see and it's been amazing that solutions are yeah We just need to sit down. Yeah, have these chats, you know, I'll be afraid to have them Did Gavin have black text and how did Gavin deal with the black and still have black text? So I mean I mentioned now is that I decided, you know what let me get properties Or my mom my dad and through that they can be able to Live off because I can I also, you know, you know, probably I'll get married We don't know and I don't want, you know, like, yeah, they must take care of themselves Yeah, so but I I think I started to to to think differently in the aspect of You know, it's one thing to just give them every month But I think if now we can create those assets that can be able to provide for them And it will help them at the end of the day and it remember it as well I mean, it's not as if it's it's just going in vain because that it's still your asset That when if maybe they pass on, you know, it will still be in the family for the kids and all of that stuff So I think now I started to to think differently even from a business aspect Right. I mean like now with the launch. We are having the financial revival weekend for the couples And within that I sort of also included family Like my kids are going to be providing flowers because they're starting a business for flowers And then there'll be service providers, you know, so I'm starting now to Like let's have proper discussions. Let's start businesses. Let's help each other Let's, you know, within the family itself. Yeah, so that we can be able to empower ourselves You spoke about knowing your why what is Gavin's why why are you doing what you're doing? We cannot in day and age Our children my child or my children still going to suffer the way I suffered It can happen, you know So whatever that I can do the contribution that I can make I'll make, you know I also want to leave Something a piece of me and that is what I think With the the the bow on the cover for this book Represents that gift to the world to say look, it's my contribution House, however small it is But to humanity to say guys, let us change, you know, let us do better and it's exposure I always talk about exposure. We can have Google But you know exposure is something that you experience Exactly, you know, if you look at the the Indian community, you know, the kids grow up Knowing that they must go and work at the at the shop. Yeah, they understand how to You know take money how to reconcile how to do stop taking I don't care if you study MBA that experience is much more heavier than the MBA You know, because you are physically seeing what's happening and you understand how to go exactly, you know So that is why it's generational and and and there's an amazing You know two stories that I write about in the book, but obviously people must buy the book And just two families And how the story turned out differently. Really? Yeah, and yeah, but it's all about what happened And you'll see how much exposure How important exposure is to everything. So there you guys heard it You have to buy the book in order to read those stories And I think that's also key is that a lot of us need to keep Reading before we wrap it up against all about your book you talk about Ups and downs. Yes that you've gone through. Yeah, I want to know about the downs We don't know about that. We know that it's happened and you shared a story that changed your life I mean you got into a point where you were in so much debt and you were still able to bring yourself Up from that. What is your biggest achievement thus far? um I I think it has to be You know, there's a lot of stuff, you know material, but I think this Pitches that I just did now For my mother And by the way, she doesn't know so it's a surprise Mom It's a surprise. So we you know, hopefully it will be registered in the next two weeks And then we're gonna do the surprise party. Thanks. Um, and for me, I think it's really To say thank you You know for I mean she was she was there, you know, she was always there for me And even when I had to go back home people didn't even know that I was down Because she would like oh, let's go and buy you a top. Let's go and buy you, you know this So it's it's really giving back to her and say thank you and I can imagine that day when we actually You know give her the keys and say this is for you So, yeah, you know, so I think that's the biggest that Biggest achievement thus far and that's amazing and That day is going to be nothing short of spectacular. You need to send us a nice video. Yeah It's gonna take it to massage the day and then It's gonna be like a thing. Yeah, it's gonna be a thing. That's amazing. I have one more question I usually do like a little surprise question. Yeah, um, I'm gonna read it quickly So a famous motivational speaker entrepreneur, South African guy probably know I'm talking about There's a question He's got a list of top 10 questions that he's really afraid That people might ask him. Yeah, and I took one of those questions and I'd like to ask you, right? Okay I What if The best decision to make Is a decision that goes against something you'd ever do. What do you do in that situation? I think it has happened a couple of times. Oh, yeah, um, I think Like for example, if if I go back to the book So when I started I mean you can hear gives financial someone so it's more It has that religious thing. Yes. And I've always been against branding myself In a in a religious kind of prospect because I always felt that I'll then leave people out Then people some people like muslims wouldn't relate to me But unfortunately this thing was in me then I had to do it and I was like, I'm doing this thing But I saw even my clients who like muslims like Gavin. I follow you all the time I'm loving what you're doing on the call seriously I felt that you'll be out, you know, so I think at times we overthink A lot of things and you know at times you just need to go for it And as long as it's within your heart as long as it's something that is Progressive something that is uplifting and remember that we come from different backgrounds, you know So it doesn't mean if I say god Then you must feel out of it. You know as long as the message resonates with you it resonates with you I mean, I'm not a muslim, but I follow people that are within that space and and I'm loving it So we shouldn't box ourselves and I think that's a problem And that is why this world is getting divided every day because we always box. I'm this I'm this We are sadaficans. We but we need to acknowledge we come from different Backgrounds and let us appreciate that and let us learn from that and This world would be a better place And you know this conversation went so so well because I'm just thinking about how like I look at you sitting in I'm just like you still are learning a little bit more every single day. No one can be perfect at this thing Right and I love that you're sharing and educating this knowledge with other people younger people And just before this actually we spoke about being humble and humility that we We need to always try and remember and to tap into and you were talking about how You know people come to us every day looking for jobs But the mere fact that when you people want money we need money to survive the mere fact you are saying someone didn't want to Pick up a broom and sweep or take a mop and mop the floor But you want money and you want so again back to the thing about humility So I want to find out from you Gavin just as we close this off. How important is humility for Gavin? It's very very important And I remember the I think it was two weeks back or last last month So I posted something where I said, you know, I what I do I do it from my heart, you know And there's something about writing that people can pick up the emotions And I wrote that and my and my one of my clients said Gavin, you know what actually if you were not doing it from the heart I wouldn't be your client I mean, but how do you know that I was took as like I see like I can read between the lines And a lot of the information that you share you don't have to share You know, it's a lot of people would charge us for that, but you share it You know so and that can only show that it comes from the heart and humility aspect of it So I think that that's where we need to start understanding and for me That's why this building Gavin as a brand is and as you know emotional as I am is very important because I want people to tap into me Not something else or somebody else. It's just as raw as I come And it's very difficult to do that because at times of my family or some people would like calling Gavin Why telling people that you're going for counseling? I might but you know, maybe somebody is scared to do it and maybe they can you know, love that. Yeah, so why not? Yeah, and that's exactly what I want to end it off and this is just a little quick question to the viewers watching Take this time now and find out. What is your brand? You know, how are you gonna carry on with your journey through life? What is your brand? What are you offering the world? What is your purpose? Thank you so much as you know we're live every Wednesday night at 8 p.m We'll see you guys again next week. Take care