 If someone said I want to be you, what would be the first thing you'd tell them? Specializing in a sport that makes more money than lacrosse. Drew Westerville, founder and COO of Hex Performance. You ready to answer some questions? Let's do it. How does a Pro Lacrosse player create a laundry detergent? Well, I can guarantee you I never thought I'd make laundry detergent. The original idea had nothing to do with detergent. It was about cleaning sports facilities, which was close to what I was doing at the time playing pro sports. And the product we were using to clean the facilities was really effective on turf. Turf was no different than the fabric that was emerging in synthetic fabrics in underarmor and the lemon. I was wearing it as an athlete, couldn't clean it. I started messing with the chemistry we were using on the commercial side in the laundry machine. It found really impressive results and it pivoted there. Why is it called Hex? It's called Hex because of the chemistry we use. They're actually diagrammed in hexagons and going through a naming process is terribly difficult. And that one had something that stuck with me. What is the hex molecule? The hex molecule is an ingredient, a technology we use that has a lot of benefits. Super unique for the laundry space. What makes it so unique? It's not a masking agent, so most ingredients cover things up. This is something that has a lot of cleaning benefits, removing specifically from an odor perspective. And it also provides a preventative technology that stays on the fabric. That prevents odors, it has a soft feel, it has an anti-static property, a lot of unique benefits that are all in one ingredient. The hex molecule is a really cool name, I like that you've branded it. Does anyone else use the base ingredient like yours? No, no, it's a very unique ingredient that historically wasn't used in aftercare or for cleaning. It was usually a technology that was built into a fabric or built into something when it was made. We've reformulated it to use for aftercare, so it's actually the first time it's been used in aftercare. Why did you abandon the whole anti-stink thing which is so relatable to a more safe message like clean up your active wear? Everyone's talks about odor, that's one benefit. It's a polluted space, everyone's doing it, everyone's marking it against it in a masking agents. Everyone says they do it, everyone's a sport, everyone's odor. The real opportunity to create a new category is addressing a fabric that's emerging. So active wear is a space where we can address and do that well beyond just odor. It's about caring for that fabric and have it lasting and performing and not having odor, so it's a bigger play. How do you prove to people that you're better than a competition? Well, I mean, the best way to prove something is to get someone to try it and see it for themselves. I mean, from the inception of this product, we've done a lot of lab testing that's atypical. It's a traditional detergent, so we've done a lot of testing that it is substantially different. The best is try it for yourself. Why do you blast your test results everywhere and try to make a whole stink about it, unintended? I think I don't think it's consumer-friendly. What brand poses the biggest threat to your existence? We don't look at this as us against other brands. We look at this as us against a group of individuals we want to capture, so I don't think we look at it that way. Is it weird being a male founder running a brand targeting millennial women? Frankly, I think laundry isn't a female topic. I think it's very quickly evolving to your own laundry, and I don't think this is a female job, so I don't find it weird at all that I'm in the laundry space. Who did your branding and what was the brief? VMG Creative did our rebrand. It was predominantly a packaging redesign. The brief was very specific to one unisex-looking package. The store clerk was very masculine, but it was really about addressing active wear and finding color palettes that aren't currently used in the category was really where we went after. Why do you switch from cool avant-garde packaging to the standard laundry model? It's a tough one. I loved our unique packaging, but I think in certain categories there's some things you can push and some things you can't. It's obvious that people like to detergent bottles. What makes you so good at your job? I don't know if I'm super good at my job. I have a lot of fun with it. Now we have a great team. I think we're going the right direction. What do you love about yourself? I'm starting to learn to seek help. So what I'm loving about myself is not putting everything on myself and starting to try and think of it like when you're an athlete, you have a coach. I think there's no different in business. It's okay to have a coach and consult other people. So I'm liking my ability to reach out and find support from others. What part of the business surprised you the most? The challenges of entering the category. What's the hardest part about this job? Patience. What have you learned so far? An NBA on the fly, I guess. I mean, this has been, you wear so many hats. I mean, I don't know if there's like, couldn't identify one thing. It's daily. If someone said I want to be you, what would be the first thing you'd tell them? Specializing in a sport that makes more money than the carols. What's the most transferable skill from pro sports to brand building? Peaks and valleys and grinding through. Tough stuff. What's the hardest thing you had to learn on the job? It's no longer sports. It's not a locker room and really understanding how to interact with people. What is a piece of advice you live by? Lead don't follow. Whose career do you model your own after? I don't think I modeled after anyone. I don't think it's one person in general. I think I've modeled for pieces of a bunch of people. What part of your brand still needs work? Every piece of our brand is never done and moving forward with. So I think for us, I think we've done well, is continue to evolve. So I think it's all a living document. What part of the brand are you most proud of? A most proud of our reason for being. And I think we're very focused on addressing what we think is an unmet need in the category. But that's really authentic. How important is community? Massive. What's the best and worst consumer feedback you've ever got? Best consumer feedback. This is a little general, but we actually get letters from people who have used the product. I think it's really unique. Not digitally, I mean written letters. So that's always interesting. The worst is hearing people ask us to move back to our bag packaging. Does PR sell products? It can. Do you work with influencers? And if so, how? Yes. I don't think it's a pay to play per project. I think you need to have partnerships and long-term agreements where this has to be something that's authentic and real and not forced and it can't be, hey, here's some money to post once. It needs to be a frequency game and it needs to be super real and authentic that they're actual users. What's been the best use of marketing dollars to date? It's honestly been influencer tests. PR or influencers? Influencers. If you had one marketing dollar to spend, where would you spend it? Influencers. Why is it so hard to get people to switch laundry detergents? It's very habitual until things have happened in the marketplace from a fabric perspective. You really haven't had a need or had a problem. It wasn't not functioning. Is there a reason laundry can't go DTC in the way that you see these other reusable, kind of Windex brands now coming up? Are you not able to kind of powder ship it and do it that way? I think it is. I think 90, over 95% of the category is still bought at retail. I think that's going to change rapidly. In the e-commerce space, you have more leeway to be more innovative in how you deliver laundry. I think there is still in the U.S. a huge issue with people thinking more is better. And 90% of laundry is water. So essentially 20% of the dose could be your dose, but no one believes it. It's crazy. When you see concentration, and that's a huge opportunity for direct consumer, is to reduce concentration, reduce shipping rates, and having people understand that more isn't better. It can be a small dose and still be highly functioning. Are you working on that? Yeah. It's a challenge because we launched the brand in a very concentrated dose, and we had feedback from people saying, this can't work. Even though it did, they had great experiences with it, they would constantly overdose. It's an education challenge, but it's a huge opportunity for direct consumer because I do believe that channel is going to grow immensely very quickly. It also feels like the next generation coming up wants everything to be more eco-friendly and reusable, and you're kind of forced to do the most least eco-friendly situation at the moment, it feels like. But that's kind of what America wants. I think we're a country that thinks more is better, and the younger generations coming up are thinking differently, which is great. Pushing brands to be more agile and think differently about the delivery technologies. Have you seen the success of a Truman's getting an investment from Henkel and Blue Land? Another one of these, all these, we send you the cool bottles once, and we just can't send you refills. I think what it says is there's opportunities to have alternative deliveries for certain channels. I don't think the business has to morph strictly to that vehicle. I think the beauty of direct consumers is how quickly you can test new ideas. That isn't an opportunity at retail. The sales cycles are so long and they're so regimented in what shell space is available, so it's really risky to try those out-of-box ideas, but I think that's the beauty of direct consumer and Amazon and your own website is your ability to test new ideas. And I think that route of just shipping a refill in a concentrated route makes sense, especially from a freight perspective. And I think it's, for any brand in cleaning space or whatever, it just gives you an opportunity to try different deliveries. It's not- I have to move the whole business here. Drew Westervelt, founder and COO of Hex Performance. Thanks so much for coming on and answering some questions. Thank you. I'm Ian Wishingrad, and we'll see you next time on I'm With the Brand.