 Call to order this is the 15th regular meeting of the 2009 2010 Common Council and as is customary The quote of the evening will be read by Sue Richards our city clerk. Thank you mayor Challenges are what make life interesting Overcoming them is what make life makes life meaningful Thank you, Sue roll call, please Born your bow Bowers Decker Hanna Heidemann Kittlesen Clayunas here Montemay or here in flesh sirik van der wheel Voo and wangaman excused 15 present we have a quorum now if Alderman Voo can please lead us in the Pledge of Allegiance. I pledge allegiance to the flag of the United States of America and to the Republic for which it stands One nation under God Indivisible very pretty injustice for all Thank You Alderman Voo for approval of the minutes of the former council meeting Motion in a second under discussion no discussion all in favor say aye opposed Motion carries resignations attorney McLean Like your honor, there's a email from Alderman Rinflesh advising that the he's resigning from the public works committee effective immediately Due to his new work schedule that the doesn't permit him to attend the public works committee meetings on Thursdays that Actually, we need a motion We have a motion in a second under discussion no discussion all in favor say aye opposed Motion carries mayors appointments attorney McLean I hereby submit the following appointment for your confirmation Heather Cleveland to be considered for appointment to the sustainable shabuagan task force to fill the unexpired Position of sue busy whose term expires on 426 2010 signed by the mayor that lies over and Alderman Vang name Voo to be considered for appointment to the public works committee to fill the unexpired position of Alder person Eric Rinflesh whose term expires for 19 2010 signed by the mayor and that also lies over public form Okay Excuse me first on our list this evening is Rhonda Griffith is Rhonda here Rhonda could you come up to the mic, please? If you'd like to get the mic situated so that it's right in front of you so everyone can hear That should be good. What is your address, please? 14 Pinewood Drive, what is it 14 Pinewood Drive? Okay? That's in summer's mobile home park. Okay Okay, you will have five minutes go ahead I am here on here behalf of all the residents who are going about the garbage fee That's being proposed to be added to our water bill. I Feel the garbage should remain in our property taxes. It does not belong in our water bill I'm already paying for storm water fee on my water bill, and I don't have any in the park no curbs We don't have any Drainage whatsoever, and we are being charged for this fee in my water bill already And I don't feel that I should also pay for other people's Other residents put more garbage out than me because I am a household of two And there's some people that put out ten bags of garbage, and I don't feel that I should be charged a fee to cover them I Think it's fair to everybody if you could figure out they keep it on our property taxes If you got to add a fee keep it on the property taxes figure out how many people are in per household and Charge accordingly to how many people are in their household, so they pay for it and not all of us So that way it's fair to have all the all the residents of the city of Sheboygan Because that's where the our property taxes are for the for the garbage removal and for snow removal of our property Some of us only work. I only work part-time and I am I don't explain it We all have budgets my budgets pretty tight and then with that fee added on I'm having difficulty paying my bills as it is As others I'm sure are in Sheboygan. There's a high unemployment, and then I have a licensed Stylist I had graduated from school, and I came and find a job to be a stylist at this point And I'm sure there's other people are looking for it that are out of work Also, and they could feel that that would also affect their budget in some way And I don't have health insurance and my parents don't have health insurance. I'm sure there's other People that don't have health insurance, and I'm trying to pull money again Just so I can get health insurance with it any more fees added on and it's gonna I don't feel that I'm gonna be able to get health insurance. I may be paying all these extra fees and I don't feel that's right So I'm all I'm saying is if you could figure out a way to charge the landlords the property owners And they could pass the bill under the renters if our renters gonna put out that much garbage. I Mean he should be the landlord should be aware that how many people are in his Apartment or house that he's renting because according to house the fire codes There is so many people Lollipur household And I know there's some households have more than 15 people in them and that is not put That's not right and we'll be now gonna be charged for their garbage, and they shouldn't all be there to begin with I mean And that's how they're gonna be able to afford it because they're all working together And they pull their money to pay their bills and that's not fair the people that live normal We all five six people in a house is more than enough, you know And it just don't feel that that's right that we add a fee to the water bill It should stay where it is And if you have to can we put a separate fee for the garbage on our property taxes, but it should still stay on our property taxes and I I hope I gave you a different idea maybe how to do it It's your decision of course to make but take it all consideration of all the residents that voted you all in and how we all feel out here and Understand I Understand that the fact is that there's Probably not enough garbage people maybe and then it has to be some way you're trying to find a solution But I don't think this is the right solution at this time But if you can figure out some way to do it where it's fair to everybody I think we all be we all be on board and thank you for listening to me your honor and ladies and gentlemen of the City Council Thank You Rhonda Thank You Rhonda next Next on the list is Dick Susha Dick, can you adjust the mic please? And I need your home address 15 North Point Drive And you will have five minutes sir. Thank you. I am representing Ishboin County Taxpayer Alliance this evening and we're concerned about the recent Pickup proposal Refuge pickup proposal by Mayor Ryan You call an environmental services fee But it still attacks on the citizens of Sheboygan and merely a shift in the method of collection Now here are some important questions. I ask you Since that fee will be included on the city's quarterly water bill Does that mean it will no longer be a deductible item for income tax purposes? If that is a case We lose another deduction that we cannot claim at the end of the year If the budget for a refuge collection is one point seven million What constitutes the remainder of the three point seven million? environmental services fee per the 2010 budget and Will business and industry and multi-unit apartment houses be built for refuge pickup? Since a contract with private haulers If not, they're getting a tax break Well more equitable for them But it will affect the general fund Furthermore, and this was not in your document. I Believe you must have a separate ordinance to establish this fee as was done for the storm sewer and For the wheel tack some years ago You cannot just add this as a budget line item We urge you to be aware of service fees It seems to be just a shift and the tax levy will only be reduced by an equal amount thereby not saving any of the taxpayers any money and Causing them to Pardon me causing them to have a valuable income tax deduction that will be lost We say this is a shell game with the taxpayers the losers Now if you favor this proposal, then we suggest total privatization of Refuge pickup that was proposed by the taxpayer alliance a few years ago It would not only decrease the tax levy But would also not impose an additional service fee Yes, the people will still be paying for refuge pickup But the service would be cheaper because of savings on labor Equipment and maintenance costs Now I know our internal study was done a few years ago as to which would be cheaper But I urge the council and mayor to review that position It seemed like an internal study of that seems to be very self-serving Privatization may not be a deductible item for income tax purposes, but neither is a service fee for which this is being proposed So therefore I urge the alderman and mayor to add this suggestion to the discussion before the passage of the budget Thank you. Thank you That's it for this evening. Okay. Thank you again former mayor Susha Getting on to the mayor's announcements Former mayor and everybody who is concerned I think you will be glad to hear that Next week Wednesday, November 11th at 7 o'clock p.m. In the basement of city hall in the Lower-level conference room with that. We are referring to that as now seeing as it is remodeled We will be having listening sessions Regarding the environmental services fee the proposed environmental services fee also that that will be Wednesday, November 11th at 7 p.m And also on Thursday, November 12th same location Lower-level conference room at city hall on November 12th. That'll be at 5 o'clock p.m. I encourage everybody including all alderman to attend We will have a formal presentation and we will stay as long as anybody would like to answer any questions and get public input We're interested in what everybody has to say and we would like to clarify our position on this I will not go any farther this evening. We will have plenty of time to discuss that I'll stay all night if we have to and I would like to have a true honest and open discussion on On exactly what this means for our residents Also under mayors announcements. We did we have With Channel 9 995 and 990 digital did I get that right? Yeah Which was formerly WSCS TV a distilled WSCS. We've shot the latest edition of the mayor's city desk show And that will air all the month of November Mondays at 9 p.m Wednesdays at 8 a.m. And Fridays at 2 o'clock p.m. If anybody is interested in seeing that That is all I have for announcements Consent agenda President Fisher, thank you. Mayor Ryan. I make a motion to accept and fire all reports of officers Pass all resolutions and accept and adopt all reports of committees You have a motion in a second under discussion no discussion roll call, please born Boke Bowers Decker Gisha. Hi Hanna Heidemann Hoth Kittleson Clayunas Montemay or Rinfleshe Cirque Vanderwheel and boom 15 eyes motion carries communication and petitions 1515 and 1516 to be referred Reports of officers to 15-17 by the Industrial Development Commission recommending approval for a drainage easement for partners for community development to construct a sedimentation bay and Eventual for bay adjacent to the pond on lot number one Sheboygan Business Center vice president Heidemann Move the suspender rules Have a motion to suspend the rules and a second under discussion regarding suspension Basically, we want to spend we want to spend the rules so that we can get this project started Any discussion on suspension of the rules Alderman Hanna Would it be possible there if we were to combine that with 1532? They're both the same issue And we're gonna have to suspend the rules there also 1532 yes 1532 is the Resolution Offering the same manner. Yep. Would that be okay? If we combine them and suspend the rules I'm seconded. I'll second. Okay, great. Thank you. So we are doing a discussion regarding suspension of 1517 and 1532 Discussion on the suspension only all in favor of suspending Opposed Okay, two abstentions We have Alder the president Gisha and Alderman Suric have both abstained. I Believe we could because they are on the partners board probably a good reason Okay, most the rules are suspended Vice president Heidemann they make a motion to move and accept and file You accept Accept and file the resolution and Same thing 1532. Yeah, same thing with 1532 Let's do accept and file the report of officer and pass the resolution and pass resolution. Thank you. There we go under discussion No discussion roll call, please Boke Bowers Decker Gisha, that's what I thought Hannah Heidemann excuse me cut Kittleson Clayunas Montemayor Rinfleshe Suric Vanderwheel and Voo 13 eyes and two abstentions And I did it again Jim Jim thank you And Alderman Alderman born votes aye 13 eyes two abstentions. Sorry Alderman born motion still carries 1518 through 1530 to be referred President Gisha Thank You. I asked the document 1525 be pulled for 1525 be pulled from the from the packet from referring and I move that the the matter the the item be be filed Okay, to be referred so 1525 we have a motion on a second to read to file 1525 under discussion Sorry, it was the wrong thing. I'm sorry. I was beeping for something else. Okay Under discussion to file 1525 Filing 1525 all in favor in favor say aye opposed 1525 is filed. Okay resolutions introduced three 15-31 by Alderman Gisha authorizing an extension of the agreement for interim human Resources and labor relations consulting services with HR Unlimited LLC President Gisha Thank You your honor. I move that the resolution be put upon its passage Oh, we need to pardon me. I'm asking for a suspension of the rules. I apologize On the suspension only under discussion No discussion all in favor of suspending opposed Rules are suspended President Gisha and thank you counsel for the suspension. I move that the resolution be put upon its passage On the resolution we have a motion in a second under discussion your honor if I may I'd The council had asked when we reached a certain point I believe the amount was twenty thousand dollars and the expenditure for this outside employee that The council would be may aware and we make sure the council has those extensions. We haven't reached that we're about 15 But we thought with all the work being done on the labor side It would be better to that nobody gets surprised and we're trying to be ahead of the game to keep the council informed Thank you Alderman Borg Thank You mayor Ryan Well this extension extension of these funds with the release still fall within the salary for the year of the Resigned HR director somebody could just fill me in on that Excellent question and the answer is yes It is still is contained in the funds that were appropriated for what would have been a city employee Only this is just an outside service, but well below. Thank you Any further discussion? Roll call, please Bowers Decker Gisha Hannah Heidemann Koth Kittleson Klayunas Montemayor Rinfleisch Sirich Vanderwheel Vu Warren and Bulk 15 ayes Motion carries 1533 and 34 to be referred Reports of committees 6 15-35 by law and licensing recommending denying beverage operators license application number 7183 based on her failure To accurately reveal all relevant convictions on her application her record of violations related to the licensed activity and her status is an habitual law offender Alderman Borg Thank You Mayor Ryan I move that the report of committee be accepted and adopted Motion in a second under discussion Under discussion Mayor is Ashley Bauer here tonight She's not here mayor Please proceed Please proceed Miss Bauer did appear before our committee on October 27th and after hearing her comments the committee voted unanimously to deny the beverage operators license based on her failure to accurately reveal all relevant convictions on her beverage operators license application her record of violations related to the licensed activity and her status as a habitual law offender. Thank you Alderman born any further discussion roll call please Decker Gisha Hanna Heidemann Cot Kittleson Clayunas Montemayor Rinfleisch Sirich Vanderwheel Vu Warren Bulk and Bauer's 15 ayes Motion carries 15-36 by public protection and safety recommending that the council accept the donation. Motion from the U.S. Marshal Service of a 2009 Chevy Trailblazer $5,000 worth of equipment a $6,000 gas card for the Sheboygan Police Department Alderman Hanna Thank you Mr. Mayor I move that the RC be accepted and adopted Second We have a motion in a second under discussion And it's even better than what's listed here this this is the U.S. Marshal Service thanking our police department for working at being good partners with them and the $6,000 gas card I think is an ongoing They their intention is it's not a one-time gift on doing this there's no strings attached is to be used by our police department and it's to thank the Sheboygan area for the Sheboygan Police Department for working so closely with the Marshal's That's excellent any further discussion Roll call please Gisha Hanna Heidemann Cough Kittleson Clayunas Montemayor Rindfleisch Serk Vanderwheel Vu Warren Bulk Bauer's and Decker 15 ayes Motion carries 1537 through 15-47 to be referred Alder person Clayunas Thank You Mayor I believe on 1537 that should be referred to City Planning Commission That was the action at the Finance Committee so not because we had it already and we need to send it to them It came from Finance 1537 will be referred to the City Planning Commission Okay, thank you You can note that thank you Okay we have reports of committees 7 15-48 by Building Use Committee stating that they will provide a summary of costs for the remodeling of the West End of City Hall to be presented to the Council no later than Monday November 16th 2009 Alderman Serk Thank You Mayor I move that the reporter committee be accepted and adopted We have a motion in a second under discussion Alder person Clayunas Thank You again Mayor Is this something that we had asked for originally or is there some question about the remodeling why are you promising this is something Alderman Serk No as your request of the committee itself that we thought it would be wise at this point in time because of the ongoing remodeling that the Council be advised of what the cost is and where we're going with it Okay Very good and if I just for the public for public consumption the West End of City Hall is where we moved in We moved the building inspection department downstairs to the West End of City Hall also we moved City Planning from across the Street to the West End of City Hall and the City Attorney up to the third floor of City Hall This is all part of the remodel which we actually reduced our lease payment at the building that we leased across the road by $46 or $47,000 and we're operating in a more efficient environment so But it will be nice to have a report to know exactly what it's cost at this point Thank You Alderman Serk and Clayunas All in favor see I Opposed Motion carries 15-49 to be referred reports of committees 8 15-50 by finance recommending authorizing the expenditure of funds for the appropriate cable TV fund for the purchase of new Camera and a related video equipment for the Common Council chambers and passing the attached substitute resolution President Gisha Thank You your honor I moved to accept and adopt the report of committee and put the substitute resolution upon its passage We have a motion in the second under discussion If you don't mind your honor this said It always amazes me how many people watch the council on TV and and as everyone knows oftentimes you can't see it Because of camera issues these cameras are ancient they're not serviceable any longer switching gears some problems So we have money in the cable TV fund to be used for cable TV activities and they'll be used in this particular case to Enhance the cameras in the council chamber and a console so that they can be switched It gives us the possibility when HD comes around their HD compatible we flip a switch and basically where HD This is part of a three-phase process that includes new audio because we have audio problems anybody watches on TV it's crazy And also looking forward well for Shaboy it's looking forward maybe everybody else for the last 10 years But looking at streaming the council meetings on the internet and even potentially housing them so people can look back Keeping a close eye on us all Thank you president Gisha this this is for $50,000 for the cameras and related equipment Initially we had a an estimate that came in at $150,000 and we have been working diligently to keep those costs down So it looks like we can probably get the whole thing done for about 75 by the time we're done Which is half the cost of the original estimates by by doing it bit by bit and bidding you know the the individual pieces rather than just Contracting with one company so it's probably the way to go any further discussion roll call please Hi Motion carries 15-51 by finance By finance recommending authorizing a transfer of appropriations in the 2009 budget establishing appropriation for cable TV Equipment and passing the attached substitute resolution president Gisha Thank you your honor I move to accept and adopt the report of committee and put the substitute resolution upon its passage Motion to second under discussion This is the companion document always with finance with this it ends up being two things that actually moves the money from the fund Any further discussion roll call please Motion carries 15-52 by salaries and grievances recommending referral of resolution number 117-09-10 By alderpersons boran bowers heidemann kath and clayunas authorizing the city of sheboygan collective bargaining committee to negotiate A city residency requirement for all newly hired including full-time and part-time represented employees to the common council with no Recommendation Alderperson kittleson Thank you mayor. I'd like to make a motion to file this document please We have a motion in a second to file Under discussion under discussion of this document was in came to salary and grievance. There was no recommendation Union negotiations are already underway and although city residency is a wonderful thing The salary and grievance committee has given its instructions to the bargaining team and they that is to move forward And I believe the process has already begun and we've put it in place And I don't believe we want to do the bargaining through resolution Thank you all the person kittleson Further discussion alderman rindflash. Thank you, mr. Mayor The report recommends No recommendations And there's really nothing else we can do besides accept and file with the report. I do want to go on record I think that that we can Make a stand and say that we do want wish to negotiate as a as a council Residency requirements or not if you recall for the non reps in the past We had had negotiated and said in this committee in this council that we can never go back to the the union representatives for a Residency requirement if we didn't really start with the non reps and so when we did to vote to have that non reps become residents That it was my first step and I would think it's important that we continue that step as well But again though with the report committee nothing else we can do we can't really can't amend it to change any other statement that way But I think we can By speaking out say that we think it's a good idea and so that negotiation committee can can see that What comes to negotiations to the more we have on our side that if we have to pull something away Negotiations the better off we are. I think it's a very important one long term I think it's important for the city to have the residency requirement for new hires We're not asking anybody to move that's a lot, but at the same time I think it's important down the road So once we go very strongly on having residency requirements at this point in time Even though the committee chose not to take any action. Thank you Thank you're Alderman Rindflash Next we had Alderman born Thank You mayor Ryan. I Don't think we're far. I don't think we're that far in the process where we can't add this to the list of things on The city's side of the ledger for negotiations. I know the unions are going to have Are going to have a long laundry list of things that are important to them And I think this is important to add to our side of the ledger It's my understanding that the bargaining so far is in the initial stages There have not been any proposals set forth at this time And so I still think there's time for this to go forward and be on the city's side of the ledger There's a lot of pain in the city right now with unemployment people in all of our districts and I would be willing to bet that if a clerical position came open right now a represented clerical position that position would come over or would come open and We decided to fill that in spite of the hiring freeze that we would probably get three or four hundred applications for that one position And I certainly would like to see One of my constituents or one of your constituents that's qualified for that position a City resident get that position rather than somebody that lives in Plymouth or Howard's grover Usberg Leading a leading economists in the country are saying that even if the economy turns around We will not be back to full employment in this nation as we were in 2007 and early 2008 for probably five years and So that's why I think this is very important. It's very timely and I'm not I'm good I'm not going to vote to file this document. Thank you. Thank you Alderman Boran. Next we have Alderman Balk Mr. Mayor, I just To address the issue why the committee wasn't able to offer a recommendation to this body I was out of town that night for work I was unable to chair the meeting my vote would have been would have put it into the filing And if I had been able to be there last not last meeting we wouldn't even be having this conversation So it would have been the will of the majority of the salaries and grievance committee to a file that back then and all We'd be doing is approving that filing I Applied Alderman Boran for this. I'm actually it's actually some of my fault He and I talked about it, and I thought it would be a good idea in retrospect. It was too late in the process this this these negotiations are ongoing and and again, I hope we can bring this up sometime when it's When it's more equitable, you don't get anything from these negotiating units without paying for it So as soon as we asked them To let us have this residency requirement They're gonna do what they do every time I ever met with them. They're gonna put their hand out They're gonna say what's it worth to you, and that may sound kind of antagonistic But that's the way it is and if this city doesn't like that then quit sending people to Madison that put the people in Mediation and arbitration laws that are that are in place that have tied our hands where they are now So if you've voted in Wisconsin for the last 25 or 30 years, and you don't like the way This is right now look in the mirror and quit sending those kind of people to Madison. Thank you your honor Next we have Alderman Bowers Thank you, Mary. I was the only depression that this could be used as a bargaining ploy And that it wouldn't become part of our laws or anything like that. So I do think that it would be beneficial to us to use it as a bargaining ploy and we give up and they give up so However without making it a law or an ordinance in the city I would be in favor of it if I may just speak briefly on it we With all with all due respect for Alderman Boran and I myself I believe in residency for our city employees I have and I've supported it since the since my first year on the council I believe that all city employees should be residents of the city However right now with negotiations the city does not have a lot to give in negotiations what we're looking for is basically To bargain economic issues in other words, can we get a pay freeze? that Goes right to the bottom line of the budget that we're trying to put together right now Can we possibly get a freeze on step increases or a delay in step increases that these are important matters right now? That matter economically to the city to throw residency into the mix right now in My opinion is like throwing another wrench in the gears You know we can do you folks can pass this resolution if you'd like you Alder persons Directing the committee to negotiate it But it will not have any immediate economic impact for the city at this point So that that would be my opinion on it and that's all I will say Alderman or President Gisha Thank You Your Honor When I became president of the council an obligation that came with it was to be on the bargaining team and That is made up with Tom Rice Terry Hansen our finance director Alderman Bauch as chairman of salary and grievance and myself plus the Appropriate city department had dependent on who you're talking to whichever department you're talking to So for people to say we're not too far in the process. It really isn't a big deal We just started this thing I've been in virtually every single minute of the meetings leading up to and including all these bargaining sessions We've had and I'm talking hour upon hour upon hour upon hour So for someone to say don't worry about it. We just started this process By our agreement with our represented unions. We cannot state to you in open session What's happened in those meetings to this point? But I can tell you that It's a myth to say that we're just in the infancy of this process and this won't mean a thing Because that is completely false It's been brought up at these meetings It's caused a problem in these meetings and you can have residency tomorrow via the contracts What are you going to give them? What if that committee comes back in and says hey guys We got your residency. It was only going to cost you a 4% You're going to do that? We don't have any money. We have nothing to bargain with. I'm not saying anything out of school We don't have anything. We've got a million one hundred and two thousand dollar deficit and you want to stop bargain Insist on bargaining residency. This isn't the time for that Whether you this is not about residency There's a process in our city ordinance. It says the salary and grievance committee should set the policy for the bargaining committee Seller and grievance committee did set the policy for bargaining months ago and That policy is exactly what we all voted on as our budget resolution for the year. That's the policy That's the message. That's the honest message. We've given our bargaining partners for the last Dozen meetings we've had and now we're going to go in and say oh by the way forget about all that We only care about residency and it's going to cost us a lot of money First it doesn't follow the ordinance the council has every right to jump in and say you got to do this then you guys can all accept The result of that and that is high wage increases because that's the only way you're going to get it We have nothing else to give they have an insurance plan that there is nothing else like it that we can find in the entire country of the United States So we can't give them any more there They don't pay deductibles Co-pays all that stuff can't give them anything there. It comes down to wages again. This is not about residency It's about a process and it's about does are the decisions we're making today on all these packets and all these resolutions on everything We do make that one million one hundred and twenty thousand dollar figure higher or lower We have a statutory requirement by the end of this year to have a balanced budget by statute This makes the dollar figure higher than the one million one hundred and twenty thousand Where are you gonna find the money? I get also a lot of great ideas, but where is the money? This will do tremendous harm tremendous harm to the stat to the to the Ordinance that we have in place and the process was followed by the salary and grievance committee and everything right on down the line To now suddenly switch gears Again those who have not been in these meetings do not I've committed Our upon our upon our in strategy meetings and then these bargaining sessions. I tell you it's false That's a false thought That we're in the infancy and this won't matter It is false and the result will be higher costs to the city when we don't have any money Somebody wants to find the money to pay for it. That's one thing, but I urge you please Don't do this. This is bad policy bad timing and Let me give you an example and I'll end and that is two weeks from now I decided to write a resolution say city employees have to pay 50% of their health care and we bring that into the council It's a great idea. Just like residents. It's a great idea. We're gonna do that Two weeks from that Alderman Hannah comes in and brings a residency as if city employees have to wear red hats on Thursdays We're gonna then bargain that and change the bargaining process There's a reason the ordinance is set up the way it is So the salary and grievance committee sets the policy the policy is then carried out by the by the bargaining committee Which they've been doing because I've been there and Now we're gonna change the whole deal. I'm sorry That's just there's a reason these ordinances are in place and by screwing up the process You open up the possibility of another ordinance in two weeks another ordinance after that in two weeks another after that And who's gonna pay the bill unless the taxpayers of the city of Sheboygan for what? I see basically as a as a feel-good Measure that's gonna cost a ton of money and I would like to ask Acting the floor to open for acting HR director Tom Rice to give his opinion as a professional involved in this process Do we have a second to open the floor to all in favor of opening the floor to Tom Rice? Aye opposed Ladies and gentlemen You've asked my opinion. I'm not going to talk to you about Statutes and general orders and those kinds of things because quite frankly, I'm not sure I understand all of it. I Will tell you that we are into the throws of negotiations We have put forth a position with all of our unions telling them that we want to partner with them and we want to share in Trying to resolve the issue that we have before us, which is a one point one million dollar deficit Most of the bargaining thus far has talked about economic issues As far as I'm concerned, that's all we're gonna talk about Because that's all we have to talk about we have to take and complete a Insurance program by December 15th So that we can put that in place That is a monumental task We have to convince our unions that there is no money available and Terry and I and Jim and Corey are working as hard as we can to make sure they understand that I Don't know what do you understand the magnitude of what we're trying to do But we're trying to get a contract with seven different bargaining units With virtually them giving up Quite a bit and us giving them nothing If anybody's been involved in labor relations, that's almost an impossible position to bargain from And yet I think we can be successful Simply because I think in talking to our unions. They understand the situation and thus far. They've been very reasonable. I Think if we throw this into the fray They're going to consider this is unreasonable We don't need more things to withdraw from the table We have very few things to talk about all of them have a dollar impact and all of them need to be resolved So I would just urge you to think about the impact this can have We have set across the table to every one of our unions and we will continue to say we have nothing to give And we don't Questions that you have are there any questions for? Acting HR director Tom rice Thank you, Tom next we had Alderman born Thank You, Mary Ann I Begged to get disagree with with President Gisha on this This has been out there in the public domain This is not springing a surprise in our bargaining units This has been out in the public domain for at least the last two weeks when this got referred to salary and grievances And as I said before the bargaining units are going to have non-monetary things on their wish list and I think the city can have this on their side of the ledger as a part of partial as a bargaining tool and if push comes to shove if it does involve money That doesn't mean that the city bargaining Committee has to accept the proposal of the unions. It's a give-and-take But I definitely think we should have it on our side of the ledger because I know that the bargaining units are going to have a long list of of items on their side of on their side of the ledger and also I think you know it might be who've are are represented employees to show a little Empathy and sympathy for the economic situation in the city This is not going to affect one city employee who is now working for the city This is only going to affect new hires And I think it's time for our public employees to show a little empathy for what's going on in this community And who's paying the bills for their salary this young lady back here who happens to be a constituent of mine is Having a hard time making ends meet and there's hundreds if not thousands Of our constituents that are having these same difficulties. So let's step Let's have the bargaining units step up to the plate show a little empathy for the people that are paying the freight in this town Thank you Thank you Alderman Boran. We have a Alderman bout next you mr. Mayor Just a couple of thoughts The reason that we shouldn't vote on this night the reason we should vote to file is because there are a lot of Older persons in this room that would vote no Not because they don't support residency but because they Understand that this is not the right time to engage in this conversation and the second thought is so the reason I think we should file it tonight is because Putting it on the on the docket to so we can stand up and be counted with regard to our position on residency That's not how we would vote tonight or most of us anyway a lot of us would vote based on the economic impact of already being engaged in the negotiations and the second point is Alderman born's got a lot of passion for this and he's exactly right my experience so far in the bargaining process has been that there is a Disattachment or an unattachment between what the municipal bargaining units Feel and feel obligated to do and accept and what's going on with our constituents. There's a disconnect there and the fact that HR Director Tom feels that it's a monumental task to get 450 people covered with medical insurance and paid next year We'll tell you again, and he's not wrong. I'm not mocking him I'm saying that it's unbelievable that to get 450 people health insurance and paid next year We have to go through the gyrations that the president gish is talking about it is unbelievable So I say again if you find it unbelievable look in the mirror if you've been voting in Wisconsin for the last 25 or 30 years Because you voted those people to Madison cut it out Thank you your honor. Thank you again Alderman Bach Once again president Kisha, and then I'm done. I won't talk about Madison. I'd like to address the point that They'll have non-monetary items and will have non-monetary items From a person who is sat in these meetings that does not exist That is a fantasy I'm talking about reality of what actually goes on in the room as much as I can say based on our confidentiality Agreements, they don't have a list of little throw-ins and we have our list a little throw-ins This is not a little throw-in. I will further state that if we have to give up real life cash percentages to To make this and I believe improper resolution based on our ordinance We can do it if not in the proper in the sense that it the council can't interject but improper in the sense that is screwing up a Process that's already in place On record I will not be responsible for the pay raises that are going to be result in us getting this Because we'll have to give up cash. There are no non-monetary items If that is what's in your head, it doesn't exist from somebody who's been in the room for virtually every second of these discussions and backed up by our professional HR person Tom Rice It's not oh, we'll give you this and we'll give you that and there's no money really that costs any of this stuff That's not the case. We are bargaining financial items and basically financial items only there aren't there isn't anything else This will balloon our deficit in 2010 That means more layoffs in the city less cops less firemen less office people if we have to give two or three percent You are voting if you vote not to file this For more layoffs, there's just no other way around it We got to give up cash for it and we don't have any cash. I'm not saying residency isn't a good idea I'm saying that this process and interjecting it at this time with our budget situation at this time is Going to mess everything up and I will not be responsible For those percentage figures that will blow this budget up for not only 2010 Three-year deals or two-year deals could be 2011 and up to 2012 it will cause you major financial problems Feneed Thank You President Gisha We are out of lights on the motion to file Roll call, please know what they're voting on No And I vote would be to file the documents, okay Cough Kittleson Clayunas Montemay or Rindflash Cirque van der wheel Voo Warren Boke Bowers Decker Gisha Hannah Heidemann, no, excuse me ten eyes five nose Motion passes to file. Yes file Okay, ordinances introduced 10 15-53 lies over 1554 and 55 to be referred matters laid over 11 14-36 Resolution 109-09-10 by Alderpersons Gisha client is born Montemay or in Heidemann authorizing a transfer of appropriations in the 2009 budget Establishing revenue and appropriation for updating lighting in city buildings in HVAC update at Municipal service building and for business development loan funds from the US Department of Housing and Urban Development CDBG recovery program President Gisha Thank you, your honor. I move that the resolution be put upon its passage Motion in the second under discussion No discussion roll call, please Kittleson Clayunas Montemay or Rindflash Cirque van der wheel Voo born Boke Bowers Decker Gisha Hannah Heidemann and Coth I'm sorry. Thank you 15 eyes motion carries Resolution 110-09-10 14-37 by Alderpersons Gisha Clayunas born Montemay or in Heidemann authorizing the city of Sheboygan in the county of Sheboygan, Wisconsin to borrow from the trust funds of the state of Wisconsin the sum of $800,000 for the purpose of financing stormwater improvements and for no other person purpose Excuse me and for no other purpose and don't give it to any person President Gisha. Thank you, your honor. I move that the resolution be put upon its passage Motion in the second under discussion Alderman Voo Thank you, your honor. I have a question of the lab paragraph The first paragraph on the back the way I understand these paragraphs is that the there'll be property text race through all the city But it could be I could be wrong in maybe just to property owners that different properties receive sewer work Just want to clarify on this paragraph if throughout the city or just Okay, you're talking about the paragraph on the back of the photograph on the back That there shall be raised and there is levied upon all taxable property. Is that the one? All taxable property within the city of Sheboygan in the county of Sheboygan, Wisconsin A direct annual tax for the purpose of paying interest and principal on the loan as they become due President Gisha, would you like to handle that Steve would you like to handle that? In other words, I think what this is saying is we're going to have to find the money to pay this back obviously But is it a city or just specific property owners He wonder if it's he's wondering if it's an assessment In order in order to Borrow funds and have a balanced budget you have to agree that You will raise Taxes over the the life of the loan in order to pay back The loan payments the state requires you That's how the state guarantees the loan basically is that the city Is agreeing to pay it back Over time and I don't know how the loan repayments are structured, but they require that the city adopt In each tax year Include an amount to cover the principal and interest of those loan payments to pay back the state And if I may By attorney mclean saying that the city raised taxes It doesn't mean that the city is going to raise raise the tax levy to repay the loan It means that the city will have the revenue coming in and it will be in the budget to repay the loan Just as it would any bond or you know any any any bond or any other borrowing that we would do Okay, thank you Thank you. If I could further maybe clarify more direct to alderman vu's point This will not be assessed just on the people in that area alderman vu This is Pay the bond payment in this case or in this case Technically out of this land trust fund where the monies are coming from will come from the general fund It won't be just assessed on that one section. It's over the whole city And this is normally something that we would in in former years go out on a bond We would have we have a bond issue to to take care of this but with the small amount and and not wanting to Go out on the market for bonding right now because we do not What am I looking for here? We don't want to go to the bond market We don't want to go to the bond market at this point with the unemployment as high as it is in the city Exactly. We don't want our credit rating looked at that. That's what I was looking for It makes sense to go to Go to this fund to borrow the money from the state All the person play with us Any further discussion I would just add your honor and counsel that if you did go to bond Basically, there'd be the same requirement. You have to agree To the bondholders that you're going to be repaying the bond proceeds. So you've got to agree to annually Levy an amount to cover the principal and interest of the bond so This is a small dollar amount If you were to bond for it in addition to getting credit ratings and that sort of thing you're paying a lot of additional costs for a rather small dollar amount and the loan Interest rate from the state is very favorable three and a half percent. So it's it's uh I think probably beneficial to go through the state trust fund loans here than Then to bond for it Thank you attorney mcclean any further discussion None roll call please clay unis Montemay or rin flash sirak vander wheel blue boron bauk Bowers Decker Gisha Hannah Heidemann kath And kittleson 15 eyes motion carries 14-38 resolution 111-09-10 by alderpersons Gisha clay unis boron montemay or and heidemann authorizing an amendment to the contract for professional services For the design and engineering services for taylor drive road reconstruction in storm sewer with donahue and associates president gisha Thank you. I move that the resolution be put upon its passage Motion and a second under discussion No discussion roll call please montemay or rin flash sirak vander wheel blue boron bauk Bowers Decker Gisha Hannah Heidemann kath kittleson And clay unis 15 eyes Motion carries other matters authorized by law attorney mcclean 1556 is an aroh by the city clerk submitting communication from terry lee 11's requesting a waiver relating to the sex offender residency restrictions that will go to public protection and safety 1557 is communication from the boys and girls clubs requesting permission to host the 2010 gust mackere three on three basketball tournament at the land park august 5 through 8 2010 i assume that would be yes That would be 2010. That's a typo on that one Now we'll go to public works in marina and harbour 1558 is an ordinance repealing and recreating section 10 dash 103 Sub G of the municipal code So as to create an economic development grant for certain successful applicants for reserve class b alcohol beverage license that lies over 1559 Is an aroh by the city clerk submitting the city's tax levy report that supports the 20 Excuse me the 2009 10 budget for the lake shore technical college district That will be referred to finance 1560 is submitting the wisconsin apartment of public instruction tax levy certification for the coer school district That will go to finance 1561 is an aroh by the city clerk submitting communication from ken wilson regarding a bill that he received for $331.44 for a recycling violation and asking that the bill be waived That will go to public works 1562 Is an aroh by the city clerk submitting various license applications for the period ending june 30 2010 and june 30 2011 That will go to law and licensing 1563 is an aroh by the deputy city clerk submitting a communication from linda shaman Requesting that her accident claim number 29 dash 08 Attached to ro3 11 0809 be filed as there is no need to pursue payment of any medical expenses Since the insurance company paid the expenses in full That will be referred to risk management Thank you attorney mclean for a motion to adjourn In a second we are all in favor say aye opposed We are adjourned