 Good evening, everyone. I'll call the meeting to order at 7 o'clock. First item on the agenda every night are the minutes. So January 4th, 22. We accept subject to modifications. Second. Terri under number 6, this is a question or comment, which is if I remember correctly, we decided we did not have time to discuss item number 6 form based code update and that we've deferred any discussion to a future meeting and I just wonder if the minute should reflect that. And that's correct. Yes, thanks 3 top number 8 under budget deliberations. It's like that to look at the energy coordinator should be the energy planner position. Here are no other corrections almost in favor of proving the minutes of January 4th, 22, I have amended. Hi, hi, this is a time for public comment on any issue that you may wish to speak on. If you wish to speak, please come to the table and identify yourself. Anyone on zoom, which is. No, no one on zoom. Okay. Then we'll move on to the. 2021 equalization study reports and built him and is going to be joining us by zoom and Eric, if you can. I'd like to lead off the the comments and turn it over to actually tear. I got a hand raised online. Just as I said that for public comment. Okay. Would you like to go? Share and I see you with your hand raised. I'm going to connect you to talk. And if you could just share your last name as well, when you're connected, my name, my name is Sharon Goodwin. But you know what, I think that I need to wait until the agenda hits on the energy committee interview. No. Yes, I just want to make. You're right. We'll call upon you and that's the next after the equalization. I just wanted to make sure that, I mean, I can see you guys, but I don't have the camera on that I can see, but I don't need to be seen. But I just wanted to make sure that you knew I'm ready to go. Thank you. I know who you are. Yes, I know you too. We'll call upon you. Sure. Yep. Bill again, you've connected right now just a moment. Can you all hear me now? Okay, great. So anyways, every year we have the equalization study. I'm not sure how many do we have new members this year. Okay, just to a quick overview of what the explanation study involves each year. The state looks at all the sales we have in the town of Williston as well as the other towns in the state. And does a three year sales study, April one to April one. And then the results of that study are given to us in late December for our review as to whether we feel the number is fair. The first, the first part of that study measures what's called the common level of assessment. The common level assessment measures the sales versus the assessments and by percentage where they're where they're landing. The study is what we call a non time adjusted study over three year periods. So those sales that happened to between two and three years ago are given the same weight as the sales that happened in the last year. That's not really a typical way of most states do it, but that's the way we've always done it in the state of Vermont. This year that number came in at 84.97%. The second part of that study is what's called the coefficient of dispersion. This is a general measurement of equity within town to make sure that each individual property assessment is paying their fair share in comparison to other properties within the town. The COD is like a bell curve. The center point of that bell curve for this year would be that 84.97%. And then it measures outwards how far the sales are from that center point. This year, our COD was measured at 9.56%, which by international standards and standards by the state of Vermont is considered very accurate. We would not be required to reappraise town, unless the COD went above 20%. So that 10 number is very favorable to the town and shows that we have equitable assessments throughout the community. Any questions from the select board on that first part? Looks like no. Bill, Jeff. All right. Okay. One question. Jeff here, Bill, are you going to get to the question of whether we need to do a reappraisal based on the CLA being below 85%. I do plan on talking about that briefly. So anyways, I reviewed the sales study and the one thing that popped out, I thought it was fair for the most part. The one part that popped out was the fact that we had roughly 17 sales, 13 sales, excuse me, in the commercial category and only two industrial sales. However, the CLA that they applied, the state applied, was the 84.97%, excuse me, 84.97% for both of those categories. And I looked at the commercial and the commercial sales, if you throw out the outliers, shows a much higher CLA, closer to say 91.65%. I think given that number and considering that our commercial and industrial grand list represents roughly 35% of all our grand list value, I think it would be in the town's best interest to appeal the CLA for two reasons. Number one, if our CLA goes below 85% threshold, then the state is going to require that the town complete a townwide reappraisal, and that order is going to come next summer. The second reason and more important reason, I believe, is that CLA, that's 84.97%, is utilized in determining our education tax rate. And so I think it would be who the town and the select board to appeal that number to try and get that CLA somewhere up around 85.5%, which would leave some of the taxpayer pressure when the board sets its rate in the education department sets the rate for education tax rates. So I think that there's two specific reasons to appeal this. Even if we only get above 85%, which is a very small climate, it's only 300% that at least alleviates the pressure that we may have in looking to do a reappraisal. Any questions in regards to that? Bill, just one question. And I think I know the answer, but just to find out. The lower we go below 100% for the CLA, does that mean the more we have to provide in education taxes? That is correct. The tax rate itself is specifically adjusted by that common level of assessment. So to be real simple about it, if our tax rate for the town of Wilson is say a dollar, that that 84.97%, the amount of our tax rate is going to be $1.14, $1.15 somewhere in that neighborhood. So it directly impacts what their individual property owners are paying on that education tax rate. It does not necessarily, well, it actually kind of doubles up because we spend greater than the base provides for the per pupil. And so unfortunately, we're adding on to an additional amount because we spend more per pupil with our education taxes. So it still uses the same formula. But again, we're paying more in taxes due to that CLA being low than you would otherwise. Any other questions? If not, there is a motion suggested. Move to authorize the chair of the select board to file a petition with the director of property valuation and review for a redetermination of the town's education property value. Second. Second. Discussion of the ocean. The only question I have is I would like to learn. What, what it, how it is they, they came up with that CLA. So can we include that as part of the request for a. Or what's what a. As part of our efforts here. So, as Bill, what we can, what we can ask for. We certainly can. I'm not sure how much an answer we're going to get from the state. I can dig into there was a report when I first started in Wilson back in 2000. There was a report that came out shortly after I got here, which was called the all may report. And the all may report was a statistical review, if you will, of our equalization study, making suggestions as to how the state could improve that equalization study. And it might give us some insight or Jeff specifically some insight into how that actual calculation is done. I had a gentleman come into my office. This is again, we're talking 1516 years ago, and he actually uploaded the program for determining the equalization study as well as the education per pupil spending, and my laptop did not have enough information for the program to handle the information. So it's it's pretty complicated from what I understand. And I think we would have to get somebody that is really invested in a statistical knowledge. Maybe somebody from UVM to be able to explain how that actually occurs. So a little bit a little bit above my pay grade, unfortunately. But what concerns me bill is that when you go through your analysis, you end up with numbers that are very different than the state's numbers. And so there's a real core kind of misunderstanding here and that's the part I find concern. I do to Jeff. I don't think I appealed the CLA last year but I do believe we appealed it two years ago. And specifically, when I was looking at the median low aggregate median high aggregate, and then the median ratios. I looked at every single town in the state of Vermont. And there is only one or two other towns in the state where the ratios were lower than what the aggregate load aggregate high and aggregate median work. And I asked for an answer as to why that happened and nobody would give me one. And so again, you know, I specifically in my letter and I think we could probably pull it out said, why is all these towns have these higher numbers for CLA, and only Wilson and maybe one other town in the state has a number that doesn't really make sense with the reporting information on that equalization study. Okay, good. Thank you. So, any other questions on that. Any further discussion on the motion. If not, all those in favor of the motion and say aye. Aye. Any opposed. So thank you, Bill. We appreciate all the hard work. Okay, Jeff, it asked me that asked me in regards to reappraisal activity. I'm sorry to say hello. But I think Bill's asking Jeff, but did you have any further questions on reappraisal? And no, just just a comment. I mean, I think that's the type thing where we really want to avoid it if possible. And so, you know, we have to. Thank you. Moving on to interviews and appointments for volunteer boards. So we, over the weekend, received another application for the DRB. So we'll put that off with the two candidates until our meeting in February, first meeting in February. We'll go on and to the one candidate for the social services funding committee and that's Michelle. I think Michelle is going to join us by zoom, I believe. Yep. And it looks like we might have just lost the. For a second, just to bear it bear with me for a second. It's like I'm still. If you try to try to rejoin. Megan. Yeah, let's do folks Eric, maybe in the low, is this a committee that has a standing number of people on it or yeah, this is a seven person committee and this committee meets. Infrequently, primarily, they need to allocate the funds to social services organizations that are in the budget. Due to their infrequency that they that they meet the appointments don't have terms with them attached. They're, they're appointed and for as long as they'd like to serve. So there are currently, there's 2 openings on this group. I believe there's. Okay, there's 7 in total. There's 5 people who are active right now. So Michelle's for her name for someone to be considered to. You just need to, you'll have to hit the camera back on. I think Michelle, I see you there watching that you connected as well. We're getting the video back here in the room at the same time here. Can you hear me, Michelle? I can. Thanks. Okay. There we go. We're back connected here, Michelle. We've got you on with the Wilson slide board. Welcome Michelle, we have your application before us. But if you would briefly give us a little about your background and why you wish to be on this particular committee. So, currently I'm working as a school counselor at Middlebury Union High School. I've worked in schools since 1999, which is the same year we moved to Welliston. And prior to that, I had worked in human services and have a, I think a fairly good understanding of human services community needs. When I saw the opening on the committee, I thought this might be a perfect match to be able to use some of my experience and be able to contribute to the community. Thank you. Questions from the board. Michelle, I just asked what, what did you do? You're saying human services. Could you describe that a little bit? Sure. So my doctorate was actually in rehab counseling. And I worked, when I first came to Vermont, I worked for something called the Vermont Council on Community Mental Health based in Montpelier. And my role was to work with the 13 developmental disability providers throughout the state. And we were housed in Montpelier because I spent a lot of time in the legislature actually lobbying and advocating on behalf of human services, specifically around funding. And after that, I worked for the state of Vermont in the agency of disabilities as a Robert Wood Johnson project director, again, working with and advocating for people with special needs. And then I sort of did a full circle back to school counseling, which was what my masters was in. So that's sort of my background in a nutshell. I'm not sure how to ask this question. So excuse my fumbling here. My question is along the lines of what do you see the town's role. The concept is, I think this committee helps advise the town about those organizations that ought to receive either through the budget process or through I think a special pot of money, a small pot of money that the committee may have charge over. So I guess my question is, is, you know, what do you see your role as being or that's not really what I meant to say. What would you, what do you envision is the best role for will listen to play when it's considering these outside organizations and whether to recommend they be funded through the budget process or through this small but special fund that the committee has, I guess, oversight over. Yeah. So, I can say having worked in human services and education for many years, there are never enough dollars. And when I heard that this, the town that actually set aside this pot of money to fund special projects. It's a great way to perhaps fill some of those gaps in the needs of the community. I don't know the specifics I had a conversation with Aaron earlier today about what the past fundings of projects have been but without knowing specifics I think it would be trying to figure out what are the needs, how could the funds best be used and then trying to allocate those as best as possible to be able to meet as many needs as possible within the community. Very good. Thank you. Other questions. If not, then there is a motion to suggest it. Move to appoint Michelle rock to the social services funding committee. Second discussion on the motion. Hearing none all those in favor of the motion say aye. Aye. So congratulations Michelle and we look forward to having you serve in that committee. Thank you very much for the honor. Thank you. Thank you, Michelle. Have a good evening. So we're moving on to consideration of the applications of five people tonight for the county energy committee. And I should recall two weeks ago we interviewed three people. So at the end we will be looking for appointments. Later on on the agenda near the end of the agenda. And so I keep in mind that I'm going to ask you for your top three choices. When it comes to that, that point. I don't remember 14 on the agenda. And I have a handy daily chart made up so we can hopefully come up with three individuals. So with our top three, if not, we'll want to consider how to move forward. So we do have, I believe, three people in the audience that are going to be with us and to remote. Yep, I've got Sharon Gutwin connected remotely and Matt would I just connecting him remotely with that. Dar Gibson, Sharon Quinn and Andy Herbert in person here to the three that are in the building. If you could probably space yourself out at this table where there's a microphone before you. And keep your mask on for the time being, if you wish to be masked by your speaking, that's fine. But in the meantime, and you may to when you're speaking, yes. Just play music with your microphone. It'll pick you up. The microphone only picks up for the TV folks. So it doesn't pick up for amplified amplification for us. So if you would, if you're giving your mask on, be cloudy or if you're not speak loudly too. And we have the two on zoom at this point. Yep, they're both connected. Okay. So I guess the, the first thing to do then is to while we do have your applications in front of us. Ask you to briefly give a review of your, your background and why you wish to be on the energy committee. And we'll alternate questions among you so that you don't always get stuck with the first one or the last one and we'll do our best to do that. So we'll start with you if you introduce yourself and give us the right your spiel. Thank you. My name is Dar Gibson. Interested in getting involved locally in the area where. I've worked in energy commercial wind farm in south Texas. I worked in commercial and residential solar here in Williston for all their renewables. I used to fix the trackers you have out back here. And I worked for a semester down at Vermont Tech on the anaerobic digester that they have there since closed. I've also worked in Antarctica for over 20 years. It's very science projects as meteorologists at the South Pole. And up at Greenland as a science technician. So I have renewable energy and some science background and also worked in Vermont as a. residential. So I feel like some good perspective. Feels a little bit like an article here. My name is Andy Herbert and I was born in Burlington went to BHS went to the University of Vermont. Worked in Vermont for a while subsequently worked in Illinois and New Jersey and in 2003 moved back here with my family. We live in Southridge and professionally I've worked as a purchasing procurement supply chain person. And helped save the places that I've worked for money and efficiently supply. My internal and extra external customers with best products at the lowest prices. Good evening. I'm Sharon Ray Quinn, born in Montpelier, lived here all my life. And I moved to Williston 10 years ago in September due to hurricane Irene floodwaters that trapped me many hours and I lost my home and consequently moved to Williston where my two children and grandkids are. I have no experience in energy, but I'm retired. I have a lot of energy and it's a way to give back to community. My. Workground history is I worked 20 years for the agency of transportation. I also have been a bookkeeper office manager for a law firm. I was an expediter for a bombardier transportation that built the trains and Barry optometrist assistant. I've been retired for 10 years. So I have plenty of time and energy. I know we need to reduce fossil fuel. Thank you. I know that we need to source some energy. I know the goal in Williston is to have 90% source by 2050. And I would welcome your consideration. Thank you. Thank you. I know Terry can and Jeff and I have yet to meet Gordon and Greta. I think it's great that you've had so much interest in volunteer positions. I'm a Williston resident since 1986 and a business resident in Williston since 2003. My passion really is in community sustainability environment and, and had from the get go on my first house installed the solar PV panels and hot water panel and, and at the house I'm living at now it's a multi generational house with my daughter and her family. We have as many panels as we could put on we have geothermal, and we have a Tesla wall, and then the owner of kismet place and Blair park. We have a little power plant going on on the roof you can't see it, but it is 50 kilowatts of power that helps to, you know, reduce the carbon footprint. I've always been a firm believer that sustainability is really the bottom line, you know, businesses bottom line is supposedly profit and then I've heard it's a triple bottom line that includes profit people and the planet. Fundamentally, without sustainability can really have any health in any area. So, I, I don't look at this attention to energy and environment as something that is optional. Certainly in my lifetime. I could burn it up. But I've always been somebody focused on the whole of life on earth and it isn't just humans either it's really sustainability of life in general. So, and as a business person. I feel like certainly with developers they might really be focused on the bottom line and they might not consider something such as what would be of conservation in nature, because it would cut into profit. That's where I think some guidance, I think fundamentally we all really do want the same thing we all care about the same things. It's just some of us have a more acute awareness, and that has been me. So I certainly have a lot of experience I would say, from both residential and commercial sides. And I do have more free time now because I'm not running the rehab gym I have my brother and daughter doing that. So I also have more energy I don't think I have as much energy as my predecessor and the applicant but I certainly am willing to help and even if I don't get a position I can certainly. I feel like be of help. So I definitely am all in support of whoever is most appropriate for these positions, getting into position, and, and, and they will have my support whether I be on that board or not. Thank you. And Matthew would Good evening everyone. My name is Matt would I currently work for the state and Vermont Agency of Agriculture, where I do primarily pesticide inspections but also I work in the fields of feed and fertilizer worker protection and forcing the federal work. Let me send him a message. I can see I can see he's still actively talking on the on my computer so it looks like a crash to insert appropriate content about technology now. His priorities is going to be connectivity. Cool. We'll believe it on the temperature. That's why I love him personally. I don't think he's, I see he's still chatting. Yeah, I guess you can see the. This time of message in the chat here. Did you see Matt that that that we've got disconnected so they weren't able to hear you but I got to hear you. You're kidding we got disconnected. I know I would hire you in a heartbeat. You might have to repeat half of what you said, I just have been communicating through the chat line. So we. So we got as far as where you work at the agency of agriculture. Just a secondary just waiting to get unmuted on the other. Well, it looks like some other people saw me too. Oh, good. I wasn't the only audience. Oh yeah, great job. Hi, Matt's Eric. Can you hear us again? Sorry about that. Yes, I can. Yeah, sorry about that. I don't know. The tech tech difficulties here. Apologies that Terry outside of them. If you could just pick back up from a few minutes ago. Sorry about that. I was telling Matt, I got to listen to him. I thought he did a great job. But he has to repeat about half of what he said. What was I saying when I got cut off to your member. I just started out with where you work with the agency of agriculture. So, okay, I'll do it again. All right. So I currently work at the agency of agriculture, state of Vermont, where I'm a pesticide inspector primarily, but I also do work in feed seed fertilizer, federal worker protection program, migrant housing inspections, and some somewhat in the hemp program as well. But primarily doing pesticide inspections as part of that regulatory work that I've been doing. I have had to present often complex and sometimes controversial. Controversial subjects to, you know, in public meetings or have done trainings for companies to get applicators certified in. So I think I could help out in the outreach area portion of the. The description for the committee members here. Am I still online? Yeah. So I think I can help with the outreach portion because my public presentations and things like that that I've done. I also back when I first started with the agency, we initiated the don't pee on the lawn. Campaign to help inform and educate homeowners about the use of phosphorus on their lawn and try to get them to use non-phosphorus fertilizers due to the impact on water quality and eventually, you know, in the streams, rivers, and eventually Lake Champlain. So I created the PSA for that program. And the don't pee on the lawn was supposed to be sort of a funny, you know, catch your attention reference to, you know, the phosphorus on the lawn being key. But anyway, so I can help out with the public outreach portion. I'm a master's in horticulture and I managed a commercial greenhouse producing perennials and annuals for a local nursery for seven years. And with my master's in horticulture, I have experience. I'd be able to help with the, if the town did want to go the route of creating the town nursery, the tree nursery, possibly at Catamount. I think I'd be able to help out pretty well with that as well. So I'm just very passionate about it, about the environment. I want to help out where I can. I think this is a critical time right now where I feel like we're at an inflection point where things are starting to change, but we really have to push hard to get the societal changes that are needed so that we can, you know, make the goals of the various, you know, the things that the scientists are telling us need to be done. I think it's very important. And I want to help the town achieve the goals and help the, the energy coordinator do the best job that they can for the town. Thank you. Questions from the board for the candidates. I'll start. Just so you know, this is the same question I asked the other three candidates that we interviewed last week. And then at the end, if it's okay with, with folks, I have one question I'd like to ask Sharon. I'm sorry, Sharon Ray, not Sharon about one. My question has to do with the town energy plan. And if you've had a chance to read it and then, you know, sort of expand on your thoughts about it, kind of what you saw on it that you like, that you think maybe it's appropriate, what you didn't like, what you might want to change. And I don't know how to. So let's go back and reverse order to start with Matt. Okay. Let me go to Sharon. Okay. Yeah, thanks for that question. I have read the energy plan. It was a lot for me to absorb all in one. I'm sitting, but I feel like it was. Very well done. And respected it. It had a lot of very specific detail for us to follow. You know, if I do get on the energy committee. I don't, I haven't had a chance to look into all the references and see where the information came from. And I'm just, because it seemed like some of the numbers were very specific and, and I'm, and I'm glad to see that, that information is out there. But I just, um, I did want, I did want to dig deeper and look into some of the sources of the information there. And, and, uh, and learn more about the background of the plan. But I think it's excellent. It's very comprehensive. And I'm excited to, um, To put it into action. Sharon, go to this next. I like Matt. I thought it was an excellent. And, uh, plan and well wing. And, uh, Went into a lot of details. I would say that what impressed me and where I feel like I could be the most held is sort of like with my business as a physical therapist, we're trained and trained and fixing people. And yet even in college, I felt the need to go into prevention, right? So, um, Yeah, you can, you can really focus on, on trying to make a building more energy efficient, for instance, but you wouldn't have to work as much on energy efficiency in a building. If you used a vegetation, we all know that, um, Shade trees in the summer will help to cut down costs and air conditioning and likewise in the winter, if you have evergreens to shield against the wind. Um, if we have more, not only paths, but they have to connect. They have to make sense for people to not use their automobiles to move around, especially in the task corners area. Um, there are ways. That weren't as much that you didn't go into that were more traditional of what you would find in an energy plan. And they were certainly we've got it. We got it. Every building that goes up, we got to absolutely continue in that plan of energy conservation. But, um, I saw a new building going up on Williston road and they cut down like way too many trees. And I get that a business really likes everybody to look at them. Um, but just like how the signs, you know, had to go through the shrinking. And we now all appreciate smaller signs in Vermont. I think that we can encourage people to. Take advantage of the, what nature provides and nature provides an awful lot. I mean, they do a better job than they, she, earth does a better job at conservation than any of us could ever do. So we have to, to tap into those resources. And I think that just like people have found businesses with smaller signs, I think that we can also find a way to have business owners adapt to the new world of, of really tapping into the resources of nature. Sure. Yes. I have dealt into what was written for the energy plan. Um, I also did not check out references. Um, and I want to tell you that I am a good listener. And I'm someone who likes to give back. Red Cross volunteer for 10 years. Um, I've. Uh-oh. Someone's laughing. Um, I think it throws online, but you can. Oh, okay. Yeah. Um, and so I would offer input, uh, to the best of my ability. Uh, I would offer clarity. And, um, though I don't have a background, like some of these other wonderful candidates do, um, I would very much like to be on this committee. Um, I've also applied. Um, I've also applied. Um, I would very much like to be on this committee. Um, I've also applied for the justice board and, um, Any way I can help out my town, my Vermont that I love. Um, I would gladly do so. Thank you. Andy Herbert. Yeah. Question. Oh, sure. I don't know if I can repeat it verbatim, but the concept is have you been, have you had the opportunity to read the energy plan and then, you know, Open question. What do you think of it? What did you read in it that you thought was good or positive? What maybe did you think, uh, could use improvement or change? Well, I read the town energy plan and seeing all the references, et cetera, I found that it was the inner layer of the onion. And then you got town. And then there's the regional energy plan. And then there's the state energy plan. All of them seem to be in concert to a major degree. But, um, one thing that, of course, it has brought to my attention is that we are, we would be contributing to a larger effort. And in taking a closer look at what the state plan is looking for, the number one thing that, that I see them looking for out of this, the town plan is us representing the special nature of our community as far as it relates to what's going to be rolled out by the gang of 23 in Montpelier. Um, and make sure that things like you sheds and, you know, things that are particularly important to Williston are represented in the overall picture. Um, as far as the plan, there were two things in there that sort of got me a little bit off guard. One is it keeps on going back to as almost a handle be all is more efficient, uh, wood heating and using, um, heat pumps. And when I called energy Vermont about this, about considering a heat pump for my house and they said, okay, what have you got? And I have three zones in my house. I use natural gas and, um, baseboard heat and electronic thermostats that turn down the temperature when people aren't going to be using those portions of the house and it's well insulated and the representative from energy from on is that what it's called? Um, they said, you know, something you're looking at probably a break even, um, thing. And, you know, if we're talking, it's, I thought that one of the things about the whole energy committee is to reduce greenhouse gases. And if you're going to be using albeit efficient, if you're going to be using wood stoves, you're still going to be creating carbon dioxide. And frankly, my natural gas is a cleaner effluent than what you get from even the more efficient wood stoves. Um, the information that I've received is, is accurate. So, um, I think that we've, we've got some more things to look out, look at one thing that I haven't seen anybody say anything about is air conditioning. Have you tried to buy a whole house fan in this town? I've gone to FW web, which are, you know, the big HVAC people and said, Hey, you know, who do you know that puts in a whole house fans? Do you have a whole house fans? Nobody said anything. And it is. A great way to save energy and have a more healthy house and, you know, breathe the air that you came to Vermont to be breathing. All right, listen, probably pushing people instead. I ran through the report. I didn't read everything. It's impressive. I'll say that whoever folks put it together did their homework. It's comprehensive. It almost reads more like an environmental plan for the town. It's talks about recycling and waste and landscaping. And those are things to keep in mind. And I didn't get a sense of priorities necessarily. That's something to work out, which, which of those local objectives, so to speak would be priorities. I'll say I'm an environmentalist, but I've worked in renewable energy and it doesn't have to be an environmental crusade to enact a lot of these things. If you take the long view, you can do these things and save money and make the town more desirable place to live, increase property values. These things are not mutually exclusive. So if you do your homework and really get after it and do your research, you can do a lot of this stuff that's in that report without the tremendous sacrifice financially. Like I said, long view it will pay off. So I think it's just a matter of prioritizing what's in the report and maybe if there's some state objectives that are supposed to be met sooner rather than later, those would be the first ones. But overall, I think it's good. You had one question for Sharon. Well, first of all, are people okay if I ask? Okay. Sharon, I couldn't help but pick up in your your application. The comment we said I understood their need since I lost my home in 2011 from Irene's floodwaters. You were actually referring to something else, you know, why you became a volunteer. But many people, myself included, believe that storms like Irene are largely the severity of storms like Irene are largely caused by climate change. And so my question is, what did you, from a climate change or energy perspective, what did, you know, how did that impact you? How did that change you? Did it change you? Well, I have a lot of faith in my relationship with God and he's my provider. So, though I was trapped many hours, rescued by boat, went to a Red Cross shelter, and that's why I became a volunteer for them, I knew that he would provide, and he did. My daughter stepped up, I was in a new home in Williston within three weeks, it closed in three weeks, which is kind of record. So, yeah, natural disasters, devastate. There's loss of life infrastructure. And I just have a very positive attitude. I fear nothing. And though I don't have a background, like I said, like some of these other wonderful candidates that I've heard from tonight, I'm someone who works well with others. I love the diversity that we have. Yeah, there needs to be changes in many areas. And I'm ready, willing and able to learn and to offer what I can to contribute to the town of Williston. Thank you. Other questions? Jordan, try to be brief. First, thanks for all of you for coming tonight for consideration. You're all very well spoken. I can tell by either your background and energy or non-background that you're very passionate about what you're speaking about. So, thanks for that. I think my question is straightforward. There are many focuses that you could come into this committee and kind of take the charge on. What would be like your personal passion where you would get started and hit the ground running? Some of you have read the plan or not all of it or haven't understood all of the plan, but that could be a tough question. What would be your... I mentioned, Dar, you mentioned prioritize. Where would that priority be? And this is a question for everybody. Well, I'm not sure I'd want to come into it with that sort of approach. Honestly, what I want to do, again, I think it would be a matter of priority, prioritize all those local objectives. There's a lot of stuff in there and look at maybe what, you know, I notice we're behind in... I can't remember what it was now. Some of the... One of those objectives, energy production or reducing emissions, forget what it was, but we're already well behind what we were supposed to be in 2020. So maybe just prioritize the goals that the state has and hit those first or maybe make those priorities. A lot of these things you can do in parallel. They're not one at a time. It's a lot of stuff. So you can get the incentives, roll out incentives for various programs. I pick up that Green Energy Times newspaper when I see it and you flip to the middle and there's all the incentives for, you know, upgrades to your home and your business. I don't see that information anywhere else. That's what I tell people, get the Green Energy Times. You can get the rebate on your new washer, that sort of thing. So maybe you could just do some really easy messaging with that sort of thing, weatherization, but also, you know, really try to address the bigger items in there. What are we going to share next? Yes, I certainly agree that there's so many items in there to work on that you'd have to select a few to prioritize to move the ball forward rather than just do a small percentage on, you know, 20 items. It's best to determine what can we do now? What is most vital that the town of Williston needs to do and go forward in that method? Sarah, good morning. I mean, I think to get the committee together for the first time and just sort of go over all of this is what, instead of going in with a preconceived notion of what I would expect to be of that priority level, I mean, obviously there's basic, you know, understandings that it's good to always go for the low-hanging fruit first and, you know, get that set and then move into the deeper, you know, more involved areas of a plan. But I would imagine that getting together with passionate people on the topic and hashing out kind of the perspectives of each person, what they bring to it, then you could come out with that priority list. And I do agree, you know, to work in concert with the state, with the nation, but certainly with the state of Vermont, to be really connected to the other communities, especially the neighboring communities. It'd be nice to have some meetings together where we're sort of talking about, you know, what we're doing so that we minimize the development of the wheel, you know, in each town. Let's do it together sort of thing. So there's, it's more of the structure of starting the plan that I would be focused on, less about exactly what in the plan, because I think that that would be something that would become apparent very quickly in the meetings. So Matt. Yes, I think something I think we could focus on would be a combination of the electrical energy generation and agriculture. In one way they go hand in hand because agriculture can be used to generate electricity, you know, through digesters and space on farms for solar installations, but also agricultural land can serve as a very large sink for atmospheric carbon if the land is managed properly. I think a lot of conventional agriculture strips the organic components of the soil with the use of the synthetic fertilizers and pesticides. And I think we can make great strides and improving both the soil and increasing the amount of carbon that's captured in that soil if we have good agricultural practices employed. So between the agriculture and the renewable energy generation, I think those are areas that I would like to focus on. Okay. If we're talking about, was it a question of what do you want to get out of the first meeting of the group type of thing or what am I coming in here thinking about doing? Matter that, yeah. Basically getting an understanding of the best thing for the committee to do and whether or not we're going to try and bite off manageable chunks or try and save the world by ourselves. I think that we've got some low-hanging fruit that we can deal with. There was a survey that had been done after I think it was 1997 when the new building rules came into effect as far as insulation and sealing. And we've got a list of 3,200 houses or whatever that were built before these, things went into effect and finding those houses, approaching the owners of those residences and helping them insulate and seal the houses better would be a very good and frankly easy thing to go after because there's a return to the homeowner and overall benefit for the community. So go after the low-hanging fruit and get some winds chocked up so that we've got something to report back to the community with and say, see, we're here to help you and come to us, talk to us, tell us what we can do to help you help us and help the community. Thank you everyone. So a couple of you have mentioned this but a big chart of the committee is really as outreach and education engaging with the community to get them involved. A lot of this involves individual homeowners or businesses being on board with these plans. So just want to get a sense of your comfort level with this and how you might go about doing getting people engaged and passionate. Yeah, after that one. Having been a professional negotiator for over 30 years, I feel that that's something that I could help with. I noticed that the target for business insulation, ceiling, et cetera, was capped out at 50% and how businesses cannot be coerced, convinced, whatever, to improve the insulation of their facilities and save on their energy spend. I don't know how or why we've just sort of thrown up our hands and said 50% is enough. I mean, what I've got a degree in marketing but what I have always done with that is used to sell my company to my suppliers as the best partner to have in the relationship. And I would use that ability with these business owners and get on board and get their properties to become more efficient and reduce their energy footprint. Matt, sorry I had to unmute. Could you repeat the question please? Just a big part of the committee's kind of charge is outreach and education, engaging with people, kind of getting them passionate about, you know, reducing their energy consumption and so forth. And so I just wanted to understand your comfort level with that and how you might go about, you know, getting people in the community involved. Okay, yeah, thanks. So I did mention in my intro that I have experience doing presentations to the public, you know, on sometimes complex or controversial things, but I think in a situation like this, we don't want to be too heavy handed. I feel like you don't want to turn people off if you really try to force something down their throat. I think you get more flies with honey. And I think that we can take a more positive approach to try to get businesses and homeowners on board. And like, you know, we've seen in the energy plan, it does talk about the money that you can save. And there may also be grants and things that we can look into to help local businesses and residents pay for things like that. So I think if we come to the people of the town and say that we can, not only we're not going to force them to do these things, but we're going to help them with some funds. I think that's a way that is going to probably be received more positively in the town. And Dar? I'm on board with what Matt said. I'm not a canvassing. The neighborhood is not necessarily in a strong suit where we're trying to take care of seats. I'd probably be better at the messaging part and just explaining to people how this is, you know, certain objectives can be found and their property values in the long term and the benefits of making something good is just going to take a long view. And I'm a bit of an industry inside, so I'm going to gather the information and do the homework there. So I want to be the salesman. Sharon Quinn? I like speaking to people. It's in my comfort zone. I'm currently the American Red Cross Community Volunteer leader in Williston. I've spoken on TV. I've been at rallies and spoken in New York City and Philadelphia. And I have compassion and empathy for people. And when there's a need, I try to go out and help the community or the city or the nation. And so, like I say, I don't have a background that some people do, but I'm authentic. I'm enthusiastic. I would greet people with a warm smile. You know, some people never even receive a smile or it's been ages. And so, we're to reach out to strangers, not just people we know and I feel I'd be an asset. So, thank you. Sharon. I think it's fortunate there's a lot of momentum right now, actually globally on this very topic. So I would sort of tie into the energy that's already swirling around. I think a great avenue would be through the schools. The kids are passionate about this topic at all of the grades. And I think they can go and proselytize their families and grandparents included in getting on board. But to keep it light, fun, sort of maybe even a little bit competitive if there's a way to do that, because we know that that works in motivating people, maybe a little bit of, you know, if you get like with another town, maybe there's a way that we could tap into, you know, making the attention greater by emphasizing what our neighbors are doing or whatever. But I think the whole point is, there's already light on this topic. It's a matter of putting it a little bit more on fire. And in using different wealth like social media platforms. We could do things at different events within the town, like the 4th of July. And it's not just put a table out, sort of say this is what we do, but have there be some excitement around it. And there's agencies that could be also involved at helping to raise the level of attention to this topic. Like, what's that biking? There's a bikers group. I don't remember it, but anyways, I think that the committee is less about doing all of the grunt work, but finding people to, to sort of carry the torch in many different directions, but the school for sure is one area that I would focus on. And it's like their future. So, you know, have a project where you put out to the students, you have a PR campaign, you know, put together a poster and then get the newspaper to do something. But having townwide meetings, I think we're fortunate that Williston does have a good amount of involvement in these meetings. So having that where people can maybe break out in groups. And so you just basically involve more people to get on the bandwagon of this effort. What I do. Any final questions? We were having an issue with the chat. So everyone watching at home that's seeing that hate speech. I'm deeply sorry. We're trying to trying to address it right now. There's some really inappropriate chat happening. Somebody had infiltrated the chat. Can you turn the chat off? Yeah, I'm trying to do that. I think. Just won't go there. Okay. I think I see the other issue. One other person. I also forgot to mention that I did spend some time on the planning commission. That sounds bad. Like I spent time in jail or something. I mean, I have experienced being on a committee. I spent time in a volunteer position. I spent time on the planning commission. Oh. Well, this committee reports to the planning commission. So that's a good thing. I have one question if I can ask. Do you anticipate. The day and the time that the energy committee would meet. Is that been determined? I don't think that's been determined. The committee's going to have to figure that out. How they can do this. Get all seven people there. Okay. While spreading awareness is vital. Of this and of anything that you want to move forward. So I appreciate it. Thank you again. Any final questions. Thank you all. This is an open meeting. When we get to the point of making the appointment later on. In the session, you're welcome to. Stay. We talk whatever suits you best, but we're. We have a long agenda. So if we won't get to you to this and so probably. I'm staying for the mask mandates. Interested in that. Okay. Thank you all for coming tonight. Would you be looking for any further. Input answers to any questions at that time or. No, no. So at that point, we'll be down to the, the bitter end. And hopefully. We'll have three appointees. Thank you very much. Thank you all for your time and for flying. Thank you for listening to us. That's a long list of candidates to go through. Yes. So move on to the face covering rule making extension. This is a non-profit first full issue. And I know that we have at least two, two people that wish to speak that I've given them. I'm going to go ahead and give you a little bit of time. Is there anyone in the room who wishes to speak briefly. Regarding the issue. Yes, sir. Identify yourself and. My name's Mitch Kimbrell. I'm pastor of Christ Memorial Church in Williston, and I was. I spoke with you guys the last time that you took up this question. I'm thankful for the opportunity to. Talk with you again and thank you for your service to our town. Thank you. Thank you. I'm coming by simply to ask that as you consider renewal of the indoor mask mandate, if you decide to renew the indoor mask mandate that you would please keep the house of worship. Exemption that was part of the initial mask mandate that you passed in December. In view of Burlington having passed a renewed their mask mandate that kept their house of worship exemption. Houses of worship in our church. We've seen an increase in face masks since. Since the last time I spoke with you guys, which we've always welcomed and never discouraged, though we're grateful for the opportunity for those who. For whatever reason prefer not to wear face masks during worship to have that chance when we've had. Activities that are off of the church grounds. We have followed the indoor mask mandate. We haven't wanted to find loopholes. We regard the mandate as applying to our house of worship and not to just any activity anywhere that we have. Our church has not just recently, but during the height of the pandemic in 2020. Purchased to air purifiers. Our associate pastor for logistics could give you all the impressive statistics about these air purifiers. I wish I could, but they were purchased and were quite expensive each for the purpose of purifying the air. We've also recently increased the quality of the air filters in our indoor climate control system. In an effort to provide some mitigating factors to COVID spread in our church, though we have a main auditorium that could accommodate the whole of our congregation at one service. We've remained at two services to kind of facilitate an unofficial sort of social distancing, which our people seem to have followed and and appreciate it. And we continue to we plan to continue having two services when we could have one numbers wise while we seem to be in the height of a COVID case spike. And then lastly, as I said back in December, our church aims to be helpful. We want the town of Wilson to be glad that we're here. And so we don't intend to be Maverick, but I do come asking that as you guys take up this question again, that you would please keep the exemption for houses of worship in place. Thank you. Thank you. I want to ask her to give a brief introduction as to what we're about to do tonight. Thanks, Jerry. So just to recap on December 7th, the select board adopted a face covering rule for indoor public spaces in response to the ongoing COVID-19 pandemic. This is under the authority of Act 1, established by the Vermont legislature and signed to law by the governor in late November of last year. Act 1 dictates that a municipal governing body may enact a face covering rule, and it's initially in effect for 45 days. And the governing body shall meet prior to the end of that period and vote to either rescind it or extend it. So this is the 43rd day since the board has put that rule in place. And under the under that act, the board has that question before at this evening, whether to extend it for an additional 30 days or to rescind it. So these extensions should the board decide to extend it this evening there for 30 day increments. This process may be repeated 30 days from when the extension takes place. And then according to the act, every rule will sunset on April 30th. If there's any still in place by a municipality. If the board wishes to make any amendments and granting an extension to the rule this evening, certainly within the board's authority to do that as well. And I've, I have the document up on my, on my screen should anyone like to propose any amendments. Thank you. It was the, Mr. Blackburn and the audience. So why don't you come up to the table. You have two or three minutes to introduce the person you wish to introduce. And he has five minutes to give his opinion on, on masks. I've actually asked to have him be extended to the eight and take my three minutes. So I was just going to introduce him and have him speak. Okay. So my name is Joe Blackburn. And tonight I'm very honored to bring you Stephen Petty. For those of you who do not know who Mr. Petty is, he is a professional engineer in six states, a certified industrial hygienist, and a certified safety professional. He has been disclosed in nearly 400 cases as an exposure and exposure controls personal protective equipment and warning expert. One of the big challenges that we face today is that medical doctors are often offering their opinions on the topic of exposure control and PPE, which in most cases, they are not qualified to testify in the field of industrial hygiene, which covers these topics. I've requested Mr. Petty to attend tonight's meeting because I feel he is one of the most qualified mask experts in the U.S. And we'll be able to bring us the facts and expertise around the conversation of mask effectiveness. So it's with great pleasure, I introduce you to Mr. Stephen Petty. And thank you, Mr. Petty, for being with us tonight and taking time out of your day to help us out. Thank you. When Mr. Petty is on, I'll have about seven minutes to give us his opinion. Hi, Stephen. I see you as SEP. I'm going to allow you to speak. And I believe you have a presentation. I can pull those slides up for you here. Hello. Hi, Stephen. Are you there? Yes. Can you hear me? Yes, we can. Welcome to Williston. Thank you, sir. If we have any questions, please feel free to ask them in the chat. And welcome to Williston. Thank you, sir. If we could begin on slide 10. All righty, while you get that up. My name is Stephen Petty, and I appreciate the efforts by Mr. Blackburn to reach out to me as well as members of the board to let me speak. Let me say that my professional background, I've been in over 400 cases on exposure, exposure, control and PPE. I testified in the state of Kentucky and then as a result of my testimony, the mask mandate was overturned statewide. I spent my entire life trying to protect the public and workers and from hazards. And unfortunately masks don't do that. Hope to show that to you today. There are many things that do unfortunately masks don't and they're creating great harm. This slide I'm going to talk about, and my credentials are before these slides. This slide is the macro view of what's going on. I show the cases in Vermont. As of very recently, and you'll see that they're lumpy in the winter. And if masks were doing a great job, you would not expect to see curves like this. You would expect curves to decrease with time. What those curves really show is the way people get exposed and get sick is when they spend more time indoors. So you see peaks in the winter months. We can move to the next one. Number 11, please. All righty. This is another slide that shows a similar situation, three counties in the LA Basin and lo and behold, they put mask mandates on and boy, didn't those cases drop? Not. They exploded. Doesn't look like masks had much to do with that. Next slide. Same thing out of this country in Israel. You see mask mandates put on. The cases explode with time. Interestingly, not the lower curve of Sweden where they never had a mask mandate. Not only do we have lower peaks, we never had that explosion in cases. Next slide. At the epidemiological level, this is ground level, if you will. Next slide. The best study out there, in my opinion, is the Bunn Guard study out of Denmark. 6,000 participants, 3,000 wearing masks, 3,000 not. And looking at what were the incremental cases for each group. And statistically, what was shown was that the mask didn't make any difference. Next slide, please. One of the few slides in the United States or one of the few cases in the United States is some work by Oster and friends. And what they found when they looked at masking of students and children as well as our teachers is that we did not find any correlation with the mask mandate. Reinfection rate versus mask wearing. One of the things you find, and I've testified in federal court now against some of the CDC stuff because they were not for mask, for mask, not for mask, for mask, and now again, not for mask, is that the CDC studies, and I went and looked at a few of them in court. And generally they don't have a control group. That is a group that's not wearing masks to compare with a group that is wearing masks. And so if you don't do that, you can't compare the two to know if there's a difference. Next slide, please. This shows it's a little busy, I know. But those air bands show that groups wearing masks and not wearing masks in schools in Florida. And basically there's no difference. Next slide. At the micro level, go ahead and next. Everybody's probably seen dust through a window in the summer and those particles are about 50 microns or larger by point of reference. About 500 times larger than COVID particle. Next slide. So this round white circle with a black ring is the cross section of human hair and that little red dot is a one micron particle. The COVID particle is about one tenth of that size. So basically a COVID particle is about a thousand times smaller in diameter than the cross section of human hair. Next all of you when you wear your mask and you get a human hair by your mask especially on either side of your nose below your eyes the answer of course is yes. You can get dozens of human hairs by there. So it's a free way for these particles to go in and out. You hear this term source control but that's ridiculous. They don't care which way they're going. Next slide. This is a little busy but what it shows is the key is masks cannot be sealed. Respirators can but masks cannot. That no matter what the efficiency of the mask is if you have 2% gap area around the mask the efficiency goes to 25% and if you extend that to 3% gap area the efficiency of any mask no matter what its effectiveness is is zero. Next slide. Just some points of references basically a standard sheet of paper is 100 microns or about a thousand times bigger than the COVID particle. Next slide. I've been saying this for two years and testified in I don't know how many cases on January 2nd of 2022 Scott Gottlieb, former FDA chief based the nation spilled the beans basically said a cloth mask is not going to protect you from the virus and he's absolutely right. And on January 14th last Thursday or Friday even the CDC admitted cloth masks really don't work. Next slide. And if everybody thinks that we should go to N95s that brings a host of problems. First of all you're going to have to be under the respiratory protection standard and OSHA 29 CFR1910.134 this is an actual label off of a 3M N95 mask says it cannot eliminate the risk of contracting infection illness and disease and that's true. It is better than a mask but it will not stop disease. Next. These are all the differences in terms of when you have to go to an OSHA respiratory protection standard and this is what I spend my life in there are very specific requirements to wearing a respirator versus wearing a mask and these are the differences are listed here. Next slide. So here's the bottom line real science based solutions are based on what we call an industrial hygiene hierarchy of controls. I'll show that in a second and that consists of engineering controls such as dilution and destruction of the virus. They're used in real schools by this author since August of 2020. They're used in real schools. No mask worn minimal effects in terms of disease and it avoids in the second half I'm not going to go through all this material but I presented material even coming out in January of 2022 from New England. There are tremendous effects to children are wearing masks decreased learning physical and emotional effects and these are only coming to light but there's two studies that I attached to this presentation you look at at your own and industrial hygiene this is how we take care of exposure to hazards the most effective ones are on the top the least effective on the bottom it turns out for COVID substitution elimination doesn't apply but engineering controls of dilution and destruction are the best ways to control exposure to COVID. PPE respirators are the worst because we know from decades of experience that people won't wear it properly it's uncomfortable etc. They'll break the seals and by the way masks aren't even in this hierarchy they basically can't be sealed I can show you the papers that prove that absolutely. Go ahead next. I'm going to stop here and if you have any questions I go through a series of slides on the engineering controls that work one more slide if you could pop ahead we can increase dampers, increase fresh air next on one more please and I've gone through each of the technologies that work in both of my offices and both my homes and I've recommended this to hundreds of people the school that I work with in August of 2020 we put in these new Calgon Eye Waves they're about $400, $800 installed they'll cover 6 tons or 6,000 square feet and and very recently ASHRAE Journal just put up more data on their effectiveness so there are technologies out there that work that will destroy this virus as well as mold another bacteria and what I've done with a series of slides for you all if you're interested is I've indicated what the technologies are their effectiveness and their cost if we could go to the next to the last slides and I'll be done you'll have to spin ahead it's like 50 a couple more please go one more two more up please one more one more I'm sorry this is a study that came out last week from England the Department of Education and they basically showed that with respect to happens to you is a mask don't work but go down to the next one the next four slides and I won't waste too much of your time they went through an extensive review as well as all the harms being done to children by wearing masks and I've got this paper I've seen one before but they're there for your review I could talk for an hour just on the harms done to people with masks but there are much better solutions out there unfortunately masks have taken the air out of the room and believe me I've spent my entire life protecting people I'm the lead exposure control expert on all these Monsanto Roundup cases so I've been deposed in 40 of those if I thought for a second masks would do some good I'd be right there but no they don't they do more harm than good and there are much better solutions for us out there and finally we're seeing even the public is beginning to hear from political leaders that obviously they don't work I appreciate the time to speak with you I don't know if you have any questions I'm more than willing to stay here in my office and answer those but if you have other things you need to do I understand thank you for the opportunity to speak thank you I I just so can I just understand the COVID-19 virus is even smaller than a micron is that true what a tenth of a micron yeah so if you look at like your mask I can see you now and I ask you the question can you stick one of your and you see people with beards or facial hair all the time but can you take a hair and put it through your mask and you can see below your eyes the answer of course is yes well this particle is a thousand times smaller than that but these particles don't travel by themselves isn't that also true they only travel outside the human body if they're attached to a particle of saliva or they're aerialized which is up to one micron inside that information is put out there it's not true you can go back to Ash Ray Handbook for the last 40 years and see the size of viruses they're 0.1 microns or smaller the point to be remembered is that people have been saying mass stop droplets but that isn't droplets that's the issue it's aerosols which are less than 5 microns and I've done calculations I can send it to you that the virus particles will stay suspended in the air for weeks up to 50 days so the problem is that you have no way of knowing if somebody was in your space two days ago the room full of particles you don't have a virus meter on your head and so the only way to ensure that your space is clean because you're going to get sick indoors not outdoors is to ensure that you either dilute out that concentration or you destroy it and we know that from since 1950 the hierarchy of controls has been in place by the National Safety Council since 1950 that's how we deal with these issues isn't one of the ideas here is that if everybody's wearing a mask my particles won't come out my aerialization will happen but it won't happen as much as if I don't have a mask and it'll also if somebody else is wearing a mask then the chances of them receiving one of my particles of saliva or aerialized particle is even that much further reduced it's not just one person wearing a mask I apologize that all shows that 99.9% of the particles aerosols not droplets so those particles are a thousand times smaller than a diameter of a human hair your mask has zero chance of stopping them I did look up another thing called the Brownian motion physical phenomenon which particles smaller than 0.3 microns moving in an erratic zigzagging kind of motion which increases the chances of being snared by mask fibers not if there's a gap let me explain let's assume that you have a wall that's made out of insulation but you have doors and windows but there's no doors or windows there and this whether it be smoke or virus or whatever particles if they move against that wall system where are they gonna go they're gonna go through the openings right well your mask has mask by definition cannot be sealed I can cite the literature for you in fact I have a standing order if you go to my podcast I have somebody being fit tested which is what I do with a respirator half face and with a mask and you can see when they get hit with the visible smoke which is 500 times larger than the COVID particle they react as if they get hit with smelling salts the problem is even if I have granted you 100% effectiveness on your mask material which it's not it's like 5-10% if you have gaps that approach 2% of the mask area zero effectiveness I've measured actual masks they're around 9% gap area versus mask area so and the literature is clear that mask can't possibly work there's no seal in other words I ask everybody I did a lot of work on asbestos asbestos particles around 5 microns they're about 50 times larger than the COVID and I tell everybody if I ever was to put people in masks to protect them from asbestos I should lose every license I have so why in God's name would I let people wear a mask to protect them from something so much smaller just a couple more questions one is a serial question I was looking at an interview done by Lindsay Maher professor of civil and environmental engineering at Virginia Tech but she's not an industrial she's not an industrial hygienist she doesn't even have the right credentials it's like having a debt with all due respect sir it's like having your dentist to your heart surgery but isn't it like having an environmental an industrial hygiene expert talk about educational impacts you did that no I just cited the papers you can read them yourself because we're asked are there any effects and I can certainly talk about certain effects I can talk about the physiological effects I can talk about the mold effects I can talk about the biotereological build-up effects I cannot talk about the psychological effects because I'm not a board certified psychiatrist but you have presented evidence about educational effects certainly because I know because the school that I did this in the school person I'm with is has an outstanding high school of 750 autistic children and I work side by side with her because she said the kids cannot learn with masks so that's where I got that information from is somebody that I worked with very closely that's why I was asked to come in have you are you familiar with or do you have an opinion on Bill HNA H-A-N-A-G-E an associate professor of epidemiology at Harvard University School of Public Health I don't know the name he's an epidemiologist not an industrial hygienist epidemiology is a completely different field is there any other field besides industrial hygiene that would you would agree is confident to render opinions on this topic well the reason I'm picking 400 cases is because industrial hygienists do the exposure exposure control like in the roundup stuff we don't use epidemiologists we don't use doctors they do the causation that is the cause of the disease but they don't do the exposure exposure control that's my area of expertise and that's why I'm picked as one of the top testifying experts in the United States okay but what's the answer to my question I don't know how to answer that other than we have a lot of people pining on industrial hygiene subjects that aren't industrial hygienists okay is there any other field besides industrial hygiene that in your opinion is qualified to render expert opinions on this topic on exposure control masks and COVID-19 well masks are intended for exposure control right so the answer would be no I mean that's the if you look at the front end of my presentation I said one of the biggest challenges we have is we've got a lot of people pining on exposure and exposure control that don't have the right background unfortunately I mean believe me I dedicated five months of my time and I'm dedicating time today I have a full-time job to try to help people understand this issue I've done I've helped over 2,000 people and I don't know how many school boards I've spoken to and most of them at a minimum make masks voluntary they certainly don't make a mandatory but that's a place to politically to start with but believe me I was trained also in the art of behavioral psychology and behavioral marketing I finished first of my class in business as well as the technical degrees I have so I understand you face challenges in the political environment but at the end of the day you've got to deal with real science and it's coming out I just put a podcast out last week that says you know the real science is finally leaking out and it is and it will thank you yeah I'm not really sure how to ask this question so I'll do the best I can my question has to do with I heard what you said and I think I understand but my dilemma is I have the Vermont Department of Health in the CDC apparently saying something very different if I heard you correctly I believe you said don't require wearing a mask it doesn't work if I believe the Department of Health the Vermont Department of Health in the CDC they say wear a mask particularly if you're indoors so I'm not sure how to ask this question is the Vermont Department do you believe the Vermont Department of Health in the CDC are wrong well I always ask I don't know about the Vermont Department of Health because I'm not it's not possible for me to know exactly what they've written but on the CDC side I would ask you what scientists would ever have positions don't wear a mask wear a mask don't wear a mask last summer wear a mask and now on January 14 say masks don't work use N95s I mean when somebody asks me about science and they say I always say well how can science change its position 180 degrees twice in a year and a half it can't and so the reality is those of us out there that have spent our entire life in trying to protect people don't believe for a second that these masks these what's happening at CDC is they're trapped between politicians who want to say they've done something and the sciences and so you see that struggle that goes on constantly but the mask are a political solution not a technical or science solution let me ask a different question if you don't mind sure I appreciate the time do the masks like the ones I'm wearing right now do they do is there impact on reducing either my transmitting or my getting COVID do they have a negative zero or positive impact well that's just sort of the lawyer is wearing a mask 100% totally useless or does it provide some benefit yeah that's the lawyer question I get it I get asked that in trial all the time and here's the way to answer that question quickly let's imagine you have an engineer and a mathematician in a room and you're the moderator and you ask them to have the distance the far wall and have it again and have it forever and then the moderator says to get to the wall the mathematician says no and he's theoretically correct and the engineer says yes close enough well the answer might not be zero but it's really really close to zero in terms of the factors so if I could restate that just to make sure I understood it it's so small that it's of inconsequential benefit yeah and the other the other point I'd like to make if I could the American Industrial Hygiene Association our trade group put out a paper in September of 2020 that said and I believe in this that if you're going to offer a solution you should reduce the risk in this case of COVID by at least 90% mass even perfectly sealed mass reduce it only 10 5 to 10% and with leaks they reduce it on the order of zero so I say to people well if I put a solution out there that stop people 5% or 10% of the people from get to ask bestosas I don't think the public could be very happy we have to provide solutions that protect a super majority of people 90% the only way to do that and even AHA American Industrial Hygiene Association says you got to go to engineering controls and we've known that I don't mean to be tough but we've known that since 1950 I've been doing this 45 years so that means I'm old you just made an interesting comment and I'm not just agreeing I just it perked my interest where you said we need to what's the word protect the super majority of the people super majority thank you thank you for repeating that what I've heard is one of the big issues with COVID is hospitalizations and the impact on COVID and causing our hospitals to go into kind of a crisis situation because they don't have the capacity anymore to handle COVID and everything else they need to handle so do our mask effective in helping prevent that aspect of COVID and your answer maybe that's not my area well the mask wouldn't help that situation you're still using the thing that you do in a hospital is right now what we have is a situation where there's within ASHRAE the American Society of Heating and Refrigeration and Air Conditioning Engineers there's two panels, 91 which is associated with energy codes make buildings more energy efficient and I heard some of you folks talking about that earlier and then there's 61 62 which is indoor air quality and they conflict because the way that you make buildings more energy efficient is you use less outdoor fresh air my recommendation since this started is buildings especially industrial or institutional buildings open up the damper so instead of having 5% fresh air we maximize fresh air do we chew up with a little more electricity yes we have some humidity issues perhaps but we'll dilute out any contaminants in there by doing that by a factor of somewhere between 100 and 1000 then you put in these destruction technologies that I've given a list of them for you folks if you have the time or interest in looking at them they actually will destroy the virus and they'll destroy mold and bacteria at the same time so that's the real solutions in a hospital setting, the masks aren't going to do any good I can give you study after study after study that show you the surgical mask cannot stop infectious diseases in hospitals thank you thank you sir if not thank you very much Mr. Petty for coming and hopefully somebody will come too Willis and Percy I think I've been there but it was quickly alrighty thank you take care also the audience who wishes to make some brief comments Hi Sharon Rae Quinn again I just want to say if you do decide to go forward for 30 more days with a mask mandate I would hope that you would still consider excluding houses of worship I know where I go to church some people wear masks the majority don't and it's just a personal choice I believe it's a freedom that's taken away from us and Saturday I went to an eight hour conference on masks on COVID and there were speakers from Texas Virginia, Delaware one was a former worker for the CDC a couple were doctors very with a lot of expertise and experience in the field so please consider what that gentleman said with his reviews of 45 years you know one size doesn't fit all so stay safe stay warm thank you we should be talking about the seminar they had this last weekend Ryan Cole had Richard Fleming and had a few other experts to talk about the COVID virus itself vaccinations I believe was a part of it masks was a part of it as well I just want to comment on one part Mr. Petty was talking about where CDC gets some of their studies I believe there's around 15 of them that they use none of them are randomized control trials so they took the control group out in that part that he was talking about and I think the one particularly one that they talked about most through CDC if you do the research they were talking about the two hairstylists out of Missouri all wearing masks they ended up with symptoms and then they wound up testing positive and continued to treat or continued to help 139 clients and 67 of them tested and they were all negative 72 of them did not test but did not have symptoms but without the control group you don't really have any basis for that trial because you took away the other group if you were going to use that you'd have to also look at the Indiana gym where the trainer tested positive and they continued to train 50 people out of all of those people none of them wore a mask and none of them tested positive only the trainer so if you look at that neither one of them are worth anything to look at but if you look at that there's no control group so you have no basis you have nothing to go on and randomized control trials have been the gold standard for science for as long as I can remember I don't know the exact amount of years but randomized control trials is the gold standard that we should be using and CDC has failed to do that so that's kind of where Steven Petty was going and that's what he was talking about those are the studies that they were quoting and CDC has actually quoted that because of that one particular study the hairstylists and a few others they decided to say that the masking worked and that really is that has no merit it doesn't really hold water so that's kind of where he was going and I just wanted to comment on what she was saying as well thank you anyone else wish to speak anyone else on zoom that wishes to speak I'll just share I've disabled the chat due to the zoom bomber issue that we had a little while ago and I can speak to more of that during the mattress report I asked folks to email me directly if they have any comments for us excuse me wish to speak I've been inspired here I just want to reiterate what these other folks said I'm not going to a house of worship but it seems like it's time for personal choice I understand where you're coming from Jeff it's a dicey situation with the Vermont Department of Health and the CDC I don't think anybody it's difficult to deny their message to go against it but I've been working from home for two years triple backs, got the flu shot and wearing a mask I want my community back and that's what it is I go to the store and talk to anybody you can't hear anybody you can't see anybody's face but I understand the bind you guys are in or the decision you have to make that's my two cents anyone else just know that be free close would it be okay if I asked a question of two of the people who presented is that okay go ahead Mitch and Sharon what and if you don't feel comfortable answering that's totally fine if the exemption for houses of worship not to be included what would be the impact could the people on zoom hear the question that you asked okay so our church is led by a team of elders of which I'm one and I don't get any more votes but as the senior pastor if you guys said that masks are required I would advocate to our elders that we follow suit by requiring that face masks be worn in our church services as we did during the time of Governor Scott's emergency order the whole time it's been required by the government we've worn face masks and when it hasn't been required we've likewise not required them though everyone's been free to wear them if they like and we've encouraged vaccinations we've encouraged boosting and we've done a more than thorough job in my opinion of letting people know when they might have been a close contact whether we think that any transmission happened at a church event or not as far as the there are people for whom wearing masks presents a respiratory issue and so for those people there would be an impact there's also I don't want to overstate things our church is going to keep on meeting we won't cease to exist if you guys remove the house of worship exemption to be sure but there is an impact that comes when people who the scriptures to teach are your brothers and sisters in Christ have to communicate with each other only behind face masks there's a dampening of our worship of the Lord Jesus Christ that we think takes place in those kinds of scenarios but we've done it before and if you guys say we must it's a question we'll take up as elders but if we thought that we to run our parishioners in any sort of grave danger you can be sure we would think differently about face masks so I just humbly make that request at the board but I hope that's addressing the question you guys I happen to go to ignite church on South Brown L Road in Williston pastor Todd Callahan is a senior pastor assistant pastor is Sean Trollen and like I think I mentioned before some folks wear masks the majority don't if you don't continue to exclude that if you do pass the mask mandate we're going to carry on just as we did yesterday or today some people wear masks I'm sure the majority won't some people during two years have watched online we continue to meet in person Wednesday nights at 7 Sunday mornings at 10 the Bible tells us to congregate together so people suffer when they can't see loved ones we're family of God they're not my blood relatives but they're special people in my life it makes a difference when I attend services in person and that's the way the majority of my brothers and sisters in Christ feel it just makes a difference and to have the praise team, the worship leaders perform and have a mask only off when they take some breath before the next song starts and my utter honest, humble opinion ridiculous we ask people not to attend services if they're not feeling well if they have sniffles the flu is still out there COVID is real yeah I feel that there are so many cases in the hospitals here in Vermont around the world where they say the death was due to COVID there are other underlying issues, even more major when they went in the hospital but they list COVID so the figures aren't right all the symptoms of COVID are actual symptoms of remdesivir which is what they push you to take in American hospitals and that kills people it causes kidney failure and other failures we also have machines that our church went to great expense to purchase close to two years ago where they can just kill and filter out things in one hour we have several of them in the building so you're safe coming into our church and so I just I want you to just not make a quick decision I want you to really consider whether to extend this for 30 days and certainly if you do please please exempt the churches not everyone goes to a church not everyone has a god they believe in that's your choice it's my choice so please try to honor and respect those that do like to attend church to have a belief in God so that we can continue to gather together and enjoy one another thank you God bless last time I promise so what she was referring to with the Remdesivir I actually have some experience with this as my cousin was actually hospitalized after being double jab with COVID and she did pass away she was in the hospital for about four weeks on a ventilator and they use the protocol of Remdesivir and I want people to understand where they actually got that from NIH and NIAID they do studies, Ebola studies they did the Ebola study they said it killed 54% of their patients that they treated with it I find it a little bit particular, a little odd that they would select that particular drug to use in our hospitals when it killed 54% of the people it ends up attacking your kidneys and what happens when your kidneys are no longer functional you retain water and when the water comes up and your body fills up your lungs also fill up in an event you when they did this to my cousin it ended up killing her they ended up eliminating every ounce of money that she had in her medical exhausted the whole thing and then sent her home and she died a few days later she did not die of COVID she died of Remdesivir poison and the reason why that is and you know that is because if you look at the study and you read the studies of the three or four drugs that they used Remdesivir was the one that killed the most amount of people and those are the exact things that they died from so when we talk about what they die of there's secondary and then there's the primal cause and COVID I would suspect most of the time was actually the secondary cause because nobody's been dying in the hospital when you go of COVID when you've gotten a motorcycle accident and you die of that that should be the first thing second thing they died with COVID so dying with COVID and dying of COVID are two separate things you know and another thing that I learned during my research hospitals get about $13,000 for every positive case that you go to when you go to a hospital test if they can get you actually admitted and put you on a vent it's another $39,000 okay but we're only talking about masks here tonight I understand that so you're kind of way off topic right? I was just picking back picking up her bullet it's nine o'clock sounds good just want to throw that out there so that we understood where she got that Remdesivir dying of COVID and how the so just want to throw that out there so it's now time for us to make a decision Terry did have a Sharon go and want to make a quick comment regarding Sharon I'll connect you and I do promise I will be quick I thought that that expert witness though did an excellent job and and Ken you did an excellent job to cross examining I can tell you're an attorney I just want you to know that as a business owner that includes a gem and I watch people exercise if you're walking that's not a problem if you're exercising in your target heart rate zone where you really do need more oxygen the masks all masks decrease your oxygen level and I have an oxometer at work and I put it on myself so you don't even need that though I mean put a mask on and make yourself try to breathe hard so we're really not able to allow our members and our patients who might be needing more oxygen to be exercising in the best way that they should for their health so I do hope that we will not continue the mask mandate and I feel like if it is mandated at least not on the members and gyms and I know the Edge hasn't had a mask mandate because they're not in Williston and there's a reason you know why gyms don't have masks that's it good night thank you so I would like to make a decision tonight either to continue the mandate or to rescind it and if you would make any changes to the existing mandate that would also need to be taken care of so I've been looking for the motion move under the authority of act 1 to extend the town of Williston's face for the COVID-19 pandemic for 30 days until February 2022 as it was originally passed which would mean there is an exemption for houses of worship and there's also an exemption for health related limitations is there a second? a second discussion of the motion the only thing I'd say is I first of all I want to thank the expert I did not mean any disrespect I just needed to get certain points out and to the degree of my tone was too press examining I do apologize for that I don't doubt anybody's sincerity I do note that when we passed this the last time we all got emails that we were Hitler that we were doing this is the beginning of concentration camps etc I don't think anybody here would have sent those but we did get them and I don't think that's the situation with people who have a different opinion than mine I think everybody here presented very very well and I honor and respect that I just have a different I have a different opinion and I'm looking at what the CDC says I'm looking at what the Vermont Department of Health says I'm looking at what the Harvard University School of Public Health and Epidemiology says what the Missouri University Science and Tech Professors of Civil and Archaeological and Environmental Engineering are saying this is just for another 30 days and it's just a face mask I think this is something that we have to do I don't like them either I want to go back to normal as fast as possible but I also do feel the need to point out that there are science does change real scientists originally thought that the Earth was in the center of the universe and then more and more data appeared and they changed their mind real scientists thought that you know all kinds of things that turned out to not be true so the fact that science is changing doesn't mean anybody is trying to fool you or take away your freedoms for reasons I still can't understand it just means that we have a different understanding so I think this is for another 30 days and I favor it any further discussion I agree every day I wake up to my kids what was yesterday's data they're growing up in an environment where they're constantly surrounded by COVID they wear masks to school every single day and have for the entirety of the school year the entirety of last school year and no they do not love wearing the masks I do not love wearing a mask but I do it as I said the last time because I have such utmost compassion for everyone around me and I believe that if it can mitigate my potential potentially exposing anybody else and their mask can potentially mitigate my exposure then that is a sacrifice that we do as human beings for each other right now when my kids ask me tomorrow what the data was from today I have to tell them that there are currently 116 hospitalized within the state of Vermont which is amongst the highest that has been throughout the COVID pandemic there are 26 people in ICU beds currently in the state of Vermont which is amongst the highest that has been throughout the pandemic and so again with the utmost compassion and concern and love for my fellow human beings I feel that this is a step that we can take to protect each other and we will continue to see everybody and this is 30 days hopefully this wave of Omicron will have crested and will be going in the other direction at that point but I feel that it is imperative that we take this step for each other at this point that's awesome we have more discussion right now two things I would like to say one is we heard again tonight we've had a request before and we heard again tonight a request that gyms be exempted so I'm just throwing that out there to see if there's any if there's interest in doing that and then I think last time my comment was last time when we voted to put in place the mass mandate my comment was is there's a bit of the mask outweigh the impacts to personal health, personal liability I don't doubt anything I've heard tonight but on the other hand I don't doubt what I read when I look at the websites of CDC or the Vermont Department of Health and right now they are very clear wearing a mask indoors is appropriate is a good idea and I'm going to have to take that as my lead in making this my decision unless there is an amendment to test the motion gyms will proceed with the motion I had originally made that amendment last time and I got booted I didn't get voted down I got booted down nobody even said that one thing that happens I regret not chiming in and saying let's at least talk about it and that was a mistake on my part because personally I don't agree with the church exemption I don't know if it makes sense going into that I mean you have people captured in a room for long indoors for a long period of time I would assume that in the store where somebody might be in the store for 15 minutes and moving around in that store isn't my gut tells me that's less whatever the right word is less conducive to transmitting COVID than when you're sitting still next to people in an indoor environment for a long time not long time but extended time let's say so if we go along with the church exemption I guess my logic my engineering logic doesn't understand why we wouldn't go along with the gym exemption actually my thought on that is people voluntarily go to church you know maybe when I was kid growing up Catholic I can't say it was voluntary but my parents thought it was but it's not likely that people are going to be in there in either one who are going to be there because they don't have because it's mandatory because they have to go to the store they have to go to the drug store they have to go to town offices so to me that's a distinguishment in policy it's not a difference in engineering I agree with that no further discussion and no amendments to the policy were at Ted's motion to accept and it's seconded right? it was seconded so all those in favor of the motion say aye aye so we have passed unanimously thank you all for coming tonight to offer your opinion on this and we appreciate that so we'll move on to the ordinance on special events Eric you're going to start it off and then that will take over yep this is continuation of the discussion we had the end of last year regarding a rewrite for an ordinance you may recall the public festivals to prevent a wood stock from occurring in Williston in the early 70s so Matt's office has done a lot of work on this with a rewrite and we're chatting with Terry before the meeting part of what we're going to call this ordinance maybe a point of discussion here as we go but for tonight Matt got additional feedback from public safety department heads after the first discussion whether the board want to pursue this further we'll get board's feedback with this discussion and then if the board wishes to schedule a public hearing we can have the town attorney give a final look over the ordinance before we warn that hearing in the coming couple of years so I can turn over to Matt great thanks for the opportunity to come back and talk about special event ordinance and repeal of the public festivals regulation which does present an opportunity to also repeal something where the word regulation is misspelled in 22 point all these years I guess it hasn't made too much of a difference following the last time that we looked at this with the select board we spoke with our police and fire chiefs looking for some comment and received that and I've essentially tried to work the comments from those two departments into the draft I'll start with talking about the police chief's comment which was a simpler one and proposed a solution that I think warrants a little bit of legal review and what she fully said was well you have this fine structure that's $250 a day and if I'm running a very large very profitable special event illegally that that fine isn't much of a deterrent so we recommended some language that might be able to scale that fine with the size of the event by considering each attendee of the special event is a separate violation that would rack the fine up obviously much higher I would like us to confer with council about whether that's actually reasonable to do and do point out that there's also a possibility of just getting a court order to shut down an event that's being operated without a special event permit and that would go beyond simply finding somebody you know you can take an action under that we had more extensive comments from the fire department who of course look at servicing a special event more from a practical emergency services standpoint and you know there were really two things that the fire chief wanted to get into this ordinance one was just general reference to adopted fire codes access for fire equipment and be able to show a layout of an event to the fire chief for their approval including fire lanes boots etc and the list there is fairly extensive but seems fairly common sense and for those following along I'm in section five fire safety 5a and then 5b for larger events over a thousand persons the chief's recommendation is to require some actual staffing of the event by Williston fire personnel and so that's based there and there's a little bit of ability to determine that level of staffing flexibly based on some of the aspects of the event including whether or not alcohol would be served there the second element of the fire chief's comment has to do with the use of tents temporary structures that don't meet fire code the same way that a permanently constructed building does and what the fire chief has proposed is an additional fee for larger tents that would be used as parts of an event the town has been exempted in this draft from that fee so we won't have to pay ourselves and there is also a discussion of large occupancy event events that either have more than 250 people in an enclosed space with fixed seating where alcohol is served or 500 people in an enclosed space or fixed seating where alcohol is not served so a couple of other thresholds in there for some of those things that are specific to the fire chief's concerns I understand I was not in attendance for part of the discussion of this draft the select board has probably some questions to think about still about frequency and duration of special events and the manager and I also had a discussion today about what inappropriate guidance or threshold might be for events that are always elevated to the select board for review and approval versus those that are most likely smaller or less intense that could be handled out of the manager's presence so prepared to answer questions about that or discuss maybe some possible ways the draft could be modified to build that threshold I think the last time we looked at this we were in agreement as a board to follow something besides a special event that's the temporary event that you suggested and I have a couple of minor things to ask about on the top of page 2 letter C under section 3 application requirements not less than 21 days does that business days or calendar days I noticed in the fire departments they say the number of days or work days I would suggest that we just be consistent I don't think the number of days had a lot of relevance as long as it was appropriate amount of lead time for the office to process the request so I might say it was calendar days to go to something more like 30 and just give it a month they just would clear it up and then the under section 5 B half way down it talks about a minimum of two firefighters EMTs shall be hired for a minimum of three hours I think I need to say three hours each most of my minor things other folks who want to weigh in the only question I have has to do with section 1.1 definition of a special event and the number of events we did hear a comment during the when we spoke of this last that you know if you live next to a location that has a special event and let's say that 12 times ends up being a Saturday Sunday six weekends in a row that could get pretty old pretty quick and you know as being a neighbor so I just wonder if we want to rethink that a little bit and if I remember correctly we sort of had this same type of discussion when we're doing the noise ordinance and with the North Country Gun Club and when they could hold and I believe we did call them special events so that's that's my only question I wonder what staff's recommendation on that would be in the background in my mind there's some there's an interplay between what we're doing with a proposed new special event ordinance and what we are proposing to regulate as land development under zoning and at some level what this ordinance communicates is that if you're going to go beyond these thresholds if you're going to build permanent structures if you're going to develop a site so that it you know like a fair grounds or something or if you're going to be there with such frequency that it's really become a more continuous operation you do need to at that point comply with zoning and that threshold then because of the way we do things in zoning that threshold then means well you need to situate this facility in a zone where the facility is allowed and these types of special or temporary events are often in association with an agricultural property or a property in a residential district or maybe in the village in a district where large concert facility or gathering place is not in allowed use or a type of structure that would be permitted so I think that the policy question for the select board on this is at what point are you as a group interested in saying that's really that's really a type of land development we want to regulate under zoning that's something we want to just say go put that with the other commercial uses I set out these numbers in the draft not to exceed 8 hours and either be a single event or part of a series not to exceed 12 as a starting point there's nothing special about those numbers 12 is arguably in Vermont every Saturday of the summer and you know depends on who you are whether that sounds like a lot or not if you're an agricultural property looking to hold an event that can't be understood as exempt from regulation under the required agricultural practices maybe that doesn't sound like a lot gosh we'd like to be able to do more if you're a neighbor to that property that might sound like well boy Saturday night's one of my nights to be home and I'm going to be experiencing this event next door to me if I could if I could is the part that's defined in 1.1 definition of a special event that's only and I say only maybe shouldn't be using that word but that's there to define what a special event is that's not how we're going to necessarily regulate something that is ends up falling under the definition of a special event in other words even though the definition says no more than 12 times per year you want special event X to happen on your property you may not have the approval that comes from the town may not allow you to do it let's say 12 days in a row is that correct I'm just reading through back into section 4 action on permit for the select board it is correct in that we're setting some outside limits if you want in other words under this current draft if you want more than 12 events per year this is not your avenue anymore you need to go find a way to do that that's in conformance with zoning same goes for the time duration or the other threshold which was the one that calls out the zoning districts in the longer duration when you get into the discussion in 4 of the action on the permit it lists a number of reasons that a permit could be denied and we have some fairly broad reasons that an event could be denied including that the location would cause undue hardship for adjacent businesses or residents which is kind of a catch all anything in the zoning world that you can deny outright is also something that you can condition all the way down to a denial we could add some language that makes it clear that if you would like that the select board could modify to limit the number duration etc in consideration of these values the other way to look at it would be under the way it's drafted today somebody comes to you they want all 8 hours all 12 days you know once a year and in consideration of the location the nature of the event etc the select board says I think this creates an undue hardship my vote would be to deny I would be interesting in approving something that was less impactful if it was less frequent would you applicant like to modify your application but another way to do it would be to just add a subsection here that do you want I guess the select board to be able to issue a partial approval or a conditioned approval that says great application you want 12 concerts we're going to give you 6 you could certainly do that do it that way as well will there be some sort of process by which neighboring businesses residents are notified that there is an application out there for a temporary event or a special event that may impact them because they may not know that this is even going to happen until it gets approval right will we warn it will we put a notice in the paper like when we get the applications I mean how will they be notified that they may have concerns currently the only notification of this is that it would show up on the select board agenda if it was an event being reviewed by the select board asking that question differently could we require neighbors to be notified I certainly think you could I think we would just want some guidance on you know is it someone who abuts the land directly is it a radius some of that can be discretionary at the staff level but just to know for our process that's the board's intended ordinance I think that depends on the size of the amplifiers used at the concert yeah yeah I'm not sure but I do feel I don't know the answer to that I think you know crowd size of the events could impact that equipment being planned to be used could impact that you know the amount of vehicles coming in and out I mean all kinds I think ultimately would probably come down to size because that probably dictates the most amount of crowd and noise but I do think some having some language about notifying the immediate like a budding at the minimum of budding properties in a budding neighbors yeah that that could be fairly easily made part of the requirements for a complete application that the applicant demonstrate that they had notified their directive butters or every every resident within so many feet of their property line or however you'd like to do it I mean you know we have a in zoning we have a very prescribed way of notification that is handed to us by the states is this is how you'll notify butters of pending development reviews depending on what kind they are you don't have to do that exactly I think I think you could look for it as part of the form of the application that would be developed to show compliance here so if we added a line that said notification I'd look I'd look for any guidance but it sounds like at a minimum it's a budding a budding landowners or maybe within some radius in the property where the event is going to happen other one other question so sorry Matt Greta made me think of this the the discussion about the medical facilities and differentiating between a smaller special event or temporary event in a larger one a larger one being a thousand or more will there be a thousand or more people traveling to a special event particularly if they are due to arrive within a relatively narrow window of time could have a traffic impact and is that part of the review so under section four we talk about whether the time route hours location or size of the event will unnecessarily disrupt the movement of other traffic within the area and we talk about that a couple other ways in here so I would leave it to the individual review of an event if somebody came and said I'm having Woodstock and Williston say well you know if we think you're going to create this undue impact we're just going to deny it what's your plan for traffic applicant have you talked to our police chief are you are you hiring a detail etc you know there's a lot more in my mind sort of negotiation and conditioning in a permit under an ordinance like this then there would be you know something we were doing in front of the DRV yeah okay at the board's discretion we have a lot of good feedback this evening we could we could summarize that and bring it back to the board at a meeting of February if you like look at a clean version before any potential action so if we could get it back in February then we can schedule a public period after that yeah we could probably have this ready for the next meeting with the feedback tonight so you can have a clean look at it from the discussion tonight if that's your preference yeah okay works for you buddy alright thank you we'll keep you on the hot seat the next is the regional unified planning program list for Williston and Eric just want to leave it on it and turn it over to Matt this is the annual program list for funding requests from the Chitton County Regional Planning through the Chitton County Regional Planning Commission the Planning Office and Public Works Office prepare these requests the board is asked to endorse approval of these it will go to the full review by the Regional Planning Commission we'll also speak with our representative as it gets to that review stage to advocate on Williston's behalf but this is an annual request it's a good pool of money the town has access to it's assisted with a lot of town projects throughout the years Matt's prepared a summary memo consultation with Bruce from Public Works and provided the board with the more detailed sheets more for reference Matt can provide a quick overview knowing it's getting late as well if there's any questions he can certainly answer about a project here sure as Eric said these are the town's requests for assistance for fiscal year 2023 under the unified planning work program Chitton County Regional Planning Commission and as Eric said project requests typically originate both from the Public Works and Planning Departments and I've listed them that way in the cover memo so a couple of Public Works projects traffic count requests CCRPC staff to perform traffic counts on local roads from year to year this year's request did not identify any particular roads but stated that there were probably four or five places where counts were warranted that could be requested going forward and I should mention that we developed these requests in concert with the CCRPC staff and thank them greatly for their assistance there's a lot of back and forth about what level of detail the project whether there's a chance for funding match whether it can be handled in-house and how to characterize the project that goes on in the development of these so something like that might sound well you didn't have to say which roads you wanted measured somebody at CCRPC probably said that's fine we can figure that out once the year gets started and you know what you want signage inventory request as I mentioned for this not the kind of signs we deal with normally in zoning but the kind of signs the town of Williston owns uses in its right of way for traffic control etc getting those assets inventoryed and into a geographic information system so that they can be mapped and managed in that way is the signage inventory request and then stormwater similarly is a request to continue filling out a data set for the town about stormwater treatment facilities in town locations of inflows outflows ponds etc and field verification of some of those locations to build out that geographic data set for the stormwater then I'll talk a little bit about the planning projects briefly we have planning projects requested in two major areas one is preparations for public outreach of the next town plan and the other are a set of projects that are resultant from our taff corners visioning exercise issues we identified that go beyond what can be accomplished in the pending bylaw amendment which you'll see very soon in other words not everything that came out of the taff corners visioning project can be handled by regulating land use there are other things that take some other work so first up comprehensive plan for the development the 2020 decennial census is more or less complete we anticipate full release of data from that by the beginning of the fiscal year and along with some American community survey jobs journey to work data demographic information we're requesting some assistance from the regional planning commission to begin assembling that data essentially for presentation back to the community before we start the community, the kinds of questions we ask that are the lead-in to the next comprehensive plan. So in other words, in an overview way, toward the tail end of FY23, we want to be able to start our public engagement for the town plan and say, so this is who you are, this is how many of you there are, this is where you work and how you move around the town. These are your demographics. Knowing those things, now we'd like to ask you some questions about what you think the future of Williston should look like. So it's a very, very preliminary work to get going on some informed decision-making informed community participation for the 2025 town plan. Next up is affordable housing needs assessment. There's a really good set of data out there about the need for affordable housing in Chittenden County. And we certainly talked a lot about affordable housing throughout the Taft Corners project and received that input, I believe, a letter that was copied to this board as well as the Planning Commission from the Racial Equity Partnership that in very brief summary, apologies for not getting all of the high points said, you know, if we're going to have more development in Williston, some of it ought to produce housing that's affordable for people. And, you know, there are some regulatory tools the town has contemplated over the years but not engaged, one of them being inclusionary zoning where you actually require a certain percentage of projects of a certain size to be built as affordable housing. If the town wanted to adopt or consider adopting something like inclusionary zoning, there are some statutory requirements that the community has done a needs assessment. So given the timelines of these things and the desire to be responsive to things that came up in the Taft Corners project, we wanted to get that needs assessment done so that not having it is not an impediment if we want to take up further regulatory work around housing and the provision of affordable housing. That's that one. Multi-modal hub scoping study and I think buried in the memo we might have still used the word transit center even though it makes the CCRPC staff concerned that we want to build St. Paul Street bus station in Williston. Not quite what we're imagining but in the Taft Corners vision process and the prior work of our mobility committee we talked a lot about what we call mode shift facilities, places that you could park and then get on a bus or lock your bike for the day and get on a bus or walk to and ride away from me a carpool partner etc. And that's what we're talking about here. On both our official map and our other work with the mobility committee we sort of brought back to life the idea of a transit center at Maple Tree Place where the town owns some land and would like to have some assistance doing the preliminary work around the feasibility of what could actually be developed in that part of town and how would it enhance people's access to mobility in and out and around Williston. The last one is the growth center communal stormwater management system feasibility study. It's a it's a long title for actually a fairly short and very preliminary project. If you were to go into the sort of the back 10th of the Taft Corners vision document that you saw in July you'd see a section about overarching issues or things that are outside of the realm of land use that we think might be challenges to having Taft Corners develop in the pattern that was envisioned in the vision document. And one of those things is that if each development in Taft Corners has to handle stormwater on its own site it can make it harder to achieve that compact efficient development pattern. Additionally as we looked at it more we realized that the vision for Taft Corners and the regulating plan in the draft form based code anticipates the construction of a whole lot more streets that would become public and that's more impervious surface that would have to be served by public infrastructure. So this is the beginning of just trying to get our hands around what are the town's options as it considers the buildout of the stormwater infrastructure that would be needed to support the vision for Taft Corners. There are some things in there that I think are a little more challenging to think about like serving public and private stormwater in the same facilities and or there being the idea of any public responsibility for the treatment of private stormwater. I'd want to emphasize that this work would not commit the town to any of that but would rather just be an informational exercise to understand physically what might be needed in the various parts of Taft Corners. And that's what I have for requests for the CCRPC. Questions for Matt. One question. So Matt when we get these types of requests if you will or documents before us we obviously have to rely on staff because you're in the trenches you know what it is that you need. So my question is is what is in that that isn't what isn't in that that maybe we should think about as opposed to what's in it. Sure well there's one there's one glaring thing that's not in this and it's not in it because it's not eligible for transportation funding match and and that is to take the street sections that are in the Taft Corners form based code which will hopefully in some form be adopted fairly soon and get them drawn into this public work standard specifications which is its own document its own ordinance that's not the same as zoning. So in other words if somebody is going to build one of those streets that we have in in the regulating plan and that street is going to be considered for you know eventually being taken as a public street it needs to live in the public work standard specifications in an engineering drawing. We had hoped and thought that we might be able to be eligible for transportation 80% match on that project but in consultation with CCRPC Eleni Churchill said to us transportation planner at CCRPC said you know this is too much design and design is not eligible for that kind of funding so you can you can study and you can scope and you can think about feasibility but you can't do design with that money. So we're going to need to pursue one or more different strategies to get that work done. I think the good thing is that we can get if we were considering a new street under the form based code we can get the right of way with you can you can build one of the streets that's in the current specs in that right of way and you can place the buildings in the right place and you know you could arguably come back to it. It's not an issue at all if somebody's building on an existing street we're not making them you know rebuild a piece of Zephyr Road in order to build a building that fronts on it we've just specified the set back line and as the town works on some of the public streets that it has been interested in building for example Trader Lane there's an opportunity to get those cross sections designed for at least one of the six street types in the regulating plan actually I think Trader right in the one way sections around the Trader green in the regulating plan makes us gets us two and a half things out of the six that we need designed if we were to pursue permitting on Trader Lane and full design Trader Lane we'd need to get those cross sections done any way they could be considered for adoption then so there are some ways of backing into this we also will probably in the fall pursue a municipal planning grant to get that work done okay I'm also looking to find out how much money we're talking about for this work it's sounding like it's less than 15 and more like in the $10,000 range so it's it's not hundreds of thousands of dollars it's a small amount of work the transportation engineer who consulted on the form-based code has been asked to give his his best guess at what he thought it would cost so we'll keep working on it in those other directions but we could not get it into these requests for assistance okay and that's all we should know that I don't I don't I can't think of anything else we left out there are some other requests for technical assistance that we're pursuing that came out of the Taft Morris project that did not need to be put in here in other words they're more like pick up the phone and CCRPC will help you with them for your information on those we had a question about a sort of an oddball street layout at the 90 degree corner of Seymour Street in Day Lane where things have kind of converged so we have two curb cuts and a 90 degree had some comment from the neighborhood there we're going to just get a little bit of help taking a look at that we are asking for a white paper from CCRPC regarding what would need to happen and what the cost to the town would be if the town were to ever consider taking over routes two and two a as class one highways so you know the vision for Taft Corners imagines those two roads being rebuilt in a way that V-trans would not want to continue to maintain them we know that comes with a price tag we've asked CCRPC to give us some idea of what that price tag is just so decision makers have the information and I think we might have had a few other sort of just safety related requests I know Oak Hill Road a blind spot at the top of the hill by Sunset Hill was in there those are technical assistance requests that will happen more likely this fiscal year the very beginning of FY23 and we're not big enough requests that they needed to be in this okay good thank you yep any other questions the motion was suggested I'll move to approve the project's proposed for inclusion in the regional annual unified planning work program fiscal year 2023 there's a second second discussion on the motion if not all those in favor of the motion say aye all right thank you thank you thank you so moving on to the things we really need to take care of right and the capital budget and program for fiscal year 2023 or just give us a couple of brief remarks on that yep these next few items are our legal stuff for for town meeting for consideration so we'll start with this one so after the last meeting staff made the reductions to the capital expenditures as presented on January 11th and we've provided an updated capital summary sheet based on those discussions as every year the the board would need to approve the capital budget and plan should you be ready to consider that motion this evening okay any questions bearer before I ask for a motion motion then would be in order I'll move to adopt the capital budget and program for fiscal years 2023 through 2028 as presented for a second right and the discussion on the motion okay so similar to capital we've included a summary of the general fund budget after the discussion on January the 11th in your packet just for some numbers this represents a 13.63 percent increase and an estimated tax rate of increase of 0.0383 cents so for the effect that would have on a median homeowner it would be a hundred fifteen dollars in taxes for the year or nine dollars and fifty eight cents per month so you might recall our discussion on the use of ARPA funds at last meeting Shirley followed up with Katie Buckley whose VLCT is an in-house expert on everything herpa just to confirm our our read on that with the rule that came out and the VLC had no objections they did point us towards we had looked at the new staff calculation to the board discussed three hundred thousand dollars their their advice is going to be have all towns looked for all of their funds to go in the lost revenue bucket you might recall we're getting three million dollars our calculation of course of nine hundred fifty thousand that could be lost revenue under this final treasury standard they're saying the minimum lost revenue is three million so that allows every town of Vermont except the city of Burlington to classify all its funds lost revenue good news for us that's the maximum flexibility for ARPA funds for a governmental operation so as the the board and thinks ahead for the additional use of ARPA provides a lot more flexibility so just want to bring the board's attention you did have that ceiling of the three hundred and ten last week when you looked at this just sharing of that that changes that threshold but not sure if the board wants to look at any further or not that's what should the board wish to move forward there's a suggested motion this would essentially establishes for the article on that town I don't think I'm interested in changing what we decided last meeting which was the three hundred thousand but what would be helpful to me and sorry Shirley would be as if we if I could get a listing of the ARPA dollars we've committed to spending already so I know where we are compared to the three million dollars that we're anticipating are we at 50 25 percent that type of thing I could point you Jeff to this capital summary as the ARPA called out in the ARPA column and then you'll have a motion to consider with the fire department later on this agenda should the board support you support the capital budget piece of this if the other pieces support would be about 600 000 of the three million at this point okay so if I could just make sure I understand if I take the ARPA dollars that are shown on the budget seat which is 166 201 feet um oh there's a little bit of the equipment on this oh okay 201 total there and add that to the 300 that we anticipate using for the fiscal fiscal year 2023 operating budget so that gets me at about 500 000 so we for lack of better words I'm too tired to think of the right way to say this but we've spent or committed about 500 000 of the three million we're anticipating okay that's very helpful thank you thank you for the questions looking for a motion I'll move to adopt the general fund budget for fiscal year 2023 to be considered at town meeting in the amounts of 13 148 554 dollars second sorry discussion all those in favor of the motion say aye aye yeah both we've got allocations for firefighter hiring and fiscal year 2022 yep we've uh preview just throughout the budget process so kind of summarize and ask the board to consider action this evening um the addition of up to the nine career firefighters identified in the FY 23 budget the board can consider moving forward with that in the fourth quarter of FY 22 we've been accepting applications um planted right now is to schedule folks to interview in February the town supports this budget at town meeting we could then make conditional offers in March so we could as we could have a start date in early April depending on how many folks we can identify to address this issue it would take the chief's plan about a eight week training academy to get those folks ready to go so that would be operational by April May into June at that point the staffs looked at it if the board wants to consider and supports that timeline allocating up so that need for the fourth quarter of FY 22 would be projected about $150,000 um of this expense we've built that into our fund balance model that you looked at in detail last week of um our estimate at 16.7 percent the end of FY 23 um there's a suggested there's two motions you have in your back of the the first one is is to designate up to this amount of money um for the operating side of it and we say up to that amount because there as we get to the end of the fiscal year we will surely will look and see where where we've ended up in terms of any under spending or other sources with the budget so if needed it would tap into these reserves to cover that expense the other piece I alluded to um for these new um employees they would need um equipment capital equipment radios turn out firefighting gear uh coats boots etc um so we've discussed looking at ARPA money to fund that that expense for these new employees depending on how many you could hire so um this kind of lays out the fiscal pathway for the board should it want to move ahead with that plan at the fourth quarter here. I have a question for you. I think I think personally I feel that there is a definite public safety need um so I support it. My only question again for Shirley is getting back to my previous ARPA question. If we approve this motion then I need to add another $130,000 to the ARPA funds that have already been allocated or spent meaning we by passing this motion we've allocated up to about $630,000 of the three million. I just want to make sure I have that correct. Yep that's correct it would leave about 2.4 million um available. Okay good thank you. And so one or two motions combined are in order. I'd make a joint uh combined motion rather uh to move to designative necessary up to $150,000 of the unassigned fund balance for operating expenses for the addition of up to nine full-time firefighters to the department fire department during fiscal year 2022 and further move to designate up to $130,000 of the American Rescue Plan Act ARPA funding for firefighter firefighting equipment inclusive of radios and turnout gear for up to nine new firefighters in the fire department. Let's do a second. A second. Sorry discussion on the motion. All those in favor of the motion say aye. Aye. Aye. Any opposed? This has to do with resolution for ambulance finance. Yep one more piece here you might recall on the capital plan for FY 22 is a replacement of the 2014 ambulance staff approved a purchase order last summer to complete and determine the final pricing. Giving challenges with the supply chain this ambulance won't be delivered until the summer of 2023. Our first payment won't be due until fiscal year 2024. So we identified short-term borrowing as a way to pay for this purchase as the town's done in the past for ambulances. Not that we know what the cost is going to be to enable the town to look at short-term borrowing it would require affirmative vote of the at town meeting by Williston residents. Short-term borrowing and the other options of lease agreement which the board would have authority to enter into. Short-term borrowing allows for lower interest rate and also enables the town to own the asset outright upon repayment of the debt. We bid the cost at about just a hair under $265,000. We built a little escalating factor in the question should you support this approach would be not to exceed $280,000 for the purchase of this ambulance with short-term borrowing. And if you support this it's required to have a necessity resolution adopted the town attorneys that prepare that for your consideration and that would then be reflected on the warning for town. There are many who have noticed that the original amount we learned this morning but we have the assistance of the firefighters brand which was the brand that trained the neurologists. We have excess there so essentially we were about $50,000 that we're going to use to buy the power load in the pot. So that brought the foregoing down for the okay. Sure. One question. I actually have two questions if you don't mind. First building on that is the $280,000 is that the anticipated purchase cost or is that the anticipated that needs to be financed or is that the anticipated purchase cost less the sale of the older ambulance? Okay. All right. Good. Thank you. My other question has to do with we're going to sell the ambulance and somebody's probably going to buy it and use it as an ambulance. So I read in this where it says has reached the end of its useful service life. Well that's not really true because we know somebody's going to continue to use it so it still has service life in it. What the town does is make a decision about what's the most cost effective time to sell the ambulance and I wonder if that concept of cost effective should be built into that first paragraph and I know the town attorneys looked at it and the town attorney knows more what language to use and the necessity resolution than I ever will but I'm just curious why that isn't there. If I'm a resident who's voting for this I would think they would or I would want to know is the town doing what they consider to be the most cost effective approach to getting a new ambulance online. So that's. I don't know the answer to that, Jeff but I agree the reason so we are financing over seven years but the ambulance is we actually keep for eight years so the new ambulance becomes the primary for four years then it's the second period for four years and then another new ambulance will come on but after eight years is when we find that repairs and maintenance on the ambulance are prohibited because of the I know the industry standard is set for the ambulance for financing an asset like this certainly it can last longer but kind of our best practice for replacement falls to that my question just becomes do we want to build that term cost effective into the resolution and just something to consider do you need this something tonight or it can you know it there it's not critical to be signed tonight so if you want me to run that at the borough should run that by the town attorney I can run it by and just since you will offer stop by to sign it down yeah yeah so the will work to not not just thinking on on process there if you probably adopting on February 1st is going to be too late because the warning has to be adopted and this is part of the warning the board could entertain a motion to adopt this for the town attorney's final review with that with that item there that the board could sign it if there's any changes that would be better instead of even calling a special care sure sounds like I should make the motion then since I caused I'll move to adopt a necessity resolution help me out here as reviewed by the town attorney and as presented as present no I'm sorry I'm going to strike what I just said adopt to it move to adopt a necessity resolution as reviewed and and anything or just reviewed fine as presented and reviewed as presented and reviewed by the town attorney for the issuance of indebted indebtedness I'm not going to be able to say that right in order to finance the purchase of a new ambulance thank you thank you all those who think we can say hi hi hi okay so it's not the panel it's the ultimate piece about this I've been built to all these components signed in town meeting warning I've shared a draft with the board the last couple of weeks I've got a final version of it to consider tonight one piece is the legislature and the governor did sign on Friday the law that would allow same as last year for a fully remote virtual hearing as opposed to an in-person component of town meeting I've made this draft consideration reflective of those elements it would be the same structure we had last year for a town meeting should the board want to move forward with this approach we can talk about the logistics as we get closer should the the board may want to meet in this room but have the engagement all virtual so we didn't end up with a room full of people or the board could join from home or some board members could join here but however you want to logistically structure it the the big thing would be to whether to be in the gym or not be in the gym and this this reflects not being in the gym at all or the auditory any thoughts on this or questions for you gym versus town meeting room I mean so it's not really I mean we're going to do it I mean virtual primarily like we may be in attendance but there will not be community members in attendance exactly the public would have to join remotely yes okay no matter where the board wanted so I don't I don't particularly care where we mean it's probably logistically easiest to do it here because all the equipment's here right yeah yeah this is for the purpose of the warning the public yeah they can only log in at this link right okay that part I'm sorry I didn't understand so yes then it makes sense to hold it here yeah which is but that's not but that's not you don't need to have any of that language yeah all right so if the chair would entertain in motion yes I'd move to adopt the official warning for the public information hearing and town meeting vote by Australian ballot to be held on February 28th and March 1 2022 and second I'm sorry I do I have a question it's I think it's an arrogant surely question on article number four it says shall the voters authorize the purchase of an ambulance for an amount not to exceed 280 grand for a term of not to exceed seven years and as I read that I'm wondering does does that motion that article need to mention that the way in which the ambulance will be purchased or financed would be issuance of a general obligation bond or is the language there sufficient it's sufficient I don't know that's the same question for the town attorney but we wouldn't issue a bond we would do short-term borrowing from a bank but the same question he said this conforms the statute perfect thank you great minds think alike thank you for respecting on the voice yes not always been favorite of what you say I I any of those moving on we're at the appointment to the town uh volunteer boards of the energy committee okay and it's a fine way to uh give me your three uh top contenders uh for the position I will enter them on my chart and we'll see who ends up hopefully we'll have it well we'll have at least three that will end up with the highest total and we'll see where I go from there so who would like to start off with the there are three I can start um I Maria Gingriss um Matt Wood and Sharon Gutwin for my three tell me the second one Matt Wood yeah so Gingrass Goodwin and Wood okay those are going around the table and I also had Gingriss I'm Wood and then I had Gibson okay and Ted Maria Gingriss Andy Herberg and Dar Gibson Dar Gibson and Jeff well unfortunately I when I say I have just two it doesn't mean I won't have three but I'm going to start with the two which is Maria and and Dar and it's because of they just bring what I think is incredible experience and one of which it's almost like it's a PhD of experience to the committee and that's wonderful because I had I think having that technical um capability on that committee will be um will be very helpful the trouble the reason I'm having trouble with the third person is because um I'm thinking this is somebody who I want on some other aspect that they can bring not a technical aspect and that's more difficult for me to evaluate amongst all these candidates all of which I could choose um so where to go with that fourth candidate and I'm really really struggling with that because I don't know how to choose um uh one over the other what is it one over the other by well that's okay we only have two people left at this moment um we have Gibson and Gingriss we all agree that got the most votes Maria got five Dar got four uh Gonzalez got zero Gutman got one Herbert got two Roy and Quinn got zero and Wood got two so we have a decision to make between it looks like the Herbert or what I'm sorry I was not uh Wood was in in the running for me so it's not like I'm opposed to Matt Wood's candidacy in any way um so I I was thinking uh Andy Herbert because um I like what he said about being in marketing and using it to convince customers that they were the best partner they could have and he noticed the business insulation pool was lower I also like the fact that Matt uh Wood had a lot of uh outreach uh and experience it if not directly relevant it was also uh close to being directly relevant yeah that's what that put appeal to me about Matt's Matt as well is that um you know I think although his areas of scientific expertise were not necessarily you know part for part on items on the energy plan I feel that ultimately um you know there's some opportunity for kind of thinking outside the box for for additions to you know things and he had some some good ideas with that but also I think um bringing the piece of of education and and what not to um the committee would be really helpful so I could go with Matt Wood. Other thoughts? I'm happy to confirm um I like what you know when he said you know I've had to present complex and controversial issues in public hearings um and at first I'm like yes so but then he he explained about how that helps him be an advocate for um what it is the committee comes up with and and being able to help explain that um to the public so again and I I was wrong we have one person to choose out of six remaining candidates and that's always tough to do especially when there's nobody here I think I would say no to all right I'll go back to that question I asked because it was kind of a loaded question because they all they all passed the test I'm not looking for anybody to come in with their own agenda um I'm looking for a team player and I think a lot of things can be done in parallel and I think you know Matt spoke to that as well as others um but I do think um you know everybody had definitely things to offer so that was not an easy choice to pick three but alone this last one but I'm he was he was on my list I'm sticking with that too sounds like we have three it does it looks like uh the consensus is to um for Wood, Jean Grass and Gibson and I would suggest that since we did alphabetical order to on the last uh people that we pointed that we do reverse uh order on this time we'll recommend Wood for the 22 appointment and the other two for the 24 appointments so I need a motion to that effect or not okay I'll try that here we go all right so move to appoint uh Matt Wood to the town energy committee for unexpired three-year term through June 30th 2022 and Maria Jingress to the town energy committee for unexpired three-year term through June 30th 2024 and move to appoint dark Gibson to the town energy committee for an unexpired three-year term through June 30th 2024 it was your second discussion of the motion if not all those in favor of the motion say aye. Aye. Any opposed? Roughly members of the report. And I can go through this very quick I'm thinking I handed out the November finance report this evening um surely could walk through that next next meeting that we would like to do for tonight um OSHA ETS the supreme court blocked it so the town won't have that policy decision to to consider at this stage um I can send out via email too but I'm anticipating a possible executive session at the next meeting and we could we could start that meeting earlier for executive sessions so I can send out an email so everyone can check their calendar see if that may work for them um then the police departments receive the $205,000 Homeland Security grant for new radios we had a tree fall on the pump station at River Cove Road made a couple foot diameter hole in the roof it's all fine get it's a not effective pump station at all but if you hear anything uh my brief report this evening as it's late is there any other business to attend to tonight well the thing I have is there's no meeting next week one quick thing for me um I submit to the discussion about the firefighters once the town meeting is is done and we know if the budget has been adopted or not I would like to have a discussion about whether to fund the energy planner starting in fiscal year 2022 versus 2024 I think the appropriate time for that would be at our next meeting okay if we can get the uh well hopefully it'll give time for staff to update a job description that we had before to give an estimated cost uh to uh of of the position and analysis of where we're going to find the money great perfect thank you so there's no other business I'll call it we're adjourned I don't know what I'm going to do with my Tuesday night the only thing keeping me off the streets the the warning and the uh mask rule are certain