 Welcome to Toffy TV today and delighted to be joined by former Everton captain and top football pundit now. Don't hudges and don't, how are you? I'm all good mate, I'm all good. Can we have some positivity today? Can we try and park all the negative? You're going to bring it, you're bringing it, you're bringing the positivity. Everton have announced shewn ddaish, well it will be announced today as the new manager. What are your initial thoughts on that one? It feels right to me, I think of all the candidates, I think Daigiel come in, he knows the game, he knows what system he wants to play. I don't think he'll take any prisoners with the players and that's a good thing. I think of the candidates, I thought Bielsa, Bielsa's never ever took a job at this point, he's crazy, he's always took a job in the summer. So I think where Everton's a little bit chaotic at the minute, if you throw Bielsa into the mix and more fuel to that fire, it would just feel as though the whole place would just be nuts. That's taken nothing away from him because I love him as a manager, I just don't think this is the right time for him. So I think out of the candidates, Ancelot, he was never a manager in my opinion, with no experience, he can't lob him into a relegation battle at a club, that's, you know, this influx. Yeah, there's just so much going on, he might be a good coach, but how did he get the player? So of all the nominees for the job, I think Daigiel get the players going, I think he'll talk well to the press, I think he'll get the fans on side, it feels good to me. Do you think if this would have been a summer recruitment drive, that the candidates may have been different? Because it's obviously, if you're a manager of any short or even if you're a manager who's got a good reputation when you're out of work at the moment, this job looks a tough job, middle of the season, three wins all season, joint bottom basically, not a lot of money to throw at it at all. It's a better, it seems to me like your evidence, maybe evidence list would have been better in the summer, had it been that, better maybe not the way but more diverse, and that's why it is Sean Dice right now. I think that's fair, I think if you look at how big the Premier League and the pull of the Premier League is, when you look at two of the sides that were in the bottom three or close to it, Wolves and Aston Villa, and then went and got Lopeteggy and Unai Embry who were very, very good managers, brilliant managers if you like. So if you fast forward say four or five months and have it and survive, then there might be a Thomas Tuchel that might take the job, there might be a Pochettino that might take the job, so the standard that candidate would be a lot higher. It's just difficult for a Thomas Tuchel and a Pochettino because as it stands they're probably not going to come to Evan, which we find a great gem because we know how big the club is, but we also recognise the situation and they don't want a relegation on their CV. So it feels right to me, even if it's Dice on a short term, even if it's Dice for four months and you give them a couple of million quid if we survive happy days, then you might move on or you might set a Dice, there's two or three years, let's see what you can do. Forget about four or five year plan, ever need something that's going to be settled, everything's a little bit calm for a season or two, so that's why I think it's just massively important. We know, especially going into a new stadium, a brand new stadium, it has to be. No, it's like Newcastle talk last season, everyone was taking a mic at a Newcastle last season, oh you're going to have the best stadium in the championship. Everyone's looking at a Newcastle, don't want that to happen, then when Eddie Howe come in, Evan have got to survive, they can't go into a new stadium in the championship. No, and you're right to suppose, when you're looking at it from that perspective, that is probably first and foremost on the club's mind, isn't it? There's obviously new ground next season, you know, the end of next season, they're hoping to move into that new stadium and while it isn't, you know, Everton, as poor as it's been so far, it's still only a win off 14th place, so it's not as if the 10-12 point of drift already, it is going to take a big effort, they're going to have to win double the amount of games, what they've won all season, so it's going to take a big effort to do it, but maybe, yeah. It needs a big effort, and it needs a big effort from the players, the players have got to respond, I mean, you know, Frank knew he was going to be under pressure when he was one winning 14, that's it. He knew he was going to be under pressure, but I think the way Frank handled himself this season, but more so last season, and he got all the fans, and I'll never forget the Crystal Palace game. I mean, I was commentating on the game, and I promise you, I was nearly in tears, because I think at half time Everton were gone, buried, and then somehow they got a win and galvanised, and the fans were amazing, so I think any sort of message to the Everton fans, and I know it's difficult, and I know I'm in the minority, but try and park the negativity just for like, I don't know, just till the end of the season, I know you can't forget what's going on, but if it's negativity, it's not going to help Sean Dyche, it's not going to help the new manager. He's going to be up against it, the players are still going to be the players, so we can try and get some positive energy into Dyche's team talks, into the players that need to perform better and need to stay fit. And Everton got a chance, listen, I said on ESPN the other day about Arsenal, we were talking about the title race, and I said, you know what, I said, what are Arsenal's difficult tests? And they've passed some, you know, they drew against Newcastle, they beat Tottenham in the North London Derby, then they just beat Man United, and I said, I guarantee you one of their next tests is Everton at Goodison, because there might be a new manager, there might be a new manager bounce, there might be a new, there will be, if obviously Dyche takes the job, he'll be a new voice, new system, players playing for the badge again. So that might be a difficult game, but it might be a good game for Everton, because what you don't want when you bot in the league, I've been there myself, what you don't want is you don't want a Southampton, because it's all or nothing, it's like all the losers are going down, and it feels like Everton have had that fixture about three or four times in the last two or three months, more swing games, more swing games, and lost them. What you can do is you can have all the adrenaline and take all that, there's no team talk needed really for Dyche. Arsenal, come on, you're playing top the league, go and rattle them, go and get in amongst them, get the crowd on the side, make it intimidating for them, that's I think the team talk you'll give for that game. So Everton have got a chance, even though it's rock bottom nearly versus top. No, I think you'd like to be in good shape, and it's an early kick off as well, sometimes you can catch those good sides, a little bit cold, and the atmosphere. I think what I would say is, even though there is a movement, people aren't happy with the board or with the owner, the support for the team has still been there, and I think regardless of whether that carries on, it will carry on to be honest on, I think where the fan base is, or it seems to be, it wouldn't speak for everyone of course, is that the board are at the point of no return, so I don't think that's going to ease, but what I do know is that the support will be there for the manager and for the players. I guess that's the, while that game is going on, and beforehand when the players are getting ready to come out, that's critical isn't it, that continues, cos you know having played at Goddison, that if the crowd are up for it and create that electricity, it can get us wins, even when they're unlikely can. I always class Everton as a very classy football club, and I didn't like the scenes when I seen the fans chasing Jeremy, and I didn't like that, and that's the minority, that's some idiot looking for two minutes of fame, and it was awful, but it's probably been a part of Anthony Gordon not turning off the training the last couple of days trying to push away for a movie, I think, and I've been here 11 years, like I love Everton, and Everton fans are going, yeah, yeah, yeah, but he should be training, he should be playing, totally true, and they all should be, they should all be playing for Everton and playing for the badge, and obviously the fans and their personal pride, but that's just the message I would give, if trying to have some positivity, there's been lots of negativity I think in the last 10 days, two weeks, if not a little bit longer, and rightly so, you've got to try and protest, but protest peacefully, I didn't really like true or false, I don't know the scenario, the situation, but I didn't like how some of the board were told to stay away from Goodison, I didn't think that was a good look when the cameras panned on the seats, and there was no board members there, I thought, come on, this is not Everton, you know, I'm a very positive guy, you know me, I'm always half full, and everyone needs to stick together here, board members, even if it's a short period of time, board members, fans, players, manager, because it's imperative Everton survive this season. Yeah, it is, and then obviously that affects what's going on going forward, and I think just going back to Sean Dyke, he's obviously the big story, and that's what we're talking about, the 4-4-2 comes back out, you know, we've not seen that for a while. What's the worst system in the world, by the way? No, no, listen, listen, it's whatever, systems, you will know this being a player you are, systems are great, but players will still have to run, players have to tackle, players have to take the chance when they come along and drop into spaces, I'm quite sure managers set you up in certain formations, but actually when you're on the pitch, it changes anyway, doesn't it? There's a great quote I think I've seen on social media on Instagram, and it was cluffy and I'm paraphrasing, I can't remember it exactly, but he said systems mean absolutely nothing, players will get you the sack. So it's, it's, you know, it's true, and what I would say about 4-4-2, and I've said this and I'll stand by it, when you're in a dogfight, I think in the Bop the League, the easiest system to play for players is a 4-4-2. So you've got a right back and a right winger, there's your relationship, you've got two centre backs relationship, left back, left wing out relationship, two in the middle of the park, two up from, so you know exactly what's going on, what you don't need. You know, let's just, let's just say Davide Ancelotti come in and he had these grand ideas of playing a diamond or some fancy sort of system, players began like, am I meant to be here, am I meant to be there, awesome, I'll bop with us around the pitch, I'm not sure we won't, that you'll just go 4-4-2, right winger versus left back, left winger, right back. It's almost like a little bit man for man, I feel like, but not a Bielsa man for man, but you know your jobs, like if I'm going into the Arsenal game, I'm saying to my midfield partner, whoever it is, I'm saying, right, I'm taking Thomas Partey today, you do Granite Jacker, that's what we'll do, and that's what Dijewel will want from these players, man for man, you get the better out of him, you get the better out of him, we've got a chance to win in the game, and that's how it should be, so I think a 4-4-2 approach, even though, you know, even though it's classed, I think there's a little bit of a dinosaur system, it's not, Lordiola's played 4-4-2, they've all done it, just having died you get this unfair rap. Do you think, just on the back of that as well obviously, I mean, first and foremost, the amount of times Everton's strike is isolated, Dominic Alder-Lewin, a lot of time when we play the 4-3-3 is just isolated on his own anyway, no one's close to him, so maybe having, you know, whoever it is alongside him, whether it's Ellis Sims, whether it's Neil Maupai, whether it's another midfielder breaking, and it's almost a 4-4-1-1, having someone close to him will help him, but do you think, do you think with regards to Shaun Dij, because he was at Burnley and he didn't have a very big budget and he did well to keep them in the league and stuff, has he got the capability to be a little bit more expansive do you think, and to develop what do you think? Yeah, I think so, I think, listen, I've listened to Shaun Dij on different platforms, I've listened to him on Sky, I've listened to him talk about the game, and he's more or less saying he can't say it because he respects the Burnley players that he played that was playing under him, so obviously there's a level of respect there, but he's more or less saying, listen, I can only provide a system where the players can implement that plan, there's no point in me playing a diamond if we haven't got a number 10, so when I looked at Dominic Calvert-Lewin's form under Ancelotti a couple of seasons back, and I think Ancelotti got him performed, and I think it was one of the Italian track as a comment was, and much of it was in Zagliau, but it was, and he said he'd done his best finishing when he was finishing first time, and he took it on board and he was finishing first time wasn't he, but where Dominic Calvert-Lewin was, he was in the 18-yard box, now if we said like Duncan Ferguson for example, and Duncan was playing, the last place Duncan wants to be is on the half-way line trying to link the play, he wants to be in the box, so you've got to play the people's strengths and Dominic Calvert-Lewin, while he's trying to nurse himself back to full fitness, match fitness, he needs to do less run and probably chasing people down, and that's where the system comes into play, don't chase the right back down, let your left winger do that, don't chase the right side of player down, let your winger do that, you just take care of getting all of the ball, taking the team higher up the pitch, getting crossed in the box, winning head of scoring goals, simplify the game for him. One of the, you just mentioned it there, you know, Carlo Antelotti did play 4-4-2, he had to see Alison and Dominic Calvert-Lewin alongside him and that's when obviously scoring goals as well, so he did go up to that as well, Carlo at times, two try, I guess two try to get evident into a bit of a rhythm and you know, be a little bit more solid and I guess that's where we are at your own day. How important as well, don't obviously the transfer window closes on Tuesday and it is difficult, I think it's difficult to get players to come in when A, you've got no manager, and B obviously in evidence predicament and C, I guess you're not throwing a big thrown of money at it as well. How important do you think it is that Everton get a couple of new faces in, even if it is to just create that little bit of energy and that positivity you were talking about before? I think it's pretty big that you get players in, but in my opinion I think it's more important you don't lose any. You can answer it better than me because obviously you're on the ground there in Merseyside, I'm obviously down in London. But what would be the scenario from the Everton fans if say Dyche got old of Anthony Gordon, put an arm around him and said come on, like we need you, and he got in playing. Would the Everton fans take to him straight away to be okay with that because I know there's a lot being said but at the same time the club's bigger than any player. So that might be Sean Dyche's priority actually getting some of the players like Anthony Gordon playing again because he's a top young player. There's a reason why in Newcastle I want to play 50 million quid for him. I've got the talent. Again, just reading and taking the temperature, certainly on social media and we have to remember social media is a small percentage of fans. But a lot of people are kind of feel like he's burnt his bridges with everything now and they go by staying away. I think he did just being a training. They wouldn't have even been really an issue. People might have been a bit frustrated with him. Come on, you can do more because he hasn't had a good season forever and that's just a fact. He's not being what he was last season. I think staying away from training makes it very difficult. Personally I still think he may well move over the weekend. I think they may well do a deal but you're a better place than me to say this. You've been a captain of everything. Do you remember when Howard Kendall was there and he signed Mitch Ward and Carl Tyler? Other fans weren't particularly happy that he signed in shipmanship players. But I was on the phone to Howard every five minutes going, What? You're taking Mitch Ward and Carl Tyler and you're leaving me behind. Any chance? It took him three months to sign him. Any danger gaffer? He's probably realised after a bit. I remember when Carl Tyler and Mitch Ward signed, I remember the murmurings were like, What's happening? We're not signing Premier League players, this is from the Everton fans. I think that he's going to have to be creative. If he doesn't feel as though Anthony Gordon's heart in it, Then sell it to Newcastle or Chelsea, who wants to pay the biggest transfer fee, then use that money, But it's got to be done sharpish. It has to be done sharpish because the windows closed in a couple of days time. So he's going to have to be creative. It is. I guess I know what your answer is going to be, but do you think Everton can get out of this? Definitely. 100%. It's pretty obvious and it's pretty bog standard. When players were in a relegation battle, I was anyway when you were in a relegation battle. My thought process was, all we need is back-to-back wins and you see what's happened to Aston Villa. Not so much wolves, but they've won a game or two under the new manager. Villa think of won three straight wins away from home. If you can imagine a league table with six points on it, all of a sudden it looks healthy. Granted fixtures coming up Aston Liverpool look horrendous on paper. But there's a way out of it for sure. I promise you there's a way out of this. 15 points, 25, 30. I mean, you'd be looking at what, 35 I think? 35, 36. I went down with West Ham with 42 Premier League record. I definitely think there's a way out of this for Everton. Back-to-back wins. It might not be the next couple of weeks and I'd like to think this team's like Bournemouth. Even though Forest have had a little spurt, this team's like Bournemouth. This team's like Southampton in my opinion are worse than Everton. It's just we need some results. It's the goals, isn't it, as well? Obviously, we just simply haven't scored enough goals. I think this is one thing that maybe Sean Dice will do. Obviously, you've watched this team for a number of years now. We've got one of the best headers of the ball in the Premier League for sure and probably in Europe on his day. I'm going to call the looing. I imagine Sean Dice will be encouraging more crosses into the box. More shots because if there was a criticism of Frank Llanparg, Everton were too passive in and around the final third for me. That wasn't enough. He wanted to play. Wherever at the minute, they might just need a little bit and it sounds crude and it sounds old-fashioned, but they might just need to lump it and they might need to smash it into the channel. Put Arsenal under pressure, play from there, then you can play all the stuff. I think also as well with Dychey working with Tarkovsky, Dwight McNeill, Michael Keane and other ones. He knows the individuals, so he knows how to push their buttons, whether they need a bollogin or two. He'll know a lot of the players. I couldn't imagine Bielsa going in and playing murder ball with Seamus Coleman at nearly 50 at right back and James Tarkovsky and Cody Orwell, amazing professionals. I just couldn't see that working. Dychey, I think it's the right fit for me. I'll let you go then, Don. You always bring the positivity, that's what I like. You do, and it's good. I've been saying it, even though it's frustrating and even though it looks right now like we're spinning one way, like you've just said, there are positive results, a fresh pair of eyes could spin it the other way and it is a case of everything, just bike hook or biker hook and see what happens in the summer. Hang in there. Hang in there. Be positive. Absolutely. Don, thank you very, very much for joining us and great to see you and speak to you as always, mate. Stop, man. There you go. Let us know what you think in the comments section below. Are you with Don? A positivity? Can evidence survive? Give us some less sleepless nights so we can just enjoy a nice night's sleep and the work starts here. The new evidence manager are you behind them? What can you do forever in Football Club? Thanks for watching.