 think-tech Hawaii's law across the sea program, across the sea of time. There's been a dramatic rise in hate and violence in the world recently. Adviceiveness seems to be the trend. The recent events have made me think about growing up, how I grew up in Hawaii. There was so much diversity, but inclusiveness was normal. Most of my professional legal career in Hawaii has involved dealing with clients and other lawyers across the sea, all over the world. Diversity and inclusiveness were normal in my professional and personal lives. Recently, I came across my class photo taken in 1961, when I was a fifth grader at Kapalama Elementary School. I felt a connection between the diversity and inclusiveness I found in Kapalama and my professional and personal lives. I also thought there might be lessons for the world to learn from that class photo. Two of my fifth grade classmates were Bill Wise and Henry Chalk. In this next photo, I've circled our faces. I'm in the front row, right in the middle. Bill is on the left side of the third row, and Henry is fourth in on the left side in the same row. I circled the faces so you could see who we were in those days. We were all good buddies. We'd walk across the Kapalama campus together. We were different, diverse, but we all accepted each other. Henry and Bill accepted me, and although I was this immigrant Canadian boy, I felt like I was a local boy. I still do. Now after the fifth grade, we all went to different schools. Bill went to Kamehameha, Henry, St. Louis. I went to Punahoe, and many of our classmates from Kapalama went to Farrington. Now, although over 60 years has passed, our friendship with Bill and Henry myself has endured. Henry is a retired sales agent, a route sales agent, and lives in Spokane, Washington. Bill is a farmer, lives in Wahewa on Oahu. I've recently reconnected with both of them. When Henry returned to Hawaii for a visit, there's a photo of us at the restaurant when we had lunch together. Henry and Bill are my guests today. I'd like to welcome them. Aloha, guys. How are you? Aloha, Mark. How are you? Aloha, Mark. Good, good. I'm glad we're all together. I know you're all busy, and let's get to it. I wanted to ask you both to share your memories and what you've learned from attending Kapalama Elementary School during our very formative years in the 1960s. Bill, let's start with you. What are your memories of attending Kapalama Elementary School in the 60s? Well, thanks, Mark. There are many memories, and I think one of the memories that stand out for me is exactly this topic that you've chosen, the kinds of people that we were with, different kinds of people, that diversity, and that includes the teachers that we had throughout our elementary years, from me, from kindergarten through sixth grade there at Kapalama. All those teachers were wonderful, and of course, our fellow students certainly helped me to actually understand what learning was all about, and because of these relationships, I actually enjoyed learning, especially math and science, those two things I really enjoyed. The diversity was there, and the inclusiveness was certainly there, but I don't think we thought about it very much then because it all felt so natural, and that's what I think about. Right, yeah. Henry, what are your thoughts, especially when you look at that picture, and all the different kids, what were your memories and thoughts about Kapalama Elementary School? I think we had diversity, it was obviously, again, in reminiscing and looking at that picture. Quite a lot of differences, but in the public school system, you're living in a particular area. You see all of these people in your neighborhood, so you're familiar with that, and then going to school and studying together and playing together, and the teachers was a big part of that, including everyone and teaching us and being fair. We came from homes where we're taught to respect your elders, so when you went to school, your teacher was one of your elders, and I think they had an easier time for teaching because we grew up, the neighborhood grew up together, kids knew each other, and it started with respect, maybe for each other, but also for elders and our teachers, so that I think they had an easier time teaching us and working with us as young children. You both mentioned teachers, and who was our teacher? In the 5th grade, Hoboki? Is that how you? Yeah, she was really nice, and all the teachers were really nice, and she's over on the right-hand side there, and they didn't scold you. I mean, they made you learn lessons by just talking, it seems, and you learned the right thing to do without being put on the spot, right? Henry? I think so. I liked my 5th grade teacher. She was very, very nice. It seemed like she was nice. Just always have a smile. You felt comfortable around her, and she worked with everyone. There's 34 in that class. There's a lot of students to just be, you know, so I think it was a mutual thing where we as students were students, and it was a little easier time to be there and listen to her direction. She was a very, I think she was cool at that time. And you're both right. I mean, we didn't, we just thought this was normal. We accepted the way it was. Bill, you know, there were a lot of kids, was there any talk about race or religion or anything like that in any of our classes that you can remember? No, I can't remember any negative words about someone's religion, nor about someone's race. Now, I know here in Hawaii, we always tease each other. You know, the Hawaiians get teased or something. The Portuguese, of course, get teased for other things. And the Chinese, Japanese, the Haudenys, all the stuff. But none of that came into play that I can remember. Nobody was singled out specifically because of their race, nor do I remember people getting singled out because they look different or they may have had some kind of handicap. I don't know what the handicap might have been, but people who might have actually been different were never treated that way, especially in the classroom. That part I remember. In the classroom, Ms. Luboki, she obviously had some kids that were quite quick to learn things, and other kids who maybe took a while to learn a particular subject matter. But she never, that I remember, she never had anybody stand out. She acted like we were all trying to learn something together and she treated us that way. Yeah, all of us kids, we were treated equal. I mean, that's a lesson there, I think. I mean, if everybody went to that class, maybe a lot of this divisiveness and violence that we're facing nowadays, the world's not won't be perfect, but maybe that would have helped. Henry, I mean, taking a look at the picture again, are there any kids in that photo that you remember that stand out to you also? Well, you know, there's three guys that lived close to where I lived that we kind of walked the school together, walked home together after school. One was Alfred O'Brew, and his mom was a Cubscott leader, so I was involved in Cubscott with him. And he's Portuguese. There's a Wilford Martin who is Filipino, and he lived on the block away from my house, so we went on over there and then my house was the closest to the school, so we gathered there and then head on walking to school. And then Warren Massimoni, Japanese, and he lived up the road a little bit more, but we never really were buds. We weren't really talking about, oh, you're Filipino or you're in this and you're in that. We got along and we had a good time. So yeah. Maybe if kids walked to school together, even though they were different races and different ethnicities and different religions, maybe, you know, they may not be best friends, but maybe they'd learn to live together in peace and harmony some way, or at least not in such a violent world. I remember John Coma, Karen Ng, Linda G, Milton Juan, Lloyd Watanabe, all of those folks and others. I mean, we were just, we just got along and it was being all together. I think. Bill, what are your thoughts? Well, especially in recess time, you got to interact with kids in a totally different way as opposed to being in the classroom. So I used to try and hang out with the guys that were fast and Johnny Calma, Lloyd Watanabe, those guys, they were always the quick guys. And I wanted to hang out with them because I wanted to learn how to run fast. But I also hung out with other people because they had different skills. Some guys could play basketball. Now, we never had real baskets. I don't know if you remember, we had a post with a thing that looked like a metal basket on top with chains on it that replaced, that would be in place of the laces that they have on baskets now. But it wasn't, it didn't even resemble a basket like kids have today, but there were like four or five of them in the playground. So we play basketball and that, basketball, you're close to each other. And that introduced me to how people take care of themselves when they're stressed. And then the other thing that you mentioned was walking to and from school. That was a big deal because every morning you'd catch up with different people. I never left home exactly the same time ever. I rarely made it to school. I never either. But as you walk to school, you'll meet somebody else walking along the way to school. And you'd be with them for like five or 10 minutes, maybe not saying much, but oftentimes having a short conversation about something and learning about them and you learn about yourself too. I loved the walking to and from school. That was, that was always good. Yeah. And, and maybe that's the way you learn to live with people. Like Henry was saying too, just, just walking with them and talking as you say. Now, we all, we all went to different schools after Kapalama. And those schools competed in football, basketball, you name it, especially football, basketball. Now, I, when I went, you know, I was in Punahou and, and yet when I, when we had games against St. Louis or Kamehameha, I'd kind of, I'd still feel good about you guys. I'd still feel like you might be over there or, you know, playing or somehow involved. I didn't feel animosity, even though we were competing. I mean, did you have any feelings? Also, Farrington, Farrington, the same thing. A lot of our classmates went to Farrington. So do you, do you have any, Henry, do you have any thoughts about it? Do you feel the same way or did that Kapalama experience help you in that respect? Well, I think Kapalama helped. Oh, the one on the front, because you weren't from a particular neighborhood. You were from, could have been from that whole island, from parts of the island. We even had some classmates that were from Maui that were attending St. Louis. And, you know, there was a diversity. There was a military presence of students from the military base that would come to school at St. Louis. So we, you know, it was a bigger, bigger diversity. So, you know, the diversity that we learned to learn in and play with when we're young at Kapalama should help, would have, did help learning the different diversities as I went to St. Louis. Bill, how about Kamehameha? I mean, you kind of think of Kamehameha being all Hawaiian, but was there any diversity or how did you feel? How did Kapalama help you there? Well, Kapalama certainly helped because there were, there were so many different ethnicities at Kapalama. And the same actually held true for Kamehameha. There were guys with Japanese last names, Filipino last names, and guys that totally looked like probably guys, but they were like half Hawaiian or something like that. It was just incredible. But because at a young age in elementary school, we were exposed to people that were different, but because we never treated them differently as we go to high school and then onto college, you learn to just see like right through their skin or right through whatever it is we're looking at and wonder, what is this person really like? Now, oftentimes you don't get an opportunity to come to get really close to somebody, but because of the experience at Kapalama, I was willing to like just be open for myself to be open and then think that somebody, the person I was speaking to, I think he's open too. Why would it be anything else, right? He would be just as open as I am. And so conversations could flow between people. And that's what happened. Conversations were able to flow between people that I met at Klamel. And obviously, we all still have friends from high school that we still keep in touch with. Especially Puno, St. Louis, Klamel, the alumni associations are pretty strong and everybody kind of keeps in touch one way or another. And the interesting thing that you mentioned is that inclusion was normal. I mean, because of our experience, the three of us had this experience where even though people looked different and maybe even talked different and were different, but it may not have been perfect and it may not have been wonderful, but we included everybody regardless of the diversity. That was what I found was very helpful, especially as I got into my professional life as a lawyer because it just was normal. I mean, inclusion was normal. I didn't think twice about it. But how about you guys? You know, Henry, in your professional life, you're on the mainland now. Have you found any connection there with your Capalama education and what you've done in your job? It's kind of funny because I went to California first and they really weren't sure whether I was Mexican or Indian or whatever. And so that was always interesting because as we got talking and learning more about each other, I got to play football there. So I hung around with the football team. So that was kind of a natural where we were able to share where we were from. Easier opening conversation, obviously, just through sports and being together all the time. But even during classes, once they found out I was from Hawaii, things kind of changed. They're a little more open. They wanted to know more about Hawaii. That was exactly the same when I moved to Spokane, Washington in 72. They weren't sure if I was Alaska or Indian or Black or what I was, but they actually started conversations when you're from and all of this. So it just made it a lot easier because we were used to that. We were not in Capalama and the grants through high school and now you're here in a different country. But you know, state, what I'm talking about, and different diversity. So it's one of you learning as well as them learning each other. So communication was open. You wanted to know. That's what made it easier. So yeah, that helped me. And just I think having that background and that education and just accepting others made it a lot easier for that conversation to happen. Now, Bill, do you think this is just, I mean, you both kind of said maybe because we're from Hawaii, I think. Is it just because we are from Hawaii? Is that what this is about? Or is this something that can be broader? Bill? It can be broader, I'm sure, but because I'm from Hawaii and I think because we're all from Hawaii, we're kind of prejudice to think that there's something special here. I do think that. I do think that there is something special here where we are a lot easier on other people regarding accepting them or not. You know, I was in the fire department for about almost 20 years and I boarded that commandment out. So when you get into the fire department, you board for 10 days for 10 days a month. He's sleeping there in the quarters. And it's not, you don't have a choice about whether you're going to get along with people. You have to get along with people because these other guys want to know that on the job you have their back. You can't be thinking twice about that. You all have to have trust in each other. And so if you, like we did, if you had come from a background where you trusted people, where people trusted you, and that's, I really did get that from a couple of just without being reluctant, just trusting people, it made my career in the department a whole lot easier for me. There's one other thing I was thinking about as Henry was talking about this idea that the atmosphere as we were growing up, that made it feel that in spite of the fact that we were so diverse, in spite of that fact, there is inclusion. And the two things that struck me in our generation was one, the world of Second World War had ended what, well, 13 years, which is a short period of time, 12, 13 years prior to our being in the third, fourth, fifth grade. And that had changed the world. A lot of people looked at the world differently after the Second World War. And thank goodness we won that. And the other thing that happened right as we were at Kalpalama, I think it was in the third grade, statehood. So we were now going to be, as far as statehood was concerned, in spite of the fact that Hawaii was different, we as a state were going to be included in this great country. We were included as a territory for sure, but it was so nice to know that the United States was going to accept us and become a part of the great country that we're privileged to live in. You know, we have a couple minutes left. And I kind of want to close on taking another look at that photo, that class photo. I want to ask you both, you know, we were all different, but we were, we just walked down the campus together. We played together. We lived together. We didn't have any prejudice. And again, I'm not saying the world is perfect, but is there something that we can all learn? Henry, start with you and Bill then after that. But what can the world learn from the Kalpalama Elementary School photo and education that we have? Henry? I think the inclusiveness and being able to talk to each other, communication, you know, communication, actually speaking as we're speaking and looking at each other's face. I don't know. And, you know, computers and phones and texts and, you know, social media has taken a lot of face-to-face communication. The fact that people knew I was from Hawaii opened the conversation. For that conversation to continue, I needed to find out where this gentleman was from, where this girl was from, and talk about them and their life and understanding where they're from and they understand where I'm from. So I take open communication. As the teachers, as our teachers taught us and included everyone, you know, we grew up in, I think, an easy fun time because we're able to enjoy so many things that just being around each other, just playing, you know, the basketball, the kind of hoop we had and all that kind of thing. But, you know, the teachers made that available, the students, we got along. That picture, I laughed because I look at it and I look at the dress of the student and the girls, how firm and proper they were in their dresses. And the guys, some of them had shoes, some of them didn't have shoes. But, you know, we're not for recess. We got along. We had a good time. And, you know, I still remember their names, just like Bill remembers names, you remember names. And, you know, trying to get in touch with them and talk to them and try to find out where they're at. You kind of got that rolling. So, yeah, I need to continue to do that. So, thank you, Mark. Bill, what about you? What can the world learn? I mean, I heard what Henry said and that is, we learn about that we're different, but that enhances the conversation. Bill, what are your thoughts? I think it absolutely does enhance the conversation. But it makes me think that, you know, the Lord's been good to all of us and he includes us in his kingdom. And for now, where I'm in my life, I'm realizing that having a place where you feel comfortable, be it elementary school, college, or as we were an adult, it's so comforting to be in a place where you know you're accepted for who you are. And I think maybe in our culture now, kids are either they're trying to become adults too quickly or adults are trying to make kids grow up too quickly. I sure would appreciate it if children just are allowed to be children and grow up in the manner in which we grew up. I think that would be fantastic. And that was growing up together, even though we were different, diverse, we included each other. And thank you. Aloha, my Papalama, fifth grade classmates. I appreciate you very much. Thank you for talking about this. I wish the world could live and go to school as we did in the fifth grade at Kapalama. I think it would help out a lot. So Aloha to both of you. Aloha. Aloha, Mark. Thank you.