 I think it's interesting that you're bringing up external design versus internal teams. You know, at IBM, we are starting to build an internal design function again and higher in quite a bit. And we have been relying a lot on external, and you see that as a trend. How do you balance the, I think it's interesting that you have this external perspective versus internal design and control and creating that environment to get the right mix there? I mean, do you think about that also, or do you mostly, for some of you, keep the design function in-house? What's the right environment and mix to get to the right level of design? I think also to add to that is that when you do it internally, in our case at least, you tend to enter into something we discussed before, which is linking design also to business. And we've seen that the best designers are not always the most successful business-wise. Because they're like artists, they're like real creative people. And so, I've seen, in Europe, that's a bit different from, I would say, here in America. I've seen a lot of average designers being very successful at what they do because they've got a very good business sense, which doesn't mean that's wrong. I applaud them for what they do. But they're different from the designers. We understand that the real bring something experimental to the table. Like getting to something really great. I mean, that's the one tension that I kind of always worry about is there are trends in design that, and you sort of, there's just people sort of congregate or aggregate around a trend. But how do you get to a place where you're confident enough to be yourself, to be truly different and get to that kind of differentiated greatness, I think, is kind of a question. I think about it all the time is how do you allow yourself to take that, to be confident in who you are and your point of view and let that come through in the design versus kind of, because even the business tends to be more conservative. I think we should be in this business or I think we should show up in this way, which tends to be the common denominator in the market versus the differentiated position. You posed the question as internal versus external. What fascinates me, I'll go back to what you said about, really it's about the trust that instills the vision, right? So at the end of the day, we're talking about designers and people. So if you say, well, I was at P&G or I was at Etsy, it's always neat when you hear the question, well, what years were you there? Was there phases where there was the protection of design? And you got to work on this product, or you got to work on this. And that phase represented a collection of people, internal or external, leaders that somehow built that trust to allow the design to happen. I totally agree with that. Sorry, one second, in that you see some businesses who are very keen on having everything internal, right? Like no one knows us better than we do, so we're going to build a culture and an understanding of who we are. And we're going to execute on our vision in the way that is most germane to us. And then you have other businesses where we're like, hey, we've stagnated for a while, we need to shake it up and bring in some outside thoughts and visions. And I've been in-house and I've been out of house as a consultant so many times that I've gotten to the point where I don't care how people are paid or how they're employed. The point is to get the right people in the room and to attack the problem in a way that is proper for that particular thing that is in front of the business. And yes, I think you have to look sort of long term about how you build a team and build a culture. But if you can sort of curate and maybe it's hub and spoke model or maybe it's, maybe everyone's connected and if there's a centralized vision, I'm not sure what works for every business. But bringing in all the right perspectives at the right time, I think for me has been the most successful way to do that in the past. I think with software, I mean this may be one of the interesting differences in that because you're never done with it, it's exceptionally difficult to effectively outsource, right? Because you really have to be inside of the team. It's your product, right? It's not that teams and I'm not coming in to help that team. It's there's this in the room where it goes through corporate orientation. There's a huge mural on the wall that just says, this is now your company. Because everybody comes in and they talk, those people at Facebook and Facebook Facebook. And it's like, no, it is you now. And it's really important because this is like a journey. We're kind of inventing it as we go along. And so in that kind of space, it's pretty difficult to take the core of that product experience and have people who are not inside of that kind of tribe, that family driving it. I mean that being said, if you're creating a physical object that has a finite reality, that there's a huge benefit to bringing people and their new ideas and perspectives. I agree and I think at the same time, you bring up a really interesting point, which makes me think that it's critical that we, good design and a good product have no, they don't exist. They don't exist in the absolute. So every product and within a rack of clothing at my company, between one product and another, each product has a different need for its design. I like having the flexibility based upon the business task at hand to have an internal and an external team at the ready to kind of curate based upon this business problem I'd like to put together these types of individuals. So and sometimes when you look at the challenge and you think wow, that's got a lot of engineering and technical requirements to run down your manufacturing line in five different places around the world. At the same time, I'm going to really rely upon my internal team who really understands our processes more deeply. But I'm going to bring in some people that I know that will challenge the very nature of that manufacturing line to add attention to the team. I think that being really intentional about how you introduce that tension I think can actually be get a really strong outcome. So I like the notion.