 Hello, and welcome to if everyone super chat catch up for Episode 250 for the one where we talked about art again with girls solar sands fun times We're here to check out the messages you guys put in and we're gonna we're gonna gonna answer them. It's gonna be great This is I think they got jumbled a little bit so they might be a little bit out of order, but that's okay We'll just make sure we answer them all starting with thoughts on house usher. I really enjoyed it Me too. I really enjoyed it. I thought it was me I'm very good showing by Flanagan, and he does not botch the ending boy. No, he doesn't that last episode. We were nervous We were like, oh no, please. Yeah, spoiler-free assessment is the Characters are pretty on point. It's got some twists and turns They lay a lot of groundwork for you to predict a lot of things that are probably gonna happen Yeah decent bit of poetry in how the story unfolds though from what I have heard Po po fanatics po fans are not as happy as they could be I've heard more the po fans are upset than happy that that would be the consensus. I think And this was not a huge surprise Being that Hill House fans were very upset by the haunting of Hill House I can't remember what tin of the screw fans thought of Blymana But that all I know is that Flanagan is kind of the answer to a hypothetical which is what if you ignore the source but also make a thing good and That's what you get and you know, it's a This is a guess if you're really into our Edgar Allen Poe's work I don't know that that would be a reason to recommend this. It's more so just an interesting story in of itself You'll appreciate a lot of the references and nods though. If you aren't Edgar Allen. Yeah, um, and you know I have a limited knowledge, but even I was like, oh, it's the thing. Oh, it's that I know that And and as far as I know there are people who are familiar with this work that are more than happy with this So I don't know. I mean, I'm I love his work and I'm very happy with this. So yeah, I'm one of those people So so I was gonna say that's probably as much as we would want to say without spoiling anything I recommend and we rate it, you know, it fits in with the other three I would say pretty well in terms of like, yep That's a Mike Flanagan show that has all of his regulars in it that tells a story that's full of Interesting things to say about human nature and it's got some spooks in there a good man does This season was a very spooky show. Would you recommend it for people who just want their horror? Oh, I don't know about that I don't know about that either. I feel kind of like it had some spooky stuff here and there But it didn't it like it it didn't feel like a horror show It felt like it was this thing. That's a step down from that in terms of its It was By comparison to his other shows it was more graphic. Oh Yeah, this is this is the goriest of his of the four the goriest and the most titillating I would say yes Definitely had the most of that going on. So I guess it's probably safe to be like, you know, keep in mind Viewer who's wondering if it's scary. We would rate You know this well, I don't even know what we would rate it in terms of the scary You know top-to-bottom in terms of the the three shows right midnight mess Hill House and Bligh We mostly stuck to the idea that they're complicated in terms of describing the scare factor, but that Mike doesn't do the whole like dare I say like insidious approach or Scary thing runs at you real fast and characters run around screaming and stuff It's a lot more of a slow burn usually with all of his stuff Um Though I mean there's some overt stuff and some jump skis you get you get your your drip feed of sort of Expected horror from the show. I just yeah, it's um, it's got its moments. That's for sure Yeah But it's not gonna be thrills all the time, you know a fast-paced never-ending stream of chili spooky stuff Mm-hmm But yeah, we recommend yes Do the docks a wolf Lemming calling out react streamers. Oh, let me know Loki happened and House of Usher was pretty good hell of a two weeks Also, hi rags. Hello. Yeah, we're gonna have the idea of a little lemming Making his video I just don't appreciate them. I think they're stealing. That's what I think I Worked hard every day What up lemmings eat nuts, right? I assume so they're they're rodents So I guess they eat like grasses and nuts and price whatever they can kind of find They wouldn't mind some cheese if they could get their hands on some. Oh, yeah I'm I don't mind cheese if I can get my hands on it. Yeah, Sam Your stuff Mollie play Max Payne to it's better than soma mmm I hear Max Payne to is really good. I've only played a lot of three I've only played Max Payne three as well. I would highly recommend Max Payne three I have only played Max Payne one and a lot of it. Okay. It was fun Max Payne Max Payne three is a really cool game I uh, I I'm particularly uh, because I mean, you know Usually the story is the thing that people point to right and presentation But uh, like in terms of its core gunplay, it's really like straightforward and really minimalistic, but it's solid Yes, very skill-based very cool fun Very rewarding I'd call it it feels really good to do really good in that game Especially when you're playing on the harder difficulties. Oh, yes I can't believe sniper wolf stalked jacks films on friday the 13th um Yeah, I mean that's kind of a crazy sort of development to that story, isn't it? Yeah, and I think nothing's happened yet, but uh, we'll see I think she's lost some sponsors But uh, as for anything she lost her flavor. Oh, no What's what's the thing? She lost her g fuel flavor It's one of those things where I can see someone being like, oh, so you're okay with canceling It'll just be like I can't believe that she's been able to get away with this Like in any way she actually went to his house and posted picture of it on instagram Absolutely, not case behavior anyway, um Name the star wars show that people said it's gonna be the best and Now no one remembers it. So what was the point? More stars. Oh So they've got they've got the answer in brackets, but I was actually gonna say like surely all of them apply to this Uh, I'll talk about nobie or boba fat. No one really talks about mandalorian I'm thinking can I be most fits the bill? Yeah, I would probably go with that the person who sent this put in brackets that it star wars visions um I feel like it's I don't know about I I mean, I don't hear people talk about star wars visions um But I don't know that that was one that was like massively hyped by a huge portion of You know compared to kanobi for instance Yeah, um and boba fat similarly felt like it was people were talking it big when it was coming out and then people jumped off that ship Super cool. It was about boba fat and we like boba fat Oh, boba fat is so cool. They got some remorse and he was boba fat boba fat was considered clownish Basically by the end of its run worse. It took a little bit longer for kanobi to have that uh that kind of effect like by episode seven People were not super happy with uh boba fat. I remember that much Yeah Um also do a wonka arc We'll be in the wonka arc I mean, there will be well, I guess you'd have the original the uh The the remake timburne one and the new wonka movie that's coming out to shalamet right? He's triple threat So, yeah, that's uh three wonkers. Hugh Grant is uh, he's playing uh, the umpa lupus Yeah, he's playing all of them. Yeah, he's playing the umpa lupus. Oh, we're doing that Um, all right, that was really beloved by everyone makes sense that they're doing that again Yep, uh, yeah, I suppose so. What's Hugh Grant been up to these days? Ah Listen dungeons of dragons Oh Yeah, he was he was he was pretty good at that. It was funny. Um, I mean he's charming. He's a charming guy. He is Yep Happy birthday maula. Love your fringles rags. You've grown on me. Can't wait for my vinyl threesome Oh, yeah, I'm very excited. Uh, you know be getting those later Thank you. Um Pause this till I'm caught up on episode 47 All right, fair enough. All right, we'll do We'll pause How you wrote everything after saw three I wouldn't have either I would have either a bring back jiggy and say he's a vampire Um, or be Get jiggy with it So I might say their alternative is that he's an alien trying to understand humans Oh, those are the writers Yeah, I think so, um, they get in there too, you know, give them time So all 15 I think is where we'll maybe we'll maybe crack it Can you imagine saw 15 being nominated for an academy award for best picture? No, I can't And you know how that you know how like the uh, because of the Oscars they they have the The uh, the orchestra play the the music. Could you imagine the orchestra? Up there playing the sore theme as I imagine Directing that film goes up to accept their award How did it happen to be the Uh, you know, mindset says he was just watching some films that uh fateful night And he just happens he's just whatever reason he sees sore And then he just gets into it so hard that he's like This has potential and then he offers to direct sore 15 It's a doubt. It's like a shenanical, um, saw fan Yeah, he's like you almost cracked it so many times and I just I want to give her that extra push and uh I would watch a martin scorsese saw movie hell. Yeah, even if it was about three and a half hours Oh You know in pieces Maybe half and oh wow just no Damn, I don't I don't know if that was I know it just that's a long time to watch a saw movie. That is a long time Well, it's a long time to watch any movie, isn't it? That's how long that movie is right? What would you rather a scorsese? Or tarantino Soul movie, uh, I would rather the tarantino soul movie. I reckon Yeah, I think same That just sounds really I feel like it's more of a tarantino. Yeah thing Don't feel like it suits him better. We watched a diet tarantino movie yesterday after you left ringing I a diet. We don't have to talk a diet a diet tarantino film yesterday Kind of yeah, we don't we don't have to talk about it though, but we can if you So anyway, it's friday the 13th at october of halfway through the latest saw e-fap before I had to work a local park Who do I see at the park? Of course, it's mr. Saw himself toben bell. Nice guy iRL Did you really see him? That's right really? He's um, I've been made aware. He's got a youtube channel that he just posts random stuff to he's He's like a normal human. He's not one of them celebrity humans, you know That makes sense. He's not like a superstar, you know, but he's like recognizable Yeah, he's a superstar to soul fans, but he's outside of that, you know, it's like well, he's just he's toben bell There he goes. Look at him with his uh apparently he sings as well And plays guitar and stuff Does he do the voice when he sings? I hope so Start spreading the news I'm leaving today If we hit that bullseye, the rest of the dominoes should fall like a house of cards checkmate philone's throne trying to sound smart and competent Oh, is that from something? That's I feel like that's a future armor quote, but i'm not sure It could be a zapp bradigan thing if we hit the bullseye, the rest of the dominoes should fall like a house of cards checkmate It's shit I really enjoy that His other quote that people were using that uh, it would be great if thrall decided it was uh in the game of chess You could never allow your opponent to see your pieces Um Live on my birthday fringy. What's your favorite dinosaur? Uh, am I gonna be boring and say t-rex? I don't know. Are you? Uh, I really like t-rexes. I also really like uh brontosaurus Why do you like brontosaurus? I don't know. They seem like happy guys, you know Do you think happy people are better than sad people? Uh, no, it's just I I like how you know dinosaurs always seem like a very sort of competitive aggressive It's like a very hostile kind of world and then you got like big old brontosaurus. They're just chilling and eating leaves I don't know. They look like they're happy dinosaurs. They look very content I think they're like when when the t-rex rolls by they're like, oh, here we go I don't know if they're like that. I think they're like, hello, mr. t-rex You're not gonna mess with me because I'm uh, I'm a big lad, but uh, you know, I hope you're having a good day Save travels mr. Mr. t-rex how like net flanders to home a sort of thing. It's like he's he's a yeah Just trying to find the good, you know Yeah, that might be a good way of putting it brontosaurus is like the net flanders of dinosaurs They were called uh in the land before time. They were called long necks They didn't actually use their real names. They had little um Little like I guess not kid names, but like the the brontosaurus's were long necks Then you had the triceratops were tryhorns or three horns They'd all have like different like designations that were kind of based off of how they looked I mean think about other dinosaurs I do really like velociraptors, but specifically the ones in Jurassic park are really cool But I uh, I personally really like the feathered Sort of our illustrations that uh, you know, the fonder raptor kind of ones. Yeah. Yeah, I quite like those Uh, your thoughts on linguine suddenly having hyper dexterity when rollerblading I would have liked to seen earlier showing him good at rollerblading Was he I feel like that's a kind of dexterity that wasn't ever mentioned before because he was actually shown to be rather dexterous throughout the movie When he was avoiding bumping into people and this moving around you could argue, too That the dexterousness is present but something that he has trouble accessing confidently when Yeah, confidence might have been a part of it because remember When before he goes out he says we need someone to wait tables like he knows his place He knows his role and what he can do and he goes out He's being affirmative and normally throughout the movie. He's kind of Following along not really making super big decisions Even the reason that he was at the restaurant was because it was a letter from his mother when she passed away So it was more like he was following her wishes Um more than anything else It's like he's in his element. Um, kind of yeah This is something he wants to do. He knows needs to be done And it's for people that he no cares about now and he knows how to do it It's like the difference between the super familiarity with a video game and you're doing all kinds of crazy things and then you play Arguably easier game for the first time and you're like, whoop whoop. Yeah. Whoop whoop working out. Oh god Um But as for any information previous that he uh is able to roll a blade well I thought there would have been but maybe there isn't This I don't remember any like explicit um reference I probably would have wanted to set that up. I am oh but um it's uh This all kind of works, you know, it's uh, it's it's a thing that he's good at That you maybe wouldn't have expected Yep, I fit some of everything else Uh, do you guys believe in heaven and hell and if you do go to hell? Do you care something to think about lads? Um, I don't believe in I don't believe in heaven or hell I imagine hell would not be a pleasant place based off of the no and described memes aside Um, obviously if I had to choose between the two I probably would go with heaven If if hell is going to be the way that I You know the worst case scenario actually just consists consistent torture not being able to talk to people different forms like even going down to boredom All the way up to like, you know, what making you watch horrible things happen to people you love or something Like if hell was that it would be like, yeah, I obviously wouldn't want to go there If the choice is between eternal suffering and torment of whatever kind, you know and a An eternity of bliss. I'll be at a brainwashed one. I kind of have to go with a brainwashed bliss one Yeah in heaven Assuming I'm still myself I can make you know I could make something of that environment more so than I can hell. I think Probably hopefully But um It would be very um Matrixy to be in heaven. You'd be like no, this is real Wake up sheeple Uh, would you rather see? Yeah in a non-tismy place much would much rather see you in the non-tismy place Oh, are you saying you'd rather see us in heaven than hell? Thank you. I guess. Thank you very much um But as as you may be aware, we're not we're not too into the whole heaven hell thing in terms of uh thinking that's actually a thing Um, so I guess if it is real, we're all heading there. I'll see you there lads hooray Stumbled on a pretty good person Yeah, but does it wait is that how that works? What do you have to believe in the in the stuff? So tereology is the entire study of what the conditions of salvation are in christianity. Uh So it's it's oddly enough. It seems to be very hotly debated Which you you'd think it would be very clear You'd want it to be You'd think that it would be incredibly clear, but I guess it isn't really just picture all of us in a like old folks home Dear at the end of our days is like we got to make it if it's true and you're like with a little calculator or something like I don't know I guess we'll hope As long as they have video games in hell we should be okay Stumbled on a two hour youtube video, which is a collection of Hassan related clips from efab 147 148 161 Do you consider this transformative enough or is it content stealing high rags? I have to see it. I don't know. Yeah Can't tell by the description um Yeah, there's there's like an amount of stealing that can and does happen on the internet That's impossibly hard to police or at least without becoming like pretty hawkish about it Um, which can have really bad effects In some ways, I know that this is a sacrifice a lot of content creators think about which is like I could go after people who reupload or make quote-unquote compilations that really are just chopping out some things They don't like and reuploading Like if someone did an hour of Quote content a and then an hour of content b and then back to content a an hour later And someone just reuploads that but chopping out the content b portion It's like is that really enough work for them to monetize all the work that you just did and A lot of content creators will be like, well, I'll just let them Because if I was to try and bring down that which Hassan has talked about this actually um Then you'll you'll have another negative effect of being seen as someone who doesn't allow like fans to You know celebrate work or something or then it can bleed into criticism or reaction and stuff You kind of just end up leaving it alone I guess what i'm saying is that whether or not it is stealing a lot of people Know that and they can get away with it because they rely on like the good faith and good will of the creators in the first place And that's not even to speak of other platforms where they actually just steal whole channels and reupload Which is crazy by the way, but I don't know I guess whatever makes a living I think it was um could have been jacksfilms could have been someone else, but I remember uh, they Brought down a channel that was uploaded all their Videos on tiktok and they got a message from the person saying you got your bag. Why can't you let me get mine? Which was uh interesting as a point of view also, hi rags Hello to you In response to reject modernity embrace tradition meme modern art guy just did the reverse reject Tradition embrace modernity meme It was shallow and the bad faith argumentation just evaporated what little water in the puddle there was Uh, I soundly thought it was shallow. Yeah Hello guys I finished watching efab 90 and the bit where you guys joke about wilford brimley dead had been rolling on the floor laughing Keep up the good work That was a fun one. Yeah, the fun me me episode And that was a good meme and then he died and ruined it and then he died. He had to go and die Oh He just had to go and die What a shame As an alt writer myself, I believe people deserve less. Now. Excuse me as I exploit underpaid workers for fun. Ha ha ha ha Oh, that guy sounds cartoonish. He's a villain. Yeah, you can tell by the way that he laughs At the suffering of others. What a bad man. What a foul human Hmm Australia what the fuck the kuwaka They have large muscular cartilage reinforced butts. They crush the crush their predator's skulls against the ground with sad butts I don't believe that That's not true I think that you're making I think you're Is this misinformation? Is this some is this slander? Do that just go on the internet and tell lies. Yeah, evidently Well, I mean, I I certainly couldn't confirm or deny but it sounds like it's an unpopular sentiment And the yeah, you know, we got to look after that population They wouldn't appreciate it if we just allowed that to go without any, you know challenge Have you guys played iron lung? No, I've not I've heard it's very scary though I've heard they're making a movie But markiplier is a star in yeah Oh Interesting very much. So I'm gonna check that out when I come I will be what they're up to Yeah, I'm super super curious to kind of see that either. You know what the game is. What do you do in iron lung? I don't I don't I don't I really know Um, fair enough Yeah, I don't really know I think it's similar. I think it's something about deep-sea exploration looking for like some Treasure and there's monsters or something. I'm not exactly certain I've only seen like screenshots here and there and people say yeah iron lungs really scary Well the trailer that he's a trailer for the movie version just had a guy Covered in blood saying some spooky things and I was like I have no idea what this game is, but all right Maybe it wasn't blood who knows Uh Do you guys watch house of usher yet? I didn't know Edgar Allen Poe was so fascinated by lemons the more you know Oh He is he loves lemons boy. He's he's really interested in lemons as we all should be lemons are yummy They had a delicious taste You should be interested in lemons. I think so. Yeah as generally you should be interested in lemons How many times per day, you know, it's talking about how many times a day men think of the roman empire How many day times a day do you think someone ought to think of lemons? Oh, not as much as the roman empire Yeah, um, we don't want it to take away from you know, let's not I will you know, look, there's sufficient time in the day to think about the roman empire and 24 hours Yeah, exactly. Well 16. Well, I guess we include dreams Uh dream time, which I suppose that counts, right? Absolutely If you think about the if you don't think about the roman empire during the day But you you know dream about them at night, then I think I'd say that counts If you're dreaming about it, is that you thinking about it or is that your brain taking you on an adventure or? I think it has to be thinking about right? I feel like we Any line that we try to draw between I guess a thought it depends on how conscious we believe You know thoughts what are thoughts arise from you know thoughts Do you think them or do they arise and then you notice them? You know there's a Lot of debates about that and I feel like the more we try to draw lines between what constitutes thinking when at the end of The day if it's all happening in your brain Yeah, I don't know about that. So yeah, I think if you dream about it, then you're thinking about it All right Um, Bob Ross was a serial cheetah Damn I did not know that if that's true I saw another comment talking about spread out his love and his affection throughout the world I saw another comment talking about how he'd stolen the show from his mentor or something And that the person really didn't like Bob Ross and that people should know more about him I was like, oh no, is this we doing the thing where the good person turns out to be evil? Or something. I don't know any of this information. That's why I uh I Cannot confirm or deny Um high longs rags and fringes Hello Hello to you Where do you draw the line between an anti hero and an anti villain? How would you describe this define each? So as far as I'm aware an anti hero an anti villain as a definition depends on whether they're the protagonist or the antagonist of the story So the anti hero is like the pov character the main character Whereas the anti villain is the antagonist and that them being anti is then derived from, you know, whatever their traits are Although anti hero was uh, they do like they achieve the heroic stuff and they have an interest in it But they're willing to do dubious actions I'm not sure because I feel like I've definitely seen characters classes anti heroes who were doing things that weren't like good um Well, that's the idea. Yeah Well, no, no, no that that because it seems like what you're saying is their goals are good But their methods are bad as like the anti hero thing or Essentially for at least controversial And so then the anti like punisher that their goals are um Well punisher would be a pretty archetypal anti hero, but I mean What's that like for instance, you know is waltz an anti hero or is he? The just the villain essentially and then he goes from anti hero to villain Um So you'd say by the end that he would be considered the villain of the story Certainly when he organizes the deaths or those people in the prison that that I feel like is peak walt villain that that area of uh breaking bad I guess what I'm trying to figure out is because of course like breaking bad's often being said to be essentially the story of the Villain, but I wonder if that's how you know the way that these terms are typically used that he would be characterized um Because like I said, my understanding was that the anti villain is typically not the pov character They are still like the opposing force to the protagonist, but You know, they've got like noble qualities or noble traits or You know go about that they're they're uh bad goals in a in a noble way So I'm looking up. Um, I've gone to tv tropes dot org. I've found it very useful over the years Yeah, yeah, I think it's a resource Anti heroes are to them described as a protagonist who has typically the opposite of most of the traditional attributes of a hero They may be bewildered and effectual deluded or merely apathetic More often an anti hero is just an amoral misfit while heroes are typically conventional anti heroes depending on the circumstances may be Pre-conventional in a quote-unquote good society post conventional if the government is quote-unquote evil or even themselves unconventional That sounds like Because it's described them as the protagonist. Yes. Um, if we all write that definition then that sounds it sounds like a kind of I don't think they need to be the protagonist. I was gonna say I don't agree with the definition anyway I don't I don't agree with them needing to be a protagonist um But what's interesting here is that their little I guess their little flavor quote under the page is actually One, uh, I haven't seen this name in a while But uh, they reference salver harden in isekai's mom's foundation from 1951 an amazing book Uh, the quote is tales without end are told of these massive lonely figures who bore half seriously Half mockingly a motto adopted from one of salver harden's epigrams Never let your sense of morals prevent you from doing what is right That sounds like uh Kind of anti-hero ish kind of line Yeah We're so we're so if we were gonna if if we're gonna base if we went by definition that wasn't based on essentially what role they're designated in the story would What so would we say they would then be based on essentially their goals and motives and like the inverse right the anti-villain has What bad goals but goes about it and anti-villains are kind of Maybe what I would use for that would be uh, you know, um anesthesia the I forget his name. Is it bar talk bar talk the bat? Yeah, he's like he seems chill and he's got like he's he's I guess he's up with the villain's plan for the most part But not really doing much to add to it and the simultaneously wants nice things But lots of people in theory, but doesn't he's like he's like closer to it There's a couple of characters like that The description they give for anti-villain is pretty short The anti-villain is the opposite of an anti-hero a character with heroic goals Personality traits and or virtues who was ultimately the villain Their desired ends are mostly good But their means of getting there range from evil to undesirable Alternatively their goals may be selfish or have long-term consequences They don't care about but they're good people who might even team up with a hero if their goals don't conflict I still don't know if I find that as useful as the one Uh because that that feels like it's describing Walter White almost What that he would be considered an anti-villain possibly would that be an would that be an issue if he was considered an anti-villain? I think the problem is like the way we look at the terms in a Anti-villain kind of implies a level of like they're not as bad And you know by the end of the story Walt is uh, he's doing some pretty vile things Well, I was gonna say Depending on where in the timeline you are he could just be straight up villain like there's not much Yeah, yeah, like especially towards the and he's getting particularly ruthless um And callous so like to describe him as an anti-villain seems like not quite right because it feels Hmm. Yeah, um, so well because because I guess uh now i'm just trying to figure out like uh I'm just thinking about other examples where I think of maybe saying I guess they're like an anti-villain uh You know you got um an anti-villain's goals may be selfish or have long-term consequences They don't care about but they're good people who might even team up with the hero if their goals don't conflict That actually feels like as a description that you could fit punisher in there And I've not heard anyone say punish as an anti-villain No punisher is all but again, I feel like that stems from the fact that punisher is like the pov character. He's the protagonist So that's why he's an anti. He's the anti-hero. That feels weird to me that we base it around protagonist status or not because well, I mean, I I guess uh I I imagine that the reason why that's the case is because it's just pretty rare That you would have a story where like the antagonistic forces is like the hero essentially I just mean that we call lots of characters heroes when they're not the main character, you know what I mean and Yeah, no, I I get you low from that because I was actually going to say, um, there's a couple of Examples, I guess like, you know like Boromir. He's like one of the most easily encapsulated heroes and it should be like Yeah, but he's not a main or something if someone was to say he's not a protagonist. I'd be like, that's weird Well, I guess uh, I guess the thing is is that it's it's uh protagonist As I understand it protagonist just means that they're the the main character. It doesn't say anything about the story sort of Yeah, it like the protagonist is the main character and the antagonist is the opposing force It's just that generally the protagonist is the hero and the antagonist is a villain The problem is that like villain is a is a is a strong word Um, you you can often have people who are opposing forces who aren't like a villain. They're just you know an opposing Yeah, I mean Puss in boots the last wish has like one two Well, that's that'd be an interesting one Five antagonists Like, uh, you know Goldilocks isn't a villain Um, she's an opposing force. She's an antagonistic force, but they're not the villains the villain And even death, right? It's like, yeah, I wouldn't say death is the not the villain, but yeah Jack Horner is the villain jack is is the villain Um, so maybe maybe death would be considered like an anti-villain in the sense that we know the fact that he has some kind of Code that binds him. We brought up a breaking bad. I was actually gonna say I feel like a Mike Irmantraut kind of counts as an anti-villain Me seems like a very much a good man, but the oh, that's an interesting one Yeah, because he is an opposing force to waltz And he's uh His ends reach really bad things for a lot of people that he doesn't necessarily care about Because he's doing it for his daughter sort of thing Well, so would you say that like sol in better call sol is more of an anti-hero? Well, you guys talk about that. I need to do something real quick, and I'll be right back Okay, um, that's the this work gets real complicated because that's like six seasons of actions And I'd have to think about timeline again in terms of which who we're choosing at what time Well, you know what here's an interesting question because everybody accepts punisher as an anti-hero Daredevil is kind of an interesting one where you could consider him an anti-hero depending. What about uh, what about old batman? I feel like those are on a sliding scale and that that is actually how it slid who went from uh, Punisher to daredevil to batman Batman, uh, well, I think it depends on uh the interpret the iteration of batman as well, right? If you'd consider him an anti-hero, that's also true. Yeah, we need to know which batman we're dealing with Is he a batman motivated by you know, he enjoys beating the fuck out of people Like, you know, like daredevil's got that aspect Uh, yeah, it's well. I mean it's kind of interesting, right? Does a hero who has darker elements to their personality? I I I'm almost I'm not sure if that's like enough To make them what people would typically consider an anti-hero because I mean, you know Typically the hero's got some kind of journey that they got like black widow, for instance She wouldn't be described as an anti-hero despite the fact that you know, she's got aspects of her past that Uh, she's not the um, not the mcu one No, uh, yeah, yeah referring to the mcu one. Um, well, I mean, I guess Loki probably turned into something of an anti-villain towards the end right Wouldn't it be anti-hero by the time? Where are you choosing what film? I'm trying to think because obviously and Loki hears the villain and avenges sees the villain So it'd probably be between like Thor the dark like in ragnarok. It feels like he's kind of I he's probably anti-hero by that point. I'd say maybe there was no phase when he was the anti-villain He went from villain to not really no hero by the end essentially I I feel like anti-villains are just pretty rare honestly compared to it was like anti-hero is a pretty popular archetype whereas anti-villains are a little bit more difficult to find it's making me think though because all it's making me think about is uh I'm not sure how exactly to draw the line on which is which is which and and how they how we arrive at them Yeah Uh, solar sands solar sands the s s s coincidence I mean, you know a lot of people can preview it by s s solid snake for example He's uh, and he's pretty cool Mola, I beseech you play armored core um I don't know. I'm just not that sold on it. Um, some people say it's really cool, but that's about it and Uh, I've seen the gameplay And I get it like you're a mech and you have lots of cool, you know guns and stuff and you fire the mechs I was just like, I don't know though. I'm just not Not something that's grabbing me. You know how something can grab you by the soul Not being grabbed by Fringy, I beseech you play mad rat mad rat dead I haven't heard of that. Oh, they're right. Yeah, that is Um, and they've got one for rags. We'll wait till he's back a mold It's on the topic of art slash games was wondering if any of you massives have encountered a game in recent memory That made you feel like they wasted what video games can offer as a medium. Oh So many All right, so typically the kinds of games when you ask that question the kind of games that come to my mind First and foremost are games that give you Um, I either give you a choice that should be meaningful, but isn't it's like a fake choice Or something really should be a choice that you can make and should make But it just it's kind of you're super on rails and um, And you you aren't able to really make any choice I think those are the Among the strongest elements of that media is being able to make narrative choices because you are a part of the story May I suggest because you're the protagonist. Well that The example would be resin evil seven. We have to choose between taking. Oh, yes Fuck take Mia or the other girl to safety And uh, if you choose either of them, uh, essentially a slightly different cutscene plays Where it's so funny too One you get your boat gets attacked by swamp monster And um, you wake up as Mia because she's you know, uh, fall into the water and then I guess beaches somewhere um You play as her for a bit if you choose the other girl Because the same cutscene plays and then you wake up as Mia on the beach and it's like What how did this happen? It's like it just she also was in the water or something. I don't know shut up Like, okay. Um, yeah This I so that's interesting But I'm I'm guessing that because my thinking with the question is like a game that has a story That is betrayed by the type of game that it actually is Well, there's going to be countless examples. I assume I was just one from rags The first thing that came to my mind was a general sphere of bioshock infinite Like that was what I was thinking as well Bioshock infinite should not be it probably it shouldn't really be a first person shooter game I would say that This question should have been a stealth game. Oh that too Or third person shooters That that is because that's the most popular genre a lot of games end up being in that genre Even though the story that they were telling really should have been, you know, serviced by a different gameplay loop Yeah, bioshock infinite's a pretty pretty pitch-perfect example of that Then there's like Lord of Ring Golem, which is just terrible. Uh, yeah, just didn't need to exist as uh anything really No, they could have just scrapped that but they didn't To this day, I will be um really really sad because um these people have no actual balls Druckmann should have had it in The Last of Us 2 That they should have publicized because they know No Um, I or I bet they knew that they could find out right how many people spared Abby by the end or how many people killed her at the end actually give you a choice You know, I think that you have uh, you you have no balls to not allow the player to make that decision um Especially if you had any level of confidence in what idea you were trying to get across Yeah, um, it's that's a kind of game that just makes you wonder is like why are you making video games exactly like why Why why are you in this industry? Because it just seems like you're foregoing an opportunity to leverage the medium for what it has to offer that films can't do films and tv shows um, you just kind of had your story you wanted to tell it and Even though it made for a really interesting choice Like that would have been a really interesting choice, especially given you know what they thought their game was about But uh, well, you know, it's our story, you know, it's ours I um, I don't really know too much about cost and numbers and things of that Nature, but I am curious if they wanted to make a show like the last of us or whatever But they wanted to wanted to do it entirely As like a like a cutscene in-game graphics that sort of thing But make a show like that because we're getting to the point where they look really fucking good now So I don't think you'd really get that many complaints from a lot of people Would that cost more or less than shooting a show of like the last of us's quality in live action? Uh, well, I mean, I think we have some kind of frame of reference, right? The last of us show costs something like a hundred million dollars to make didn't it? Uh, that's a good question. I'm not sure but I think so I think it was something like that. Um Sure looked expensive and and I would be very surprised if the last of us wasn't a six figure uh game in terms of its budget Yeah Um, yeah, I I figure I figured that it would just be a matter of like That it's got to be expensive, right? If you wanted to like a fully like cg TV show for like nine episodes, you know nine hours worth of story. That's got to be expensive, right? Undoubtedly, yeah video game graphics He like I'm because you know video game graphics still aren't on the same level as the kind of things That can be accomplished with pre-rendered Um, true. Yes I think going stylized is kind of the arcane route or something similar going stylized is the way to go. Yeah Because we're getting to the point where you might start confusing my brain and I get that little that little Little voice in my head. That's like, this isn't real and I'm like, I know that. Why are you telling me this me? Um, the thing is though is like what can be accomplished now like some of the pre-rendered trailers for video games? It's insane Like the the the pre-render trailers that did for cyberpunk were crazy Like in terms of how lifelike it looked Yeah Rags I beseech you play with my boyhole. Hi rags Hi, I will do no such thing. I will do no such thing Hey efap is on hashtag lemon Hey, yo Alrighty Uh, you call this a cheeseburger they used to put come in between the patties. It's something called customer service That's what you used to get not anymore. Everything's cheap That's a quote apparently I don't think they used to put come in the burgers Well, I mean, you know That was back in the day and coke and the coke I mean come in the big I come in the burgers Your thoughts on linguine. Oh, wait, let's say read that already Farewell and adieu to you fair fleamish massives farewell and adieu to you massives of fleam This is the gay michael douglas. I think Stuff I always I feel like they open with that. Hello. I'm gay. I'm actor michael douglas So my favorite class of mass effect is the sentinel warp and overload your favorite Um, I I either like soldier or adept. I like to go full combat or I like to go full biotics Hmm, I think uh Uh, I like adept as well. Yeah, that's a that's a good one There's something neat about being able to have like the full List of biotic powers and being able to use them neat With all this talk of art I've decided to take my own work to the next level both my art and my writing to make the best manga I can possibly produce. I hope to show you all one day Oh, well, best of luck. I hope it ends up really good. Neater. You know good luck Or any of you lads a fan of harvey birdman I've not watched attorney at law I presume they're talking about that. Um, I've seen clips and I've liked the clips. I've seen The old I have not seen show. It's like space ghost Uh thoughts on the northman and its efap when high rags Oh, I haven't seen the northman first off. Hello That is when we need to watch at some point I would like to watch the northman Feel like it kind of slept slipped through the cracks or something But I would like to like to give it a look. I'm definitely interested. I want to take a look Um, I think efap's youtube shorts could work very well with edited down but concise visions of good arguments slash moments from the pod I think that's a pretty good idea Well, and I gotta get someone to do it. Don't I I can't do that too. You can't have the long man making shorts That's some kind of against the law. He's got a reputation to keep Yeah But um, I agree that probably could work Shadow the edge hog is a good design or has a good design Um, um, I mean, it's okay I don't really have an opinion on it in terms of like the quality of the design It's sonic, but he's black and red that has a gun Well, the thing is is that I like uh classic sonics design a lot Um newer sonic is okay. It's just like, yeah, yeah, yeah How design points work if it's uh, Sort of like a recolor of something else that's well designed Uh, I'm not sure I mean, how do we feel about mario and luigi? Do we feel like luigi loses points because he's You know a variation of mario's uh look I think you would be able to say that with the originals, but with a look now I think the design is very distinct, you know Uh, I'd say that that well, sure. I but but I imagine I imagine the argument would be made is like, yeah, but You know shadows got his his boots are a little bit different and his uh What are they called like the things on the back of their heads? The That quills a little yeah quills. I guess they kind of like I guess a hedgehog would have quills Yeah, they're shaped a little bit differently. So, you know, they don't they don't look exact and their eyes are kind of They're shaped a little bit differently Like he's in a bit more of a permanent sort of uh Scowl So, you know, there are differences there. We're in the same with the mario luigi. I look different Well, I didn't name that they had different shoes and colors this figure maybe like bigger or smaller hands It's like the whole face is different That's good Yeah, but Yeah, sonic and shadow they kind of have similar looking faces too. That's what i'm saying I said the opposite of that What they don't have similar looking faces. You know mario luigi do not have similar looking faces um That looks similar But they're different. You could like then they look like their brothers For instance, I have a similar face to my mother. I look sort of like my mom, but we're obviously not similar So it depends where you draw the line of what is By the way, I mean, you know besides the memes. Yes, I believe that they have done a better job of making luigi Look different from mario than they have for shadow mario like luigi is taller. He's skinnier um Yeah, like it's he looks different That uh, yeah, I've never really stayed at the difference between shadow and sonic. Maybe it's really noticeable outside of the color I would imagine more pointed blue. That's that's basically the main difference. He's got sharper Features, I guess you could say Um, but and I guess something that helps mario as well as not everybody looks like mario luigi You know, like there's that's pretty dramatic different. Yeah Yeah, they When you put them side by side clearly that it's it's on the template. It's on the sonic oc template that you just do Yeah, whereas with uh, yeah, if there was a line between these two approaches I feel like sonic and shadow underneath the line and married luigi are over the line in terms of and again, I think I agree It helps that they're I which is you know, I guess you could make the case that there is sort of a consistency in the way that sonic characters look but I believe that the consistency also holds true for the mario art style and You know, like the difference between mario and wario and wall luigi and like donkey kong and yoshi You know, it's different than the difference between You know sonic and tails and knuckles and amy and shadow There's a uh, there's a certain consistency that carries through Which you know It's not necessarily a bad thing. This uh, this showed up in google images. I guess from deviant art, which is kind of funny Uh, I think that the images are just way too similar, you know, like the this art style They basically just recolored them all. Okay Damn luigi is being sassy. Look at him Wario is very skinny. He's very thin. He's lost quite a bit of weight. Yeah, he did a keto diet He's lost a lot of weight I like how wario. He's just he's just really greedy, you know, he's a greedy guy. He likes his money And I wonder when they're gonna do another uh, wario like not not the wario wear games But the you know, like wario adventure platformer games I don't care else to you said it too many times for me not to think about it now Isn't it wario? Isn't that what he says? uh Well, sure, but I mean, you know, yoshi says yoshi and people fight over Yoshi or yoshi But how do you settle it? Uh, I've always called him wario even though, you know, he says wario. Yeah Yeah, like I've always said enough to know how I pronounce it To me, it's interesting because I again, I don't call him while luigi is I just say wallowigi That's what I say So i'm not sure Which is kind of interesting because I I've the thing is is that I can accept people saying yoshi But people usually fight me when I say yoshi, which I find bizarre. Oh, they do. I continue to say yoshi though. I say uh mario wario while luigi luigi yoshi Well, so as I understand it mario and mario is just an accent thing And I think it and I'm pretty sure it is mario. I'm pretty sure that's how you say it. It's mario Yeah, yeah in the same way wario not wario Yeah, yeah, which you know, yeah, it's uh, it follows. I've always just said wario for some reason I don't think I'm the only one either. I'm sure about it. I'm sure wario Have you ever played the the indie game wireframe? I What about uh gears of wire years of wire god of wire God of wire Wire hammer 40k Hello wires I have fond memories of that game never played the second one I played a bit of the second one. It's uh, I mean, I liked it, but obviously didn't I hear that uh Halo has gotten better by the way. Hello infinite. Um, that's what I've heard The new updates have made it a better game that there's different leadership now at uh, 343 But now I'm very glad to hear that just in time Yeah, that's like a the heroes enter the building and you know, stop the evil from killing all the innocent civilians The emerald's already dead I was thinking about um, what was it the one In the simpsons whether the guy with the funny voice. I think you're off the hook I don't remember. Oh Oh, it was you remember that it was the do you remember the guy who whereas like all in favor. I all oppose me He's saying that Many points to the buff guy. It was him. Let's get him I mean, it's just grinning like evil This evil grin is that I don't know why but that's reminded me of mr. Snrub. I love that fucking joke Hello, my name is mr. Snrub Hello, my name is mr. Burns. I like What was it? I like to Close what was it? It was he was at the bank, right? Yeah, it was like I would like to not Oh push something to do with some check or whatever that's like. Okay, mr. Burns. What's your first name? I don't know Do you remember the one where uh, do you remember the one where bot played the prank in the bank? What do you mean the bank is out of money in solvent? You only have enough cash for the next three customers I'll just stop like trying to get that money. I was like, I don't I don't have your money It's it's in bill's house and friend's house. Hey, what the hell are you doing with my money friend? It's just moe, right? He punches him. Yeah, moe just punches him. He just accepts that the money is in friend's house I'm predicting soar six slash x is your faves you predict correct You predict you have a very good prediction But those seem to clearly stand above the rest for the most part one and one Yeah, one is the because the reason why we would have to say that it's because you go you go six ten one and then a big gap Yes, there is a marked difference between those three films and all of the other ones It's like the first two final destinations Uh, I'd say the first one. I don't want to put two in that category. I uh, I I'm I'm a I'm a pretty big fan of the first one and I like the series overall, but As we concluded the second one's big plus was the physical effects. It wasn't like character Oh, and and uh, five was kind of interesting. It was three and four were really four was the worst. Oh, yeah Where is the characters? Uh, I remember. Yeah, I remember that I remember the characters But specifically the character names is kind of where I'm going with this No, oh, no, I can't remember the name. There was racist racist's wife milf and milf's husband Yeah One of the guys just got run over and that was just it for him. They were just crossing the street and got hit by an ambulance Uh, what was that? Yeah, well the problem with that was that he was uh, he was a big old main character to an extent He was the guy Yeah, I remember you mean because like to be fair that happens in the first fell destination It was one of the first kills Whereas he was like part of the adventure essentially I think the really awkward part was that the first one really wanted to lean into the mystery The second one wanted to do it as well. Uh, and then by the time they were at four It was like most of the characters basically disregarded at all Um, it was just an excuse to essentially get the deaths, but they didn't really care about the Uncovering the mystery or you know trying in any way shape or form to avert the catastrophe Um, I think it was a bush viper fringy. Oh, yeah, I remember reading that out the uh, oh, yeah Yeah, yeah, we uh, that's right. That's snack Uh, a good double feature is capitalism a love story and saw six I see because saw six regards health insurance and capacity to positivism But I mean, uh, well, yes, I guess so Uh, hi, I'm gay actor Michael Douglas. I recently bought a warehouse to store all of my copies of my beloved sonico six Oh Oh, that's a lot of copies. I think use the money from quantum mania to get that warehouse. That's pretty cool Ooh, that's true. He's probably got a big chunk of change from that movie. Oh, well, yeah, he would have gotten paid That's right. Oh, yeah, it's marvel who didn't get the money Uh Even had some homeless break in to escape the cold they immediately left once they saw sonic's stupid face everywhere Even homeless people even even homeless crackheads have their they have their limits That was in the era because the the big thing with sonico six was that we're trying to take themselves more seriously Dr. Eggman looked more like a normal person. Sonic was taller. Everybody was taller. They had that princess And then they had Yeah And then they had silver the hedgehog remember and he was from the future And uh Wasn't it like that sonic or something was like some big evil Or like at least some big evil or something in the future I don't I have look fringy. I'm gonna be honest. I have no idea what you're talking about Seeing yeah, it's it's a confusing. I mean, it's really a multifaceted Mature nuanced story that they told in sonica. Undoubtedly. Yeah, it's true. Yeah, it breaks new ground I like the more in sonic generations how it's like, oh man, we're just like traveling through time. That's crazy. Huh? Let's stop Eggman Honestly, you know, you appreciate it Yeah, or just, you know, the old ones where there was basically no story at all It was just go save the animals and stop Eggman It was a Just this is some sort of a ring addiction Hmm showed my family puss in boots the last wish last night by the end No one had laughed once two of them were asleep and a few went to watch more Loki afterwards feels bad. Oh You're memeing right? That's a meme. That's gotta be a meme weird that It would find that boring and the Loki I mean even the art style alone and puss in boots You'd think would keep someone engaged, but okay. It's not a very long movie either So hence why I'm almost convinced that's a meme Um, I looked up fringing in an old book and it reads Fringy is a wholesome plague doctor from redacted He specializes in the story of the study of his own mysterious goo. He likes going on little adventures and dislikes gay actor Michael Douglas Oh I like going on my little adventures Yeah, I suppose I do I like a little adventure every now and then well, you didn't deny it rags. So I guess Um, well, I mean, I like yeah, I like I like Michael. I I like uh wall street. That's a this is a good movie You like the I see you like the movie, but yeah Well, I mean, I like I like Michael Douglas as an actor Yeah, why was it confusing that I mean it'd be you know And that is it common that people don't like Michael Douglas Oh This is written about you. I don't know. I can't say to the veracity of the claims. I wouldn't want to do that either Dynotopia is indeed good rat Dynotopia, I don't know that one I don't either Speaking of art from controversial people any thoughts on german dictators paintings before he was a dictator also high frangy and by rags I I mean if we're talking about hillar. I mean he was pretty talented artist Um, I think I've seen him before I can't remember think what I thought about him, but of course It's one of those things where it's like, can you separate the man from the art? It's like, uh, sure You give it your shot, you know your best shot The austria joke from dumb and dumber hits hard I haven't seen dumb and dumber in long enough to know what that joke was. Yeah, I can't remember If ray shadow legends got an arcane quality show would y'all watch it. Yes Yeah If piss and shit got an arcane quality show I would watch It's uh, it's easy. That's an easy win. Um Uh, what do you think the discourse around it would be like if if ray shadow legends got that that would probably be good for them Actually, that might be like a good idea Absolutely Yeah And I wonder if because the amount of money they fucking burn on like advertisements I say burn they get it back. Obviously otherwise they wouldn't do it. Um, I imagine that they could Possibly hire even the same companies maybe or I was going to say would they be able to offer more than riot? Probably not Um, but then again, I don't want to say because I actually have no idea what they're capable of In terms of how much money they can spend that probably make a lot of money Yeah Um, basically anti-capitalist envious hack artists couldn't stand that kinkade made bank on unassuming non-pretentious works of art I mean, there would have been some people maybe who had that point of view, but I can I can understand Uh, the anger to some extent if you spam a lot of the similar images in a row And then find out that the guy like was pretty ruthless with it Um, you know, I can see a resentment building up, but ultimately like I can't I just I I find it hard to be mad at him. I think I think I just the odd itself is like a it just was getting really boring That was that was the main thing that it was doing for me Yeah, and it's not even about like whether or not it challenges me on a philosophical level It's just a matter of um, my eyes are looking around to be interested and I'm like I already saw all that I already saw all that Which is interesting because I feel like from what I saw there's like videos and stuff He's clearly capable of doing other things. I just never wanted to move too far away from A particular mode, which is uh, which uh, I guess isn't surprising if he was making hundreds of millions of dollars. Yeah I'm actually doing a very cool. And hey, maybe he really really enjoyed making those images particularly and it's like, all right I'm not gonna maybe I guess you wonder if you get bored though, you know Maybe he'll be interested to talk to him about that. See what he says Too late now though. Um Wanted to promote the film essay channel movie wise. He's got a nice sense of humor talks a lot about classics and maturity and characters Wait good stuff. I have not seen him myself Uh, hi lads I feel inspired by rewatching some of your older episodes Will you help fund all of my old female movie remake called 12 pissy women? Oh, no. Oh my goodness You can't do that That's every show now though Though you do wonder if a film with that kind of like a controversial name came up, but it was incredibly well written Like I wonder what would happen I don't know you'll be seeing you assume it's a comedy wouldn't you 12 pissy women 12 pissy women Yeah, it's not what you call a batman movie. It's like a super serious drama. Like, okay fair enough Uh, you guys will say fleams and tisms without restraint yet kitch is the cutoff point. Yes Yes Pretty clear because fleam and tisman pretentious and they make sense The kiss they do make sense. I make sense to me Is the Mona Lisa challenging one could argue it's just a picture of a woman, but it's one of the most famous works of art There is I don't uh challenging. I don't want to make challenging like the only aspect of what makes art good I just feel like some things don't challenge me at all that I think are amazing. So I like being challenged. I don't think it has to be challenging. I don't think art has to be challenging It's like if someone said you think, um, you know, why do you like soma and god of war ragnarok greatly is video game stories? I could probably reference soma's very challenging ragnarok's not very Well, I guess the thing is I mean mario is art And if we're not talking about, you know actual challenge presented in the gameplay Mario isn't challenging at all But like the idea that that would make it lesser. I just find absurd Yeah, we have lots of different metrics for like the I would say that comes under the umbrella of meaning at that point and challenging can be one of the ways Yeah, exactly. Meaning is a complicated thing. Um, because something that's inspiring doesn't necessarily challenge you It could just I again, I just uh, I find it strange that Someone could look at something that is beautiful but not confronting And consider that to be like lesser As just sort of a matter of like as a kind of a rule as something that's common inherent Just seems strange I The marvel's an unbridled kitsch also high rags. I'll ghoul Hello Who knows? I mean it's funny because Like I said, I'm never going to use the word kitsch again, but uh, we've talked before about how marvel is Pretty afraid of letting any particularly strong emotions sit with the viewer for too long. Yeah So in a certain sense you could say that that uh marvel is falls under that category Yeah, it's kind of I don't want to say cowardly, but Um, it's hard to describe like what I would call that Well, it's not running any rags, isn't it? Yeah rags. Yeah fair. Yes. There you go. Get the chair Yeah I feel sort of thin like jam spread across too much man bill boy baggage Uh find a man of fortune and then just jam him up It might take a lot of jam, especially if he's a very large fellow Just dunk him at that point it's easier plus he tends to he'll probably tend to eat it So you have to be quick with your every quick. Yeah. Yeah, how do you quit? He's got that cartoon tongue that like slits all around and gets it all up in one Yeah, like curds the cowardly dog he just like Just you know clean himself all up in one big swoop like in the tower of doctor's lost with the candy plums Of course. Yeah Uh two girls one poo Hmm. I guess the other one didn't need to go The signatures on the wills look like the third and signature when he's possessed by saaron lull anyways That's that's fair. Yeah, that does they did kind of look like that. Uh, this one's for you walt Also, hi rags Hello to you Roosterteeth are removing red versus blue and other shows from youtube I knew they were being tis me these past few years, but this just takes the cake Like entirely I want people to like subscribe to their streaming service Damn Damn If funko pops were paintings, you know, is that what you're saying king kate is If funko pops were paintings That's interesting. Um I don't know But I see what you mean the unified nature that makes you almost disgusted to look at it because of that I understand that aspect But come on funko pops just Well, maybe that's the key to understanding the people who hate king kate actually funko pops. Maybe that's it Bring it if you played a mark of the ninja, if not, I recommend it You can sneak in shadow and you can have a magic tattoo that slowly takes your sanity away Uh, I have played mark of the ninja. That is a really cool side scrolling stealth game Um Why have a fussy husky or a dopey boxer? Oh, would you rather Fussy husky or dopey boxer I've A fussy husky, I guess. Well, no, what maybe maybe it's too warm around here for too much of the year to have a husky maybe My my climate doesn't know itself. Well, I don't actually know. I don't know much about dog ownership The thing is it's pretty hot around like there are plenty of huskies in australia even though it's really hot Um, and in terms of the breed that I like more I like, uh, I like huskies, but I Maybe conscious of the weather. I might go with the boxer But I I definitely prefer huskies. They're like one of my favorite breeds of dog. They look very cool Oh, yeah, they're one of the coolest looking dogs. Yeah, they're very approachably wolf-like in a way More or less the category like for me my preference like dog dogs really bigger and they look like a wolf So, yeah them, uh, labor doors german shepherds, uh kelpies Uh, what's what's the what's the the, uh, border collie? Wait, that's the what's what's the uh Uh, lassie dog. What what breed is that? Is lassie, uh, golden retriever or a I like no, I don't What is yeah, what is uh, uh collie? That's what they are but are collie. All right a rough collie Rough Rough indeed Um, yeah as for me, I'd pretty much the same answer. I am I think Whether he would be suitable for a husky, but I kind of I'd be interested in having either If I was forced to of course Um art e-faps are like catnip to me keep up the good work No problem. Yeah, you bet. We like art. I'm sure we'll talk about it for many years to come Until we finally put it until we put it into this and we finally solve it Uh, does YMS not like as I get it, but Amen, let people not like and like each other. I guess. I don't know. That's just the way The world works Yeah Uh, there was animation Tweet of a wholesome family eating mcdonald's and some political brain rot victims literally said it's evil right wing pedo propaganda Uh dev made a made a video on this For those of you who don't know check out dev's channel short fado toku who made a video on it Is it called the world is weird? I can't remember the name part 7,843 No, it's not it's not a twitch It's not a tiktok reaction thing. Oh, right video proper. Yeah Have you guys seen house of usher yet? How does it compare to flanigan's other work? Uh, well he nailed the ending I say nailed. I mean he didn't destroy it You know what I mean like that's nailing. Yeah Um There's some issues I take with bits and bobs the writing, but I was very happy with it overall. I thought it was a neat story um How does it compare I didn't uh get as much out of it as I did from bligh um But I'm quite fond of it and I think it's leagues ahead of like a lot of tv shows that come out And it's almost embarrassing to compare it to like a so-called oaky Ha ha ha it is embarrassing to compare them. Yeah Do you remember like the sequence in the first episode where they go from child to child to child and they're having a conversation with a significant other Slash their career opportunities slash the bounty that's been placed slash their Point of view on this entire court case. It's just dare I say spamming information at you it's like Setting up everything going over dynamics and it's just like whoa. Do you remember this? Do you remember getting like 11 out of 10 information per scene compared to 0.1 out of 10 There's just so much uh more dense. Yeah And you miss it. You just miss it Oh sweet crispy critters hope this ign review doesn't have surprise cringe though since it's a soca that can't be helped I don't think that cringe is surprising in a soca I would also say that was by the cringe that was an okay ign video that we saw It was okay By ign standard. Yeah by ign standards. That was a seven out of 10. Yeah, we agreed with most of it I think there was some stuff she said that was weird But you know she said some weird batshit stuff But for the most part pretty decently spot on with the show for the most part Um boom, but about I love how this episode echoes back to the over criticism and how we should praise not necessarily original done well That's a very interesting written sentence I'm trying to make sense of it trying to say that Can you read that again? I love how this episode echoes back to the over criticism And how we should praise not necessarily original done well Maybe oh adaptation. Maybe Maybe not necessarily the original, but it's done well in and of itself And if that's what you're trying to say then I totally agree Um done well is kind of the big, you know huge focus of those You know thoughts if it's done well Then it's done well and we can talk about adaptation stuff You know as it's own separate conversation Unless as you know Fringy well knows and I know from watching the halo show You can't just take shit from something and not know why it's There to be taken, you know, sort of it's not just a buffet that you could shoot us in that and this and that You have to think about it. You have to put some real thought into if you're gonna deviate You need to understand why the decisions were made in the first place and what material was supporting them So that you can create new material that fits You just pick and choose you end up with something that's Broken Yeah, let's let's say you're going to if you're going to the buffet where the sandwiches are made, right? And instead of getting like your bread your meat your cheese your plants that kind of thing Instead you just got like randomly Like olives and shredded cheese and like just random stuff And you don't know why it all comes together to make a sandwich. That's kind of how storytelling elements can be Uh, have you guys seen the newest dev update from riot arcane is now canon Would love to see you guys react to the lore segment of the video seems like they subscribe to your philosophy on storytelling Hmm I don't know anything about the canon of league of legends, but i'm smaller It does maybe doesn't surprise me at all that they would Rebuild around arcane because arcane. Yeah lean heavily into the stuff that people love Yeah, which is by the way, just a really great non hypothetical to now have the the source material exists They make an adaptation that is different and leagues better And then they basically reshape the source to To match this adaptation to the elation of the fans That that that's like a you know, that's got to count for something in the conversation about adaptation Because um as far as i'm aware some of the marvel comics even have morphed around what happens in the films to the chagrin of marvel fans Yeah And of course it's like well, so what's the key element then don't change source It's like no actually it's literally down to how good the writing is every time. That's always what it is It's not your get out of jail free card because it takes work But you can excuse a lot of stuff and even excuse is a bit loaded But you can get away with a lot of stuff if the writing is just good Um, but yeah, obviously we'll be there on the on day one for arcane when it comes out season two And on the burn But i'll have to check that out if they talk about their storytelling philosophy in that video. That sounds like fun Anyway, uh more i watched the prestige for the first time and my god a masterpiece But why specifically though do you consider it as you said the greatest story ever told in a film spoilers? Oh, that's part one. Um, have i ever described it as the greatest story ever told? I know it's my favorite Um, i i might have used those words before but i feel like that's uh Very careful saying something like that. That's that's big flames because um, i'd be more inclined to say that The lord the rings trilogy is the best story ever told in film and you might be like well, wait Why why why isn't that your favorite then it's like well you choose these things differently I think that the scope of lord the rings and the coverage and then the impressive nature of a lot of the filmmaking elements would likely lift it differently Not to say that prestige doesn't have that as well But like why I think prestige is incredibly special is that it's an incredibly detailed and like layered story that comes in three pieces that move around and um a cut such in a specific way that they have like Realizations that um are really important and ripple through each of the timelines or Uh sections as you will So like in terms of how to split up a non-linear story I think it's super impressive on that angle. Then there's the character work is fucking brilliant the fact that this like you know cataclysmic Series of events all comes from the fact that it's loads of misunderstandings ego and interest in Sort of being the best I think it like appeals hardcore to fundamental nature of humanity that what what we're all here to do what we try to do and I like the the two characters almost have the exact same goal but for different reasons and different interests and then The duality aspect of the whole thing obviously, um They're personas as magicians versus the lives they live as men and how it like completely gets fucked up by all their ambitions the uh The split between boredom and Well other boredom and uh, there's differences between them despite the fact that their twins leads to one of them dying Well, the other one doesn't like the ambition kills one and not the other um Then you know the the the pledge the turn the prestige that thematically matches the way the story is even told um As well as like, you know the the acts of discovering how the magic works in loads of parts of the film As well as the magic behind the the the filmmaking And I think there's really cool They had like rock solid down to earth magic tricks that were being performed like in camera So to speak like there's there's there's obviously going to be special effects with like the tesla stuff But a lot of it is actual like one quote illusion magic was in the film And they show you how it's done and stuff and then they have like commentary on what that means and what It's like for a magician to work and what people are interested in I think it's representative of our interest in media a lot of the time Like the tricks behind it can sometimes ruin the interest in it. Um, this comes up with like discovering The history of a spooky monster or the the lore behind like this could happen with like discovering how the jedi came along It's like maybe something we don't want to know It helps uh keep a sense of mystery or something and As he says when you like teach someone the trick They like lose all interest in you and that's something the boredom learns earlier on That there's there's I could go on forever. Uh, the prestige is an infinitely fascinating movie to me As well as uh everything it's saying what it's doing And then I find it Super impressive. It's just a fundamental sort of study on our interest in Making a difference being appreciated and As angios says before he dies that he just wanted to see the look on their faces to convince people that the world Isn't as simple and solid Boring and mundane as you thought it was Which is uh really neat. I like the prestige. I give it a thumbs up Prestige is my boy now I don't know if anything else you guys want to say about it instead of just me No, I uh, I mean That's fair enough carry on I think that's good. Oh, I I guess I'll just one uh one edition of I think that's saying lord of the rings is If someone said that was the greatest story in film, you know, it'd be hard to fault them because of its You know, how good it is and with all the stuff under its scope, you know There's so much going on a lot of good messages a lot of great characters and places You know, it's this excellent package of you know, the cinematics and the music and the acting that it's just uh, it's hard to beat It's a really easy thing to point to uh for like an archetypal great story Or an archetypical way It's it's a really easy, you know set of films to point to is This is like what stories are And it's a really great one Yeah, I think so, uh, you know not to be too like silly about it, but just good triumphing over evil by working together Pretty much achieves that 100% You know going on arcs learning things about themselves and their place in the world and coming to grow together uh Bond and then going on an adventure Going few layers deeper. I think the Lord of the Rings is one of the better examples of what it has to say and You know show about the nature of redemption Yes, it's got it's got some really great fundamental themes. They're really They're really um, it's not that they're common I don't think that's the right word. It's that they're very universal Yes camaraderie redemption um heroism bravery Even addiction with a golem to an extent. Yeah, exactly even even there too It's amazingly. So this is uh, this is a three-parter on the prestige. It's amazingly well executed with the microcosmic intro you lord itself compounding leapotent Like any great of storytelling and the ideas that explores are so distilled and so complete I tend to agree. I love that movie But my question other greats of cinema have these qualities too So does it simply arithmetically inch out higher than all the other greats? Or is there some unique transcendent thing that it does slash has? Oh, I would why it's my favorite just appeals to me the most. Um It gets really hard when you start to get to the best of the best in any given medium It's a reason why I often don't like having something that I just say is my number one because it feels like it's more a collection of Um, the best slash the things that appeal to me the most For me it's really simple Sometimes I'll just go with whatever I realize over time is occupying my mind the most or had the most impact on me Simple as that like some of these things I'll be like I wouldn't have said this but I have to because I know it's true like that this thing affected me the most Um, exactly. So yeah, prestige is definitely up there like soma is also up there and uh You know other Are the bits and bobs of media like Buffy who are just like made them end up making me think the most and it influences a lot of my Choices in life ultimately. So That'll be why it's my favorite. For example, if someone said what's so you think that prestige is better than no country for old men I'd be like Better We start getting into this territory. It gets complicated. Yeah, exactly Uh, just tuned in to be greeted by why would we presume that the leprechauns milk is green? Yeah, we're having an important discussion. Imagine the leprechauns milk green. That's right. It's philosophical Uh, does she mean that a viewer can approach a show without extensive knowledge of what comes before talking about the ign review Um, I am not sure exactly because I can't remember but uh, like I said mostly solid videos. Okay In fact, I think we should promote her in in ign because she She thinks slightly freer than them Yeah, for an eye especially compared to how well uh, asoka was reviewed By uh by ign. It's kind of funny. It's so funny. You know, the show was reviewed What was the overall an eight out of ten several episodes got a nine and you put out a video It's very on point about how Uh, asoka and the finale was the finale that was rated a nine out of ten It just feels like it captures uh, what we've been saying about like aggregate review sites or not even aggregate Just I don't want to say the word shell, but you know what I mean like sites that come across like traditional mainstream like Media websites like ign or game spot or the the only caveat I would add is just ones that we expect to be bad at their job Like as opposed to Because I don't want to say that for all of them. Maybe there's some out there that have better reputation But ign, you know ign is a particularly clown-ish Uh, it is like peak video game journalism website, isn't it? I mean, it's the ign of video games Yeah We had a fact. Yeah What's the meme conspelling? Oh, yeah, classic Fun fact relevant to current events. Neil Druckmann said the scar wlf conflict in the last phase two was supposed to represent isrealpout Please no Just yeah, just just no. No, thank you. Neil stop it sit down You know, you you still have time to decanonize the last of us too. You can still do it Any day any day working on that factions multiplayer mode for like three four years and now that's basically all but dead And what do they got to show for it? You know the last of us two Three years old at this point By now you would be expecting to find out what their next video game is and like And it's well underway. Yeah If it's actually the last of us three that would blow my fucking mind, I would be I would be shocked Well, hey, it's pretty bold as a decision That's incredibly bold to continue. I wouldn't be able to resist play at it. Honestly. I'd be like What did you do out of morbid curiosity? But the the part of me is really curious. Absolutely I guess the problem at this point is, you know when it's like, hey Fringy, do you like naughty dog? I don't know if I can even say yeah anymore. Um I'd say yes if you were speaking about naughty dog up until a point Um You know basically up until and including uncharted 4. Yeah But now no And I really really really really do not want them to go near their old stuff I don't want them to make another uncharted. I sure as hell don't want them to try Jack and Daxter again No way Just let it be in that in that wonderful realm that was the early to mid 2000s Um, does anyone wonder what Ahsoka even means by I know now for context they're talking about when Sabine says sorry in reference to giving up the map to get to Ezra and Ahsoka responds. I know So I'm gonna be 100 generous and say that what we're supposed to draw from that is Ahsoka recognizes That she knows she did the thing wrong, but that she also did it to get to Ezra And that that's not remember Ahsoka said something like it was fate that that decision was made or some bullshit Oh, I think that was um, she said she was fated to make that choice But she said it in a way that was more pessimistic whereas Uh good old Hu Yang was trying to spin it in a more positive way that that was the only choice she could make Yeah, well, that's kind of where I was gonna go with that That's exactly the same thing I think we're supposed to assume Ahsoka understands Why she made the choice and that she knows that Sabine knows that she probably shouldn't have But that she was always gonna because it was in favor of Ezra. No, that's and then of course, you know, it's headed into her continued statements Doesn't matter. I got you back Sabine Because I stick with you much like my master should have stuck with me although. No, she said Anakin did stick with it, right? Even though he absolutely did not yeah, that's just bullshit I mean he tried to kill her and yeah, um I still think that analysis is relatively generous and that they should have been way more flesh on all of that. That's uh Ridiculously thin That was all that they had for those characters. Yep. That was the conflict They could have done something with and we got about five miles All of the house of usher was eight episodes the episodes were longer But there's no reason that the Ahsoka episodes they're not bound by the restrictions of network television I felt like those episodes even halfway through episode one. We'd already passed the total information provided by Ahsoka season one Without any without any hyperbole honestly one season of uh one episode of fall of the house of usher Is equivalent to the entire season's worth of uh story and Ahsoka I said half not exaggerating Oh I thought you said that half was like equivalent to several have you said no whole season So and to sound less hyperbolic, I guess because I know a lot of people would be like, huh Yeah, very funny. So take the um the first scene where they're like eating as a family I think or they've met up. They're having cake, right and they're talking about their um the pym forms um There's an exchange. I think they cut in the cake and uh, rodrick says Uh, fredrick marrying this woman is the one thing you didn't fuck up Um that line alone is already huge in terms of like wow He's willing to say that in front of all of them that he considers fredrick a complete fuck up That this girl is someone he appreciates mainly because she's able to decorate cakes. Well Like I wonder how well the is that somebody didn't know or is that something does he care? I don't know and I guess he's probably trying to sell it more So as a joke, but everyone else enjoys like the nature of it being like that and then Frederick says oh well, I guess we have that in common uh sort of you know raising a glass to um Roderick's new wife and this is all information you have within the the scene itself Who has looked awkward throughout the whole thing and just just trying to get along with his kids Because she's their stepmom technically even though she obviously I think she's younger than several of them um And is not being accepted by the family and has already commented earlier that fredrick is only Theoretically nice to her to try and impress the dad because the dad obviously doesn't have Infinite time left and they're all vying for his fortune inheritance that's the a lot of the comparisons to succession that are made and then um I think it cuts to um I can't remember if it was camille or the eldest daughter but I think she says oh for fuck's sake and uh, then it cuts to the the The new mother of the family technically who's just starts drinking wine Because the compliment from fredrick has now caused everyone to think about how she is their mom Like and nobody likes her there and considers her like an addition that's been added because rodrick is interested in her Which we discover is partly related to the fact that she Is a big consumer of his drugs and so a great advocate for the fact that they're safe and healthy, right? Like she takes more of a dose than anyone else typically does And what i'm getting at is like there's all of this in like two three lines How long does it take to get that kind of content in isoka? Like It's absurd It's remarkable. Um, it's astounding how lacking in story Asaka is compared to like a real television show This is what I mean Like this is why my videos are so fucking long with the stuff that I cover that I really like Because like it's easy to extend it as well like we've done this with efab episodes But like when you don't like it you can talk about not only what they miss But all of like the ways that the line itself is so pathetic compared to what it could have been How it contradicts everything that came before it like it's such an interesting scale of how much you can achieve With just a line of dialogue and yeah when we were watching us I was just like, uh back to tv back to actually watching actual stories actual characters Where everything they say really nice matters as weight decides like things in futures um Hey mass, it was thoughts on the new spider-man games. I've been replaying them in anticipation for the new game And I really enjoy the gameplay I've not played it. I'm the only one who's played uh spider-man, right? I believe so. I think so. I have not played it Uh, I like it. It's a fun game. Uh, it's got fun combat. It's uh, the traversals um Which feels like a thing that Uh, it feels like it sort of goes up and down in terms of games recognizing How important it is to make moving from one place to the other fun in like an open world game Something somniac was uh, though, maybe this is a hot take. I think sunset overdrive has a better traversal than uh Then spider-man ps4 that get that game was really Damn that game is that game is really unexplored one, wasn't it? Yeah. Yeah, that was uh within the first year That's uh, I got that with my xbox one bundled with it. Um, that game is really good If you're looking for a game that's got really fun traversal mixed like with the combat integrated into the movement really colorful Um, like sunset overdrive is a really great game. It's uh, it's kind of a shame that Basically, nobody played it, but it was kind of uh a victim of the the early era of the xbox one when The good reason everybody was pretty yeah people were like really pretty pissed off with xbox and resistant to uh to that brand Um, but I guess to bring it back to spider-man ps4. Yes, it's a fun like open world uh game arkham s combat but uh It like it integrating verticality and the movement into the combat as well with the gadgets. It's a fun game Yeah, I like it. I'm looking forward to playing the the new one Uh, I really enjoy the gameplay of both the story and the first game is pretty solid But the story in spider-man miles morales is packed with issues world building plot and characters are all quite flawed thoughts Uh, well, so I didn't play miles morales. So I can't speak to that one And I haven't played the first game since it came out. So I don't really remember much of the story I remember that there were good beats in it though. Uh, but as for like the broad plot. Yeah, I can't really speak to it Also high rags mubles and frong Hi. Hey Jeff bridges is on record as having a low opinion of iron man and realized he could phone it in And even then he injected it with some personality. I was gonna say I love obadiah stain. The performance is really strong So if that was him phoning it in I guess that just means that he's a really good actor I don't know if I've ever been unhappy with the jeff bridges performance. Yep. I always bought it and uh I bought him in that but to be fair like it's it's well known obadiah stain is not Particularly well realized by the time you get to the end of the film As a character Uh, a shilling for the disney star wars Decay meter. Oh, yeah, I guess so Uh, why there was no comment showcase in osoka minis. Oh, yeah, I did answer this the uh, they They did not get out on the timeline that me and fring would have preferred to get and that was with both of us working on it Without comment showcase, uh So, you know, we we're trying to find ways of getting this stuff done a little bit faster And that's just how it worked But of course, uh, I guess that just means it goes back to being a comment section in general Which is still you know, they if you guys to interact and appreciate Don't comment sections are just Comment sections. We read them still here and there and incorporate a lot of the insights into future episodes and stuff Don't chew for it Uh, the empire is never more alive than when we sleep Is that is that a quote from andor? I could buy that I think it was a quote from andor. It rings a bell Uh, don't let them lock your balls molly. We appreciate all the hard work. Keep it up and what are your jabs? We'll do always what are your jabs? And uh, that's it. That's the last message. So thank you very much Everybody for the kind messages kind donations and uh, hope you enjoyed that episode of efap and this catch up There's still more for us to record. So you'll get more in future. Don't you worry? Um, but for now, thank you so much. And uh, I guess goodbye Yeah, goodbye everybody See you