 All over the internet and every news media outlet out there, everybody's talking about the swine flu, I mean, it's, you know, it actually is probably causing quite a bit of stir amongst most people, several people I talk to jokingly, say, Chi, I hope I don't get it. It just arrives on the scene out of nowhere, and it is kind of suspicious. And my guest today is the keeper of the native nutrition flame, none other than Agenus Vondaplan. It's how you doing? Fine, how about you? Very good, very good. Eating raw, eating raw. Yes. Anyway, I received an interesting email from you, and I looked at it and I thought, hmm, this really deserves some attention. So we're going to talk about this theory that you have about what's going on. First of all, one of the things that I was amazed that I learned in the email was the nature of these viruses. Viruses are not living things, are they? No, they're not. It's not like a microbe. It isn't like a microbe at all. They are protein waste products in solvent solution, and they can have animal tissue in them. Now, you cannot transfer animal tissue of that nature, any kind of an animal flu. Well, let me explain what a flu is. A flu is a solvent detoxification. A cold is normally a bacterial detoxification where microbes eat damaged tissue that is of a waste product, and when they consume that tissue, they can consume about 50 times their weight, 24 hours, and they have a waste product of about 1 to 5%. That's like you eating 50 pounds of food in one day and having a 1 to 5 pound waste product to deal with the next day. That's a good janitor. Really? So we want colds. Now, flus occur when people are so toxic that bacteria cannot help break down the toxic waste products because there's inorganic substances like chemicals from pesticides, inorganic fertilizers, food additives, you know, Pepsi-Cola, all those sodas which are just chemical, they have nothing to do with food. When those chemicals get in the body and saturate the body and they destroy the bacteria, then our bodies have to make a solvent or many varieties of solvents to dissolve tissue. So the body may make about 300,000 types of viruses that are specific to a specific tissue within a particular cell so that the whole cell isn't, its integrity isn't disrupted so the whole cell doesn't die. It's just cleaning out let's say the veins in a particular area of the cell, whether it be the veins for neurological functions or lymphatic which is cleansing or the blood itself within the cell. So those are specific cleansing viruses for specific areas in the body. Now, no time does it ever get to the point where you have more than let's say three viruses at a particular time in any particular body. Now when we talk, if you're in a laboratory looking at it, there's nothing live there. You've got soaps, you've got solvents just like we have soaps and solvents to dissolve grease off of your garage floor from your car. Now what happens when you use a solvent, you use water in relationship with it because water is the main solvent on this planet. It dissolves rock, plants can eat. So water is our main solvent. If you look under an archeological book, the first thing listed under solvent is water. So we mix a compound of proteins or chemicals which with water create a dissolution of substance in this particular case. Let's say the swine. So you're talking about a specific tissue of a pig. And a pig is not going to have a virus unless it is so toxic from poor feed and vaccines and all kinds of medication that it can't use its natural bacterial cleansing. And that obviously is happening because if you've ever seen animal husbandry, how it relates to swine, I mean they feed them garbage. They literally feed them garbage. Everything that people throw away and is rotten, they feed it to pigs. Well that started in Egypt and Israel over 6,000 years ago. Pigs were used in the streets. That's why it was illegally pigs, not because there was something wrong with them at first, but because they would eat anything. So all the waste products got dumped out the windows and the pigs went around the streets eating everything. So it was illegal to eat the garbage collectors. But because people were eating a lot of cooked foods and throwing contaminated foods out, let's say the God that were left in silver vessels or lead cups and dishes, then of course they got contaminated with heavy metals. That was also thrown out and the pigs started getting diseased. So then it was illegal to eat the pigs not only because they were the garbage collectors, but because they were diseased. So that had continued. So when farming became a big agricultural moneymaker, companies started going to other companies that made processed food like cereals, getting the waste products cheaply and then feeding them to pigs. One of the things they feed to pigs is chicken waste, chicken feces. People have chicken farms, they gather all that chicken waste up, they sell it to both the pig farmers and the cow farmers and they feed it to those animals. Yeah, but that's okay. Pigs and dogs and chickens and birds eat a lot of fecal matter. What fecal matter is, fecal matter as long as the animal is needing chemicals and being injected with toxins. That's the issue. The feces are predigested matter that the body didn't have time to absorb all of. So other animals eat those feces and they're very healthy with them. So let's get back on track because I'm very intrigued by this. So swine flu has arisen because we have sick pigs out there who cannot, the necessary viral response is inadequate for them to take care of their own bodies so they develop, they manifest the swine flu, correct? Correct. Now you can have 300,000 varieties of swine flu because of the different complex 300,000 different types of tissue to be cleansed within a pig just like within any other animal organism. However, they cannot cross species. So how did we get swine flu then? It's been made in a factory and injected. Okay. Just the way AIDS was manufactured, it was created at UCLA in 1961-62 to create cancer and laboratory animals to study cancer. Okay. I don't want to get too deep into that yet because I want to just elaborate one more thing here before we move there. So in theory, a virus, first of all, there are good viruses obviously as you just said. All viruses are good viruses. And they're obviously necessary responses to something that's happening biologically in us. Correct. And so the swine flu virus or any of the normal viruses that we catch throughout the years, how are they actually, do they incubate in our body and dormant until we spread it to someone else? I've never understood where the viruses go. The viruses are like the cicadas to me. It's a mystery. They come out once every seven years, but where are they for the 6.9 years before they come out? Where do viruses reside? You're working under a wrong premise to begin with. You're never going to find the answer if you do that. Okay. Virals have no nucleus. There's no respiratory system. There's no circulatory system. There's no digestive system. Virals are not alive. That's like saying tide soap is alive. Okay. They're not alive. They are solvents. They are soaps. That's all they are. So when they're not making us the bad ones, when the bad ones are not making us sick, where are they? What are they doing? Well, what's happening is, like I said, we have colds, which are mainly bacterial, which go in and feed on toxic tissue that's been damaged, waste products that we are to, we don't eat well enough. We don't eat all raw. And therefore, we accumulate toxicity. So bacteria have to come in and eat that waste products because we're not, we can't keep up with all the waste. Gotcha. Okay. So that's what a cold is. Okay. A flu is mainly viral. Some bacteria may, some areas of your body may not be so contaminated that the bacteria, natural way that we cleanse with bacteria when we're overloaded with toxicity or waste products, bacteria will help us. But when we are so toxic that the bacteria are poisoned by the tissue from chemical inundation, then we have to make solvents. Each cell makes a solvent. Gotcha. Each cell makes a soap to help clean itself. Okay. And it's a union. It's like a factory. They all, particular cells get together and say, let's make this for us to help clean us. So they're making a soap to do that. So there's nothing dormant about it. I got it. It's just that when the accumulation of waste is so great and you can't use bacteria, then the cells make a solvent. There you go. And that's a flu. That's a virus. I want to start back at 1976, Arjunis. What happened in 1976 with the swine flu vaccine? Well, I was 29 and living in California at the time. And a Dr. McBean from, I forgot her first name. She's an MD. She and Ida Honoroff, who was a consumer advocate and was nationwide syndicated on like 3,000 radio networks. Right. Those two women showed that the swine flu was a hoax and that the swine flu vaccine that Ford and Rockefeller pushed through. David Walker was our vice president and owned controlling stock and many pharmaceuticals. They were behind the swine flu thing. Even Gerald Ford went on and received his swine flu shot. Of course, David Rockefeller didn't. And they showed that the swine flu was a hoax and that the vaccine was going to harm and kill people. And it did, in fact. Didn't some people die? I mean, a large number of people died from the vaccine. Isn't that right? Well, there were three that died right there at the poll immediately after they got it. According to Ida, I did a radio show with her. She had the figures that showed 2300 people, elderly people, died within two weeks of the shot as a result of the shot. In other words, they didn't have the flu before they got the shot and then they got the swine flu from the shot. That is the only way that a human being can get a bird flu or a swine flu is if it is injected in them. We do not have those tissue. Once an animal product goes into our stomach, it no longer holds the animal's tissue. It completely dissolves it and makes it into human tissue. So there's no way we can get a swine flu or a bird flu, avian flu, any other flu. Years ago, they used to blame it on races, you know, the Spanish flu, the Mexican flu and stuff like that. Then when Rockefeller and Carnegie started taking over the universities in the early 1900s, you know, shortly after that, after the Spanish flu incident, they started blaming everything on animals. Monkey flu, monkey aids, you know, all this stuff. They're always blaming an animal, an unnatural creature. They're always blaming nature. You cannot get a virus into another animal. Viruses are cellularly produced in their whole form. So if a human cell creates a virus, it can only be done inside a human body or in a test tube where you have human cells. So there's no cross species of flu. Viruses, it's impossible. You can get herpes from another human being, obviously. No, you can't. No, that is false also. So how do people transfer herpes from one person to another? They don't. That also a fallacy. They're saying, okay, the bears in northern Mexico come out of hibernation, and then the next-door bears come out of hibernation all the way through the United States, all the way up to Canada and all the way up to Alaska. So you're saying that that is an epidemic. We have a bear epidemic. The swine, any kind of flu is the same thing. When the climate temperature is right, certain tissues will cleanse, and they may go in a seven-year cycle. They may have a six-month cycle. It depends upon the tissue and how contaminated it is. If certain tissue needs to clean out every two years it will create, and you can't use the bacteria, your body will create a solvent, a virus. That cleans that particular tissue every two years, every six months, every three months, every seven years, every 12 years, depending upon that tissue and how contaminated it is. You cannot, herpes, you know, that's all a fiction of the pharmaceutical industry themselves. So in other words, if someone has a herpes, let's say a genital herpes, wouldn't they be able to transfer it to someone else, especially if it's a man to a woman since the inside of the vagina is basically mucous membrane. It doesn't have the same barrier as, it doesn't have a stratum corneum like the outer dermis does. Couldn't you transfer it that way then? Well, can you, do you think tide soaks contagious? No, it's not. I use it. OK, tide soaks contagious, solvents are not contagious. I can inject it into you. And then? And then you would get sick. I got you, OK. And that's how people get to the only way people can get swine flu is if they've taken animal, a pig tissue, grown it in a solvent, toxic environment, and then the swine cells create a virus to break itself down. OK, now let's, OK. You can inject it into a human, and then you will find those actual swine tissue in there. Which is where the virus would end up having some place to reside then. Correct. No, there's no place to reside because they're not alive to reside. It's just you have a waste product and now the body has to clean that waste product out of the body. And it's going to be very alarmed because you've got foreign tissue in there injected into the body. That's why guillion bear disease. That's why anaphylactic shock occurs when you inject people with foreign debris, foreign tissue. It goes into shock. It can even die from the shock of foreign tissue being injected into you. OK. All right. Let me ask you a question now. In the email that you sent me, you postulated that perhaps some of this vaccine that was created back in 1976, which killed so many people. It has just been vaulted. It has not been destroyed, you say, correct? Correct. They were supposed to destroy it, but my understanding from one laboratory technician that I know who works at that lab, they vaulted it. They put it in a vault. That makes no sense to me why they would even vault something that killed people. Because there seems to be certain people out there and even President Kennedy a month before he died said in the speech, there is a secret society that means to get rid of and annihilate certain people. The Bush family was connected with Hitler. They financed Hitler. They're into annihilating people to destroying races and stuff like that. So you've got these people that Kennedy tried to warn us about because he was in that affluent society with many of those people. Right. And they intend to destroy a lot of the population as soon as the resources became very low and the resources are getting pretty low and we've got 6 billion people on the planet and according to some of the information that's delivered to us, they want to get rid of 4.5 billion people. So this is all part of the New World Order process that's occurring supposedly here in the country. Well, some people call it New Order, World Order, other people call it other things, skull and bone groups from Yale. Right. Yeah, so that's part of it. And they gave the task of looking at overpopulation to Henry Kissinger back in the 60s. And he wrote a paper that's about 280-some pages. I think that's about 260. And he talks about the greatest way to get rid of overpopulation is to inject people with contaminated medications. Really? He wrote that. Yes. And you can look at the paper, look under overpopulation, Henry Kissinger, Ronnie's search engine, and you'll come up with that paper. And then that was given to the NSA, National Security Association, also the military, and the government secret services. And they all voted on a particular proposition. I forgot the number, 281, something like that. And that gave the military and secret services, secret military divisions the right to start biological warfare and experimentation on US citizens. So now this vaccine that was manufactured that killed all those people that has since been vaulted for no apparent good reason, how would it have found it? No, the apparent reason is that they want to reuse it. No, no, that's not a good reason. I'm saying it's a reason, but it's not a good reason. You mean it's not a healthy and compassionate and humanitarian idea. Right, it's a sinister reason. So how does it find its way to Mexico? Well, a few months ago, the Mexican government gave out free flu vaccines. That's what I was going to ask, were these people vaccinated? Yes. So obviously they were given this, some of the swine flu vaccine was taken out of the vault, given to the Mexican authorities, probably with a lot of money in their pocket. And they gave it to, you know, some clinics and then it was being injected into people. And then when people got such a reaction, then it was, you know, they found swine tissue in their bloodstream and in their kidneys maybe and the bladders, you know, that's about the only place you could really find it and detect it in a laboratory test. So they find it and then you have to understand that see how this media campaign is so fast? Oh, I know, it's explosive. It already had to be, it had been set up. They were already ready for the cases to be discovered. You can't have 85 cases show up and all of a sudden, oh my God, you know, we've got an epidemic on our hands. It could be a pandemic. To be reported, they would have to show that they're very unusual cases. They would have to, even when they go to have the laboratory test something, it never tests for anything that the laboratory is not directed to test for. And that's, and I was just going to ask you that. I mean, they would have had to specifically been looking for swine flu in these individuals. Exactly, exactly. So this has all been set up. It's a whole media campaign to sell what? They're trying to sell Donald Runsell's Tamiflu. I know, I'm getting emails. They're going to pull the swine flu out of the vaults again and start selling the swine flu vaccine. I've been inundated with emails from Canadian pharmacies telling me to start buying Tamiflu now before it runs out. That's amazing. You said that. I got three emails today alone from three different Canadian pharmacies. Yeah. Well, the media's recommending people use Tamiflu to fight against the swine flu. All you have to do to fight against the swine flu is never get an injection from a doctor. Or an injection from anybody. The only way you can get any kind of foreign animal tissue into your body is by injection. Ajit, as you said something at the beginning of the show that you also put in the email, and I'd like you to elaborate on it. You say that AIDS was created in a laboratory. Yes. In Los UCLA, University of California, Los Angeles, 1961 and 1962, they created a mixture of what they did was combine the waste product, the virus of a bovine, the lymph, let's see, the lymphenomic virus of a sheep and the leukemic virus of a bovine. These are bovines. The way you can only get a virus, like I said, is if the tissue is so toxic with chemicals that bacteria can't do the normal janitorial work and eat the organic tissue and then reduce the waste and eliminate little waste. When your body makes a solvent, the way which is a virus, the solvent is a virus, it's a soap, it's not alive. There's no nucleus, no respiratory system, no digestive tract, no circulatory system. There's none of that. So it's not alive. It's a waste product. Right. It's dissolved animal tissue. Right. And specific animal tissues. So what they do is they take animal tissue and put it in a petri dish in a contaminated environment but with enough solution to keep them alive. So the cells start taking themselves apart with solvents. And will eventually kill the cell. This virus will kill the cell. It'll kill itself by poisoning itself and taking itself apart. I want to stay on track here for a second. We're kind of going back to what we talked about in the first half of the show. I want to ask you to elaborate more on how the AIDS virus is created in a lab at UCLA. For what purpose would they create something like that? They were trying to create, according to the records that I got to see, and they were discovered by a Dr. Robert Strecker. I'm a nutritional doctor. Got my PhD in nutrition. Dr. Strecker has like four doctorates and one is in biochemistry and virology. Right. Now the only way that you can make a virus is get it in a pastry dish with the animal tissue. The only way that animal tissue can ever get into a human is if it is injected with another animal. So what they did was they incubated these two diseases from both a sheep and a cow, the leukemic virus of a cow, the bovine, and the lymphenomic virus of the sheep. They put those two together and created a new kind of deadly biological warfare disease. So they did that. Was that the reason for it? Were they trying to come up with a new biohazard, a new biological welfare? They could have been the reason, but they put in their paperwork. It was to create cancer. It was to force cancer in laboratory animals so they could study cancer. That is very suspicious reasoning to me to come up with something deadly like that. There are already lots of agents out there that will cause spontaneous tumor and cancers in rats. Exactly. You can put cadmium in it. You have kidney cancer in weeks, overloading with cadmium. There are lots of ways. So this was a suspicious reasoning for me to my thinking. But it was done. Dr. Strecker called his brother, was an attorney, and said, this is where it leads. Follow it. So his brother checked the NSA, the War Department, and yes, that information had been sent to those departments. And it was allowed, it was given the green light to be used in experiments. So we found out the experiments were undesirables. They figured that in these particular committees that the undesirables were homosexuals. Right. Now, how could they administer this to homosexuals to see the consequences of this particular formulation? Well, you just have to find homosexuals who also intravenous drug users and then spike the heroin or the speed or whatever they're shooting with some of this stuff, I guess. No, you still can't get a good population that way. What they found was that in Los Angeles, New York City, Houston, and San Francisco, that 90% of the people who were being treated for hepatitis were homosexuals because they used a lot of drugs, damaged the liver. So hepatitis is a viral detoxification because there's so many chemicals in the liver, your bacteria from the liver can't clean it. So your body has to, the liver cells have to make solvents, which are, again, viruses. So it makes a self-cleaning substance. So all of your hepatitis are diseases trying to reverse a toxic condition where the liver is about to stop working completely. When you get to hepatitis, that means your liver is in terrible shape. No bacteria can help you. So you're saying they contaminated the hepatitis vaccine? The vaccine. With this AIDS virus. And they injected, that's why 10% of the population in those cities who got AIDS were not homosexuals, they were heterosexuals. Then they went and put it in the smallpox vaccine. The US government and the UK government donated hundreds of millions of dollars of smallpox vaccine to African countries. Then all of these do good meaning groups, you know, go out and administer and going to save the world by giving all these vaccines to African children and everybody to save their lives. You know, from smallpox. We're given this AIDS virus in the smallpox vaccine. That's amazing. 125 million were donated. How many cases of AIDS were propped up in Africa within a year? I don't know that number but I remember it was 95 million. 75 million people died. Then with the US government and the UK government did went to those countries and said, listen, we have, you know, help for AIDS. We have chemotherapy, which is AZT. We have chemotherapy that we can help your people with. We can help you stop this disease. We can treat your people. We can bring the medical in but you will owe us a lot of money. Now, they charged so much money that no way these countries could pay back. So when all was said and done and all these people were dead and very few people ever came through the AIDS without death, the US government, the UK government says, oh, you owe us this much money. If you can't pay it, you owe us your country's resources. Wow. So they turned over the country's resources to be run by the World Bank. So that took, we took over the US government and the UK government took over 27 African countries with that AIDS, hoax and inundation. It's just like they used a different kind of warfare to usurp another country's resources. It's like war like, you know, any of the Spanish, you know, the Roman... They're waging a stealth war almost like a Trojan horse war because they are being perceived as they're being invited in. They're being perceived as the saviors but they're really the ones creating the problem so that they can come in and finish the job. Absolutely. And if you read the book there are sessions of a financial hit-band. I think that's the title. It talks about this man who worked for the US government and the CIA. They went in and, you know, loaned great amounts of money to foreign countries, foreign governments that could never pay it back and then would take over their resources. Wow. Something that I never gave much thought to. You know, I was born in 1958 and I don't have the mark on my arm from a polio vaccine so I don't know that I ever got it but I remember it was very popular back then and you pointed something out that was really interesting. While people were running to get the polio vaccine there were large numbers of people who were not getting the vaccine and they were not seeing the outbreak in polio. For instance, the Amish and the Mennonites they didn't go for the polio vaccine back then and their kids didn't get polio and the other interesting thing is all these third world countries, why are they not overrun by polio today well because it's another hoax. Polio is a disease that comes out maybe every 28 years and it'll have its peak and diminish sometimes it will be strong but it's usually every maybe 240 years of polio will create a a severe reaction in humans. Now polio is a polio myelitis everybody has it's a bacterial detoxification of the spinal cord. So it usually takes many many generations before the spinal cord will get that toxic to where a whole race will have to go through a heavy detoxification at the same time. That doesn't mean it's contagious it means that the toxicity builds up all in the whole race at a particular time and everybody needs to cleanse their spinal cords at the same time. So it's not a contagious thing. The detoxification came necessary right after canned foods came into being during the World War II. So 1945 to 1947 canned foods became a regular staple of our supermarkets. So people were eating canned metal combinations, amalgams of metals that were implanting themselves in the spinal cord because this nervous system uses a lot of metallic minerals to conduct electricity and transfer light. So all of these free radical metals coming from 10 were getting into the spinal cord. So by mid-1950s we had a huge amount of cases of polio and they weren't in the people who were eating normal food they were in the more affluent neighborhoods who were living on canned foods like you know my parents did they loved the new error of technology. So they came up with a polio vaccine and that was breeding polio tissue monkey spinal cords they would decompose that tissue and then say this is going to prevent disease and then that was liquid mercury, liquid aluminum formaldehyde, ether and detergent. Those were just five of the 68 ingredients. All the other ingredients are labeled inert. Inert for what? And what is an inert matter? Doesn't mean it's not non-toxic. It just means that it's not indicated as part of the solution of the problem given. But it's very toxic material. So you have all of these toxic substances. Now, when the polio vaccine came out in 1958 it was a year after the polio almost became extinct. It was down to 1% of the normally infected population that had preceded before it. Not 1% of the whole population but all of the people who had been infected, it was down to 1% of the highest rate of infection. So they introduced the vaccine on the heels of it going away on its own in other words. Not only the heels, actually the trail. So they took complete credit for getting rid of polio. They were already gone. And you point out that in other countries polio is not a problem and they don't get polio vaccines. Correct. Do we still give children polio vaccines today? Absolutely. They get three in their lifetime, minimum of three. And after I got my third I got in giant pectoris and diabetes within days after my third vaccine. So you obviously had a reaction from it. What is that? Human Pempeloma virus vaccine on a lot of young girls now and they're trying to make the parents feel guilty if they don't let them. I would never let my kids get a vaccine of any type whatsoever. Absolutely. They're all poison. And there's no record that they ever prevent anything. When I was in Paris studying at the Sorbonne Pasteur's material I had to have somebody help me because I don't do well in French. And it was all written in French, of course. Right. And not one of the animals he ever vaccinated lived. Really? Not one ever lived. They all died of amaphylactic shock or severe flus. That's shocking. Yeah. And so there's no real foundation for that supports that these vaccines do anything then. Correct. Now how can you say oh, you're likely to get you take this you're going to prevent it? When many people who get the vaccines actually get the disease. There was one percent of all that. In 1958 there were three states in one city that kept record of polio cases. And they found that the numbers went all the way up to 484 percent increase in polio all of them all of the cases among people who had received three or more vaccines. Wow. Polio vaccines. So when you're injected polio tissue into somebody, you're going to give them polio. Well, I've never gone. I went for a flu shot when I was a young adult, when I lived in Las Vegas my mother called me and said, you know, the flu is going around and you should go get a flu shot. I never thought about it. I had all the symptoms of a flu. I was sick and down and out for about two days. You were given a flu. I thought to myself, I'm never going to do that again. That would be stupid. Absolutely is stupid. There's not one person that doesn't get sick from a flu vaccine. They may get a little nauseous. They may have diarrhea. They may have some vomit. They may get dizzy. They may get very sleepy for days. Everybody has a reaction. The chances of your reaction is the same reaction you would come in contact with if you had the straight flu injected in you anyway. You probably would survive it anyway. It really wouldn't matter. The key to all of this, and we can come back around and talk about it. Let me also say one thing that's very important. There's a lot of your viewers, I mean your listeners who are saying, well, look at the Spanish flu vaccine. The Spanish flu was the first vaccine ever made. It was given to people all over the world. Only people who got the vaccine got that flu. And that was by, I forgot the man's name. He wrote Man's Correct Diet. It's a book. It was written in 1928. Something like that. When he had gathered all of the information, he was an engineer for a health company. And he proved that the vaccine created the disease. And anybody treated by the medical profession would die. That's the truth. Because they would compound it with penicillin and other drugs. It's amazing. It just continues to go on. My biggest frustration is that the medical orthodoxy does not look at people like people. They look at us as organisms. A vehicle for them to achieve what they want to achieve. It's a parasitic relationship. They want us to depend on them forever and ever by their drugs. They have lots of cars and swimming pools and big families. So there's the key. If you never want to get the swine flu, don't go get the swine flu vaccine. Don't get any injection. You never know what's in them. I reject myself with testosterone part of my hormone replacement therapy. I'm talking from a doctor. There you go. I actually buy my testosterone from a laboratory that I know of and I trust them implicitly. No, I know you're right. The follow you stay away from most physicians there's a handful of good physicians out there. They don't get me wrong. They're not all bad. The ones that just follow the company line, they don't use their own brains. There's a lot of book says to do for this and that. Those are the ones you have to stay clear of.