 Hello, we are recording Jenkins and Google Summer of Code office hours. Today is March 11th, so if you watch this recording, we have just one week left before the student application starts. And we use all the possible time to help students with their project proposals. So today, we will run a standard agenda and after that, of course, there will be Q&A. So if anyone has any questions about the projects, please ask here. And of course, we are ready to organize that hoc sessions, like this one, like once we organized last week. Okay, so we have a number of people on the call. Let's just go through the agenda. So the first item, which we discussed at the previous meeting is about collisions between Jenkins and continuous delivery foundation JSOC organizations. So we spent some time to discuss that we CDF team, and right now all profiles are updated. So if you go to some of this code. So here, if you go to, okay, I'll start in the coordinator. Okay, so if you go to organizations, now there is an updated CDF page, updated to all the resources. And when you open the page, you can see that it redirects you to the Jenkins project specifically here in the descriptions. And now if you go to project ideas, you fix the bit as well and here for Jenkins and Jenkins X again it redirects us to our resources. So in the current state, we think that the problem is solved. So students reaching out to continuous delivery foundation can find the Jenkins organization. And at the same time, we started the channels and continuous delivery foundation so that we can contact other projects and the CDF or partners quickly if any changes are needed. So this is the first update. The second update is just about my capacity. So now I'm not stepping down. Actually, it's quite opposite because to some discussions with other core maintenance, I will be reducing my involvement in Jenkins core and other components for the next months so that I have more capacity for application reviews and for other meetings with Google summer of course students. So sorry for all the delays. I hope I will have more time. Okay, any other news and updates. Okay. Do we have any new mentors on the call? I guess not. And action items. So last time we discussed few option items and I guess some of them are completed. So I submitted a pull request for Jambatron. I haven't submitted a blog post yet. But it's still to do. Our admin meeting is done. We have a meeting today right after this call and after that we will be meeting for half an hour before every office hours. And Jenkins online meetup. I'm not sure whether you've seen the message in the JSOC public mailing list, but now there is a doodle. It's on the different mentors right now. But we will be doing online meetup or two online meetups next week to present JSOC, to present projects and to do some Q&A. I didn't send it to the public mailing list right now because it's less important for students who have already reached out to the project because you already know a lot of details about the projects you're interested in. So the main objective for these meetups is to help newcomer students to start quickly if they're interested. But if you're interested, you're still welcome to join. And I will forward the message to the public mailing list after the meeting. Okay. Quick start for automatic specification. It's still to do. Okay. Let's eat. Are there any other open action items? I will likely be writing a blog post for Jenkins X. Okay. Nothing from my end. Okay. Thank you. And by the way, you probably missed it. One thing that you. Well, that was my session this weekend. Right. That's correct. Okay. We went in and out. We couldn't hear you entirely. Yes. Can you hear me okay? Yes. Hold on. Can you hear me better now? Yes. Okay. Yes, I did do a. There's a university in Western Africa. And it's part of the Google student developer program. I did a presentation with them. Also a Q and a. Sorry. And if anybody else is interested, just to do it in your cities. Or maybe online. Taking the current situation or likely online, because for example, I had a plan to do presentation in a show. It's canceled. Yeah. Online events. I still do. And I hope to do one Russian speaking event. Next week. Can you hear me now? Yes. Okay. A recording is all it started all over the market. So you get an action item to match to recordings now. This is my action item. I will finish my update. I met with the wet West South African. And I was like, I don't know if that was said right. And a university in South Africa. And we did a session about Google summer of code as well as a Q and a, and it was really good. It was well received. There was, I think over a hundred people that joined. And that was just really, really good. So I was very happy to do that. I can say that I was there. So I know it was really good. Thanks a lot for doing so. And as we discussed, please do such kind of promotions because it's really important not only for Jenkins, but for Google summer of code entirely because JSOC is 16 years older this year, but still the rest students who run it aware about it somehow. And now spreading the word is useful because more people get about union to send. JSOC is a really great program, whether you participate in Jenkins or not. I do have a question for Kara. Kara for your Jenkins X blog post, are you going to be doing that under the Jenkins banner? I will be certainly publishing it on the Jenkins X docs and blog site, but I'm very happy to publish it under the Jenkins site as well. And certainly I'll be linking to the Jenkins site and where all the projects are listed. Okay. I'm not sure it makes sense to repost it on the Jenkins site. Well, we definitely will definitely do reposts and whatever if needed. But the main objective is Jenkins X because right now Jenkins and Jenkins X have separate communities. There is a lot of intersections, but getting it posted on Jenkins X would definitely help. Okay. So what else do we have? So Jenkins online meetup basically stays. So it's next week. We start for automatic specification generator again. It's actual though we discussed it at the meeting yesterday, but putting it on the proposal would be nice. So sorry for the delay today. Regarding the rest, one, I think I wish I didn't mention news. It's mostly poor card means is that this year we will need to change how we do the payments. Because we don't want to go with SPI this year. Well, we have SPI as a plan B and thanks a lot to them. To giving us such escape hatch. But our main plan is to find a way to do reimbursements to participants through maybe community breach or links foundation resources. Because many people will be traveling. Many people will be doing the JSOX work and other things. And right now this SPI takes a while to get reimbursements. It's not a grumbling because SPI is powered by volunteers. So they help us a lot. But the resources are really limited. So by going to payments driven by Linux foundation, we could probably do payments more quickly. Maybe within weeks of the submission. It's definitely better than the current situation. So it's just heads up for mentors and students who experienced these problems in the previous years. Okay. Anything else to discuss? And before we go to Kenny. Margie was your session recorded on Saturday. I'm waiting for the organizer to get me the recording. I did ping them yesterday afternoon, which would have been their morning. I am waiting for that. Okay. I'll get that over to everybody and then also get a tweet out. Great. Thank you. Thank you. You're welcome. Okay. And before we move on to connect. Does anybody want to discuss the application process? We have some students. Participating in JSOC first time. So if you want to, we can do quick introduction there. I will add a note in regards to the application process when students that are on the call, if you, if you're not aware that the proposal process is not a proposal that you send to us, you can send it to us for a review. And we're more than happy to, we're more than happy to guide you through that. But this application process actually goes to Google. And I just wanted to call that out. Yeah. That's exactly what I wanted to mention. So this is the portal or somewhere with, a summer of code is Google.com. Anybody can register there. So there are or admin mentor and student interfaces. They're different. If I understand correctly, students cannot log in right now into this feature will be available on March 16th. And you will need to submit your proposal through the website. So how it works. You basically register your set the agreement. Please make sure to read it carefully because there are some mentions about eligibility and other things. So just double check it to make sure that you're on the safe side. And after that, you will be able to submit a proposal draft. So you don't have to submit your final proposal. You can firstly submit a draft. And our recommendation is to do it earlier because in such case firstly, or condomins. Yeah. Thanks, Martin. Okay. So. Yeah. In this case. Okay. Let's go back to that. So when you submit your proposal draft earlier as Oracle means, we know that firstly, you will declare your intent to apply. There is already something submitted. So in the case your internet gets turned off for one week or whatever, you already have a kind of application. And as often means we can prioritize the reviews. We can prioritize finding mentors opinion them. If you see that there are proposals staged because we had a lot of discussions in the many lists, but these discussions state discussions until the proposal is submitted. And so our recommendation is to submit drafts earlier. If you dislike your draft, you can dismiss it later if you want. Or you can submit your final application later for final application. Again, it's recommended to submit it not 30 minutes before the deadline, but a bit earlier because yeah, Google summer off code team does a great work on scalability. I'm not sure how the site works, but still the last hours of JSOC applications. So there is a lot of applications coming in and the site is quite slow. So better to submit earlier. Yeah. The application is safe itself is quite trivial. So I think you will be able to do it quickly. Just don't leave it till the last days. Any questions about that? And yeah, since we speak about applications, I would like to open this page again. So I know that many students have already reviewed that student proposals. So here we have some documentation about what we expect. So it's based on the official JSOC student guide, which you can use as a reference, but we also make some additional suggestions about what we expect to see there. One of important topics is disclosing your availability because it's one of our main retrospective takeaways. Everybody has exams, vacations and other things. It's not a problem. We anticipated to happen, not only in the case of students, but also in the case of mentors. But it's nice to know it in advance so that we can do planning carefully. And if you already have a full-time job, just think twice before applying to JSOC because again, JSOC is important, but it's not as important as your career or as your study. So please focus on them first. And if you have time for JSOC, it's much appreciated. JSOC is considered as a full-time job and combining two full-time jobs is usually not a good idea. Okay, any questions before we move on? Okay, then we have a few mentors, a few students on the call. Are there any questions which we haven't discussed yet? Samit, are you muted? I'm so sorry. So what I was saying is that the template given on the student guide, is it a very hard requirement to follow it exactly or if I cover all the sections, then I'm good? There is no harsh requirements. So there is a Google Summer of Code student guide and in this guide there is expectation, for example, deliverables are clear, dates are clear, why it's important, because your proposal is what will be a base for evaluation. So that Google or code means can intervene in the case if something goes wrong. So all these plans are not slated in stone. You as a JSOC team, so students and mentors can make a lot of adjustments during community bonding and during coding. And what is our organization's approach is as long as everything goes well and as long as mentors are happy, we are happy. But sometimes something goes wrong and this is when these proposals get important because it helps everyone to evaluate what was exactly planned. But even without that, having a clear proposal is important because mentors will be re-evaluating it. So they will be making decisions based on your proposal, based on your contribution history. It doesn't mean a code contribution, but whatever discussions like these meetings, et cetera, it's also something we take into account. But still final and clear proposal is what really matters when we get to the project selection because usually we have much more good applications than we can accept. So there is a lot of decision making which is going to happen in April. Okay. Does anybody want to add something? Hello. This is the first... My name is Ifoma. This is the first time I'm joining the meeting. So my question is based on the proposal. So based on the documents or the things that are required, so you have something that is expected of the students to achieve. So my question is, those things that have been expected for the students to achieve, are you supposed to write the code for those things and submit it as part of your proposal or is it just the things that you need to do after when you've been accepted? Because sometimes you see like implementation, people write step-by-step implementation of what they have done or what they want to do. So I don't understand that part. Do you need to add those things? Are you speaking more in relations to the machine learning project? Yes. Okay. There is no... We do not expect... I'm actually one of the potential mentors for that project and I thank you for submitting your interest in that project. We do not have a code requirement, but as a... One thing we do ask is to see in advance some things you may have worked on that could help show that you have an idea or you have a solid foundation about the project, but we do not expect code up front. Okay. So the step-by-step of what the students will be expected to achieve is not something you should do now. In your proposal, this is more of the logic of how you plan to achieve the goal of the project, but not the actual implementation of it. Just more your logic. Okay. So there's no need... Sorry. I'm not done. So there's no need to add implementation of how you want to do it. You know, you would add the implementation, but from a word perspective, I would do this or in the first coding phase, I would do this. You're just basically saying what your idea of implementation for that project is. Okay. Okay. Thanks. You're welcome. Think of it more as I'm writing the specifications of how I'm going to do this body of work. Okay. Yeah. Makes sense. Thanks. Yeah. I have a good question. Is there a page limit for the proposal? No. Okay. I mean, I definitely don't want a thesis. I'm only speaking from my review. A thesis or dissertation or capstone project. I think you need to think about this as you want to cover your abstract, meaning you're defining what the problem is. And then you're going to say, here are the steps I'm going to do in the given framework. Sure. So historically we had different proposal sizes. I guess our maximum was about 40 pages or so. It's still smaller than a thesis, but definitely wasn't that convenient for potential mentors to review. Smallest ones were just a few lines or CVS in some cases. But usually proposals take, let's say from three to six pages. We really don't want you to deep dive into the implementation details. It's nice to have some details, because they show that you did a research about the project and that you understand what would be needed to be done there, but don't try it for specification. It's needed at all. Not needed. If you go back to the original questions about code. Firstly, I second to what Marty said. We do not require anyone to write code, but if code helps you to write a good proposal, just do it. If doing some contributions to the project helps you. Again, just because it's really important and historically the most accepted students we had did some contributions, because it really helps to make a proposal of a better quality. It's your choice how you approach that. There is no strong requirement. Okay. Anything else? Nothing for me. Yeah, I had one for the customer service build proposal. Is there any plans for a further meeting because I was almost preparing proposal drop so like, is that possible? Could we have a tool or something? Yeah, we do it upon request. So if you request it, we can do my meeting. Yeah, if it's possible. I mean, I could, I was just completing my job. So I might have a meeting list by tonight. If at all, if you could arrange one. Okay. Yeah. So one problem with that is that everybody has limited capacity. So in my case, I already sent six GSO related doodle invites for the next week. Okay. And yeah, I'm not sure I will be able to do just another meeting next week. I sure no, no, no issues. You can do it when with other potential mentors. But yeah, I'll create a little or you could just ask in the main increased because there is an active main increased about this project idea. Okay. Thanks. Actually, there is another option. There will be a platform seek meeting tomorrow. Amazing. So if you want, I can put it to the agenda. Yep. I'll be attending a meeting. Okay. What, what time is it in? I think it's known UTC or something like that. Just a second. 2pm UTC, I think, which is 6am Pacific time. No, it's actually known UTC. Yeah, because this meeting time changed. You can always find it. Usually you can find actual time here or on the Jenkins event calendar. Yes. Since we're on this page, I will just put it to the agenda. It's 12 noon UTC, right? Yes. Okay. Thank you. Okay. So it's tomorrow. Okay. And again, if any video wants to have a discussion for projects you're interested in, just request it in the mailing list. There is no need to wait till the next office hours to do that because in such case you lose a week. And the fast mailing list request as good as requests on the call. Anything else for today? Let's see if there is something in chat. Okay. Making mental note for Martin's birthday present. Plus one. Okay. So if that's all, I think we can close down the meeting. So again, welcome to summertime to America's. And in the case of Europe, we go to summertime, I believe, in two weeks. So it's always an interesting meeting in J. So because it's firstly critical meeting at the same time, everybody has a mess in their calendars because of time zone changes. But we will try to figure it out. Does anybody else have any questions, comments, concerns? Too easy. Okay. Then you get 10 minutes of your life back. Yeah. Thanks everyone. So see you next week or at one of the meetings we are going to schedule. So there will be a lot of meetings over the next two weeks. And again, there is no mandatory meetings. You as a student, decide which meetings you want to attend. Well, if you're a mentor, we actually kindly ask you to attend the meetings related to your projects. But students, you just prepare your applications. And this is your main and only priority for the next two weeks. So whatever helps, just let us know you do our best to help you. Awesome. Thank you, everybody. See you all online. Bye. Bye.