 Hello everybody. If it's Wednesday, then it's Warhammer even when it's only noon Eastern. Hey, that's right We're here with an early show. It's gonna be a short show even with Tyler. I promise it's gonna happen What's going on Tyler? How you doing buddy? It's weird. There's a light coming in. It's not dark. You can kind of see me It's uncomfortable. Yeah. Yeah, we normally we normally you know worm weekly as oftentimes We live in the night in the darkness and every so often we we come up here and yes, we have to We join the we join that the daytime we Guy put a put a screen up up there, but today we're gonna talk about the battle scroll and stuff like that, but of course first Let's get into the news. So what do we got ma'am? The news the world-class segment We've been doing forever everybody's favorites. We we clearly enjoy it We're not we're not tired of this segment at all rumor engine Nope, we always have great things interesting things to say about the rumor engine photos. Yep. It's a stick with a rock Yep, I think it's upside down. I'll say that Okay, somebody was like why does Vince talk about the rumor engine? He clearly hates them all. Hey, look listen person Who was speaking truth? Okay? Um The issue is they keep making crappy rumor engines. I don't know what to tell you So like make one that's actually somewhat guessable and not garbage and that's fine This one is like kind of interesting. I guess because it's clearly saw it like a Sort of I think by the way, this is definitely an iOS thing and specifically I think this is going to be a war cry or underworlds thing That's that's my guess. I think it is a little bejangle hanging off of like, you know a serif on or a Cruel boy or a something like that. Yeah, you recognize the marking at all that circle with the line. I didn't know No, yeah Yeah Ski VT says Vince hates everything. That's not true. I just hate most things just most things There are plenty of things I do like just most but I mean it's a big universe, you know Uh Yeah, I don't know. It's but that's I have no other great insights beyond that stick with rock Love it Well, are we good? I think it's fantastic So I see you have battle scroll here. That's the only other news thing because everything this week is 40k So we'll talk about battle scroll in the main segment. Don't worry. We're gonna get into it We're gonna we're gonna get deep amongst it talk about it. I do think it's a pretty exciting battle scroll There's a lot of like actual quality stuff in here I'm happy to see so Truly better late than never I suppose Okay, so with that Let's just let's just get straight into pick of the week man. What will fast Ever or I mean, there's just no news this week. I don't know what to tell you All right pick of the week Tyler. What do you want to share with everybody? Yes, sir So I'm cheating on multiple levels this week, but let's start with the terrain directory I put way too much work into this insane terrain directory Everybody if you're interested in a train any interest in terrain, please check it out Justified the months of compilation and crap that I did on the silly directory. It's a huge compilation of about well, most of the 3d printed terrain SDLs etc that are out there around the world and all of the different game app providers organized by theme You know winter greenery desert and so on so hopefully it's useful Anthony Pocaccio and David Griffin are responsible for this insanity. They started the love of terrain So there you go. Did you see that? Did you at least open it for me? I you are you're my friend. You got at least open it. Did I open the document? Yeah, I open the document Yes, okay. Thank you. That's kind. I appreciate that Why would I not you said it to me I looked at it And Number two war coda battle reports. So this is multiple levels of cheating We've got you know too many to do I really appreciate the channels that are covering it. It's been amazing Battle Shock War gaming Ridge and Jordan had an incredible game on the members only season of war saga of dice with Matias and Carson and Rob and all those guys the weird cast The Austin folks weird knobs they they did one a live stream that was really cool. So anyway, yeah bunch of links We're gonna have for that and let's just remind everybody war coda is the set of additional battle plans that Tyler worked with some others to create to supplement your battle plan needs if you're feeling a little burnt out on the GHP battle plans or you just want to try some new exciting updated versions that sometimes are paying homage to previous Great battle plans from AOS history Including what I think is a fair balanced and genuinely fun Relocation orb. I have gotten in multiple games by the way with war coda. I want you to know that Tyler Like honestly, it's the only battle plans. I'm using right now All of my recent AOS games have been just war coda games and I really like it. So So at any rate You can find that I'll link that down below as well when you're there. Hey You can download war coda for free. There's no cost to it, of course and get those battle plans, but but If you're gonna do that. Hey, why not throw, you know, five bucks or something in the tip jar for Tyler for all of his hard work and Testing and refining and creating all these battle plans. You can find that link down below I had people my friends, you know friends like these torture me all weekend with like, you know 20 bucks extra for a signed copy, you know a photo. It's a little bit more on top Oh, so that was fun. I enjoyed that. Anyway, yeah, this this influencer life is I don't know Vince. I don't know I don't know about this life. It's a rough life. Yeah, absolutely Okay, so For myself my pick of the week is gonna be our good friends Scott and John maniac and in John and trapped under plastic specifically this last episode was great because they had Our good buddy Jason craze the owner and leader and grand potentate of monument hobbies on there And he's talking all about sort of his journey and making paint and all of that kind of stuff Obviously monument hobbies is somebody I've worked closely with that's where I made my Made my signature set of paints with them. They're a great company Just incredibly supportive incredibly community friendly like just all around amazing amazing people who work there one of the reasons One of the major ways that I decide who I want to sort of partner with and talk about stuff is when they're actually like good people Like I don't want to partner with a holes. I don't care if they they have money or something that's really not interesting to me and Jason and Jen it's basically a family and Jordan who's their their painter and all of that basically everybody from monument is super awesome and The way that they've supported the community is fantastic over the years They're always ready with like prizes with support with showing up at conventions and helping people and providing paint to folks and stuff like that So and and and they make all of their stuff here in the US so there you go there they They actually assemble and test all their paints and stuff like that here Their brushes are actually getting moved over here And that will make them like the basically the only manufacturer of quality sable brushes in the United States when once they get the production facilities finished Being set up here because they're they're they're they're on shoring everything here It was originally they were working with Germany, but they you know, they wanted to bring everything into the States So there you go So super cool at any rate the So check out that link down below for that trapped under plastic episode Everything we talked about is linked down in the description. So go check everybody out. Tell them we sent you say hi Vin sent you. Okay. So With that, let's talk about some hobby time We're moving quick Tyler I'm good. Are we painting yet? Are we painting a model yet? When are one of them storm cast hitting the table? That's what I want to know Tyler I know I'm I'm still in my terrain. So this is a new phase. It is it is a mark It is quote unquote a model. It's terrain terrain still counts That's fine as long as you're regularly painting terrain. That's that's good lead up You just we got to eventually we got to eventually take the training wheels off and go to them go to a model Yeah, I've got to get this hobby night going again That was the main thing as I talked with you about right that actually got me painting and absolutely Give me feel like I was enjoying this and so I got to reach out to Jeff Cody and some friends to get that going again I need to do that later today and stop talking about it. So But yeah, doing a little bit of train played in a GT played some games over the weekend That was a lot of fun. I can't thank you midwest bash GT LaRon Roberts. Good friend. I held an awesome tournament One it's a shout out Jake Benprop who took the best overall. We're in the Midwest. We do best overall. Sorry everybody. It's it's still a thing. I Don't understand how everybody else doesn't We've talked about awards before in detail and it's still mystifying to me that like other people don't have the concept of just like best overall best General and then like best painted and best sports or something to that equivalent right to like that kind of community recognition Like it's such an obvious Triangle to me and it gets rid of all the problems because like the general is on battle points only the painted is on painted only the sports Or whatever it is the equivalent of like, you know being a good a good player is on that only And then you have the one who's like representing the pinnacle of the hobby I don't get how it's controversial and I don't get why everybody doesn't do it. It's so mystifying to me Just like the rest of the world doesn't know what we're talking about here There and meanwhile they're over here creating more and more complicated insane ways to play Warhammer I don't I don't know. It's like the award system seems very simple Yeah, so Yeah, so good time what was able to have a good showing for the Legion night so that was awesome and Yeah, good time nice My hobby time I did get a game in this weekend as well. I actually played the old world. I was rolling some brettz And some Bretonians we got the for the lady We got out the the noble knights and where it was glorious victory much honor was earned for the lady Perhaps too much of a victory frankly It was just pretty gross, but that was due to a couple things that broke my way and a couple things that definitely broke against my opponent But it's very fun And then I'm still painting this guy the tomb king here. I'm working him up All all of the non-metallic metal copper is done I really wanted to hone in on this and like work this and be thoughtful about every single surface on this miniature And he's almost done. I've got like a little bit of elements left to finish in some of his jade Sort of jewel pieces that adorn him and then that he will that and like the inside the inside wood of his shield I guess but other than that He's been a lot of fun. I really like this model. I have to say like this guy is great He's been super fun to paint. He's a really clean really crisp great model So this is a tomb king that comes out of the like he's the new sculpt that comes out of the big box Yep, basically, and I like him a lot. So great model So that's that's been my hobby time hours and hours and hours and hours and hours of doing the exact same Non-metallic process over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over again Because that's how you get better at stuff is you just drill it until it makes you insane. So that's the plan Well on the on the game of the society, I mean, it's good character building for your opponents. He needs that every once in a while sure Well, we'll play iOS or something next and I'll get my teeth roundly kicked in, you know, that's that's what'll happen It's generally how it how it goes. I've had very good luck. I'm not gonna call it anything else in in the old world against him and In every iOS game he where skill can be more expressed. He he generally roundly Puts me in the ground. So there you go Okay Cool. Well with that Tyler. Hey, look at that. Why don't we get on to the main subject, which is the battle scroll Okay, so let's boop, there we go. Let's start at the beginning here, man first things first before we get in any specificity How'd you feel about this overall what you think do you like it? Yeah, I did I Was glad to see they did quite a lot in this one You already got out the the asterisk on this one that we're all familiar with we don't have to hammer that But I was generally a fan of this one. I mean the conspiracy continues which Really makes the puts the entire enterprise in question Vince Venturella of a certain unit at a certain point cost Despite the efforts of some of us to correct this injustice, but you know other than that it's it's fine in dandy You're right judicators should be 220. I think we should start advocating for that now Yeah, they are they are way too cheap at 200 Tyler. I'm glad you're I'm glad you're leading this charge It's absolutely correct and I stand behind your your decisions. So yeah Just thinking about them the whole time against the 60 shots from the 26 inch threat range of the reverse three by 10 reverse You know to casual what like 160 180 points Ah, just just made me made me feel good. Well, they have that storm cast armor. So it really helps Yeah, that's a point for Tyler. Absolutely. That's four up, baby. That four up goes a long way. It's very strong. Absolutely Uh No, I agree overall, this was a very strong battle scroll lots of good changes. I'm I'm actually quite pleased with Uh, I do think there are some more opportunities with a couple things But for the most part, I think this was a really really good change across the board Uh, so I mean, hey, let's just get into some specifics. Shall we? sir All right, so first off We're gonna just dive through this. I've got all the individual FAQs that where there was meaningful changes teed up as well Okay, but we'll start with the battle scroll itself Um, so core battalion the wizard finders of ant do do door Uh, we're gonna try to make this not garbage. That's basically what we're doing here Uh add the following paragraph beginning of this ability. You get a five up spell ignore. There you go That's I'm not gonna read the whole text. That's what you get So if you're in wizard finders, you get a five up spell ignore tyler sir Are you ever putting this in a an army now? Oh, I'm interested to see if often what would happen is Do I have like four heroes right where I've got an extra small hero a not unique small hero That is kind of a dangler and Okay, I might think about maybe I got a behemoth that I like to keep alive I could throw that hero in the behemoth and then some units, you know, some elite units to give a little The general answers I don't think it's gonna have moved the needle a whole lot But I could see it getting some play in in some lists like it's gonna have some play on the margins. I think And But yeah, it's not gonna be a huge I like that They did it like it at least make yeah, I think if I know what people look at it The the old one uh aj. No, this is just because I'm going away with my wife here this afternoon And so I wouldn't be around this evening and the show must go on so hence earlier time show and tyler was nice Now we're doing this over our lunch break basically From our real work uh, so the My answer is it's still basically nothing Um, but I would put it exactly what you said. I think you caught it exactly Sometimes in skaven I won't have six heroes and if I have an odd number of heroes like and it's an army I don't care about drops anyways, right like skaven I'm always 50 million drops and I usually don't have I actually just don't have enough battalions to put people in That's what it comes down to I like run out of them and I'm like, I don't know. Maybe I'll just put somebody in vanguard I guess right I would put them in this over one of the crappy core ones in the in the core rules So we we beat the it's now better than the real bad ones Uh that are in the core rules. So okay, great good stuff Uh Battle tactics add the following battle tactic drain their power You complete this battle tactic at the end of your turn if a friendly hero with a null stone Adornment is contesting an objective that was controlled by your opponent at the start of your turn Okay, tyler. So we're directly handing a battle tactic tied to a null stone adornment Here to basically counterbalance the fact that there like so many of the battle tactics were tied to having a wizard Right and I will say I felt this uh Overall, I hate battle tactics and think they're they're poison garbage. Yes. I know I've never talked about it on the show This is a real new thing if people are right hearing about this for the first time That being said, this is a good addition to the season as a generic battle tactic because many times I play many armies without wizards I give them a null stone adornment because like I can and it's free and why wouldn't I if I don't have any wizards, right? and so Cool, I have an actual thing I can do and it's not I don't have to like it's a nice mid mid to late game when I can take that I don't have to worry about You know magical dominance or something like that good good counterbalance to that Yep, you said it all my friends. I like that this ties also with the change to corn in terms of maybe Actually having a no magic sign Corn sons iron jaws are going to be three armies that all like having this this thing existing. Yes. Yeah So yeah, yeah, good change. I mean, yes Agreed Battle plan power flux victory points change the fourth bullet point to score one victory point if any enemy wizard hero units Were destroyed in that battle round the victory point is scored at the end of the battle round instead of the end of each turn Um, okay Sure, I don't necessarily love this just because I hate weird off turn scoring anything where everything else scores at the end of your turn But like, all right. I sure why not? I give people more sort of time to kill wizards where if it happens off turn You still get the credit basically is what we're what we're doing here. Yeah You could do some angle shooting where you could try to get your I don't know how often this would come up, but uh, maybe look to get a wizard killed in Uh, your turn not your opponent's turn so that you're denying them the point. Yeah, sure The idea now that's gone. Yeah, but definitely. Yeah Yeah, uh No, I didn't change my camera angle. Well, it's the exact same camera angle. It's always been I'm just I'm just I'm more lit because it's daytime That's that's all no, but this is the exact same camera angle. I've always had uh, all right So, uh Yeah, yeah, cool. Good stuff Uh, bup bup bup. Let's keep moving. Here we go um Yeah, yeah, there was this little change to the the within nine inches, right to male male stroke. It used to be 12 Is that okay? Yeah, that's what I thought fine. Okay, cool. Yeah All right, uh I mean malevolent maelstrom. I know people kept talking it up and being like, oh, it's amazing It's this and that I've never not laughed at malevolent maelstrom and I've never been worried about it once so Yeah, it's it's meaningful and it has been meaningful and certain list the obvious list star born That has you know the eighth layer of the star born recipe So eighth eighth ingredient, but yeah, it's it's okay. Yep All right, let's get into the specific grand alliances. So first off in blah days of cornae I believe that's how you pronounce that Uh hatred of sorcery add the following each time a friendly unit casts a spell You must roll a dice on a five plus that spell is automatically unbound Suck it wizards. Uh, so let's talk about this one for a minute. Tyler. I think this is interesting Here we have a relatively decent incentive Not to take wizards in your corn. We had seen the rise of people including like the zinch Uh regiment of renown and so on to pick up early points and and tie things up and to get magical Dominance turn one and so on and so forth This definitely puts a halt on that I am fully in 100 behind this rule Um, I think I actually like this better than if they had just said You can't have a wizard in your army, which by the way, which they could have done Right, like you could write the rule It's just like hatred of sorcery You may not include any model with the wizard keyword or that is capable of casting a spell or something like that in your army Right, like they could have gone full prohibition Instead they made this incentive where like Where the narrative fluffy players will still do this because they don't care if they have some reason they want to do it But spiky hardcore players will would never take a wizard anymore because they're not going to risk a battle tactic on a 33 percent chance to fail and lose that lose the game. That's absolutely. Yep You know that my friends. Yeah, that that says it all and and the wording of this. Yeah You know applies to magical dominance, you know, if you roll exactly so yeah, they got the wording right everything's right here Yeah, I dig it as well Yeah, uh, David. Yes, it does because allies can't benefit from allegiance abilities But they could still be affected by them. So this is a good example of that, right? Um, where where like because it's stating any friendly unit like it's the specifics going to out rule the or override the general So, um, and yes, I agree with chuck hit the like button. It's free and it helps everybody hit like and subscribe and do fun Things that make fun things. Okay. Cool. It also helps maintain, you know One of the the things that can help keep corn and check potentially is surrounded destroyers Usually they're round one play right like they can't struggle with that round one battle tactic Whereas they were dipping into magical dominance now as an alternative, which was just ridiculous So yeah, I like that. We already talked about the no stone Uh element that they've got added as an offset to potentially losing the magic. So yeah, good stuff Agreed I'm not sure on that one. Arturia. So I need to look into the detail there Uh, all right on the maggotkin of nergal Sloppy tea bilepiper. Oh boy big old change here. Uh, so my love is like a ripe ripe fart Very funny, uh, okay, uh changed from no pile in to minus one to hit. That's it. Yep Good good great. Yes. Yes. Yes. Most nergal players that I've heard like they're all on board. Yeah, I mean, dude It was not a great it was a terrible play experience Especially for less competitive players Players who don't know about the nuances of how you can get around it a little bit With pylon rolls where you can actually pile in, you know, if you're like Base to base touching you can wrap and still be legal because you're not moving You're remaining as close as essentially, right? So like there were some nuances there a lot of people didn't know about Yeah, it was just a hot mess. So big fan of this change. Yeah Minus one to hit still a good good buff, you know, it's it's fine Um, nothing wrong with that at all and I mean very punishing to like a lot of the new fec stuff It actually is a very strong counter to them Whereas the pylon often wouldn't have been because the the way that many of those units would have fought They didn't need to pile in kind of at all To have a lot of efficacy, but but negative one hits actually incredibly strong And so Just because a lot of their units are on four ups. So it's it's pretty good And it's obviously a much it's a much much more player sort of friendly thing. It's a much less So yeah, yeah, it's still good. Uh, quick shout out to our friend Dinos He was talking in one of our threads yesterday About the demon prince and how it's got even more value now in nergal the demon prince I didn't realize can benefit Dinos pointed out it can benefit from sloppity's tunes. Yeah. Yeah Yeah, so like a demon prince with prolific talents now 12 attacks try to get whore frost on him He could be on twos and twos to hit twos plus one of wound from the from sloppity. So anyway, yeah He's relevant for battle tactics like the new battle tactic in nergal He can apply on the on the demon side, which is interesting. Um, Yeah Yeah, it's kind of funny get to have his little entourage with him, right? Like we'll talk about the demon prince here in a minute Of course as we get into it Uh beasts of chaos. Uh, I don't know why the actual header here is is magenta I don't like I guess we didn't change the name, but nonetheless, that's funny So here we see the first example of something we're going to see actually quite a bit Uh, which is uh Increasing range to two inches. So gores and zen gores both going to two inches, which is great Uh, this brings a lot of the units you would want to be on these bases up to two inch range Existing things like best of gores were already two inches. So that's fine Uh, basically you see a lot of like of the 32 mil models are we're going to see throughout here that we're problematic Uh are now on two inch reach, which is wonderful Um, so yep Yeah, good stuff like obviously it's changed. We've been asking for all Uh a lot Uh, and so I'm happy to see the trigger was finally pulled on this. So yeah I mean, and there's probably also somebody to be said about doing it selectively rather than universally maybe in terms of trying to better maintain balance or Uh, I don't know Yeah, there's probably arguments on both sides, right have taken just the universal approach That we had with what the prior season of the fighting two ranks versus being more selective about what actually benefits from this I mean, you know, certain units are going to be able to benefit from it more than others So maybe they thought let's not have everything be eligible But no, I'm sure there was probably a lot of discussion around like which units are appropriate Could we cause any problems if we make someone two inches, right? And my guess is this is sort of the first Pass at it, you know, I who knows what it's going to look like in in four months or whatever, right? come come new addition time, but You know, obviously this is a A good change now for the for the end. It took us a while, but we got here at the end. So that's fine Um Skaven, uh, they're flee flee, which was their new battle tactic got updated to be just two or more friendly Skaven units instead of like requiring a hero, which is good Because your heroes normally weren't in combat in that way and would just either like scurry away during combat and so you couldn't Um, you might you might fail it for different reasons Or they're actually dead because Skaven heroes generally get killed if they're in combat Like there's there's lots of ways you you might not actually be able to complete this based on what happened in the previous round Um, so this is a good good change. It's fine. It's a nice layup battle tactic for Skaven again I kind of hate battle tactics and I hate layup battle tactics But I guess if you're going to give them out to everybody, I then I want mine too I either want less corruption or more opportunity to participate in it. Okay Uh, so if we're gonna have everything's gonna be corrupt, then I want to be part of this. Okay. Um And then of course, uh plague monks are now minimum unit 20 so they can now go 20 40 60 instead of 10 2030 Good change overall. It actually makes them match the box. They came in Which is uh appropriate Um So maybe they were trying to get a little more Differentiation relative to the plague sensor virus that we've been seeing all over the place and not not many plague monks Yeah, I mean the real problem is just plague monks not taken in big units just really aren't very effective They need a bunch of bodies because they die so quick like everything in Skaven just dies in droves if it gets touched by anything And so like you you have to have the bodies to just absorb Stuff Yeah To just like absorb the hits because you're easily going to lose like 15 18 20 models when anything hits you in Skaven, you know, I mean it's just it's just what happens Um, so there's there's I mean warhammer. Those things happen to to those. Yeah, I sure. Yeah, I'll get um I'll get it Yeah, I played a game with Skaven recently and I I I went used like I actually used quite a decent number of clan rats Just to try to run like a heavy clan rat strategy, right? Um of just like lots of bodies to sop up on things and you know when you get them in 40 plus 40 or more It is hard to remove the unit just because of the density of wounds Like all of those units got knocked down to to very low numbers But because of battle shock immunity and then them slowly like just constantly retreating and then building up a d3 every battle shock I was able to keep them like in the game and being functional on the table, right? Um, if I was limited to 30, they would have all been dead. So I know it's cleaner It's not plague monks, but it's it's the same point. They're basically the same unit. So Oh Okay, s2d demon princes Change the axe and sword to seven attacks and the talons to 12 attacks um Yeah, okay, uh, you know, it's fine What the obvious change is to just simply make it so they get both that would have been the thing to give it back to the Talons and the thing But because of how it's modeled now everybody thinks that I'm guessing everybody thinks that doesn't work and um You know that's nonsense. Nobody gives a crap about that. Uh, what is a malefic talent? It doesn't need to be the giant foo fighters oversized hand Okay, it just he has an off hand. It's got claws on it. That's a malefic talent Right. No one knows what that is. So stop it. Just stop it Um, but here we are. Um, this is still fine. It's better I still don't think they're like that good on average, but it's at the price they've currently fallen to It's decent enough. Yeah, I mean As an ally especially and again, I mean what dino's was pointing out in urgal, you know, I was thinking about like what other 12 inch flying Meaningful hammer, could you choose an urgal at that price range? Sure. Uh, there's not right I mean, you're looking at little lord of blights or lord of plagues Sort of had at least been in that price range. I don't know where they stand at the moment Uh, but certainly close to 150. So yeah, dude I I'm definitely interested in trying to throw in a dima prince in my lesson particularly with the change to wards and bodyguards where we'll be getting into in a minute. Yeah. Yeah, we will Yeah, um, yeah, I mean it's certainly like we'll talk about that. Um Yeah, that's it's fine enough. There's still not what they should be and that's ultimately what rubs me the wrong way Right. Is it supposed to be this like pinnacle of, uh, Like this this thing you're ascending to right, right? I want to do a show tyler in the future about tiers of heroes Because whether intentional or not they have created five tiers of heroes Okay, it's exciting. All right. I'm that's right. We're gonna go kingdom order genus phylum species sort of thing, right? Like there are five tiers Of heroes in this game. I don't know if they think like this, but subconsciously they have built to this And I would also allege that when something who is clearly supposed to be in a certain tier Then falls out and ends up being in a different tier That's the ones that everybody has a problem with Okay, okay. All right. So I'll unpack all that in a future show other But like it's it's The demon prince is in the wrong tier and that's ultimately where the problem comes with him. We'll get there Okay, that's it. It creates a sort of ludonarrative dissonance. Anyway, good change. Happy to see him get better I still played with demon princes even though they were terrible Uh, I would just like to do a victory lap here Okay, when demon princes initially came out. I directly called out that they were total garbage They were like more than they were 200 plus points And on their profile, I was like, this is a garbage unit and I had some people push back at me and be like, no, it's fine Especially from gw who are like, no, it's fine. They're not that bad. Oh, yeah Weren't they? How's that looking now? How's your opinion looking? Down that they're down 50 plus points and you had to buff their attacks. Okay Listen when we tell you something's garbage. All right at any rate Personal beef. Okay. Cool Disciples of zinch Zangors going to two inches again. Just like we already mentioned in beasts. Good stuff I hope people try zangors. I've often thought they had a lot of potential But I think the one inch reach was a killer for them. I think at a two inch reach They're a much more interesting unit I think they've always been right there on the cusp and it was literally just their reach It was stopping them And my belief is when we had the situation where some people were where we had easy access to like battle brothers To fighting in two ranks type of stuff. You did see some people roll in some zangors Yeah, Joannousing. He comes to mind with piece of chaos. I mean, it's not zinch, but yeah Noah ran a bunch 100% man. Yeah, hopefully we'll see more of them come back Yep, yeah Agreed um pitch battle profiles horrors of zinch Change to battle line if the unit contains no blue horrors and no brimstone horrors If the unit contains no pink horrors change the points cost to 120 If the unit contains no pink horrors and no blue horrors change the points cost to 80 I don't understand what they changed here. Isn't there was this a points change or what what happened here? I don't I don't get it. I don't know what this was a change over Because they weren't battle line before with blues or brims and they're still not Uh, maybe the fact that you're allowed to take them separately now. Maybe that was it Well, you could do that before too Oh, could you? Yeah I maybe some of the comments can point it out. It's just a point change. Okay, cool. That's what I thought Arterius. Thank you Yeah, I didn't think there was a functional change here. Okay. They just have to include it in this because it's it's weird Okay, I thought I was right. Yeah, it just just a point change. I assume because the points live in this weird text Um Forever we are cursed by the silver tower Silver tower was a fun board game. It gave us a lot of great stuff. It gave us the gaunt summoner And the whole idea of the silver towers, which is all cool and great additions to aos lore and fun stuff Uh, but I really hate that it gave but that is what gave us brims. That's what gave us brims zones Okay in all older editions. It was just pink split split to blues and then they die But because they needed little individual things to keep fighting Right in silver tower now we have to deal with this crap because somebody made a board game Nine years ago now we're cursed for the rest of time to deal with this garbage Well, we're both big fans of the of the creator of that board game But I mean you can hop on twitter and yell at him if you want to give him a hard time today I have no problem with the board game itself. I want to be clear. I've actually played silver tower quite a lot I actually think it's a pretty good name. Yeah, it's a great game. Yeah Um, it's just like I hate that because of that we're cursed to have to deal with it in the actual war game it'd be like Monopoly introduced some new rules. So now our aos units change like I don't care. What what is going on in the world? Like okay, uh now now if you go to jail it costs you extra money or something. It's like no stop stop that shouldn't affect aos Okay Let's keep going grand alliance order Vanquishers range to two inches. There it is. Tyler the storm cast buff. I know you've been waiting for I have actually Winning me. I mean that was kind of rude msc mc. M is a little mean that she put out I mean some truths just just cut deep. Yeah, basically Two inch range vanquishers. It was community. Nobody cares Uh the yeah, no, it's meaningful like going that, you know, particularly if you've got vandals Been talking about vandals buddy. I just wrote a list the other day 10 vandictors 10 vanquishers all the goodies storm keep jared brown infamous for his amazing luminous list He took storm keep to lvo Uh john anderson gave him a whooping appropriately with luminous on stream game one But he went for one with with storm keep. So like everything everything's coming together vents The meme I would have used is the guy with the butterfly and it would just would have said two inch reach vanquishers And it would have been like is this fixed storm cast that would have been my meme. So There you go. If I was a meme person All right at any rate that's good change like it's fine. I mean I know um Uh, what's his name matt was was uh always trying to use vanquishers. And I think he did to to some degree He does. Yeah. Yeah, so I think he's gonna be happy to see this change All right, uh seraphon Uh change change to that. So this is the lord of celestial Whatever resonance there nonsense Change to the first time each phase that this general either successfully cast a spell that is not unbound Successfully unbinds a spell or successfully dispels in and the spell you receive two cosmic power points instead of one So tyler you've you've had much more experience in getting your uh teeth kicked in by seraphon What do you think of this change? Yeah Good change. Uh, it's going to slow down the tempo of their Uh summoning so previously, you know, they could with regularity like summon five wrapped on chargers That would that's pretty that's pretty good units, you know getting those So that that's the main thing is it just slows the pace down and some of these other changes It's still I think going to be playable But I doubt we're going to see it as much with maybe that this ties into the wizard finders battalion given The five up love to more armies So, yeah, uh, I think it was needed like We've had a lot of conversation right around this. This is one of those where it's not going five all over all over the place It's just a terrible play pattern to play against. Yeah, it's just it's horrific And it's not just like it wasn't just me folks like yeah I had that one game where it was utter insanity never seen anything like it in eight years war hammer But I eventually learned how to play again. There are armies that can play against it's fine Like did okay with lesion and I was able to win like it's not impossible to beat but anyhow, yeah, this is Do you replace starcraft tyler? I a little bit I almost failed high school because of of games like that And so not a lot, but yeah, it's fine. That's a big starcraft player and you know Uh One of the most horrible things you could hear if you like depending on what was going on in your situation Was you would hear nuclear launch detected, right and it'd be in like your And you're like hunting for that little red dot like where is this happening, right? Where's the little dude who's got a call down the blast and so on right and Trying to reveal him or whatnot and uh You know, maybe your zerg you're floating your little your little windbags around trying to reveal him and uh the Starboard playing against starboard is like playing against somebody who gets nuclear launch Just like way too early at the game just like races do it, right? Yeah, that's that's what it is. Okay Um, kreuger and kreuger war spawned, uh, I'm so glad they changed these so I get to say that word like a hundred times So the kreuger, uh, changed the wounds characteristic from four to five Uh, big change big change One of the things tyler about this game when they keep pinning rules to specific wound values I don't have talked about this on many shows Is that you end up with these very hard break points Where so much of a unit's value is determined by that one number Like regardless of anything else it says on their scroll And right now those break points are at five wounds and at 10 wounds Right Like a nine wound hero and a 10 wound hero that have the exact same war scroll Like that are literally exactly the same otherwise, right except one says nine and one says 10 The nine wound hero is just objectively better by a long margin than the 10 wound hero Right, and it's the same for like a unit that like you take you take a unit They're exactly the same except once has four wounds and once has five Huge difference in efficacy there not just because of the 25 wound buff into like theoretical durability buff, right? But because it's now it's not three guys on an objective It's six guys on an objective if they're any unit of three for example, right? And this really matters a lot Like in one of our games I had pigs easily stealing objectives from trolls It's just an example, right sure because at equal numbers i'm five therefore There you go, right? So I just walk up and can just take it from them by existing so five matters a lot Good change in my estimation very good change Uh cities of sigmar alchemyte warforge or blazing weapons Melee only that's what this matters to like let's just that's that's what it is Yeah, so I think they I would have it seems weird saying this I would have liked to have seen them drop the points a little bit on the fusiliers Um, I think they're like 170 right now. Maybe 10 points I'm not sure we're going to see I don't we'll see but I doubt we're going to see a whole lot of fusiliers Uh, this was impactful steam tanks, right steam tanks. We're getting leverage out of this with the 3d6 Especially that they could get up to um shown by gavin at lvo So yeah, I mean this needed to happen I think particularly when the fusiliers could do sentinels 2 point over 3 point over wherever the hell we were You know where they once per game they could do a re-roll so they were just fish for six is likes that all sentinels did so Yeah, it needed to happen. Um, but maybe they should have some other adjustments particularly with fusiliers to account for it Sure Yeah, I mean, I I'm fine with them starting a little more expensive than if over time they could always back up now And I think it's the right way to be a little more conservative with heavy Yeah, no, I know that because you you were insane when it comes to this nowadays Uh, we've got reference points plenty of reference points. That's all right. Let's keep going Two to caters at 220. Sure. Absolutely Uh, bloodthirsty shivers going to the the hit roll of a six goes to auto wound Uh, so Fine, I think it's a good change to you if you thought about the I haven't thought about the math on this Is it I mean, is it a much of a difference seems like I mean, maybe it might be if you're Yeah, I don't know. I haven't thought about the math on this. It's it's a good rule I mean, I like this rule in general. Let me just say so like Um, getting back and playing some old world recently. This is effectively, um, poisoned attacks Okay, so like back in warm fantasy, there was a rule called poison attacks And it's back in the old world and it's if you roll a six to hit you out of wood You skip the wound roll, right? You still make saves and everything is normal, right? But it just you bypass the wound roll And it's very potent ability and honestly, I think that the I I would like to see this kind of thing employed more I hope going into 40 we actually use this more often than just like going straight to mortal wounds or something on there Yeah, yeah So speaks speaks things up Yeah, it does. It absolutely does. Yes. Like all these sixes are just wounds. Cool. Like there you go. Like it's it's it's great um, so yeah, I and uh Sharks are slightly worse damage, but mainly removes high variance. Yeah, I agree Okay, uh, okay. I don't want a math land aspect of the sea the tsunami of terror change the tsunami of terror uh to Casting by seven range of 18 And you still get your three enemy units. Sorry. And now you have three enemy units. Not d3 that being the very relevant change there Um, and you minus one to save and it has to be three different units given things. We'll see later on Yes Um, which is good Uh, good change. I like this. I like that. I like being automatically three units I I think the idolons are really cool. They basically never get used and that's unfortunate. Uh, hopefully this will Get them included in some lists. So And I agree Cygnus says rules that reduce roles rather than adding more is always good in my book. Yeah, I agree Um fire slayers Volkite berserkers, uh, both of them getting two inch reach. That's a great change. Happy to see that I think that's a very exciting day for our fire slayers players. I know there's many excited fire slayer people out there So cool stuff Continuing that train But many I mean all six of them Okay, well, I kind of quite Great masking like I I thought subconsciously you were being sincere. So good work. Nope. All right. Nope. I'm not Uh, okay, and then uh night haunt bladeguest revenus dreadcite heritans and glaive wraith stalkers all going to two inches Very needed change night haunts in a rough place right now. This is quality I this is not like this alone is going to save the day But god does it make these units actually like Theoretically playable instead of just automatic trash, which is nice. So that's good Well, hey none other than the big fill in the uk had his night out night hunt out this week So if big fills playing him I I've seen a couple of night haunt lists by the way that are that are night haunt lists It's negash Like manfred's r o r and 200 points of night haunt battle line Right jane wrasse or or black guys take a pic. Yeah. Yeah, yeah Like boy. Oh boy. What a what a night haunt list you're playing there. Okay, sure Yeah, uh, Cory bragg says as a fire slayer player that changes dope. Very good. I'm excited. Kenny says. Yay There's a respectable 10 of us fire slayer players. Thank you very much. Yeah, exactly Uh, all right, Ozzy arc bone reapers null myriad. Uh, it went from a two up to a four up That's all just shortcut it and say that Yeah, it's board wide now. You're not limited to the hero track and no hero range. Yeah Yeah, good change. I mean, I don't think we're gonna see as many null myriads. Uh, we were starting to see a fall off anyway Yeah, but yeah, that's that's probably what it should have been from the from the get go Uh, I agree. I like to know hero change and just at a regular four up It's it's still doing very much its work Anybody who's ever played like stormcast dragons where you have a four up, you know It's it's very disincentivizing for people to use magic on you and you feel pretty good having it. So Absolutely 50% of the time it works 100% of the time. So Uh, so like grave lords the grasping dead change to pick one friendly summonable Uh unit within three inches of any enemy units you complete this tactic if any enemy models were slain by that friendly unit This turn and that friendly unit is within three inches of any enemy units at the end of this turn What did this change from? I don't pay any attention. Yeah, like So because I hate battle tactics Sure So previously dude, you did not have to kill a model. You just have to start the turn Within three and in the turn within three. So you'd have situations like like hey, look, I've got five skeletons that are in combat Yay Yeah, so they're actually having played far too many games than I probably should have with this army the last couple of months Legion night, uh, there were all the time situations where scenarios like that would come up, right of yeah So it's good. It's like it doesn't seem like much, but I think for a lot of lists it is meaningful Absolutely They still have the easiest Book battle. I mean, I would yeah put them up as number one number two certainly top three on the board of easiest battle tactics I'm just getting to 28 without an issue. Yeah. Yeah, okay. Sure Yep Okay, uh work work lands the the important part about the change here is No longer does big wall just auto get just be the that big wall fell off the number one battle tactic Completer Because it used to be that they could just run the the the gay like just run the show by doing all of the different Easy to slam dunk battle tactics from their individual Armies that made them up now you have you can only do the one that aligns to your general Fine. Good. That's how it should have always been like it was silly that I hate big wall. I hate soup things I either want it to be that's the army or give me an iron jaws or like make iron jaws its own thing and and that I make cruel boys their own thing. Um, there's a third army there, but I don't remember them. I don't think they're important Uh, so it's fine. Um, good change the mall gruntas Uh Change the unstoppable momentum to only tick down at the end of the battle round Instead of at the end of every turn. So good change not far enough Momentum is so annoying tyler. I played the big pig at holy wars and there was one game one Out of five. I played this guy all the time. He only died once Where he got to six momentum every other time and he was where he wasn't at six momentum He was at one Because it's just impossible to build momentum Okay, under the under the rules. This will make it slightly better But it's still hard like because the only way you really build momentum is you fight low enough Wound things that you can use your your monstrous action That's it Otherwise you just take back to one you just sit there you run you go up Turn ticks turn ticks. It's just like it just goes back to one. So um, yeah better still not great, but that's fine Um And then big old change to sons of behemoth wrath of the titans earth shaking roar The very garbage monstrous rampage that you have that was unique to them Uh is now just roar number two Yeah, that's all it is like I know it says orders, but it means commands if they've they've already said it was a Mistype or whatever. So that's fine um Like so now you have two roars with this this roar with a kicker. Uh, if you happen to be engaged with some small unit Um, this this thing as it was did basically nothing Uh, so You know, hey, I'm I'm here for it. I'll take roar number two great Yeah, double roaries is good For sure So no complaints there. All right, let's talk points Um I mean, there's a lot here. I'm not going to go through every army Instead what I want to focus on is tyler. What are the points changes that jumped out at you the most? Uh, here, this one's from beasts to ossearch bone reapers so Uh, you know, I'm not I'm not looking at the stream That's okay. I have page one of the points changes basically Okay, well, I mean pendulum need to go up a little bit. It was all over the place Sure, uh, let's see The it was nice to see some drops in cities like talia. Hopefully talia. That's that's a big point drop on talia Really excited about that. It is hopefully we're gonna we're gonna see her on the table more now the Yeah, so some adjustments there good work gavin greiger on getting those steam tanks, uh bumped up doing the doing the community work there And what else do we got? I know check was excited about marathi Marathi coming down back below 700 where she should be I do agree with that change I think most of the daughter's changes are actually pretty dead on I liked those a lot Um, the flesh eater courts changes were really good as far as the big monsters big points move On the unbounded monsters, which is which is correct. Those things are liquid hot garbage Okay, and so like they were they were so outside the the the ballpark with their points I was actually super happy to see them get adjusted. Um, so that was a very good change in my estimation Um, I liked that a lot Um, the over changes are welcome I think the most interesting one is the mournfang pack As down at the mournfang pack going down to 150 is actually really interesting now for that unit Um, I think that might actually be worth taking a look at I think for those at 300 is actually pretty interesting Um as a unit And then obviously my other big one is the auric war clans all the big all the big pigs going down Um, I probably that like almost exactly the points amounts that I said they were overpriced during the show When we reviewed them. So I was happy to see that Uh, and then you know, I The other stuff like our boys are probably still not down enough You know knock off wish brand chaos warriors at home. I don't think are quite getting there still, but that's fine um You know goblin stuff. I was happy to see things like bounders and goblin balloons that go up just slightly I honestly think they deserved it. Yeah, uh, and then finally on slanesh Nice try keep going Like It's that army is in such a state right now. Um, it's it's bad. It's real bad Yeah, the fire sliders needed reductions almost across the board Wrote a list played again with that army. It felt like it was stuck in like six months ago Like it just if five to ten percent overpriced that army. So yeah, like a list will get back maybe five percent You know a hundred points. You'll get back some maybe more but at least a hundred points. I would say Uh, nargo got a few adjustments. Glad to see a harbinger of decay dropped a little bit. Yeah, uh, more butx one Uh, I guess whatever it just brings them all into line, which is yeah Yeah, they're like, uh, they're all equally worth each other. I don't it's it's Yeah uh OCR a couple adjustments nothing dramatic The Cara drawn. I've heard some people argue. Maybe the cara drawn got hit a little bit too much I mean, they were they were doing quite well So I mean, they're not it's not a dramatic increase. It's interesting to see. Yeah, how that impacts ko Yeah, I mean, I don't know. I honestly think that that's the correct adjustment for them Like I I stand behind that number cent. They're a terror. They were probably the best army in the game um, so Like I think they're gonna be okay Yeah Going down to page two here We have uh, again, we mentioned the seraphon adjustments. So the star seer the star master The astralith bearer and lord croak all up points, which i'm happy about and then meanwhile a lot of our more Uh, coalesced focused items. So our steggy chief You know our Uh, sores old blood on karsaur and scar vet all going down in my mind. These are correct changes Like we it's you got to try to punish the the starborn some while while not hurting the coalesced because It's if there was ever a tale of two cities It's seraphon You have like one of the strongest armies in the game and an army that's really struggling Which is shocking because it has like minus one to damage as a rule and yet still here We are and that's because so many there they're like coalesced pieces You want to use your big stompy monsters were overpriced. Yeah I play to get some steggies before the the point drop a couple weeks ago and I was Surprised like yeah, I could see them getting the the drops but I definitely could see them being quite viable competitively The I don't know about the steggy chief and where I agree. He needs to keep going Who said it? Artarius rex said keep going on that steg chief. I agree. Yeah when he came out at his points I said that they should be brought up in the haig for a war crime I remember like and I stand behind that Yeah, uh, dude, there's something about people named Dan getting excited About pterodons and usually reproductive as well. So obviously we had the historic pterodan You know Metta for a little bit in the uk my good friend dan who We played so many games warhammer. He is very excited right now about pterodans pterodans Yeah, he thinks it's just going to be the terror that's on the way. So Looking forward to that And uh, Skaven did we do enough on Skaven? What do you thoughts on Skaven? Uh, I'm fine with the grace here on screaming bell change going up as well as the censor bearer change going up That those are the only two actual adjustments up the plague mocks didn't actually increase That's just to account for their doubling the the unit size um plague clot 90 is hot is hot like Uh, I've been all about them plague claws recently. Let me just tell you and at 90 points I was a buyer at 100 at 90. I am a big buyer of this like get ready for filth terrain from the skies Um master molder at 80 is great. Grace here at 110 is great. These are already strong units The vermin lords are probably still overpriced for what they're doing. Um, I just link they're not 400 point monsters They just don't ever make those points back Um rat ogres at 130 is sexy as all get out like I am here for that in a big big big way rat ogres have and continue to be the best Probably unit in the army other than censor bearers And so to have them have a points drop. I think is fantastic. I mean you're talking about a six wound model With a four up save, you know counting on two as objectives Your biggest problem in this army is and always has been reinforcement points And it's utter garbage that they still have to labor under the four reinforcement point limit Which is just ridiculous. So but you know good changes all around um, so yeah Been seeing a lot in the gash list with the point drops on big big guy himself So interesting to see how much he hits table to go, you know, here I think he will get in there I think there's gonna be some less people are gonna try him especially in night hot But we'll we'll see some more even beyond that Um, you know, so blight I actually like some of the changes that happened there with some of the things down Like vordry that again the unmounted terror guys things like that those all feel good But nights needed it Yeah, absolutely Anything not anything that doesn't say summonable on it is like almost instantly relegated to unplayable in this army right now And it's really a problem. They they made the distinction between what is summonable and what's not way too strong Um, and then lastly, of course, we can't leave behind without mentioning that, uh, of course, the larial the ever queen now at 800 I'm sure she's making every every silver necklace, right tyler like she's totally playable now Yeah, I guess unless your name is uh, matt davies Yeah, he's been able to make her work incredibly well and some of the people who've been using his list in the uk But uh, yeah, I still don't see it. I I have no clue how he was doing what he was doing with nine bows or six bows Plus I have a many bows, which I think have been not garbage, but you know, not the choice for a little while and yeah Uh, yeah, I don't get it. Uh, quest for souls for going down was surprising. That was a great buy at 230 Uh, vandals vandals. Yeah, the disrespect for that for that man She's this big guy in the narrative and that's that's it Uh, let's just hit a couple. We're basically at our time, but I do want to hit I need to to go here in just a moment But we'll just take a couple core rules hits here real quick that are of relevance Um, the things that we need to mention are we have a change from a previous ruling that if a thing says You can pick multiple units. Can I pick the same unit multiple times? The answer is now no So those things can't you can't just multi stack if it says pick three units. Can I pick the same one multiple times? You cannot which is a great change and how it always should have worked the previous FAQ was literally insane Uh, it's and so I'm glad to see that change There's a little bit of clarification Was that yeah command core like it comes that down with yeah, no no multi stack healing and yeah Command core and the idol on being the two biggest examples of where this occurred, but but yes Um control of ability or control of objectives just got a little clarified on the timing. That's fine Um Does the unit have to be eligible to fight? Yes, of course Like that's actually in the core rules. They referred you back. That was already answered They were just pointing you there nice little cleanup on random move characteristic Uh on on how you on how random move is generated versus run roles and they're correct You have to do it after the you you pick the unit to run. It's just a good cleanup Um Random movement's already pretty bad. So that's fine. And then there we go Well, that's the one I'm looking for we're scrolling all the way down to get to wards That the big one Some abilities allow you to roll a dice to negate a wound or mortal wound or to allocate a wound or mortal wound to a unit other than their original target abilities of this type are referred to as wards So now all of your bodyguard abilities are wards and you can never make more than one unless Calm down fireslayers players who shouldn't have this rule, but somehow you do Unless your your specific rule says otherwise. So basically all of our All of our Bodyguards and stuff like that as we would colloquially call them are now Are now ward roles and hence negated by things that are ward roles or occasionally buffed by the things that say They can buff ward roles Tyler, let's leave on this because I think this is a big change. What uh, what do you think about this change? Uh, honest answer is I haven't thought enough about it. Uh, the Yeah, I'm not honest. I'm not sure man. It's Do you think it is the right cleanup on this to make it to where you are able to turn off Yes, bodyguards. Okay. We're ignoring. Okay This is the counterplay that always should have been there And moreover these always should have been grouped under one Conceptual rules banner. I know we needed that. Yeah, so that that resonates. Yeah Okay, yeah, I just I I never really thought much about it has big implications Right like a lot of bodyguard things are less valuable. Simple. That's what it comes down to A lot of things that shut off wards just got a lot more interesting because they have a broader application And frankly, I'm here for it. I think that's the correct Choice like honest answer. I just think it's how this always should have worked Yes, it will have implications. Yes, some of those might be pretty rough for some individual armies Okay, that should be dealt with right if if some points need to be adjusted somewhere or something like that Then that's fine. We should do that But this is the way the rule this is a much much much cleaner Interpretation of these rules and how they should have always worked Period. Okay, right on. Yeah To me that is worth it the fact that we had these like different separate but equal Ridiculously way to interpret things we need different rulings for all of them silly silly silly bring it under one banner Everything then works cleanly and then if we need to make adjustments from there, let's do so Okay, yeah fair enough. Yeah All right. Well, there you go folks quick show like I said Thank you everybody ever much very buddy. I hope this was helpful for you battle scrolls good good stuff Tyler, thank you for jumping on over lunch break All of you out there. Thank you so much for watching. Don't forget to hit like subscribe If we missed anything or you want us to talk about anything drop it down in the comments always read every comment Looking forward to the discussion down there on whether you think this was a good or bad Overall battle scroll. Tell me what you think if you want to support the show share it That's free You can hit the links down below pick up paints from monument or whenever you're buying your hobby supplies You can go through amazon doesn't cost you anything extra, but give the show a nice kickback There's also a merch store down there If you want to pick up tyler on a shirt for yourself and have his cool little sylvaneth sprite on a shirt for you Maybe maybe get a shirt Uh, so when you see him at adept con or a future event You can walk up to tyler and just point at the shirt and then point at him That would be funny and cool. Uh, and of course there's also our patreon Where you can focus on review and feedback and taking your next step on your hobby journey as always though folks Thank you so much for watching really appreciate it and as always We'll see you next wednesday