 Well, we did have a nice lunch yesterday. I watched the discussion. One of our topics we talked about was the greater joining, which was actually the same topic we talked about at lunch when I had lunched the day before. We talked about the greater joining. She said, yeah, it's even beyond collaboration. It's seen the same as... So we're all the same one. It's not people collaborating. It's actually a recognition that we are the very same one. And it's like a deep inner feeling and a recognition. Judy said she felt that when she first met her husband and when she first met Judy and Ken, she described a lot of experiences in which basically it was revealed that Judy and Helen and Ken and Bill were all the same brothers that all lived at the same time many years ago. And Helen, one time, was over in Israel, I believe with Ken and they were traveling along and she said, stop the vehicle. I gotta get out. And it was right in this particular place. And she said something like, it's like the holiest, this is the holiest sacred base on earth, but it was actually in a place where six Essen brothers who were very devoted way back in the time of Christ and before had been and had lived very devoted lives where they were all buried. And it was just a reminder of the sacredness and the reverence that even though the dream seems to look a lot different than it did 2,000 years ago with technology and the world certainly looks different, that that reverence and that deep desire to know the Creator and to know our true selves is burning bright and burning strong as ever. And here we are using the mechanisms and means that are available to us now. But the miracle, it really transcends time. And we did end up talking a bit about simultaneity about how everything's happening simultaneously. We started off talking a bit about reincarnation and how reincarnation is not a concept that's essential to forgiveness because we don't really have past lives or future lives in the sense of beginnings and endings and time and space. But we do have always an opportunity to come into that depth and holiness that lifts us up beyond time and space where we can really see this dream. And I think you said during the meal it kind of got real dreamy. Real dreamy. That's what you were just saying. Yeah. Yeah. I was like... In a way, I don't even know. It was just like really, really dreamy. She was like, okay, this is my room. And then from there even it went further. It was so dreamy and the feeling that... There's this feeling like... Have you seen the movie The Time Traveler's Wife? Yes? The main character, he's just like... In the end he just goes to all these moments. He travels through time. And then he says every place that he goes to that there's some kind of attachment or something. And then all of a sudden it just like... I felt like him. Again, I felt like I just go... I don't know. It was a feeling like... I don't know how I got here. I don't know, we drove, whatever. I was like all of a sudden there's this scene that I am with Judy. And David. And all I have is this... Thank you, thank you. And the next thing I hear, Judy is talking about completion. And I was like, this is completion like through that gratitude. Thank you, thank you, thank you. And it feels like everywhere, almost like it's just got like other places where I go where sometimes there isn't a thank you. Then it's just opportunity to come like through forgiveness to that place of thank you. And again, through completion. And that's all it's for. And then... And then I don't know what's then. But it's like things got quantum. I was like, I don't know what year it is. It's like some things were... Like I had some moments like just... In my mind that I was like, okay, I've seen this three times in a row. Like three times, like the same event happened. But later on I realized that it was actually... It was within three years, but in a moment it felt like it was three times in a row. So it got that quantum. And so it was... Yeah, like forgiveness. And so like when it dons that, like so experientially, it's just so like... It's wow. Yeah. It really reminds me of this movie called The Fountain where the female character in that is basically talking to her partner. The female character has a disease. She's dying, but she's... She's surrendering. She's yielding into the light. She's yielding into the love. She's smiling. She's laughing. She's not afraid of the body dying at all. And her partner is a scientist who's desperately trying to find a cure for her body living. And he keeps seeing her though over and over and she just kind of whispers to him, finish it. Finish it. That was a little bit of the feeling I had when we were with Judy and Whit in our conversation that Judy said she had a lot of different readings, but at some point earlier in actually in past lifetime she'd come... She was told she'd come very, very close and she assumed that what the close was was to waking up, but she'd made one wrong turn when she got really close and then she seemed to have a lot of guilt about that and so, you know, we have to accept the Atonement. We have to see the Christ in everyone. We can't have a grievance and make it back to heaven. You can't get in the gates with a grievance and so it's beautiful to think of that like coming to that completion and what Judy and I talked a little bit about is like even now with people getting into a course of miracles and these teachings and everything the grievances are still coming into awareness and for people it's even with course students, course teachers, course groups, that's just the backdrop for the grievances to come up. A lot of times people feel guilty because they think I'm studying the course so I shouldn't have a grievance but actually I've been going to these national conferences where all these teachers come together and there's nothing like a national conference that brings up the grievances of the teachers. I get into the elevators and who won't speak to who and it's quite amazing actually who's avoiding who and Jesus is having a field day getting doors open and elevators, people all squeezed in with tiny tiny spaces that don't see each other or even want to speak to each other even though they're working for the same boss and they're doing the same work. That's quite a fast name for me these big national conferences because I've been attending them and speaking with them since 2007 and it's been good because even with different organizations that are around the course we talked at our lunch the other day about a platform where people can come as equals and there can be open dialogues and discussions it's still just a backdrop for releasing grievances even among those your peers or those that are are working at this consciously because everyone's going through a healing process of the seven billion we'll say and the one mind underneath it is going through a waking up process but it's still even among those that are into it consciously there's still a lot that has to be raised up into awareness and so that's really what the blessing is relationships are a blessing because they're being used as mirrors to reflect whatever unconscious content and attack grievances are still left and it isn't a pathway of avoidance it's a pathway of hide nothing hold on to nothing let everything come to the light willingly, voluntarily so I think it's quite precious for all of us to come together in that we use a lot of techniques we use movies because a lot of times when people relax and watch a movie their stuff comes up they find himself crying or getting very emotional with the movie and the movie is doing the same thing that relationships do it's just being a backdrop context for those emotions to surface where the mind feels relaxed enough and comfortable enough and safe enough to let what had been repressed and pushed out of awareness to come into awareness and that's beautiful too having a puppy dog here I know a lot of times in nursing homes it's amazing how the nursing home lights up when the animals are brought in because again the elderly people feel safe with animals there they can pet them, they can hold them it's a soft, warm experience where they can let their stuff up for healing and also let their love come through because they shower the animals with so much love and affection and here's been great for letting be showered with love and affection and also drawing it out of us he gave you his paw that's the second one second puppy in the row second puppy that's offered yes, offered a paw no, you take it yeah that was precious spirit they're very willing to do that we need to be able to do that as human beings to reach out at times and open up at times and ask for help at times and say I'm here, I'm ready to offer help how can I help what a beautiful spirit when we just show up at that so, yeah these gatherings for us are very profound because it's just such an opportunity to come together with a focused purpose for healing and then we never really know what's going to happen last night we thought there might be a movie or some movie clips but there wasn't it didn't come in last night but David stayed up till 2.30 am joining yeah, we just hard joined continued on and on and on all the relationships that we both helped start to trigger then people had to talk about it until about 2 in the morning and so that was good too but I see us today so I'm back back in action so, yeah we can open it up and anything in particular anybody would like to talk about miracles that are happening in your life curiosities recurring things and it's like hmm, yeah I wonder what that is why that keeps coming around again or circulating in consciousness coming back or anything it's great that Diane was just sharing it's been kind of a miracle how we got here because she's been following along more virtually and then she got an email from my friend Eric who's from this area and I listen to Eric all the time in my car and I've recently just seen you guys a lot on youtube and mainly youtube and so you just got something inside that said I was already feeling connected and I got an email from him that said call Nikita if you want to if you feel inspired and you did and I was like yeah really David's coming here did you not used to hosting this kind of thing this is like a totally out yeah I don't think I've ever hosted anything well not ever yes because we figured out it was about a year ago it was back maybe about a year ago in March when I think I was coming out to this area and I believe you contacted Eric and he said could I have a one-on-one with David and it was about your daughter and emotions a lot of intensity going on now she's often in LA so here you are hosting it yeah we showed up in your I love it and it's very much quantum because it's not really it's just been a calm job to think that there were things that happened a year ago that there's actually a world out there outside of our mind that outside of this room actually this seems like there's a real world out there that you will go to after this and that's just hypothetical if we go into it deep enough it's actually possible to have an experience where that won't happen you know that's always a great invitation where the spirit is saying come with me if you know it takes faith but come so with me come into an experience where you have an experience and the world as you knew it before ceases to exist and I've had that happen I've been doing these gatherings for about a quarter of a century and I've actually remember I was in New York City one time started to in the middle of the gathering started to have an out of body experience while I was speaking we went deeper and still deeper and deeper and she felt so relaxed that she just thought she would let go of her little tether she took off on the silver cord a little bit and decided to go so the body still seemed to be there in the gathering she was like can I talk right now because I'm drifting away I'm leaving you all and is it okay David can I do this without permission to go off during the gathering and I said yes you do and so she was speaking to us as she allowed her mind to drift away from what seemed to be the context of the room and was very open and verbal about it I've had others that one time I was at a gathering this woman came up to me and she said she said I have narcolepsy she said and I just want to mention that to you because I know if I watch you or listen to you I start to get so relaxed that I will just go right into my narcolepsy and I will fall asleep and probably my head will just drop onto my husband's shoulder and she said I hope you don't take offense at that I don't think you're boring or anything and I said you just go ahead just stay as long as you want and then you have full permission to drift off into whatever experience it is narcolepsy we don't have to think like that anymore we don't even have to label it just give yourself over to it and she went up to about 20 minutes and went down and I had another friend who was an assistant of mine back in the early years in the 1990s Kathy and we would have sessions and we'd go deeper and deeper and deeper and her head would just you know those bubble doll head would just and where'd she go you know I always thought well that's why we didn't film in the early days you know going around all these engaged faces you know but I think there's something to the saying of allowance we have to allow ourselves to let go of our seeming perceived world our seeming perceived situation our perceived world even there has to be a lot of permission in this and I realized as I took the course very very deep I took the course into what I call mysticism where I went into mystical states and revelations and the things that the first generation to work with the course were kind of hinting at how Thetford never had a revelation Helen Shuckman did the subway revelation and Jesus did tell her they're very rare your mind really has to be ready can you say what the revelation is? the revelation is going beyond the perceptual world what Helen's revelation was Helen's revelation seemed to involve a subway where she was riding the subway and then suddenly she just went into this experience of absolute oneness where she was absolutely one with everyone and everything and Jesus said these are rare but this is a glimpse of the end he said this is where this is all heading into this absolute oneness and that's what my experience was the figure ground kind of collapsed and then all it was was it went into light just absolute light it wasn't a light like sun or anything yeah and I've actually shared a few of my revelations hi Brian excuse me it was really hard to find I knew it was going to be dark but we figured people have iPhones smartphones nowadays she was just saying at dinner well it's really dark but people do have phones that's true don't worry about it they'll find us and they'll come in when they come in so there's been some times where I have shared revelation experiences and somebody will start crying and go oh my god it's the first time I've heard that kind of thing and they've had something very very similar like they hadn't really spoken about it yeah I had been traveling all around for quite a long time back in the 80s and I had a lot of free time at night so I was reading course and miracles actually I'd been reading it quite a bit I'd taken that with me on the trip and I was in the London subway and I had that same kind of experience of unity consciousness I wasn't expecting it pure profound I was partially involved in having spent the time reading the course I mean I don't know what all the precipitating events were but hilarious but not the subway that's when I asked what happened on the subway yes I'm glad you did because I have a friend Helen and she had a subway revelation experience too something about these subways kind of interesting they're simple subways are like symbols of transportation and that's what a revelation really is it's almost like you're transported into see a glimpse of the end and that is so precious because it's like suddenly your whole practice is like oh that's what it's all for it's not some kind of a concept it's an actual experience so I was saying right before we came in that if we look at it from quantum that it seems like there's a room here and there's a world outside of that room and there's a world that you go back to but that's not necessarily the case we can go so deeply into an experience that it changes our entire perception of the world and who we are and what that really means in another term would be this idea of location is just a concept too so when we loosen our mind from that idea of being located of like having a coordinate in time and space where we exist we start to loosen that up it's very delicious the mind just kind of expands and this is very nice and this is delicious and then things that seemed so prevalent were so persistent just kind of softened and drift away and it happens with relationships it happens with our perceptions of ourselves with jobs and work it happens with travel travel suddenly is different because there's not this sense of going somewhere we're getting anywhere this idea of destination kind of re-orients where you have more of a feeling like who you are is the destination and this other sense of going somewhere starts to sound kind of funny like that's funny who could go anywhere these are like expansive states of mind that start to come in and those states of mind are very convincing and yet we still have to give the destination the ego part is not wanting us to let go because it wants to exist and in order to exist it needs guilt and fear and it needs the status quo that's something that Nikita's been exploring over these last weeks it wasn't really exploring it was more like exploring exploring how to let it go although I didn't even know what that was she finally asked me what is the status quo yeah what is the status quo that I'm here that has to go because I kept hearing you can't have status quo and be happy and so I was like what is the status quo and where maybe I'm supposed to communicate it to somebody and I was like I don't have the status quo that I know of and I'm all about not having anything as far as I knew but then and then it just went on and on and then again it came up and there was something like again the status quo and then I kept hearing even more it's like you have to let it go you can't be happy and have status quo and then I finally just I just couldn't hold it anymore so I called David and I said what is the status quo and he explained it in a way that I could understand because I even tried to google it but I couldn't comprehend it still I'm like what is the status quo I couldn't it's one of those questions yeah and then David explained that in terms that I understand and then and I was like and then they said well the reason I'm asking is because I have no choice to keep it I have to let it go and that was just a matter of like the how and just the praying and like help me let it help me let it go the only thing I didn't want to do is like I didn't want to let it go on my own like an egoic way like beat it down or judge it down but it's like it has to be with spirit like in a true way and then funny enough David mentioned right away he's like well you know what's a good way to let go status quo travel and I was like whoa really so that was this is why this tour is quite something it was just really really like very focused on forgiveness and depth and of course like you know the call to just like deeper to accept the love yeah yeah I'd like with David and Christine were bringing up relationship things and can be part of the status quo too where it seems like there's there's even issues that involve two people or that relate to people in a practical way or that are between two people when actually the issues aren't really in a betweenness they're not in that context there's a whole different level like Einstein saying you can't solve the problem from the level of the problem so if you've got your definition of we'll say an interpersonal relationship and you keep searching and searching within the level of the interpersonal relationship for the solution it can get quite frustrating when there is a solution but it's it's a you might say a level up or beyond the level of the construct so the construct is just acting out and operating and it gets very frustrating when you try to solve it from that level we watched we were down in Southern California with this group of young people up on the mountain and they were dealing with some relationship things maybe not so overtly but there was an intensity underneath and so we said let's watch the movie Herb with Joaquin Phoenix and The Voice of Scarlett Johansson and that was you know I said oh that's a good one because you kind of it's you get taken first you start to see this this man played by Joaquin Phoenix start to take on an intuitive operating system that's very friendly and effective and helpful and and then he seems to start almost to fall in love with his operating system very helpful and friendly and then it starts to get more intimate they even start to have have sex although she doesn't have a body yeah you know it's kind of I guess this is where they talk about phone sex or whatever internet sex well this is you know ritual and kind of getting into it with her and the feelings of falling in love and the feelings of connectedness and like hi oh hi you know the tones of voice that get softer and softer when there's this kind of connection and then as it goes on it's a beautiful metaphor so she just wants to keep expanding her awareness expanding her consciousness and that's not unusual I think all of us that had relationships where someone the partner or someone will say to us I really want to that's the purpose of this whole thing is to expand my awareness you know I don't want to say locked in some kind of definition of who I am I want to open up so she's doing this and then she she I think it's they say in the movie Northern California they developed an Alan Watts operating system so he's like a famous mystic and so she starts to interact with Alan Watts and he even has the voice of Alan Watts kind of the sound of it you know it's so real we're like he's now he's introduced and he's like oh okay nice to meet you nice to meet you and then as it moves on he gets she's interacting with so many people as she's expanding her mind so to speak merging that he will say things like how many people are you talking to right now because it's multiple simultaneously communicating with multiple people and then the issue comes up how many people are you in love with and it's not just three or four the numbers are way up there it's a mind expanding experience it goes beyond two companies raise a crowd because the numbers go you know it's really an interesting movie of forgiveness of letting go there's so much surrender and then eventually the operating systems basically leave the realm of the human consciousness because they've got to go on you know it's like watching a story or starting to appreciate the stillness and the vastness in between the words like she's literally going beyond verbal communication into like Mozart said the best part of music for him was the silence between the notes Mozart said and the same might be said of this crude communication of words which is an attempt to communicate but there's something way more vast than that type of communication it's like a communion experience that's way higher so that one yeah it was fun showing it to this group of young people like a little young community because they were like whoa almost like pause the movie get the snacks wait a minute here it was like whoa but that was fun in the sense that that's what's happening as we heal you might say our frame of reference is getting stretched beyond the status quo, beyond the familiar beyond the concepts that we have held for who we are into something that's greater than the concepts and of course we'd say it's just forgiveness it's a self concept but it's a shared self concept it's a concept of the self that we share with the Holy Spirit and therefore we share with everyone and it's what everyone is aiming towards when you have a family when you have a relationship, when you have a community what you want is the communal connected loving feeling not the form it's never the form of what we want that's just what we interpret as the bringer of the experience but actually the experience is coming from within and we're just attaching the form to the experience and saying oh thank you, thank you beloved you have lit my life up and really we were ready to be lit up and it wasn't a form beloved that lit us up it was just we were ready to experience it and they seem to be part of it and wonderful, it's wonderful that they are because we while we believe in form the Spirit has to use the form to communicate with us in meaningful ways and meaningful symbols so we keep going so it's very precious that we have that and I would say as we go deeper we come into more undefined experience which is not the status quo because the status quo always has a definition and the Spirit is not content to leave us stuck in awareness in a definition when there's something much greater than that definition we weren't created to be defined God can't be defined, why would we think the definition of God that we could be defined if God created us and caused likeness and image, why would we think that we had to be defined and that brings an easiness to the ego the loss of definitions usually it comes with a bunch of questions like what's happening to me am I going insane am I losing my mind those are the expressions that come up when these glimpses of a state of mind is not defined start to come into awareness even briefly have you had that yeah, yeah it just was like the world completely disappeared did the questions come I think it's upon the return that the questions are it's not like in the experience itself there's no questions what is it like it's like everything is perfectly known everything is still it's fulfilled Judy used the word complete she said I'm here to complete I'm here for completion and that's another totality, completion fulfillment and I have that feeling I do feel that I don't have a linear direction to me anymore I don't have any goals I don't have any ambitions you know I could watch the grass grow and have just as much joy as anything else there's a contentment it's just a contentment and I feel that was the impetus for the call I think I could feel you praying which is really just a call a call to an experience and we trust the spirit I said do you want to come to California and we'll just take a trip and you said yes and so a lot of things just came flooding in after that including the contact and what seems to be what we're doing now that came from it as well she said she really felt it and I felt it I was in bliss for days after I talked to you imagining you guys coming here I was like it was like it is now almost it was that huge you said first you had that and then you had some fear that came up there was a little fear like oh my god I was in love just now the ego part goes I let go of everything but I still have things I want to do and then there's that little push pull I still have that too but then I also have the opening oh this feels so good they go back and forth it's great that you can even bring that up maybe it's people feel like an unconscious like there's experiences and time and space and maybe it's just a little whim or a hunch of like I still feel like I'd like to experience this or that and again the spirit is so amazing the spirit can use everything the spirit uses the bucket list you said you had whims to travel you had some things that were still kind of in there and now the spirit's using them to take you out of the status quo isn't that lovely even the bucket list gets used so it's not a bad thing it's not a wrong thing in fact you start to get a feeling like wow there's nothing really wrong it's just as I'm ready I'm ready for experiences then I have experiences and then we seem to be more ready and then we experience it but there's not really a right or wrong to any of it it's just like when I'm ready it is there how wonderful and readiness is not something too that can be it's not like a commodity like oh I'm going to wrap up my readiness or something like that it's something that very deep and it's not something that we can quantify and put define in some kind of a way it's natural yeah I think it seems to be it can feel like a letting go in the sense that you know that the serenity prayer has three aspects to what I can control, what I cannot control and the rhythm to another difference and there's those three aspects I always tell people that of course miracles is just an expanded version of the serenity prayer because everything's there in the serenity prayer that's why it's so effective in the 12 step programs people having major healings huge transformations they're not studying in the course of miracles but the serenity prayer is right there at the core of the 12 steps and what's the expanded version well the expanded version has simplified expanded well I mean that's why it has 365 lessons and the text and the workbook and the manual I mean it's I think it's just a version of the how for the intellectual mind and so it's really not necessary but if your mind is intellectual then it does seem very helpful it wants a little bit more than that little prayer it wants to stick its teeth into something 1200 pages you know not that it's necessary in any ultimate kind of sense but Helen Schuchman described as saying ah it lasts the pathway to God for the intellectuals so that should give you a context for a course in miracles I went to Columbia one time and there was a course group down there on a coffee farm and eventually I made it out to this rural coffee farm and it was a group of mostly women that were there and they had a farm hand that had worked on the coffee farm his entire life he had never left the coffee farm he had never gone to town he was born and raised and all these women who were studying in course in miracles were like debating one day that was the big question does this man who's so happy so content and who's never left the coffee farm does he need a course in miracles they were debating in their course group about it and they prayed on it and they all agreed no he doesn't leave him alone don't bring the book to him because he was such an example of contentment and simplicity and how it's not a complicated thing at all so that's great wouldn't we say it's more than just intellectuals like when I feel that I get that I understand that I just feel so much more intellectuals we're always talking about purpose and it's an amazing display of purpose and in fact even the way that the course came is an amazing display of collaboration and willingness the whole story because Judy was talking to us about that yesterday Helen seems to get a lot of attention but she said it was actually Bill who asked the question there must be another way and then Helen was like taking down the shorthand of dictation but Bill patiently typed it all out and she said really it was a lot of love and willingness and a lot of calling it forth from a very sincere desire for this better way I can answer to a prayer so I would say that is more of an oversimplification just like when people say on the spiritual journey a lot of your head and getting your heart or something like that this could be oversimplifications and so it's just a very good use of the symbols we call words symbols that symbols twice removed from reality a very focused use of it and still to this day being there and having lunch with them you can feel the dedication and the care to all the translations I had had lunch with Judy's daughter a little while back when I was in this area last time and she was saying my foundation freighter piece that holds the copyright she said we actually need money and they spend basically a half million dollars on every translation and they sell the book but it's not like you know they sell it like wholesale and they give books away to prisons and do all kinds of things which I was beautiful I said well I'm glad you're telling me this because that's there's always something in me that just is open to just what serves the whole I'm glad to join and be of assistance in this in some way I feel like there's a sense of honor and respect if you could feel that at the table there's just been such a steadfast devotion to this whole thing that we call a Course in Miracles and while it's not special as a book it's certainly helpful extremely helpful and it has been helpful for so many and so there's like a reverence and respect for that so we did have some very interesting talks around that as well and what could be done and so forth and I think part of it it's not ever just about fundraising but it's also about gratitude and bringing raising awareness of this because oftentimes in this world part of the status quo is things just get taken for granted and they were telling us the story of I guess Tam going to Terry Jampalski and Diane and just saying that they had given some money to them to help them out when Jerry needed it and it's like we actually could use some financial support. What? I thought you had millions of dollars with some of the book that could just be assumptions and we all aspects of life where we just assume something and don't unaware so I think part of it's just an awareness but beyond that it's just the gratitude. I do feel like there's a huge experience there that we've been graced with in our life that the spirits use of those symbols has just impacted us in ways beyond what we can even describe and sent us on a trajectory that we never imagined I know you didn't imagine this for your life and I didn't imagine it at all for my life so I have a lot of gratitude for that and you do too I do too I was just sharing with someone cause even with Judy when she was asking me some questions and I was like cause again there's all this gratitude that was there and then with that gratitude the newness it's like again everything was so fresh it's never just like oh same old core same old life it was again newness of it like I just said like I was saying oh I had two major events in my life one was when I was 25 and the course was given to me it just came out of nowhere and one was it was just put in my hands and no work like without any further ado nothing no explanation and what the other major event when I was 29 and I met David and I came to the monastery so these were like they're the same like in terms of the purpose and so they were and again like even when I was like looking at it it wasn't like it wasn't from the past and then someone asked me that question like in Southern California I said when I was 25 when I was 29 and then I was like well actually now now like I'm in that place right now where I'm just like I don't know where I'm going but there's a lot of gratitude and I don't know what's going on and there's just like this place it's just like walking into unknown and taking a leap of faith and it was just that was like that's like course's job that's what it taught like it was like without the course I could take the leap to take to go to Utah so it was like so all of it it's just and it's like bigger and but things get so fresh like in a way that it's like oh wow and then I was talking to someone else the other day and he said oh my god I just I saw I can't believe that's David because I'm so used to watching him on YouTube and here here he is and I was like I still have that after all like technically it's been four years I still have that and she's like and I say what's going on and she said you're the guy on YouTube that's so new yeah it's like how did this happen oh my god like merging of the screens and again so I had that today you guys came in here before I got here when I got here when I saw your shirt it was like oh yeah I watched you in that shirt there she is there's that born shirt that's in my house now I think one thing we can go into really dive deep tonight it's a way for us to really go into the experiences I always hear people one of the discussions it seems to be going on it's all about religion and spirituality I saw this thing on Facebook right before I came in here and they said religion is following the messenger and spirituality is following the message but it's very interesting because I find words are just words so when people say religion to me what I hear what I experience is not the concepts but it's an actual experience like peace of mind to me is religion you know religion to me is non theology I had to let go of everything I believed about religion in order to experience religion it's never in the word there's lots of types of reactions against religion religion is bad, spirituality is good and on and on and on but when I'm really experiencing is that when you go much deeper into the experience you have this experience that you're it's like that netting netting from the east you're none of whatever you thought you were you're none of it and that's so freeing just to see that you're none of it you don't know mind it's the Zen beginner's mind it's the mind that's prior to time and space prior to concepts how delightful, how joyful how relaxing to be free of concepts and let that presence if it wants to use the concepts great that's wonderful too it's like a swirl like when a musician or a composer uses the notes and it's when you know you have the appreciation for music there's something you feel in your heart with that when it's being used in that way I wanted to share something you mentioned about Helen's remark about this is a spiritual path for intellectual think of the famous intellectual Piglet who said I think therefore I am confused and when I start thinking about the course, especially when I'm reading the text as opposed to when I'm doing the lessons I could get myself very confused thinking about I have a right mind I have a wrong mind let's see now but this into eternity there was this intention to forget now you know that kind of thing it drives me crazy when I start thinking about it and when I just let myself do a lesson and don't think too much like the one lesson of one of the review lessons this week is my attack thoughts are attacking my invulnerability but what really comes true for me is that tells me that every negative thought I have every negative thought I have is an attack thought against myself that's how I process that but if I can just not let myself get into this the thinking about things and just accepting and just doing my best to live it the way you do the way I see you and lots of people in the monastery and other places actually living this and not trying to make sense out of it because it's the ego that's trying to make sense out of it and that's what I want to get beyond I want to say you just stay there let's get over here into the promised land I do feel I have been talking a lot about going beyond the words and that's really coming back to the prayer of the heart like what do I really want of course is to say I want the peace of God is nothing to mean it is everything so to me it's that from the saying to the meaning and then when there is this sense you mean it in your core you mean it you truly mean it with every fiber core of your being then in one sense everything is then out of your control there's no control with anything everything just flows in a beautiful and voluntary way that's what's delightful that seeing that there actually is no control over the world that Jesus does say that you know we talked about the serenity prayer but right around the rules for decision he says you have no control over the world you made well there comes now he's like he's giving the key to the serenity prayer in there and how relaxing that is and then if I have no control over the world you start to begin to open up to this idea that things could never have been different that everything is and always has been absolutely perfect everything has always been in divine order how relaxing is that because there's no mistakes in that that means you begin to open up to this idea of the perfection of the plan not a plan in linear time as if there's a linear plan but the perfection of coming back to just see it in a whole new way see it simultaneously and when the mind just begins to do that then it starts to just relax into a state of mind that is is so free but it's also you can't understand it from a linear perspective it's so content we're getting into Forrest Gump land and we all love Forrest everybody loved Forrest Gump everybody felt the warmth when they watched that movie there was something there that was so simple and there was such a happiness with that with Forrest and that's it so it really is letting go of the definitions you also are letting go of problems and that is a great relief you realize that your life is not meant to be like a problem solver and and wow is that a great realization because all the guilt came from trying to be a problem solver in a yogurt way you know that's why we have professions in this world and that's why people were diagnosing it was the mother of our hosts she was so happy the more I talked I gave one morning session and she was I guess diagnosed with attention deficit disorder and she came to me she was at lunch during the break she was so happy she said all the stuff you're talking about that's me I'm free I'm happy I'm concerned with details I'm concerned with logistics and this is me it's me it's me it's just it's this diagnosis it's crazy just had the biggest smile on her face like I'm more than okay I'm wonderful and I don't have to try to let go of that wonderfulness and fit myself into some kind of definition that something's wrong it's something that's flipped you know and that's beautiful too in the sense that everything is taken care of too it's like there's a part of the ego in mind it's like well yeah all this peace love and joy that's all fine and well and good but it's always got the big but you know you have oh yes you walked in at the perfect time at the crescendo behind that I was talking about there aren't any problems and there was so much happiness and then I saw and here you are you joined us on that high note that idea that of course says you have no control over the world you made and I was talking a little bit earlier about the serenity prayer how healing that is of course the miracle is just an expanded version of the serenity prayer because the wisdom and the difference is the spirit the Holy Spirit what you can control what you cannot and what I mean by control is what you can change and what we're hearing from Jesus is you can change your mind about your mind what does that even mean well you can change it from believing you're a time bound creature an eternal being that's quite a shift from a time bound creature to an eternal being that was created eternal and remains eternal and so that's where the change is it's a change of mind Jesus even comes out and says that you can change your mind about your mind and that's what that means but he also points out that you have no control over the world you made which also means you can't change the world you can't change the personality self you can't change a partner you can't change the environment you can't change the world seek not to change the world seek rather to change your mind about the world here he comes back again so it's it's really so so so so so simple all of spiritual awakening comes down to the tiniest little tweak in the mind where the mind shifts from believing it's a linear creature to accepting that it's an eternal being and with that tiny tiny little tweak the tiniest little tweak in mind it's almost like a big sigh it's like ahhh ahhh you know because it's relief there's relief with that relief that you don't have to be concerned about things and last night you've heard of stand-up comedians I think last night you were there it's like I was a sit-down comedian oh my god they asked me about politics and then I zoomed into sexuality and then what else did I zoom into there was nutrition I went after the spirit just went after everything it was so much fun oh my god I was so so fun but that's what I mean by those kind of things just think when the mind goes into nutrition how much guilt is associated with that search for health in food or in diet or fulfillment in sexuality think how complicated you know it is I kept referring to the Bay Area because I'd talk about different relationships and then I'd say wow we're in the Bay Area so you know there's a wide range of experimentation of beautiful openness and everything but what's all that openness for is to come to an open mind and an open heart is to come to that connection with source that's what all that openness leads to that contentment, that joy that fulfillment that love that's what it's all for and then whenever we look at things I was talking about politics and I think I was using the vacuum cleaner if you took politics as a topic and then you sucked out sides parties whatever if you just sucked it out if you sucked all those things out you'd be left with nothing and also this joy which is amazing to think of how happy you could be if you did that and then if you sucked all the things out of sexuality all the parts you sucked out and the private parts you sucked out and you just vacuumed well you sucked all the parts out of sexuality what would you have again and no thing then you could do with nutrition and organic and inorganic and you know went and sucked it all out very delightful to have a still mind and what Buddha and Jesus call an empty mind we're here empty of concepts empty of causes you know so you've got to be for certain things and against certain things why? why do I have to take sides? why do I have to make comparisons? who is it? who is the one that does any of that anyway? that's not the I amness that's not our creation our creation is not taking sides any opinions analyzing trying to figure something out so yeah it's quite delightful it's also very playful and there's so much humor with it I said oh it looks like I'm getting a new profession here sit down comedian I was sitting on a couch like this having fun but you know it's like Lion King it's a bit like Hakuna Matata a true sense of Hakuna Matata no cares, no worries for the rest of your life Hakuna Matata not that you have to eat bugs you know whatever but this is like a Hakuna Matata state of mind where you're relieved of concerns and worries you're relieved of believing that you're a construct that has to face a set of problems every day and then you try your best and then you get another set and the wonder suicide is the number one cause of death no wonder those depression and use of drugs to try to cover over and mask these sorry states of mind that seem to be the ego state of mind is because the mind is asleep and dreaming and just still fraught with guilt believing that it understands something and that it has real problems and the good news we're sharing is that the problems aren't real including the core problem underneath which is separation from God that's impossible there was somebody last night that was saying but what about that's impossible separation from God we have to come to a point where we start to see the unreality of that and if that's not true then that means we can't make ourselves up we have to accept ourselves as an internal being humbly accept ourselves as an internal being and that's not really a change at all that's just an acceptance it's just accepting what is it's not like a real change how can that even be difficult if it's just accepting what's already there you know you don't have to make up something new you don't have to invent an identity what if it was perfect if the problem's not real and we can't solve it anyway what's that step when you perceive that there's a problem in front of you and another one and another one and another one and you want to try to solve it and it appears that it's outside of you with family we just watch as my three teenage sons are beating the living daylights out of each other like do I just watch I don't understand I'm always battling with that bridge between they're all okay even though he appears anxious and he appears depressed and he appears angry and terrified I know that's me and I'm making them all appear like that but in a practical application on my regular everyday I don't get to sit in a room padded by all of you like if it were just me they would be different and I guess it is but whatever but in a practical I'm gonna go back into the fire the minute I leave you guys all and I'm gonna watch the pain and unraveling of each of my children that's where I wanna crawl in a hole and die that's where I could just go this is too painful I can't do it yeah it's like from a sense of we'll say the mind or the soul there's a call there for release like you're saying I want an authentic release into a state of of harmony a very authentic release like you're saying as well in order to experience that release I have to give that release in order to receive it for myself I have to give it so if we're dealing with we'll say three teenage three boys then I'm gonna have that's my opportunity to give what I would receive I have to give sanity I have to give equality I have to give peace in order to know that I have it you've got three teenage sons I happen to live in a community with 33 other people so I've got 33 others and that's just a symbol too because I feel like the whole world is my community I've been in 44 countries so I've just I'm around people a lot and puppy dogs and kitty cats and birds and there's just a big community in my mind and so with all of that and that includes politicians, Donald Trump he's part of my community my family and some of them are passed on Asama and Saddam and Hitler but I've got some other ones that I'm still working with you know that's my community it's a broad community and there's things happening every day and I'm out and about apart amongst it seemingly but what I really realized is that I have to offer the gift in order to receive it for myself so I had to do that with people with pets with all these encounters I've had with occasionally politicians and actors, actresses all walks of life when you are kind of a public journey for the last quarter of the century where I've kind of been out and among everybody a very public kind of experience so to speak and I've had to consistently give what I want to receive so it's good practice at guidance you know what you're describing in fact that's the only way I think you could have harmony would be to really get in touch why is guidance so important because only guidance knows what to say and do or how to extend it in any given situation you could never have a book that you could just refer to okay I've got three teenage sons and then this the book wouldn't be big enough to cover all the situations it can come from three teenage sons just three teenage sons there's no book big enough like a recipe book you know like I want harmony today and oh we got a storm brewing here and this and this and this there's just no way it's only internal guidance that can get you through and believe me Brian and I go back we were part of a community how many years ago 20 years ago 20 years ago or something and then I've had before that and after that I've been seemingly the symbol of community so it's just not David and it's like when you have shared property, shared bank accounts shared everything it makes it lively even back then we were calling upon trust with everything with our little kitty there and things haven't changed you know there things you know how that goes it's like when people try to even get married and have a partner it's quite a thing to navigate a partnership in time and space then you throw some children in there and then it gets pretty complicated or seemingly complicated to navigate so to me to see the blessing of that to see that wow this is how the classroom of my time seems to look for me that I've chosen this that I'm going to accept what I've chosen I'm not going to try to be like James Bond as the car is going off the cliff looking for the eject button oftentimes it's tempting to look for an eject button there must be some eject button somewhere how did I get into this wacky scenario I need to get the sunroof it's Brian's office I said pop get out somehow but it's been helpful in the sense that to me it helped me grow into a strong connection with the Holy Spirit that there's always a presence that is there that has the answer that is the answer that will give me whatever to say to do whatever is practical whatever is helpful whatever will extend the sense of harmony in connection that power is always there and then I've just come to rely on that power and what does that mean I've let go past learning I've let go of education I've let go of opinions I've let go of being right I would rather humbly listen and follow than be right I would rather humbly listen and follow than make a point you know or win an argument you know I just can't even remember I can't even remember when I had a bad day I can't remember anymore I can't remember an argument it was so so long ago in an ancient time that really never happened you know but I can't remember I can't remember what an argument is like anymore because there's no desire to contest anything you know people used to say well what do you do like if in some kind of situation where somebody takes something from you or they take money from you or this and this and this but it's such a state of acceptance that everything's working in divine order if I go to a restaurant and I pay the check and I give them some money and they give me less change than would seem to be expected I see it as perfect and if they give me too much back I take that too I I'm just like watching the world I'm not trying to correct anything I'm not trying to correct anybody anything I've practiced with everything I'm like the dreamer of the dream I'm just watching the dream and everything in that dream is just just perfect I wouldn't have a thought of changing I wouldn't think people talk to me about pollution like I went over to Beijing China I've been over there four times and the first time I got off the airport and they drove me into Beijing and there was like this it's kind of like LA on certain days it was kind of like a gray some people might call it smoggy you might remember from the Beijing the Olympics and everything like this and they were apologizing for me in the car they were apologizing for the Beijing sky and I said oh it's just beautiful they say it is oh it's a beautiful gray I love that because I'm in just full appreciation of who I am so therefore I'm in full appreciation of everything I love smog if you're in love with yourself and you're in love with everything like pollution who made that up? God didn't create pollution we can't actually start to take things so seriously and believe that these unreal effects which are just projections of a distorted mind have any reality I'm really in line with the Holy Spirit the Course says the Holy Spirit looks not to effects for it is judged their cause as unreal the ego is the belief that made this whole cosmos and the effects which seem to be all in time and space the Holy Spirit looks not to effects I love reading that in the Course if the Holy Spirit looks not to effects and I'm supposed to look with the Holy Spirit and be with the Holy Spirit and be with that presence who am I to judge pollution who am I to judge anything that's what Jesus said in the Sermon on the Mount judge not he was offering as a fast track to the kingdom of heaven he wasn't saying stop it stop it he was saying you never had the capability to judge so don't try to do something that you weren't created to do he was really trying to save a lot of time by saying you are innocent and you don't have the capability to judge not that you should stop it and you're doing it you never ever had the capability that's not you that's not you the ego judges but you're not the ego you weren't created as an ego you were created as a divine spirit so this is what I call Jesus as divine logic at some point it's easier to go with his divine logic you know what you're actually right it makes sense I think it's true what you're saying and I will have to let go of everything else that I believe in my mind to accept it but I'm willing to do that I'm willing to be wrong about the past I'm willing to be wrong about everything that I thought I knew I'm willing to be wrong about that crazy identity that I seem to try to hold on to and make real and defend I'm not going to defend it anymore take it do you think that I don't know what your name is that her the suffering that arrives from her story is only because of a certain identification with the story and with how she would like the story, how the story should look and all these kind of ideas that the ego projects into the space now if all that you think wouldn't be there you think she could just be who she is without any kind of judgment and that would be then perfect that she has these three sons that are going crazy and maybe you think that would actually change the behavior of her sons do you think or would that just take care of her story and the sons would just still live their karma in a way it would take care of the entire story in fact there's a part where Jesus says history would not exist if you didn't keep making the same mistake in the present history would not exist so there's some kind of distortion of clinging to a make-believe idea a make-believe concept called a make-believe identity a fictitious identity and then when we give our mind over to that and we say oh no I want that to be real I like that story oh it's got some good and bad but I kind of like it it's not helpful to be attached to that so what I'm saying is it's possible to tune into guidance I call it intuition and it's so practical whatever the situation seems to be I've had people that have been in the setting like for example one friend of mine from years ago she was she was kind of in the medical profession but then after a while she just started to question all the medical assumptions like is this really necessary so soon she was out of that career she got out of the medical model she just kind of jumped out of that and then she got into massage and so she was doing massage and one day she told me she was doing massage she was massaging and she did it for some years and then she started looking at her hands and going like what is this you know what is this what does this mean what is this and so she told me she just was like she just walked out of the office that was the end of being in the suits because she just she couldn't relate to it anymore and I said well what did you do well then she went to the spiritual community that studied the course but they seemed kind of wacky and they were pointing the fingers at her so she said no I don't think I fit here and so then she went and she decided to become a Christian science practitioner well Christian science was founded by Mary Baker-Eddie who said there is no mind and matter there is no life, truth, substance or intelligence in matter so I learned to pray so she's gone from a medical model to masseuse to spiritual community now she's going to get into prayer and she started to pray and pray and pray and pray and pray and pray and then people would just call her on the phone and say I have an ailment can you pray for me and she would go zoom into the truth and their ailment would disappear and then somebody called one time and said can you pray for me for this I just landed in a strange city and I was scared I don't have any money I don't have a place to sleep tonight called her on the phone she said okay so she prayed prayed prayed and a man walked up to her friend and said can I help you I don't have a place to stay I'll pay for you because sleep at night it wasn't just ailments with the body it was involving situations even that were stressful she just started to get into the power of prayer that became her vocation was to just pray what did that mean to join with the truth and that's what the Course calls true empathy to line up with the truth whoo and then I haven't talked to her for years she probably isn't part of the world anymore the way it was going it was nothing we just kind of had no need for a world no point and there was another guy who was part of Christian Science I talk about Clarence Thieves I remember I got a paper from this guy Clarence Thieves I said okay what's the title of it something about the Sermon on the Mount so I started to read this Mimigrave paper from this guy he was a Christian Science practitioner as well from years ago he'd been in one of the wars he'd got chemical poisoning gas poisoning I went through this total healing everything healed and then he was working with a fellowship of students for years and I'm reading now his paper on the Sermon on the Mount and as I'm reading through it I'm just going I had the feeling he wasn't among us anymore just from reading the ideas that he was in the paper every paragraph I read I thought he was a human I read another paragraph this guy is not a human through the whole talk at the end they had a little note at the end of it when I got to the last page Clarence didn't deliver this address he wrote it, he didn't deliver it he laid aside the body his wife had to deliver and that's what I felt the whole article just like those were not human ideas because he was talking about he was talking about how the error you can't have good errors and bad errors you can't have healthy errors and unhealthy errors error is error and error has been corrected period and I was glorious there were no good errors or bad errors there were no great nations of error it was just erroneous the false is false that's what I call forgiveness to see the false is false he didn't deliver the talk his wife was there to deliver the talk he's gone Clarence Steed if you ever look it up and Google it, great those are the kind of witnesses those are wonderful witnesses people have said to me David if I followed what you're talking about the world would cease to exist and I said precisely why is everyone so concerned about the world if has the world ever brought consistent happiness to anybody who's engaged with it what if it's something that were to turn to the light like the kingdom of heaven is within to turn away from the images and to go inside toward the light you came in late but we were talking earlier about revelation I've had those experiences where the world just completely disappeared it was just blazing light everything was blazing light there were no bodies just everything was love everything was perfectly known there were no questions if that's reality just pure love and light then what's the need to protect a belief in the world and so that's been my life for the last quarter of a century it's like I've got I don't have a desire to protect the world but if you would go towards that that would transfer to all the perception the teenage sons are part of the world so are the mountains and the clouds and the continents and the stars and the black holes but if it's not judged it's not ordered and arranged and the other important thing is I just don't believe in ownership my constant desire is to protect their world and that's what's what's killing me protect their world we do have some good movie clips I don't know if we have capacity here to do we have a TV a TV or something or some other project yeah we have a big monitor that's the TV yeah that could come in tomorrow night we can just experiment with that we had some good clips I showed one on the 51st date with Drew Barrymore and kind of the same maybe we'll show it again it's just such a hit it just doesn't get old we can't talk enough about these things all the characters in that movie try to protect Drew Barrymore who's had a head injury and they all try to adapt and adjust to her insanity so they're all doing a lot of maintenance and this is what we generally call people pleasing it seems like love in this world but it's not love at all we try to please others the thing about it is it's all backwards when we try to serve these images before we feel like we're enslaved we're going to do the right thing and serve all the images and then before we know it we're like drained I've been so loving now I'm dead and so we have to go past altruism service is beautiful but even people who get into service professions they can burn out if the ego is involved in that serving so we need divine service that will release us from the story not bind us to the story but I'm just so glad you're bringing this up this is the way out I just was in Southern California a young woman came to me there for a week in retreat and she just been jilted she was just two weeks away from getting married and her fiance went to see his female spiritual teacher and this woman said this female teacher didn't have really sexual boundaries she knows as he came back and he just packed up and left two weeks before the wedding and so she came to the weekend retreat devastated but by the end of the retreat she was so happy and just dancing listening to what I was talking about and she went from devastation of losing a life partner I think if he contacts me I would love to share these ideas she turned into grandmother Willow from devastated jilted bride to grandmother Willow come here my child I'll talk to you but it was in a weekend it was a turnaround in her mind she was not the victim of the situation she was like oh this is working together for good I have a lot of love to share I have a lot to extend and if I am going to get married I'm going to marry a partner that shares my value for awakening now that's the kind of partner I said yeah you could go for that that would be beautiful so you see it's all about upliftment and seeing another victim thank you thanks for the time thank you all for dealing with that beautiful you would crack up the thing about it is you brought it up but I have been traveling around for so I get invited into people's homes and I will abide there but that's some of the most fun parables of my life where I'm invited into a home with teenage it's for sure about a TV oh my god this is reality TV it's max I'm in there the longer I'm in there for days or sometimes weeks or months I'm in the home I went into one home Lisa's home and she was like a CEO of a company but so she seemed to be the boss of the company but then I got to know her when I went into the home life she, the teenagers had absolutely taken over the house they were completely running she was CEO of the company she'd come home she's running around picking clothes off the floor and baking for them and doing things and this and this and they were sitting back they were like running the house and she felt so drained and so tired and I said well yeah I don't see where you have any time for your spiritual devotions and life you work all day you come home you work all around you pick up the form you do all this and this and this and she said well what's the option I don't even know she didn't even know there was another option and everything so I said I'll stay here for a while so so I got in there and we just started having conversations and she was like oh my god oh my god and to the point where by the time I left I'd say have you had the conversation with them yet and she'd say oh yeah I did have the conversation and she would say well I've had a new outlook on life that's been inserted into my mind she told the teenagers and so I won't actually be picking up all your clothes and I'll still cook meals for you when I'm inspired and she just let it all out to them and everything that's not acceptable and that's not going to happen you're the mom with the children you're here to serve us and you know they she said no actually I don't that's not going to work for me anymore and then so I said how did that go she said well we had World War I there and then she decided instead of just stuffing all of her thoughts that she would sit down and have heart to heart discussions with them as equals and she would just talk about her emotions as she would if she would go to the therapist or whatever she would candidly talk about what she was feeling and they were like no no no no this is not working well we don't even want to hear those we do not want to hear those things and she continued to do it and I said well how's that going after about a week or two she said World War II me talking about my emotions and then finally she continued to talk about her thoughts and emotions then they basically said if you're going to disclose all of your thoughts and emotions then we're going to disclose all of our thoughts and emotions I said how did that go she said World War III but eventually it all turned around it all turned around now she's we'll say she's a healer in her divine strength and certainty and this is many years later and she's a healer she has people come through her suicides and all kinds of things and the glory of the Lord the glory of spirit pours through her and where did the teenagers go well the one teenager went through the school of hard knocks the son actually in a pretty extreme life ended up in prison and had all this time in solitary confinement in prison and so forth so she started she started to send my books she sent the course and she sent my books into prison because we had all this time in solitary confinement so he started to read them and he had a little bit of prison ministry going in there when he started to go oh my god this is a spectacular stuff so he started to light up in prison where he had all that time to devote to that as soon as he got out he called his sister who was the other teenager now in her twenties or whatever and he said can you help me I want to go out and be with David David and we have the first Course in Miracles monastery in the world so she bought him a sister bought him a one way ticket out to the monastery so he went from solitary confinement got out and came right out the monastery and then he was there for a while one of those discussions I think is on YouTube he also was at this little town called Camus and I think somehow this woman he got involved with was like a setup or something where he thought he was victimized he didn't touch her and she said and so we ended up sitting on a couch like this and going into this whole thing where I could say but you're innocent and he said but I get angry when she thinks that I did something and I said but what does that matter you know you're innocent and so it's on YouTube I just saw that posted a few days ago of us sitting there and going now this is years later the teenagers now in his 20s and we're having this discussion then he ended up going to Hawaii when I went to Hawaii he was over there I think he's he's still in Hawaii he found his place it's like hippie communities it's the big island of Hawaii and the daughter who's now she's grown she's a family a husband family and she's very much into spirituality and she called Lisa her spiritual teacher now went from mother to mom but spiritual teacher she tunes in she does live stream she tunes in and then she calls her and she's like I really needed to hear that I am applying this like she applies everything she says and there's this like real relationship like she's like you're my spiritual teacher and she said I am still I still like my dream I really do so I can't quite she'll say that like mom you're working with David and David is showing that it's a dream and how to escape the dream she says but I like my dream so it's fine for you for now but now she's starting to get into I understand you're fully into it I'm not quite in it as you are but it's like I am where I am I still like what I like but she said but eventually I think I'll end up with you there but there's that like there's just that deep honor and respect and then like beyond it's like we are now together we're together in the real relationship with the teenagers in the house there's not only like turning things around so that they're all equals but there were things like drugs and all kinds of things that seem to come in as healing backdrops and context including the teenage daughter who when she was a senior in high school she got pregnant to the school center home so when the school center home and she's pregnant then again her mother called me oh my god my daughter's pregnant now what next like what's going on how do I deal with this like you were saying and I said oh what a wonderful opportunity and so then when the daughter had the baby suddenly Lisa who had raised two children and was not planning on a baby she wasn't pregnant herself so now there's a baby in the house just like puppy dog in the house which is a baby in the house Lisa had such an aversion to the baby that the daughter would come and bring the baby to her grandmother Lisa would take the baby and hold the baby out away from her and then I would say what are your thoughts about the baby I can't say it I say what are your thoughts I hate babies that great is a private thought you just don't hear that you just don't hear that in society very often I hate babies I say good let it up it's just the thoughts in the mind you don't really hate the babies but these are the thoughts coming up so then she had to heal all these thoughts around babies like I've done my job and I didn't want a baby in the house now the baby's in the house I worked with forgiving the baby so we worked on all that and then the baby grew up I was her grandson Cole I was actually there in the hospital when Cole was born see I get inserted into all these it's very fun and then it went from hating the baby to adoring the baby I'm not interested in my daughter but I love my grand so I went from hating the baby to loving the baby but excluding everybody else I said no that's not going to work so then finally little Cole started to grow up and Lisa would go and do her travels and keep opening and healing and Cole was like nanny nanny nanny they just had a special relationship now so I went from hating the baby to now they got a special love relationship and then we went through that whole phase finally one time she came home after she'd been off traveling or at the monastery with me or doing something and Paulie her son the teenager was home it was back in the back room and here comes Cole and now he's maybe a young he's a child now maybe maybe five or six he comes to the door and Lisa's just sitting there waiting for him to come just jump into her lap and she sees him and he comes racing across the room and she's just waiting for that embrace and he runs right past her over to Paulie he hugs the son so that was undoing the special relationship with the grandchild so you know it's all doable but all you have to do is have the willingness to keep opening up whatever thoughts are not pushing them down, not denying them let them all come and like dark clouds let them come and let them go don't protect them from the light and they will go and yeah we have many many many parables including Kirsten who's writing who's written the book now about her time with me many years ago called I'm married to Mystic and it's about yeah it's about a dismantling of when she came over from New Zealand and we traveled to South America and all of the things she journaled all her time with me but all of the healing that she went through so that's coming out pretty soon like it's the next one out and it looks I always thought it was going to be a hit but when I mean a hit a healing hit a healing hit for the ones who really want it I don't mean it in terms of numbers but I mean it, it's just so deep so deep in terms of practical and so truly helpful like truly helpful so what's the pattern that you kind of recognize now with your understanding that prevents people from taking that leap you know what I mean it's kind of that it's at a certain level of true understanding that needs to be in place in order for something to switch into this other dimension of no eye no opinion no manipulation no suffering I mean it's all these qualities right but the shift is a gradual shift right it's not like it seems like what I feel like it's a gradual shift of awakening it's just like all these pieces to the puzzle need to kind of fall into place but it's the same time there seems to be also a spontaneity factor so to speak you know where something just shifts from the illusion to something that's just more real now is that that crucial momentum of understanding that at some point the leap happens what is it really where do you see like do people stay choose to be bound and why are some kind of able to pass that line so to speak I mean it's kind of I don't know how to answer that in relative terms but do you know what it is often it goes very very deep in the sense that I used a lot of movies Jesus taught with parables and I teach with parables because it's so deep that that it's obscure it's like beyond what we call everyday human consciousness everyone has a kind of vague memory of it being there and they have little glimpses of it so they know that that wondrous miraculous state is there but the big question is how to experience it consistently and not just little glimmers and flickers and what's underneath it is basic cause and effect that Jesus was fully awakened and so he would teach things like before Abraham was I am if you look at the structure of that sentence before Abraham was I am you can sense that there's a fundamental shift in the mind towards the I am this towards the presence towards the eternal state that's prior to time so we're not going to find future enlightenment it's not going to be at the end of time it's actually before time was and so this whole world is a hypothetical world it's a hypothetical cosmos what do I mean by hypothetical it's a big as if and as if the separation from God or the fault from grace occurred which it didn't so this is a hypothetical world and then all thoughts about the future in the past are actually hypothetical it seems that there are reality but there really aren't like when you were sharing Julian was sharing about three teenage sons well we're looking we're seeing Julian but we don't see three teenage sons we're just taking on her word that she actually has I know that she doesn't but she thinks she does and so we dealt with it from that perspective and that level but what it is that's a hypothetical too everything that's about the past or the future is a hypothetical and yet we deal with things as real situations as concrete solid real situations not just this hypothetical thinking the issue of dreaming a world of hypotheticals is that the mind believes that it is those hypotheticals and somehow that it's got to solve the riddle of identity and it's a Batman the Riddler it's quite a riddle every human being is trying to solve the riddle of his own and her own life how do I get past this even Junie Scott she's ready for completion she said I'm here to complete it was fascinating talking with her because years ago she had this very powerful reading and it was all recorded and everything and she said basically what is it what is it that I need to do for completion and the reading it said lawsuit and she said lawsuit and lo and behold it was right before of course the miracles lawsuit the lawsuit was the foundation the reading is the the Kaushik record you know the script is written it's all there it's just tapping into it but even that it wasn't about forgiveness it was about just trusting and letting go of outcomes and coming to see the perfection of everything even the lawsuit wasn't about winning or losing from the world's perspective she was on the losing side but you would never know it from her face because she's coming into completion she's coming into that sense of acceptance that she doesn't have to change the world or she doesn't have to to make the world a better place or all those kind of things so I think what you're describing it is right before you came in I was talking about it's the tiniest tweak in the mind but it's just covered over by layers of complexity that make it seem like a big problem almost like an unsolvable riddle the ego tries to make the simple choice for correction turn into almost impossible riddle it just goes on and on and round and round keeps repeating moment after moment day after day like Groundhog Day it just goes on and on or like Lucy in the 51st date that we're probably going to watch tomorrow yeah she's reliving this day over and over and over and all the characters in her dream are adapting and adjusting to the error instead of just being direct and honest with her but the tiny tweak we don't make no it's more like the spirit's there and we have to align with the spirit and we see that we've always been innocent it's not we don't personally make that tweak we don't personally because I always think that I'm doing something wrong and if only I did it this way and I made all this happen because it's my internal reflection you know blah blah blah all the same stuff we all know and then sometimes when I get the wave of peace I did absolutely nothing to get and whenever almost anything goes right I did absolutely nothing to make it go right so when you talk about that last little piece and I don't know if there's ever a last one or just is an on and on and on learning that's the thing that I feel that I'm always missing like I'm so close I can taste it and then I go right back into the Groundhog's Day again yeah it's like this make-believe invention of an eye of a self is associated with the body of personality and so that tweak that I'm talking about must come with the recognition that I am not and have never been that body I am not and have never been that personality I am not that person who decides I never have been in the end even the concept of personal choice which is so guarded by the ego you know it likes that I can choose choice, choice, choice, choice that whole thing is going to be gone in the tweak as well I remember one time I had a friend of mine Pam and she said oh my dad is a retired minister and he's got a friend who's a retired philosopher and they had a retired scientist and they all meet at this diner these three old guys with white hair and they just meet at this little diner and talk about the world and everything like this and she said I talk about you and they would like to meet you they want to meet you and I said okay I'll go up there so I go up there and it's this small town little diner and I walk in and you know I'm a new character in the diner it's the same people every day it's a small little thing so I feel like I'm walking in like an old movie in the wild west I go back to the table my friend Pam's with me and there's these three guys retired, retired, retired we talk about the world and try to figure the world out so they're all there and I sit down and I start I don't even feel I'm in a diner I just feel like it's just the universe just starts pouring through and they start asking me all kinds of questions and it starts coming through and coming through and so finally they get very still and the waitresses are just coming up and carefully slipping into food and like there's something mystical happening up there you know and it's like that movie we watched Baghdad Cafe you know it's all turning really mystical and I'm with them and I see one of them just touched upon and I'm like hmm and this old man says well when we make it back to heaven will we retain any sense of individuality back in heaven and I looked and we said no and the three old guys just shivered no one it's like the shivering thought there's no individuality left it says the board it's like a collective conscious it's a collective light the light that you just merge with it's just absolute oneness but it was so fun because at the end this kind of surreal scene we all got up and everyone in the diner just watched us and followed us all the way through because they heard every word of the entire discussion at the diner no private thoughts but the parking lot I looked back all these heads are in the diner looking out into the parking lot like what have we be held almost like it was an alien invasion because they're down in the diner for something like this but it's just fun what it does is it just takes us that little tweak it's like the grace of God there is no sense of a doer of an accomplishment it's like that feeling you have where you said I didn't do anything almost like you're washed in peace and you didn't do anything and that's part of the forgiveness and letting go of the dream and letting go of time and letting go of the body is you have to come to a realization in that tweak wrong or right in your life wrong or right but you were mistaken about the whole thing about the dream, about the body the ego made the body out of hatred people talk about Adam and Eve and God created Adam and Eve as the first two people in the garden no God didn't create bodies it was divine light there's a garden of divine light and even the tree of the knowledge of good and evil that's a symbol from Genesis taking a bite of the fruit of the apple from the tree of the knowledge of good and evil that's a symbolic tree there's no actual trees in heaven with leaves and all these things and fig leaves I always say the whole cosmos is a cosmic fig leaf it's like the sleeping mind trying to hide its private mind and private thoughts with a giant cosmic fig leaf there is no actual fig leaf there is no actual tree it's symbolic taking a bite of the tree of the knowledge of good and evil is taking a bite of the belief in duality and oneness and duality are very conceivable one is real and one is not so in the end even the part in the bible is as if God had anything to do with that scenario because that's where people come to me and they go why would God put such a tree in the garden I mean if God is love wouldn't that be kind of a temptation like to say I'm putting a tree in here and it's the tree of good and evil and Noah that's duality so God supposedly puts a tree in there of good and evil and then says don't eat from the fruit what happens when you tell children not to do something don't eat candy you've raised your brother don't when you say don't what's the first thing that goes into your mind do you ever have put you in such a position oh okay if God didn't put it then it must be the ego that invented all of it and to believe in it is the insanity but God is off the hook let's not think that the loving creator is the one that's responsible for the fall from grace because the loving creator had anything to do with the fall from grace because if God created you perfect then you must still be perfect if God is all knowing and all loving and all powerful believe me this little puff of a thought called an ego is not making conditions that God now has to meet so God can't attack what he did not make he still has to honor the sleep will say in the sense that he doesn't even really know of it so the Holy Spirit is like our remembrance of the truth it's that memory that's still in our mind that will never go away it's so loving it's like holding that memory of the truth for us until we're ready to embrace the truth and accept the truth and that is like a state of grace then so even atonement it's grace it's already there and it's available in any instance so it's as this world was over long ago so the correction is available it's the escape patch there's nothing preventing the mind accepting the escape patch there's nothing blocking the mind from it it's fully active it's fully functional and it's fully available so then we start to give up this victimization that's something outside of me some force outside of me that's greater than me is keeping me from knowing who I am no that can't even be true and that's good news that's what they say the good news of the gospel that's a really good news how did you find God what's your definition of God oh you missed the first part and the God can't be defined and neither can who we are it's the definitions she gave a little talk before you came in on the status quo of this idea that oh you must define it I do terrible in intellectual debates because I really can't partake but it's it's interesting because it's the status quo is the belief in definitions so really the question comes is how can I live without definitions is it possible to live without definitions and I say it sure is I just call it guidance just living by guidance living by what is given you know it's kind of a few sentences thinking it's a very radical kind of perspective and I was even thinking I would do a line this up with the whole vision of dharma you know and dharma, the dharmic vision is there is something that's in alignment with the divine somehow and there's something that's really out of alignment you know if you just lead somebody up that's not really considered dharmic in the instant point it's actually our dharma so the polarity is right in place when it comes to the word dharma one is an indication of dharma you know that kind of idea and so it seems like to get I mean he's sad it just seems impossible it just seems like wow it's like we would sit in Syria now we would sit like in the middle of a battlefield you know where the bombs just fall in our heads and people just die left and right you know it's just kind of wow you know how can I come to a neutral place a place of no judgment within that I'm still struggling with dharma again it's back to the belief in the idea that there are actual places and actual bombs and so on and so forth and quantum is really an experience that the unified field that they're discovering in quantum is almost like the scientific word for this connection this energy this unified awareness that the mystics have been talking about and the poets really I'll meet you there you know it's been talked about for ages and so ultimately it comes down to start seeing that the world is a world of perception and the world the linear world is false perception none of it has a reality it's a figment of imagination it's almost like Dante's hell people are concerned about burning in an eternal fire as well the linear world that people watch on the news Syria bombs dirty bombs the linear world of time and space is hell so people don't have to worry about dying and going to a fiery hell where that's our starting point in terms of world it's like the first company to admit oh this is hell and there's even a workbook lesson where Jesus starts off kind of at the top of the workbook lesson and I love it when he gives a question and I remember the first time I was doing the workbook and I read this question from Jesus and the question was if guilt is hell what is its opposite and I remember looking at the question and it's like if guilt is hell what is its opposite then his next sentence is the reason you have hesitation in answering oh my god this kind of a cone are you setting me up here if guilt is hell what is its opposite the reason you have hesitation in answering is because you do not believe that guilt is hell oh my god so that's why I have hesitation with that question because there's something attractive about guilt it's the ego is that clever and that sneaky that is deep I was like whoa that is deep like for example in 12 steps when you get a group of alcohol likes or heroin addicts or whatever and they start going through all this healing they all talk about the struggle their addiction there's something in their mind that values that heroin that alcohol that's attracted to misery in the groups they have to face there's an actual attraction to the misery well this ego thing must be pretty clever if it's got the mind locked into guilt and attracted to it so there's actually three sections in the chorus that are one after another and attraction to guilt is the first one then he follows it up with attraction to pain and then his third one is attraction to death when I first read it this is morbid three sections in a book attraction to guilt attraction to pain attraction to death so that's starting to get at your question like why is it so hard to make that tweak because you know the tweak is there we know there has to be a better way than this we know there is there's something in us that knows that but what is it and why is it so buried why is it so obscure so vague so ambiguous why is it that way it's because of the attraction to guilt and that's what every addict has to face as well if they're going to heal their needs can come to a point of my life is that constructed it is unmanageable like nothing that I've done has served me and I need help they call it a higher power they don't even bother to define God or give a name to a Jehovah it's higher power I need help I need something beyond what has been constructed to to bring the healing David and I there are many acrimonies for God but the one I love is the gift of desperation that's the gift gift of desperation rubidon you're giving this a gift that's other things it's interesting you've got too many modern technologies I feel like James Bond sometimes I feel like James Bond sometimes so also you see how important this is like I've been saying down Southern California and over there where we've been basically I was saying that we're brought together with a purpose and us meeting is by no accident and that we have a lifelong relationship dedicated to waking up from the dream that this configuration is not by accident that it's meaningful that the mind deep down is called for what do you call it of desperation deep down the mind is calling is praying for the gift of desperation there has to be a better way to come to that tweak there has to be to come to like anyone who's seeking for truth has something inside that's saying oh there is such a thing it's not a myth it's actual truth or actual enlightenment or self realization it's an actuality it's not a myth and yet this configuration I would say is a quantum configuration of friendship and actually seek and you shall find knock and the door shall be opened it's actually affirming oh yes you're coming in close now you're just at that point where you're ready to pull the curtain like in the Wizard of Oz you're ready to have Toto pull the curtain expose the wizard the means of magnifying things and trying to keep the mind trembling and fearful that's what the wizard was trying to do we get some ego charge out of the guilt is that what you were saying before the attraction to it it's a hit of some sort for the ego it has to get exposed because then it has to come to a point where the tables turn where like Jesus says you must ultimately learn that guilt is always totally insane and has no reason he's like coming in like whoa you must come to see that guilt never serves you and so what does that even mean well I remember at one point I said wow the ego is so tricky that it just divides everything up into good guilt and bad guilt I mean you think of it there are times in your life like if you go you go to the grocery store and on the the front of the package of whatever it is the chocolate cookies or the chocolates it's that guilty secret or guilty pleasure they even have name brains now chocolate guilty secret or guilty pleasure see the attraction to guilt is now taken on a name brain in a grocery store that would be what would be good guilt like okay you're entitled to it go for it this is your guilty secret your guilty pleasure and then or it would be like a parent telling a child shame on you ashamed of that on one hand that would be the bad guilt and the good guilt would be like hmm okay you did that we've all done that it's okay putting it into a category of the good guilt you can pass on that like it's a lie but it's a white lie it's just a little lie it's just a little guilt and a little guilt is okay because that's good but oh there's some things you did what oh you should be ashamed of yourself you see how there's a blade oh that's okay it's just everybody does that oh that's terrible you see the ego is clever it just starts to break the guilt up even into good guilt and bad guilt when Jesus comes in there's one thing you must ultimately learn that guilt is always totally insane and has no reason we have to come if we're going to come to innocence we have to come to a sense of guiltlessness there can't be the guilty and the innocent you see how the ego puts the guilt and puts an opposite to it the innocent ones are the people that get to go free and go around and work and do all the things and the guilty ones are the ones that get locked up in prison the ones that are out they're innocent the guilty ones they're paying their price lock them up lock them away in prison so you see it's all part of the system that the whole system is part of a dualistic system that has no validity and no reality but you have to unplug from the whole thing the experience that innocence the status quo you have to be completely free of the status quo because that's just almost trying to normalize the world what is normal people say I'm glad you're still normal what is that it's not a compliment I know for me it's the moment I think I'm me I'm not getting it it's just a non-starter right there if I think I'm me I'm not getting it you've got to start there and then let it go you can't figure this stuff out it's insane and it doesn't exist and of course keeps pointing to it and pointing to it and you can read it a hundred times and you don't see it I don't even have the thought there is no thought there is no dream there's nothing separate from that I am and so it's just letting it all go it's just surrender but you won't figure it out you won't figure those three kids out I keep trying I had a friend from Kentucky who was a musician and a singer so she would take the lessons and she would sing them to me as jingles I have no neutral thoughts I see no neutral things I am not alone in experiencing the effects of my seeing the effects of my thoughts I am determined to see different Lee so she would just jingle them back with her twang her Nashville voice kind of like a Kentucky voice and just sing sing sing these strings of like she would take a word I release myself as I release you I release myself as I release you I release myself as I release you now I know you not but we'll learn of you a new how we like jingles with commercials while it's like the spirit is like saying yeah just these are our mantras every lesson and some of you I don't know if you're familiar with the Course in Miracles but it's 365 lessons in purifying the heart purifying the mind that's the practicality of it and how we do that is up to the spirit to reach us in a way that we can can relate to it like you're saying where you just it comes down to the me just letting go not trying to understand anything in this world not trying to figure it out takes trust there's a lot of programming in there it's like oh don't get too it's mind training stuff don't get too fanatic with emptying your mind you're not going to be able to survive if you still a lot more to read yeah it's just really trusting we're on a walk of trust but we walk together in this we are mighty companions along the way everyone's of hope and shining shimmering experience as a witness of oh yeah it's happening we're waking up it's a gift