 Think Tech Hawaii, civil engagement lives here. Welcome back to Talk Story with John Waihe. Today we have a most interesting subject. I have been accused over the years of having a delicate hand in the formation of the Office of Hawaiian Affairs back in 1978. And so today was our opportunity to see how well that agency is doing. And what I found is that it is a moment of renewal. That we got a couple of new trustees for the Office of Hawaiian Affairs and I thought it would be really fun to get them on this show and talk a little bit about who they are and what their hopes might be for Native Hawaiians and for our state in general. So please help me welcome Kale Akaka, who is the trustee for Oahu, the Oahu trustee for the Office of Hawaiian Affairs, and Brandon Lee is at large, the trustee at large. And both of you had exciting elections. That's putting it mildly, like saying you had a subtle hand is putting it mildly. Well, yeah, we're trying to be subtle. Anyway, it was exciting. It was exciting and it's so good to welcome new people. You've been on the show before. I've been on before. It's because of your many activities with Native Hawaiians. But Kale, this is your first time. So we thought we'd start with you. You now work at Kamehameha Schools. I work at Kamehameha Schools. Soon to be working for Office of Hawaiian Affairs as a trustee. And was this your first election or you ran for office before? I did. I ran, first time was in 2012 in Kona for the State House. Oh, OK. Yes, it was a difference of 45 votes between myself and the person that moved ahead. Oh, my goodness. I know. 45 votes difference. 45 votes, the slimmest margin of office change. You should go and meet my friend Kameh Waters. I'm fully aware of it. It was like 44 and 22. So you understand what that's like. Yes. Oh, terrific. But tell me, now that you are in the, you've been elected, you have a very famous grandfather. I do. Yeah? Senator Kaka is your grandfather. And I had the privilege of knowing him many years of my life. We have much to mahalo you for, for having appointed him. Oh, yeah. I had a slight hand. A slight hand. Again, with a slight hand. All right, Brandon, tell us what you've done with Native Hawaiians all over the state. I know this, for those of you who have watched this show before, you have already met Brandon, but let's regurgitate it for you. Regurgitate it again. Well, I am born and raised in the Association of Hawaiian Civic Clubs. I'm the son of two former presidents of the Association of Hawaiian Civic Clubs. I'm the outgoing second vice president for the association. I'm also the president of the Kamehameha Schools Alumni Association. And the reason you had me on the show before with Nalehu Anthony was I was the elected chair for the AHA 2016. So both of you have been involved, at least with Hawaiian activities. I think it's safe to say we both grew up in this and continue to work in this. Grew up. Well, yeah, no choice. And as you remember, Gov, my grandmother, right, Mary Vahino Kalanili, who was the founding member of Pertarco Olave, so. Yes. Yes, yes. So, you know, you guys are just like my son. Yeah. You had no choice. Well, I shouldn't say. We have a choice. You had a choice. And we choose to continue this legacy. He had no choice. No, yeah, grandma didn't have a choice. You're coming with us. Yeah. We're going to go do this. You're going to go walk. You're going to go to watch. You're going to go see the home. You want breakfast? You're coming. You know, how many young people today that are taking leadership have similar experiences. You know, you had memories of, I'm sure you've seen your grandfather in action in the United States Congress. Oh, yes. What was that like? Tell us a little bit about that. I've had the great fortune of growing up in this family and spending my summers alongside of him in Washington, D.C. It's been so inspiring from baby time, seeing that his ability to reach across the aisle to get things done behind the scenes in public. It's just, but where he does it in with the aloha spirit. And that's, I think that's one of the things that people think fondly of him, that his, him being an aloha statesman. And so a lot of what we've been doing, I think, is in working to continue that legacy of service to doing, to putting people first and doing things with the people in mind. Well, fantastic. And you're, your mom's special, your mom's special. You know, she's been, I have been able to relate to her, work with her on many issues. So you tell us what it was like. You're better than me. So now you just did. You just told us what you did. Tell us what it was like growing up in a house that was really built around Hawaiian Civic Club. It was, you know, both my parents were founding members of Pro Harbor Hawaiian Civic Club. In fact, my mom is the last surviving founder of Pro Harbor Hawaiian Civic Club. But, you know, growing up in that household, you know, my dad used to tell us all the time, well, what are you going to do about it? And if the answer was like, well, nothing. Well, then I don't want to hear about it. So if you're not willing to do something about it, then I don't want to hear about it. And I didn't really start living that way until I got into high school. And issues, you know, that was the mid to late 80s, right? At Komehameha. Right, right. And we all remember what that was. Are both of you Komehameha alumni? I went to Konoaina. She's from Hawaii Island. Yes. Born and raised there, but also raised here. I even went to Maema at one point. But I work at Komehameha school. So, in fact, one of the leads that they gave me a couple of Fridays ago was the Komehameha lay. I felt like I graduated. But you actually graduated from Komehameha. I went to Komehameha. I was a 13-year senior, so I was a lifer. But yeah, I went to Komehameha. So you knew my aunt, Esther McClelland. I knew her very well. She is tough as people say she was. Yes, very much so. Very much so. Yeah, I stayed with her. She was a lovely lady. But I was very much a troublemaker up there because I grew up in a household that taught me to stand up for what I thought was right and what I believed in. And at that time, I'm happy to say that Komehameha isn't like that anymore. But the Komehameha that I went to was you sit down, you be quiet, you're lucky to be here. You don't complain. Right. And I wasn't raised that way. So I complained a lot. No, you got a chance to do that in public. I was very public about it then. And when I was sent to the office and they said, well, we're going to call your parents. And I was like, okay, Ben, sit in Tony Lee. And the response was, oh, those are your parents. Yeah. No, they're going to come up here and argue with you also. Right. That's great. That's really great. What are you guys doing for the anniversary coming up soon? For civic clubs? Yeah. The Honolulu Hawaiian Civic Club, which is the mother club. So that's the club that Prince Jonah Kuhio Kalanianole founded. They turned 100 years ago. They turned 100 years on, I believe December 7th, I think? Or no, sorry, December 16th is their 100th anniversary. And then the association wasn't founded until 1959. But Prince Kuhio founded that club so that Native Hawaiians would get civically engaged and start to learn the Western process. Because if this is a process that we have to live under, then we need to learn it well so that we can beat them at their own game. So both of you are now with the Office of Hawaiian Affairs, right? Have either of you or both of you, have you had a chance to go down there and get oriented? Have they done any kind of orientation with you? Not yet. The week of the 10th, they're putting together an orientation for us. My understanding is the first time they're doing that. Yeah. They've talked about it a lot. But that's why I asked the question. They're actually doing it. They're actually doing it. But that's the class of two, right? Not necessarily. So they said that the two re-elected trustees are invited to come. I made the suggestion to General Counsel that part of that training be about Robert's rules of order and parliamentary procedure and that they make it mandatory for every trustee to attend. You know, that's a good idea. That's a good idea. Well, especially since that's the rules in which we operate on that table. Is it Robert's rules? It's Robert's rules. No. I know there's a different set of rules that the legislature uses. The legislature uses Mason's rules, which is very leadership bias, right? Which is why the Speaker of the House and the President of Pro Tem have so much authority and so much power. OHA operates on the Robert's rules of order, which gives the body the power, not the chair. Oh, see. He's a parliamentarian. Maybe he's the master of that. Well, that's good. OHA needs a parliamentarian. And by the way, I think that Trustee Ahuna would probably agree with that. He likes studying the Robert's rules, and Trustee Wahe might do it. I don't know. But they all should go to orientation. It would all be good. Well, at the very least, if they're going to have a class on parliamentary procedure and Robert's rules of order, I think that every Trustee should be required to attend. If that's the rules on which we operate when we are sitting at that table to make decisions, then everyone should be proficient in it. Yeah, I agree. You agree with that? I 100% agree. Well, you learned something. You got two votes. You got two votes out of nine right now. You just need three more, and you can insist on it. Do something like, you know, you don't get your bonus or something. We get bonuses? You know something? I don't know. Maybe. Absolutely. I never knew that they had a bonus, but who knows. Since you had that slight hand, I would hope you would know. I don't. That's why you guys are on my show today. Tell me what's happening at OHA. Okay, so you get sworn in December 10. We have our investiture December 11th next day. Okay, and where will it be held? At the OHA offices. That's the OHA. The investiture? Yeah, the investiture. Washington Place. Your old house. Yeah, my old house. My hood. The hood. And your hood. Great. So when do you guys, when is your first like official meeting? I mean, when do you decide? December 10. December 10. And then you're going to also deal with things like leadership and the rest of it. As soon as we're sworn in. So you guys must be getting lobbied a lot right now, one way or the other, or have you. Or maybe not. I don't know. No comment. I know that and no comment. Wait, wait, wait until I ask the question so we can sex this up with them. It's like, I know at the legislature that the day, actually even a little bit before, they think that you're going to win. It seems almost historically the house got it together like that. Well, no. It's been times when they didn't. I've been with the, when we actually, when the house would come into session. I think it was back when Jimmy Wakatsuki was chairman or some of those guys or speaker, when the house would come into a session and then recess because they didn't, they weren't organized. So they did and this went on for like two or three weeks. So it's possible. I've seen OHA go through the same thing too. But for them, they usually start, you know, jockeying very quickly. I don't know what the custom is with Office of Hawaiian Affairs, but I am sure that this issue is going to come up. It's going to be the first issue that you face, actually. Well, that's actually the very first decision we have to make. That's why the board meeting is called as soon as we are all sworn in for us to elect, to re-org the board. So elect a new chair, new committee chairs, vice chair, committee vice chairs. Well, since you got the floor, what's your hopes and dreams for OHA? Well, I have big hopes and dreams, Gav, because I remember when you guys did this work in 78, you know. I remember my dad explaining to me what this meant, you know, and what the possibilities finally were for Hawaiians. So that's my hopes and dreams, you know, that OHA finally is able to fulfill what its mission is, which is to better the living conditions of Native Hawaiians and not fight among each other. And, you know, the hard thing is people think that how do you define what better living conditions is? Right? Is it housing? Is it education? Is it economic sustainability? What is it? Oh, yeah. So that's what the trustee should be discussing, not whether or not I should sue you over something or if X beneficiary should get something and Y beneficiary should not get something, that's not what it should be about. Okay. Well, we're going to take a small break in a minute. So when we come back, we'll ask Kalei whether the trustee, the new OAHU trustee, what her hopes and dreams might be for the Office of Hawaiian Affairs. So we'll be right back, folks. Thank you. Aloha. This is Winston Welch. I am your host of Out and About, where every other week, Mondays at 3, we explore a variety of topics in our city, state, nation, and world, and events, organizations, the people that fuel them. It's a really interesting show. We welcome you to tune in, and we welcome your suggestions for shows. You got a lot of them out there, and we have an awesome studio here where we can get your ideas out as well. So I look forward to you tuning in every other week where we've got some great guests and great topics. You're going to learn a lot. You're going to come away inspired like I do. So I'll see you every other week here at 3 o'clock on Monday afternoon. Aloha. Hi, Mabuhay. My name is Amy Ortega Anderson, inviting you to join us every Tuesday here on Pinoy Power, Hawaii. With Think Tech, Hawaii, we come to your home at 12 noon every Tuesday. We invite you to listen, watch for our mission of empowerment. We aim to enrich, enlighten, educate, entertain, and we hope to empower. Again, maraming, salamat po, Mabuhay, and aloha. Aloha, and welcome back to Talk Story with John Wahe'i and our guests, the O'ahu trustee for the Office of Hawaiian Affairs, Kalei Akaka, and the Ad Lodge trustee, Brandon Lee. And we're having a most interesting conversation. We have two new trustees for the Office of Hawaiian Affairs. By the way, folks, if you have any questions, feel free to call us at 808-374-2014. 808-374-2014. So we were just talking to Brandon about his hopes and dreams for the Office of Hawaiian Affairs. And what would you like to contribute to the vision? Well, to continue his message here, I think it's really important for our people to be able to come together, to work together when we're talking with each other versus at each other in the most respectful and aloha way possible, to really get things done. So part of my goals and my vision for doing this is through working partnerships. So that's on the city level, that's on the state level, that's on the federal government level, and also with organizations with the same concerns and the same goals. So we all pretty much want the same thing. We want betterment for Native Hawaiian people. But there's ways in doing that where we can rise our people up and the community as a whole rises up together. But I'm really looking forward and pumped to put my experience and my relationships to work, having worked at the legislature, having grown up calling many people like you, uncle. Uncle for many years. Maybe you'll get a payoff though. The benefit is to help the people. Right, but you mentioned working at the legislature. So I started working for Maui Reb Gil-Keith Agaran. He's the judiciary chairman now, right? So you can squeeze for a better definition of what seated lands consist of. Yes, so working with him and then I moved over to the senate side and I worked for Senator Brian Taniguchi. So I did committee work in higher education. I ask you a question. So you worked for the guy that ran the higher education committee. Okay, University of Hawaii sits on seated lands. Do you just, you know, like a gut thing? Do you believe that ought to translate into at least some kind of tuition support for Native Hawaiian students? Well, I think that's worth talking about. I'm actually interested to hear what your ideas, your mana'u would be on that. Well, actually there was a... I'm all about options and good opportunities. Yeah, because it seems to me like there's needs to be some offset and actually Nalil's mom, Eti-Lili Kala did that, raised that issue on a number of occasions. Right, and she brought it to the civic clubs and we pushed, I think, four or five resolutions through over the last 20 years asking the legislature and UH to waive all tuition for Native Hawaiians because in lieu of the fact that they're not giving us our 20% parada or supposed to be giving us, that all Native Hawaiians who attend the UH system attend tuition free. You know, they've been getting away with it too long. I mean, because you mentioned the 20%, right? There's a requirement by the Hawaii State Constitution that 20% of the revenues generated from what we know as seated lands or called seated lands should go to the Office of Hawaiian Affairs and it's almost a direction of duty, I think, not to have resolved that question with OHA. Except for the four words that you guys put in as provided by law. Yeah, but there's still the mandate. There is? There's still the mandate and it says as provided by law. And I remember we dealt with a similar issue with a Native American tribe in New York and at some point the court said that delay, you know, not doing, not providing by law becomes a violation of due process. Do you think that we can ever get to that point in Hawaii where the court would say or people would say to the legislature, enough is enough, you can't keep passing the ball? I think so. And I think the legislature responds well to public interest, public outcry for the need, the importance of that. So I think there needs to be some gentle reminders to the legislature, but it also takes the work of the Board of Trustees, the CEO, the administration to support this vision and to have the one-on-one relationships at the legislature. So both of you believe that you can, we might be able to work things out? Absolutely. Or do we need another? Give me a time frame, Gough. What, two years? No. No? No, as long as that's in there and given the current federal court status that we have now, I mean, look what just happened in Arizona when they used Rice Via Cayetano to take away adoption rights from Native Americans. Right. No, in the next two years, that's not going to happen. That's the reality. I'm hopeful. I'm hopeful. I'm hopeful. We clearly need to have more presence at the legislature. We need to have more presence at the governor's office. We need to be more present. You guys think we need another 10,000 people in March? Well, that was fun. I know you guys walked in. I walked in. I remember that. You guys remember everybody walked down through Waikiki? It was over 10,000 people. What a fantastic day they were. There's different ways of showing interest, showing up to hearings, calling for a hearing, putting testimonial forward, calling your senators, calling your representatives, being present, really just being present and showing, this matters to me and this is why. Well, it's going to be important. It is important. If you believe in the betterment of our people, then one of the things you need is resources. In order to meet the pass get hand, we need proper funding, bottom line. Well, we're not going to get the proper funding without the 20%, right? So if Native Hawaiians really want to push that 20% issue for the PLT, then what they really need to be lobbying for is the Sunshine Law. The legislatures get to get things done because what did they do as soon as you guys wrote Sunshine Law into the Constitution was they went and wrote a law that waived them of the Sunshine Law. But yet the Office of Hawaiian Affairs is still stuck with the Sunshine Law. We cannot have meetings behind closed doors to discuss things without the general public they're weighing in on what we're talking about. What? Well, hang on. We also cannot go to the legislature and have those closed door meetings with the legislatures because of Sunshine Law. Is there an actual ruling from somebody that says that the legislation, that the legislature should be setting the standards, ethical and Sunshine standards for the Office of Hawaiian Affairs? The reason why I bring this up because we were talking about my sleight of hand involvement is that the, back in the day, what the purpose of, one of the purposes of creating the office was to have an agency whose focus was on advocating for Native Hawaiians. Now people believe, they don't have since that time taken that to mean that because this is a state agency that somehow it's under the executive branch. It's under the executive branch. And so anything that applies to all the other agencies applies to OHA. That's not necessarily true. Except the court ruled that. Well, when? I know what you're saying, but they never really dealt with these issues. The reason why I bring this up is the city and county, for example, has their own standards. Now, unfortunately, they are specifically put under the Information Act. I was going to say, Council, even neighborhood boards operate on the Sunset? Oh yeah, they all do because they're all part of the executive branches. But I don't think anybody is actually challenged and I've had this conversation with Professor McKenzie. She's actually challenged that whether OHA is an executive agency or not. We just presume it. But that may be for another time. But that's just something to think about. Oh, definitely something to look into then if that's the case. Unless we can have conversations behind closed doors with legislatures and the general public out there can say what they want about hiding and doing all of this. Nothing's going to get done. We're not going to be able to solve these issues. Even if you do have these meetings, the other problem and might be actually the bigger problem is the fact that when you talk about civility and working together, you can't actually meet and do that. Not with more than two of us. Yeah, and so if you actually had a situation which got tight, I've been in situations where we closed the door so five legislators go in there and don't come out until you have a solution. But now the first thing that would happen is my dear friend Richard Borreco would be calling on the door like, let me in, let me in. And so you'd never get rid of a solution. And almost every vote is 5-4, right? Yeah. So what do you do? You can't sometimes... Well, I'm sure that your younger, smarter people will figure out all of these problems. It's about finding balance. But, you know, we talk about partnerships. Yes. One of the other obvious institutions is Hawaiian Homes. And developing a partnership, it seems to me with Hawaiian Homes would be kind of high on the agenda. Absolutely. What? Oh, we're running out of time. So let me give you a real quick another thing. You know that one perfect thing, and I haven't even talked to Trustee Wahe about this yet, or at all, but it's the fact that there are 30 homes sitting vacant on Papakulea. And they're being used by really unsavory elements, I mean, with drug use and all of that. And what they lack is renovation. So, you don't need to answer, but go check it out. Have you spoken to DHHL about this? No, but I've spoken to Kohio Lewis, who told me this. From CNHA. Yeah, and he just told me, and he's looking for a partnership. So it might be a way to do something. Well, OHA finds up to $3 million annually. And I think with everything, we can always do more. So it's about being able to lift each other up and work together to do. There's so much potential. There's so much potential. Oh, thank you. There's so much potential as you say. And I hate to cut it off, but I want to thank you both. It's been a very interesting time that we've had. And good luck. And I know as fellow native Hawaiians that we actually count on you to do what is needed for all of us and for the entire state of Hawaii. So OHA, thank you. We'll continue the conversation.