 Okay, so let's start with the question, eh? I know some of the questions off the top of my head because I was looking at the very end. It's slow, but long. Is that right? Okay, so one of the questions was, that's a nice little opener, was around... In your slides yesterday, all 143 of them, you used a mountain image that you've used many times before. Is this you just building up to your own free solo? Ah, shit. Actually, I saw it. Is that working? No. Yeah, you're on. So yeah, free solo. I actually watched this movie, funny enough, when I flew from Boston to Seattle for Triple Con. I'm obviously not going to do a free solo, but it was a great movie. That's a good question for me to type along. Okay, another question was around... Not that long ago, you promised to write a recipe for the Umami demo. How are we doing with that, Dries? Not very well. Yeah, I'd love to get a recipe in Umami. And especially like there's some photos, I'm more of a photographer than a cook or a chef, I should say. So I would actually love to take an existing recipe in Umami, try to make it, and contribute a photo. So that would probably be my step one. Maybe I can take a question from the room. Anybody questions from the room that they can speak out loud? I'll repeat the question to you. Any questions from the room now? So I'm considering we open... So creating a UI or experience, which is more tailored to a smaller work path or a long time. Is not it our audience's interpretation? So I'll try to repeat the question. So how important is it to have a user experience that is tailored to smaller sites? We're just tailored to enterprise facts, because going toward a smaller site may give you experience. Yeah, it's interesting. So we actually think a lot of the improvements that we're making today are beneficial for everyone. For both on the low end as well as the high end. And I think there's a lot of improvements we can make that are in the same vein. Actually, very few capabilities in Drupal 4 are unique to the enterprise, in my mind. In terms of UI and offering experience. So we've got some deep running. Okay, we're getting there. Actually, this is a good one. Right at the top of this from Chris Holbrecht. As Drupal has grown out, have been primarily a hobbyist project into an enterprise one. How are we approaching and how are we attracting the next generation of developers? Yeah, no, it's a great question. It's not an easy question, you know, because I think a lot of people got into Drupal because it was so accessible. It was easy to crack open the code and start making changes to it. And obviously as Drupal has gotten more complex, because it's gotten bigger and bigger and people have more and more use cases that they want to use Drupal for. We've lost some of that accessibility of the code, meaning it's no longer as easy to just get involved and make changes. So it means that our audience from a developer point of view has changed a little bit from, you know, hobbyist developers, let's say that can, you know, make changes in very little time to, you know, maybe, you know, there being a requirement to have sort of a more in-depth background in programming. You have to know more concepts. You have to know more, you know, design patterns which are maybe not, you know, as easily thought as, you know, the Drupal that existed 10 years ago. So I think the way we attract more developers is through a variety of different things. I don't think there's a magic bullet here, but I do think we need to go to where these developers are. I don't see Drupal always being represented at developer conferences that would, you know, or would make sense for Drupal to be represented. I don't think Drupal is featured enough on certain websites either. Like a lot of web developers, you know, use or read websites like Smashing Magazine and these kinds of websites. Like we should really try and get, you know, more articles about Drupal on those sites. We do often we're sort of in our own world. Drupal camps on Drupal.org and not enough RV kind of getting off that island if you go. So are you saying we need, now we've got our code off the island, we need to get our image off the island as well. Yeah, so there's an amazing story to it. I mean, it is amazing technology and obviously I like to think you all believe that otherwise you wouldn't be here, but there's so much to like, there's so much to love, and we don't always do a good job telling that story and inspiring people that are not in the Drupal world, you know, about it now. So I think getting off the islands, going to conferences, writing guest articles or, you know, on other sites. And also universities, I'm going to schools and universities and telling people about the power of Drupal and how amazing it is and what a great career choice it is. You know, all of these things are good. I think if you are an employer, they could bet on hiring new people, meaning people that don't know Drupal yet and give them a chance to learn Drupal on the job. We've actually done this at Acquia. You know, we had a program where we would, you know, we hired a bunch of developers, some of them junior developers, some of them career changers, and we gave them paid training to basically pay them to learn Drupal at Acquia for six months. We did some classroom style training, we did some pair, you know, programming, all of these things. And at the end of six months, we gave them a, we offered them a job which they didn't have to accept. And they were like, well, that's amazing. Like, they're going to pay us for six months so we can train. Yeah, it makes a difference. There might be a job for me too. And so a lot of people took that job, and still today a lot of people are at Acquia, and they're some of our most passionate, committed, loyal, energetic employees that we have today. And, you know, just the impact of them is so immense. And so I would definitely encourage organizations to really take a chance on new people and invest the time and energy to bring them up to speed. You know, I've seen too many organizations that want to hire senior developers and senior developers only. I was really encouraged. I had a meeting with quite a lot of business owners yesterday, and you part of taking that as well. And they were really quite keen to actually start doing more collaboration together on training materials and sharing their own training materials with each other so that we get a more common framework and a larger number of people can use them. That's something you definitely support, I assume. Yeah, yeah, absolutely, I think. Yeah, the more we can share it, the better. I mean, I'd go and start a core DNA. Yeah, absolutely. We are open source after all. So, I just noticed this question from Kevin Thull, which I love, which was, what is, for those of us that don't know, what is the proper route to creating initiatives? What support happens if they're created? And, as Kevin says, he's asking as the maintainer of the unofficial Drupal recording initiative. How can we make sure that those initiatives for all sorts of things end upon your slides on a Wednesday morning? Yeah, that's a good question. I mean, so there's really multiple ways, but sometimes initiatives are created kind of more in a top-down manner, and we do that by looking at data. So, for Drupal AIDS, we do the survey. I think over 3,000 people responded to the survey and allowed us to prioritize all the things people were asking for. We followed that up with other surveys. We followed that up with lots of conversations. I spoke to hundreds, actually. Drupal users and hundreds of agencies and was vetted with the court committees and the product managers on the court committee. We went to, I guess, like a classic process, a product management process, to come up with these initiatives. And these are, many of those are the ones that I mentioned, but not all of them. Other initiatives, and this is the part that I want to talk about most, is that the power of open source and the power of Drupal is that initiatives can be grassroots. There's a lot of great initiatives that have been created by people that decided to just do it. They said, we're going to do this. We're going to start an initiative, and then they started to have momentum and traction, and those also end up on the minds of people. So it's important to recognize that things can come from different directions, and I think it's essential. I think it's essential to how we innovate. So an example would be Tweet, and maybe this is going back a little bit more, but I never decided, hey, let's do Tweet. The community took that initiative, people rallied around it, and it ended up in Drupal 8. There's a lot of other examples, but the point is, it can either be top down, and we'll start another cycle of doing the research and surveys, probably like a year from then, when Drupal 9 is almost here, or maybe after this year, but in the meantime, I all need to keep innovating, keep organizing yourself, keep doing the things that you're passionate about and that you're conviction about, and start an initiative. Yeah, I mean, I know from a pharmaceutical background that attrition is a great thing. It's better to start a hundred things and just see which succeed than to never start them in the first place. Right, and Kevin is actually the perfect example of this, but let's recognize that for a second, he's standing right there, yeah. We kind of should have recalled the kill now. Kevin decided to start recording camps and ponds, and has now recorded, I don't even know how many camps and ponds, hundreds, and it's kind of an initiative, well it is an initiative, it was never, never did anyone go to Kevin as far as I know and said, hey Kevin, let's start recording initiatives. No, Kevin decided to start doing this, and now he's scaling that as well, he's making video recording kits and probably others to do the same, so it's actually an amazing example of sort of an initiative that just emerged. Brilliant. Okay, so I've got one from Alana, I think she's in the room somewhere. Oh, hi. It was about, you talked in the Dries notes about the privilege of time. How do we convince organizations to acknowledge the need to give developers and other contributors time to contribute during their workday? Yeah, I think, I think, and I've seen this and I've heard this. There's a lot of anecdotal evidence, I don't know if like a part of this, but those that are actually involved in the Drupal community, those that do get that as part of their job or in their free time, they actually become much better Drupal developers or it doesn't have to be just developers, but it's not going to be developers right now, so quite collaborating with others in the Drupal community, you can actually learn so much and you can learn it so fast, you can go straight to, let's say, the people that help build the layout builder and ask them questions, right? And if you don't contribute, if you're not in the issue queues, if you're not at the events, it's a lot harder to do than you have to do a lot more self exploration, which could take a lot more time. And so that's why organizations like the ones that I mentioned in my Dries note, Pfizer, I think it was the state of Georgia as well. That's why when they work with partners and they work with Drupal agencies, they will pick agencies that contribute back to Drupal that they know are active in the Drupal community. And in the case of Pfizer, it's like Mike Len who ended up running that, he has a quarterly review with each of his Drupal agencies and every quarter they need to show Mike what they've contributed back to Drupal. And if they don't contribute, it takes off the list of approved vendors. I mean, it's an amazing process and he learned that that is how he gets the best results. That's how he avoids, you know, difficult Drupal mistakes, you know. And so, you know, kind of going on and on, but there's a lot of benefits, not just for the individual that come from contributing, but also for the organization that the individual works at. Okay. I've got one from Darren, which I think we may have talked about before, actually. Will Drupal continue to be a complete product? Or is it moving towards just being a back-end component? That's a good question. I think it will be both for the foreseeable future. So the way I interpret that question, maybe it's the wrong interpretation. The way I interpret that question is, you know, will Drupal also be coupled? Like will it exist in its traditional way where it provides a front-end? Or will things move to being decoupled only, meaning you bring a front-end to Drupal? I don't know. Is that where this is going, do you think? But in my mind, the power of Drupal is that we do both. And I actually do believe that a lot of users of Drupal need both. Like it makes a lot of sense to build a traditional couple website, maybe for your main marketing website, because you get all the power of the layout builder and we do it in place editing, accessibility and search engine optimizations that Drupal ships with. But that same instance of Drupal could also power mobile applications, you know, what have you. And so the ability to mix and match the different delivery options is actually really powerful. I think it's a key differentiator compared to completely headless solutions, but also the differentiator compared to sort of solutions that only do the traditional or coupled methods of content delivery. So it's a strength and we should embrace the strength. Now, even 10 years the market changes to be completely decoupled. Great, we can follow that, right? So we're set up in a position of strength where we have optionality for the future, but in the meantime, it absolutely think we should keep doing both. Yeah, good. Okay, I've got one from... In fact, I've got the same question that people expressed in different ways. So Caroline has asked, I was dismayed to see the recent Stack Overflow survey found Drupal a very dreaded framework. I love D8. I'm glad you'd love it, Caroline. Where's Caroline? Is she here? Ah! I love it too. But where do you think we've gone wrong? And how do we fix it? I don't think we've gone wrong. The last time I looked at the data, Drupal was in the top 20 most commonly used systems or in the top 20 most loved systems and in the top 20 most most hated systems. And actually, that's a great place to be. And actually, so was other software. If you look at all of the software that was kind of in the loved and hated category, there are amazing names to be with. It was like Linux. It was like WordPress. It was like really significant, highly successful open source projects that ranked in both. So I think it's a little bit the nature of the beast, so to speak. And I didn't I started data Caroline and I didn't think it was as worrisome as maybe other people in Drupal I think we're just a very large project with lots of people that love Drupal for sure, with lots of people that don't like Drupal. And I think it's a measure of success. Cool. I've got an anonymous one. Anonymous? I don't think they're in the room. I hope not. Could there be a finance industry summit like the government one? Are the next Drupal clients? Actually, there's a lot of organizations using Drupal like some of the largest in the world like City Group. I think it's one of the largest banks in the world that have standardized on Drupal. Charles Schwab has a bunch of Drupal. I mean, there's so many examples and I think they're they have their own unique requirements around regulatory environments. I mean, there's probably a lot of best practices that could be shared amongst people in that industry. The beauty of Drupal is actually that it's really strong in a lot of these verticals. I mean, really strong in higher education or really strong in media entertainment. So we have summits for some of these things and then there's actually secondary verticals where we're also really strong but maybe not in the top three or top four. But it's not I mean, we could actually have a summit for every vertical I think because it's almost as though the summits could reflect Drupal.org case studies because if we're getting case studies then there are definitely people. So, yeah, I know we've recently launched a case study section on financial services. Maybe that people are out there. Good to hear. I believe it. Okay, so I have one from Sean. This has been a long week. When you met Matt Mullenweg, co-founder and WordPress and automatic, did you discuss philosophies about open source or just CMSs in general? That's a great question. I've known Matt for a long time and so we, when our paths cross, we try to meet up and just hang out a little bit, exchange notes and I don't know, we talk about a lot of different things to be honest but we definitely talk about open source and content management and industry trends and things that are going well and not well. I don't know if there's a specific topic that we talked about but yeah, I don't know. That's nothing that really jumps out at me like it's not like we have these secrets you know, secretly scheming things or something, it's just like more like socially talking about stuff without a real agenda. It's just like more of a friendship than what I'm trying to do. That's good though because we're all part of playing the same game, so being friends and working together with different people in different projects is a great thing. I know people in junior and it's great. We do things. We're on the same side of the battlefield in many ways, we're both we're all trying to advocate for open source. We believe in open source. There's a lot of common friends and then yeah, there's also things that we don't look eye to eye about and that's okay, like kind of critique them about their not prioritizing accessibility as much as I think they should. That's okay, we can disagree about those things. We need to talk about it but it's all very amicable. I don't know, I think Matt has a lot of respect for Drupal actually people may not notice but Drupal predated WordPress but WordPress was just launched WordPress.org was just a few pages and one of the pages actually Matt gave credit to Drupal. Oh, no way. I think that's the big reboot since I've done that one for the way back machine. I do think we inspire each other or we try and work from each other. Absolutely. I'm going to ask this one because I don't know whether we're going to be able to answer it here but I think it might be something that we come back to later. We've changed Drupal console this time and in terms of the core sessions we've compressed them down into two days rather than three days so rather than being three short days they're actually two long days now which I'm feeling right now, I must admit. Have you got any thoughts on that? Maybe but I think at the end of the day we should look at the survey results that don't really matter. I think on this topic I think hopefully everybody will feel like the survey and provide feedback and we'll look at that data but there's definitely things that I liked about the changes I liked that we brought in a more diverse audience that we reached out to the site owners and sort of business decision makers that actually write the check and for building a Drupal site I like that we incorporated marketers and fountain authors so I think that's very good. I'm excited about that but at the same time I've heard a lot of developers say that the next day would be better that two days is maybe two compressed. It's an interesting one because I've got conflicting thoughts on that as well and this is one of the things that struck me was it costs money to come to Drupal Con not just for the ticket but also for being here and if you've got two very long days then it's one less day hotel cost but you know. That's why I started up my answer with what I said. Let's look at the data and let's make data driven decisions about how we want to keep evolving Drupal Con. Drupal Con for you so let us know. That's why we send out the surveys. So Avi has asked a question Drupal has over the history has been late at solving for non-ambitious experiences. Is it still a good solution for the small business or non-profit with a small budget? That's a great question I think in many ways the answer is no. That's kind of the facts. So in Drupal when I started Drupal in a market with completely different there wasn't any software as a service at the beginning there wasn't OBS, there wasn't OVB there wasn't NASCAR space like 10 years ago people would come up to me and say hey how do I build a website for my daughter's soccer club or something and I would say oh it's Drupal it's awesome and today I mean it's a little bit harder to justify because there's so many good options to do simpler things faster and cheaper than the Drupal and so I don't think that's a bad thing just the way things have evolved and so there's no denying that Drupal is more expensive than some V solution that I just mentioned that doesn't mean Drupal is bad I will say that I reject the notion that Drupal is just for the enterprise I've tried to explain this many times and that's why I use the term ambitious digital experiences versus enterprise digital experiences and I'll repeat it one more time I've learned that I have to keep repeating myself until people repeat it back to me I know it's going to be a weird thing to say but I do believe that Drupal is for ambitious non-profits I do believe that Drupal should be for ambitious startups or small organizations if you want to do something new if you want to do something very innovative if you're a non-profit then you want to rethink how fundraising works do campaigns in a different way that's going to allow you to break through you know, like you are a little startup called Airbnb and you want to build a business online like those organizations should be using Drupal but they also probably have a slightly larger budget and so that's why I reject the notion of enterprise because to me enterprise implies large companies with large budgets and it excludes the ambitious smaller organizations but if you're small and you have almost no budget then maybe Drupal isn't the best choice that being said there's a lot of examples of small organizations with very small budgets that are very successful to Drupal and so it's also not necessarily like of the table either and we're also constantly making improvements to Drupal that actually makes it more accessible for the low end of the markets you think about all of the things in 8.7 even not only our media management capabilities all of these things actually benefit the low end and the benefit of the high end you think about the work that we've been doing about making Drupal easier to upgrade things like the automated updates initiative it actually I believe it benefits the low end more than it benefits the high end more because in the enterprise you have staff you can afford to be developers or we think developers through a Drupal shop that's the problem on the low end it's like you may not be able to have full time staff or you may not even be able to hire somebody for a couple days a month some of these tools that we're building have actually allowed it to happen again so it's kind of exciting that we can build things that actually benefit everyone if you look at the roadmap product roadmap carefully you'll see that a lot of these things are actually beneficial for everyone cool we've actually one at a time we've got to ask two more questions if everybody is okay with that this next one I'd like to say something as well after you've said something okay so it's an anonymous one we still hear and see some inappropriate behaviour particularly towards women at after-hours events often hard to address due to power differences can we stop it well we have to and so I think if you see something you know say something I mean that's where it starts in my mind and so there are channels where you can go and you see these things you can go through classification you can go through the classification staff you can also come to me and share it with us so we can deal with it and I will say that when these things have happened in the past and I'm not aware of every time something happens necessarily but I have seen the staff deal with it very effectively again I'm not saying you list the case every single time but I do know that the staff is very serious and based on what I've seen they're very serious about it Thanks Dries because I'm actually the code of contact coordinator so that's quite nice it kind of was I just want to say one thing from the Drupal Association putting on the event if you can't or won't behave appropriately at events you're not welcome simple as that you're not welcome to behave appropriately and that goes for everyone that goes for you, it goes for speakers it goes for our staff it goes for me that would be awkward but I would still do it so yeah and I'll leave you with one final question to might be a little bit cruel it is what is the internet going to look like in 20 years what is the internet what is the internet going to look like in 20 years I don't know but I do know one thing this is like a philosophy from Jeff Asos like many of us product management he doesn't ask what's the future going to look like in terms of new things but he often asks the question what do we know will still be the same in 20 years and let's double down on that in fact they'll be managing content and in fact they'll be managing more content than they're managing today so as long as we keep improving Drupal's content management capabilities of a lot of conviction Drupal will still be in here in 20 years that is brilliant thank you very much Dries thank you for all the questions they're really appreciated I can't get them all cheers that was brilliant I was literally clicking flu and they were just going I was literally the way that we tried to do it but I was choosing questions that were easy to make a conversation thanks Dries oh god that's the wall