 Good afternoon. Good morning ladies and gentlemen on behalf of the Institute of International and European Affairs I'm delighted to welcome you to today's event Which is part of the global Europe project Supported by the Department of Foreign Affairs in Ireland this project aims to contribute to the debate on Europe's role in the world and Ireland's role in the Multilateral order with particular reference or in the particular context of Ireland's term Which which we've just begun as a non-permanent member of the Security Council We're delighted to be joined today by Gareth Peterson the UN special envoy for Syria Gareth will talk to us for about 20 minutes or so and then we will open up to questions from the audience You can join the discussion using the Q&A function on the zoom which you should see on your screens Please feel free to send in your Questions throughout the session as they occur to you and we'll come to as many of them as possible I'd like to welcome also those who are watching the event on YouTube Today's presentation and the Q&A session are both on the record So Gareth Peterson is one of Norway's most distinguished diplomats he's had a very very Successful and high-profile career. He with a strong emphasis on the Middle East He was a member of the Norwegian team to the Oslo negotiations in 1993 Later on he was Norway's representative to the Palestinian authority He worked for the UN in a number of roles including as the Secretary-General's personal representative for Southern Lebanon 2005 to 7 and then he was the special coordinator for Lebanon 2007 to 8 he was Norway's ambassador to the UN From 2012 to 2017 when I had the very good fortune to work closely with them and indeed to count him as a good friend Gar went on to become the Norwegian ambassador to China 2017 to 2018 and Since January 2019. He has as I said been the UN special envoy to Syria An absolutely critical job on one of the biggest challenges facing the world. It's Very nice for me to reflect that Ireland and Norway are both now members of the Security Council together We competed in a very gentlemanly or gentle womanly fashion against each other both were elected And now it turns out that both are co-pen holders on the Syrian Humanitarian file for the Council. So for a number of reasons were blessed to have Gair with us today Gair Pedersen to speak to us about Syria. Gair over to you David, thank you so much and thank you for that wonderful introduction and Also for the invitation to be with you here today, you know, as you know I'd hope to be with you in Dublin, but of course with a pandemic here we are and David, you know lots of hones memories from over time together in New York And of course in particular your leadership when it came to the sustainable development goal and that you know The miracle actually happened that we were able to actually agree on those principles back in 2015 So I think we all of you are a big thanks for the wonderful work that you were doing back then and as I said Great to great to see you again today You know when I took on this job, I was told by my friends and people who knew better that I must be stupid to take on, you know, the most impossible job in the end of and You know in hindsight, they may have had a point. But anyway, here I am. Let me Let me try to give you, you know, I Try to summarize sort of my intervention in 10 points It's a little bit overlapping. But anyway, it's a way for me to Organize it and Let me start by sort of stating in the obvious and that of course is that any discussion of Syria must keep Front and center the depth and scale of the suffering of the Syrian people the conflict has known in March been going on for 10 years and The Syrian people have seen death Injury, displacement, destitution, detention, torture, terror, violations Indignity, instability, intervention, occupation, division, redevelopment and devastation on a massive scale and Remember today Millions inside the country and millions of refugees outside are grappling with profound trauma Extreme poverty, personal insecurity and a deep sense of hopelessness for the future Half the population have left their homes. We must never forget this Second and this I believe I'm or I'm afraid is a very important point the grievances and actions that led to this conflict have perhaps only been exacerbated by it and The course of the conflict has only deepened the sense of each that they face existential issues and It has deepened the depth of their mistrust of each others Today the Syrian parties seem deeply entrenched in Entirely different narratives of the origins and the cause of the conflict and the root to solving it and third Syria and you know this of course is a profoundly regionalized and nationalized conflict The effects of the conflict have been felt across the region and the world and today Five armies Russia Iran Turkey the United States and Israel intervene in the theater Syria is broken into at least three areas of the factor control One by the government With Russian and Iranian backing something is somewhere between 60 to 70 percent of the territories The second area where Turkey and on the position groups prevail and of course you also have a spread around alongside this international terrorist groups Daesh and Al-Nusrah and the third song where US umbrella and the SDF the Kurdish element prevail On top of this the economy has collapsed You know, it has been what I call a perfect storm of factors the impact of a decade of conflict The global economic conditions due to the pandemic the spillover from the Lebanese financial crisis Internal factors such as war economies corruption mismanagement and external factors and measures has produced a slow tsunami that is crashing across Syria According to Ocha More than eight of the 10 people are living in poverty While the word food program estimates that 9.3 million people inside the country are food insecure With rising inflation and bread and fuel shortages We can expect to see your government and other the factor authorities to be Increasingly unable to provide basic services and subsidies for basic goods As you all know Syria is on the Western sanctions tied by Western players to multiple issues arising from the conflict and demands on the Syrian government Amidst this complex and grim reality and after 10 years of war there is really no easy path To a true end to this conflict Let alone today when the Syrian people could determine their own future For Syrians today the struggle to survive close of many other issues and yet the yearning for the of the people of this what I call the ancient and proud state of Syria to get beyond this conflict and to a better place Is deep and strong? So for me as the UN envoy it's always not enough to curse the darkness We must also be able to see the Light and to at least light a candle that can charge a path for the Syrian parties the region and the world to end this suffering and this conflict and find a solution and Here let me move on then to what is my foot palm and This is obvious that it has to be said that there is no military solution to this conflict This has of course been through throughout the conflict, but I think it is no truer than ever The last year or so the conflict has shown this and you Since March or last year as you will recall in March last year. We had heavy fighting in the northwest of Syria in the Idlib province It ended with the sensational hostilities between Turkey and Russia and since that the front lines in Syria have not shifted and I think we have no come to a situation where we can say that no one actor and No existing group of actors Can restore serious sovereignty just as no one actor and no Existing group of actors can determine Syria's political future It is only and this is one of my key points of course is only via a negotiation that this could be done And that brings me to my fifth pump There is a framework for a political settlement of Syria And that is of course security council resolution 2254 It was passed unanimously in the December 2050 And it contains all the elements needed for a political settlement settlement of the conflict Like all resolutions it reflects the time in which it was written and there have been profound changes on the ground and internationally since then Yet it stands to test of time by providing what I call a balanced and comprehensive set of issues that need to be addressed to resolve the conflict This framework however, cannot be implemented by a dictator And when it exists on paper, it of course doesn't really exist truly on the ground And to change that this is the key issue That would require I believe all Syrian and international parties to work with me to carry it forward Step by step by mutual and reciprocal measures There is in my opinion No other way I have sought in the first two years of my mandate to facilitate Building blocks that could begin to turn the resolution 2254 from a roadmap to a concrete path And this has as you can understand not been easy I'm currently taking stock of the state of implementation of the resolution Consulting widely But as of now I'm ready to share a few things with you and this brings me to my sixth point The calm of the past 10 to 11 months is indeed what I would call a fragile car This past month again was a testament to this We have seen an abrupt and a significant significant escalation around iron is in the north east Syria We have seen an intensification of a strikes attributed to Israel We have seen continuous Isle attacks in the east and the central area And we have seen mutual shelling and a strikes in and around idlib And this is important turbulence in the southwest It is also what I would call a relative calm with that I mean civilians continue to be killed in ongoing crossfire and idea attacks As late as earlier in this week in modern Syria And of course syrians also continue to face a range of other dangers from instability arbitrary detention and abduction To criminality and activities of UN listed terrorist groups So the solution 2254 calls for a nationwide ceasefire in Syria Remains both a humanitarian and political imperative It would also enable an all loved effort to counter cover in 19 across front lines in Syria But relative calm on the ground And even the reduction of violence alone Cannot address the root causes of the Syrian conflict And this brings me to my seventh point There is a need for other steps on the ground between the parties That could address urgent humanitarian concerns And also build some trust and confidence First and foremost full and unhindered humanitarian access And an issue I have dealt with from day number one Progress of the tenees abductees and the missing And at the very least information on the missing and access And the release of women children and the sick of the elderly There have been some release taking place in negotiated exchanges But these are not all the scale and character that would contribute to building confidence and trust And that would be important For instance for refugee return and for future elections and administered under UN supervision With all Syrian including the diaspora The digital throughout That indeed is the end point of resolution 2254 So what I have called a virtuous cycle of steps on these issues Would help also to move towards a safe calm and neutral environment in Syria And would be a cornerstone to Uh what I call a step for steps approach of various actors However, and this is my eighth point. There is therefore A need for syrians to reach some political accommodation Including by putting in place a new constitution The constitution could be a vehicle for addressing many concerns among the syrians and it could if Approach properly build trust and confidence and open doors to other issues At present the syrian constitutional committee is the only forum where the syrian political parties the government and the opposition Are discussing the future of the country This body established by agreement of the parties and in which sits as I said Members nominated by the government and the opposition that also of civil society Can be an important piece of the larger puzzle if we can get it to work It has met five times here in Geneva There have been interesting discussions But as I said last week after the fifth session It is not at present working as it should It needs to be a forum that builds trust Not the opposite For that it does need a serious work plan and genuine interaction on concrete substantive proposals And it needs after 15 months of work to work to make progress And as I said after the last meeting We can't continue the way it has worked so far But this brings me to the obvious nine point The united nations cannot on its own bring about a solution to this conflict Nor are the solutions only in the hands of the syrians What is needed is what I call a constructive international diplomacy on syria Much more can be done to maintain international peace and security while also looking at practical And concrete ways to safeguard and restore serious sovereignty independence unity and territorial integrity And promote the implementation of resolution 2254 There is a need for key players to come to the table together Not just in their current groupings For a series of all encompassing the discussions To address the various components What I call a serious cooperative and constructive international diplomacy This really should be possible The council still remains committed to security council resolution 2254 And despite their well-known differences Key states in my opinion have shared interest in seeing syria Out of a state of conflict crisis and cause Including on issues like stability Containing terrorism The safe dignified and voluntarily returned of refugees And preventing further conflict And let me also emphasize that I do believe that the differences between the international players are not strategic at their core This comprehensive approach Inclusive of all issues and all actors Moving in mutual and reciprocal steps on all the issues outlined in resolution 2254 Could unlock genuine progress and could chart a safe and secure path Both of the crisis for all syrians By creating this dynamic Of reciprocal measures We could slowly see the establishment of a safe calm and neutral environment Allowing any constitutional reform to be matched by positive conditions on the ground Such steps would also contribute to refugees returning in a voluntary and safe and dignified manner There are also other issues where there remain ample room for constructive diplomacy Such as sanctions and working towards syria's economic recovery and prosperity I continue and I will continue to engage widely on this front And I do believe that it is extremely important That we make sure that we have a concerted Sustained and robust diplomatic dialogue among key players And indeed this is a prerequisite for this approach Of course particularly between united states and russia But also the states of the astana format the small group and of course the un security council I'm of course aware and not blind to the many Chances facing the international community But my strong message to all is that addressing the crisis in syria Is indeed a core interest and the responsibility of all Before I close let me return As my tenth and final point to the syrians I deal of course daily with the syrian parties who are fighting But they are not the only ones we engage and not the only ones at the table I refer here to the many voices of syrians from all walks of life Women and men who continue to inform all aspects of overwork On implementing security also resolution 2254 And this is largely thanks to a consultative mechanism Which my office set up in 2016 Indeed the women's advisory board the web and the civil society support room The women's advisory board comprises 17 women from civil society of Myriad points of view and political persuasions Over half its members are based inside syria And continue to amplify the rich diversity of women's voices living inside syria While bringing at the same time an important gender lens to these discussions They also provide important insights on the range of other critical issues Related to the political process Meanwhile the civil society support room Has brought the inputs of approximately 1000 syrian society civil society actors Of the last four years And i'm pleased to say 40 percent of them are women And the regular and sustained engagement with the broad range of syrian civil society has remained a key strategic priority for us Especially giving civil societies role in building riches And establishing trust across a very divided syrian society The profound tragedy of syria is all the more painful Given the common feeling all syrians have about their unique and special country I believe it is possible Slowly steadily surely to chart towards syria towards a vision Of the common future that could be shared by all However, it will need a genuine and constructive international diplomacy As i emphasize today to support a syrian syrian process Thank you so much and back to you david Thank you very much gar for a very powerful And uh eloquent presentation on the challenges syria faces and which are central to your own role I mean you you've Struck many themes there which Resonates for irish people And i mean first and foremost the the scale of the suffering You you've brought it out very very clearly the dire humanitarian situation and full and unhindered access For humanitarian workers is Absolutely critical and i know that's one of the things that you have been prioritizing And then the fact that there is a clear political framework in resolution 2254 the the the the Elements for a settlement are there, but There is the lack of political will in some quarters to actually Engage on that You made lots of points which I would like to come back on but i'll open the floor now But let me pick out one I thought that it what you've done in relation to involving women in the search for progress in syria is It's a particularly important message I remember from our own time a few years ago at the un that in earlier efforts to Launch political dialogue On the future of syria the voice of women was not quite silent, but it was certainly Barely heard and there were criticism indeed of the un at the time for not having done more To advance that but you you you are heading in the right direction And I think that the platform you've set up is a very very important initiative All right, thank you very much for laying out all those issues and indeed the challenges to the International community. Let me go now to questions which have been coming in from Many in our audience And I will Pick them in no particular order Here's one from retired bigotier general of the irish army jaira herne Who makes the point that No lasting peace and reconciliation can take place in syria without The alawaita asad elite embracing it At the beginning of the conflict the west in particular sought to Remove the alawaita asad elite is this former positioning now An impediment to the un's quest for political and humanitarian progress the fact that the west as it were made that pronounced effort to remove the What the questioner describes as the Asad elite Can I try that one on you? I thought you would start with more of a softball question, but anyway Back with a few With with friends like these and and so on You know, um, I I think what we have seen The last few years is that The focus is no not so much You know in international diplomacy About asad It's about, you know, how can syria change So when I You know, when I meet with western interlocutors or arab interlocutors You know, the question has become, you know, how can we make sure that we see changes in in syria And so they would say that it's not it's no no no longer about regime change But it's it's about what they see as a change of behavior in in in syria I think this is has been an important development because I You know, obviously, uh What was mentioned that we we need, you know, a true reconciliation in syria Uh, this this is a momentous task and would require, you know For the syrians Read it to be able to sit down and to address Um, what has happened during the last 10 years in in in an honest manner that would be extremely extremely difficult Let's let's be honest about this and You know when this is uh in my discussions with my syrian friends One of the more sensitive topics And there are very strong disagreements on how to move forward on this on this from But I think, uh, you know to be able even to come to this stage We need to start addressing the other issues that I have mentioned in my introduction. Thank you Uh, thank you very much car. So I have a question here from Elner Bernhill who is a journalist with or te the irish television service and Elner asks how difficult will it be for ireland and no way to ensure the humanitarian corridor? From turkey into syria is maintained and how will The Basically, how are the opposition from permit from p5 members like russia, uh bb overcome They would prefer of course the age to go through Damascus Um, as you you know, we have had uh until last summer we had um, I believe three crossings that was Made possible by uh, human security council resolutions opening up for what we call cross border operations and cross line operations Um, the the russian position has been that it should now be possible to move all the humanitarian assistance as you rightly said through Uh, through Damascus in other words emphasis on cross line operations We the un has said that no we still believe that cross border operations are indeed necessary And in particular, you know, uh, the situation as it now has become in idlib with with hundreds of thousands of idps With economic hardships with the pandemic All of these issues we believe The time has not come To to change this so we are hopeful that you know With island and law way holding the pen on this that it will be possible to move this This process forward I believe it will come up for a well most probably is it in july or or june? I I believe it's uh, july So there is still a little bit of time to work on this and but in the meantime Because the key issue is to utilize all the opportunities they have across line And to use effectively the one cross border operation that we still that we still have. Thank you Thank you garner. Um the question here from nyle oakifus with trochera one of the leading irish development and humanitarian organizations nyle points out that progress on the missing and detained persons Is a huge concern for refugees and and many syrians Tied to this will be accountability for human rights violations Could you comment on the prospects for holding the perpetrators of human rights violations to account? um, you know, I Been as you know, the 22 54 security council Resolution 2254 is also addressing the issue of Abductees missing and detained and it has been the priority for for my work from day number one And I have emphasized, you know, in all my discussions in Damascus, uh, you know, obviously with the opposition and with uh, you know with with uh, with turkey with iran and with uh, with russia The importance of this fight We are now currently together with the icrc working with with russia Turkey and iran and trying to see if we could facilitate more releases so far This has been more of what I would call, uh, you know prisoner exchanges what we need is is a broader exchange That as I said could start with uh with the eddily women and and children and of course the sick And then we need more information on the detainees and we more need more information on missing persons All of this, I think, you know, this is of course as I alluded to in my introduction is a humanitarian issue uh, or You know extreme importance for too many syrian families Uh, but it is also an issue if it is handled correctly that could slowly start to build confidence And then of course as I said, uh, you know in answer to my first question Then there are many issues That would have to be addressed Uh, obviously later on Okay, thank you very much. Um, the question from uh, now or outside who is, uh, Assyrian lawyer living in ireland Do you think that, um Agreement could be reached on a new syrian constitution before the presidential election this year? I mean it would be interesting to hear your sense also of how the most recent meeting of the constitutional committee went and whether there's anything Which would encourage us from that? um Thank you. Um I the the last meeting of the constitutional committee the small body Uh, was not a good one And we uh, it it was to me a disappointment And I I said after the meeting that we need to change the way the committee is working And um, I am currently working on some ideas that I will exchange With the culture nominated by the syrian government And the culture dominated nominated by the s and c And I will also discuss obviously also with Uh, with with international community ideas on how to move this process forward If there is a political will it should be possible to make progress But then I need to see That this will actually exist Uh, I think, you know, we we don't know yet when the presidential election will be But I think it's uh, you know, it's fair to say that if things do not change We will definitely not be able to reach an agreement on this before the presidential election Yeah um, thanks car a question from, uh to the queen who is uh, uh with the The institute with the ia, uh, so to us um What policy approach to syria? Do you see the new u.s? administration taking? and Secondly to what extent has the pandemic distracted attention from the ongoing Uh efforts to reach a political settlement in syria To quite distinct. Thank you. I think we you know, we're all obviously waiting for You know the new administration to formulate its policy on syria Uh, but if we are to judge from what we know that key persons within the administration has said before they took office I don't think we should expect big changes in their policy That is both when it is related to to sanctions when it is related to Question of reconstruction and aid and of course the presence in the northeast my assumption And I think this is shared with most of my interlocutors is that we will see more of a continuity But of course as always personality matters and it will be interesting to see, you know, who will then Be following up this file on a day-to-day basis. So in motion Yes, I do depend believe that the pandemic Has made it, uh, you know more more difficult, but but also, you know, it's obviously such um On top of so many other issues in syria Uh, and as I said, you know, I believe for the syrians. There are so many issues that know are You know, maybe are strongly concerns then for instance the work of the constitution committee You know, you have the hardship of the idp's the refugees And you the economic challenges the social challenges All over syria and then on top of it. You you have the pandemic So it's it's really as I said, it's sort of a perfect storm gathering and a salami sort of moving all over syria. I'm afraid Thanks gary. Um, a couple of questions from leoneo doubt who's with the irish syria solidarity movement. Um, I'll just Uh, give you the first one which really goes back to um The only makes the point that there has been total lack of progress as we know over the past decade in reaching a diplomatic solution. Um What other strategies for example stringent financial penalties? Would you recommend be be pursued against? Uh, president Assad and his international allies, uh, such as russia So what is the scope for international financial sanctions? Um, well, as you I'm sure the Um The one you the person you mentioned is well aware of there are very tough sanctions against syria And I'm sure he's also aware of that there are sanctions also against russia but You know, my my point is that You know, uh, all we need a different approach Uh, we know the elements we need to address And to be able to move forward, you know, we need the key international interlocutors to sit together at the table And to address all these issues And that uh, and if that is not happening The most frankly the most likely scenario in syria is that 10 years from now You will have a new you and envoy and I can promise you that That will not be me and the issues will be the same But perhaps even more more difficult because you will have then not sorted out the belt of refugees 3.6 million refugees living in turkey, you know, more than a million living in lebanon They're close to a million in in jordan And and 50 percent of the kids not having their education So this is you know These are very very serious issues And if we don't approach approach it in a new manner, they're actually the international community understand That when it comes to syria, there are a lot of common interests But it would need, you know, you sit down and you address all of these issues The you know Sanctions would have to be at the table You would have to have All the issues about how to create a safe and common neutral environment in the muskos The issue of detainees abductees and missing persons You know, the you know how to deal with UN listed terrorist groups You know, all of these issues need to be at the table. It will not be easy, but the process needs to start Yeah Are just coming back briefly to the issue of humanitarian access Leonio doubt the same questioner Makes the point that humanitarian aid Via demascus Doesn't reach those in the parts of syria controlled by the regime It basically um Sorry, I think the question just disappeared. No, she she she makes the point that Residents for example of the wukban camp have had no almost no aid deliveries for years Would there be Do you see a route including a cross border route which could bypass demascus and deliver aid to people such as those in rukban? um, you know rukban is um It's it's uh, you know, another terrible example of our How dire the situation all for for syrians I'm sure the The person who asked the question is aware of that quite a few thousand residents of rukban has already left the camp And as I'm sure she's also aware of this is an area that is controlled by by by the americans So it involves, you know, quite a few, you know, very difficult issues We have managed since I started to have a couple of deliveries into rukban But it is not a system that is in place and that is sustainable and here it also goes back to differences between russia and united states and On, you know, the the presence of the u.s in in the in in in the rukban area Yeah, and I can assure you that this is something we we're working on more or less on the daily basis I imagine and coming back to the accountability issue A question from michael o lachlan who is a He's a member of the institute. I just have to call it up michael Sorry michael macklachlan and he asks What what progress has there been on maintaining data and information? About war crimes and crimes against humanity for use as a future tribunal at the icc or elsewhere Um, you know, sorry Will this cover outside states? Who and themselves in the conflict? Sorry to answer like a bureaucrat on this question But this is really not my file. But as you know, there are other u and entities working on this and and there are You know serious work on this that i'm sure, you know with the question to the To the right people would be able to give you a good answer on these questions. That's fine. I know it's perfectly that's understandable and Well, here's a question from patrick demsey of the wfp in demascus To what extent do you see? Asad or the al-awaids Sharing power at all and and with whom and what would the country's political setup Look like in other words, would it be federalized or would it remain a centralized state? But with a coalition government That's an easy question. Yeah, it is and and and david the beauty of it is that I don't have to answer this is for the syrians to decide And of course the issue about you know a federal or whatever you call the system One of the issues that they are discussing within the constitutional committee So these are questions that the syrians themselves are discussing And indeed that the syrians themselves will have to decide in the end Yeah There um the the question from peter mcloon who is a board member of the of the institute Is the arab league still playing a role in in relation to a solution syrian conflict? you know I think we what we have seen in In syria is you know a great concern by arab states that they are I think they feel that they are not really at the table And that uh, you know syria is dominated by non-arab state actors Obviously turkey obviously wrong Obviously is right And as I mentioned already the united states and And and russia So I think there is a there is there is um There is um A great concern Not only within the arab league but also in t arab capitals That something should be done to to fix this And i'm in in close touch both with the arab league And with the arab state circles on this particular And a number of questions gyre just referred to In effect where we are With the constitutional committee, what are the prospects for getting tangible programs? I mean you've touched on this a little bit But what are the the kind of concrete steps that could be put in place? Um, you know confidence building steps Because I suppose the the scc is really the the the main game in town over the next few months to get to to to Stimulate some progress so a number of the questions Relate to what we can do towards implementing 2254 But starting from the scc No, listen I You know when When we started working on the constitutional committee, I think, uh, you know, we at the un I think the syrian parties I think key international interlocutors all understood That the constitutional committee could only be one element In moving in the process forward and I uh, you know, we we spend for ice I should you know It it it has been a long process Going back to 19 Sorry 2018 and then when I started This was sort of Was handed over to me by by Stefan de Mastura my by predecessor And we spent then until September So nine months working on this And it was a difficult pregnancy. I can tell you But we worked on two things we worked on getting, you know Of course, 50 names Nominated by the government That was the decision of the government Then the 50 names Nominated by the opposition the scc that was decided decided of course by the opposition But then we had these 50 members from civil society And here of course that was Trying to find a balance So that we could have, you know, genuine representatives From civil society and this turned out to be very difficult In the end, we succeeded But in parallel with this we worked on What they called the terms of reference for how the committee should be working And I you know, I had intensive discussions With the then chairman of the s and c Nasser Hariri And with foreign minister In with the with the foreign minister in in Damascus And late Malin And this of course were complicated discussions, but it moved forward And in the end we managed to form a compromise And this was actually the first time That the two parties had negotiated through us A paper that they agreed on and then became the basis of negotiations to sit down And the first meeting we had in Geneva in I hope I get The year and the month right it was in November 2019 Was it, you know, with all 150 members present here at the UN At at Palais here at the UN in Geneva Was a very good meeting, huh? With good opening statements from the two co-chairs that sort of Indicated that it was a way forward for the constitutional committee And we then had You know, we had established also what we call a small body With 15 from the government 15 from the opposition and 15 from civil society That would be the drafting body of the committee and they continued, you know, after the 150 had met With their first meeting And, you know, if we go through all the five meetings together, I think we find a lot of substance You know, we we have actually achieved quite a bit But but but what happened, I think in the last meeting was that the progress stalled It was, you know, we didn't see that we moved forward in the Methodology where we just not continued discussing What I said is that we need now to move forward in a manner so we can Identify areas where we agree where we disagree and that we could start moving towards a drafting process And we're lacking a methodology to do that Then of course, as I said, I believe there are areas where there may be commonalities And this is what we no need to see also in the future if we are going to make progress um As I mentioned in my introduction Uh, I am now with my with my team working on this and I will be actively engaging The two co-chairs and then based on that we will see what is possible But as I said, I need to see changes And I want this committee if it is to be successful We start to build trust And to make progress And I I need to be sure that this is actually happening to be able to move forward Well, the best of luck with with with with that initiative There's a question from Usaima Peregrina who's at the University of Granada and she thanks you for everything you're doing she Asks about the Syrian civil society support room cssor and I think her question is really Uh, what Have they produced her question is have they produced other tracks within the Geneva framework? I am not quite I suppose she means what kind of impact It has had Is there anything can you comment on the effectiveness or otherwise of the the Syrians civil society support room? Yeah, I you know, I think what is um Extremely important is of course that through The dialogue we had with the the 1000 members of the Syrian civil society This has I think it sort of Enables us to connect to the realities of Syria Yeah, here the real voices of the of the of the Syrian people And to to be informed by their concerns When we are moving forward hopefully in the political process But I I've been very clear, you know in my dialogue with uh, with my friends in the syrian civil society that This you know, they are not there to substitute the political process But they are there to help to inform us so that we can hopefully move the political process Forward in a manner that could meet the aspirations of the syrian people Because after all this is what we are we are tasked with Is to find a solution to this conflict that actually meets the aspiration of the syrian people And here the role of the syrians the civil society the women's advisory board has been and will continue to be extremely important Yes, yeah We're coming to the end towards the end of our session ghar There is some interest I suppose in the extent to which The crisis in lebanon is spilling over into syria. Could you say something about that? What impact is it having so far? It has has a major impact um on the syrian currency and the syrian economy and You know, so this sort of comes on top on all the other issues and have contributed to the fact that you know have Together with the older issues. I mentioned the fact that you have a 10 years of conflict, you know this really also had incredibly strong impact on on Syria and as you know, uh, the problems in lebanon is indeed continuing So I'm I'm afraid that there, you know, there is no immediate prospect that Things will change for the better when it comes to the issues related to the economy Final question ghar, you might not be able to say very much of this But how do you assess the posture of russia at the moment in relation to? Making political progress to you You know, you've emphasized the need for constructive international cooperation diplomatic cooperation Do you see russia playing a role there? Oh, yes. I mean I'm I'm having a very good cooperation with with musko You know, obviously You know, in my opinion, there there can be no solution to the syrian crisis without musko being on board but as I said It is no longer like this that one party, you know, being at musko tiram Ankara or washington or brussels or you know, the any arab state can dictate the outcome of the conflict They all need each others So yes, musko is important But also all the others that I mentioned would be important to bring this together and to be able to start anew to see based on You know, I think security consulate solution 2254 but building on that to move this process forward And as I said, this is possible But of course, if we require a new kind of investment and political will all the key interlocutors Yes, yes Well, that's a very fitting note on which to end the the events ghar. Thank you so much for making the time available and for being willing to answer these Questions all of which are are challenging We'd like to thank you very much for coming to the IIA It's great to see you again. It's great to hear in detail about the work you are doing In which there is enormous interest in Ireland, I have to say syria is always close to the top of our international interests and In particular now with the role that we will have on the security council so we wish you every success and and We will be supporting your efforts to bring about solutions on all these fronts, whether it's the humanitarian challenges, whether it's the the making tangible political progress an ending of the suffering of syrian people and finally realizing the Implementing the political framework, which has been there since 2254 was was Adopted so thank you for all of that the frankness of the exchanges and We don't envy you the role and I'm sure in 10 years time You won't be in it But in the meantime, I've no doubt that it will be in better hands That than yours. So ghar. Thank you very very much. Thank you so much. Really been a pleasure all the best, David Thank you