 I'm very excited about our first speaker here who is a writer, a former journalist, maybe still a journalist, he'll tell you all about it, but is a best-selling author. Has anybody here read the book Disrupted? Woo! Yes, just a hilarious book. Dan has been around our communities for a long, long time. He was a writer at Forbes, he Newsweek, he also became known as Fake Steve Jobs for a while. Many of you know him, he's got a great sense of humor, he's been a screenwriter for the television show Silicon Valley, in addition to this wonderful book he's written, please welcome Dan Lyons. Welcome. Thank you very much. Okay, hi guys. Good morning. Good morning. So my son and I are here together and we're skiers, so we're actually very excited about all the snow. Although I don't know if we're supposed to leave tomorrow. I wanted to say thank you first of all to Jim and to all of you for inviting me to come here. My son is with me, he's sitting right there in the front and that's him meeting Lienus yesterday. My son is 11, his name is Paul and he's an aspiring techie hacker. He's wearing his born to hack t-shirt today. So if anybody has a job opening or an internship or an 11 year old, he's very hard worker. No, and I think it's great that you make this family friendly and that he got a chance to come to this talk. He's never come with me to a conference before but this one I thought would be great and the highlight so far is that he got to meet Lienus yesterday after Lienus' talk and to hear that great talk that Lienus gave and that last bit that Lienus said about work being 99% perspiration, 1% inspiration. I kind of thought, like I'm getting a little heat for taking him out of school this week and he has a twin sister who is at school and part of the heat. Anyway, but I really feel like hearing that talk yesterday from Lienus was worth more than a week's missed school. Well, it was only four days but that was such an inspiring talk for a young person to hear that that's what life is about, that it's about working hard and just doing the work. So I was very, very grateful that he could be here for that. I'm also grateful because I really think this is a very special community, the open-source community. I didn't realize until I heard Lienus talk yesterday that it's 25 years old. It seems to have gone by so quickly to me as things happen when you become elderly. But it really is something special and the first time that ever clicked with me was about 10 years ago, canonical, the guys who make Ubuntu invited me to come talk at their, they had a conference every other year for all of their employees and this one year it was outside Barcelona and I got to go and give a talk and just hang out with them for two or three days. And at the time I was a reporter either at Forbes or Newsweek. I think I was at Newsweek then. Anyway, I was overwhelmed by the affection that these people have for each other, the genuine sense of community they had with each other. They were people who worked all over the world and often only knew each other by email but once every two years they would all meet and finally get to see each other in person. And so I had meals with them and hung out with them and I came back home kind of overwhelmed by the experience of what a fantastic culture this was at this company. And I think this community feels the same way to me that it's people working together on things with on shared goals and who aren't driven by this idea of getting rich quick or maybe getting rich ever. So last night here in the lobby just hanging around, we ran it to Jim, we ran it to Sam Ramji from who's now at Google and other people and they were all so nice and so engaging and Paul and I were having dinner at one of the receptions and Linus and his wife sat down and we sort of sat there talking about school and skiing and kids and it was just really, really the nicest people I've ever met and I think one of the great things about being a tech journalist for so long and working in and around the industry in various ways has been the people I've met. More than anything else, it's just I've met so many fantastic people and I'm sure you feel the same way. You make these lifelong friends. So that's my way of saying the next thing is I need to start also with an apology. I've been told that this is me as my first communion and I grew up Catholic and so I'm really good at confessing and apologizing and seeking forgiveness. For a long time I was a pariah of the industry and I think in some places I still am and these are all fake addresses you can't really reach me in any of those so I put them up there to look legit but I'm not. No, if you wanna send me hate mail you can. It's because in 2003 I was at Forbes and I covered this lawsuit, I was covering IBM and this little company called SCO, sued IBM. They had bought the rights to an old version of UNIX and then they were gonna try to leverage that and shake down IBM for some money and I wrote a very in-depth article looking at all the sort of cross-dealing that SCO was and how they had done the same playbook on Microsoft. There was just one bad thing that put me on the wrong foot with the open source community which is the headline in the story said what SCO wants, SCO gets and people took that to mean that I was rooting for SCO and I thought they would win. I actually did think they might win because they had done this to Microsoft but it wasn't quite the same as being on their side but I'm here to apologize even now for this 14-year-old headline that I didn't write. Someone else with some editor in New York put this headline on but anyway. Over the years my headlines about SCO got more and more negative like Bumbling Bully, the gang that couldn't sue straight, Dumb and Dumber, SCO gets TKO'd and then Snowed by SCO but it didn't matter and this is 2007. At this point I was already a pariah so I am here again as they say to apologize. Compounding that problem was that then when I did fake Steve I had to ask myself what would Steve Jobs think about open source and my feeling is that Steve Jobs would think it's great you wanna give me free stuff, thanks assholes I'll take it and then I'll charge you for it. That was basically how I thought Steve probably thought of his operating systems based on BSD I think and so he started with open source code and then the free software foundation decided to pick a fight with Apple and I thought this is a gift from the gods because I thought okay the Linux crazies are pretty crazy but the Apple crazies are even crazier and I'm ready fake Steve thinking okay you Linux guys wanna have a fight? Okay, wait till I unleash the Apple hordes on you. So we did this, then Richard Stallman I discovered Richard Stallman who was an endless trough well of comedy. Welcome to freedom your rule book is in the mail. This is him killing a shark that had violated the GPL so yeah, I'll tell you a true story cause I live in Boston I'm sorry. There were a lot more of those but I picked this one. I live in Boston and a couple years ago I went to this thing with my wife it was Bulgarian folk singing right because my wife is into this stuff and my wife was one of them in college and then so afterwards there was like a little after party and people were dancing and doing the weird Bulgarian folk dancing and there is Richard Stallman and he's dancing around with flowers on and he sees me across the room and our eyes meet and I thought oh my God he knows who I am right and I said to my wife we gotta get out of here like now and we did we took off I was like I'm not gonna have this guy come over and attack me right. I even once made fun of Linus more than once but a couple times I did make fun of Linus even though I have and I always have had a kind of man crush on Linus and I never got to meet him as a reporter he's very elusive he won't even like talk to you on email it's hard to even get an email from Linus this is by the way during his people magazine Sexiest Man Alive phase which I love when the fame got to his head he got a little crazy so but I don't wanna leave it up there for too long because you know bleach in the eyes but so but he I've always admired him but I could never mean it so finally here I finally got to meet this guy who's been like a hero of mine for 20 years in real life during my day job I actually have been a sort of big open source fan so I switched to Android very early when I was at Newsweek and then did a really big cover on Android and I realized at the time for every you know for year after year after year we would get these stories where people would say this is the year of Linux on the desktop this is gonna be the year of desktop Linux it's gonna happen right and then it would never happen right and then when I saw Android I thought this is it this is Linux on the desktop this is gonna be it this is the thing right that Andy Rubin had done what Steve Jobs had done in a way which is say okay forget the desktop let's look to the next generation ahead let's look to mobile devices and let's focus there this story by the way is worth looking up there was some really now in retrospect really funny predictions like by 2014 Android some say could have 25% market share of course it was 80% right so Android turned out to be bigger even then than we I guess thought it was gonna be back in 2010 and it's also amazing to me just that in seven years how much that world has changed and how open source has become just basically the platform of everything now okay I wanna talk to you quickly about my this book and this adventure I went on and some things that I think have gone wrong in tech that are sort of in a way the opposite of the open source community and this book came out last year it's coming out on paperback in a couple months I left cards outside on that little table under a mirror if anybody wants to pick up a card and get in touch with me afterwards just grab a card and there's my contact info on it so in short the story is that I was a tech reporter and I was at Newsweek when basically it went under and in 2012 and I got laid off and I was 52 years old and I looked around and it wasn't just that my company was going out of business my business was going out of business and I always wanted to work at a tech company I always had this idea of working at a startup they always seemed to be having so much more fun than we were you know the journalist you know you'd go visit these guys and it looked like they're having a blast right because they're all growing the companies are making money they're hiring rather than laying off I had spent the last 10, 20 years in companies where you're always waiting for the next layoff so I went to work at a place called HubSpot which makes marketing software and it was like had every startup cliche they're in Boston so I didn't have to move they had every startup cliche you can imagine so we had the dogs in the office we had nap rooms, we had beanbag chairs which at age 52 you should not have conference rooms with beanbag chairs because you can get into the beanbag chair but you can't get back out there's no graceful way to get out of a beanbag chair you know so you'd see all these people kind of crawling around on all fours after a meeting which I thought was very undignified they had the average age was 26 literally half my age almost everybody was right out of college they had these like bros who would like they had a push-up club in the lobby at lunchtime like doing their bro thing like do you even lift and I'd say very quickly really there was like a blend it was like a mix of a frat house a Montessori kindergarten and a Scientology compound right it was like all three things in once right and thank you so equal parts of each they had a culture code they loved culture they wanted to talk about culture we're gonna make culture overt and explicit and we're gonna create a company that we love right and the culture code basically just defined how what does it mean to be HubSpotty how do you belong to the cult right like how do you fit in and they had a couple acronyms heart and warp warp was value over replacement player which is like comes from baseball pro baseball like why are we paying you more than what we could pay the average person to do your job which is a cruel metric and the other one in my case I thought they should have a negative warp because they were paying a pretty good salary and I did almost nothing right so and heart was you had to be humble effective adaptable remarkable and transparent right and at one point I had to have a review with my boss who was a guy not my in my four in the 40s say but two grown men and we had to sit in this little tiny room and he had to give me a heart score and I got a two and I kind of thought like how has it happened that two grown men are sitting in a room having a discussion about such obvious visible bullshit right like like this they you know like heart what's your heart score like and how and but it sounded all scientific here's your number we can we're a data-driven organization your heart is a two I'm like why should be a zero right I have no heart right they had training when you joined and they would talk about your superpower like what's your superpower and they would talk about this literally and I would burst out laughing I was a journalist right like I mean you know journalists really don't like this stuff so what's your superpower what is your superpower and we had around they had two weeks of training we had to learn how to use the product but it was really indoctrination right and they would tell these kids do you know how lucky you are to be here thousands of people wanted the job that you got but it's harder to get a job here than to get into Harvard right which is totally not true but anyway but and so they would feed them all this stuff and then they would be like okay what's your superpower and then we had to go around and tell something about ourselves that no one knew that made us special it made us a snowflake you know and I'm like I don't really you know have anything you know and like one guy was I playing a heavy metal band on weekends like oh cool you know I was like well I I'm the only one in this room who's had a colonoscopy right and they like they take a hose you kids you won't believe this but trust me this is coming for you right they take a hose but they do give you they give you pills you don't remember it you know but you know they did it right you know and they're just looking at me like dude what is wrong with you like nobody laughs right like nobody nobody laughs right that was my superpower I endured the colonoscopy right I'm the only one here who takes Lipitor I have high cholesterol so you know so and then the main way to succeed was just to be enthusiastic you didn't have to do anything you just had to be a team player like a total team player you had to be GSD get it done and this is a real chalkboard HubSpot equals cool like somebody at work just stopped on their way to get a coffee and just wrote HubSpot equals cool on a chalkboard like I don't know why right they had a slogan one plus one equals three right which you guys all did math you know that's not true right but I mean so one plus one equals three and then they would say things like I like that idea but I don't think it's one plus one equals three enough you know we're HubSpot we have to do something a little better I'm like what so and they had cheers for peers so constantly people would be cheering for each other because the way to get attention or to get to move up in the organization was to show that you gave praise to other people it took me a long time to figure this out so we would get these praise gasms I call them they were like emails with someone would say like oh my god I just want to say that Ashley last week totally crushed it when she was running the blog all by herself right but it would be to everyone right everyone in the whole department would get this email and then the protocol was to reply to all you had to reply to all saying oh god girl you go you know like woohoo ask you for president and like and if you didn't reply to all like you look like a curmudgeon right and then you so your email would fill up with like a hundred emails from people all saying the same shit to each other right and for a while I would ignore it then I thought like I'm looking like a grumpy old guy so I joined in would be like woohoo and I felt like 800 exclamation points you know and then someone figured out like dude you're being a dick stop that right so I'm like so I'm thinking like this place is nuts right this place is really crazy and then one day the founder there published an article in LinkedIn he had a new management breakthrough which is that he really wants to always be solving for the customer and so he would bring a teddy bear to all of his management meetings and they would have to talk to the teddy bear as if it were a customer that was the way to remind you to always solve for the customer right so I'm like okay this is officially nuts right like I spent I spent all these years writing about Apple from the outside envisioning it as this cult compound and now I'm living in a real cult compound right this even crazier than I ever imagined Apple even as a fiction writer right so I sat desk to desk with this guy who is like my boss who was like 12 and I was like and I was like dude hey dude that thing with the teddy bear that's crazy right and he's like what no and I'm like look I was like look no one else is around you can tell me like we know it's nuts right and he's like no it's you know it's kind of eccentric but I was like oh my god right so I like like no one will laugh at the teddy bear that was even worse to me than the teddy bear was the fact that no one would laugh at it right so I called I called a friend of mine who had left journalism and become a marketing guy but had done it successfully unlike me and I said to him I told him about the teddy bear I showed him the article I was like is this normal like man is this what it's like in the corporate world I didn't know you know and he's like no dude this is Jonestown like get out now like run now like you're you're sort of one step from having to be drink Kool-Aid like literally they're gonna go around you're gonna do the mass suicide the white robes the whole thing right so and this is what meanwhile everybody else look at this is a real picture and this is how they were every day it was like it was like being in La La Land it was like people like living in a musical this everybody was really really happy right and I was not and which makes you miserable it makes it's crazy making because you're like maybe something's wrong with me because they are all really really happy maybe the world has changed and now people bring teddy bears to work and that's cool and that's normal right but as time went on I realized I wasn't going the wrong way in fact it wasn't people weren't happy when they did studies and they did surveys they did relentless happiness surveys they had very high turnover and very low morale and that puzzled me too but then I realized there were two cultures there was a surface culture which is all that crap then there was a real culture right and the real culture was that they had this huge sales boiler room this telemarketing boiler room where they put me in for a while to punish me for asking for a new job and it was like really really loud and I had to listen to this guy named Noisy Pete all day long get on the phone and say the same script over and over hey Bob how's it going down in Orlando how's the weather down there yeah great hey what's your marketing plan for this year and they click hang up start again right smile and dial all day so these kids would get paid very little money stuck in a room given a really hard number to hit that they couldn't hit they would get burned out and then they'd get churned out and then the rest of the company was the same way only it was even less rational because you could get fired for no reason at all and they'd have a little group of people and one would be made the boss and she would just fire all the people who didn't like right because they had these untrained managers these under-trained managers nobody got any training at all so it was just like Lord of the Flies right you just take a bunch of kids and put them in a room and let them be crazy with each other right and one of my favorite stories was oh and when they fired you they called it graduation this is great this is a great thing and we get these cheery emails saying hey everybody just want you to know that Derek has graduated we can't wait to see where he's going with his next big superpower rock star adventure it's like dude you fired that guy right and you'd look over you'd be like wait a minute Derek's gone like and then you'd look in his desk is empty everything's like spinal tap drummers just poof they go up in a pile of snow right like people and it would happen all the time people get fired all the time was like living in Argentina in the 1970s just boom they just disappear right so um and then I realize they don't even think this is a problem they think this is great the high turnover thing was actually like they would say you know they would explain it by saying well you know we're we're we're rock stars and we can only play with other rock stars so you know if you weren't a rock star you got graduated right and this wasn't even unique to them it came from netflix is from the culture code but this came from netflix we're a team not a family right this idea that you know we uh we need to have a players in every position but it's telemarketing right it's customer support it's not you know anyway it's more like it's just a way to use a vendetta on people right the other thing I started looking around and realizing is they had this huge emphasis on culture fit which I think it's become this terrible euphemism this really bad euphemism which really means racism and and lack of diversity and it's a way of sort of turning a negative into a positive so look around there's no one over 30 like hardly except for me and one other guy who wanted to become my friend and we used to go for lunch together when they had to break up because people would see us paired up like the two old guys right we had to have a man break up so uh but there went and there were no people of color like no black people we went the first time we had a whole company meeting I looked at 700 people in a room and it's like all just white kids in their 20s and like not even a very diverse group of white people like clan rallies have a wider swath of the Caucasian population than we had we had like one kind of white person it looked like the kids you see on Cape Cod in the summer like Cape Cod just boxed up the whole population launched him into Cambridge and they all landed in one building right so I started realizing there were really serious problems about this like the industry in a way had gone wrong in ways I wasn't as I didn't understand Reid Hoffman at LinkedIn actually brags about this so don't think of your job as a career you're not coming here to work for a long time you're not going to do what Lienis Torval does and write an OS for 25 years now you're going to work here for a year and a half and then we're going to graduate you and you're going to go do something else right at Amazon this so I left to write this book and they hacked my computers and tried to find out what I was writing and then the FBI got involved there's a great great other story that's in the end of the book but Amazon you know you walk out of a conference room grown people are sitting there crying at their desks right and I start thinking like I've stumbled into a much bigger story than I realize and people start writing people will read my book and start writing me telling me these horror stories of things like what I experienced at HubSpot wasn't really all that unusual in fact it's becoming the norm right Jeffrey Faffer who's a professor at Stanford wrote an essay when my book came out why modern work culture makes people so miserable right say it's a return to the work arrangements of 140 years ago not some a new managerial innovation it's worth if you're in the gig economy God forbid you lose your job and now you have to become an Uber driver because they won't even pay you as an employee right they may force you to be a contractor and VCs won't invest in your company if it's a gig economy company if you want to make your employees actual employees right which kind of kills me because Uber has apparently ten billion dollars in cash sitting in the bank that VCs have given it but they won't pay their drivers as employees they won't give them benefits right when the driver sued Uber spent a hundred million dollars to settle the suit to make it go away which tells you how badly they don't want to make people employees right Amazon has people living in tents in Scotland because they can't afford to live near where they work and Jeff Bezos charges them ten bucks a day ten pounds a day to ride a bus Jeff Bezos is worth seventy billion dollars but he makes his employees pay ten pounds a day to ride a bus to work so instead they sleep in tents right so what's happened is we've created this class of people called the precarious right who either get in their job but then bounce every 18 months or never can't get a job at all right and anti-depressant usage is up 400% suicide rates highest in 30 years right so we're making work fun like on the surface it helps it was fun right we're giving giving people this right but it's making people miserable right was this this weird uh kind of conundrum right and I think the reason is we're taking away all these basic things save a retirement work-life balance a fair share of the equity when HubsWatt went public they had a big party a handful of people made hundreds of millions of dollars and we all went to a party and they gave each of us a little bottle of that fresh net sparkling wine you know the fake champagne and then they had a girl checking off a checklist so that you didn't take two like you couldn't sneak back in and get your second bottle of fake champagne anyway uh so then they asked myself why is Silicon Valley changed and I'm going to try to get through this quickly because I know I'm running out of time BC I think is the problem right from 1995 to 2015 the venture capital industry twice the number of funds twice the number of firms four times the number of active investors and four times as much capital under management if you go back prior to 95 I haven't been able to do this analysis yet I think it's way way more dramatic right but this is basically the beginning of the dot-com explosion right Netscape's IPO BC cumulative capital 66 billion to 627 billion in 2015 total VC investments 8 billion to 60 billion so you just have a huge amount of money rushing into this space right in search of a return and the motto of this new economy is grow fast lose money go public cash out right so you know all the focus is on customer acquisition revenue acquisition buying top line growth lose as much money as you want right I didn't analysis recently from my fortune column 60 tech IPO since 2011 that are still independent a lot of them have been gone public and got taken out or acquired right only 10 have ever made a profit right if you look at how much money Twitter alone has lost it's like two and a half billion dollars since it went public right crazy but meanwhile every one of these has created created you know centi millionaires and billionaires so these people are foicing these really risky money losing companies into the public markets skating away with their money and then leaving for leaving you know the day of reckoning will come right I think there's also something else is happening in the old days if you look back at the early days of HP when H&P were running HP they saw themselves as having four constituencies customers, community employees and investors and investors came last right they wanted to have happy customers they wanted to pay their taxes and be part of the community they wanted to take care of their employees and make sure their employees had a good life and could feed their kids and you know put their kids through school and save for retirement that's all gone away and now there's only one consistency that matters and that's investors and we've somehow taken it for granted in the last 20 years that this is the new normal that the people who matter most are the investors when really all the investors are doing the VCs I spoke at a VC conference this joke did not go over well you guys have the best job in the world you take money from one group of people you don't take your own money you take their money then you give it to these guys you work them like dogs by the time they succeed you own all of their company and you make all the money that sounds like a great racket but that has become the racket the other side effects of this are bro culture income inequality and worse so bro culture this was not HubSpot but it looked like HubSpot the CEO of HubSpot was like the world's oldest teenager he was 47 years old still loved to hang out with the kids and wear his like big funny hat on the single-demiro party but you have bros who invest in bros who hire other bros and they call it culture fit they have this frat house culture they have go for a beer as a basis of hiring like I like to hire someone that I want to have a beer with after work which is the stupidest reason to hire anyone ever right like thank you but they will actually say this and HubSpot when I got hired they said that I like to hire a girl I want to go I don't drink and I'm never going for a beer with you because you're an asshole but I still want to work here right but no but they that is like the reason they give to hire people right and your CEOs who have no experience and they have no adult supervision in the old days in the old days being like Google even Google had to hire Eric Schmidt or their VCs wouldn't put the money in right now the idea is no just let Evan Spiegel go at it with Snap right so you have this that and then you have bias along on every vector age, race, gender right HubSpot had like I said nobody my age no one of color and then there were a lot of women but they only got this high no women in any power you look at the management page I have a couple of funny slides that I didn't put in here if you look at go through a list of every management team in tech white guys, white guys, white guys and it looks like they were all made in the same white guy lab like they were all hatched from the same kind of egg they don't even look like different kinds of white guys right incoming equality this is I think another factor of skewing all the return to those investors and letting them skate away and not dispersing the money out throughout all the employees for example Uber the taxi market is say let's say it's a hundred billion dollar market globally it's a hundred billion dollars but it's spread among thousands and thousands or millions of little customer companies right and individuals Uber replaces that has a 60 billion dollar market cap and that's 60 billion dollars will be in the hands of maybe a hundred people right when they finally go public eight men control as much wealth as half of the world this number came out recently a few years ago it was a few hundred which was already pretty appalling right but now it's down to eight the other thing to notice I think since we're at an open source conference is that two of these guys are made their money in the old world of closed source software which was probably the greatest racket ever invented on on planet earth right but most of them are techies even Bloomberg if you count him right CEO to worker compensation ratio this is a really interesting chart because you see it go back in 65 was 20X and it crept up crept up through the 70s through the 80s and then look where it peaks 2000 the height of the dot com mania boom look who's making all the money the CEO is 376 and they think okay the crash comes everything will settle back down but it doesn't it comes back down to 300 now so it's basically it went way off the rails and then stayed there and then worse right to recap I think the fine financialization of the economy where the where the finance industry now is 20% of GDP leads to only investors matter leads to eight men control half as much money as half the world I mean controls much money as half the world leads to the precarious this angry mob of people who have nothing right which leads to this Brexit and you know he who shall not be named right but the precarious I think lashed out people lashed out people realize they're getting screwed and they lashed out at the at the ballot box who's the last bit of power people have is I may not have any money I may not have a pension I may not have health insurance but I got one thing that even Larry Ellison has is I have a vote I have as much of a vote as Larry saying I'm going to use it and I'm going to screw you with it right so if we keep going in this direction I think we end up here this is a guy who made a lot of money on Amazon one of the early investors who two years ago said the pitchforks are coming for us this is a story from the New Yorker recently doomsday prep for the super rich which I highly recommend you read Evan Osnos wrote this thing about how people like Peter Teal are now bugging out for New Zealand and making bolt holes right trying to escape from the mess they've created like instead of taking their billions of dollars and trying to fix the system we have by paying taxes Apple has 264 billion dollars in cash sitting outside the country and won't bring it back unless they get a special break why don't they want to pay taxes and they complain we don't have any STEM grads we'll pay your fucking taxes right you know so you know fix your schools so instead they're going to bolt hole out and they're going to live in New Zealand they're going to live in bunkers right seriously they're going to live in bunkers with their billions of dollars which to me is insane right which is another way of saying I came around to realize Richard Stallman was right right like after all those years I made fun of Richard Stallman I'm like oh my god I've turned into Stallman right I'm 56 years old now I've become Richard Stallman you're supposed to become more conservative as you get older I've become a crazy Bernie Sanders liberal right but like um but I think Stallman did see this Stallman saw what happens with Microsoft where does that lead to yeah Bill Gates becomes the richest guy on earth and you have this income inequality you have this disparity and you have this huge massive people who rise up and create problems for all of us right um we make this joke on Silicon Valley I don't want to live in a world where someone else makes the world a better place better than we do and we kind of make a joke about how techies all talk about making the world a better place my one last message to you is I actually think techies can make the world a better place but it's not by making Snapchat right I think it's by creating a company that hires 10 people right and pays them really really well and so that they can have a good life and a good career and have a family and have kids and save for retirement and if you make a company with 10 people and you make one with 10 people and I make one with three people because I won't do as well as you but you know and they have a hundred and ten you know we can basically make this world a better place we can make the world we want to live in right we can build the world we want to live in we can make the kind of companies we want to work for that's what I saw at Canonical ten years ago and I still think it's true today I'm sorry for rushing so fast but thank you and again I'm very very sorry for all my old Richard Stallman jokes because it turns out he was right thank you very much