 All right, cool. Well, welcome everyone here and anyone that's also going to be watching this as after when we record it This is call number four and we're going to be talking about how to find clients. This is going to be Part one of a two-part call this first call we're going to be talking more about Finding your very first clients and you know for anyone that is new starting off to freelancing and needs to get You know get past that first hump Finding their very first clients Now if you're new to the group It's open participation. I look at these groups are kind of like a wordpress meet-up group You know where you come in we learn about something and then it's just open participation We we could talk with it with each other Anyone is free to ask questions And not just to me, but to each other you guys can ask and answer questions to each other Can bring up other topics? You know just it's open and there are a few functions in zoom one of them is to raise your hand So right now the groups are small So we're just kind of just like you know Let letting it go right now But once starts getting big and we start getting more people involved It really helps with the raising the hand and also keeping the microphone on mute Unless if you are talking that way we don't pick up any other noises that goes into the recording There's also a chat function. So everyone is welcome to chat with each other and What to expect from this call? We're going to be talking about where to start looking for your very first clients and Also, what to do with your first clients when you get them and gaining experience to find more of your ideal clients So real quick. I want to give a breakdown on myself a little bit of a background I'm 100% self-taught. I've never worked for an agency and I've never worked inside this field before I started off as a front-end developer after one year front-end development I transition into web design and then I Transition into more of advanced web design where I got into UI UX and strategy and then after two years of freelancing I found it an agency or agency lightbox digital and we're a custom web design agency and We've been doing that for two years now And the biggest challenge now for all new freelancers is how to go from no experience to become an Experienced enough in your fear in your field where you can start working for quality clients And this is something that we all have to go through We all have to start from some place and it could seem overwhelming in the very beginning Because you know like where where do you start? How do you get those first clients and what do you do? And that's what we're going to talk about inside this call. So first off. Let's go ahead and start with the do's and don'ts Make sure that you are completely honest and open with your potential clients This is key right here in the very beginning last thing you want to do is ever Mislead your clients into thinking that you have experience or you could do anything It's best to tell them the truth, you know, tell them that I'm brand new I just started but I'm trying to gain experience and I'm trying to learn more and build my portfolio You tell the clients that and they're going to know exactly where you guys are at You know one thing you want to keep in mind is clients. They trust us with their businesses By setting honest expectations This will keep the peace between you and the client if you tell the client that You could do anything, you know, they they ask you for something you say, yeah, no problem You could do it But you really can't and you don't know what you can do or do yet You're setting yourself up for a lot of tension for the client and for a disaster possibly and Your priority with your very first clients is to get them to refer you to others We're going to go more into the referrals a little bit later, but just just Basically, this is kind of like the golden egg right here For if you're brand new and starting off to get those referrals from your very first clients Now the don'ts there's one big don't to not do and that is do not work for free It's tempting it is so tempting. I was tempted. I even did one project for free, you know It's very tempting be like I just want experience. I want to build my portfolio. I'll build you a website for free Don't do that and here's the reasons when you're working for free. It is hard to get clients to respect your time They'll keep asking for more because it's free and they're going to get all that they can't out of it We I did one free job in my very first projects that job took one year and it was working with the client That was actually a worldwide organization that should have paid a whole lot of money a stretch that job on for a year You need to gain all the experience you can with each project, you know This includes pricing learning the scope collecting payments from clients Every single one of your first jobs needs to be about getting that experience and one of the big Experiences you have to get is how do you gauge the size of the job? How do you gauge how much you charge for that project? And you really don't know until you start doing it So if you do all your first jobs for free, you're still going to have to learn those jobs that those those You need to learn that experience still later on so it's best to do it from the very beginning with the very first projects Another thing is getting paid for your work Even if it's not that much at first. It could be just a little bit. It still builds self-esteem Confidence and motivations it feels good to put that work in to learn something and Just you know that grind of being on YouTube of being in group calls like this You know practicing building your own websites, and then you actually get paid for it You know it does something from within and it feels good a boost that confidence and it gets you prepared for the next job Instead of doing free work for clients. You could do free work for yourself You know you there's other ways of building our portfolio as well You know you can find a website or a company that you really like You know you might be you might like Nike a lot you can make like you know a Different version of a Nike website, you know a concept version or just whatever you like You could also work on your own personal website one of the thing too. I did not list on here when you do work for free You're gonna end up getting paying jobs afterwards and that free job could keep Going on and on and on and then you land that paying job But now you got this free job that just won't stop and that'll get in the way of your paying job It'll cause stress it'll cause burnout and it could cause the other paying job that you got to potentially Lose out on the quality So where to begin you know where to start looking at and that is a start looking close to you You know look around you your first clients can already be found right in front of you and This goes for just about all brand new freelancers out there Everyone has you know close to a story like this of the first clients and one of the best places to start Is with your family and friends? So start asking yourself like who is around you that could use a website and now when I say family and friends I also want to throw in there just other Equanances people you might know like on a day-to-day basis You know you might be visiting a restaurant that you go to once a week where they know who you are And they know the food that you order You know this and you might have other businesses or other people like that that know you They might not necessarily be like a friend you hang out with but somebody that knows you and these are the people to start looking at It's to start talking to and start putting yourself out there and thinking who really needs this who could use it And it's a lot easier to talk to Somebody you know and to tell them that hey, I'm just learning. I'm just starting off and they're going to be so much More open to it The next place is going to be Facebook Facebook, I think is just a great place for a new freelancer to start off. There is a lot of potential on There for you to get your first clients and to get your first projects or even to get more ongoing work as well You know reaching out to your local Facebook groups searching the classified groups But where people buy and sell stuff around you the way I got my very first projects was I posted into all the classified Channels on Facebook. I posted on there on brand new I'm looking to get some experience build a portfolio and I'm willing to do a few websites for really cheap and I got a lot of people responding back on that and I ended up taking three projects out of that one And that was how I started off It also helps to do it in the groups that's close by you because you could actually go and meet the people, you know It's easier to get work remotely once you have some Some experience and a bit of your portfolio already in there because you got something to show people You know at first it's hard the biggest thing is to gain trust, you know, I mentioned earlier Businesses are trusting us, you know that they're trusting us with their business So by reaching out to people who are close to you in your local area, you got a chance to go out and actually meet them Hold on one second All right So by having them inside your area, you're able to set up those meetings and meet them Locally it worked out very well for me and just a like just to like give you Example of how it worked for me I was able to meet in person out of the three people that I got one of them is still my client to this day and We've been building and working on his website and actually got to the point where we helped his business with it and You know today. He's still our client. We're still doing work. He's still on our maintenance plan This is four years now and he's also paying our regular rates, you know The first ones was super cheap, you know, I didn't know how to price But now he's paying the regular rates because we're giving that value to him And we've also built that trust and another one of the people that and one of what another one of my very first clients Is actually now one of my closest friends Another thing you could do on Facebook Is letting your friends and family know what you are doing using your own Facebook page in your own feet Start posting about your journey as you're learning becoming a web designer and web developer Putting yourself out there, you know, if you keep posting this stuff and keep sharing about like I just learned this We're just doing this let people know who you are and what you're doing, you know Because people are gonna talk so-and-so is gonna talk someone's gonna say. Oh, yeah, we're thinking about website I'm like, oh, yeah, did you know your cousin could do this, you know Or did you know, you know, so-and-so could do this and all of a sudden you're out there You're putting, you know, you're just putting it out there and now everybody knows this is what you do And also, I mean Facebook, I think is the best place for a new developer or a new designer anyone's new freelancing But this could also work with Instagram with LinkedIn Yeah, I think just with those ones right there other other social media as well But definitely Facebook you're gonna get out in front of your friends and family More faster and you're gonna be more known for what you do All right, and then the another one that you could do is the networking events in the local meet-ups You know, there's that that app that meet-up app that website There's all kinds of things you could do to start going out and meeting people And this is for the events, but I think you don't have to network just an event You can network anywhere you go if you are new and you're just wanting to find work Just keep that in your mind whenever you're talking to people, you know I'm gonna go back to that that restaurant that you keep that you go to every week and they know your name Keep that in your mind when you're in there, you know, because you're networking when you're talking one-on-one with people Always keep that open So that was finding the first clients and I really honestly believe doing this putting yourself out there You could find those very first clients, you know that a lot of people a lot of people are willing They don't really need a website to like their business is going to hang on the You know, it's going to like hang on the balance if it's going to succeed or fail if they don't have that proper website You got a lot of people with small businesses that you know, they just need a little boutique website They just need that little bit to like show information and these are the kind of clients at first when you're new They're a lot easier to land because they are newer They're also looking to save money and you know if you present yourself in a way like hey I'm here to learn, you know Like I really want to just gain experience and I want to help you out by you know Giving you a website at a really great price at the same time You're gonna help me ox is gonna give me the opportunity to learn and grow my skills and build my portfolio It's like we're helping each other out. It's easy to get that people are really open to it But what's really important what is most important is what you do with those first clients And I think that's what's being overlooked a lot I see the questions in the group the biggest question is how to find more clients and You know, I really believe that this is the key right here. What are you doing with the clients that you've already had? Most freelance freelancers they build their businesses through referrals and word of mouth You know, we don't start off with marketing plans. We don't start off with huge budgets for advertisement You know, we don't start off already at the top as you know as an expert as someone with experience You know, I mean we have to be realistic if you're starting off You're not going to be able to help an e-commerce company, you know Boost up the conversion rate 3% You know, you're not going to in the very beginning it takes time It takes experience knowledge and skills to do that So we rely on the referrals and word of mouth in the very beginning and just about all freelancers That ever talked to I see that gets busy starts off this way and it comes down to how are you taking care of your clients? How well do you take care of your clients can determine how much more work you get? This is a quote that I love right here that I like to go with underneath all projects under promise Overdeliver and what this means is don't tell somebody you're going to do everything for them Keep it within the scope, you know, they want a five-page website It's like we're going to give you the five-page website, but then over deliver on that You know like like just clean it up like add on whatever you can to it to make it worth, you know, so much more I mean Realistically with elements where we could build a five-page website in a day, you know You or a couple days, but but why not spend, you know a week on it Why not spend 10 days on it to make it solid? Why not go ahead and add in one of the free SEO plug-in tools? Why not go ahead and register it with? You know submit the site map to Google so that way it's being crawled and it's being indexed on it Why not add analytics to it as well? You know you start adding these little things on you go back to the client like look it We built the site, but we wanted to give you, you know a good jumpstart on it So we also submitted you to Google. We hooked you up with analytics We did a little bit of your things for your SEO to get you a start inside the right direction We just want to make sure you know You're in the right direction and you got a better chance Of having a successful website and getting more business, you know You under promise over deliver make the client happy and really care for them So taking care of your clients I'm sorry. Let me turn that off Taking care of your clients. This is going above and beyond It's asking for referrals to ask for those referrals and those reviews And if you haven't set up Google my business in a Facebook page do it right away start collecting those reviews on your Google and Facebook And then look to maintain a long-term relationship with your clients Fact this one right here the maintain a long-term relationship with your clients I should have put top of the list. This is on the top of my list It has been since I started in fact I have a list of everything that we need to check off in a project and the top thing that I have on my list is Building a long-term relationship with my clients almost all of my clients that I have I've had for well over a year And the hard truth is you have to get better I mean, there's there's no way around it if you really want to build your business and get those more Quality clients and start to you know, like get paid more. You just have to get better I mean, we don't start off with a bunch of skills if you would have seen my first websites There are nothing like what they are right now And I have no doubt that in one two years from now I will be producing even better quality than what I'm doing today But when we're starting from the very beginning to the quality isn't there, you know And just have to face that and I have to want to get better. I Really think there's we could go in a couple different directions here You have to ask yourself. What kind of a designer or developer do you want to be? What kind of a freelancer do you want to be? I mean, we could go on Fiverr We could get a website for $300, you know that they're out there But I mean look what you get on Fiverr for $300 you get, you know, I'm just gonna be straightforward You get crappy work by somebody who doesn't give a shit about you, you know They don't care about your business Somebody can pay $300 to build a website is not going to put in the love and care and like really Want to help that client build their business. They're not going to research that company They're not going to really take time to get to know that client So do you want to be one of those developers or do you want to get better? Do you want to really care and help your clients out? This comes with experience and developing skills in your craft We are in the business of helping other businesses It takes hard work and dedication to improving your skills in order to get to the level where you can actually make a Difference in someone else's business with hard work and a genuine care in helping your clients solve their problems Achieve their goals and growing their businesses You will gain the experience and skills needed to provide actual value and the more value you can give the more Your business will grow the more you can do for other businesses The more money you're going to make the better clients you could find The first step though is finding your first clients. We have to start from the very beginning We have to get those first ones going and just look around you. They're there But the second step is going to be taking care of those clients and by truly caring and helping your clients To the best of your ability your business will grow and you will keep attracting more clients And this is how you move up there. This is how you get to become an experienced designer developer This is how you get to move up as an expert and go from no experience To having that high quality experience taking care of your clients developing skills and truly caring about helping others You'll get there with that So that's it for the slide right now. We're going to go ahead and open it up for q&a open discussion It's a small group right now So anyone feel free to just go ahead and jump in ask a question or if you have also if you have you know Your own experience with how you got your first client or something that I missed because there's a lot of different ways People, you know, there's a lot of different ways others got clients I'm not going to tell you ways that I didn't I can only speak from my own experience You know what I what I put inside this slide right here is things that worked for me and they worked very well I went from my first two years I had clients around the world and I was working with some pretty big clients You know, I I moved up really fast in this and I really believe the reason why I moved up fast Is because I took care of clients and I generally care from them from right here, you know, it wasn't about the money It was about really helping So with that let's go ahead and open it up All right, I'ma have my tea Great presentation, buddy. Always always good to hear from you I have a question for welcome actually he was posting in the facebook group last week about uh having some struggles finding some clients and I'm suggesting he changes pricing but I'm wondering how that's going for him personally if he can uh If he wants to go ahead and answer that feel free not to if you don't want to don't know Just wait, what are you saying? Oh, I was just saying uh, you posted last week And I'm just wondering how it's going for you now Any any updates any any more clients on your end of things? No, I didn't find any client My post was deleted because of they said no self promotion whenever I post in the group In elementary group they did in my post and I didn't find any client Okay, did you raise your prices though? Yes, I did Okay, I think I think that might But from you'll just have to wait to see I guess Yeah, maybe I raise my price. I raise my prices, but uh on fiverr. I no one is ordering. No one is giving me order I don't know why Hey arcum, uh, what else are you doing to find clients? Like what other places have you looked for them at? Only facebook and fiverr How many projects have you done already? Six Where are you located? I'm in pakistan Are there any local and I don't have access to local business. No, I don't have access to local business Okay, are you kind of like out outside of like the city? No, I'm in in the city, but People here don't know about any like websites and they don't want website. They don't want their business online. That's why Okay, I see Yeah So on facebook, where on facebook are you posting? I'm posting in different groups and Some people like admin deleted my posted because they said no self-promotion and like this and I don't know how to post and what I type What I write to get clients Have you had anybody contact you back? Like like got to have you got to like this I got four I got four clients from facebook And only I got one from fiverr You got four clients from facebook and one from fiverr Yeah All right, how long ago was this since you got your last client? One month ago And it was from fiverr. It was a member press the website that I made All right Well, check it out man. This is what I want to do. I've seen you posting inside the group I think that we have to dig a little bit deeper to find out why Nobody's responding to you Why you're not getting those clients Uh, I don't know the marketing techniques marketing strategies Well, that's I want to take a look at what you're what you're sending people and how you're doing it So what what what I want to propose to do, uh, I want to find out why you know So after this call, why don't you and I link up together? You know, well, what's what sort of a call between you and I was find out, you know, what's happening You know why why they're not going through because I really think they're they're out there But we just have to find out the problem That that would be very great All right Cool, you got it man. I'm going to send you a dm right after this call Thank you Does anybody else have anything maybe share your story of how you got your first client or how you're finding your clients right now Because even though we're talking about the first clients This kind of works, you know through the whole first year I would say first one or two years you could still be finding clients through these methods or other methods So if you guys have some different method of how you're finding your clients, you know, share make it help others Uh, can you hear me? Hey, what's up? How are you doing? I'm good. I just finished my like the first meeting with my first Non-before client like I have a client through my friends, but this was like first start client So this client like I was a coffee shop Regular customer and then I just realized they don't have a website And then they want to make a second branch of the their coffee shop in the town. So I offer them to Make a website because they also wanted targeting Not only I mean Chiang Mai for other people to know and they want to target into the restaurant or customer And like for that I said like you know facebook because so many like european or americans after the Facebook looking that event they don't many people don't use a facebook anymore So just make a website to have a more firm information deliver And they said okay, and then we had a first like official meeting of the to talk about the website And then they gave me like bunch of idea like what to do what they want to they want to sell the beans through the online like Put the paper things and then like it came then we talked about all the design stuff Everything was great. But when I talk about Start to talk about the price everything changed like they want to I said like like $800 for the whole day like installing WooCommerce Uh design custom design and then like a little bit of basic at CEO blah blah blah And then I said oh it's still cheap enough to afford and then they say like Oh because this is low season and like we just opened the second one We spent too much money for the second one to open and then and also they're my friends So I don't want to hurt their feeling too. So and then end up eventually they cut off many pages It's like to cut off many pages to reduce the price And then they the price eventually going to be around $300 with full page website without any like the Selling mechanism any like WooCommerce thing nothing just inform it informative website about their restaurant And then I just also Realize some of the local businesses. I think not it's not in America. I think it's more like Asia country They really rely on their business on facebook And then So the the reason why my friend doesn't want to spend money for the website He knows website is good, but he cannot see the value like because he's still until like He's still already like selling the his coffee beans online like with the Thai wire transport And then he I try to convince him if you put your WooCommerce you can deliver Those product overseas through using the PayPal the things but I think just like he's already doing so much thing on the facebook and then facebook is free So he can't see the point why I need to pay for the website and then I Couldn't convince him like in a short time. They're like Actually, you're right like you're actually working your business with facebook within the time Is really okay. So Yeah, like what do you opinion? How do you convince the people that who thinks like just working on facebook or instagram? Those things are enough and we don't need a website. What would you like to how would you convince them? Well, first I'm not really trying to convince anybody. They need a website not now. You know, like I've gone through the You know I've gone through the process of learning how to do a discovery with the client And the thing is that you got to do is you have to find their problem You know and in the in the meetings within the discovery meetings When you're asking just questions after questions trying to find out exactly what is their problem You know, like why do they need a website? You know, what what is the purpose for it? I mean, I've heard one problem right now on what you said that they want to Advertise to the western population Western customer So that that's one of their problems right there. And so that's what I capitalize on find out their problems Then look for the solutions to the problem You know, maybe it might not be a full-out e-commerce website. That is a possibility you know and you know by finding the their problems then you could go ahead and diagnose it and Prescribe them a solution I like the timing there too Minjoo has a Canadian in vietnam I Google restaurants to go to all the time. I don't use facebook as a westerner in vietnam. I don't use facebook To go to any restaurant. I always look at google reviews and then I go to the google website So, I mean that's some value right there if they want to cater to westerners I for me and my girlfriend personally don't use face what we use facebook, but we don't use facebook to look up restaurants near us Yeah, yeah, I'll type in a coffee near me and then I'll look up different reviews If I like the reviews, I'll then click on the website. Look at their menu. Yeah If their website isn't very Good or you know in my opinion or they don't have things laid out properly. I won't I won't go to it I'll just go to another one That's what I said to my friend Exactly that's what I exactly said to my friend like you have to focus if you want to have a western european Client don't focus on facebook focus on website and cheer advisor like that's an answer They still yeah, I couldn't convince them Another option too if you wanted to increase it from a 300 project back up to the 800 project Is you know something pierce just said you go on google and you're looking So there's other things to other factors in there like the google my business Optimizing their google to my business making sure they're the first ones found when someone puts in google maps You know coffee shop near me Same thing you could also do facebook advertising. There's other things too and local seo Hmm Yep, thank you for suggesting. Yeah, so that so I sell my first my real real first direct Project, so I cannot be and that's why I'm late this That's a win. I mean that's still I'm looking I don't think the very first couple projects should be about the money It should be about the experience You know because that's what you're getting out of it. You just had that experience of reaching out to somebody And just straight networking just like hey, I think a website will help your business and you did that And then you got to go sit in on a meeting and actually talk about money with the client These are like really big steps right here. So it's a huge win in my book I know some people I know some people inside the industry like they might be like why are you saying 300 is okay? You know, I like I think once you get down the road. We'll start talking about raising that price really soon, you know, but For the first ones, I think it's a good win Yeah, thank you Jeffrey. Like I really appreciate your advice yesterday too. And then I trying to convince them, but yeah, it's a $300 I just thought and then it was no, you know, like Like bad attention between friends because I'm still friend of them. So it was it was all good. I'm happy with that You know, this could be an ongoing thing as well You know, you keep this client like you said already started off as a good relationship Keep that good relationship. Let that good relationship build up And you know, then you can offer other things down the line, you know This this could turn into a lot more business for you right here. Yeah, I hope so. Thank you Awesome, man. All right anybody else I mean just to touch on what you said earlier you know a lot of my a lot of my future business is going to be Local back home when I go back to Canada. I already have three clients waiting for me You know to do some work for them two of them are one of them is a good friend The the other one's her boyfriend who's doing a clothing line So I mean those are two opportunities for me right there word of mouth is kind of How I'm trying to start out people know From who are on my facebook. They know that I'm you know, I've been learning this skill over the last year and a half and I built my own website for me and my girlfriend's travels around Asia here And I think that's going to help me a lot too is just showcasing You know a nice website that I built for myself and Like you said family and friends too. I mean that's going to help play a big part in uh You can get in clients plus after I've done these other these three websites and add to my portfolio Then I have a lot of I have something tangible to go up to local businesses and actually say hey This is what I can do for you. Look what I've done for other people Yeah, once you it's once you get that momentum going it really happens like it happens fast And it's crazy how it happens, you know, but it's just getting that momentum going Family and friends is a great place to start and just talking to anybody that you really know But it's those referrals those referrals really start to kick in in the very beginning You know, there's other things too. Uh next week. I was going to go more into it Like for me after my first year of freelancing Somehow I ended up with clients. I can seven different countries and I got a lot of clients right now in portugal I ended up getting in I keep getting clients from portugal And it all started with a project. I collaborated with On another designer. So we had a client. I was referred to the client for the development the client had another designer Uh, they were in portugal. They're you know, they were friends from somebody here in Chiang Mai and uh You know, like I I try went out of my way to really work well with that designer and to collaborate with her And then I built a relationship with her like not, you know, like a work in relationship And like just kept it really cool And then we started bouncing work back off of each other and she's brought me in some really good projects And she's brought me in some other designer friends that needed developers So, you know, just like looking at all those opportunities and really working well with people There's something about when you When you give somebody a really good experience, you know, you give somebody a really good experience And you know, they want to share that experience You know, you have to think like people talk about this stuff when they're at the dinner table You know, and how do they want to talk about you? They want to talk about that that stress and that headache and that bad experience that they have Because I guarantee you that when you talk when you're getting clients A lot of them have had bad experiences with developers already So that gives you an opportunity to stand apart From any of those bad experiences by giving them just, you know, an awesome experience And I have any question like any of any of you guys like Trying to go to conference to like the like startup conference or some kind of like the business conference to like Kind of is a old-fashioned way to the marketing, you know, like at giving the your card or like showing your If kind of networking Like it's not your business part of the conference But just any kind of conference go to To find a client any of those you guys have any experience because one of my friend That was first idea that he suggests me to You're mute. I think I'm sorry. So what was the question? like like Some people go to the conference Not related with the WordPress just like the any business kind of conference To find a client and like give the you know, like business card and then like I just introduce myself Like I'm making a website if you're you have a business So if you need a business if you need a business website, you can you know contact me kind of like that's old-fashioned marketing way But that's my friends actually like so just need to do like go to the at least like three different conference of like different kind of business topic any kind of like for the uh, especially like startups company Conferences and then find a client over there and then those clients usually have a money too And yeah, and then like I just wonder anybody has those try those method And how it worked if you have experience All right. Well, has anyone done that I want to give other people a chance that could share their experience with this in your best bet might be You know this elementary meetups all around the world too. I know there's one here right now today in vietnam Saigon, I'm I'm personally not there right now, but the prior engagements but I don't have any experience doing it, but I'm sure it's definitely a good way to Meet other people in the tech world, you know, definitely collaborate on on projects and stuff together and you know, different people have different skills. That's a good way to Match up skills with each other. I think I don't think you're necessarily gonna maybe find a client in those kind of meetups But you're definitely gonna find people to work with in the future I see Hey boy, do you have anything on this? Your experience with this. I know boy if boy is quiet back here. This guy crushes it. He's awesome This dude's an awesome designer right here from Bangkok Yeah I gotta put your credentials out there, man You got skills. I know you got a lot to offer Yeah, you mentioned about the meetup Or conference, right? Um from my experience, I usually go to sports playing badminton and I've found some of my clients there It's not related to WordPress or anything else or website, but there's a Maybe a business owner there and you can find that meet or you can serve there Maybe you have solutions that match their problems there so Don't nothing just always go to tech event or Meetup or WordPress meetup or just Yeah, that's my experience Any any social and meetup like can anyone gather those meetups that you are recommending? right Maybe it depends on your luck to Yeah, but but most of uh entrepreneurship Meetup That's good as well. Um and the web meetup in Bangkok. There's a lot of group in Bangkok and It depends on your local, but maybe if you you can speak in that meetup is a good chance that you can try It means like as a speaker, you know, like, um Like speak means that talking about your business Um I I don't like the way that it's like a heart sale for In in a community or meetup. I I just doing what I am good at or showing my willing for sharing my knowledge there and then people will come up to you Okay, yeah, thank you for sharing Cool. Yeah, I've been to a lot of those meetups in Bangkok. There's a lot over there. It's a great place to network Uh I've done okay I've done okay with the whole business card handing out and You know, it is a good way to build connections Uh, the one thing you want to keep in mind though when you do it is not to go in there selling You know, like you don't want to go in there desperate selling yourself It has to be like something genuine what I found works for me is is if I'm genuine And I just want to learn about someone else's business And you got to like approach it in that way like I just want to go meet people. That's it So if you approach it that way, I think you'll have a good chance of you know, finding new potential clients. Definitely It's a good way to find clients And in Chiang Mai, we have some meetups too. We got some entrepreneur ones Uh, there's meetups here. I haven't really been involved in them, but They're there Except for the wordpress meetup Chiang Mai wordpress meetup rocks that that's what's up right there We're going to be I'm going to be doing one in uh a couple weeks and it's going to be uh An elementary based meetup. So I'm excited for that I'm excited for that too All right Can I ask a question? Yeah for sure Um Can you share your experience about your first bad clients first bad one? That's a hard one Or maybe what you can learn from from them, you know, like I really believe that like okay, um I wouldn't say bad clients, you know, I would say things that went bad But I don't like to say anyone's bad. I mean, I have had one bad client But that's because you know That we had different morals and ethics, you know, that that was a rare case But I think, you know, unlike all the situations where The project went sideways. Um A lot of it was on me and not Not looking at the red flags, you know, the red flags are always there, you know, they're there And sometimes I just put my head down and ignore them just to get the job But my first one I don't I'm trying to think of it You know, let me go ahead and go to one of those first three uh jobs that I got All right, because out of the first three jobs that I got one of them I did for free And I didn't want to do for free and I was talked in I felt like to do it for free And then it was also it was for a non-profit It was for like an NGO that really did some awesome stuff man. These guys were awesome people Like they were out there rescuing women that were entrapped in select slavery So I really wanted to build their site and work with them But I was so so gung-ho to do it for I'll do it for free because I felt like I'm doing my part to help out But uh, you know, we're supposed to build a basic website It was all laid out and this project took one year Like one whole year and like no matter what happened They came back with more changes and it was just like we're dealing with the whole board Like a tired board of people so it wasn't just one person making changes But it was like a board and it just kept going and going and going and it was long because it started to cut into My paying jobs it started to cut into my good project. So that was getting You know, so what I got out of that that one right there was first one never do a job for free Second one was build the scope and be very specific about the scope And about what you're going to deliver and have something in place in case they want extra Which means they got to pay for the extra work Uh, the third one is if you're dealing with a larger organization that has a board Don't talk to all 20 people and start taking revisions from all 20 people You know have one person There be the one that is getting all the data and your Point of contact with that. You know that I talked to so instead of getting emails from 20 people I you know next time now when I get an organization like that I tell them well here let your point person talk with them You guys get your stuff together you figure out what you want then come back to me So that that was my lesson, but there's tons. There's tons of lessons like that I got stories for days, but uh Yeah Does anybody else have anything to add before we end this call like any other uh things that are working for them right now How or how did you guys get your recent clients? How about you boy? What other ways do you get clients right now? My first crying of our client turn kind Do you mute? No, I'm sorry. Yeah, uh, no, how are you getting clients right now? Because you're pretty busy like it seems like every time we talk you got like good projects going on Uh, what what are you doing for like your uh leads your marketing and how you're getting clients? Actually, um, I have my supporter that work in most of agency that I'm outsourcing them So that is my source of work and jobs for now Um, yeah, another one is another part is for bidding the project of pitching Yeah, that you all have to do Bidding like what do you mean? Um submit a proposal for a big organization Okay, how are you finding those organizations to are they finding you? Um google So you're looking for them you're actually going out looking for them Yes, I have to all right well I don't know. Hopefully next calls you could get more into that because you work on some pretty big projects and You know, I would be interested to learn You know more How you getting especially you're in thailand too and to show men that you know in thailand we could get big clients I I just have a question to boy So you talk about the agency And then like how agency work going like with you register or something like an agency and then they're going to give you the regular Jobs and then you don't need to hunt the jobs and clients. Is that how the agency work usually? um This is about the connection to the people is um, I can say that it's a contract or type of work, but It's just a personal relationship that I know the person who work in agency in different agency and and sure they cannot serve the Project on time or maybe it depends on their capacity Yeah Yeah, so I can serve there and give them a solution that's maybe work faster or Maybe a bit cheaper for them So like they usually get their job and they get Too much jobs and then like outsource to you in your right, right And for some time I can I can be like um How to say um Uh a fake staff for the agency Okay Yeah Yeah Yeah, I just wonder like how the agency work and then like the Like registering agency means that like having a regular like the work amount or just Like the same as like the freelancer, but just have more like middleman connection things Like you're I think your case is a bit different that I imagined. Yeah Hmm. It sounds like you're white labeling for agencies. Is that right? Sorry, it sounds like you're white labeling for agencies It's not kind of white label, but yeah. Yeah, sometimes it's kind of white label. Yeah Well in the next call we're going to be digging into this a bit more You know because this one this is going to be a two-part Call right here. This one was more for like just getting started Uh getting the feet off the floor, but the next call I want to dig more into it because uh, you know Now what do we do? How do we improve it? How do we find more qualified clients? How do we find more high paying work? How can we start to make more money and move up? So today's call was you know, like basically right from the bottom of no experience But now we're starting to get some of that experience and now that we got some experience underneath our belt How could we go ahead and get some more work? You know, what ways could we go ahead and market? What ways could we get in front of more qualified clients and to get those bigger projects? One of the ways is similar to like what boy just mentioned Which is uh, something I also do as well Which is reaching out to other agencies doing some white label work Behind that for some very large growing agencies. You know, it's a very good way to get more business going Uh, there's a lot of ways. So I want to dig into this more I think next week we want to just talk more about finding more clients finding more qualified clients And then we're going to start going even taking it up to the next steps afterwards because you know, we start off Making, you know, not that much, but I'm in this to build my business You know and the only way I'm going to build my business only way I'm going to retire is to really Uh get to where I want to go, you know, which is making more money for what I do You know and by adding more value in what that I when what I give clients So with that I think we're you know, I think we're pretty much good on this call right here Does anybody else have anything to add before we uh before we say goodbye? One thing that I just think about If you want to go to conference on meetup to find out the client I recommend you go to Find someone who work in the marketing department or business development That will be a source of your jobs or work that's coming to you. Yeah definitely Yeah, that's why I do parallel agencies parallel markets marketers Digital marketers SEO companies You know and in Thailand we got a lot of Bangkok is really big on a lot of opportunity there Cool. Well, I think that's it. Let's go ahead and wrap up this call I'm really glad thankful for everyone for being here participating Making this happen. I really hope that this call will help others We're gonna go ahead and post this call live into the group. It should be up there later on tonight So others could watch the replay also for um for the slide deck I'm right now preparing a way to go ahead and make sure that it's accessible for everyone inside the group So by this weekend, uh, I'll have a link that I could send to the group and you could download everything One of the things I want to do inside this group is I want to be able to give more resources As well for for anyone that's new starting off their business, you know So I have some things planned and we're going to have a place just for group members to come to and be able to get those resources And uh with that, uh arkham. I'm going to talk to you after this call man We're gonna, you know, we're going to see what we could do over there and anybody watching this call also, um You know, feel free to DM me anytime. Uh, I get back to everybody for sure and that's it. Thank you guys all for making this happen So thank you Thank you. Bye See you everyone. Thank you. Bye Bye