 Hello everybody, if it's Wednesday, it's Warhammer and that must mean it's time for another episode of Warhammer Weekly Joining me as always is my co-host Tyler. What's up, buddy? How you doing? I? showed up despite my hatred of this faction and the little And everything it represents Insert I'm here Well to balance out the two dinosaur potential haters We had to bring in two dinosaur lovers We had to go to get two two guests for this show first off He's back crazy horse Anthony Pocastro Anthony. How you doing, buddy? Good to have you back on the show Fantastic. Thanks for having me back again. Your costume is amazing. You you are Just ready to go also joining us back on the show couldn't be more thrilled to have him back Lots of reasons to congratulate him for things we were talking about before the show So let's enjoy him while we can still get some of his precious time Ridge, what's up, buddy? How you doing? Not bad. I don't have as good of an outfit as Anthony But I did bring a little bit of something Oh, no And I invited you to the show I didn't know you were gonna come up with the intro like that Yeah, good to be back boys Got oh go ahead go ahead cast cast if you're listening I'm team cast she she is 100% on target with every season war bat rep featuring your stupid faction. All right, we think we can move on very good We have a lot to get through tonight folks. So pack it up pack it in let me begin We're gonna talk about a whole lot of stuff because first off we've got some news and there was a lot of it over the weekend I'll take us through this Tyler There's a rumor engine. It's the most boring type of rumor engine because it's a cloak. It's definitely a cloak No question about that. It's a stitched together cloak probably of different skins and Yep, it'll be a lot of things can be like 50,000 things that could be OBR dark elder think of a lot of things 40k AOS anything in between the only thing it's not and what it should have been was a picture of a tiny ship That looks like a dinosaur So we would have known that they were launching Battletoad gothic, which was what they should have announced this last weekend complete fail To coincide with the launch of the Seraphon book. We should have gotten Battletoad gothic, but we didn't okay, so here we go Let's talk about Warhammer Fest over the weekend because there was a lot of big stuff First up this new tomb king guy a lot of people lost their minds over this. I don't know if Tristan's watching yet But obviously a new tomb king guy, so Let's just go around the horn. We're gonna just go around the horn Anthony. What do you think a new tomb king guy? You like this dude? Yeah, sure. He's fine. I Appreciate that's my vote is equal rich Yeah, as Warhammer wiki as it could get he's fine. Yeah, I'm not a huge tomb king fan. Sorry Tristan, but yep and Tyler Yeah, I dig him and especially cuz Tristan will love him and I love Tristan. That's completely fair Yeah, I was like, okay cool I mean, I am a huge tomb kings fan, but I was hoping for something a little more But here we are Bretonian Paladin who for some reason I downloaded the back of his picture the back of him I don't know why I did that. I thought I downloaded the front, but apparently I didn't But here's the back of the guy the front of him looks like the front of a knight This guy underwhelmed me. I Looked at him and I was like, okay That's okay Fine didn't blow me away Anthony. He looks like a unit champ not a hero is is my problem with him But I like it overall Sure Ridge Yeah, same Yeah, Tyler, I think we're all trying to keep it to saints Knowing the show, but yeah, nothing nothing in particular stands out with this guy I've never never keen on Bretonia happy for you Bretonia player weirdos who are out there Yeah, I mean the yes, I agree with Master Shaker said Bretonian knights don't dirty their eyes with peasants hencewise looking away from us Love it fantastic You know There was a lot of like not great news about Old World over the weekend like the Statement that the line will contain Forge World resin some plastic and metal Wow Okay, we're really just metal. We're just resuscitating the old molds then for a lot of the range got it Mmm-hmm that hurts and then no launch box for for Old World. That's that's that's also a surprising thing I would have thought after their horse heresy experience They would have absolutely made a launch box, but they confirmed there's no launch box That doesn't mean there's a starter box because those are two separate products in their mind And they may have been being cagey, but starter boxes are expensive launch boxes are cheaper Because they're meant to be lost leaders so Yes Ben said the Old World is a mix of some new plastic some new resin and a lot of old sculpts. So there you go Okay, let's keep going big news It's not the summer book is not as we previously thought the next season of war My guess is that just they just canned that whole idea. They were like whatever or maybe we'll do one for addition or something Mmm, and instead we're beginning our end times Who's excited about it and by that? I simply mean the run-up of narrative books Leading to the next edition and this is the correct time to start this sort of a thing a year out I'm sure they had intended to be done with all of the army books by now And just the schedule got pushed back like in in my mind They absolutely had planned to probably make cities the last one and launch that in summer and that's it They're done and then this comes out. Mm-hmm, right. Yeah But just the nature of the past three years Has made it happen. So book one harbingers We got that we got my favorite quote from the hosts. I love this. You're ready for this It will provide updated sculpts Our root models, sorry today updated models for more than a dozen factions. Okay, look when you're dealing with small numbers How many donuts did you eat more than three so for Like just give the number Yeah, we don't need to introduce these additional words folks like stop being cagey. Okay, so it's 13 got it You're gonna be made 13 models. Just say 13 Okay But anyways, we got our first four. We know there should be four books. They're coming out relatively quickly as we'll see in a moment Harbinger's book one and then of course that leads us to our death dealer for Zeta knockoff here Our homage I guess depending on how you want to frame it. So sure Um Fun that they'll person wrote lethuce on the sign because that doesn't exist anymore. So hilarious Let's go around the horn Anthony anything to say about this sweet nergal death dealer lord of whatever he's called this guy Harbinger decay. There we go. I mean, it's a really nice update to an old model. I think it looks cool Yeah, yeah, it's good I have a harbinger primed in zenith all then I never painted it and it's like I even liked the old model I played a bunch of nergal, but I just never got around one of those models. He just never got around to doing So it's like the new model is amazing. But yeah, I don't you got a you got a nergal army rich I do I got glocky. I got probably about 20 25 blight kings Six drones. Yeah He's ready to be locked and ready Tyler as the resident current nergal player Yeah, what do you think of this guy? You excited to slap chop this guy? I was the oh hundred percent this guy was the second greatest thing to come out of the weekend We all know what the first greatest thing was we'll get to it there. Yeah, this this model and perfection Love it and land. Please. Please for the love of everything Papa nergal give us But I can't believe I'm talking like this, right? Like I mean, it's like the exact opposite of what I used to Later, I'm sorry a little but I mean everybody everybody was throwing a little under the bus including you events You were the first one to throw her on the bus So I might as well just join the bag my bandwagon. I've thrown her under there so deeply. I'm now just kicking her Backing the bus up. Yes. Absolutely. Yeah, so but please give us a new war scroll because oh good lord Help that current we're scroll. Oh, I have to imagine that you get a new war scroll with all these sculpts. Yes Yeah We also got this fun guy from FEC who has a little oversized double bone scythe staff thing Okay, cool. My response is sure Anthony Yeah, I mean the model is fine. I don't know if you're gonna show that that these are all gonna be regent a renown boxes to Yes, what what scares me about this one is his all his ghouls are still the old sculpts of no new ghouls folks Unfortunately when FEC gets released, which makes me sad. Very sad We still stick with tiny little ghouls tiny little hunched over ghouls rich By you. Yeah, it's cool. I just can't wait for FEC to have more than you know four units Just yeah, it's being nice to be able to build lists that aren't all the same thing So when that comes out, then great. Yeah, that is the most exciting thing an actual new model for this this range expanding from seven units to eight look out Tyler Yeah, I dig it. I mean, yeah a lot to say about it, but I think it's pretty cool I don't really love the overall model But I do love the face like special shout out to never sculpted this face and just did a wonderfully expressive like incredibly Incredibly human face like that is very very very living and full marks on that that same to the thing Well, whatever the opposite of a human face is is this guy So fire slayers hero there he is He's got two fiery hammers. He's naked. Can we talk about the update in technology in fire slayer technology? They haven't figured out pants or shoes but but He did figure out like he watched like He watched like an 80s movie of some kind he watched the video for maniac Right. Yeah, and he's got those leg warmers on now. Those little like ankle it leg warmer thingies. Oh, yeah So so good for him We're getting there Yeah, he just looks like another fireslayer pass. It's every single one of them Yeah, and it's gonna be his name is gonna be a spell on the gate guy plus one attack guy like what's got that Which one of those guys has the banner which one yeah, yeah, who's the rally guy? Okay? Yeah Or maybe in the future the the the magic proof guy depending on where we talk about with this book and some other things going on But hey, who knows? Goblin wearing a squig bone. I'm not sure that much of an insight of a squig is bone It feels like more of that should be cartilage. I'm just saying If they they're that solid, I'm not sure what the the anatomy of this creature is but okay Yeah, he's fine there's not enough teeth Well, I think you like lost some of them, maybe they fell out of his head Stuff sure I agree with Manzac who said fireslayers never ceasing to disappoint. Yeah I do like the bat squigs he has around him, so that's fun. Yeah, it was a sweet So those are our first four harbingers all fun so, okay, and then that's anything Maybe we're gonna get to this have they sent anything Vince about I miss all this at an event over the weekend Have they sent anything about where they're gonna get like updated allegiance rules and these Dom ringer books like we did with broken realms? They didn't say updated allegiance abilities, but there's updated rules Like there'll be rules for the season and things to play with though It's my guess is you're probably talking about like mostly narrative stuff, which is fine That's where I would like this to be like it's okay for some stuff to not be like competitive people will get enough You'll get your GHB at the same time and then for everybody if you want to something different or it's not as you know For the non-event crowd you've got it's not like you can't use in match play stuff. It's just I mean non-event stuff, right? Also known as the GBH according to coach Coach every listen every time coach says I don't know if anybody else has noticed this I might be the only one says GHB. It's GBH the general book hands. I love it It just gets put smile on my face every time very nice So summer we've got serif on harbinger book one GHB. Okay, cool So there's our update autumn cities rocking in there along with book two and three of this Of our harbinger series and then book four in the winter so end of the year leading or potentially Like theoretically end of the year whatever and then an unknown book. What could read the red book? Yes, the army book. It's an unknown army book. What army could it be? Oh sure. Yeah Could it be the one army that hasn't received an army book update yet? Maybe No, it's lumineff It must be a little menace Bringing them back again Okay, so good stuff there We're just stopping that immediately. All right, and then Cities of Sigmar got another little preview. We got our heavy nights. I thought this guy was pretty cool So I grabbed this photo What do you think of these guys? Anthony, what do you think of these you you're a you're a cities fan. I am and I really like these I'm a little concerned from my aspect of my ability to paint and the amount of Bejangle-y things that are now coming on the cities models, but the new sculpts are really really nice I'm very much looking forward to what they do with this whole range and how it fleshes out You know Ridge. Yeah, same I really really like the sculpts the horses they everything's just nice and new But honestly, I couldn't be more similar like I'm a decent painter But a lot of the trim a lot of the stuff that is gonna take a little bit more to do I really really love cities from mechanic-wise and I really love bringing in units into other armies using allies and stuff So I'm just pumped to have a ton of like iron drakes and Phoenix garden and other things that hopefully I'll be able to use them as Certain, you know different stuff. So yeah, I can't wait for the city stuff to drop. Yeah, Tyler Yeah, they are a little busy, but I like you overall aesthetic that we've got rockin here And yeah, I think folks like Dave Griffin Pocastro. Have you heard from Dave? Is he excited? Yeah, very much so he He's he's over the moon for him. All right. Fantastic. Yeah, somebody pointed out that maybe the horse tubs are a little small and Proportionally in terms of these models, but whatever. I don't know. I just saw that. Yeah, yeah I saw that going around on Twitter Yeah, I don't I think the horses are fine It's just that the armor is making it look bigger because it's a flat armor not a not a like laying armor, right? shaped armor But yeah, I agree with everything you said I do think there's probably a bit too much detail here You know one of the things that bothered me They all have this extra crap behind their saddle like the back of their saddle has some thing Poking up like every one of them having some unique The jangly dangly bit behind their saddle I looked at and I was like no no no no Cutting every one of those right off that is gone a saddle I need a tiny little ridge that the guy's upper butt sits against right whatever like that's that's it But I thought like the it's funny because we talked like a week two weeks back That they're just rereleasing the old Bretonian nights for Old World and I like I talked about that sculpt and why it so shows It's age it lacks the cut ends it lacks the detail It lacks the the fidelity of a modern sculpt and then they give us these guys Like put the two of those pictures next to each other the old Bretonian nights They're rereleasing versus these dudes and I'm like Come on son. Come on What are we doing here? All right And absolutely Brian's cave Yeah, I can't stand those black rims though. That's that's a real problem with warmer Yeah, buddy, that's you're I'm expecting Browns from Goblin green all the way goblin green look what are we talking about we saved basically the best for last We all know this was the big reveal of the weekend. They could have Opened the ship by the way, I really appreciate I did these reveal shows they would like open They'd be like, all right, let's get into it. Here's some pictures. Here's some stuff blah blah blah blah They talked to it 15 minutes. They're done. They're out. They're like, thanks. Have a good one everybody buy Fantastic a plus job way to go guys That's not sarcasm that's being real stop screwing around with a bunch of other nonsense just give us the the goods This is it This is it Megapink Yeah, glorious Megaboss on the mega gorg run to What what else can we want here? I mean truly we've we have achieved all that I've ever dreamed of in life The fact it's big enough. It's got two brutes on the side just hanging out like sidecars They also mentioned that you're during the show that you can build this in different ways This will actually be multiple units. I don't know if they said two or three units, but there's a But there's a version without the hero on top like where this is just a monster Nice, no, it's there's still a guy on top. He just is holding both rings is not a hero. Yeah, so it's just a guy there Yeah, yes, there's still I should you're right. I should have said that your way There's not a hero on top. That's what I meant, which means there's a battle line version of this Which means four of these and I'm golden Castro getting excited Princess mononoke bore just so so awesome 100% Yes, Ben Stafford said yes, there's a monster chariot and hero variant. There you go. So yeah three versions Absolutely, yeah, like again a huge expansion of the range My blood toofs in this one kid the funny thing is, you know, we did surveys about like what models Do you want to see added to ranges and stuff while back and with iron jaws? Everybody just said a boss on your grunt and other than that. We're yeah Because none of us want to end up none of us iron jaws players want to end up like this No, yeah, right Where it's just like you've got to start retiring Swaths of sculpts and you're still trying to come out with new sculpts and the thing just ends up still with an insane list of nonsense You keep keep the list tight tight. Yeah, that's it I'm good. So far an insane list of nonsense. I'm glad we all agree Exactly And then lastly, I just wanted to bring this up because they also mentioned the Warcry roadmap, which I thought was pretty cool into 2023 2024 So obviously we got nightmare quest which they also showed which is the fleshier quartz versus stormcast Hey, look another new flesh eaters unit. You'll have you'll have these guys whatever that is So man, the range is just expanding a left right and center over here for fleshier quartz Yeah, seven to 16. Let's go And then you've got some new starter set for new players as it said and then you've got four new war bands Two new war in the order versus destruction. You got two new war bands in winter and two new war bands Complete question mark order versus death and winter and to be known in in spring So clearly lots of war bands still on the horizon for war cry war cry must be rocking and rolling for them I'm happy to see it Like that's great My perception was nobody really liked to the launch box for this last go round But you know, it just like it just wasn't the hit but then after that they came back with some strong boxes So like the the the monk vampires were just fantastic. So I mean this you get a new realm shaper engine. So Yeah, yeah, just in case you didn't have enough realm shaper engines now you get a bonus realm shaper in your in your in your nightmare quest box That's right. That's right Okay, and somehow we did it 21 minutes. We got through all of it. I'm very proud of us. All right, gentlemen Let's go to some pick of the week Anthony, what would you like to share with everybody? Emma and Dyson demons. She has been painting stuff in a ridiculously high contrast vibrant style for a while and she recently did some of the Raptor downs which came out really cool She did it two different ways a high contrast one and then I like semi slap choppy one So I thought they were pretty cool. It's fun different take on painting which I like love it Fantastic linked down below rich. What do you got for everybody? All right, I'm gonna do a very quick semi Tyler only only gonna be three The first one I'm gonna do is just miss cast. I think you've probably shut them up before Tyler Mm-hmm. They had a new episode that I just thought it's just interesting to listen to Owen Alex and Darren And they're their buddy Chris my ho on so it was it was good episode Yeah, they talk a lot about like new books and you know, I really loved that they you know They talk about like making your own opinion reading the books without like looking at what everyone else is saying What units are good which I love doing as well And I just couldn't like couldn't be more perfect for with the Sarah Chris Chris My Hill always finding way to get prime time in a list clearly an exceptionally smart aOS player Yeah, there you go. Yep, and then the second one I just wanted to say kind of fitting Kayla pasting. We're talking about Sarah fun I think I even did last year, but I don't know if there's many other like pure Sarah fun channels But he always talks about he's got one about the trog bomb bunch of different lists and things like that So that's kind of relevant and then just lastly wanted to shut up my boys party at the all points I know you guys have had him on but they just did a new episode Tom Egan's from a OS world was on and it was cool to listen to but more just I don't like listen to the first half Where they're just kind of bullshitting around and stuff Yeah, that's it Fantastic all links down below Tyler What do you want to share? Since rich took over my role. I'll keep it a one Actually, I'm very happy to announce that vault wars 2023 tickets are now on sale So we're going to have a link in the description This is your tournament is what you say my tournament our tournament Yeah Vince, I'm sure you're going to get there this year Hopefully there's no excuses. You've got a place to say October 21st 22nd okay, so Little ways away. You're being very non-committal Vince. That's fine. I love I have like no, it's fine. I have no excuse. It's okay. It's all right My yearly corporate conference for my company is I think that week after but I I'm not sure I just so it's gonna depend off the look I literally think you're right before it Yeah So anyhow, uh, one thing I want to mention that I'm excited about for this year We're gonna do the Highlander award So maybe we could do a show on Highlander list. I've talked a lot about this over the last year The Highlander award is going to be for the player who finishes Best overall with a list that has nine or more different war scrolls And no duplicate war scrolls So I I nerded out a while back nine was the number Or where it actually starts to impact your list building choices Like you're not able to get that optimal Now not all factions can do this but Almost all factions can do it. Most of them can do it. So it's an opt-in award I want to see people bring Highlander list the prize will be a replica of real life real size replica of the Highlander Sword, you know, the original Scottish long sword. We're gonna get one of those And yeah, I can't wait. I think corn will win my guess. Corn might. Yeah. That's a good good choice. Yeah I don't know man. It seems like you it's getting there with With the the best overall is really the hard part But then again, it's in october. So we could be out of the current season. That's true. I'm just saying You know, it looks like that sun's list is back on the table. Okay, and that's I don't I don't got a duplicate anything I just can't I can't get to nine Like can we can we make an exception if I bring giants? I took all my scrolls, but I can't have nine They don't let me have nine things That's that's that's a personal problem. Yeah No, I feel like it's gonna be corn. You're right Tom Tom, I had forgotten you won the inaugural vault wars. I appreciate that reminder in the comments. Thank you, buddy Yeah, I had forgot I had forgotten about that. Yeah iron jaws can do it now that we've got the new pig That's what it will be. We'll be if there's a new pig comes by then that's I'll be rocking the iron jaws list and ready to go Okay For myself, uh, two quick shout outs first things first, I'll say uh for my pick I've got a video from sam lens down there on he's painting dante, which is a 40k guy, but And then I know this isn't a 40k channel But he's talking a lot about doing it in true metallic metal and making metals look cool and interesting and fun And sam is a really good teacher and shows you how easy it is to make your metals look really rocking Even on a model that is literally all metal because dante is just all in gold Uh, and so it's just and it's his process is very simple and yet it looks rich and fantastic So check it out very simple sort of thing going on there. I loved it Uh, and then secondly what I'll say is hey Don't forget to uh like this video and subscribe and do all those other things I never say it earlier in the show, but now I'm remembering hit all those buttons Click all the things that make all the dings and it's really nice and we appreciate it. Uh, okay So let's uh, let's talk about some hobby time here Uh, we'll go straight into that anthony What have you been working on buddy? What's on your terrain terrain and more terrain we got approved We got approved for 16 more tables at nascon bringing us up to 128 players So I had to print 16 more tables worth of terrain which are almost done. I've got uh Think 10 or 12 done so far. I've got to do the rest and uh get them ready for august Where tyler should be but isn't going to be for some reason. I don't understand why This will be there tyler. It's a long story. It's a long story. I know I know keep keep it up I want to be disappointed if you stop giving me crap for this a cheer Never never shall I give you any more than what I can Very nice ridge. What about you? You've been working on that's just depressing because I'm not also going to be able to come to nash con Which just you saying that's like, oh, it's another there's one of my favorite favorite event We gotta let other people go Uh, man, I almost said it. I was gonna have a big ego moment for us, but I stopped myself. All right, we can move on Good job. Yeah, I've uh, I've been working on serif on stuff. Who who would have thought uh, yeah We got sent the new box So Jordan kept the source wars because I have like a hundred and I just don't want to rebuild although They're way nicer than new the old sculpts. I just already have so many so I'm building the 10 rapidons. I think they're awesome, which don't want to bury the lead and then The new slam eventually, but yeah right now my old slam is just kind of I pulled them out and put them into the Croak chair if I wasn't running both of them. So Nice, essentially get him done too. Nice Uh, yeah, all my source for my serif on army are the 90s source. I purposely I I never Updated I I purposely went and gathered all the old ones because the old ones were so much better Like the the middle sculpt plastics were they're too skinny. They were too like weedy and little But the 90s guys the ones that came in like the Bretonian box even though they're They're all samey. They're much thicker. They had they were they were more meaty like the the current sculpt Although the current ones are obviously like far superior. All right, Morgan would be happy Absolutely living that old hammer life Uh Tyler what you been working on? Well, I completed my painting commitment that I made for this terrain project and I If you count the summoning I do have 2000 points of an army that I have painted myself But my buddy as I mentioned last week helped me out with a few units But yeah Vince it feels amazing to play an army as I told you on the drive home It's guys that is glorious like I don't know it's why it took so long But it is a phenomenal feeling seeing your little toys that you painted on the table Absolutely. It's a it's a it is a point of personal pride among humans. We love creating things that is that that is a human condition And then to use the things that you've created in a virtuous way and a celebration with your friends Truly, is there anything better in life? I mean not much. This really is like the pinnacle And I don't say that with any sarcasm or or or irony. I really mean that like I don't Everybody else in the world is missing out who isn't a wargamer who doesn't understand It's like to create something and get to use it in such a fun hobby with you and your best friends Like what a great time like what an amazing thing we all get to do super relevant really quickly I so I did this it went to grain clash and I played scaven and I was doing more of like a hobby I really wanted to do all aspects of it I took tons of time Like actually getting thankful up to a really really good standard getting my rattlegers that type of stuff And it does feel like even on an event So I'm usually going there trying to just do you know really well and Whatever and it yeah, it feels so good when you have like a really really nice nice armor So I'm absolutely seeing those brown rims on the table, baby. It doesn't get any better than that. I'm gonna stop I'm gonna stop Pocastro. We're gonna have to talk man. I got my commitment done We're gonna have to talk terrain I know you're a busy guy and you've got you've got another you another person you love a little bit more But but I'm still here I told you all you have to do is paint a box of skinks and you can have all the terrain You want my friend all the time the key is open for a box of skinks. I'll send you All right, you have three sitting over there somewhere still Deal I'm all in For myself. I finished up this girl right here She's all done. Now. This is the morrigan from journeyman miniatures And I'm really happy with how this came out. It'll be she'll be featured in a couple upcoming videos And it may be the best thing I've ever painted. I'm not sure But it might be And It's definitely the best skin I've ever done. I'm quite sure about that And so that's going to be in a video and yeah, I just I'm finisher and I feel great and I can't wait to start on the next Thing like I'm I'm more jazzed now Uh in in painting than I have been a long time I'm excited when I eventually have like a gw thing. I want to paint again I'm sure that it'll pop up. I actually know what it is. It's that pig Get that thing in front of me right now Why am I not painting it this minute? Uh, but at any rate, uh, yeah So the problem is I like I just have so many armies. It's at this point There wasn't there's there's alexander wept for there were no more worlds to conquer or whatever, you know Um All right Uh, but good times Okay, gentlemen with that Let's get into it Uh, where are we at here? 33 or 32? There we go. Okay Serifon Cool beans Babow Serifon 2023 battle tome. Let's talk overview and I want to get all your opinions. We're gonna So everybody understands how we're going to do this. This is a lot of stuff And and we got through a lot of we've been being very responsible with our time so far We are going to push through this at a relative clip We're going to give the things that need time to discuss the appropriate time to discuss But on things that are less interesting. We'll kind of just Move on down past Our journey into higher power continues every week is an increasing curve and now we have reached the pinnacle With certainly the strongest of the last three books Uh I don't know if I Think this is bent. I don't ever have an opinion on that straight out of the gate or rarely I don't think it's like egregious. They've seen much more egregious books, but it's definitely strong It's definitely very strong The book has been reduced in complexity. Thank god And scrolls so some of the old scrolls are gone But some new scrolls were added so okay And there's still a lot going on here. This army is still very much an exercise in in synergy Like very very very much There is tyler, you'll be happy to see lots of potential for mixed arms and varied unit types making an appearance in a competitive force I don't think they're quite your highlander type level I think you will have repeating scrolls But I do think that there's there's the very realistic thing that you're going to be wanting to have You're going to have a variety of scrolls for performing a variety of roles to be successful in a competitive force We'll see if ridge checks me on that or not if he disagrees with me But I I don't I didn't read anything initially that jumped out of me That was like, yes, I'm definitely just going to spam this and that's the way to that's the path to power And There's some very powerful magic here, obviously a doi. It's a you know, it is a spelldom book Uh, but also plenty of good options for melee and shooting like you've got some good You got some good people who want to get a tussle Have a good fight have some good ranged power projection both through your spells and through shooting And this is certainly like they really built out the the The nature of sort of the sub faction choice in a way that they haven't before because you're sort of You have a super sub faction and a sub sub faction in your coalesced versus Starborn and that's that's been a thing since the last book. I'm not saying that it's just boy. Does it really like It's like Everything flows from that now it is the first choice you make and almost everything is derivative of that The units that are gonna you're gonna find higher or lower value in The leaders you may or may not be inclined to use the units that are gonna Deliver response on the table even the role some of those units fill Can shift a lot based on that initial choice okay Like that's basically two separate armies. I almost want to say Yeah, spells like different spells for each It's kind of nuts. I wasn't expecting that. Yeah Everything is different So, okay, did I miss anything in the in the overview there gentlemen ridge? I'm gonna start with you this time Anything you I missed or anything else you you've gotten your overview of book Uh, just like high level kind of thing. I think, um There are going to be some armies that are going to be able to counter this You know just there's there's a lot of strong armies in the game right now So thinking about seraphon when the last book came out. It was so strong It was like it was a completely different environment than the environment that it's good. It's released in now so Things like corn or things like lumineff, you know Like having these a massive amount of mortal wounds if techless can just reflect them, you know, or Corn just gets blood type for them. There's a lot of I think they're going to be a lot of counterplay to these types of like the magic kind of builds um Your heroes are all dead. That's just like Common theme you're going to see now in in starborn factions. Um It's not really getting rid of comment is huge on this lands war scroll. There's yeah, just so many like changes Uh, I think it's just great like internally though. Like you can kind of build what you want. It's good casually There's going to be some competitive builds Um, I haven't really done much to look too much into the agridon stuff, but I think there's something there I think they're going to be okay. Um, but yeah, it's uh It's like to say too, it's like when books come out like they just come out It's always right away everyone's like oh either. This is crazy strong or like you see so many people if this book's garbage It's just so shit. Like I can't believe anyone's dying anything with this And it's like I feel like this is one of those books like k.o When it first came out everyone was kind of like, uh, it's all right a lot less range not really great And then three months later, it's the most the best book in this Yeah, so I I'm hoping I've been yeah, still just reading so so much and playing some different synergies and different combos now but um Yeah, that's kind of just like an overgreed. I think of it. Okay. Good love it Anthony, what about you? Uh, they definitely made sorus a thing where in the last book you never needed a source in my opinion Uh, it's actually a real half of the book now I think they toned down shooting a bit, but it's still enough Um, and like ridger saying there's still plenty of counter to it I mean no married with a two up ignore your spells is going to be a real bad day When you try to just nuke things and do nothing Uh, and then they just start sitting on objectives in your face And you don't have the the power to punch them off if you're on that half of the book So it's it's definitely a A chess game now not so much just a a bowling match where you're just knocking all the pins over really easily Yeah, I'm very interested to see over the summer and especially potentially into the next ghb whatever that brings us how this Meta shapes out because we do have this emergent crop of books that all want to be spellcasters That all want to be like spelldom type armies. And then we also have this anti magic Uh, zealotry that's like real potent in the meta as well. You mentioned almeria corn was mentioned, right? Like these kinds of forces out there not to mention the fact that other spelldoms are itself a counter to your spelldoms, right? Like that's always been the case and so I'm just fascinated by the Potential for for like how does that shake out who wins because in a world where You know, some group of armies are going this is the main thing I want to do and another group of armies are going That thing is completely worthless Boy, oh boy does that that become an interesting thing to see which which tied wins You know, does the ocean or the beach win? I guess is the question, right? Yeah, I think I think too when there's scrolls that like you know are going to do something like say fulminators Or something that's very strong. Like that's that's something that you can rely on whereas like say this is really strong in magic Um, we were talking about earlier magic is always magic if you watch the battle from tuesday You know the probe can still always cast a three a three of miscast You know, there's so many things that can happen with magic that it's not always Maybe you're the best pony to have in the race very strong when you're plus three plus four with cogs out But you know, you can still roll threes and sevens. So Yeah, you better be Factoring in 70 points for cogs if you're gonna lean into the magic side of this book because I'm miscast and you're just Oh, you're in a world of crap Yeah Okay Good stuff. Well, let's get into the specifics Let's talk allegiance abilities and actually these are going to be completely broken up Um, and that's because they are completely different books Uh, as I as I said To to a point, of course Um Like you're still using the same scrolls, but I mean, it's like the army plays very very differently depending on what you're playing So we're gonna start with starborn. Um, and as I said everything cascades down from this this choice So you've got your two starborn sub sub factions, which is jacrothians tail and fangs are so tech I like probably didn't need it. But okay, sure Seraphon always get another layer of rules still because of sunk cost fallacy and anchor bias We still got to bring in an extra layer the last book had it So this book has to have some extra layer of rules as well for no reason Uh, hey What do I know? Okay Fine. It's fine. It's the best. Yeah. Yeah, sure. Sure Uh, it's it's a lot of text for like Two things. That's all it's it One might say that itself is a problem you would want to avoid when writing rules No, uh, if you use a lot of text, you should generally have it be, you know, doing a lot of things. But anyways Lords of space and time Uh, so Okay, got it. Understand fire up the TARDIS. I'm here for it. Uh, and The they get two heroic actions your slondu They and the two heroic actions are either they can replace a spell or they can teleport a unit That's it. Those are your heroic actions and then the unit can't move afterward Okay, fine. Cool. Good enough Um, the replace a spell thing is actually relevant because the regular slon don't know all of the spells in the lore only croak does Uh, only only light okay and spells do a lot Yep Uh, all right This stuff. Okay, here we go cosmic power. You must construct additional pylons. So okay Uh in your starborn army the following are considered to be cosmic nodes Starborn wizards starborn astrolith bearers and friendly starborn realm shaper engine faction terrain features So you will have one of the terrain feature You will have at least one astrolith bearer One plus like you are not taking this army Every starborn army starts at 1860 points because you have 140 points astrolith bearer in there I cannot imagine a list without him in the list Uh, and I could even see an argument for having two Um, though they are very duplicative with their function on top of each other But one's just sort of a backup and then you have some number of wizards. So that's your nodes Okay Obviously the realm shaper doesn't move around the board, but the other ones do that'll be relevant later You begin with zero cosmic power points, which are a thing you will now accrue Uh, so you now have a separate Mathematical mini game. You're going to get a track here. Uh, so good times And the start of your hero phase you get a you get a cpp For every starborn wizard or friendly starborn astrolith bearer on the battlefield In addition, you get a cosmic power point each time you successfully cast it One of your starborn wizards successfully cast a spell that isn't unbound Okay So let's say you've got four wizards and an astrolith bearer Let's just say That's that is a possible configuration Uh, then you're starting off with five you're accruing per round Plus one for every spell you successfully cast If you're one of your wizards were to be a tripcaster and the other three were single casters And let's say you get five out of your six spells off. That means you've accrued 10 So that's kind of in the in the area of The math All right, it could be less could be a little more But that's sort of what we're talking about here You also get them for dispelling and unbinding Uh endless spells and and unbinding enemy wizard casts too. So Absolutely correct. You can still accrue these in the enemy turn Yes, it should be noted that the the one you get for your presence on the table is only at the start of your hero Your yeah, yes, but you can gain you can accrue the other ones in the enemy phase Um, so, you know, I mean again goes back to what you were talking about like your playing corn or something Right who is like, well, I Let me check my notes here. Yep. I didn't bring any of that crap so Uh, cool. I guess none of those will be happening. No points will be gotten Off turn for you. Um, so obviously it can it can vary Um, I mean this army wants so badly like starborn wants so badly To run into some like middle the road average trying to use magic to some effect Army where they've got like three wizards who are just going to like cast some spells with no bonus or plus one and just be like I can do magic too and it's like sure you can little guy. Yeah, give me their points Yeah Um in that event, please just just stop casting your magic. You're not you're not doing anything to help yourself Just stop Uh, so There you go. Now there are Four ostensive ways to ostensive ways to spend your cosmic power points your cpp's Okay, what are those four ways fans? You might ask well In your hero phase, you can spend these mystical power points We need a new name for these. I refuse to call these cpp Yes, you have a different name every time Uh, you can spend your your your your cosmic moon power Uh, so you you get if you spend five moon power points Then you can return d3 slain models to a friendly starborn unit with a wound's characteristic of one or two holy within 12 Amazing each sorry each friendly unit fully within 12 very important. So See these and skinker do's and sorus and sorus guard all get d3 guys back around you both Both your units of five guard is what that's amazing for I brought back three and two but I didn't have enough room on the tuesday game to bring them back. That's insane for five cpp I agree warps don't enjoy or they should just be said and and well these are just star points. Okay. They are star points That's what I'm calling them. There you go star points is the winner Why did I not see it? It was right there my face. Yeah, I mean This is a really good effect for five points. Five points is a slam dunk. You basically automatically accrue this um Yeah, and you can't use the same ability more than once each phase. I should state just to be clear about that Okay, so yes, it's going to return your source guard guys back But it can also you know, you could get some skinks or some regular source too. Isn't that that'll counts okay And then protection of the old ones Uh, you spend 10 star points And until your next hero phase, uh, the revivifying energies have a ward of five of what is happening there Why is there like there was like a weird feedback effect happening? I don't know what that was Okay, uh at any rate if you spend, uh, 10 star points the revivifying energies Which is what comes off the astrolith banner bearer goes to a ward of five up instead of six up Okay What's the bubble on that holy within 12 holy within 18 of the astro 12 12 catch it I don't know if it's worth 10 to be honest. Uh star seer gives it the once per game. It's pretty pretty nice But with star yeah Yeah, I'm always you Give me five or 15 10 Yeah, agreed agreed the 10 is like nope Okay And then your star points can also spend 15 And if you do roll a dice for each enemy unit within 12 inches of any friendly cosmic nodes so Remember our cosmic nodes are the astrolith bearer the realm shaper engine in any of our wizards We are now rolling a dice for each enemy unit within 12 inches of any of those nodes potentially five or six nodes spread across the board right Now admittedly we don't want our salon too close to combat. So maybe not that one, but there you know others, okay And on a two up that unit suffers a number of mortal wounds equal to the roll Boom can be spicy. Yes, and it should be noted. This is not a spell This cannot be unbound This cannot be Uh corn whenever I cast a spell I roll blah blah blah and gain blood tithe points This is just a massive smack of mortal wounds emanating from many places Many places on the battlefield side You you pair that with like spatial like teleporting one of those heroes that said nine and then you use this Along with forest luster deliverances. It's like yeah everything within that is is going to be dead It's yeah Yeah, that's what I was going to say like the timing of this. It's very easy on a store-grown army to get 15 Star power points in your first turn And it's in the hero phase you use this and you've done all your other casting stuff And you've teleported your trogladon in their face and then he just goes nuclear and when the reactor melts down It's going to be a bad day Oh, that's that sounds like my first experience with this army everything plakash or you just said is true It was an effort of like 18 or 19 star points Uh, I got blasted by the quadruple celestial deliverance got nailed by this He was rolling a lot of four of five sixes On the the cleanse the realms and if it weren't for nergal like god help anybody without without wards I estimated I Took about 50 mortal wounds over the first two battle rounds including my ward saves From just all that's going off. It was it was quite crazy and until there's an FAQ you could technically Drop that you know trogladon seven inches away instead of Yeah, nine inches so you get even more stuff. Yeah. Yeah like Ooh spicy. Yep Yes, it is it should be noted doubling up your nodes does not double up the mortal wounds because it says within 12 inches of any friendly cosmic nodes So, you know having like two little wizards standing next to each other doesn't double tap the unit in front of them But you don't need to you do Yeah, that's why it's balanced. It's fine. Yeah, sure This is so much splash damage like this army is starborn specifically this build of it It's just like splash damage on parade Uh Vexlers in there you're you're laughing So falling down the meteors boom boom boom Somebody did that in another I've anyway, yeah rich. I've been seeing that more and more. It's not just stormcast now It's like they're allying in for vexlers. I think they're hundred each or maybe the 120. Maybe it's three vexlers Anyway, yeah, it's amusing. Look, I just want to say I'm glad everybody's finally on the train that I'm on Back when we did the stormcast review I was talking up at vexler and I was like this banner is amazing People are sleeping on this like seriously go back two years, right? I'm on board And and I was using them in tournaments and that guy always delivered for me. He was like the post office man. He delivered I remember it. Holy havoc like exactly two years ago. You were like, uh, this is the vexler and I'm like, oh Is that the one that brings guys back to like no screw that stupid guy? This guy explodes you or like I think that one's works. You're like, oh, yeah, wait and see Yeah, exactly. No, I just measure a 12 inch bubble homie and everything gets hit I ain't rolling on cash. Just yeah. Yeah, you can't really deploy anywhere else. So just everything in this. Yeah, exactly Just I'm gonna get my my target is your army Okay You can also summon they still have summoning. There's the there's the star power cost the star point cost It's it's this stuff they you can summon a lot of your army You're now like, I mean it's a lot of points. Don't get me wrong But it's also at the same time not Depending on what you're trying to do because as usual the best uses of this are often just Summoning up deck chair sitters and other types of like objective holders and chaff and things like that and i.e your your 10 skinks That kind of stuff and and that's you know eight Star power. It's not expensive. So You know, I've always been a fan of you know late game You bring in something like the the pterodons or the rippers They have a nice long movement So like turn four you bring them in over here, but in turn five they can go and be on a back objective somewhere Because of how how far they move That's a good call. Yeah, I I've been using it mainly for yeah 10 skinks a lot outside of seven Taking an objective things like that Um, but really you could hold on to in one and turn two you could pull down a snake bass deep Like there's oh, yeah, and and outside seven as well is just amazing because you're gonna have that the space fold of stave So even five wrap it on like they can do some decent damage. So yeah It's quite a nice sad that they left the dreadsorian off this list Never heard of it. Okay, I do wish I do wish they had the five guard on there though They have the 10 guard just second. Yeah, I think it's 10 It's like I wish there was just five guard because sometimes but Kind of everything It's it's a good list But I think they saw that that would just be the eternal summon Right because they it would have needed to be like 12 points and they'd just be like, yeah That's just everybody will just repeatedly summon those bodyguard units and to keep this land Over and over and over and over again Like that's the slain retreats the slain summons more bodyguards to him the slain retreats the slain summons more bodyguards to him Like oh good. This is a fun cycle. We're caught in Um, so yeah, it's it's fine Okay Uh Anything else we want to say about the allegiance abilities. I mean very strong set of allegiance abilities lots of mortal wound power Good mobility through the teleport the versatility of spell swapping A lot of nonsense to keep track of but you'll if you're one of my problems with this kind of a tracking thing Is you play this army like three times You will know you will understand what your nodes are and how to accrue your cosmic your star points Like that won't be hard for you. It's actually a pretty simple thing, right But somebody else who doesn't play against this thing are you know this army regularly and you got to explain Okay, see these things are nodes now nodes aren't what I count to get my points But there's a lot of overlap in the two. Okay, so here's how this works. Yeah, and it's going to be like Wait, what what are you doing? Yeah, yeah, the spatial translocation thing too. It's like it's so much different now Because it's in the hero face So again that just changed everything because it was always end of movement Uncondition teleport any unit you want anywhere on the board. So that was I think much stronger But there are strengths to being able to do that in the hero phase, which is you'll see there's a lot more synergies with With that, but I don't know. I don't know what I would have preferred the end of movement phase Teleporting whatever you want anywhere on the board was just so strong in star Yeah, yeah, still strong just kind of a bit different now Yep Yeah I like how they rained some in and changed it a little bit where like you were saying Instead of it being board wide and it didn't matter now you have to have a slant alive and they got What you want teleport has to be within 12 inches. So yeah, holy. So you've got to Be in certain areas which makes it and it's a heroic action. So now you're heroic action Yeah, so no heroic recovery and things like that no cp, which is you know, not a super issue And I do like that While the summoning star power points seat means a little You know weird. I like that It's now Not in replace of one of your valuable assets of your casts where you used to have to give up your casting In order to get your your summoning points Yeah, and it was like, oh, do I need the summoning? Do I need the casting and you had to play the game and now it's more like the The cordon one where you can I get I can get some benefits or I can You know summon some units, but I don't have to give up these super valuable resource for how many how many times you had like You had three summoning summoning points and you're like, okay d3 like roll the big three you get six You can get 10 skinks or even yeah, how many times I had would have four summoning points You know like all right. I just need to not roll a one or two here. I get six I've literally lost games before if I would have rolled a two a three up to get two or three Summoning points in the last edition then you can summon 10 skinks. You can teleport like Yeah, yeah, sure. Oh, yeah All right Let's talk about their command traits and uh, so we've got these are split between uh, slon command traits and skink command traits Uh, I don't know why there's that second list, but it exists for some reason um I don't that'll be that'll that'll there's gonna be like you you Um month from now when you pick up this book and you you look at the skink command rates You're gonna have to blow the dust off them because you're not gonna get used Uh, people are gonna be playing frogs Uh, but let's talk about what what what should we be directing people's attention to anthony start us off What's your what's your pick here with your hot pick? All right, so so two things one the one everybody knows the lord of uh, celestial renaissance Man there who just gets two star power points every time he casts or dispells or anything like that Uh, yeah, sure. Just give me more star power points. So that's all I need Um, but it's funny that you say the bottomless doesn't matter So here's an interaction that needs an FAQ if I take a Skink chief on stegadon, you know, give him an arcane tome and make her a master of star rituals Does he now know all the lore? Because it's not a spell enhancement Right that has given him the entire lore or given him any spells It's made him a wizard which now he gets the entire lore Yeah, who who cares? But uh, I just thought it was fun. This was also the first reading through the book This was the first when I realized when I got here. They really go. Okay starboard is skinks and coalesce this Uh source because they don't even give you an option for a source here Like you're not taking source your one source guy doesn't need anything at it That's gonna be in your army in starboard doesn't need anything. Here you go. Right. Yep Yeah, I mean the lord of celestial resonance is just such an obvious path to power We just talked about all the incredible things you can do when you get to 15 and the summoning and all that kind of stuff So doubling up on a tripcaster who has the potential to generate six star power points instead of three star power points Uh, you know, I mean, that's that's that's a big shift. It's a big shift Yeah, rich are you picking the same thing or are you going anywhere else? Well, the one that yeah the one that doubles the length of endless spells is kind of cute But you're gonna have an astral like you said no matter what so it's just it's so simple. Yeah, that's that's the one hard stop It's all every every time yeah It's a shame too because I really like shrewd strategist. Um, the whole counter charge thing is is really fun But i'm not taking a skink general. So I don't know why like especially in starboard I said I don't know why we're talking about it Like it's you're just constantly dispelling the spells for two as well Like yeah, it's just that one's just so much stronger than yeah, and it's just so so good. Yeah. Yep. Absolutely Like it's lord of celestial resonance. There you go The higher state of consciousness by the way people might look at and be like, yeah, but Of course, but but being ethereal effectively is cool and it's like yeah, not when you're on a four up Uh Better idea just don't get attacked. Okay, so Uh, that brings us to our artifacts Um as they choose to to spell it We've already mentioned it ridge. What's your pick here on the artifact list? We've already talked about it like three times. Yeah, the spaceholder stave. I think it's called. Yeah So strong and that's I think anthony you're saying just needs an FAQ because at the end of the movement phase Your character this land does this so then the next time you bring a unit in it could come in seven I don't know if they're intending that that was supposed to be when you summon Or if that means if you don't summon anything the following hero phase you technically haven't done a setup You can spatial translocation something outside of seven because that is technically your next setup So I don't I feel like it works easily right now like rules is written. That's how it would would go I just I don't know if they intended that to be mean only summons would come outside seven But it's not crazy strong. So I feel like it's fine that if you did it I imagine it'll get FAQ to be only summons just so it's like clear because it's uh It's a sort of semi non intuitive interaction Otherwise, right like you have to you're sort of banking this ability for your potential next turn And a lot of times they're they're trying to remove those kinds of like those Delayed holdover effects from the game because of the confusion they cause my guess is they just didn't think about the the limitation so Uh, my guess is it'll be the next friendly starborn unit to be set up on the battlefield this turn or something A hundred percent and and it makes you say that if it was rules as written now You would actually have to declare at the end of your movement phase. Okay. This guy is going to guide in the next unit You know what I mean? You would have to physically say that for it to technically be the next hero phase which is just done So yeah, I think they're they're probably going to FAQ it for some and I think the FAQ is not just for summons though What Vincent exactly said is the next unit to be set up because in dracotheans tale You can set up a unit at the end of the movement phase So this this could work for that too. And I think it's fine working on that even It's just a holdover to the next turn. That's wonky Right agreed. Yeah I and by the way, I still think that's my pick even with that Change just because it is so strong. You mentioned the dracotheans tale interaction, which we'll get to in a minute Uh, it's an extremely strong interaction. Uh, I do want to give a fun shout out to zoetic dial Um, just because this is the type of thing that I truly love. I love these kinds of effects I never want them to stop writing stuff like this I don't know I don't know if anybody has ever played the dune board game like the original dune board game the good one It's a really good. It's a really good board game But there's a bunch of different alternate win conditions in the game and the benedezerit One of their win condition is they write down a player and then a turn of the game that that player will win on And then they write that and it goes and it becomes secret And if that comes to pass like if a tradie's wins on turn seven and that's what they picked They show their card and if it says like a tradie's turn seven The tradie's loses in the benedezerit win because it is as they have predicted, right? And so I just love goofy like things like that. I just think it's fun and this is what a dial is Yeah, you you you like secretly record this battle round that you think is going to be highly impactful And then at the start of that battle round you just miraculously Heal all your wounds and get plus one to save for the for that a battle round, which is just that's just fun Yeah, they've had that item. It's been in yeah the iterations Yes, don't ever get rid of this don't ever get rid of fun items like that. Keep that around You still will never take it though. No, no, no, no, but like A fun game casual. Yeah. Yeah for a fun game thing. It's super amazing, right? um, I love crap like that so okay, uh Yeah, I mean it's baseball or stav. There we go again, um the uh I love the sacred stegodon's helm. The problem is I'm not taking the skink guy in this force The guy I want to put that I want to put that helm on a different guy in a different force But anyways, same with the trog of others the trogladon. Oh, yeah, it can definitely see it on a trog It could work on a trogladon. Yeah, so like if you are taking a second artifact I could see going for it, but it on starborn side I think you want low drops. So I don't think you're going for extra battalions to get extra artifacts Okay, good stuff Let's talk about spells. There's a lot of them There's so many of them and you're gonna have a lot of spellcasters, especially on this side of the house So ridge we're going back to you here, buddy Uh, what what's your what's your picks what you're taking? Uh, again, let's just remember vitamin k Old old lord croaky. He gets all of the Whenever he gets all of the spells of whichever one you put him in Yeah, so in starborn, he gets the starborn spells and in coalesce. He gets the coalesce spells um So But but the regular salon does not regular salon is picking a spell just like anybody else unless he Swip swaps. It's what he's got. So okay hit me. So yeah, there's this man. They're so good comment His comments call obviously is just your kind of first one. I think you would take Depending on what matchup you have like say if you're playing if you're playing against iron jaws And there's something with a bunch of like a big maw crusher or something like the making rendash spell is Seems incredibly useful. You can always stuff sacrifice if you know with croak and use that one, but also teapox Whatever defiance or whatever it is the minus one to wound one as well unbelievably good. Um So I could definitely see that one as well like running that in the slant or if you're running the Spell enhancement so you can use two spells slan can always switch a spell So there's just so much variance that you can kind of gauge it to whatever you're playing But um, I was usually casting comment with the slam because I wanted to do all four deliverances with croak But it's like it's if you're not doing that and you think you're going to get more benefit out of getting turning something into rendash Or minus went to wound if you're running the trogladon and yeah, if you have the trogladon mystic shield He's got the sacred sacred plus one save to send his helm. Yep. He's owned a wound He's minus one to hit like you can just make that guy predict any heels d3 like So I can see a little bit for the other so even the other spell like lessening the caster I think it is by by one. They're unbinds. It's just another one. Okay. You really want to make sure this spell goes off You could possibly do that, but yeah Yeah, there's obviously needs to be an faq on drain magic because it doesn't actually work As it's written now But I mean that's just that's just I'm sure that'll get fixed like the way drain magic and the reason it doesn't work right now Is because drain magic is a spell it is casting might have six if successfully cast Until the end of that phase add one to the dispelling rolls made by friendly units and subtract one from unbinding rolls Made by enemy units. So the second part of that sentence is perfectly fine. Like, okay, cool The first part of that sentence. No fail. We have already passed The but when you are casting the spell we have already passed the point in time where you are dispelling Uh, so that does not work given the fundamental rules of the game Uh, but I assume they'll just fix that in some way and and go from there Yeah, uh, agree All right, Anthony any any skinky do spells make in your list there? What do you like in the skinker do stuff? Yes, so I actually like the uh cosmic crush Because when you throw on my oracle when I throw him out there and he's close and if you come up against a block of like Uh cast warriors or cast knights down a three up save So you roll Yeah, blood a number of dice equal to the models in the unit And if they're on a three up save every four up is a mortal wound. So That's uh, that's pretty tasty. I'll take that um Very frightening to uh to to any of those corn things or anybody rocking around on a two up save really hates this spell like boy Oh boy bad day for them. Yeah Yeah So, I mean it's it's situational Like you were saying I'm more than likely going to cast mystic shield with them But uh, if there's a target for it I like having this there even five up save like right. It's still like it's still just the same board killing spell I'm in a five up save unit. It's super good. It's just another it's another yeah toolbox I mean, uh, what are pink horrors or what a four up? six Six pink pink star six of them. Okay. They're about yeah, it's equals or exceeds See you're hitting on the number. So exactly even like a four up five up unit still doing a lot of mortal wounds And the key to understand here with the range is that the range is a lie Oh, yeah Uh, we we we have to just go ahead and put that out there right now Like mystical unforging which is the one you mentioned several times rich, which is so powerful, right? It just sets the rend characteristic of an enemy unit's weapons to To to not dash. Yeah to no rent Yeah You know like such a strong spell But only has a range of 12 inches and any and a casting value of eight in most armies I would look at that and go cast value of eight range of 12 this spell is worthless No matter how good it is, right? It ended up like the it would end up like acid spray or whatever in cities Yeah, right, which was always like so had so much potential but short range high cast never happening, right? Whereas here you've got so many bonuses to cast and everything should be read as being six inches at least farther than whatever the range printed says Just like if it says 12 it's 18 if it says 24, it's 30, right like that's Yeah, that's what we're dealing with. Oh, so a tempest too. We didn't even mention that Stella tempest is just amazing. I don't have the book but I'm just doing it from memory. But yeah, Stella tempest again That's another like crazy Ford Ford killer 30 inches five up mortals. Yeah, so many things Yeah, yeah, cosmic. You bet. You're right. Cosmic crush thunders Well, there are three up save now awesome Enjoy this. Yeah Stella tempest is great for you. You've got squig heard great here. Have a Stella tempest This off squigs Yes And yes, as pointed out exactly not only six inches all the ranges as Willard says but then also think about like where the trog is as well If he's Yeah, the range is where I what I want it to be Yeah, yeah Speed of haunchy too is amazing. I don't know the skink spell like it's that's what you're taking on at least your star priest or Your star seer, but yeah hero phase move on. Oh my god So so good on most on the raptidons on if you're running rippers Yeah, awesome rippers especially. I really like or I could see if you wanted to lean into some skew pterodon drop the bombs Use it on there. Yeah. Yeah use it there Um, I just wish you could use it on monsters. Even another little cheeky thing you can do This is the real yeah, all the all the johnny tricks are coming out But you could even instead of doing the spatial translocation You could technically use speed of haunchy on your star priest or or your star seer Hero phase move them stay within 12 of croak or whoever and then you can cast from that Hero right just to get your deliver in your deliverance range. So there's a lot of just a little You know playing if you play a bunch you start to find like those other synergies will will save you a bunch Yeah, anytime you can pick a unit and move it around in your hero phase, especially with a keyword as broad as skink in this book Like spoiler a lot of things still have the skink keyword the skink keyword still a high value keyword Yeah, they've reigned it a little bit Yes, I will agree with the statement we reigned it in a little bit I will grant you that point, but it is still a high value keyword Oh, yeah, but okay And then you've got the two sub sub factions Drakothians tail appear on command during deployment instead of setting up a drakothians tail unit on the battlefield You can place it to one side and say that it's set up in the temple ship It's up with battletoad gothic And uh as a reserve and then you can set up one for every one you've set up on the battlefield Blah blah blah the end of your movement phase You can set up one or more of the reserve units on the temple ship on the battlefield Holy within 12 of a cosmic node Which remember is your wizards your ashlet bearer and your realm shaper engine And more than nine from all enemy units, but then yes exactly so anthony as you mentioned if you have The staff of being within seven inches Or sorry being at seven the seven inch line not within being the staff of seven inches um Hey now Then you then yes, you can there's I don't see any reason why you can't guide these guys in and by the way That feels like that wouldn't get FAQed because that does feel like it's appropriate, right? Yep, I think it's fine. Yeah, that feels like an absolutely intended use For sure. It's just the interaction of like the following hero phase if you don't use it and right is the only Yeah, but that one feels like the one that's like, uh, that'll probably get changed Yeah, yeah Uh, and then all right fangs of so-tech the serpent strikes Teeth Yes, exactly the commanding player of it. This is okay, we'll get to it I got to read the whole thing before I start complaining. All right The commanding player of a fangs of so-tech army can use the redeploy command ability up to three times in each of their opponent's movement phases in addition The first two times the redeploy command is issued to any friendly fangs of so-tech Soter so-tech this mistyped that The rage had already kicked in at this point. Yeah, exactly. I was like stroking out Fangs of so-tech skink unit no command points are spent and then also this adds battle line wrapped to don hunters and wrapped on chargers okay All right, you you can still do it with guard or warriors three times if that's what you're you're thinking But if you do it with skinks then the first two are free. Yep Yeah, yeah Why is this worded like this? Why I what this is one of those things why I just want to be like Seraphon, why are you like this? Okay, this is why everyone hates you Okay Because like Trip redeploying is not a weird thing anymore Right like lots of people have double and triple redeploy. They can issue the redeployer command multiple times This goes back to like cruel boys on their their thing could do it, right? There's plenty of armies that can do this trick. I don't mind this trick Okay, it's fine. It's fun. Cool. I get it It's a very mobile army It suits to that It's a spell cast the army you want to stay out of you know melee you want to sort of harris the enemy force Totally tracks like for similitude All everything works here for me and then you went and wrote The dumbest thing which is I just do it twice for free. So till let me understand this correctly Guaranteed zero command points exhausted. I can just redeploy two skinks Every every opponent movement phase period. Yeah, like with everybody else. It's you spend one Right to do the first redeploy and then you do not spend additional command points the second and third time This is this is activated. Okay, by the way later in this book. We're gonna read a guy whose rules work like that Yeah, okay, it's great. I love it whereas these guys flipped it. It's like you only ever pay for the last one All right, I guess sure. I mean what that tells me is I'll only do the third one if absolutely necessary Otherwise this rule should just say twice per round redeploy two skink units for free. That would be weaker That's what's insane Yeah, okay, if you need the third one you can pay for it, right? Yeah And yes, as I was going to point that out Willard, but you're absolutely correct and it should be noted that base skinks Um, when they redeploy rule twice and take the highest die, which is also a very good thing solid, yeah I hate this rule I hate this this could have just been written like every other freaking rule Right, and I would have been fine with it. I would have been like, oh neat. Yeah, that makes total sense What a cool rule, but no We had to write it this way and make it the only thing in the game that works like this There's a few other instances of this much when we get to the crux of war war scroll I'll I'll rage out with you a little bit But yeah, I hate when they do dumb rules interactions that like why did you need to do that? Or add this other stupid thing that I need to keep track of like I know exactly what you're going to reference with the kroyger skull and I agree completely It made me so angry when I was reading it. I was like, why is this here? Okay, we'll we'll save it. All right. I'm going to guess ski I'm going to guess skiing storm ball than that too. Just just going to go out and live I don't even know honestly, but I'm just going to take a guess Yeah, so uh one thing. Thank you. Thank you. Thank you, ridge I'm uh, this is excellent zen practice for me. I'm enjoying this All right, so can we back up miss school and forging Until the start of your next year phase the rent characteristic of that unit's weapon is treated as dash Yeah, you guys may not know this but so what happens when you have something that's modifying right if we got like Plus one to rent interaction and you've got this spell right in those situations Do you guys incidentally know offhand what? It still modifies it. It still modifies it There is there is some oddity to this that can happen in unusual situations of set values versus Versus modifications based on the timing where you usually run into this problem is with like Stone guard in lrl versus modifications to rent That's where it can get weird because then you have like a set value fighting a set value And that's when timing gets weird, but with this no just further things will still modify it So like yeah, I hit the unit of pigs Here's the easy example like exactly. I hit the unit of pigs. I turned them into zero They were charging to me and declare the wall. They're they're rent increases. I won their rental. They go to one. Yeah Gotcha sweet So easy peasy Um, okay, it's still really good Oh, yeah Yep, still really really really really really good. Okay Cool. Um Let's uh, let's talk about coalesced who for some reason Uh, first of all, this is my home. I just want to say that I've never been I've always been a coalesced player I I'm not saying that jokingly like my my army is my my I spent I converted up my my beloved little skink on stegadon word chief guy Like he's my favorite little boy and he's always my general Because this is totally just a fun army for me. This isn't like a turdy army So I play this when I want to smash and play smashy smashy time with my dinosaurs. So Yeah, uh And all my all my stegadons are the again the 90s stegadons that hunk of solid metal He could just kill a man with Five pounds of of metal And the shooter comes in you're grabbing that thing before Yeah, exactly. Just nail it with that. Yeah, they're going down Okay Predatory fighters add one to bite rolls for your sorus and and kreuger units with the mighty sorus jaws Sorus jaws or vice like jaws ability, um, which is different now And this is actually interesting the way they changed it, but we'll get to it This this will mean more later But this is exactly what I meant when I was talking about like How you which sub faction you take Dramatically changes how you sort of evaluate units and what they're capable of Because it makes a huge difference to the overall Impact of these units something like even a plus one to this role is going to make a big deal as we'll see Yeah, big time And then scaly skin Subtract one from the damage inflicted to a minimum of one by each successful attack The target's a friendly coalesced unit that has the sorus kreuger or monster keyword Nope, perfectly fine Stop it Change this Change this right now the four week FAQ should include a change to this. Let me just say that This is a nonsense rule that just invalidates certain armies and I they should change it They should change it to you can do it on skinks and other things Yeah Opposite of last year's FAQ. Yeah Exactly 30 skinks minus one damage. It's fine. Perfect Tyler, I don't imagine you have the biggest dog in this fight But just because You're mostly playing an army that relies on damage one high attacks attrition damage, right? Like mortal wounds Yeah, and stuff like that like nergal is not the home of damage, too right Um Not that it doesn't exist. It's just not the really the way they they win most their stuff is just a bunch of damaged one Right But I think of like the ogre. Well, someone think of the ogres Okay Who just rock up and are like, okay, I lose then cool Like just destruction somebody think of destruction. Please. Yeah, exactly like anybody who who's not called gloom spike gets Uh This is just like such an instant lose. It's obviously nothing's really a hundred to one blah, blah, blah Please don't take my joking hyperbole is me saying that like No ogre player can beat a coalesce seraphon player. Obviously. That's not true skillet ways a bunch play ways a bunch The scenario ways a bunch yada yada yada yada yada, but boy does it put you on the back foot in like a crazy way Yeah, that's how what do you what do you think of it minus one damage you a fan or no Well, I would have to look at the overall package here Where are we with coalesce, you know, and I don't know ridge if you have a sense Uh spoiler. I haven't looked at the worst goals. I've skimmed the high level stuff, right the eligibility, etc So I don't have a good sense on how is coalesce looking as far as in bounds or out of bounds in overall strength I mean, I played them. I played this a lot over the last season And with like iron jaws. Yeah, it's rough Yeah, like into so it's engines and staggies are probably not going to be as relevant But I just yeah, just like minus one damage in general like I know vince just hates that role in general Are you like of the same like even with obr now with the petrofen? I'm definitely I'm done. Yeah, rich I'm definitely worried like I mentioned on the show I'm definitely worried about like the thing that strikes me as most concern of obr is the petrofex With mortis, whatever they're called the guard, right and the stalkers. It's like, yeah, here's my six guard. Here's my six stalkers Here's catacros. I mean, I feel like if we're going to see something that's a little copy paste That's quite powerful. It's going to probably be something along those lines And with the minus one damage and bringing them back on, you know multiple potentially on three ups But anyway, yeah, I mean in general I it has flavor of something being problematic But it depends on the context more source I think you're going to see a lot more if it's going to be coalesced you're going to see source blocks You're going to see Hopefully the new agragons when they they finally drop they'll be cool But I think the days of the engine and the staggies are are sadly gone other than your your fun games vents, but They're still they're still decent just all one rend You know, it's I could still see them here and there there are ways, you know shoot them with The minus one save the new sally's like the spawns of kotet Other ways I think that possibly they could be okay and Thunder lizards, but I think yeah, the sail of scaly skins mainly going to be the carnos and the The source borders now Agreed. Agreed. I think the carno has some some gas in the engine for sure Uh, and I think that you're I think your source are actually a solid unit I can't determine what I think about kroyger yet. I just know they make me angry as we discussed and Uh, but but I'm but I'm not ready to write them off Uh, so rich one one thought on this I I don't know if it's One thing that comes to mind is helan for luminous So like when I think about helan, right like helan increases the shot potential of luminous And now we've gotten sentinels that have bumped up But if you just run two by ten sentinels, let's say a 320 point investment outside of helan That's that might feel overcosted at times I I would guess like I mean that's that's eight, right So you have the certain rules that within like particular context really change the nature of scrolls and point values And I I do wonder if I got you. Yeah, something like this is is like that Yeah, yeah This is such a swing in the evaluation of a unit because it just it radically impacts the way that this unit functions And and it really really radically impacts the way that unit functions against certain armies Match independent. Yeah. Yeah. It's the thing. It's very match-up. I did sure. Yeah, I completely agreed in like In like too heavy of a rock paper scissors way for me, frankly Yeah, and I made the exact same argument with obr Like I think that rule should also be fired off the roof for for petrofex elite Um, I don't know what the fix is, you know, is it like subtract one from damage if the damage is three or higher or subtract one from damage if the You know more than that or or if it's a multi damage attack like or something like that Like I don't know or maybe it's just like They have a ward of six up or you know, I don't know like there It seems like there's a bunch of different ways you could implement the thing um They could have plus one to save against all missile weapons or or like They could turn the rend from all missile weapons to dash just all the time or something like I don't know I don't know that actually wouldn't be bad because nothing really has a three up save So then you could never get to yeah, so that that would be okay. Yeah Yeah, it's on a bestilladon, which is on a two already on a two. Yeah. Yeah, so it doesn't matter Like I could see some ways to that you could have implemented this where we wouldn't be having this same discussion All right, and I'm not saying mine that I just rattled off for perfect But I think they all feel better. All right, you get extra monsters rampages. You get one per per monster type So one for carney and one for steaky one for the troggy and one for the basti um My my appraisal of all of them is they're all fine Yeah, they're all cool. The basti one's sweet. It's it's cool. I like it Yeah, the mortals I agree the basti one's the best, but he's kind of the guy Oh, well, I don't know. We'll talk about it. He's kind of the guy that I'm I'm often not Super throwing into combat, but maybe I am now more. I don't know like I I think the snake basket was already getting pretty popular at the end of the last run And I think I'm on team snake basket now fully So now it's just like how do I get this little slow guy up into combat because he I want to use this monster Just rampage and then release snakes Yeah Um, I I do like the carna store one because I like anything that lets me pick a model and kill it Which is which is fun. Um, you let you kill champions and like you are picking the model So, um, you can hit champions and I didn't stick with that. Yeah, that makes sense. Yeah, so Which is a nice thing like being able to pick out those support models like Go up, you know, go go, you know, ate your champion. This unit can't issue commands to itself anymore Right, like that is a thing Oftentimes there's still a hero around but not always and that matters a lot Especially when we talk about the rules that your big monsters have namely shutting off some pretty vital things So yeah, yeah, okay, but they're fine. There's like they're not bad But you're but they're they're fine. I mean none of them are better than roar No, so no, yeah, that's the other part Yeah, if you're running two of them then you can do one of them probably Right, but some situations roar if say they don't see pee like there's yeah There's some situations where yeah You're not roaring as usual roar remains the top of the pile. It's a very high bar to cross Uh, okay Uh, cool. Let's talk about command traits much simpler allegiance abilities and coalesce though and for that I do credit them one page versus two page. No additional tables Just keeping it very simple Uh, here we've got slon and sorus command traits because you will I think you will actually have sorus generals in this army I think that is a doable thing um But Anthony go back going back over to you. What's your pick here on your command traits in in coalesced? So, uh, I'm gonna take a dominating mind and use it on my dreadsorian and be totally happy If I can still use a dreadsorian. I'm there if not I still think, uh um Pickly scale live on a karnosaur is probably where I'm going Yeah, so the plus one to save rolls for attacks. Yeah, this general just period all the time It's you know ranged and melee plus one to save is obviously strong having mystic shield permanently on you Yep, pretty good. Yeah So, yeah, I will say if you're going to take a frog. I don't hate wrath of the eons the whole once per battle Uh, you add one to the attacks of all melee weapons used by friendly sorus and croyer units wholly within 12 That is an interesting punch of a big bubble of plus one attacks That can lead to some places as we'll see there are some pretty potent spells We can trip off on sorus here. We mentioned sorus blocks can be a thing Punching them with a whole extra attack and a big block is not a not a bad thing Uh Yeah, rich you got any any picks? Uh, I don't know in front of me D. I know I was thinking about because I my coalescence. I played Uh last week is there's one. I think that you get two two extra spells in your slam Yeah, yeah master of the material blame I thought of that because I ended up taking the spell enhancement because I ran a star seer a star And a slam so I ended up Running the spell enhancement so I didn't need to but because I really wanted to run prime war beast on my karno So that's the one that I would run in the karno just because the the jaws are just so good, right? That's the five damage one. So having four of those instead of three. Just just yeah Yeah, better. So that's the one. Yeah for me for but obviously the plus one save as well I just like the to kill stuff more than not die. So Is the Is the karno still on a four up save base? Yes. Yeah, okay. Gotcha. Yep I I also like the vengeful defenders Because turn one you're in your your own territory. So now you're your general who could be a karno sore All right, he can make a move and two friendly sorus or praxe gore units So a big block of source warriors can move so that they can get a little closer Or you get those agrodons moving and then move it again like you can use some work with some moving You're gonna see You know a karno sore nine agrodon six agrodons Move up eight and then move up eight movement phase like you're gonna see a crazy With that and it is it will be good because they're you know, it's one of those lists that You move all that stuff push it into your opponent's army and say, okay Can you can you deal with that because you can't do that then I went too too prior then You know, it's over or or if you can't deal with it then So I could I could see that one too. Yeah, I'm just I haven't seen much of the agrodons I'm excited to play a bit more of those. I feel like On tts. I guess because the models aren't here yet tts You could practice or just proxy, but I just sure can't wait to actually get the models. Yep Like I will also say like the custodian of divine technology where your salon just gets two bonus artifacts of power In addition to the first one. So it's like you're getting three artifacts total. Effectively, you're trading your one command trait for two artifacts Um is always an interesting choice. It's just a question of are those artifacts actually worth it on the frog That's what it becomes a question of so let's answer that question. Shall we but uh, yes indeed But as a side note, I like this list much better than the starborn list This one feels much more like full of stuff that I wanted to take or could see using in a particular army Much more of these were were a better pick Um in starborn. I felt like I was like that one that one done. Why are we still talking right? Yep Okay, so our artifacts here Um the throne of the lost gods four inches to the bearers move characteristic and one of the bearers wounds characteristic Uh crystalline skull you start with a power reserve of zero every time you successfully cast this bell It's not about increase the power reserve by one once we're battling your hero phase You can say the bear will shatter the crystalline skull if you do so you release dan acroids delicious vodka all over the battlefield And and when that happens Uh, you pick an enemy unit within 12 inches of bearer and roll a number of dice equal to the power reserve For each three plus that unit suffers one more to wound. That's a bad item Uh, it it xy it's xy grubs I I think they mean it'sy. I I bet that's how they're that's that that's like british humor Spelling something itxi and meaning is itsy like itsy bitsy grubs That that feels very british humor to me in other words, doesn't somebody else have this same named artifact I That would be insane if they did I thought it was like this shaggots It's always been it's the same thing. It's always been the same as last book. Yeah, I guess I could start that To start your hero phase you heal one wound in addition You can re-roll one casting roll or one dispelling roll for the bearer and in the enemy hero phase you rear one Unbinding roll fine like heal one the re-rolls are good Everybody likes re-rolling spell casting obviously and then kwaddle familiar once you're about to start your hero phase You can say the bear will be blessed by teapock who Who shows up in hologram form like all the jokes here? Uh, he's gonna he shares some california love And if you do so the bearer can attempt cast one additional spell in that hero phase And the spell can be any spell from the lore of ancient domains. Okay fine enough My answer is I don't want two of these on my frog. That's the problem. Nope Yeah, I was gonna answer that question that you brought up, but I was let you'll get there Yeah, we had we had to play it through right? I wanted to take everybody else on the journey When I first read this, you know a little while back. I was like, oh, yes cool two artifacts And I flip the page and I was like, oh no Yeah, xt grabs cool like that's the only one you want right right right Uh, and then on your source artifacts, uh, you have sadly I I think one choice Uh, the artifacts did not hit the same level as the command traits I'll see what you do think it's so text gaze right? That's the choice Enemy models with a wound characteristic of one or two cannot contest objectives while they're within six inches of the bearer 100 stop reading It's it's good, uh It's model right or it's not unit. Is it model? It's models within six enemy models within six Yeah, but that is a big radius. That's bigger. A lot of times you see this rule written as three not six And that's the same as what the conqueror's crown or whatever it is in slaves or is it right? Is that what it's called? Yeah that and it's it's it's good and it's came up before with me And then I realized I thought it was unit and I was like, oh, yeah, and then I realized it was per model Yeah I honestly I don't hate the blade of realities Actually, I have ran it on the Carnasaur as well So the Carnasaur's changed to his the guy up top is five attacks three threes minus one two damage So storm cast profile So minus two two damage is actually decent. You give them the empower Sell estate five attacks three Two's twos because run them into codles all at attack five attacks twos twos minus three two damage So it's like pretty reliable eight eight damage So I don't hate the blade realities. And then if you're fighting a hero, it's an extra damage too. So Yeah, I I have ran it and I I don't mind it on on there as well. But yeah, the first one Good as well. Yes. Yeah Yeah, I mean in my mind I'm just charging that Carnasaur into some unit that's on an objective and being like You know getting into the middle of it eating a guy With my monster section or something or or uh, or well And then I'm gonna roar as well because we'll talk about what I'm playing in just a second And where I'm doing two of those things and uh And then just being like, okay, none of you count, right? I'm just gonna kill some of you But it doesn't matter none of you count because I can just get into the Up into the guts of the thing and and just zot them out from counting on the objective at all Like I take this for free So, okay Spells Anthony, you want to you want to talk about any of these particular spells? What jumps out at you on the coalesced spell list? What what grabs you? Oh So the one that everybody's crying about that needs an FAQ which is the telepathic summons Which I think is totally fine because you can't use it on a monster So you can bring in a foot Stores old blood or you can bring in some source warriors and put them into combat I'm okay with that. It's not that bad There's some iterations where it's crazy like definitely needs to be changed, but oh, it's fine. Stop it Yeah, so let's let's talk about telepathic summons because it's the opposite of the starborn teleport almost effectively Right, it's it's one of these it's like the zinch guy in slaves where he's like It's the scorpion get over here is what he's doing right instead of instead of pushing them way He's calling him to him Yeah, so it's a spell that has a casting by of six and a range of nine inches But that's a lie for reasons we'll talk about in a moment Because if successfully cast you pick one friendly sorus unit that is not a monster As you said and that is visible to the caster Anywhere on the board You then remove them and set them up within the range of the spell so within nine of the caster But that's the only limitation Right. Yeah, so the caster could be say six inches off of somebody Like could be in combat could not be doesn't matter the point be right 14 inches away from somebody and you're still setting these guys up in combat He could be within one inch of a spell portal and you're setting Into a into someone's army and completely shutting them off with 30 sorus warriors and uh, yes, yes and uh spell portal Banner bear the the astraleth banner bear like all sorts of all sorts of wackadoo things that are going to happen here where You're just suddenly dropping a whole unit of sorus into combat Which look if we learned anything from the first few years of aos It's the teleports that deposit massive battle line units directly into combat Is fine. There's no issues Vanguard wing was super cool We all loved it And we're bringing it back babies Yeah, yeah, I think you couldn't come quicker. I haven't actually even played with it I ended up not taking the spell just because we just we're gonna if I took it We're just gonna play outside of nine. Obviously. Yeah But just forgetting the outside of nine and that they can't move is is kind of Yeah, pretty pretty crazy that they could but really at this point Are we really that surprised that they're gonna miss a couple things here and there so yeah Yeah, we we we missed some things Um, we would be remiss if we didn't mention empowered celestite as this will be an incredibly popular and oft cast spell Empowered celestite to spell it as a casting vibe seven in a range of 18 inches Again, which will often be farther blah blah if successfully cast just because your coalesce doesn't mean you don't have an astraleth banner bear Yeah, uh, he's still very well. Maybe he's floating around here You pick one friendly source unit holy with an range invisibility caster until the start of the next hero phase Improve the rend characteristic of that unit's celestite weapons by one a celestite weapon is any weapon that has celestite in the name Appreciated that does border on the wizard thing as a wizard as uh as as miniac pointed out We're almost on the border over with that. So yeah Okay Yeah, it's a great spot. Love it. Yeah, absolutely I mean plus one rend on a unit that by the way already has a rend just so we're all clear Well, we'll see it when we come to the source So making your regular source beaters into neg two is pretty good. Real nice. Yeah, good Tide of serpents is nice too. It's your you're slightly shorter range stellar tempest so we can still kill boards if we need to Yep, yep, absolutely. I agree. The heal one's even cute, but it's yeah, the other the other two are Are better or you're talking about the skink. Oh the skink ones. Yeah Run and charge is amazing. Oh run charge. Awesome. Yeah. Oh, yeah Yeah, some some good spells. Yeah, heavenly frenzy gives you run in charge Tide of serpents is a nice five up mortal wound horde buster, you know, like, but yeah, it's it's a good spell list Completely unsurprisingly, right? Like, yes, it's seraphon. Welcome to good spell lists Okay, even even with the skinks, which is awesome. Yeah, right, Tyler I mean what I'm I'm getting a little okay Can I run frogs and dinosaurs just pure frogs and dinosaurs and like three two four one no skinks Can I do that ridge? Yes. Yes. Yes, 100. Yes. I don't have to I don't have to see a skink I don't have to use a skink keyword doing it wrong, but you can Well, you will see a skink keyword Yes, all right. Well to discuss. Well, it's just a lot of big dinosaur. No, that's that's a lie. That's a lie You could go. Oh, no. Yeah, you could go quaddles claw and then you could literally blank the skink keyword from your list Yes, 100. Yeah, all right. I really want the stars here though, but yeah, okay Right Yeah, but you could do with adam like you wanted Three two three two ridge three two Three three two and five great games five great friends. Not five. Oh, that's it. That's what you want. All right, baby. All right I might be in all right. Let's keep going. Okay. You're two sub factions coattails claw and thunder lizards coattails claw savagery incarnate add one to wound rolls for your Soros and craig are units that made a charge and then you have to battle line your two craig are units The new craig are in the craig are worse one So that's how you do it tyler, right? Because there you just take like a frog a fat frog Right. Yep. And then I love it just Kroger and then you could you could include some of the other monsters that don't necessarily have the skink keyword Like as we mentioned, okay got rid of it, right? So you could there are still skinks hanging out on top of that and I can I can richly burn any skinks That's on his on his actual model. I can I can remove those and yeah, okay, but still on the Kroger war scroll they do still mention skinks. So You'll love it they mentioned dead skinks. Oh, okay. All right. I'm in man. This is a this is an emotional roller coaster. All right The ups and downs, right? Yeah And then my particular choice which is thunder lizard at the end of the charge phase You can carry out two monstrous rampages of each friendly thunder lizard monster instead of one and you get battle lines Degadons Suck it. I guess bcr take that their special thing is they get to have one monster do two monstrous rampages This army's just like no dog. We're not about that life. You just go nuts. Everybody do two Have a good time So love it good stuff Uh, and I love me a battle lines Degadon even though he's not that good. Uh, but that's still okay Just two points. Most they were 250. Yep. Yeah, yeah I like that they They took thunder lizards and said We're going to take away the wording here where we give them two extra wounds and we're just going to put it all on the war scroll And give them extra wounds now Yeah, because god, they need it three extra for the carnice too. Yeah. Yeah Yep Well speaking of what a great transition. Let's talk about war scrolls gentlemen. All right. We're doing all right We're doing all right. Okay And croak we trust Yeah, let's talk about well, that's where we're starting Let's talk about vitamin k Lord croak He's a forecast wizard. He's got 18 wounds and a four up save. He doesn't have a melee attack. I refuse to believe it Uh, like obviously it's it is a thing, but yeah, okay. Sure mind bullets. Yeah, I'm buying bullets. Yeah He's a dead guy. He flies. He's a war master, but he only moves five inches Uh, he can attempt to cast through Skink wizards or oracles, which is the trogladon as we've mentioned many times So you can just like he's still casting but he can pick them as the point of origin So he kind of has his own built-in quote-unquote spell portal. Uh, just in the army Uh, he if he you still do the like if he takes wounds You roll 3d6 if the total of his wounds taken plus the 3d6 equals 20 or more He teleports back to base back to his ship, I guess and he's gone And he's another time phase too at the end of each phase. Yes, that is correct. Yeah Um, otherwise you just remove all the wounds from him and keep moving, right? Um, you get all three dice every four up is a bonus command point. He's a base plus two to cast Uh, to spell and unbind Okay, um, he does know all the spells as I mentioned this earlier on but I'll mention it again He does know all the spells from whichever lore you've aligned your army to Uh, so good. That is just so amazing Yep, uh, and He hit this like golden death mask rule is really interesting. This is sort of a I don't remember him having this exact rule before I didn't go. Look, maybe I just forgot He didn't need to he didn't know he had none of that Okay, I didn't think this existed. All right at the start of the combat phase You can pick one in a unit within 12 inches of this unit invisible to it and roll 2d6 The role is equal to a greater than he was bravery the strike last effect applies to that unit until the end of that phase um Perfectly good rule 2d6 against bravery generally sucks, but in this case, it's just a sheer pure bonus Uh, you're not obviously talking about him being in combat He's sitting behind a line of something else that's fighting and they're just getting tagged by this So it's just a little seasoning on your nachos Uh, so that's fine. Uh, all good with it. And then yes, he has celestial deliverance Base range of 12 inches, but of course that should be read as 18 slash even farther through an through an oracle or skink wizard or whatever and You get to pick three units and do d3 mortal wounds to him But you can cast this spell four times You can cast this spell four times made that stronger. It used to be on a seven than an eight than a nine. Yeah, it's just Seven It just I don't like I don't know on paper. I'm just saying for the first time I don't like that guys I mean because all that I'm saying is you're just going to do this four times nothing else With croak that it sounds like necessarily in star form. There's a lot of other good spells situation Like then I guess that's fair. Yeah, it's number statement Yeah, yeah, sure in combat's call stellar tempests Like you have some other good spells you may really want Yeah, I'm a little surprised they took away that. I mean that seemed very reasonable how it worked last time With a bump up and cast highly. I don't know just seemed a little weird I don't know why the one thing I'll say out the gate is that Like Jordan absolutely hates this as you should and just playing against it so much It's one of those things that it just takes so long. Okay, three units. Boom. Boom. Okay, roll the modern ones boom roll the modern ones roll them like it's one of those things that's like Even playing like playing it again. I just got just doing it. I'm like, oh my god. Yes. I remember this This is just ridiculous. Yeah, it's like. Yeah, I don't know playing the game much more like a couple years now Like do I love just doing this 12 times? I don't I don't know. I don't know the answer. Yeah, it's really strong. Yeah I mean, I think that is very much his sort of defined role Now there is a thing that everybody who's who's noting that I did not read That is not here on his rules anywhere, which is interesting This guy's 395 points, by the way, and he is a big dead frog glass cannon Because he does not have a word save Mm. No, he didn't on the last or uh Work scroll either. It was his run guard. You've got that. Mm. Yep You've got like either the guard needs to be there and and or you need the minor protection of the banner bear or nothing That's gonna save your butt, but it's at least it's a six up, right? But yeah Like yeah, the guard are so important to this guy because otherwise he just gets picked Like he just gets picked off Only other thing that changed too is that he lost the the command ability that the slan used to use to have an empowered version of the slan Which was d3 units got plus one save and fly Which is kind of sucks because that's actually really good That's kind of one of the reasons Slant like one of the nice things the slant have flight is yeah is great on a carno like on stuff like it's oh, yeah But he's got enough other stuff Yeah Yep And I think you say this guy just gets picked off You've got to bring enough weight to bear to make it where in that shooting phase that 3d6 roll Yeah, yeah, you need 11 on average to to make him die Otherwise all those ones are gone and you start over in a combat phase. Good luck. Yeah, sure with with guard present That is a very high bar clear 100% now with guard. It's even higher Yeah, without guard present there are plenty of things in this game that will do 11 wounds to a four up save No, like accounting again assuming this is just like a fat dead frog sitting by his lonesome, right? Yeah, like I A million shooting is like look out watch out for bliss barb archers I was that's exactly what I was thinking. I was like even with five guard like thinking about 55 bliss barb archers Like yeah, he's dead. Right. Like it's just Yeah, just darkening the skies, right Maybe I missed it But one thing I was surprised to not see a whole lot with this guy Over the years is what my buddy Dan called the crow crawl. I'm sure others have called the crow crawl But where it's not just five guard, right? But it's like 20 guard And yeah, you're just moving them in this and I played against that a number of times It was powerful like because you just can't It's a thing 15 garden croak throw them and throw them down the middle. Yeah, it's strong It'd be able to bring them back and that's like I was saying you could technically run three five Three fives of those guard run run them down the middle as you're taking wounds for croak The garter dine you allocate to each different unit. Yeah, and then you bring them all back to all three He would never just five star points. You just keep your strategies keep d3ing them all back to the all three units Yep, but is that overkill for so so that would be 390 plus 400 so 790 Plus the banner bearer so figure 9 30 is that package right because that guy's gonna be in the mix there too Plus you want another slot in there because you need the extra castings and everything else to get your summoning points That's like the theme of it. It's like all that stuff. There's not much damage to star born. It's like yeah is that Gotcha Yeah Yeah, you run up against like a corn army or something like that as we talked about earlier That's immune to your magic and they're just gonna be like, oh, yeah Let's go You know, it's none of us will die and we're just gonna press the red tide forward on you right like roll tide Uh, that's the end of that story okay Talk about the regular slon who is a galley champ in the current season. So Way to go buddy Best amount of wounds and that that that thing he's sitting on If you're in obr that chair is a mount If you're if you're in serif that chair not a mount Just it's just terrain. He's got with him. He's just like, oh, don't worry about that. I brought that with me. It's fine That's cool. That massive thing. Yeah, uh-huh. Yeah That distinction is very funny to me But anyways nine wounds four up save tripcaster. Again, he has melee attacks that don't matter who cares um, again, he can Channel through skink wizards and oracles. He can roll two dice and a fairy four up You get a bonus cp He does still have the gift of the heavens the thing you mentioned the commandability in your hero phase Where you get to pick a unit Serif on unit Until your next hero phase that unit can fly and gets plus one to save against missile weapon attacks. So Cool. Yeah, situationally cool. Love it. Yep uh, and then The masters of order he gets plus one to casting and he can oh, I sure I didn't mention it before But both of the frogs can still unbind and dispel anywhere on the field I didn't actually say that specifically but that is still a thing. Yeah A very very very important and powerful crazy thing Nice. What's uh, yeah, go ahead. I was just saying you do need to be able to see that stuff too Because that's how I came up before which I didn't realize until I remember I think jordan hid like this spikes warm hide in like behind the bushes one time and I was like sure I'm not buying that. Well, you can't see it. Can you like what that's a thing? Even though I can board wide unbind you have to be able to to see the Unstuff Yep. Yeah, not including arcane. What are we caping out at for Casting and unbinding. Well, I'm glad you asked that question because let me read his spell real quick. Okay His spell is called celestial equilibrium Uh, if successfully cast until the end of that phase add one to casting roles for friendly wizards other than the caster So like I mean too. Yes allies Yeah, this guy allies real good So the he can he can turn croak if you take the package of both of them He can push croak up to a default three and then yes, there's no way to get a plus one. So you can get to four with like four Okay, gotcha And then the four up ward against mortal spell is the last one, but it's Only for him if you need another spell It'd be cool. I don't know why they didn't just make that a four up ward in general I guess that's kind of strong, but It is it is but yeah, and it's only against mortal wounds is what's being said there and yeah, like it's fine I'm fine against the just mortal. I just wish it was just he could give it to a unit not just himself. Yeah Like he can't even give that to croak. He can't give that to anybody. It's just him Just yeah, he's he's always going to be casting his lower spell because the lower spells are amazing And he's pretty much depending on what you're running. He's usually going to be casting slash with equilibrium So then your ease they're going to be casting the third one's going to be an endless spell or mystic shield Depending on your wizard situation, but Yeah, to me this this guy his first cast is comics. So that croak isn't miscasting Yeah, or yeah, I did it with croak in my game because I'm just like I'm not No, this guy's plus two anyway because you've got the banner sitting there Yeah, so plus three instead of plus two. Yeah, it's not even trust in that All right Yeah, so he's 275 like he's really good for 275, right? I mean Same utility. Yeah, I think comments call office scroll hurts him a little bit. Like it doesn't hurt him But like that's where like in rena stars or like like that oan and like the guys were running We're gonna ally him into cities or like storm cast right where He kind of lost that now because that ability. That's so cool. But um, yeah, still definitely I think worth 275 Yep. Yeah now the storm cast come over here. Uh, okay The sores old blood on carnosaur 15 wounds four up save he has a lot of attacks the big jaws only three attacks though when they hit on fours They still do five damage um, he has his blood frenzy if he kills anything he gets plus one to wound for the with his, uh For his mount so like the the massive jaws and clawed forelimbs for the rest of the battle go to twos to wound He has terror a thing. We're just giving all monsters now. This is just the thing Uh And okay, cool. So no inspiring presence. Like we're just apparently handing this out like candy What was that show we talked about last week tyler mechanics? We are seeing too much of I think yeah We have another candidate for that show This one gets my crawl a lot less than most of them Sure Handing this out to candy like when it was a thing that like the big giants could do I was like, oh neat That's a cool unique thing. Yeah And now it's just like are you over two inches tall? You caused terror It can be just game breaking. Oh my god turning on inspiring presence is Huge is so good tune in the premium game tomorrow. It features this ability quite to do it to a good Good part. All right Very nice and then he he doesn't have the Jaw bite ability that we're gonna see on the rest of them instead He has ancient warlord where he can issue the same command of two times If he does so each command has to be received by a friendly seraphon unit No command point is spent the second time This issue this unit issues the command the correct way to do it. Thank you Very they do it backwards on his scroll. I think that he's an FAQ to go to the other way. Yeah, it's much better Good lord almighty. Okay. Yeah, I mean 285 how you rating this guy rich Yeah, um, I like him. I think he's I think he's good that now that they got two rend amazing I can't believe the atrocity that the karnosaur had one rend for that long Um, I there's no way to rear all ones anymore. So hitting on threes with all an attack is kind of rough But they're five damage each so It is what it is I really like that command ability and correct me if i'm wrong. Is it um, it's every time you do it, right? Like every time so you can do an all attack following turn do all defense twice Yeah for the second one. Yeah, so I really like that ability So I I I originally I was always on the old the scar vets because they used to be 215 Um, and they were just crazy good last edition And and when I first read this we'll get to it when we get to the scar vet war scroll I really loved maim and terror, but I'll wait and not very the lead on Why I thought it was better than it is. So I really like yeah, I like this guy. Yeah I agree And we talk about a spell that bumps rare end up on celestite weapons Yeah, he can get him five attacks 33. So it'd be minus two two damage. Yeah, okay Makes him a little more killy. Yeah Yeah, I like this guy at 285 carno carno bosses is pretty good He's he's pretty reasonable for the points the the big downside to him is the force to hit on the This guy and he only has three attack space. It is very easy for those jaws to just do nothing. Nothing. Yeah Big pile of nothing. Yeah, I don't think he's top that top-end competitive, but no no I like that they gave him some more wounds That was nice, but I liked it previously where in Gwaddle's claw there you could give him some more bite attacks, but Yeah, that's fine. It's fine. It's fine And so are we buffing him in other particular ways reliably you can spells etc Yeah, I do Given him the five of work from the star serial ability is really nice There's some other like small things you can kind of do to him But other than that no like not like uh, not like you used to be able to juice them up with plus one attack from Prime warbies from like all the different ways Yeah Yeah, it's basically just like you can take the artifact that gives him four bites instead of three. It's not a huge difference Right, right later realities for an extra rend plus one damage on heroes Yeah, you can dominate mind them to make a moan down toos Yeah, his ability does that too now when he kills a model he gets plus one to wound It used to yeah, I think it used to give him actually run in charge run in charge. Yeah, which I liked better Yeah, I think might be better because codles already gives you plus one to wound But a lot of the time when you are in stuck in like same with right we'll get to the old blood So I didn't talk to that. But yeah, yeah I like everything that force the hits brutal that having to spend a weekend playing with the go I'm trying to make him work on force to hit Yep, it's swinging The old blood on foot, uh, he is fine. Uh, he's 135 points for little seven wound three up save hero um He will uh He does the standard thing now where he pulls in source warriors or source guard into fight after he fights the standard foot melee hero thing That they do so that's fine um He has a buff for the all attack command if he issues all out attack to source warriors Um, they also add one to wound rolls for their melee weapons, which is quite potent So he's issuing all attack and giving him plus one to hit and plus one to wound Very relevant when we get to sorus that we need to remember this thing exists. That's that's like really the reason you're taking him Yeah When you're stuck in because codles already gives you the plus one to wound But if you're stuck in then it's nice because it's for the next combat. Yep And I do think sorus will often find themselves stuck in just like I don't think they're a break them on the charge Blow through them and keep going unit. It's just not it's not what's there Um tactic or two, which is solid And then fashion battle tactics rich. We yet what what's what's that serif on got him now, man I've been playing scaven for the last while and it's been terrible and it's like Back playing some serif on and I can do faction tactics. It's it's amazing. What's uh, what's now never heard of him Not sure what you're talking about. What's the what's the give me five seconds vencent? What's the What's the what's the what's the elevator pitch on has this taken five seconds for me to get this out? Yes Is it terrible or are they are they terrible? Are they good? Where are we tactics for tactics or for serif on? They're great. There's probably Okay Two really good ones two good ones and then two Kind of okay. All right. Yeah, so I'm gonna read that as three easy and three medium on our on our scale So Yes, well kasher. Do you concur? Yeah, yeah I mean, they're they're fine. They're not I wouldn't say easy easy, but easy ish Yeah, sure Okay, let's call it too easy and four medium. I'll be generous Okay, sure Fair enough. So we're just like dock levels. That's fine. Okay. No issue Uh Bingo card check. There it is. All right Uh, the ashlet banner bearer. He's 140. I could read the rest of the stuff But it doesn't matter you're gonna put this guy in every army. What do you do and stop? It should just like you read the first ability and then we can just stop. That's what the point of this all is Uh Add one to casting rolls for friendly serif on wizards within I just want to take a moment here to read words that aren't present Oh, I skipped over the mighty source jaws, by the way This is a thing we'll see repeatedly all the source now the way their bites work is Every this is just I'm just gonna not talk about this anymore because all the source do it All right, except for that first guy we read The end of after they fight it's not at the end of combat. It's after they fight You roll three dice per source guy who's within an inch of the enemy unit Every six up is a mortal wound If you're in coalesced every five up is a mortal wound because that's the plus one rule So that's where that comes back. Okay nice for the heroes and one one die if it's like source warriors or Yes, yes, exactly So So that's how that all works So with your sorus if you got 10 guys and all 10 guys are within an inch of an enemy You roll 10 dice every if you're in coalesce every five up is a mortal if you're in starboard every six up is a mortal. Okay, cool I'm bad And again, that's why I say it just like completely changes the evaluations Because the difference between doing a mortal on a five for 10 dudes and doing a mortal on a six for 10 dudes is so Massively wildly different. It's crazy. All right back to the astralith bear plus one to casting rolls for seraphon wizards within 12 inches of any friendly unit with this ability in addition Add six inches to the range of any spells cast by friendly seraphon wizards within Yeah, 12 inches of any friendly units with this ability Cool I'm glad that we just got off the holy train for these dudes. Don't have to worry about it. We're good Just tippy toe right that edge in everything's fine. No need to you got a little base little base rim touching that edge You're good, buddy. You're good Why why fiddle with it with seraphon? I just And and probably in their head they were like well, it's not units He's affecting and units are what we're trying to keep from daisy chaining out But in my mind, I'm just like well now that salon can be a lot Heck and farther away. That's what's in my mind like Yeah, so it's it's seraph. It's seraphine It's seraphon There you go Perfectly Crap How How did we not come to that? Oh my god ridge Jesus Two hours into the show and you drop this gold Yeah on just just incredible. Okay Yeah, he's amazing. So so there you go chow. There's your other plus one to cast and all of that And you don't even have to be holy with it. So sweet. No skin keyword. Love it. I'm I've got a list I've got I've got my army list going. We're doing good here boys. You're doing good Like I said start with this guy to figure out which are their 1860 points. That's it I got my I got my old blood and I'm going to go croaker slants. Let's keep going. Okay Well, we'll hold on because you might get excited about the scar veteran. Okay. Okay instead of the old blood All right. Okay. So our scar vets are other carno hero, obviously 15 wins still four up save Very similar ish attack profile Still has the big giant three attacks five damage jaw is yada yada Still has blood frenzy still has terror The relevant part to him is he doesn't have the double issue command traits instead. He has maim and terror Which is you can pick one enemy unit within one is this unit roll a number of dice equal to the number of wounds Allocated to that enemy unit for each five up That unit suffers one more wound So here's here's the bit. Let me explain to you what I read that as the first time I read it And I talked to my buddy my buddy basil who I talk a lot about serif on with So I thought when I first read that it's that you say I killed like 10 other source horrors, whatever I allocated 10 Wounds to that unit. I would get to roll 10 dice and five will be mortal wounds But it is per per model right so that each of those models would be worth two So it works against like heroes if I did 10 wounds to archion But if I killed five other source horrors or it did 10 wounds, you would only get to roll two because it's each model has two wounds Is that how you would interpret that as well? Is that how that works? Do you do any following events or do you know I'm I am I read it the way you did Honestly, the first way around like it's checking the way I read it was it's checking in the phase for how many wounds You allocated to the enemy unit you chose Yeah, so if you killed 12 clan rats Would you would it be 12? So here's how I read it you're rolling 12 To me Against clan rats you're never rolling any dice because at the end of the combat phase is when you're checking So you're checking then to see how many are allocated. Well, guess what they're one wound models So they're dead. You have nothing allocated to that unit We're on a hero that's five wounds and you did four you at the end of the phase you have four wounds allocated to it You're gonna roll four dice So against infantry models you're rolling nothing. This is just against heroes and monsters If you have three wounds and if there's two wounds to one of those three wounds then you would roll two dice Two dice because technically yeah Yeah, if you if you rolled up against cast orders and there was one guy with one wound on him You would roll one dice, but yeah, this really is designed to go against heroes and Uh And monsters the way I read it because you're checking at the end of the combat phase and that at the allocation point There no if they're dead they're gonna model our models. See I disagree. So let's write. Yeah I'm gonna reference core rules 14.1 allocating wounds Wounds are allocated to the models in a unit one wound at a time You can allocate the wounds caused to your units as you see fit However, once you have allocated a wound to a model You cannot allocate wounds to other models in the unit until that model is slain c 14 2 If a unit is destroyed all wounds that remain to be allocated to the unit are negated and have no effect So the point being is that it's actually the wounds you allocated Right, it's just your damage. Just the damage. It's just the damage you put on there Right because that's that's how you see that's where you see the slain verbiage coming into effect, right? So once the number of wounds allocated to a model equals its wound characteristic It's slain and you cannot allocate any more wounds to it a slain models remove a place He went to two after all of the wounds caused to its unit have been allocated and all attacks have been That inflicted damage on the unit have been resolved. Okay So that's that's to me that's saying how many did I do if I if I allocated 12 wounds to clan rats? Right then I roll 12 dice if I'm within one of that same unit because Which is a limitation. Oh, yes, as you can with any of those guys, you're going to be able to pull It's out of one like very easily, right? So, yeah I think I think very good, uh, needs an FAQ since three people interpreted it three different ways Sure. Sure. Yeah, I I would I think that this like this is one of those ones that because the weird menu It like it's probably using language. That's fine but, uh Froggam is with you. Let me just say that Froggam is saying I'm wrong here, right? Um, it's it's interesting because it's like it depends. I I want to be on the scarlet train But if it's that then I'm on the old blood train right so like To me This one says How many wounds did you do check into that and then he's the reason let me tell you Do you want to know why I think it works that way? Yeah Okay, ultimately is because I think this is using the weird minutiae of the rules I just read in a way. We're not normally familiar to it, right? Uh, but And so like I think in their mind when they wrote this they're saying like We're they were using the very precise allocating wounds Right, like how many go back and look how many wounds did you allocate as per 14 1 to the unit, right? Whereas we often use it in other rules that are where it's like how many wounds have been allocated to it Blah, right? And then that's okay. How many does it have left now, right? That's often how we're we're reading it in the way you're describing anthony, right? but The thing that really pushes me over the edge is as champions of the seraphon hosts scar veterans and they're especially Bloodthirsty mounts pursue the greatest enemy warriors falling on them with vicious brutality. It's like Okay, so they just want to see it be like bloodthirsty and stuff like that But maybe that text speaks to your thing Because it only works against heroes. Yeah, so maybe it's the other way around. I don't know The point is we've definitely come to the fact It's an FAQ if if we have all read this And and not been sure FAQ this thing Because I totally see the way you're reading it too. Anthony. I don't I can't look at that and go Oh, you're definitely wrong. No, no, no I'm usually terrible with this stuff too. So like that's where I talk to friends that are much better at this than me And or if I'm at a tournament, I would just be like, okay, that's to or To how's this work? You tell me and that's how we're gonna play it. Yeah, exactly What I'll say is I agree with you if this guy If this guy reads the way I'm reading it, right Then I like this guy very much so I would rather take this bonus damage thing Than the double command point thing for 30 cheaper If it only works against heroes, then Go the other direction the 285 Yeah, yep, I agree The only thing I wish this guy had a three up save with that big shield. He's holding. I don't understand why he doesn't The old blood on foot has the same exact shield and he's a three up save Well, he forgot to put the armor on the dinosaur. I guess that's what it is This this dinosaur isn't quite as old softer scales, anthony Well, no, no, no the other karnasaur is a four up save also But the old blood on foot who holds the shield because the old blood on karnasaur has the sun gauntlet. He gets a Misslet's app this guy's got a shield Oh, it's definitely soft underbelly. It's a soft underbelly situation T rex's have famously soft underbellies. There you go. There you go. Yeah, I love it Okay, you don't remember when they had to defeat the t-rex in Jurassic park and they did so by tickling him Oh, yeah You just like rolled over on back with his tiny arms Yeah, I can't get out. That's okay uh All right craig and craig are war spawned 185 for three their battle line kwadals claw or 175 for three for the regular craig are um ridge But you like to talk about what drives you crazy about this girl Yeah, just the absolute ridiculous rule where if a skink dies they can Use commands on on on the korg or war scroll. It's why like why do they need to have a stupid You know, this has to happen then this can happen only if one model dies from this to happen No, no, no The whole unit has to die whole skinky unit has to die. I thought it was just one of the skinks No, no add one to the attack characteristic of melee weapons. If any, uh, oh no, if any models in a friendly Yeah, yeah, so I've missed the model part. Okay. Yeah, I was like this horrible Even the model is so annoying. Why would they ever the greatest rule in this book? What are you talking about? Nope, I hate it so stupid and hate it the next one like why why can't they just be sick to explode? Why does it have to have 10 more models? I'm just like dumb dumb things like that. Just yep. I'm all I'm all in Okay, let's talk about these guys So first of all, they both have skink guidance. These guys are not elite and cannot issue commands to themselves. They're big dumb dummies but In a weird breaking of the normal rules and in reference back to when they used to be a combined unit where Kroger would you know, you'd have like two Kroger sitting in the middle of a skink block We all remember those days the Kroger just reaching over top Yep just chopping Uh, many many a time I went plowed into a skink unit lifted all the skinks and the Kroger just killed me um the The unit champions of skinks can issue commands to this unit if this unit's holy within 12 of the skink unit And then what you mentioned for the war spawned they get plus one to attack With their melee weapons if a model in a skink unit died in the same phase so like The enemy had to activate kill some skinks Then you activate and then you get the bonus and it had to be skinks near you You would need to like charge them in or be already in combat with them and then your opponent not know Like they if you told them that rule, which who is going to say? Oh, yeah, so I have this really ridiculous stupid rule that if you kill any skinks I will then I will get plus one attack then they're going to say okay cool I'm not going to kill those skinks then like right. Oh, you're they're going to die That will that way will be found to get them killed. I'm all in Yeah, Pocachro, send me send me some boxes You need some dead skinks. Yeah, he's just making them to die And then regular Kroger exactly have this ridiculous rule if the unmodified hit roll for an attack made with a drake bite mall Or moonstone hammer so there there are two weapons is six And the target unit has 10 or more models that attack scores two hits on the target instead of one But why they're they're trying to be cute They're trying to be the callback to the moonstone hammer It used to have everything within two or three or whatever So they're trying to just incorporate a rule like we get it cool But just like either make a better rule with hordes or just make that six is explode like correct Just make it six is explode. It's perfectly fine It's especially perfectly fine on units that hit on fours Yes Right like which is the big problem with these guys like obviously the one dude with a special weapon is gonna hit on threes In both in both units, but that your other two slash your other four depending Um, I guess slash your other eight if you wanted to go truly ham in koal's claw I don't I don't think that's a good plan, but I guess it is doable um Are like all hitting on fours now. I like that the war spawned our ren too I do appreciate that very much. It's there's not a it's a good source of rend too in this armor And These guys do make three bite rolls each like they do the three dice just like the sorus heroes Which is cool. The problem is if you're running them in a six pack Usually the back rank who can fight over the top of their brothers Aren't going to get to bite over the top of their brothers So that's not oh, you have to There's four wounds, aren't they too? Oh, so they Gv. I didn't even think about that It could they could run gv, but yeah, I don't I don't know about these guys. I don't know how I'm I this one of those units that it's like When I first read it I was like, okay, could be okay. And then I read it again I'm like, uh, I don't like it's that great and it's like you just try to find a way to use them But um, I don't know about you anthony. I'm not super hot on the I'm not I wish I like I looked at them and having played a bunch of Stormcast recently told them like they remind me of annihilators But the annihilators are much better in my opinion being one wound less and all that they can do for a very similar point cost I know it's two different armies and whatnot. These guys don't have a great delivery system to get them where they got to go Moving five inches. So you're gonna want that command trait. So it's I think a move in the hero phase them will begin and I'm just not feeling it with them like they're they're Or speed of haunchy, I think but either way. Yeah, there's a five inch move too. Yeah, should yeah, they're so slow I here's what I'll say with these guys. I'm definitely off the Kroger train like the regular Kroger I just don't think there's any value there. I think they're way too expensive for what you're getting like 12 wounds at 175 with a Neg one rend a damage profile. I just don't think passes muster um the the war spawned I I want to like Right, like I want so bad to try to like those guys And I I'm not ready to fully write them off. But man, do they not jump out at me? I'll say that like at best I'm going to be like, okay. You're a solid five and a half That's going to be when I come to if these models weren't like maybe the best model in the range Like we're absolutely stunning. They would not sell like any of these. I don't think No, I agree Yeah, I just they could just made them like this is just such an easy Or an easy like mess or a mess they made that could have been such an easy win if they were just a little bit better I mean even like the heavy-scaled skin if they made that minus one to wound just native because they're not not just a missile I'd be more like, okay. Okay. I could see this but on a four up save And like these guys are just getting pumped by so many things. I just yeah Well, you look at something like the ogreid pterodons over in slaves to darkness, right? And you're like, no, that's how you build a Which are not like the hottest pick in the world, but are still okay. If you look at them You're like, okay, these guys can at least do the dirty business, right? They're gonna get in there and go to work Right. Um, I look at these guys. I just don't see the same potential too many weird caveats I compared them to because I've been playing rat ogre is a bunch bin. So I know yeah compared to them It's like, oh my god, 140 points. I have six wound. Yeah for 280 Or these other Yeah, so yeah rat ogre is so much better. It's not even close. It's not even close Yeah, it's it's a shame that they like you said, they're probably the best model in the range and it's just terrible to never be on the table It's funny. I thought of the rat ogre comparison Just because like I don't know why it just didn't occur to me But my god, does that put it into relief like just talk about living in the shadow? Holy crap Uh, and again the model the model comparison. There is also a travesty. All right, let's keep going Um, okay our agrodon boys. These are the new the new cave Bye-bye, sorus knights. Hello, sorus agrodon writers Uh, so which is important to note. There are no more sorus knights. Those guys are gone. They are they are Era 404 no longer found in this book So we've got our eight wound mounted hero And our five wound Lancers who are 210 for three and go battle line if you're so if you have a sorus general Which is cool. I do agree with you that I think these guys have got gas in the tank Uh, we can kind of talk about these guys as one sort of thing because they both have very overlapping rules um Weapon wise, uh, they've got some perfectly reasonable choices Like you have the rend to spears with Uh, but then you know, you're going to with the lancers themselves You're going to four up to hit to get the rend to Right and with the main guy you're getting one less attack Uh They both have this weird tracking mechanism that you're gonna have to do Yes Which is like I hate this rule. Why again, why is this like this? Okay Tyler I'm gonna read you. Have you read this rule yet? Or is this your first time in county? Yeah, first time first time looking at it. Let's see. Let's give this back. Why are you looking at it right now? Why don't you read it out for us? This unit has a rage score that starts at zero I hate it already start of the battle At the end of each combat phase if this unit was within three inches of any enemy units Increase its rage score by one to maximum three At the end of each combat phase if this unit is not within three of each of any enemy units reset its rage score to zero God, this is long while this unit has a rage score of one or more add its rage score to the attack characteristic of its Rending bites and striking talents good lords the mounts attacks basically. Yeah. Yes Which are really good, but why do I have to I have to be stuck in combat for this to work I don't want to be stuck in combat. I want this thing to go in Blow up what it hits and then go on to the next thing, but no if I go in and kill what's there. I'm still at zero Yeah, correct. You you get better penalized. It's it's the classic penalized for too much success Yeah, if you kill the unit you get nothing It's counter a bit counter-intuitive to koto's claw as well because you want to be a you want to abc Always be charging because your plus one to wound. Yeah, but now you you want to be stuck in so it's a little bit Kind of both ways what means you need to run this scar vet on on the raptor too and you may want to run one of him for every pack of agridons Yeah I know I lie because you can only no matter how many of them you have you can only use his alpha roar once Yeah, yeah, so even there. I'm like damn it, man How many how many how many points is the uh, is the hero again? So the hero's 175 Yeah, so it's even that is like do you just run three more? It's that's always the question Do you run just three more agridon lancers or do you run the hero? So for the hero to be worth it You need to have I would think at least two units to get the plus one to your fury or two years of six I think yeah, because if you only are running one unit, then you don't want a hero You'd want another unit of So that's yeah, you don't have to try to do the math, but yeah, I don't really rate the alpha roar is my honest answer I agree with you. It's like the alpha roar is once per battle. You're gonna go to rage ones. They go to four attacks It's like, okay Giant alpha if you do like we were saying at the beginning you move every those two giant berks up plus your chrono swore plus this guy You alpha completely pop the roar. Yeah, but the roar is only for one unit. It's not for Yeah, I thought it was all the agridon units one friendly Uh, oh, no, I'm sorry. Yeah. Oh, yeah, unit totally within 18. No, you're right. I'm doing it. Yeah, you're right It is the only time I think because then it's like it's only 18, which is it's it's a decent range So if you are doing like a a big elf lift, there's not like a screening arm in it playing against it's Yeah, again, I should also note these guys which they don't have the stuck-in grind and mechanic of the bitey bitey jaws either no, um, that's like That that feels like a mechanic that you'd want to put on your get stuck in I want to keep fighting you and biting you Unit and yet they don't have it because we ran out of space in the war school writing this ridiculous primal rage rule Which could have just been plus one attack on the charge and it would have been like, okay, fine Yeah, that would that would have been great. Yeah Like rending bites and striking talents gains plus one attack on the charge and I would have been like, yeah, great Cool, fine A plus I'm happy with this bonus. It aligns with the sub faction. I wanted to play these guys in Like there's synergy there And and yeah, sure. I can't get plus three attacks anymore, but okay. I'll just take the one on the charge But then I have it Yeah, there is there is I think oh, there's a book tactic as well Vince. You'll love Um, but it's not great It's like I think if one of them are in combat with something if you Charge with another aggro on unit and end in combat then that's one of the tactics Nice, but it's like yeah, it's not that good, but it's like no no It's very funny I think it's a unit of three of these guys is 210. Yep You pay 170 for gorg runters Which have the same wounds the same save an inch more move Yep, okay. They hit they hit on instead of because if you run the neg two ren Spears they hit on fours where on your Gorg runters they hit on threes now these the the raptors there the mounts are going to do more damage Sure, there you're you're more Yeah, because you you have no damage But you have no damage punch on the on the even with your spears on the charge or anything like that. Yeah, right, right, but You know gorg runters at least do mortal wounds on the charge As well quicker though, right because there these are they're going to be minus one to damage as well Right? You know Yeah Yeah, I just I don't know I want to love them because I do like the models as well Um, I think this is probably the second best model Yeah, the the crocs who are I think this is the second best I just don't know. I think there's gas there, but I just I think over like these guys are going to be something that like people that don't normally place Seraphon or might not love all seraphon stuff. They're going to be like cool. I can just yeah have an army of these agrodon Let's go like that's that's let's do it. Hey, Tyler. Look at that. Boom. You got your you can have some kruyger You can have some agrodon lancers. You got your your source general here. You're ready to rock buddy Yeah That loved the all mounted army and you can do an all mounted army with these guys too Which is really nice two close friends that I literally like jordan and anthony You're trying to know you're both like, yeah, I want to run all the agrodon Play this Yeah, that's totally fine. Yeah. Yeah I in the end I I don't I'm I'm I'm higher on these guys than I am on Kruyger certainly But I'm still pretty middling on these guys. I think that they these guys possibly have some role I think I need to play them and feel how it how it actually goes before I could fully judge them Same Yeah, that's that's that's where I'm living with them. Okay. Yep Although to my dying breath. I will hate this stupid primal rage rule. I just I don't like it I don't like tracking it All right, how many what what abacus do I have that? I'm like, okay over here I've got my these points and these points and this is this thing going on. I'm just like, okay These colored dice and these colors. Yeah, exactly. These ones are the rage Yeah, just just make it up if they made a charge. You're good to go Exactly this BS. I don't need it. This is where a developer should have come in and been like, no, no, stop it bad Okay regular source warriors two wounds four up save 200 points four 10 they are battling One thing I should say that is really good both the agridon lancers and the sorus and the sorus guard all have this Which is they've got the good Musician which is plus one to run in charge. Yes. You love to see it Um, so that's fantastic Um, especially in an army that does have various and sundry teleports like for example Even assuming the fix for the get over here Teleport happens, right? So we're we're assuming they do the fix where it's like you got a drop nine away It's nice that you can pull them back and then they charge in on an eight or something like that Eight eight with the roll is yep. Yeah, not terrible. Yep So I love units with built-in one to run in charge. I just think it's like the It's so funny when the dumb command group has like the best Special rules. I just think they totally undervalue those sometimes like they it's it's as though we We kind of ignore this section of the scroll and look over here when I'm like, no, this is this is the action Right. Give me that plus one to run in charge Same and it's it's all over the place in this book with that and I'm perfectly fine with that even the plus one bravery Like they're eight stock like they're nine bravery. That's I love that. That's yeah Huge huge Yeah, uh And yeah classic classic classic serif on nonsense. Um, okay So and then with the source words before I go quickly the rule is unbelievable So that's what makes them actually really good as well. So they're plus one to save on objectives So you're giving mystic shield to a 20 or 30 block of these guys and they're plus two to save on You're pretty much always going to be pushing them on objectives So just that rule is what makes them really good. It's minus one damage You run the star seer, you know turn two you roll the two two ups They got a five up board if you do it at the top of the turn, you know for your top They're bottom of two then if they win prio, it's another turn there plus to save the five up board Is yeah, I guess once we get the the little list I made that essentially that's what the list is. So yeah, that's that's it These guys are such a wonderful grindy attrition unit. I really love them They can become incredibly tough because that it's not just if they're contesting an objective You might have said this I just missed it, but it's also when they're wholly within your territory That's yeah, I didn't yeah Yeah, so like which is incredible on some maps And some we may you mentioned realm stone cash less impressive there, but still um Getting out foot. Yeah. Yeah, exactly like yeah exactly like they're just such good bodies to stand in the way and just kind of grind it out Right, they can take the clubs to attacks each three threes neg one one. They can go to neg two rent from From the celestite blessing spell So like who's with all the tack and on the charge You put their amazing in gv right now. Like yeah Yep, um, they they all like in coalesce. They're neg one to be damaged. You mentioned the Like there's just so much in these guys favorite to just be like an incredible grindy attrition unit like this is Classic attrition anvil executed very well Love these guys the points are exactly where they should be like they are strong New models are awesome. So yeah, I think they hit this one other part with the source worries. Yep I've seen so many people complaining about them because of the points increase So like oh, they were one wound and you got 10 of them for 100 now There are two wounds and you get 10 of them for 200. I'm like, yeah, but you're missing the extra rules here that are Really good. Yeah, really really good. Yeah, really good Oh, I mean the fact that clubs have rent now too You don't have to go to the spear like and you can give them more rent and you can yeah Like there's a lot a lot more going on here that you're not looking at like they are They're nice and they all have the bitey bitey mortal wounds like we talked about earlier. Yep. Yep Um, sour scarred are 130 for five. They are also battle line. They are also Exists to keep frogs alive. That is their entire purpose. That is their point That is fine. Historically that was what they did in seraphon armies going back to like fourth edition That was what they did. So I see no issues here Um, three up save is nice. Yep, three up base save. Uh, and Ironically, I don't know why I have to keep saying this every week. I really don't so first off They can absorb wounds from friendly seraphon heroes. There aren't monsters So they they can it should be noted that they cannot bodyguard like your carno heroes or your skis ifon staggy or whatever But other heroes they didn't used to be able to so that is correct. It used to be just be slam Right, but now they can get all the heroes like your little foot guys and everybody like that Yep, uh, which is awesome And it's a may not a might and not a must which is cool We talked about that with a with the book last week where it was like there's no may to it They just auto transfers over and ward rolls and then you then that becomes the tactic hit the soft unit and just Explode the hero on the other side, right? Just like Yeah, right classic night honk tactic. Yeah, exactly whereas these guys is a may so you don't have to necessarily allocate over and uh My problem with this is when you allocate obviously the allocation for the bodyguard is instead of a word roll but Uh on a three plus that wound or mortal wood is allocated to this unit instead Which means when the banners around Which the banners always around these guys Yeah, it lives around these guys So yes, they can still get the six up ward or potentially the five up ward in certain circumstances And I just hate that I hate when I'm rolling a bodyguard Which is effectively a ward into a ward in half the books They write cannot be negated after the bodyguard and in half the books. They forget that text Please can we just make this consistent? I do not know why Two years into third edition. We're still dealing with this inconsistency. It blows my mind Like Not seraphine Yeah, like it's folks. It's so easy just Copy paste that text Why do you keep screwing this up? I don't understand I don't understand. Anyways, but it's fine. They're they're obviously useful It it gets back to the same story of the challenge every time The more you invest in the frogs the more the frogs you It's a circle, right Because the more you're investing in the frogs the more you invest in other things to get the full utility and protection out of the frogs And so you're always trying to balance that cost off of like how many source guard units do I have the banner bearer And all that kind of stuff and it chews up what did the rest of your army is Okay, cool tyler anything about that I'm writing my no skink list. Thank you very much right now So you guys five five guard. I'm a I'm a I'm a yeah. I'm a little busy right now Well, you're about to see a skink that you're gonna want Just one just one Keith I wish that Keith I wish that was the case But it doesn't because when you reallocate the wound you flip back in time again in the in the allocation process So it's it's not like that like you do still get if they don't put in that negate text That's why they put in the negate text on about half the books because they have allowed this this negation On the secondary unit. It's just dumb how inconsistent with that. They are yeah I wish you were correct, but the timing it's it's it's not working how you're describing I'll be right back. We'll keep rolling. You're good, buddy. All right skink star seer and the skink star priest are two little skinky boys Uh star seer is six wounds on a four up the star priest is five wounds on a five up The star seer is a hundred and fifty points um You know He has a little spell Tyler Yeah You excited about the skink star seer spell. Let me get you excited. You're ready. Okay. It's called celestial doom, tyler Yeah, it has a cast if I have seven in a range of 12 inches, which means a range of 18 inches You pick an enemy unit within range and physical to the caster until the end of your turn Ward rolls Cannot be made for models in the unit. I'm done. I'm out. I'm gonna I got better things to do. I mean You know emotional mental health is important. It's valued in society nowadays And this is why you want this one skink around Not really for that but for his other ability. I mean, yeah He's got a bunch of other good spells too, but just having this on the scroll is not a not a bad Silver bullet answer You want all of it? Yeah um He can also once a battle Uh Roll a number of dice equal to the current battle round if every two up you get to hand out a five up ward So so yes, please Very strong With um, yeah This dude's very strong for his two abilities. Oh, by the way, he is a double caster. I didn't mention that But that is very much worth mentioning that he is a two caster He's obviously a node. He's obviously, you know, then double has the chance to contribute to star points like Yeah, this dude's really strong He makes the cut Yeah, he makes the cut for shorts I mean, you could have stopped at double caster for 150 points and I would have been like, okay Well, I'm I'm thinking about putting this guy in a list, right? Like we could have just stopped there Yeah, and uh at the same time though, they were like, no, let's go farther. Let's get it more pushed Like this dude's absolutely a steal at 150. I agree. Stagnus maximus is exactly correct A lot of things that have wards and there seems to be more of this kind of coming out now and you see it in Soul Blight you see it. Really? I don't say Yeah, absolutely This is the first time I've read this ability. I'm surprised that you're so upset I love it was like they they wrote it with sig bald and then we thought that they just must never going to use it again That's so weird We got to do it one more time They ruin everything I hate I hate all of you It has to be a skink that has the spell as well The funny thing is Tyler, I first wrote this out in pen. Let me say I didn't say at the intro I wrote it out in a pen and then I was like, oh wait I got to do it backwards because once it goes to the camera it will need to read backwards So I redid it in marker so it bled through so I could do it From the backwards or working camera So thoughtful wrench so the I I mean I agree. This is one of those mechanics that are that are Way too repeated. But hey Yep, you're gonna see a lot of star seers around end of end of discussion right there. He's real good Um Ridge you're taking the star priest as well. How you feel about this guy? Absolutely. Yeah, he has he kept that same note the same rule So six is to wound do an additional mortal not Just a mortal an addition to to your wound roll. So he's still great. Uh, the minus one to hit spells awesome Um, I find that I'm either running him and the star seer Sometimes I'm choosing between the two if you want to give the six is to wound So it's good on the source wars. They got quite a few attacks Yeah, or or the uh, the snake persilidons got 20 attacks And then so I find it's decent on him and the uh, the raptidons also great Can absorb that like six to womb buff as well. Yeah, so yeah, he's good Where you used to see this guy always around a block of 30 skinks or four skinks or whatever now I find him pretty worthless In in most skinks, you know, the the raptidons are a different story But now source warriors are the way to go with them because they have the The number of attacks where you can really benefit from this which uh skinks lost I still really like because in combat they still do to now they're baked into attacks They used to be 15 plus models. They would get an extra right So that's where you had the 60 shots. It was much better to have that buff But right still in combat they're They're it's 60 attacks force and force so threes and force with six is to wound to an additional mortal They can still do a crazy amount of damage You're not going to get all 30 of them into range to attack usually Where with the shooting you could get all the dice in so now it's not I mean I skinks are still great for 1010 blockers and you could still do it, you know there and fish but Where you would always get all those attacks. Yeah, yep All right, so let's talk about the oracle mr. Tragladon boy Um, obviously this guy obviously one of his values is you know, he becomes a Spell portal effectively for your slot. I mean for lack of a better term, right? He also causes negative one to hit in a nine inch range around him He also heals d3 wounds. He's a single cast wizard 14 wounds. His damage is like Something that exists He's got a lot of forps to hit and that one rent so it's not something to write home about Yeah, but that's not what he's there for. Yeah, no one cares about any of it. Yeah, nope. Um Now Okay primordial mire Uh primordial mire is a spell that has a casting value of seven and a range of 12 inches So potentially 18 if successfully cast pick one objective or terrain feature within range and visible to the caster until your next hero phase Units within three inches of that objective or terrain feature Cannot run or retreat and must have the result of any charge rolls This spell has no effect on skink units and units that can fly Really good just a trigger tyler There's no effect on skink units. Like I don't know why they needed to add that but So that's a good spell Yeah, that's it's it's solid. Yeah against situationally. Very good. Yeah Yeah I mean, I think of like if you're playing on boards that have big terrain pieces or reasonable terrain them or just, you know being put Shutting off retreat is always very powerful. Having charges is silly powerful Um, but you know, like there's just there's just a lot going on there. So be good at nash con with the terrain there, right? Yeah, exactly Exactly Some big old pieces on that table And it's hard to work making big pieces that all that broadcast that aura out real big And you're just gonna have that your ass is a trogladon, but no, you're not playing but fun I got yeah, I won't be playing but if I was I would be having a trogladon Yeah, we did it's funny how this guy got so much better by the rule change to teleporting Yes, because this guy could always you could blast spells out from him But before it's he teleported at the end of movement. So you couldn't do it till turn two And while he could still take a beating, uh, you know He had 12 wounds on a four up and he did have the the healing It was just modus guy down and it it wouldn't matter. So you wouldn't take him. But now It's before any of that happens. He's out there. I mean, it's This guy's a real power player now Mentioned all the ways minus one to wound minus one to hit Yeah healing d3, you know, they bump them up to 14 wounds down, which is nice. I mean, yeah He can be a little node. He can be a little little mobile node all right Little skinkaroonies are baseline skinks whose weapon combinations I refuse to read or interpret or understand because it is too complicated All of them they get all essentially It's just it's just too much. I just why I know you could build them in certain ways That's that's wild in the kit. I don't care. Just please stop this Just make a thing that says skink shooting weapon and skink melee weapon For the love of all that is holy in the in the skies above us Yeah, they didn't need to the whole javelin thing too because the javelins have ren now So it's like eight inches, but it's I think it's eight inches What fours and fives or fives and fours fours and fives. Yeah fours and fives minus one one damage. So it's like I don't know. Yeah, I'm with you on that. Just make it just the just the bolt spitters and just the Yeah, all splinters clubs I bet you don't get your shield And again, we could just call it like weapons and they could just be assumed to have a shield and it's fine Like I would be okay with it. Just we kind of build them in some way. This is that's optimal skink build And then just just call it skink weapons. It's cool. Yeah I don't need this level of granularity. What is this 40k who has the plasma rifle? Okay, like I don't care Stop it Uh, all right Yeah, there you go. It could just be shield or shooting. Yeah another good way to take it. Willard. Absolutely Um 85 points for 10 of these guys. They are battle line, obviously and their special thing is if they receive the uh They're sorry every time they run or they receive redeploy command. They you get to roll two dice Oh, it's running too. That's right. Yeah Yep, it's run and that which is a nonbow with one of the earlier command traits You would never take that was like I think in star born where you can like run 2d6 with all your skink units So that would invalidate this because you can't Roll you have to you'd have to pick which effect takes precedent and so it's the 2d6 instead of the reroll to run Um, it doesn't matter that it's a nonbow. You're never going to take that command trait anyway So who gives a hot crap, but um, but it is I love I love that. I've never heard that before a nonbow I'm gonna use that Yes, the old nonbow So At any rate, yeah, they're good. I mean they're super annoying when combined with the multi redeploy obviously, especially since you get to roll two dice and And pick one. I mean, it's just like it just generally means you're often greatly Uh inconveniencing the enemy attacker. So sure. Yeah skinks are good We just talked about how you can still have some play there and stuff like that And yes, I just mentioned they are in base two attacks now with the club, which is cool Uh spawn of cho-tech our replacement for our old finally retired Uh razor duns and little flame spitters. Oh boy Pour one out pour one out for the sally. It's one of these to be one of my favorite Killed and done a lot of damage with those. Oh god. Those guys Oh, absolutely many many of many a board state was ruined by By teleporting salamanders over the history of age of sigmar first second and third edition Oh, yes, but now we're here. They've they've trotted off in the sunset all of my Uh, all of my My salamanders are now miraculously spawns of cho-tech. How did that happen? What a what a miraculous day this is um Because they still have three little sun acolyte dudes with them So it's it's still they still just can't keyword and all of that blah blah blah The bigger bigger base. Yep. It is. I'll have to rebase them Yeah Yeah, but other than that fine Um So when they shoot they choose either the globe or the stream The globe is one attack on forest twos neg 2d6 and if it hits it shuts off their Or sorry, it doesn't shut off. It gives them neg one to save the rest around and the stream is up to 10 attacks again max Like it's the number of models in the unit to a max of 10 on twos threes neg 2 1 damage So still really good rend on that again Another still solid source of neg 2 rend in the army 125 points still quite expensive, but But decent as far as goes it is the only artillery in the in the army It does still have the artillery keyword And it's one of those units that uh, the combat profile is actually solid as well. So it's one of those units that if if you teleport outside seven Pipe into something with 10 or more models then charge it then do another say, you know Six six six nine damage or something. It's I could see I haven't actually tried these yet I have I have one based and ready, but yeah, I could definitely see them being used Maybe running two just if you're going to do that try to get the neg one just to have a bit of redundancy instead of just Failing that four to hit. Yeah, obviously you could easily Feel that but I don't know. I think they're they're okay. Yeah Yeah, I was thinking running one doing trakothian tail teleported in let it Seven away let it shoot the uh, you know the 10 shots to do some damage and then charge it in Because it it does its combat profile is pretty pretty nice and they're 16 to summon. So it's like points per It's the 125 points. So yeah, it's like a little bit more. You're not getting as much bang for your buck But still I think they're yeah do damage Yeah, like they're good. I love that we still have a That we kind of took away some from the shooting, but they kept the really strong melee. So I'm kind of okay with it. It's like an interesting artillery piece that kind of wants to go get into melee So it's it's interesting where it's also then, you know, somewhat vulnerable. So What kind of what kind of combo can you guys think of combo plays with this glob of flame acid like take that idea of teleport and Uh, do some dance so the glob. Yeah Oh, that is that requires doing the four up to hit two. Yeah, that's that's that's not that reliable Okay, I'm just thinking of combo plays to get the the minus one save and then hit them with something else Yeah, I'm more thinking Clear out a chaff unit and then put this guy into a hero with his neg two three damage a piece Bites to try to kill this important hero Especially if you can set up the seven where it's basically like more or less an equidistant charge In both directions or something like that. That's that's obviously your your prime play there Or you don't finish the screen off and you can charge into the last He's on a decent little size base means on a decent cap base. I think he's on the the is he on the varinger or the 90 He's on the like 90 like the 90 or what are the 75 what are gorg renters on yeah the 90 I think yeah, yeah, he's on a gorg renter base Okay So yeah, he's I'm sure we'll see some people play around with him is what I'll say like I think this guy would be part of of several lists I mean neg one to save is neg one to save it's it is what it is, right? And it's yeah sometimes going to do things like absorb an all-out attack It might be worth it to risk it for the three up two up But as we all know single shooting attacks are famously the least reliable thing in all of aos history One it's pretty cheap though, too, right? So yeah, it's not yeah Yeah, that's what I'm saying. He's like I keep going like He's not an 80 point salamander. Let's say that Well, thank god for that. Yes I don't know the good old days. Yeah, I don't think he loves threes right This man didn't love anything more on season of war than his sally's just destroying parts Uh, just just uh, yeah, you were so happy just that tournaments all around buddy. Yeah. Yeah You're a bad man Okay Uh, cool So let's keep going uh wrapped it on hunters and chargers ridge why don't you like take us through these guys because these these guys work in a really interesting way and you mentioned sort of Liking them and kind of some of the setup. So so hit me with this Hit me with the these guys are a combo play in themselves They are and they they copied darin watson's nomad feast master units No, he actually had a rule because I remember I played them on the channel And I was read through the book and everything with it that yeah when one the shooting unit Shoots and hits it actually gives the buff to the the combat unit. So essentially the If they hit then they get the spear guys get plus one to hit when they're in combat So cute mechanic and then when you charge they makes the shooting unit actually like pop off their shots if they're working 12 But essentially the the wrap I think the wrapped it on spears are a little bit more what you're going to see that people use Because they get plus one damage um if they're on objective So three attacks from the spears three attacks from the guy below So they're going to be six attacks a model which is what I was saying before if you give them the six to wound You an additional mortal they're you could at soaking that buff up um The guys out the shooting ones. I'm not really sold on uh, yeah, I think it's two rend one damage So it's like but it's four it's fours and fours. I think so it's like what you know, I don't see you doing too much damage from that um The spear guys though. I could definitely see 150 points five Cav bases, you know going in and doing two damage on the one profile and one on the other They could could do some damage. So that's my like kind of Cole's notes. I think of the two But yeah, Anthony if you don't have any other Things I think I'll come but I I agree with you 100% like when you look at the I could see people wanting to run the the shooting unit to give the buff to the To the the chargers, but They're just for hundreds of points. It's rather another unit of chargers Exactly and Your two attacks fours and fours negative negative. Okay one damage. So I can do max, you know Is it working? I guess I guess you could do if you ran two units of the Bose if you charge the spears and both units of the bows would shoot Yeah, if it's worded. Yeah, as long as they're as long as they're both Within 12 within the range. Yeah within 12. Yeah, which is like There's still Yeah, yeah The any works in the other direction around right so it's They're they're looking they don't get to shoot every time one of the chargers chargers raised They're looking for any if they're checking for any of the chargers to be charged I think we'll probably once I get the 10 done I'm I don't I actually I don't know if they come with both of the weapon profiles But either way, I'll probably run a unit of each just to try it out like just for whatever for a game But I the list that I have right now with my starborn list runs you Ten of the chargers the chargers. Yeah, are there Are you guys are there other ways to buff these guys get synergy? I mean It seems like a like a great unit if you could really layer some things on them Like you used to be able to do the starless nights for example impacts the 10 big one is the You can give them the speed of honks you so the hero phase move tap 12 then they move 12 Obviously given in the six to wound skink buff six to wound additional mortal and then your threes and threes Minus what yeah minus one two damage if you're on an objective Objective all six to wound the immortals. I think I don't know But it's pretty good for yeah, it's generous just a toe in to get the damage to on an objective like Yeah, there's that's that's very easy Yeah, and you might want to run two fives. I don't know. I there's there's obviously pros and cons to run two fives Yeah, they are low bravery and fragile and as we mentioned they're like they're only bravery five They're on a five up save which I think is like these guys are pretty fragile and yeah That being said, they're also not a huge points investment as you mentioned, right? You're getting no it's ten wounds for 150 points. Not the best ratio. Not the worst ratio um but like If something gets ahold of these dudes They're gonna die. Yeah. Yeah, they will do damage though. They're little missiles. Like I yeah, um, yep Pump to try and move it more Yeah, I just wish the lances hit on threes as well instead of floors. Sure Yeah, the four base as always hurts, but you know, it's Yeah, it's rough. I mean my main complaint is I think I So to answer your thing ridge to me I'd always put the chargers in two fives just because like 10 of them I don't know what the other guys are doing Like these guys are just one inch range weapon with their little lances and you got a flower It's the same as when you're in 10 nights. You're flowering flowering each and then yeah, I mean like this is such an annoying Uh Thing to make to work. It's the 10 source nights with the buff. It was seven attacks from model And it was like they could do a lot of damage, but it just a little puppy paws. Yeah little flower petals everywhere Yeah, yeah No, okay Uh, I did put in the hunters of hwanchi hwinchi In here as well and uh, I didn't I didn't read these guys It's because I don't I don't read the work cry and and all this kind of stuff I'm just I only have so much brain space to absorb things. So are these guys any good? You can tell me They have a place for sure. So the the bowl is I really like they're 90 points deep strike unit In if you're playing a coalesced army, it's just it's just a Desicrate it's just a unit that you can can deep strike and it's not like Have to be turn one you can do a turn two turn three not turn four though because then they're dead Sure Yeah, that's the the bowl of ones. I like that just for that for 90 points and then the the chameleons They just seem to I think they're what 135 for five months. So yeah, they're yeah, they're a little expensive But it's it's 11 shots three threes No red one red one damage mortals on six is the hit which is cute I could see like summoning five of them to pop off kill a hero in combination with comment or something like things like that, but They're yeah other than that the biggest utility. I think is the deep strike for 90 points Okay, so use them just like the same way you'd use corvus cabal in s2d or something like that Where it's just like this is a cheap unit. Sure. It's got some range attacks fine. I don't care Whatever whatever the point of them is just to drop behind the line Get me backfield pred board presence get me desecrate their lands or whatever future battle tactics Are going to involve being in the enemy territory because it seems like there will always be something like that around And yeah, exactly and be annoying like it's it's it's actually really underrated Um having a unit that you put like in a back corner or like in somewhere and then it's like pay that units there Well now if you only have a one unit that's 300 points You have to dedicate that 300 point unit to go off into the corner to kill this stupid annoying thing Or it's going to come and grab like an objective or do something It's like that things like that are of of value as well But nope makes no sense rich just uh just a note you might tell jordan that it's bad support from ship to not point out to your Your opponent that your unit is supposed to be on the battlefield by round three It's you know, yeah, it's it's bad. You might just remind him of that. Yeah, I know I gave him a one that game I forgot to bring my bar guys down and those ones like game and then I was like, oh, it's turn five. Yeah These are 10 Yeah, gotta gotta watch that guy. Yep. Agreed Uh, the tarowings the little birds that come with the hundreds of wingy. They're 75 points for three. They fly Um miraculously they have the ability to screech and shut off potential commands that enemy units Can can issue or receive a quite potent ability on a 75 point complete trash throw away chaff unit But hey, why not crack it out and just start rolling some dice, I guess So, uh, that makes them a potentially interesting inclusion And then they can also go into reserve if you have the hundreds of I think these guys are just like your eight like them. Just if you have if you need a 75 point Unit and you only have 75 85 points, you know, this is just something you can throw just another unit that moves 12 is is is never the worst. They're not amazing. But yeah, they have a little place The bestill it on 12 wounds now still a five inch move or was he a four inch move before? I don't know. He was five He wasn't that slow. He wasn't like nergal slow. All right. I just remember this guy being slow and then two up safe, uh, so we can stop the all the nonsense and, uh We have the archer so tech and the solar engine choice The reason I have two different points values here is because it's only one scroll, but they are pointed separately So the solar engine is 265. The arc of so tech is 200 um The arc of so tech does mortal wounds on a six to hit and makes 20 attacks Yes, please Okay I am I crazy here that the melee one feels way better to me, especially given the new monstrous action It's a hundred percent better. You're correct. That's that's that's right there The it used to be 18 attacks bracketing and now it's just flat 20 attacks and they used to wound on I think sixes now It's fours and threes Right one damage. Hmm. Yeah And it's just to hit her mortals and it can charge in and then just like roll a die Basically and do that many mortals Yeah, that's a good point. Yeah Ranch in two inch. Yeah. Yeah Yeah, so they took the The solar engine and went oh you were really good because you could shoot twice. We're gonna take away shooting twice Completely reduce the number of shots you can get by a third And It's it's three attacks. I don't care if it's twos and threes on three attacks That means zero we're going through maybe one Right. Yeah, have you have you guys are in the math what what from what this used to be firing once? What's the you know, a pan like is it well you used to have you used to have nine attacks Line attack, okay, so it would have been nine attacks three if all attack Three or four if you're gonna double tap it you couldn't actually well No, you had this king freeze because hero phase plus one hit so what you would have threes and threes So six through and then four at minus one So four through minus one two damage And then now it's gonna be so twos you're gonna if you don't drop one then threes you're probably gonna drop one or two So yeah, I it's better before definitely with the tap Yeah, right against high armor Maybe not against the three upset probably not Yeah, I mean now you can't double tap it So yeah now he doesn't bracket which is nice and he's so he's always on a two upset But at that point like I'll just take the arc and walk him out there to sit on something and tie stuff up And then come come close and then we'll unleash all the Yeah 65 points cheaper for the arc of sotek. Yeah, right. Yeah, it's crazy All right. I the arc of sotek when it feels it feels like the points are almost backwards. It's it's so wild Like yeah, yeah, yeah, they lost the skinky word So you lose a minor bit of synergy but not a ton with some of the the things that are gone from this book But Now it's skink that is not a monster. So you even if you had the skink you were you're a monster. So you wouldn't get Exactly. Exactly. So yeah, he's fine. Yes age of something. We mentioned that taro wings are silly for a 75 point unit They're like aether wings, but with a ridiculous gambling like jackpot mechanic that you get to pull every time Okay, yeah, I'm I'm all in on the 200 point basti march him up the middle of set him on You're like go fight on an objective have a good time do a crap ton of mortal wounds Seems good to me And normal wounds probably again like if he gets into a low arm unit as you mentioned fours and threes is like wildly different than fours And sixes that is for sure. Yeah I'm 20 attacks and six is the wound to additional mortal. Yeah, it's yeah They're sweet Okay, so we got the pterodon chief the pterodon riders the ripper the ripper the ripper dipper dues and the ripper dipper do writers Uh, so the pterodon chief is 110 and his little boys are 120 for three The ripper dactyl chief is 110 and his little boys are 120 for three Okay, I read both of these guys and I didn't really feel like I Wanted to use them But I might be missing something as so so i'm gonna throw it back to both of you guys Rippers are okay pterodons Just because they have this like one trick that they can do and they're It's not that it's once per game So like they're just over costed to me for what they can do their movements They only think good about them rippers can actually do some work again Yeah, yeah, I would agree the pterodons. I think because having 16 inch move 120 is a bit expensive for three models They I think they were 90 at some point and they went up to like 105 or something Which they were okay because you run six of them And just the bombs like it could be good like you said earlier anything I think yeah, because I ran the the hero as well You just auto six him and then you yeah the one thing they did change on the pterodon Morse girl, which sucks is that it used to be any movement to drop the bombs Yeah, it was only normal move So you have to actually be already up there then hit the bombs with your movement You used to be able to do like say put the star seer there hit the 3d6 charge 3d6 charge the pterodons and then drop two up two up bombs None of that anymore. It's all it has to be the the normal move in the movement phase So pterodons are like kind of a big mess But yeah, like you said the rippers are actually can do some damage I I tried them the the first bad rep we did The block toads are solid because if you run multiple units of them each unit you run has a block toad So you get plus one to hit and wound against that certain unit So I tried their their force and three so the threes and twos Three attacks each so, you know, they can definitely kill a screen Um, 12 inch move you can hero phase move them. I think there's some utility there Um But I feel like they would be fighting for the spot that you're going to be having the raptodon Um lancers, so I think the ones just kind of do that role better for a 12 inch move than the rippers, but um Yeah, so that's kind of where my head's at with them No, I feel that If I was going to summon one and put one in my list I would put rippers in my list because that's the only way you're going to get the toads You don't get the toads if you summon and I would summon in raptors, but uh, they're only 10 to summon So like it is like a last ditch like they're they're going to do more damage than anything else You can summon for 10 points. So yeah, you know, you could possibly Yeah, summon 10 3 and do some damage, but What was the thing you guys were talking about more than seven away for a setup So the stave the space is the stave artifact this land So can you do that with with this unit? You could if you teleport them or summon them. Yes Okay, yeah starblown. Yeah starblown. Yeah Okay, yeah, I think maybe this unit, you know, it's kind of like a storm cast play potentially unit off the battlefields that you then more than seven away, you know like a Nihilator thunder strike play with the imperitent maybe something like that, but yeah, I didn't know if that works Yeah, it just doesn't feel like they've got the juice like that like a nihilators with grandmothers when you drop them in from seven It's like oh lord, they coming Right because I mean if they hit They're like the ultimate punishment for people who don't know how to set up screens Right like in comes six of those guys and out goes literally anything in the game, right? It's just That thing is now dead and then they all die Right Make it work it right Um, these guys just don't feel like they're achieving that same level. I mean, yeah, it's it's a good number of attacks Like you're not wrong three attacks on threes twos neg one two. It's not like that's a bad profile, right? You know really cheap and it's the same predicament with the hero. It's like, okay I can add one attack to all those or I can just have another unit of rippers Right, so that's the kind of the big there is one artifact actually Um that I almost ran on I was gonna run a ripper chief What was it? It was the I can't even think of it now, but it was like yeah, it was possibly gonna be decent But I don't know. I think you just run more more rippers Yeah, they they they felt like a pass to me. I agree like you're you're when I read this I was like I the chargers can't fly but I like the chargers or I like the charger hunter combo kind of better The versatility that's there. I like what it's doing a little more There's just my that was just my feeling on it. But again, I don't know if I was wrong. So I'll be interested to see how that lays out. There's some points differential there. That's not nothing So I just think I just think of smorgans with all of the ripper that goes on. Oh, yeah These are such smorgans units. Does he like does he like the new most? He doesn't I don't think he's played too much But I just know okay, he ran him when they were bounty hunters because you could Six three three three three three and they actually did a shit ton of damage So as I have two damage now, who knows maybe you run like just like a ton of units of three of them Everything's plus one hit moon because you'd have that many block toe tokens So who knows but Yeah, I don't I don't think they're gonna do the damage I was thinking like I know when it was a little more ton of this but pterodon rider 16 inch move That's crazy. Like that's the highest move you're gonna find in the game Didn't you guys say there was a spell to double like you can double unit hero phase move. Yeah, yeah So you do that, right? And then you do this deadly cargo having movement of an enemy unit and interior next hero phase I mean that's potentially a lot of utility now. I guess There's you're on a four up So you'd have to do the coordinated attack once we're about to start every move you make that a two up So that that's pretty interesting. It's still only 110 I don't know. Yeah, that distracts me as potentially high value utility unit that I could see potentially in some list for a place like that To be holy within 12 of them as well And like I was saying the only shitty part is that you have to do it as a movement So you Set that up and then the following turn you with priority you would need to then move over the unit. Yeah Okay Yep, how it's how it's triggered is now very very prescribed, right? So, you know By the way, 16 inch move highest in the game child. You acting like you ain't never seen a fox before. What's the matter with you? Oh, sure Yeah, I've removed them from my mind. They're their war scrolls are pretty bad right now. So that's fair That's fair. All right. Steg it on chief Uh So Steg it on chief It's got a mount. It's got a crew. It's got 14 wounds and a four up save Uh, this is a lot going on He's armed with a little war spear his crew has a bunch of javelins. There's so many people hanging out on this thing Just it's it's party time Uh, he's got his little armored crest start of combat phase. You can pick an immune within three that has up to five models You get plus one to save real still that's still a thing Once for turn you can issue a command to a friendly skink unit without a command point being spent You add three to the bravery characteristic of friendly skink units that do not have the stegadon keyword while they're around him Uh, you're love you're using the little sunfire throwers It's it does some mortal wounds. It's fine And after this unit finishes a charge move your old dice for each enemy unit within one inch this unit on two up They suffer d three mortal wounds Okay, huge buff two up now not three up. Ah, yeah, that is god that did annoy the crap out of me. You're not wrong That's so funny. Okay Um, I want to love this guy as I said, this is like my favorite little model in the army This guy is so overcosted They've still got him pointed like he had the rules from the last edition where he could actually do stuff Where you no longer breathe off the living, but jesus out of this dude Like I used to have to keep A track on a pee on my war on my like on my war scroll with like which attack profiles We're getting how many different bonus attacks because it'd be like, okay I'm getting three extra stomps and four extra bites and two extra stabs and you know, whatever And now Nope, all of it's gone. Yeah, all of that's gone And this is actually right. This dude's not a priest like that Doesn't give out plus one attack to skinks anymore. All the the good stuff is non monster skink units So this guy can't take any of that like Injury with the no longer having the cloak of feathers or the income coming back to life Into the actual director sees like they absolutely nuked all of the Yeah on engine stuff, but they left his points like he still had all that. Yeah. Yeah, this guy should be like 225 Uh, I'm not even sure I pay 225 is my honest answer for him. I really mean that like it's I mean, that's a line. Yeah That's it. We go to the battle on one. We're better off. Just get this one exists Yeah, I mean like this is look at what I feel like the godfather over here like look at what they did to my boy You know like this is I mean, this is a massacre like this is bad Oh, yeah, he went from like super stonks great unit to Bottom of the book for sure. Yep Like this is truly a complete whiff of a scroll and you know, tyler One of the things that bothers me is we're seeing this more and more with these kinds of like these types of monster units We saw last week with spg Right where we had so many whiffs on these monster type units where they're just like wildly Overvaluing the points like I don't know. I don't know what in their head Is making it equate to this Cost like the terror guys in zombie dragon right Like yeah, like the worst unit the worst like you always say one of the worst units in the game is a non hero monster Correct. Yeah. Yeah, like this guy's actually a hero. So hey sure fine Like there's some value there, but jeezal pizzas are not much this guy like he doesn't Do anything And that feels like a problem Yeah, you can't with them with them removing the priest's Keyword from him and the skink priest being gone and the star priest not being a priest There's no longer a priest in this army either Right, right, right. We didn't even say that but yeah, yeah, skink priest. Jesus the best unit ever 80 points best hero in the game I mean, I'm not pouring one out for that guy. He's he's good. He's dead. I'm glad he's dead Uh, yes, I killed him. He deserved to die. All right. So anyway, uh, the regular stagged on I mean like, okay sure look Even worse No for 300 point like too much This guy again does basically He is 300 points. Yes, it's 300. What? Yeah, this this dude should be 225. That's why I said 225 I'm pretty sure Battleline stags were 265 before they were I think that's right. Yeah. Yep. He went up 35 points Yeah for like an incredible diminishment in his capabilities. Yes. Oh my gosh I just didn't even once I saw all the stuff. I was like, okay, whatever I didn't even read much more into it. Yep The only thing about this guy that's worth mentioning is that he now counts as 10 models instead of five Because he has those little skinks on his back. Okay. It's got the ogre rule Yep, he's got that ogre rule or the they they did the same thing with the war party on top of the arachnid spiral spider who also counts as 10 Okay Hmm. This thing is straight terrible for 300 points like Admittedly, this is better than a terror geist for 300 points. So I'll give it that credit. Okay But only very minorly so like we're we're out of complete travesty And just into really bad Like we're still well below par Um, at least the terror guys can spike a six Right. Yeah. Yeah, exactly. Right. Yes. He could potentially like have some world where a six happened He did six mortal wounds and you'd be like, yay By crappy model did something how amazing Uh I don't know what this is. This is bad. This is so bad I feel bad for even like vince sticky because I know you run a lot of them But there's a lot of players that that just wanted to get cool stag. They've really promoted stag again Like thunder quake box like I kind of I had I think two and about one more but Yeah, I wasn't really going on that train hugely But so many people love that and then yeah, they I didn't kind of think about it too much But they kind of crushed a lot of people's dreams. I think with with the Truly my four stagodons are very sad right now. Let me tell you that like that is a Not great day for me when I flipped and read it as I was like, this is what is this? Yeah It's like these are war scrolls reflective of why a lot of folks get frustrated with the studio You know when they take they seem like the narrative is You'll often see these war scrolls that were popular And then a new book comes out and you get this Where it just feels like they've been completely negated and where I don't know that yeah Like this feels like such a sizable miss I'm I'm a little confused why but but we've seen that with some of these battle times some of these war scrolls Particularly monsters. Yeah, I wonder if they actually understood like they'd realize that all of those buffs went away Right, right. Oh, no, this is there was 300 points. That's how much it is Like they didn't realize that the only reason they were so good for that point is because you could juice them up to high heavens Yeah, we got to get a serif on player onto the play test team clearly or something because like yeah I mean these dudes used to have so much juice potential like the synergy was just off the charts and now it's Not done. There's nothing So Yeah, it's very frustrating. I predict easily Within a year these guys are 200 points. I'm just gonna put that number out now 200 no, I I think that you'll see 255 and that'll be I'm saying a year from now. They'll fall in every battle scroll that comes out between now and next year They're gonna get the reverse salamander treatment. Yeah, they'll go down by a third. Yes, exactly like the four times They'll go up 20 then up 20 then up 20 then up 20 and then still be worth it at that Right. Yeah, exactly. All right. Yeah, I mean they're just tragically overcosted I know I know we're going long But yeah, I really hope we spend some time because I have some impressions that I want to run by you guys This is fascinating because this is my first time kind of taking all of this in But anyway, we want to give some overall thoughts on this We only have a couple things left over that we're going to cover quickly here Um, ridge tell us about the engine of the gods and and why it's not It's better than a regular staggered on but still not a 300 point unit go for it Yeah, they made it they kind of killed it as well. They they changed the mechanic completely on it So it was amazing before because it was you could be a priest Obviously was one of the best parts about it and then you get used to get plus one to the prayers being near terrain So you could curse from on a three F which was amazing They completely got rid of of that and they changed the way the engine rolls So it used to be able to roll 2d6 then you add one if you're within 12 of a slant so you'd roll 3d6 Now they make it so that you either withhold a die and the the table just kind of goes up from Like depending on what you kind of roll there is one one actually decent one I think I think it's the the second one after one after the healing where you can do some mortals from range But you have to essentially To get a summon now you would need to withhold a die So then you would roll 3d6 and you would have to roll a 14 which is or 13 which is unlikely So you're waiting two turns essentially to have a 50 50 shot at getting 10 source orders Which is or 20 skanks, which is like But yeah, if you don't want to run through what those actual word the wording is on those but Yeah, what you're talking about there is starlight summons. So like the way this works exactly you're you're you're exactly right So if you in your shooting phase, you can say this unit either harness or reserve the power of its cosmic engine If you say that it will harness the power pick one of the effects below and generate a power core Power score, sorry by rolling 2d6 if you say that it will reserve the power Nothing happens, but you can roll one additional diet the next time this unit harness is the power of its cosmic engine What's fascinating to me? So that's the you basically do nothing Or you get to roll 3d6 every other turn and the way that works if you decline on the first turn then only on turn two and four Are you going to actually then end up Doing that right getting your good role because in turn two you roll the big roll you're you're going to Unleash whatever it's called but harness even if even if you do that though You may not roll the 10. Yeah roll whatever you need, right? Yeah, correct. Yep And so then the one you're referencing there is yeah is starlight summons on a power score of 2 to 12 This unit suffers three mortal wounds on a power score of 13 plus You can summon one source warriors unit of 10 models or one skank cohort unit of 20 models To the battlefield and add it to your army the summon unit must be set up Only within six of this unit and more than nine from all enemy units So you'd need to withhold two turns so that you would get 4d6 Which would be three and a half times to some 14 on average 14 Yeah 14 So then on average 50 50 just over 50 percent of the time you would get a summon But how bad does it feel bad is that if you save two turns of that and then roll an 11 on 46 or And you're paying 300 points to do it once per game and you're taking wounds because you're taking no more wounds Yeah, it's like a it's a joke. Yeah, no Like this is the ultimate like they really want you to go to vagus and roll that slot machine because it's like The funny part about it is We talked about the correction of the spell casting right of not making that choice of like Don't do your fun thing to do to do this other thing, right? And now we just built that mechanic right back in here to the engine of the gods Right don't roll to maybe get something in the future. It's like no What's the what's this the mortal wound one before that? I think it's the mortal wound is on a power score of two to ten you take d3 mortal wounds But on a power score of 11 plus 11 plus. Yeah, so you need to roll like Basically slightly above average on 3d6 like literally just slightly because it's 10 and a half is the actual and it's and it's just the mortals What it's the mortals of 3d6 or forks. What's I can't uh, oh, no, wait. Sorry. That's the I'm sorry Uh, no that I'm sorry. That's time slows. That's the strike first effect. I apologize You're talking about bolts of azure energy on a power score of two to eight It's you this unit suffers one mortal wound on a power score of nine plus to nine plus nine plus Yeah, pick one enemy unit within 24 inches and visible to it roll a number of dice equal to the power score For each four plus that enemy unit suffers one mortal wound. Okay, so 3d6 So you roll say an 11 or 12 so six mortal wounds to something in 24 inches That's the only one where I was like that could situationally be pretty spicy Right, that's the one you'd use in two and four like you'd hold one roll one hold one roll one done Exactly. Yep. Yeah, but are you really going to pay 300 points for that? No, no I mean if you want to use your engine because you just love them and and you know, I feel like that It could provide some utility sure. Yep Okay, uh now there are two realm shaper engines You didn't you didn't know that did you this terrain piece doubled itself it cloned So there it's still This is just one per the sub faction you take when I said it really feels like two different armies I got to this part at the end of the book and I was like wow, okay We're going all in on this this breakdown So the starborn one in your hero phase if there are any friendly seraphon wizards within three inches of this Train feature you can pick one of the train feature on the battlefield roll a dice For each enemy unit within three of that train feature add two blah blah blah and it does the mortal wounds thing Same thing, but now you can't go in this the realm shaper anymore. It's it's uh, not garrisonable So you just gotta deal with them three which is actually better No doors anymore on that stone thing you have to you only crawl up on top and stand there Or stand next to it But you can't actually crawl up on top because it's impossible. Um, but you know narratively There's a guy standing on top of it. I'm sure. Yeah Uh, and then the coalesced one is add one to bite rolls for coalesce or some coalesce Croyger units that are using the mighty sorus jaws Sorus jaws are vice like jaws ability if they are wholly within 12 the strain feature In addition use the top row on the damage tables of coalesce monster Who are wholly within 12 inch of the strain feature regardless of how many they're suffered Now, obviously that's quite potent. We mentioned that in regular coalesce you're getting plus one of the bite rolls already This moves your bite roll to a four up Obviously have to be fighting quite close to the realm shaper to get this to trigger but I mean that does suddenly cause a Now we're just into like wild Uh, after you fight mortal wounds territory. Yeah, right? Yeah, the game like I was saying the game that's coming up tomorrow That that came up and fighting on top rack it with the with the karnosaur like that's always cool or you know It's it's in there are certain battle plans that are half, you know Half way up that are would are good for that as well like uh, how many position of the power or you know That could be good. How many rolls are you getting for the karno with the bites? Uh, so it's not there's no there's no bites for that. It's it's more he fights at top racket Is that uh, I see but for swarriors or anything like that you're yeah You're gonna get a model one for model on forums within one inch. So you can get 10. I'm sorry. Yep. Yep It's effectively it turns you from like again you go from one or two mortal wounds to three or four To like five, you know pretty reliably pushing six kind of easily that kind of stuff I find the bites are just more of one of those things like it just gets that last wound on something Or like, you know, you're like, oh, yeah, I got my three four bites. It's like, oh, I need to get one five up Boom, you get it. Boom. Yeah, then you know those types of moments happen. Right. Right. Absolutely Okay, let's talk about some lists. Both of you provided me with a list Thank you very much and this will give us a chance to close out the show and talk about that So first up we have the star born list Uh, so Anthony, I think this one's yours, right? Yeah, I mean, it's your your classic, uh croak bomb essentially through the uh Through the oracle just teleport the oracle out He's gonna hang out there and uh, then you're literally just gonna explode Spells through him I find you're gonna want cogs out because miscasting would be horrible. You've got the The obligatory banner in there because you want the plus one and the extra six inches I've also got shackles in there because If you've got an oracle out there and you've got cast putting shackles right in someone's line That keeps him from getting charged as well So he keeps him a little more reliable because now he can't be charged And he can heal up from from some shooting Uh, I put a spawn of choech in there just uh for fun, but uh In all honesty, uh, there's still you know points left So I'd probably drop one of those unit of skinks and put a unit of five guard in there And maybe then make it 10 guard even Depending on how saucy I I felt But I I put the the the spawn in there just because I wanted to try out the uh Telepter Trigothian tail bringing him in at the end of movement Seven inches away Shooting to clear out some some screen or something and then going in and using his his melee Combats, so it's a lot of moral wound damage between croak and the regular slon with uh commas qual stellar tempest these things The shackles is cheeky. I like that. I didn't actually even think of that Yeah, I'm throwing that through the shrug right immediately into the opponent's army like so he does they can't charge your shrug Yeah, yeah, you can't charge within six and it's three bases, right? So it's a seven. I think two shackles is uh seven So it's falling on an eight. That's actually yeah seven. I think it is. Yeah, uh, it's either a six or seven I don't know my phone by me. Um, I'm looking it up right now for you. I've got it right here Like Knackles is a Seven to cast. Yeah. Oh, okay. That is interesting. Yep. Mm-hmm Easy harder to dispel Yeah, that's that's and yeah, you get like you said you could easily you still got 80 points left So there's still some play at the end here of exactly what you'd want to do, right? Um, if you wanted the guard You could drop a unit of skinks get the guard you still have your battle filled and there's them If you don't care and you want to risk it for the biscuit You could always throw in like the three pack of tarot wings or whatever Um, so that way you've got that little ability to shut off the ability to inspire or to to To shut off commands being issued right which is very fun because if you're going to be blasting around a lot of mortal wounds Hey suck inspiring presence I guess on that unit that you really want to now just crack under the bravery losses of mortal wound splash From Comet's call and a bunch of repeated celestial deliverance and so on and so forth Um, yeah, I think that like you're saying the the guard just in case you get the you know Just having no guard is like this in case you get shot by Any whatever range. Yeah, but this is pretty it's pretty close to what uh, you'd usually see with the like the trog bombless At least the one right scene so yeah, and then Notably here you're generating what one two three four five six Star points base then plus like just base for the six people existing Uh, no, there's only five of them right one two three four five Well, and then the oh no the realm shape or engine is a node but doesn't generate. Yeah, right Yeah, so you start with five pro gives you four more if he he casts all Right, so now you're at nine. Yeah The uh, uh, troglon is a one cast now you're at 10 The star seer is a two cast So now you're at 12 The slon gets two for each Because of his command rate. So now you're 18 if if you all max out Yeah, turn one, which means everything turn when you go to 18. Yes, which means if you max out after you croak bomb You can then still trog bomb with the 15 Star power point turn one and you're doing that off of the troglon because he's a node So everybody within 12 of him is going to take X amount of mortal wounds more like it's definitely an alpha That's what you're going to see a lot of if if those types this similar types of things are going to be happy for sure So if you don't have mortal wound protection and you're haven't seen this yet That's something you're going to you're going to see 100 percent This is going to be the filth that you're going to see but now again minus you're probably not going to see A spawn of chotech. You're probably going to see five two units of Of five dart in there. Maybe maybe five raptodons or something. I know the one. Yeah, that's what I was saying It's pretty similar. I just have the five or 10. Yeah, and you may not even see a bestelodon in there. You may see Uh, other things instead. I like the bestelodon for walking out. He gives you some protection some more presence too Drake Dractail. He's amazing to him coming in from seven is great It's a pin piece right you pin. Yeah, you throw the bestelodon in the troggs right there Their turn they have to deal with the two up save bestelodon Plus a trogg in their face and again, that's making them minus one to hit Yeah, and again if shackles are there they can't charge you Yeah, I can't charge them six in so you can't charge them either, but I don't need to charge Right. You weren't wasn't planning on it Filling right here, bud Thanks for playing If you want to see the I saw the bestelodon that what you guys just talked about on saga of dice saga of dice that is recent release about Rep they did that. It was it was pretty interesting. Oh, yeah Yeah Yeah, so this should be You know reminiscent of the old croakless that we used to play back Yeah, uh in a day where he just goes hand Set up and your your three drop look just Yeah Drop onto their line in with effects that they more or less can't stop Generate a bunch of uh star points you even if you miss three of them You still hit the magic number and then do like 50 mortal wounds to their army In turn, maybe maybe 50 60 depending on how they set up like how how how how tight was there? Did their setup zone have to be are you playing uh realm stone cash? Well, I'm sorry your army's dead because you had nowhere else to go There was nowhere to hide. I hope you're playing like something with an l-shaped deployment that you could go hide Are they taking or or jobs? Yeah, exactly. Exactly. Yeah Yeah, this this will be a feel bad for for some players for sure But you will definitely see this on the top end. The problem is that seraphon It's like one of these lists that it's like I don't want to go too much on too much about it But it's those mid tier to bottom armies that are going to be affected by this really bad We are still going to be getting hammered by shit like this. Whereas yes Corn ko lumeneth armies that they're going to struggle with this doesn't really help against them. Right, right? It's it's yep. Yeah, corn's going to look at this and be like, hey, let's go man. I'm ready for some Tithe. Let's do us. Yeah, let's get cast and yeah. Yeah Yeah, it's it's lists like this vents that bring up what we've been talking about we want to do a show on this Like it could just be recency bias, but I'm really feeling this rock paper scissors nature This kind of you know extremans nature of so many lists and game experiences that I've been having where it's like God, that's a level of damage output that feels Out you know unusual relative to what I've experienced for eight years and and this list just leans into that Yeah, where it's going to give potentially Terrible experiences. I think to your your casual player like your the majority of your player base I do honestly hope that they do like I don't I'm more of a fan of not running the trog but obviously that's insane I'd hope that they do something Yeah, even the seraph on you point a bit like it's broke needs to go up on points There's no two ways about it the trog because of the utility you have with him He probably even though I don't want to see him go because I'd like to see him used finally He probably could stand to go up a little bit and Uh, you know, I mean you compare what the skank oracle on trog at 270 brings to your army versus what any of the stagodons of the God And it's like comical Oh a comical comparison it's Good, you know, no you go you take it you take him out of starborn. They'll put him in coalesce. Sure. He is He's not worth 170 in coalesce for the most part because he just doesn't good. He is still He doesn't have the crazy value though. Yeah, I mean he's he's might as one damage So that's the minus one hit my argument would be in coalesce. He's like probably pretty fairly pointed Like maybe a little high, but it's not bad. Yeah, I'm him down the middle of first turn if he's just Yeah, I'm to the middle of the book. Couldn't she just hero phase move him? Does coalesce have the ability to do that? Not it's non monster non monster. Oh, okay. Yeah Thought about it. Yeah. Yeah. I was thinking the same thing. No, non monster. Yeah, I'm just saying we all want to They were this part. They were clever at least thank goodness. Okay. Yeah Uh ridge, let's hit. So you you gave us a little taste on the other side Uh on a little coalesced coattles claw So hit us up with this. What's what's the list here? I'm I'm uh more I'm a fair player now. I wanted to play fair man's army play on some fair war hammer Yep, none of this crazy mortal wound stuff. No, I just went with the coattles call list This is it's pretty similar to what I was I've been mentioning a few times that I played uh on the the green room game That's gonna come out Uh, there's a few different things that I can possibly change So I originally I was going to run 30 source warriors 20 source warriors 10 skinks Um, but then I took out to 2020 and then the snake was still on just because I think he's yeah like we've been talking about He's just so much utility. So with the karnasaur as well. So it's the karnasaur, uh, the old blood karnasaur primor beast for the extra jaw attack, um, and then I didn't give him the blade realities because I went with the uh It's the grubbs artifact any extra spell just because this land spell is so good with the power cell site I want the grubbs So that's a grubb. So you re-roll one cast Oh, right. Yeah, like master magic effectively So so good for unbonding But as well if you don't get the power cell site or the teleport spell, so Again, this is obviously gonna get FAQed. So right now it's it's super strong being able to pick up that 30 or 20 Source warriors and put them wherever which I don't even think I would never play that like with someone Like in a tournament even like that just seems silly. So even but if after it's FAQed I think it still has some play the plus one to charge after you teleport them But the main thing this list does is just it's minus one damage. I've talked about it earlier the source warriors are Plus one save on the a point. So you pretty much missed a shield one of the blocks plus one save throw them on to Uh an objective and then the other one you can kind of use to do some damage The karnasaur can do some damage here and there Um and then the star seer gives a five up board usually in turn two if you're not in combat by turn two You do it in turn three and you can do three units. So Yeah, it's I don't think it's amazing, but it's like, uh, it's more of like a It can be good into certain matchups. I think Is what I'll say This does seem very fair It is fair. It's it's Very honest five All the source words move five you kind of go up and you have your two squads. It's more of like a brawler style of list Where you want to play for like say two objectives of the three or you're going to have a majority of your army Fighting on in like one area where you're just going to control two objectives. Like you're not right. Yeah Is this the one I think I have do I have the haunchy unit in there? So No, no, you got the three tear wings in there Okay, so that I think that was because of points So they're just like a unit off on the side that you can kind of throw and at that like single objective Right, but if you oh, that's right because the old blood When it's the other one, yeah From the old blood of the scar vet then you went into space Yeah, the one to the five haunchy to come down and then as well if you don't want to run that You could even take the tear wings out and run Jaws, which is what I did in that game because Jaws is so just so strong but Yeah, I probably won't play it too much to be honest, but it's like I just wanted to do a coalesce list and I feel like it's You know what this list needs but You know with the since you can already reduce damage by one this list just needs a way to Effectively bring back sores warriors without rally like it either needs a four up rally on sores warriors or we need like Super All right, what is it? Get out Right, you can remove from room. Let me tell you what Uh, I was happy to not see that in this book. I mean, I know absolutely best best thing that we didn't see reused in this was a four Yeah, absolutely Absolutely agreed Okay Well gentlemen, we did it. We got through it pretty reasonable. We stayed to it rich anthony. Thank you so much gentlemen absolute pleasure Uh Yeah, absolutely a lot of interesting stuff here. It'd be interesting to see how this shakes out I do think this will be a very strong book I think you see a lot of people run the mortal loon bomby thing just to try it out But I also think that's a blank strategy against some armies So it's gonna be it's gonna be interesting times ahead over the next two months We'll see how it all happens for all of you out there though Hey, we know what happens next you hit the like button or subscribe or do all those fun things It's so easy. Just click click all those little things that make all those little dings Thank you so much. We really appreciate you watching Uh, if you want to support the channel, there's lots of ways you can do it Don't forget to share this with your friends stuff like that You can also join the patreon down below. That's about hobby folks. It's about taking your next step on your hobby journey So but whatever you do, we really appreciate you watching. Thanks so much Ridge and anthony, thank you so much all of you out there Uh always appreciated and as always We'll see you next wednesday