 Good afternoon and welcome back to the touchline on Y25 for my name is Maxwell Waseek, we are going to speak about state of Kenyan football, international football as well as at Y25, we are going to start at what is happening back home but before then I am lucky to be hosting two gentlemen rolling behind a team that got thrashed last weekend on Sunday, 7 nil drabbing and someone was wishing me happy 7th day adventist and good to have Ken and Eric, Eric good to see you, how are you doing? I am doing well, the last statement was unnecessary. How is the feeling getting thrashed 7 nil man, you know that is something that has not happened to your team some time back, several years down the line. Ya you run away from the social media for quite some time I think 2-3 days and then on the street everybody is telling you what is the day today, I think the next day was 7th. So Leonia Sita, Sabah Nikesho, it was not easy, it was a week and everybody you meet on the street ask you how many days are there in a week, so you have to say 7 or the same number of goals you received so I think we got over it and we won. Ya Ken I think Kenyans are too forgetful and events get overshadowed by others, I am sure in the next few so weeks Kenyans would have forgotten about 7 nil drabbing of United by Liverpool. But you know there is something you guys used to be proud of 8-2 thrashing of Arsenal and 7 nil trounzing of Roma in UEFA Champions League, now you are past heroic exploits are getting overshadowed by whatever happened last weekend. I think if you look at those two results at the end of those competitions United, Liverpool won 7 nil and they won't win anything this season. No one will forget, obviously no one will forget but I am still confident in the United team because they have come for, they are 3rd in the Premier League, they are still in 3 other competitions with the possibility of winning the Europa League and the FA Cup. I am still confident in the team, it happened, it grounded the fans because we were in 7-7 dail. You were in high spirits. Dail now it grounded us and we saw where the team is but there is still improvement needed, there are still I think 2 big players needed but you know the trajectory Riktenhaga has taken this season, the team is in good hands. But it was nice to see him making a stylish comeback in the midweek in Europe and he is beating Real Betis 4-1. That was a statement too. And he hit a lot of praise on Bruno Fernandez, who got to be criticized over the weekend. I think over the weekend he was played out of position. If you look at against Liverpool when he started his red on the flank, that is not his best position. He does not have that pace. He wants to be involved in each and everything that goes around. So he is better off either behind the strikers or right at the heart of the midfield. And you saw in the midweek march he was brought back to his favorite position and you saw the damage he created. He was able to create hard work for Real Betis. And that tells you Maxwell a lot about the coach that the kind of person Tenghaga is. He is able to rally behind, to rally the team and say look here, we forget that's gone. We have to give an answer, we have to give a feedback. And I think after 4 gods I saw him referring, telling his players I still need 3 more. So he really wanted to give the fans something to celebrate. When he was at 4-1? He was at 4-1, he kept on gesturing 3-3. He wanted now the 7 he had considered over the weekend to have a kind of a revenge. And that tells you the mental strength that he has been able to put in this team. You can come from 3 days after you've lost 7 nil. You come and win 4-1 at the quarterfinals or at the knockout stages of a Europa League. That's not a main achievement. And Ken, that is something we really get back home. Kenyan football never draws that attention European football does when it comes to headlines. If it was Gormaya playing against Bidko and probably the newcomers in the local top tier are getting between 7 nil. Probably that attention wouldn't have been mouthwatering like what was witnessed when United got beaten by Liverpool. Back home we're not following top flight as we supposed to do. Ya I think it's lack of visibility on TV. It's a huge reason for that because not everyone actually goes to the stage in this country. It's mostly just the W or A.C. Lopez or Gormaya matches even though some teams actually play within their communities. 3 teams like Bandari, they play in Mombasa but still they don't get that visibility. A lot of people watching them. And also the players here are not superstars. Because when you tune in to watch a Liverpool vs. Magneto game you're not only tuning in because it's Magneto vs. Liverpool. You have Rashford there, you have Varan, Walca, Puynaz, Salah, big big big players. So you also want to see that. We haven't been that great in advertising our players because if you think of the number of players who would attract new fans to the sport here in the local scene, you can hardly name five. That's a key reason why we cannot get the same visibility and the same passion people put into the European sport. So 7 nil for Man United and whichever result across the world I don't think anyone wants to see. As long as it's Man United beaten, I know the whole world. Even if the team you are playing for loses 7 nil, you'll be like Manil Tokaji. So Eriko, like locally I'm running behind the slambos of Mother United 2008 Kenya Premier League champions. But despite being a scribe and I would have to confess the truth. I rarely attend their games because I'm supposed to cover them, write stories and also enjoy their games because I'm their supporter. But it's something I rarely do. So what do we do? Is it value for your money? Ken said because someone would argue that going at a bar to consume some fruit liquids in exchange of catching a Premier League game overseas compared to going at a national stadium to watch FC Leipards against Atlanta playing, let's say 500 book. Ati, they won't get value for them. I think one me in my personal opinion three things, one quality. Look at that team we've talked about Mother United. It used to have the likes of Simon Molama, Titus Molama. These are people who could play some beautiful football. Almost everyone who's conquered in Kenyan football scene started that. You see, from an early age it was put into them, knock the ball around, enjoy. That one you rarely find in Kenyan football. We have only a few teams who can be able to do that. That's the first problem because somebody will think why should I go and get mediocre. Secondly, organization from the organizers. Have you ever tried to get a ticket to go to the game? It's a hassle getting the ticket itself, it's a hassle. And then thirdly, as Ken has said, has put it rightly, publicity. You see, the Premier League is advertised all over. Everybody talks about the Premier League and it has overshadowed the other leagues, even the Bundesliga and such kind of thing because of publicity. Publicity will bring sponsors on board. Sponsors will bring money on board and money will be pumped into teams. So players will be paid well, players will be looked into. So we find that the Kenyan Premier League, the main problem is overshadowed by side shows that are not really important because we've refused to focus on what is really important. We improve the quality of the game. We improve the quality of management of that. Because I remember there was a time we used to go floodlights to watch those games at night. Mazen memba. Pa le nyayo kasa. Pa le nyayo, instead of getting caught in traffic, you go and catch a game. You see, and we used to have double headers. A game, you have a game that sets around five, another one will set around eight. So by the time, you see, traffic is done. You can drive home. You see, what if we have such kind of arrangements? Even you look at in Europe, they have those games that are played at night. Where by now everybody has leaves work, you go and catch those games. So I think that is what is also lacking in the Kenyan Premier League. And if they can improve on that, I believe Kenya is one of the countries that loves football. Football is loved. And that's why most Kenyans will have allegiance towards international teams. The likes of Arsenal, the likes of Manchester United. Because they want, they have failed to get that home. So and get it somewhere else. That's why you prefer to get into a bar or a social place to catch a game. Look at the hulabalu behind international games. You'd find that even us as now in the media, I think we should bring a lot of hype about Kenyan football. We need to publicize it. We need to publicize it. Because today if you say on your social media pages, we are going to Nyaya to catch a game. There are people you will influence online. Which game is this? So they start following. But you will find that us will say, man, you know how happy Arsenal and social place. People will flock there. So if you go to Gondogu Piazna at Coastline, have a friend of mine called Tofik Balala, former transport Cisimombasa County. He was attending a game piting Bandari and Tazka and he was complaining that Tazka's host team could not provide spectator stands. Bandari had to come with their own shipping containers to improvise somewhere to see it so that to continue enjoying the game. I think those small things are the one that you know, drawing us back and making our Kenyan football to be retrogressive. Especially if those things are connected to the fun experience. If it's your first time and your first seat on a container, that knocks you out for the rest of the season. You look at the example of the Derby at Nyaya Stadium because many people who attended it, paying the ticket wasn't the problem. But when you get into Nyaya National Stadium and you find that all the seats haven't been cleaned. The whole stadium. That's something that really leaves you thinking. Do you really want to be here again? I think the fun experience is really poor for not only the FKF, but also the teams themselves. And also the investment in public relations should be, they should try to invest more in it because they never talk to the funds really about what is needed in the game. You look at teams like Gormaya and A.C. Lopez. How many fun forums do they have? But they have all these big funds. They meet them and ask them about their experience. Things change in the next game. Very, very minimal. And again, we have to stick with what Erika said. The quality of football that's also the pitch. You watch it, it's totally different from what you do. You watch the Premier League your whole life and you watch KPL. You just see a shift, a difference in it. And I think that's another place that's really shocking because if our top teams cannot play football and compete even at the top African level, I think we are still in big trouble. Because I think fans from the paramount aspect of the development of the game, when they don't show up in large numbers, there is no revenue, there is no get collection, and even corporates want to associate with numbers. It's all about numbers. I think that's why we have to work together to make sure that we have a good relationship. What are we targeting? Numerical superiority. Look at what is happening across the border in Tanzania. In Tanzania, they've been able to rally their fans because they're organising their games better. That's why you find that younger Simba, it will be filled to capacity. Even here, nowadays, we have to rally a lot to get numbers. People are no longer going to the stadium. And before it was a tradition, people could just show up, not necessarily getting coerced. And there's something my good friend Simon said. Why would you struggle to bring gormaya as home matches to Nairobi when most of its fan base is home there? Why would you struggle when instead of having city stadium as home ground for FC Lopad, put those matches in Kamega and you'll see, they will start singing at 10 a.m. in preparation for that game in the evening and they will feel Buhungu Stadium. Making Buhungu Stadium to be the venue of the clash, I know it will attract a lot of fans around. Even the locals, they love FC Lopad. Identify you with their role. That's their team. Long time ago, it made sense to me and I thought long time ago we had those now community based clubs and they used to be supported a lot. Now we are not going to the community based club but now if that club is left by that community, FC Lopad is associated with a lot of people from western. Have their home ground, let them play their home matches at Buhungu. And you'll see the quality of Buhungu will have to improve because you have to make the pitch and the stadium. The business opportunities around the stadium on that much day, people will make more money and the stadium will be filled to capacity. Other sponsors will take notice and they will support that event. Like there is a team in Mombasa, it's participating in Mombasa Premier League. It's called Vita Youngsters. This team has been using influential figures and personalities who attract some following to rally behind fans to show up in large numbers at the stadium. I don't know whether that is self sustainable but it's been working out for them. Like you see when Bandari is playing at Baraki, like hosting Gormaya, fans attending that game will be countable. People attending a concurrent game when Vita Youngsters is involved because they are celebs who are social media tweeters so people are showing up in large numbers. I don't know whether that one works for Kenyan football overall. I think it does work because following is important and if you have the numbers on social media you attract more people to come and watch and also I think for some reason the lower leagues kind of have a bigger fan base than KPL because these tournaments that are away from NSL and KPL they usually have a huge turnout so I don't understand there. And also I think for visibility the simple thing they can start with is having proper pretty much interviews. I think to add on that you've talked about something about the lower leagues. I will tell you a few down on the grounding careers to find that they are well managed. They are well managed as compared to the higher league. The higher league there is a lot of bureaucracy there are a lot of issues you find that before the game is played you are tossed left, right and center but this one is not bureaucracy we are playing tomorrow we are playing next week against this team money for referees there provided and you see football has to start from the grassroot even if you look at the Premier League you'll find that if it's the Masai Dabi the fans, the Everton fans they know where they come from and it starts from there and the rivalry has to start from down, down, down there because if you look at I was on the ground there in Khares the rivalry between gas team in Ghidurahi and Khares team the fans want to come everybody wants to come and support their team it has to start there and then we push it upwards and that calls I believe there is hope because we have a cabinet secretary now who is listening we have a cabinet secretary now who is engaging I hope he say that multi-choice will be coming back and when multi-choice comes back super sport comes back that will be a huge boost because you remember when they were here things were a little bit okay Kenyan players got an opportunity to play overseas in foreign league because at least now there was visibility visibility people getting monitored and nowadays we like playing in the dark sponsorship football is about money they were able to pump in some money whereby now players will not go for months without being paid there are teams that struggle even to honor their way matches because of a lean budget so you see those things we should be able to put them behind us and if the players are comfortable I am sure they will be able to concentrate more they will be able to play better and we will be able to see value for money now the future of our ambassadors we have heard a lot regarding our national team changing name because I think we qualified for Africa we took up of nations in 2019 in Egypt after 15 years of waiting the last time we had done that was in 204 Indonesia and you know under Sebastian Minye it was a prestigious opportunity to play in conendal football though we got eliminated at the group stage and you know the following AFKON we didn't make it and so his work up that took place in Qatar last year what do we do because we keep talking about strategies programs in place structures at the grass roots youth programs getting a proper tactician someone who understands technical aspect of the game to be in charge of the national team packaging a club football better but the end product is for a fan who is at home I think for the fan it's really number one number two we cannot forget what Erica said it's about money for all these Kenyan clubs they should at least but they should not get comfortable and be too dependent on the government because that's not where the corporate these are the people who can pay up up to billions just have people see their logo on TV see their logo being won by the champions of this club so these teams and clubs they have to utilize the deal the multi-choice deal that will be coming back they have to write out to these corporates and give them anything they want have their names on shorts and try to bring in as much as they can money so that when they make something good of their season with the money they can do it again next season because I don't think the government can you know necessarily pay for all the teams in the country because this is just football we are talking about this rugby, this basketball clubs this all that even volleyball clubs will the money be enough for all those teams no they'll have to get a smaller slice of the cake for them to be part of the money that the government will dish out so for those in the FKF you look at our national team Harambistaz you look at all the other national teams that maybe are the world cup they had sponsors they weren't wearing them during playing but they are training kids all of them had sponsors you know that's where the money comes from so for FKF and the clubs themselves especially Godmahia, FC Lopez those clubs they need to find solid sponsorships first they need to look out for these sponsors get them and stop being overly reliant on government or people stepping up and coming through for them at the last minute I think we need to move away completely from that and pump real real money also to the corporates you know into football and make it a proper sport because it's the biggest in the world we cannot excel at athletics do fairly well at rugby and our football is dying we really need to invest in it because we are not self-sustainable enough a team like Efsinepans it's been there since time immemorial the last time they won a league is several years down the line and it's a team that has had an opportunity to you know contribute immensely to success of Kenyan football even by the virtue of players who've donned the late joke kina saimon mula mabonfa sambani the list is endless but sometimes it's very embarrassing to see these teams behaving like you know when they are standing they are reaching out to politicians to our prime CSM salya mudavador former defense CSU Jinguamalo to come to their rescue that's not long term it's not long term because we've refused to invest in structures my friend if you look at a team that has been able to dominate a little bit to have consistency look at taska taska has had that consistency if you pick 10 years you'll find that they have been in the top 4 consistently simply because of the structures that are there set by Kenyan broolies East African broolies and the sponsorship is consistent now if you look at now these other I'll put them they used to be community based teams go to my FC Leopards they are more on individuals rather than officers they want to create structures and you'll find that when the chairman is very powerful leaves the team also goes down because he was the alpha and the omega so I think we need to rethink our football and these teams as you say need to put structures in place structures there is the office of this and this office their work is to lobby for fans their work is to bring sponsors on board we don't have to fundraise because it's very embarrassing when FC Leopards is fundraising in the 21st century we are doing a fundraiser to pay players salaries we are doing a fundraiser to honour our marches it becomes really embarrassing and that is a wake up call to and I think also the government should be able to come in maybe parliamentarians come up with a law to regulate these teams and say that you have to look for sponsors for you to register you have to look for sponsors and these are the guidelines so these teams to protect the players welfare to protect the welfare of the workers and eventually it will improve the Kenyan football in totality and also feel like they should be quick to accept some deals because you know we saw the the one they did for the the cup I don't know they did with which betting company but I think they got 60 million for three seasons for three seasons and I was looking at it you break it down and that is the lack of now structures if there was an office of somebody dealing with that definitely you will have a lawyer on that table you will have an accountant on that table you will have financial advisors on that table you will study this deal you will take the deal you will go and sit down with it and when you come back you say no thanks if it doesn't make sense it doesn't make sense because 60 million over three years it was totaling to around there is no there is no there is no indemnity exactly and then there is no professionalism how do you sign such kind of a deal actually to be honest to be frank because on this particular platform we always can do those corporates are benefiting much than how these clubs are getting these privileges in exchange it's just exploitation it's exploitation because you see when you sign a sponsorship deal with Gormaya it's a team that draws overwhelming following locally and whatever you get in return from the fans who get to support this team it's so huge unlike what the team is getting in return so the team is being used by these corporates and I'll say it is because of our own stupidity because we should put there people who can package the deals advocate for proper sponsorship deals but I think also some of them are looking at what they get in return individually another team benefiting we're gonna close on that we've been speaking about the state of Kenyan football and I think this is something we can talk about the whole year without getting tired because we mean well for Kenyan football and we want it to be juicy and as beautiful as possible so that you know at least it can draw fanatical following like what European leagues and you know several leagues across the world do we take a short commercial break before we return with matters international football with focus on fixtures lined up for the weekend don't go away