 Oh, we've got, you know, speaking of services, we got another services angle coming up here. Richard Scannell is the senior vice president at Glasshouse. Glasshouse is a company, as I recall, based in Framingham, Massachusetts. Are you guys still in Framingham? Yes, you are. So my old stomping around. How you doing, Richard? Bruins are still in it, the sharks are out of it, so being from Massachusetts, you gotta be excited. I was hoping for a San Jose Sharks, Boston Bruins Stanley Cup, but I'm disappointed. We'll take that. Sharks couldn't pull it off last night. So Glasshouse, a consulting specialist, storage services specialist. Yeah, started out in storage. Right, started out in storage, and branching out, obviously you're here at Citrix Synergy, so you're doing some stuff around desktop virtualization. Of course, desktop virtualization, for different reasons, breaks storage, for different reasons than server virtualization. We can talk about that as well, but give us an update on Glasshouse. You guys have been tremendously successful. At one point, I think you were talking IPO, right? Yeah, so we're still in that process. So you can't tell us anything. Come on, what's the financials? So just put the muzzle on. Well, LinkedIn went for $10 billion, so I'm assuming you're gonna be like $3 billion? I'll take about half of that. Come on, I mean, they're a Rolodex networking tool. Yeah, how good is that, right? What the heck? I can fix their storage. Yeah, so we're about 600 people now, so we've continued to scale up and grow internationally, and the reason I'm here is Citrix is an important partner of ours. We do a bunch of services work with them, and obviously then, in our direct customers, wanting to be, we're involved in desktop virtualization at both the strategy and deployment level, and so, continuing to kind of keep up to date with partners. So what are you seeing with desktop virtualization? I mean, we like to use sports analogies. Where are we? Are we one guest today, so we're in the national anthem? We need a new word, we need a new word, not desktop virtualization. I was gonna say, I think we're just past kickoff, right? So, I mean, the projects that we're seeing are in what you would think of as very strong, which were enterprise clients, and it's mostly strategy work. It might be deployment into a particular use case. Obviously, the call center is kind of the one everybody talks about as being very standardized. It was pretty narrow, wasn't it, today? Well, it is now, but the strategy work that we're doing is really an enterprise-wide approach. Really? Yeah, so, and it's been driven by all kinds of different aspects. So in healthcare, we're seeing it been driven by the device, right? So doctors want the ability to look at MRIs at the bedside, on some kind of a tablet device. In engineering companies, you would have different focus around IP protection, and data loss prevention, and things like that. So it's a wide variety. You've seen a lot of uptick in government. So we don't do a huge amount of work in the government because of all of the challenges associated with working in the government. But certainly in education, we're seeing it, right? Higher ed, actually, it's really interesting. That's typically a segment that lags other industries, and in this case, it's clearly being a leader. And how about financial services? Do you see a good uptake there? Yeah, as well, obviously, in financial services. And again, different drivers. So we have, you know, we actually have some clients who won't even allow laptops inside the door, but they're still looking at, how do I virtualize the application? How do I make this an easier environment to manage? So our kind of, certainly my personal philosophy on virtual desktop is it's not about doing, you know, the same for less, it's about doing more for about the same, right? And that's, that economy opportunity has just kicked in in about the last 12 months. Yeah, because a lot of people, I think, you know, thought, okay, it's the thin client, it's the Scott McNeely, Larry Ellison, thin client vision, and that really didn't take hold because the economics really weren't there except for narrow use cases. So when you say do more for about the same, what kinds of things are people putting on their roadmap in terms of do more? Sure, so, you know, really interesting, I, one of the things I've been saying is that this is one of the first projects from an infrastructure perspective, which is what we've been all about for 10 years, that the CIO actually cares about, right? Yeah, CIO doesn't spend a lot of time typically thinking about infrastructure, right? So for 10 years infrastructure has all been about, hey, do this project because you'll save money. Do server virtualization, you won't buy as many servers. Do data deduplication, you won't buy as much backup stuff, et cetera, et cetera. Pretty short conversations. Yeah, so this conversation is all about how do I get to market faster? How do I mobilize the workforce? How do I create new lines of revenue? And it's been driven in certain cases by the device. So I want to put a device in every sales person's hand, walk in the department store floor so that they can conduct transactions right there. I mean, this is a different mindset. I mean, what you're talking about is kind of an investment mindset, it's an innovation mindset. So we've been speculating and speculating, saying as a matter of fact, that we're obviously on a recovery, there's a tech refresh. Obviously people are talking about from Windows, rolling out Windows 7 to a complete cloud revolution. So I mean, what's their mindset, these CIOs? Obviously, cost cutting is about reducing, doing more with less, I mean, that's dead. So what's your mindset? Again, I think this feels like the first thing that the CIO has looked at from an infrastructure perspective, and actually, I don't think they think about it as infrastructure. What happens is they go to some conference or they see some opportunity or the business guys come to them and say, we want to put this type of device in everybody's hands or in this segment of the business hands. And when the CIO steps back and looks over his shoulder, the guy he's got to go talk to is the infrastructure guy. It hasn't been like that for a very long time, right? Because they've been, are you saying that they've been extracted away, abstracted away? They only think about applications, right? So they think about how do I build a new application to give us competitive advantage, time to market performance, things of that nature, and that has, while infrastructure's an underpinning, it hasn't been at the forefront. Okay, so your company's been really doing well in the whole data center cloud and then deploying across multiple vendors. Citrix has got a good message today. I mean, you hear the keynote, it's a lot of sizzle and they've got a lot of stake out there in terms of some specifics. And the vision at the end was fantastic. Love OpenStack, great for developers, but really talking about people devices, that's the personal cloud, apps, desktop data, that's the private cloud, which is, we all know is kind of like hyped up right now, but then you've got the public cloud, which they're a big player in. Net scaler, front door, back door, okay, that's cool. I buy that, connecting it all together. Let's talk about orchestration. How the hell are they going to pull that off? How is Citrix going to make all that happen? Yeah, so one of the first things we try to do, or I try to do in a dialogue with a client is just get to a vernacular, right? So what do any of these things actually mean? And if you think about kind of cloud as a concept, I try to break it into four simple levels, right? Let's talk about virtualizing the infrastructure at the bottom, right? So I think the latest statistic I saw was that less than 25% of enterprises are greater than 70% virtualized, right? So turn that in its head, 75% of the world is less than 70% virtualized. End of conversation from a cloud, right? So let's get some wheels on the car before we start about how fast we can drive it. So you got to get the environment virtualized. Then you got to get an orchestration layer, which I simply talk about, do you want to be able to provision and release assets without any human intervention? If that's the next kind of iteration on- That's automation. That's automation, right? Then beyond that, what are all the policy and processes that are going to need to change to enable that? So how do you do problem resolution in a virtual desktop, right? So today, my laptop doesn't work. I call the help desk. They look at my device. If it's broken, they give me a new one. They look at the application running. If it's out of memory, they stick a bunch of more memory chips in it. And beyond that, they say, okay, well, that app runs on that server. Let's go look at that server. Now I virtualize that environment and somebody calls the help desk and says, my application is slow. Where do I start, right? So I've taken the storage out and put it in a storage array. I've taken the computing out and put it on a server. I've got some kind of- You got to blame somebody. Where do I even begin? Public cloud, do I call Amazon? Like what the hell do I do, right? So- Management's key there. The technology is just one layer in this. The operational aspect of it is a whole different thing. And then the final part in that whole world is the financial piece. So do you want to be able to charge back? Do you want to be able to do cost accounting? How are you going to be able to see how much a user costs you for us? So for Citrix to achieve their vision, we've been saying when we like Citrix, we think they're well positioned. But for them to achieve that next level, to go totally mainstream, to take this mobile virtualization or device virtualization, get rid of the word desktop, to the next level, what do they got to do to be successful in your mind? Yeah, so I think part of it is figuring out the parts of that stack or some variant of that where you feel you can own, right? So clearly they've got a leadership position in much of what's considered to be the desktop part of it, right? And so the cloud is somewhat the next horizon on that path, right? Is what part are they going to play in public versus private stacks? And I think the whole world is so polluted right now from a messaging perspective. It's really hard to separate out what any of these suppliers are going to do versus the problem of I'm a CIO, which is really who we go talk to. What do I need to do? And how can I take incremental steps as against wait for some big bang, right? So you walk the show floor, how many of the small independent guys that are all around the edges are going to exist as independent guys in two years' time? What is that consolidation going to look like? How do I make a bet on somebody today and have comfort that that solution is going to be necessary or exist in the company? We've been speculating who by Citrix the whole weekend. So what's the stat that you just mentioned earlier about the virtualization? Less than 100%? What was the number? 28%? 75% of organizations are less than 25%. No, it's less than 70% of organizations. So 75% are less than 70%. If I remember right, that's a stat from Enterprise Strategy Group. Yeah, but now you're talking about nomenclature and the confusion out there. We're talking about server virtualization and we're talking about desktop virtualization. That's server virtualization. Okay, so. Got to help this. So you're probably bigger on desktop virtualization. Exactly, so adding to the confusion is a lot of people say, okay, well I'm doing server virtualization. I have a virtualization vendor, hypervisor vendor that's virtualizing my servers. So maybe I should call them for my desktop virtualization, but it's apples and oranges, isn't it? Absolutely, it's not only apples and orange from a technology perspective, but from a complexity perspective. So server virtualization has largely been thought of as a single layer technology, which is server related, right? Desktop virtualization is a data center project, right? Because you are literally taking this monolithic device, breaking it into half a dozen pieces and pushing pieces of it to different places. So you put the compute onto a server, you're putting the storage into an array, you've got the personalization layer, the applications. This is a much more complex problem. So thinking of desktop virtualization as a desktop project, you're kind of halfway down the road to failure already. Or thinking about it as a server virtualization project. So the infrastructure is totally different and of course it's always storage. What is it about storage? Storage wrecks server virtualization. It ruins desktop virtualization, but it's completely different workloads, right? I mean, desktops are much more right-intensive. It's a whole different pattern of values. Well, and depending on your profile as a user, right? So call center user doesn't write anything, probably, or very little, right? Everything comes back to you. Which is why those are successful, right? Because the mainstream is an IO blender. Correct. So you guys obviously have some experience there. Yeah, and all the way out to, if you don't have a strong Dior plan for your data center, which you could argue that many, many clients don't, then what happens? So today, a laptop breaks, so one user doesn't work. Tomorrow, a rack goes down and 500 users can't work, right? So you got to think the whole way back from the experience that the user's going to have through all the layers of the technology that are involved to deliver that experience and the resiliency at each layer in that technology. How important is sizing this environment for customers? Yeah, it's critical. How do you do that? Well, you're trading off, you're trading off essentially opportunity versus risk. So just because you can put 500 users on a server doesn't mean you should put 500 users on a server, right? So you got to trade off your maturity operationally in terms of things like change management and Dior versus what the capacity of the asset will allow you to do. And again, that is really kind of a trade-off, right? Do you want to mix workloads? Do you want to blend user profile types? All of those questions need to get asked and answered in a design. So what's next for Glasshouse? What are you guys working on these days? Yeah, just to hopefully keep doing more of the same. I mean, we started out as a storage-related services company. We've really gone sideways into most of the major disciplines in the data center. I think one of the things that we're really looking at now is beefing up our networking capability because historically I would have said network services were largely commoditized, right? How many ports do you want and there wasn't much beyond that. As you look at a lot of these type of technologies, that dependency on the network has become really another major neighbor, right? So we're doing that. We're also spending a fair amount of time involved in large data center consolidation. So you think of the cloud. Well, kind of in my stack of desktop virtualization, starting at the, how virtualized is your environment to begin with at the server, you kind of have the same problem with the cloud. If your data centers are all gummed up, how are you even going to take advantage of kind of cloud technology? So we're seeing a lot of clients bribe data center consolidation and those large projects are great for a business like ours. So you mentioned, you know, that the vernacular, I want to get to that point where you can have a common ground with the conversations with your customers. And 75% are not even in a position. So how does that change the delivery of services? Because when we were at SAP Sapphire last week, we had a real candid conversation. I forget who it was with, but no, it was CSC. She runs the cloud group, SICA. Siki Junta. Junta, who at CSC, she's like, you know, she's like, look at, you know, in the old days on ERP, the suits would come in, millions of dollars would be spent. One year later, they're training people barely. Yeah. 10 year outsourcing. Those days are obviously over, you know, milk and the client. You got real time, you got faster response time. You've seen that movie. I mean, you know that world. You've worked in that world in the past. What's it like now in the services deployment? There's a lot more expectations. There's a lot more reality. There's a lot more accountability. What's changed today that's different than previous years? Yeah. So I think, you know, the back up the bus and take 100 kids off it, you know, and hang around for a year and see what we get. Those days are obviously gone. I also think the big outsource the whole world, those days are gone. Clients are looking for real expertise in particular domains. They're obviously looking for where you've done this before, you know, the virtual desktop thing. We're all kind of figuring this out to a certain degree as we go along. But in general, they want to see that you have strong capability. I think one of the things that makes Lasso's a little bit different is because, you know, almost half of our business is operating client environments. While we do this strategy work, it's very much grounded and operational. So, you know, I asked the question, how do you do problem resolution? You're not going to hear that from a lot of your software vendors, right? Because they just want to place that product or your hardware vendors. They just want to place that product. When we're building a strategy, it's not just how do I integrate all that technology together, but it's truly how do you operationalize that in your environment. And I think that's one of the things that, that, you know, gives us an edge sometimes in these conversations. Yeah, and it's nuanced. I mean, how do you even define a problem? And what do you want to, you know, what's an incident, you know, to you? Accountability, right? And it's responsibility. So take the ITIL stack, line it up beside the technology stack. How does this work? Right. And, you know, most software guys will go, what are you talking about? Well, the services business is obviously booming. And Dave and I are starting a new section on SiliconANGLE.com and a new research group at Wikibon around what we call services angle. Because there's a lot of money being made right now. There's a lot of transformation. The clients are looking for, from what we're hearing, guidance. They really want some real navigation, like what the hell to do. Where the answer isn't this bill of materials, right? Yeah, I mean, it's like, they want the audit, but they want really investment. They want real deal. And so that's the, it's not as sexy, it's not as sexy as, you know, big data, cloud, you know, rah-rah. But it's the meat and potatoes that makes this. It's the blocking and tackling to get back to your sports analogy. Totally. Yes, the blocking and tackling. And there's real money to be made. Wealth is being created. Small firms are growing. Yep, yeah. And the other thing is clients don't want to operate these environments. So, you know, you go back to something as unsexy as backups. Well, we operate the backup environment for dozens of companies. Why? Because it's really important, but your manufacturer candy, you don't need to be any good at backups, right? Just like you don't run your own payroll anymore, but it has to be done and it has to be done really well. Do an SLA, delivery, done. Absolutely, right. And we'll do it on your hardware and your software. So you've already spent millions of dollars. So I'm not going in with an answer that says, well, before you do that, you got to buy my stuff. Rip it out, put it to the club, whatever. It doesn't really matter. I mean, the nuance between one particular thing or another in a mature market, it's pretty small. And so it comes down to an operational expertise that most organizations either don't have or if they do, they probably shouldn't have. The technology's not the problem, typically, right? It's almost the people in process. That's a great philosophy. I think that's why, one of the reasons why you guys are so successful is that you guys just walk in and just deliver the value they need to be delivered. You charge for it, money changes hands, you're in business, right? That's the goal. It's not that complicated, right? And nobody wants to do it, right? So you don't want to send your kid, I have a daughter going off to college in the fall. I don't want to send her for a $200,000 education to be the backup guy, right? That's like, you know, not taken from the backup guy, but it's not, right, exactly, right? One of many services though. You guys do a ton, obviously, consolidation to expansion. And what's the hottest innovation pocket that you're seeing out there? So probably desktop virtualization. Again, it's just, it's the one area where, we've not seen this kind of spend money without a clear obvious economic return for, since Y2K, right? Is it because they just, it's blue sky, they know the return, it's so bad that it, you know, rolling out windows, losing enabling. I think it's the sexiness of the device to be completely transparent. It's the mobile. I mean, if I was an Apple, yeah. If I was an Apple rep, I'd send an iPad to every CEO in my patch. I mean, why wouldn't you, right? And because those guys, I mean, so I was in IT for a long time and you tried hard to keep the PC out because, you know, when you were in a mainframe environment it was this really complicated thing and how are we going to support it? How long do you think it took before the iPad got supported by the average IT group? About an hour and a half, right? Once the CEO showed up and said, hey, by the way, we're doing this, right? So, you know, those days of control are gone. So that the device is really pushing the thought process of the business leaders. You know, you've got a doctor saying, I want to be able to look at this patient's MRI right here standing beside him on this thing. Go figure it out. Richard, we had Mike Stringer on who runs services for Citrix and we were talking to him about the skill sets and the changes that consumerization and cloud and particularly mobile are bringing and in the services business, I comment that you've got, you know, certain people that love services, right? They have the services gene. But skills are presumably changing as you see all these changes in the industry. What's changing as far as skill sets? He's mentioned 600 people at Glasshouse. Are you looking at changing the mix? Are you hiring different types of people? What are those skill sets that you're looking for these days that are tough to find? Yeah, so definitely, you know, that you've got kind of two shifts that you look to take advantage of. You're either looking for people who have what I call content, so I'm looking for guys who know security or I'm looking for guys who know, you know, virtualization or something like that, or you're looking for competency. So you're looking for people who know how to do architecture and then you can give them the content and it's almost always easier to give people content and competency, right? So if you can get a consultant who knows how to build server virtualization, making them a desktop guy is not as hard as taking somebody who really doesn't know how to do consulting, but they're really smart at a particular domain, right? But we look in both worlds. We hire out of operational backgrounds as well as out of kind of classic consulting backgrounds. And part of it is because of the mix of our business. So being operational as well as strategy oriented. So you mentioned your growth strategy. Part of that is going overseas, correct? Yeah, so we're about a little bit under two thirds of the company is overseas spread across Europe and then the Middle East. Two thirds? Yeah, about two thirds. So it's not quite, it's probably, you know, three fifths or something of that order. A lot of that in new growth countries and BRIC or is it more just penetration of traditional markets? It's a little bit of both. So we have a over a hundred folks, I don't know exactly about 120 maybe in the UK. We've probably a 30 or so in Switzerland, about 25 or 30 in Turkey, and then probably 120 or 30 or something like that in Israel. So we can service everything from kind of, obviously the Israeli state, but a lot of those folks go down into Africa for us. They also, a lot of folks in that country speak a second language from the Eastern European bloc. So we can get up there from Turkey. We can service the moderate Arab nations. And then we've got kind of German speaking folks coming out of Switzerland and obviously then our guys in the UK. Benchmark the US force, where do we stand in terms of adoption of say mobile and even I would say, yeah, definitely. Well, leading in many regards, I would say the other market is the UK. That's also very, very hot. And that, you know, the really nice thing about the UK is just that the distance is so short, right? So, you know, when you get into an account, you're not spending a day on an airplane to get from one site to another. You're spending, you know, an hour or something. So it's just easier to get stuff done that way. Good. Thank you.