 Jay Fidel, this is ThinkTech. More specifically, this is Community Matters on ThinkTech. And we're gonna have a very interesting discussion with a very interesting guy who was the very incarnation of innovation. You can quote me on that, Rob. That's Rob Yonover. Dr. Rob Yonover. Lessons from the tank. That could be a triple on time, you know what I mean? So, Rob, you're an inventor, you're an innovator, there's so much to talk about with you, we know each other. Oh, gosh, it must be almost 25 years now. Absolutely. You're a PhD from UH, and you took that and reeled it into pure invention, innovation, creativity. And you've been making a living on sea rescue all this time, saving lives at sea for the military and others who go to sea or fly over sea. It's really an important thing you've invented. It's a whole array of products that save lives. What a wonderful way to spend your time, spend your life as an innovator. I'm so happy to see you again. Same here, Jay, it's great to be here and I always love a good problem, right? Why not spend your life attacking something worthwhile? Absolutely. So let's talk about the news at the top of the hour, that is your shark tank experience. So you went into the tank with those guys, some of them are not all that nice, let me say, that's my view. Yeah, absolutely, they're tough, but you know something that they're trying to, it's a little bit of a macho thing. Everyone's trying to say something smart and I had to go in there and guns blazing and showed them, tried to convince them how critical this piece of safety equipment is and they got it and they liked it. The great news was they all liked it on national TV. Every one of them said, this is great, it's incredible what you've done, congratulations, it's gonna save lives. Five sharks all said some variation of that. Zero sharks invested. And that was a shock to me because I had priced it so low that I expected a bidding war because I thought, who doesn't wanna save lives? But then again, I'm a scientist and I don't think about money so much and the people who think about money really think about money. I guess so, they're jaded, all of them, I'm sorry. I watch it for a while, but I can't, I don't have a tolerance beyond a few minutes. I know, that's it, but the overall theme of having people innovate from all walks of life is excellent and I go out and do a lot of outreach in the community and I want all kids and adults to be inventors and innovators and it's all in us. So I think there should be little shark tanks everywhere. We should give kindergarteners money, elementary, high school, seriously. I know, I take it seriously. Tell us how it went, I mean, you get up there, I can imagine, you're so articulate, you got up there and you pitched them, what did you say? Well, it was hard because you have to walk out there and they really, you got to do a stare now and you see these people, this is pre-COVID, so they're right in front of me. Nowadays, they've moved the sharks way back and they're just doing a 40 second shot of your face with reactions like a prize fighter. I pitched the idea, said it's great, said it's saved lives already, it's gonna save lives, it's used all over the world and since the show, I got the huge home run of all the techies. Elon Musk buys stuff from me. I don't buy stuff, yeah. Stay sexy. There are questions about whether you should sell to Elon. I know, I know. That's another question. It's a bummer, this last year he's heard his image, but in the meantime, he used to be God of all the techies and God buys sea rescue streamers and puts it under the ass of every astronaut. That is the home run. And even when I go to the shark tank reunions, they're like, dude, you won shark tank, forget scrub daddy and these guys that make millions of dollars, you won. What's a reunion? Yeah, every couple of years, we've done it twice now, in New York three years ago in Las Vegas last summer. You know, the shark tank thing is such a heavy experience. It's very, very stressful. And afterwards, someone started a private Facebook club of people that have been on the carpet that have spoken. So we're all kind of in this together and surprisingly, it's not like a celebratory reunion. There's a little bit of that. These guys are so over the top agro in building their business. And you know, I'm an older guy, I'm in there taking notes, they're talking social media, you know, all this tiktok, so you got to do a shark tank, a how do your journey to shark tank? They want me to do a journey to shark tank, tiktok and influencers and all this stuff. And you know, they don't know anything about my world, which is mainly the military, but you know, it's fantastic. It's like a new tribe I'm part of and we can all relate because we all went through it. That's great fallout. That's a great legacy. Then you go there, you become a member of the family. It's almost like being on a tiktok talk show. You become a member of the family forever and ever. Absolutely, thanks to tiktok. You gave me a spotlight years ago. UH has given me opportunities, blue startups, dual use. Remember those guys? Just across the board. This has been my community. And the shamanad where I'm part of Hogan entrepreneur, UH engineering, I do stuff with, I do outreach to all these schools. It's part of the community. And Hawaii is the greatest place to innovate. The Polynesians innovate it all the time. So it's perfect. It's a perfect laboratory. It's a great place to sell to the military. It's a great place to do safety of life at sea. What could be better? And you're still operating directly from Hawaii, right? Absolutely. This is still your headquarters. It's a world headquarters. And by the way, you talk about safety at sea. It also saves guys on land. Because like in the Vietnam era, you light a smoke and the the Viet Cong knew a smoke was coming. They shoot the helicopter. So you can unfurl a streamer in a clearing. And one thing the military loved about it is redeployable. You could put it away and then redeploy it unlike smoke signals or flares. And one of the guys whose lives was saved was in Afghanistan in the mountains. He needed to get a pickup. So it works on land too. Just to throw that in. Well, how about a quick list of your current products? Because way back when you had just started with the streamer and then you had variations on the streamer, very different kinds and new technologies and radio beacons and whatnot. So what have you got going now? Okay, well, let's just start with Sea Rescue. So I button it up. We have the regular streamer and now the newest version has chem lights and reflectors. So it has a day and night component. And the best top of the line is the fighter pilot auto deploy. Even if the pilot's ejected and unconscious, it unfurls automatically. It dissolves in water based on my knowledge of rice paper. We found the plastic to dissolve and that flashes and locates them from six miles away and like 20,000 feet. Unbelievable. So then we have the other inventions I've had over the years is a pocket desalinator, which converts salt water to fresh water, pocket flotation device, smallest life jacket in the world fits in your pocket, the inflatable rescue board and paddle board and that predated all the inflatable paddle boards you see. That's a whole nother story. Video search and rescue using the signal of an orange stripe or any bright color against the background using based on color and shape. They always used to look for shape only. We added color to it and all the cameras are used, many of the military surveillance cameras use that technology. I've written hardcore inventing, caregiver survival guide, hardcore health and a children's book, brainstorm islands. Oh, and the latest thing is, I can't say which fighter jets but it's also going as mandated in brand new fighter jets built in the US that are sent all over the world are gonna have streamers in them now too. So I'm doing a lot. I've done a couple of things but it's never, I never like to give up the zest for doing it. I love attacking problems and I have stupid, stupid inventions too that I use on a daily basis. People laugh at me but I've solved the problem. I like to solve problems. Couldn't get sunscreen on my back and I didn't wanna ask my friend cause he made me put it on his back and he had a hairy back. I have a roller that puts sunscreen on my back. I have white washcloths in the car that I call knee brellas. They fit over my knees so the sun doesn't burn my legs. So I'm always inventing things. A lot of it's not fit for public consumption but just to show that everyone has ideas and you watch Shark Tank, some of the craziest things take off. So just cause you don't have to be a PhD volcanology guy like me, survival, you can invent whatever you want. Okay, I wanna dwell on that for a minute. Could you have done this without the PhD? Yes and no, I lead with it. I know we just had a discussion of it. I'm really bummed that on my name right here, the doctor isn't there. But that's okay. In the world of the military, they're into titles and achievements and I have a PhD in Geochemistry, Volcanology, Petrology at the University of Hawaii and I worked on Submarine Lavas off Galampagos. I went down two miles deep in a submersible and did my lab work at NASA and MIT and UH. That gives me a foot in the door in terms of professionality, right? It's like, okay, I'm like a general or a captain or something in the military. So that's why it's very important. And along that journey, I was taught here, Dr. John Sinton was my advisor. He taught me how to attack problems and how to really try problems on and think about them and approach it from different angles. So PhD enabled me to be the problem solver I am now. I don't know if you meant that way or you meant opening doors, but both ways. I guess it works both ways. Let's go to the question of innovation because you are, as I said, a statement of innovation. Thank you. And you keep doing it and it turns you on. It earns you a living, it carries you from day to day and it's the identity as an innovator. And I suggest there must be a connection between taking that PhD and doing all the work and all the travel and all the exposure to the elements that really does put you in touch with innovation thoughts. Am I right? Absolutely. And it's also invent what you know, right? So if you're a volcanologist, like I was, we did some edgy stuff in a ship and it's submersible and on the top of volcano and I surf big waves, that's kind of crazy. I fished 25 miles offshore on the Molokai Channel alone tied into my boat. So for me, I'm always on the edge of dying. I invent survival here. But for someone else that has a different perspective, you invent what you know, right? It absolutely enabled me to be exposed to the things, the problems I like to solve, which is a good fit for me because it's, to me, it's nothing more satisfying than saving a life. And I try it on by saying, I gotta invent this or I'm gonna die. I like to invent stuff I would want, right? So you know what it sounds like, design thinking out of Stanford. Go ahead, make the best of it for me. I mean, are you using that per se? I was this way before that was even done, but I've heard that come on and now it's used in the schools. I think it's great. It is. And a lot of it is the interview, the problem ease. Not the, you've got to understand the problem before you can innovate and just free form thinking. I took one little course in it once later on, 10 years ago, but it's great. But again, in the line of, there should be inventing contest for all ages, there should be design thinking, anything that gets people better at solving problems and building innovation. And then in my world, protecting innovation, patents, trademarks, copyrights, all that, branding, all this stuff is important. I own that name, right? Crescu's my name. You can't use it. And I've built a brand over 25 years and that can be more valuable than patents. So it's all about building what you can. And of course, first solving the problem, you have to solve the problem first and you got to pick a problem that people want to solve. How did that happen, right? Okay, so you identify a problem and you don't say that's a real problem, especially so if it's your problem. And then one moment, there's one, aha, Edisonian light bulb moment, I guess. I think I've got it now, what's that like? It's unbelievable, I can tell you in 85, before a lot of your viewers were alive, I was flying a Cessna, looking down and the Cessna was rented. My friend, the other grad student was a pilot, I go, it's gonna go down, we're gonna sink, they'll never see us, I might swim the shore, my late wife might've made it or maybe not, but people are gonna die. And I researched it, smoked, signals, flares, that's all they had. Then two weeks later, I flew to Miami and the artist, Christo, you know Christo? He wrapped these islands in Miami in the bay with pink plastic. That was the aha, I flew over that and I said, ah, if I can only get a piece of that pink plastic. But then months and almost a year later, it took me to figure out to put spreader bars, air filled floats in it every three feet to make it like a centipede. So it looks, it's segmented like a centipede won't twist up and curl up. So that was the, there's series of aha moments. And the key for me is you take notes and you keep everything in your inventor's notebook with dates and then you leave it and come back to it. I like to jump to other problems and come back with a fresh perspective. And that problem, all my inventions, I've got a hundred of them, the streamer never left me. I, every time I come back to it, I go, I know that's right. I had, I was working for someone else and I worked for a smoke in the cockpit inventor in Kaneohe, another technology that came out of Hawaii. And I just knew it was right. I just was buying, buying my time. And then we ran out of money at one point. I said, let's do the streamer. He goes, I don't like that idea. I go, oh really? Okay, see you. So, I mean- So you're looking for points of inspiration. For me, yes. Your whole, your mindset is, I'm going to find a solution to that. I'll just keep my eyes open and it will somehow appear. Well. And then I will recognize how valuable it is. Exactly. The real key for me is biomimicry. I am, I believe we're just little peons as humans. We've been here a couple of thousand years. The earth's been here billions. And if you look at evolution, I like to look at how animals and nature solve a problem. Just like the streamer. What does the streamer look like? It looks like a centipede. It looks like a palm tree. It has segments. It looks like your vertebrae. So nature's already solved the problems. I just want to get out in nature and observe them and think about what my problems are and adapt what nature's already solved as Darwin, really. On Netflix, there's a series called Playlist. And it's the story of a company in Stockholm that invented Spotify. Oh, really? They couldn't get the server to work fast enough. And they had to figure out a way to have it stream real time. And the guy was dating, our hero, the founder, was dating a woman who was a biologist. And she was telling him about cellular biology. And in the work of a cell, it's the same thing you're talking about. There was a certain natural process and he imposed that on his computer program and presto spotting you worth billions. Wow, and the Google's a similar story. I don't know how they got that expanding when you click on it. Someone in Europe figured that out. But it's just, it's not surprising because most major discoveries or breakthroughs are made by people outside their field. And just like that, that's why I like to cross pollinate. I love to meet people from all walks of life. And even when I crowdsource, I was doing crowdsourcing before anyone was, meaning I would bounce the streamer idea off the guy at Taco Bell when I was getting to be burrito. I want everyone, I want all the input. And that's, because they got my customer, but he's also has a different perspective. Do you know what this, and one of the early guys, I tried to design it to look like a flare. So it looked like something was existing. And I went to a boat show or somewhere and I had it in my hand, the first one. I used to walk the floor as no booth or anything, just have it on my thing and talk that chase people down in the urinal, whatever I do to get in front of someone. And sure enough, this guy says to me, oh, I've seen those. I go, no, you haven't. And it's the first one ever. He goes, I've seen it. I go, okay, whatever, thank you. That means what I built was already kind of accepted for him as the solution. So that guy was just a random guy walking on the floor of a trade show. So, but I liked. Can anybody do this? Like you've written books with the proposition, a number of books with the proposition that you can teach people about innovation. Well, okay, I could teach them a little. If they read the book, they'll know more about inventing or caregiving or health or even inspire. And your books are on Amazon, aren't they? Yeah, absolutely. Just put my last name in there. So is it a required trait? Some people are better adapted at innovation, at creativity and inventing things. I think it has to do with how screwed up you are as an adult and how stifled you are. I think the real smart ones are the kids. That's why I like to focus on kids because their creativity isn't as stifled. And it's not a bad thing. Yours might be stifled because you took all this schooling and you know what you know. When you're a kid, it's wide open. You're a sponge and you look at things like biology and you think about, well, the ants walking over this stick, what does that tell me about what I'm trying to do? Whereas you and I, we're not looking at ants walking over sticks like a little kid. So I like to catch minds early and that's where, I mean my real dream is to have a kid's show. Remember Curious George? I want to do a kid's TV show. And that's what we did at Brainstorm Island. It's me and my dog and we get in trouble and we invent our way out. That's the first book. I love it, I love it. Thanks, yeah. The other thing is I understand this is only rumour now. I understand that you were a shy child. It is true. I didn't even talk till I got a couple of years old and when I was in high school, I was really short in high school and my parents, I was really quiet. And at one point my parents said, what do you think you want to do when you grow up? And I said, I don't know where I even got this. I said, I want to go into PR and they laughed at me. Because they didn't think I could even speak two words and I couldn't, my brother's written books and he's a, my brother's a real genius. I mean, he read books every week and I've only, I decided in the middle of my life that I'm never going to catch up with him. So instead of reading thousands of books, I'm going to read hundreds, but I'm going to read all the literature. I just finished War and Peace, you know. Anna Karen and I, yeah, I like that stuff. Yeah, but I don't know, and my sister, we're a very creative family. So I still, I think speaking is overrated. A lot of these parents are like, hey, kid, speak already, I don't know, don't let them speak. And the problem with scientists and in fact, and including this guy I told you about in Spotify, you have to communicate. You don't have to, you have to stand up there and pitch. You have to advocate for your product and your idea. You have to convince people. It's more than just saying it. You have to bring them in. No, exactly. Exactly. That doesn't come easy for most. No, it doesn't, especially for a shy kid, but at 13, me and my buddy singer, we worked at a shoe store. We learned how to sell. I was a pool boy. We learned how to get tips and selling shoes. We learned how to sell. You've got to get out there. You got to have a rap. And even I do, I'll give you one of the secrets of the book away in hardcore inventing. I didn't trademark it, but it's my creation. I have the perfect trade show booth line when someone's passing by. You don't say hello. You don't say how are you? You don't say, can I help you? No one wants to be helped. You say these three words, have you, four words, have you seen this? Have you seen this? If they say no, then show them. If they say yes, well, you haven't seen the self-deploying fighter gentleman. So that little tidbit, just like, I mean, yeah, you're absolutely right. And you know something? When I was at Shamanad Hogan and the PACE people, I'm always an engineer at UH, I'm always trying to, I always said the Shamanad Hogan program are much more outgoing people. The UH engineers are much more to themselves. They're the ideas and here's the power of the presentation. You need to cross-pollinate. And all inventors and scientists should take a class in pitching, sale, and they should go sell shoes for a week. Absolutely, I remember the day around the time I met you when everybody was doing pitching to venture capitalists and everything like that. So what about that? I mean, you go to a shark tank, you want to raise some money or at least some notoriety. You want to develop a little fame and the fortune, but at the end of the day, every inventor needs a backer, maybe a lot of backers. Yeah, that's true. And even a solo all these years. Well, no, I had a licensee. I licensed it for 15 years in the middle. And I had a profit sharing license agreement with my partner, Rescue Technologies. They had a start of the company, Kendall Kikuyama, great guy, 15 years, licensed it and we worked together and I got royalties and he took the lion's share and it was great for both of us. And then it ended, then I took it back. But one of the things that I have a problem with with the pitching is you lose control and you also have to understand that every idea to bring it to fruition takes twice as much money and twice as much time, at least, maybe 10 times as much money. So it's a long game. And this pitching to get investors, investors don't want to play the long game. And this is what I was very paranoid of. I did not want to get investors, even Shark Tank, they wouldn't let you be on there if they knew you were on there just for publicity. But I didn't want them owning me really after I didn't get funded. I feel like I'm better off because first of all, Mark Cuban's not calling me. Some 25 year old aide that he works for him is bugging me saying you need to move out of Hawaii. You need to go here. You need to go straight to, I don't need another boss. I don't need a boss. Myself is my worst boss. So I think you have to always have that, the idea that you want to do it by yourself. I'm into the little inventor guy. You shoot for the home run. Yeah, you want to get on Shark Tank, you want a million dollar idea, but if it's a 50,000 a year job invention that trickles money for 30 years, you're better off. And ironically, I had a chance to sell it to 3M. 3M flew me to Minnesota like 20 years ago they had a mandate to sell more reflective material. I said, here you go, put reflectors on the street. Perfect, perfect, yeah. And they tried to low ball me and then it turned out scrub daddy, the sponge guy also had a low ball from 3M. So he's on their bad list too, or they're on his bad list. But the point is my other friend said million, okay, let's say they gave you a million. You pay tax on that. And this is when I'm 30 years old, but now I'll be 64 in a couple of months. It's better to keep getting cash out of a small to medium business than it is to make one big hit. And the chances of making one big hit are much more astronomical than just building a nice business. So you aim for the home run, Shark Tank, million dollars on military save lives. But if you hit a single, that's good too, a double, right? Yeah, a lot of singles, a lot of doubles really work out. Exactly. And I've been free to explore all my inventions and my wife, unfortunately, she passed away, but she had MS, she was in a wheelchair. I had to take care of her and raise my kids. So if I wasn't working for myself, inventing for myself, licensing my inventions for myself, I would never have been able to kind of make sure that situation didn't go out of control. Yeah, yeah, that was actually a blessing, wasn't it? No, exactly, yeah, it was for sure. And I think anyone would say that too. That's an extreme case, but you want to be with your kids. You want to be with your spouse. You want to have quality time. And the truth is when you're inventing, that's when you're feeling good, that's when good thoughts come. If you're all stressed out, you can't force your way to invent things. A couple of other things come to mind I want to ask you. Since you started down this path, computers have become all the more powerful. And indeed, computers are writing legal briefs now. A number of articles in the Washington Post are lately over that. Now that there are computers can answer the one writing debris. Okay, you want me, you're on the wrong guy now. I want to know how computers have affected your opportunities. Okay, let's start with my prejudice, which is 11 years ago when that iPhone first came out, I said, these are the spawn of the devil. This is going to take down Western civilization. And I've been saying it ever since and I still have a phone with buttons. And I'll tell you what, I want to communicate in black and white, my voice or my text. You know, why do I know the answer to my next question, which is social media? What do you think of that? Necessary evil in my business. I mean, I haven't even really explored it yet for C rescue as much as I could. But I also understand it. You get a group of friends and it's helped me. See, I'm with the Shark Tank Pals on Facebook. We're all over the country and the world and we talk. We're together. It's fantastic. If you have good friends and good groups, it's great. And if you're disciplined, but if you're a little kid, look at a TikTok videos all day that are just ridiculous stuff. I just read that the Chinese don't even let certain types of video on unless it's more structural like learning. Their TikTok versions don't have this just idiocracy that we have, which is just my, you know, to quote my favorite movie. But all that, it's, I mean, I love computers. I use them. We're doing this virtually because of one. They're fantastic, but they're tools. And the biggest tool in any job or in any survival situation, and all of life is a survival situation. You know what the number one tool is? Your brain. You go to any survival school and having that phone, look at people when their phone battery runs out or if the electricity goes off, the wifi. They freak out. They can't even function. People can't even look you in the eye and say, hello, it's really bad. And I was way ahead of this curve. There are a lot of people that feel that now, but. You know, in so many ways, you are the same person. I've never heard back when you were saying the same things you are. Yeah. An example of these principles. But here I have a question for you. Okay. We start out with the streamer and all those related, you know, life-saving products, inventions. Okay. And that's still mainstream for you. You've talked about, you know, a hundred inventions altogether. And the notion of inventing things, you know, while you're in your sleep already, while you're having your breakfast. There's always something on the question. So are you, have you found the opportunity, the possibility of going beyond life-saving stuff? I mean, is there another area in which you can have that aha moment of putting the spines and the ribbons and all that, where you enter into a whole new field using these principles of innovation? Absolutely. Let's try to start up again, you know? I have one that's been around for 20 years and the problem with me is I'm kind of spoiled in that I like to invent stuff that matters. If it's just gonna make money or get the sunscreen on my back, I'm not interested, because I know how much time, blood, sweat, and tears it takes to get something launched. But what I am passionate about, really passionate about, and I think I have the solution, is one of the solutions is the health of the health and pharmaceuticals and the health of humans, especially the obesity in this country and this world. And what I've noticed is most people will take something if it's given to you for free, right? If people give you something. So my invention in that sector is called food tower. And I want to take over old parking garages and buildings and get the best vegetarian or high quality meat, great food, fantastic food and subsidize it and have as you, there's one catch though, it's free, but you have to walk up 20 floors to get it. So it builds in exercise to healthy food and it could be a no lawsuit zone like a Colorado skiing. You can't see them if you break your leg. And inside the walk up to the building, you could have advertisements to have offset price. Even put a casino in there, I don't care. I'm just trying to get people to eat better and exercise better, easier. I'm not saying it's hard, it's easy. I'm telling you, just where's the food? I don't have any money. Just walk up there, it's free, walk up there. I'm not saying get rid of Taco Bell and whatever. Taco Bell still is the healthiest with the bean burritos but in that sector, but I just think that that, I want to do something impactful. And I think that would be extremely, people would hate me, they might want to kill me, the food industry, the pharmaceutical industry, the medical industry, but we're wasting so much money on healthcare. I travel around the world, you go to the South and it's like, I had a friend a years ago who had, it was getting a heart transplant and we go in there for a recheck and he goes, hey Joe, when's George? Yeah, I got mine last year. It's like, that's not acceptable to be diabetic and heart disease, that stuff is all preventable. And I look at humans as brilliant by the phone and wasted by what you put in your body and what you don't do with your body. Again, why? Are you still surfing in the morning? Yeah, I surf big waves still. I surfed this week, I actually surfed this morning. I was on the North Shore all alone. A mile out, I got a place I paddle in on my 11 foot balsa gun and I chased the tow in guys away because there's a law in Hawaii that states that tow in surfing or jet ski or any boat can't be within a thousand feet of a paddle and surfer. I'm like, come on, I just say to these guys, come on, I'm 63 years old, I paddled out a mile from shore by myself alone with my arms only and you're gonna tow a little guy with a ski rope, no way, and you're breaking the law. I just went. I wanna just cover one other thing that strikes me from this discussion and from the days gone by. Sure. As you can't do what you do. You can't have this innovation experience, inventor experience, the advocacy that you do, the interaction with all these people in the marketplace without being fully aware of what's going on. I mean, that's part of the PhD too, I think. Absolutely. You have to know what's going on. You have to read the newspaper. Well, I read the newspaper every day and at lunch I read all the editorials and social media has been a godsend for me because I read everything, I devour everything and I know where you're going with it and I agree. You can be in a little bubble and that's your thing but what I'm trying to do is become connected to everything because I don't know where my next idea is coming from so I need data, I need input, I need problems to solve and I wanna understand the world and it's just fascinating to me and if you wanna understand people, you watch how people behave in different circumstances back to the selling shoes. Everyone's a customer and at my trade show booth, have you seen this? I have to be able to relate to everyone and even politically, I can't be on one side or the other publicly because there are all walks of life are customers. I could do that privately or in the right time and place but I definitely, and you know something, I'm a left-leaning liberal guy, it's more central but I love my whole life. One of my favorite shows as a kid and I hated the guy was William F. Buckley because I thought it was fascinating and I still love reading conservative stuff. I'm like, what do these guys think it? I like reading that because I wanna know, you know, know your enemy kind of thing. No, they're not my enemy, they're all my friends and we all need to bounce from left to right while to conservative ideas and somehow modify it into the middle. I mean, that's how it's done. If we could have a world of Rob Yonovers. Yeah, that's a scary thought. It may be scary, but it would be a better world. Oh, thank you, that's kind. We gotta go now, Rob. It's wonderful to catch up with you. Always, Jay, thanks for this ride. My pleasure. We're gonna do this again, right? Say yes. Anytime. Yeah, have you seen this yet, bud? Well, I have seen this, good job. No, but I know if I say yes or no, oh, you have to show me the new version of Think Tech. We'll see you soon. Perfect, Jay, thanks a lot. Rob Yonover. Dr. Rob Yonover. There you go. Hello, ha. Hello, ha, take care. Thank you so much for watching Think Tech Hawaii. If you like what we do, please like us and click the subscribe button on YouTube and the follow button on Vimeo. You can also follow us on Facebook, Instagram and LinkedIn and donate to us at thinktechhawaii.com. Mahalo.