 Welcome everyone. My name is Dave Erlapati. I'm the president and CEO of S2 Tech, an IT services company based in St. Louis, Missouri. It's a great honor and privilege to be part of Deshpande's conversation with Satguru as a moderator to explore the topic of inspiring tomorrow's entrepreneurs. We have two amazing entrepreneurs here. Satguru, who founded a nonprofit organization, Visha Foundation and Guru Raj Deshpande, who founded several for-profit organizations, both have made a huge impact on human well-being across the world. Satguru, known as the cool dude on a motorcycle among American children, is ranked among the 50 most influential people in India. Satguru is a yogic, mystic and visionary. He has been conferred three presidential awards in India, including one for his environmental work, as well as the country's highest annual civilian award for exceptional and distinguished service. Three decades ago, Satguru founded Visha Foundation, a nonprofit human services organization with human well-being as it's the core commitment. The foundation has initiated yoga programs for human transformation and outreach projects to uplift the rural communities. Visha is supported by 11 million volunteers in more than 300 centers across the world. Thank you, Satguru, for being part of the conversation. Dr. Guru Raj Deshpande, known as Desh Deshpande, is the president and chairman of Sparta Group LLC. Dr. Deshpande founded Cascade Communications with $1,000 investment and sold it for $3.7 billion. Dr. Deshpande's next company, Psychomo Networks, which went public in 1999, made him the richest Indian and over 70% of internet traffic at one point of time was routed using his company Routers. Dr. Deshpande has chaired and funded several other companies since then. So Dr. Deshpande is a life member of the Massachusetts Institute of Technology Corporation. And Deshpande co-chaired the National Council to support President Obama's innovation and entrepreneur strategy from 2010 to 2015. Thank you, Desh, for being part of this conversation. Thank you. Thank you, Desh. Namaskaram, Satguru. Namaskaram. Desh, can I start you with a one question? So as you look at the key points in your life and what you learned when you were in the late teens and early 20s, so what do you like to share with the students? I mean, the students that would be watching this video the program is between 17 and 21 years. So what do you like to share with them? Well, I think some people grow up with wanting to be a great musician, a great something and then they chart their whole life getting there. My life wasn't like that. I grew up in small villages and also big cities and my father was a government servant. So most of the things that happened in my life happened because I got exposed to things. And so every five years I've been doing things that I didn't know I could do or had any exposure to those areas. Whether it's education at IIT, PhD and universities here or managing in companies, entrepreneurship, starting companies and now a lot of the social entrepreneurship. So I think the key thing that the young people should do is that everything in life is knowing what's possible to do is the benchmark. Once you associate yourself with good people and know what's possible and once you aspire to get there I think you can get there. For example, Sadhguru, he set a whole new benchmark for millions of people and so millions of people aspire to get there. But you don't realize that benchmark unless you get yourself exposed to good people. So any opportunity to work with great people, people who are very good values, good accomplishments is what the young people should really look for and the rest will all unfold by itself. Wow, that's very, very good answer, Deishal. Sadhguru, how about you answering the question? As you look at key points in your life and what you learned when you were in the late teens and early twenties, what would you like to share with the students? See, you get somewhere not because you want to get there because you're involved, your involvement is intense with every simple thing that you're doing. Today somebody may say that you are a great person for whatever reasons, that is their perception. But most people who are considered great are doing simple things with great intensity and involvement. It is because of that this has happened. At one time, our inner engineering programs, we used to put a byline, ordinary to extraordinary. So, by third day people asked, Sadhguru, nothing special happened. I said, I never talked about being special. I said, from ordinary to extraordinary, that means you become more ordinary than other people. Because you're so ordinary, everybody thinks you are special, that's their problem. But if you think you are special, if you think you are great, I think you're going to bury yourself into something. So, it's extremely important, it is not about the goals, it is about the process, how profoundly are you involved. Like I was talking to, you know, like we have this inside programs, year-leadership programs, all the CEOs, over 200 CEOs every year, they come here from across the country and you know, some parts of the world also. They were asking me, what is it that makes this Isha Yoga Center work so efficiently? Because everybody is a volunteer, nobody is really qualified for anything particular, they all do whatever they can do. I said, the fundamental difference is you are all devoted to the goal. Here we are devoted to the process, every simple thing that we are doing, we are doing it the way it should happen. Out of that, how far we go, what happens? Happens naturally. Wow, this is very, very, very good, Sadhguru. Simple, doing simple things with a lot of... One important thing we must understand is, see, whatever we are doing right now, right now we are having a conference, you are in St. Louis, he's in Boston, I'm here in Coimbatore. This is not because of us, it's the times in which we exist. If you were here a century ago, do you believe we would be doing this conference? Or if you were 500 years ago, would they be, you know, making routers? No, maybe he would be making something, a sword or whatever else of the day, maybe a bullock cart, who knows? So, what we are doing is a consequence of times in which we exist. And it's for us to make the time in which we exist to progress into next possibility. But it is not all ours. We must bow down to every generation before us because it's because of them, today we are doing what we are doing here. So, let us not take this as a big, what to say, crown on our head, I've done this and that. Most of the things that we are doing is a consequence of the times in which we exist. Absolutely, absolutely, Sadhguru. Sadhguru, this technology are coming into this wider use. The gap between rural areas and non rural areas is widening. How can we bridge this gap? See, I feel technology is the best bridge that after some time, I believe in another twenty-five years, there will be no rural and herbal areas left. World will be like one world. Wherever you are, if you have the necessary competence and the necessary involvement, what you can do in Boston, probably you can do in Bodhi Naikapuram in, you know, in a remote place, I'm saying. Because it'll be so connected, you don't have to be in that specific place. The world where you are geographically will be irrelevant. Probably in the next ten-fifteen years, but I'm thinking, because I'm not as fast as this with technology, I'm thinking twenty-five years, but probably it'll happen in five-ten years, I don't know. Because we don't know what else they're coming up with. But the geographical location of where you are, who you are, what is your qualification, who your father was, which country you are in, all these things will become irrelevant as technology takes on. So there is no better technology. Technology is not creating the divide. Technology is the best bridge that we have. Wow. Desh, what is your take on this? As technologies are coming to wider use, the gap between rural and non-ruralist is widening. How can this gap be bridged? Now, you know, I get a front view seat here at MIT to see what's going on. And it's pretty amazing what technology can do these days. You can pretty much take every atom and organize it and set things up and so on. In fact, you know, the COVID, for example, the genome came to one of the companies that got started here from MIT called Moderna on June, January 23rd. By January 26th, they had the vaccine. And then of course it took about nine months, 12 months to go through the clinical trials and everything else and make it available. But technology is becoming extremely powerful. But at the same time, it's creating the divide, right? Because there is people automating and there are people being automated and so on. But I totally believe what Sadhguru is saying. It's the same technology, it's the same innovation, it's the same entrepreneurship that can also help you bridge the divide because it's a very powerful technique. But what's missing is the understanding between the two sides of those communities. You know, I think technologists make the mistake of trying to lead this transformation with just ideas. And the more and more complex the ideas get, the less useful they are. So what we really need and why I really appreciate what Sadhguru is doing, what Isha Foundation is doing is to first lead with compassion, really wanting to help those people and co-create the solution with them. Because it's very presumptuous of technologists to assume that they know the problems of these people and then come up with solutions that make no sense. So you have to co-create the solution, you have to build the capacity within those communities and then slowly inject better and better ideas. And the problems can be solved because now we can solve them at scale. You don't have to solve them one at a time. So I think the best hurdle in really creating the transformation and pulling it in from 25 years to 15 years is not so much technology but the bridge between the competence, the people who are very technologically advanced and the people who have the compassion and the real understanding of what people really need. So if we can bridge those two divides, if we can connect competence to connectedness, if we can inject a huge amount of compassion in that effort, I think we can get there faster. So the compassion helps in terms of connecting the bridge, connecting the divide and making the divide disappear, okay? That's great. If I can say something, please. See, as Desh pointed out, we are always thinking of figuring out a solution. No, we must figure out the problem. Most of the time, a problem is not figured out, but solutions are being superimposed one on top of the other and these solutions over a period of time have become major problems by themselves. So to everybody, you know, this has become a thing in the business schools, even in high schools, they are doing this and of course parents have been doing this always. What is the purpose for which you will live and religions have been pushing one kind of purpose, technology is putting another kind of purpose, parents and society pushing other things. See, there is no need to find a separate purpose than life because life is the greatest phenomena that's happening here. If you become an overflowing of life, that is, if you become an overflowing of your humanity, essentially, you will find a purpose because whether you do technology or spirituality or you grow a crop, essentially the fundamental business is human well-being. If we understand this, not intellectually, but if every human being in our education systems, we think that in trying to be objective, we are removing all the subjectivity that a human being is made of. Objective approach is needed for certain aspects of life, but life itself is a subjective process. If we ignore human experience and try to develop technology, try to do things, try to build nations and do everything, all we are becoming is in the end, we see we are inhuman to each other. This inhumanity is not coming by intent. It is a systemic inhumanity that is happening. Simply because we have not focused on the subjectivity of the human being, we think everything can be dissected and understood. If I want to know you, I cannot know you by dissection. By dissection, I will kill you. Only by inclusion, I shall know you. So, this is not brought into our education systems. Because of this, it looks like technology and humanity are growing in two different directions. That is not the way forward, definitely. So, how do we make a person inclusive, Sadhguru? See, life is inclusive. It is only the intellect which is exclusive, and it has to be because, see, my body and your body are two different things. There is no way these two things can be one till we are buried, of course. When we are buried, we'll all become soil. But till then, you are separate, I'm separate. My mind and your mind, they're two different things. Here and there, we may overlap, but my mind is my mind, your mind is your mind. But there is no such thing as your life and my life. This is a living cosmos. You captured some, I captured some. This is like soap bubbles. Suppose you blow soap bubbles, this is my bubble, this is your bubble. When the bubble bursts, do you say this is my air and this is your air? There's no such thing. So, the most important part is, right now because of… I'm saying this without any prejudice, the entire world's education has become… come from European foundations, where there was such a dogmatic religious impositions that when people were allowed to think for themselves, thinking means essentially an intellectual process, which is happening from a limited data that we have gathered and a logical thinking based on that. When they were allowed to think for themselves or they broke loose from the religious dogma and started thinking for themselves, they thought this is the biggest breakthrough and they energised it and formed the education system entirely on that. Today the whole world has taken to this form of education. Because of this, we're using only one dimension of intelligence, which is our intellect. Tell me if I ask you, do you want a sharp intellect or a blunt one? Sharp, no? Yes, you chose right. Otherwise I would have blessed you. So, essentially your intellect is like a knife, it's a cutting instrument. If it's sharp means it's a cutting instrument. Now, to cut something it is a very ideal thing to do. If you want to dissect something and look at it and understand it, yes, but I'm asking, will you understand life ever by dissection? You can only know life by inclusion and experience, isn't it? So it doesn't matter whether you're doing technology or spirituality or what, it doesn't matter what you're doing. If you want to know life in its essence, it's only inclusiveness. So inclusiveness is not my idea or your idea. This is the nature of life. Right now as I sit here, what I exhale the trees are inhaling, what the trees exhale I am inhaling. How come we read this in the textbook and don't relate it to our life? Because education is taught in such a way. Why is it our children don't understand? They know that plants are giving out oxygen, we are giving out carbon dioxide. How come experientially they don't feel it that when they look at a tree, one part of their lungs is hanging out there, they don't feel it? By just making people feel this, we started an entire movement called Project Green Hands from the... that it has evolved. Today we've planted millions and millions of trees, you can't stop people from planting simply because they feel that when they exhale the tree is inhaling it, when the tree exhales they are inhaling it. Is it not true? Is it not true it's happening? But there is no experiential dimension to our education. Objectivity is good to understand physical phenomena in the world, but you will not get life through objectivity. You need a subjective inclusiveness. So how do we get this? Let me reinforce Sadhguru's message in the entrepreneurship jargon that people use. So, you know, the old educational system was you learn everything there is to know and then you practice that particular proficiency for the next 30, 40, 50 years. The world is changing so fast now, that's not the way it's going to work anymore. You know, all the young people that are listening to us who want to build their careers, it's almost like things are reversed. It's a more, it always starts with an emotional experience. It's all, you have to fall in love with something and then you learn everything to be able to do that thing that you love. And then what you do keeps changing every few years. And so that decision that you decide as to what is it that you really want to learn? Because you're really, the whole education system needs to transform to learning how to learn as opposed to learning any one particular thing because knowledge is becoming available everywhere now, right? You can just Google everything. And so, but that decision is a very emotional experience. In fact, a lot of the MBAs and managers and so on, they all learn how to make decisions. But so, you're all taught in the business schools as to how you look at your options, A, B, C and you align everything up and then you come up with a figure of merit and you make your decisions. But what I've found is that anytime you do anything big in life, whether you're starting a company, getting married, buying a home or anything, any major shift that you make in your life, the unknown overwhelms the known. And therefore, people who approach these big decisions in life intellectually never get there. They get stuck because there'll be their whole life trying to figure out whether they should start a company or not and it never happens, right? And so, the journey of entrepreneurship starts with that emotional experience. It's an irrational decision. But that's what people have to learn. The young people have to learn how to figure out where their passion is and what they love and pursue that particular passion. So how do we... Your logic can penetrate life to some extent, but right now, the problem is we are trying to put the whole life process to make it fit into our logic. It will never fit. Even like they said, even a simple thing like to get married or not, they're going on thinking for 15 years. Should I or should I not? So it's a good... No, no, everything in life becomes so complex when you try to rationally explain everything that it just doesn't fit in. So, Sadhguru, you had a fortune to spend a lot of time in the forest while growing up. I mean, you observed the nature, animals, everything and you had experienced that life and you know... I was also one of them, so I was okay. That's funny, Sadhguru. But I mean, how do we get the students or children these days when we're all living in big towers and the buildings and all that, how do we get the children exposed to that kind of life around us, you know, the trees, the mountains and the forests and the animals and the life, how they interdependent on each other. And as you talked about the trees, they exhale and we inhale, we exhale and they inhale. That kind of dependency, how do the children get to know this? See, if we are concerned about a child's growth, one important thing is that they must be exposed to nature to whatever extent possible. But not everybody it may be possible like me. I went off for weeks in the jungle by myself and it is all now a success story because I survived. But it is very easy not to survive, it's very much possible. So, it is not that every child has to do that. Well, I went away and it was a big adventure for me, but it was a trauma for my parents. I can't imagine my daughter going away into the jungle without telling me and how will I deal with it? Definitely it's a big concern. But safer ways of doing things are there. In most countries it is possible still to do it. So, one thing is when we build a school right now, here we have a school. Well, we are a few hundred acres, but our backyard is ten thousand square miles of rainforests. Now we are building a leadership academy near Bangalore and also a school. So, again we are building next to a forest and we have clearly explained why we want it next to the forest because we don't want either the leadership academy that we are building and the school that we are building, they must have connection with nature because there is no greater life… there is no greater teacher than life. People think life means life's experience. No, not just life's experience, life itself. The way life process is happening by right… right now, you just see every insect is a great entrepreneur. Tremendous entrepreneurs they are. Do you know how they make their living? Doesn't matter where you put them, they just know how to make a life out of it. So, every insect, every worm, they are all tremendous entrepreneurs. If you just see their relentless focus on what they want and how they achieve it, it's absolutely incredible. And unfortunately, this whole idea, you know, these ideas have been put into human minds that we were made in God's image, all other creatures are here to serve us. This is all rubbish. You just look at an ant, you look at a mouse, you look at a little bird, how much resilience and adventure they have. This… it's unbelievable. What they do and every day their life is so much at risk, they're not just doing ventures, they're doing adventure every day. So, there is no better school than nature. If not going away by themselves, organized ways of approaching this, we must do because removing them completely from the source of life and trying to build an artificial sense of life is definitely going to come back to us in a very bad way somewhere. Yeah, I agree. You know, they… they… A lot of times people say, why is it that so many Indians who have come to US have become entrepreneurs and done so well, right? And mostly because you need out-of-box thinking, right? And out-of-box thinking comes naturally to people who are out of the box, who have a very diverse experience. So, what you see in Sadhguru's background is the diversity of exposure to different things. And… and when you get exposed, so… so I think young people, if they get an opportunity to get exposed to different things, whether it's technology or nature or society, people from different backgrounds, different languages, different countries, the more diverse your exposure is, the more is your keen insight into, number one, the humility to know where you belong in this world. And secondly, to see where you can do things that can have impact. And so I think looking for opportunity for that diversity is… is very important. As a life, the… the only two boxes that you should be in is, one is when you're in your mother's womb, it's a box, that protection is needed. Once you come out, no more box till the last box you get into. Very well said, Sadhguru. Very well said. Sadhguru, you… you have a attention, you can absorb anything and kind of grasp that very quickly. And… and I was amazed that you drew a painting, a bit of a painting and it was auctioned off for over five crores. And I knew that you are not a painter or artist and… And now I am. Now I am. Oh, you are. Now you are. So tell us about that power of attention that you can… you can watch something and learn something so well, so well that you could do anything. See, every human being is capable of this. It is just that people are busy. Our… unfortunately, our idea of knowledge has become conclusions, making conclusions, making conclusions, conclusions. I feel ninety-five percent of humanity is largely crippled humanity. They cripple themselves or they allow the society and the dogmas and other kinds of things to cripple them. Probably only two to five percent of humanity is leading the humanity forward. If everybody was in that mode, wow, we wouldn't take so many centuries to do this thing. We would have just done it like that if all the brains got together. But unfortunately, most of them cripple themselves. Some of them throw anchors and make sure you cannot go forward. All the time it's happening at all levels, I'm sure all of you have wasted in a million different ways in your lives. So this problem is because we have considered a bunch of conclusions as knowledge. See, there is a very beautiful parable where we are talking about, you know, the first man and woman on the planet supposed to be, at least in some cultures. Adam and Eve, this is a dumb couple who don't know what to do. So, they... they're just going about their life without knowing what is what. And then it seems, it seems the Creator or the God told them that you can eat whatever you want except from this one tree, which is the tree of knowledge. By eating the fruit of knowledge, they fell. What this means is, see, our parents are always saying you must get more knowledge. Our teachers are goading us to get more knowledge. Entire society is pushing us towards that. But it seems God said, do not eat the fruit of knowledge. And by eating that, they fell. This is not about some Adam and Eve, this is every Adam and every Eve. The moment you arrive at conclusions, you have fallen. Your ability to experience something is lost because you have conclusions about it. The moment you conclude, say, now I think you're a good man. I cannot experience you for what you are right now. Or I think you're a bad man. I cannot experience you for what you are right now because I have either positive or negative conclusions. I can't see you for who you are right now. Life is either a wall or a door, simply depending upon can you see clearly or not, isn't it? This happened, if it's okay, can I share a simple experience? Sure. Okay. This happened, you know, like my daughter, she grew up with me. Since she was three-and-a-half months of age, she was travelling with me wherever I go. And always I'm staying in so many people's homes and I noticed that the problem with adults is they all want... When they see a child, they want to teach something. At least they want to teach one, two, three, Mary had a little lamb, something. I said, I saw this urge in them and said, see, I don't want you to teach her anything. Nobody should teach her anything. You can play with her, you can be with her, you can talk to her, but no teaching. They said, how is this possible? If you don't even learn one, two, three, what will happen to this girl? Somebody said, she won't know how many fingers she's got on her hands. I said it doesn't matter whether she knows how many fingers she has or not. She will know how to use her fingers. That's all that matters to me. I call this thousand. What does it matter? Hello? You call it ten. I call it thousand. What does it matter? I know how to use my fingers, that's all that matters. And whether Mary had a lamb or not, I don't care. So I said nobody teach anything because everybody wants to teach a child something that's not worked in their life. When I say it's not worked in their life, see when they were children, how joyful and wonderful and exuberant life they were. And by the time they're thirty-five, they become like they're sinking down. As if earth is pulling them down, most people have become like that. Why? Because whatever conclusions they have made has not worked, isn't it? And they call this knowledge. So she grew up like this without any influence on her. When she was twelve, thirteen years of age, one day she came back from school and she was disturbed about what happened in the school that day and she said, you're teaching everybody so many things, you don't teach me anything. I said, see, I don't do anything unsolicited. Now that you've come, okay, sit down here. And I said, see, this is all you need to know. Never look up to anybody. She looked at me with the expression, what about you kind of expression. I said, especially me, never look up to me. Because if you look up to me, maybe you'll take my picture and nail me on the wall. I'm no use there. You must see me for what I am. If you see me for what I am, I'm of immense value. If you look up to me, you will put me in heaven and I'll be no use to you. And never look down on anybody. Do not look down on anybody or anything. Do not look up to anybody or anything. See everything the way it is. You will navigate your life effortlessly. Yeah. Absolutely, Sadhguru. So, Sadhguru and Desha, we have about 600 students registered for Moonshot Junior Entrepreneurship and Leadership Program Bootcamp for nine weeks. Moonshot prepares the students for Industry 4.0, the Entrepreneurial Revolution, and to empower them to become future entrepreneurs and leaders. These students are predominantly from rural areas, studying in Rajiv Gandhi University of Knowledge Technologies, Sri Venkateshwara University, Sri Padmaati Vishwamidhi Alayum, Isha Vidya, Isha Home School, and Vivekananda Bala Mandir. So, these students have submitted over 500 questions, Sadhguru. It was a tough task to get that. Desha suggested that we should involve the students. And so, we went to the students and said, you know, your meeting. So, these are the questions they have. We gave them the option to ask either Sadhguru or Desha or both. So, this is how we selected some questions. So, this is the first question is from Soumya. She is in Isha Vidya, Ramaniam Metric Higher Secondary School, 12th standard commerce stream. She is in India. This question is for Desha. Desh, what inspired you to develop your idea? You know, I think a lot of it is just realizing that there is magic everywhere. You know, I mean, there are some very big entrepreneurs like Bill Gates or Sadhguru and people like that who... Hey, don't put me there. No, no, no, no. Having, you know, having the ability to make very big differences, right? But as you walk around, there are entrepreneurs everywhere, just like Sadhguru was talking about the bird, the ant and everything else. Every institution we look at, whether it's a school or a college or hospital or a company, small company, big company, a retail store, at some, you know, it sort of appears like it's always been there. But that's not true. At some point, it wasn't there. And somebody had the vision to start it. And so there are entrepreneurs everywhere. You know, there are people who look at the world and say, you know, I think it can be different. And they start their journey without really knowing exactly how to get there. But they have the strong urge to get there. And they figure things out as they go along. And when you see that power, that power of ability to see how something can be better and making a commitment and then getting there and getting everybody to believe in that mission, I think it's just a very, very powerful tool. And I started seeing that in, you know, in everywhere. And that's what got me going. So, Sadhguru, what about you? What inspired you to, you know, come up with the Isha Foundation and the things that you're doing? Well, I'm not an inspired person because I don't know how to put this, this could be misunderstood, but let me explain this. See, for me, I have no ambition because ambition means to achieve something or to get something in life, whatever. I paid attention to life and I saw, if I'm willing, the entire universe is mine. The whole world is mine. All the people are mine. All the creatures are mine. I'm saying your company, Desh's company, all the big companies, I see it as mine. Well, I'm not interested in your revenue. I'm interested in what you're doing. People are always telling me, Sadhguru, this is such a small place, why are you going and talking? I say, it doesn't matter, small or big, it is just that what they're doing is important. What their revenue is is not my business, revenue is their headache. My thing is, what are they doing? Is it significant in some way? If it's significant, it is mine. Anyway, the world is mine. I'm asking everybody and this little girl from Isha Vidya, is this world yours or not? If it's yours, everything that you can do, you do. As a part of that, Isha Yoga Center happened, that everything that we can do, we are still doing, we are building a large spiritual city in United States and we are doing many things in the world, not because of an ambition, not because of wanting to get somewhere, not because of wanting to get something, simply because this is our world. We want to make it as beautiful and wonderful as possible. This is a very selfish goal. It is just that, why are you stingy with your selfishness? Include everything into your selfishness, then everything selfishness is wonderful. Everybody's talking about selflessness. How can you be selfless and be active? You cannot be. There's no such thing as selfless because your very experience of life is based on yourself. What you see right now, what you hear right now, only because there is self, you can see, hear, speak and everything. So there is no life without self. Now, whether your selfishness is concerned only about you or your family or your community or your nation or the world, all the entire universe are all life involved. So I'm saying the simplest way is, if everything is yours, there is so much to be done, depending upon what is your competency, you do that to the best possible way. That's all there is. So, Sadhguru, when you say something… Some ways. No, I was just going to say, Sankuru, in some ways… No, I didn't… I didn't claim the revenue. No, no, no. But your company is my company. That's how I see it. But ability to have an influence on so many people, like you say, it expands as your intentions become clearer and clearer and the self part diminishes. In fact, I see the same thing with companies too. People who start with wanting to make some money, wanting to do this, get a name, get a name and so on, they get to some extent, but they get stunted. It's the people who really want to make a difference, where the self is not at the center, are the ones who really make a big difference. So I think there's a very common characteristics. You don't start by saying, it's my ambition, because as soon as you say my ambition, the game is over. Shall I share my problems with you? Sure. So this happened when I was twenty-five years of age, and one day I'm just sitting on the famous Chamundi Hill. And suddenly I realized that I'm just bursting with ecstasy. Every cell in my body is dripping ecstasy. Then I pay attention to this. Why is this happening to me? What is it? Then I realized if I take my hand off my mind, if I don't mess with my mind, everything within me is just bursting in ecstasy. Then I experimented this little more and then found a way. Then I knew that I could make everybody ecstatic. So I sat down and made a plan. In two-and-a-half years time, on that day the world's population was 5.6 billion people. I said in two-and-a-half years time, I'll make the whole world ecstatic, because who will not want it? Who will not want to live blissfully? I thought nobody will reject it. See, thirty-nine years. Oh, you're getting there, you're getting there. So you know, people say today we have touched over whatever 1.2, 1.3 billion people are nearly two billion people, but still that's not my idea of the world. It's 7.8 billion people today. So I know I will die of failure, but I'm a blissful failure. Okay, so I have a second question. It's from Murgawal Swami Vivekananda Mandir metric higher secondary school, science stream 12 standard in India. And this question is for Dash. What was your key driving force to become an entrepreneur? Well, it's just excitement. For me, life is made if you get up in the morning and you're excited about the day and have fun that day. And if you can live every day of your life like that, there's nothing more to it. And the very first company I worked for was a little company, Toronto, that was owned by Motorola, but it was a little startup. And that's where I got that experience over the four years building a big business and so on. But every year it was a whole new experience in terms of realizing that I could do things that I never thought of. And even more so, the people that you hired and worked with you, they all would say, oh, I didn't know I could do all these things. So it's just that it's entrepreneurship is the best way to have that expansive experience, the experiencing life as it happens, as Satguru is talking about. And so that was the hook. And I feel very blessed that I have that opportunity to be able to do that. So Desh, you could have made a small difference but with the routers that you and your company and your engineers design, now you connected all the planets. I mean, today we are having discussion or this Zoom is one of the reason is those routers are transmitting the data at such a high fast speed and we are having. So you didn't just take a small problem but you took a very, very big problem to solve. Yeah, but inside of me, I share the same feeling as Satguru, I'm going to die of failure. You know, I think the world is so huge and so big, anything you do, if you can make a small dent in the world, that's a good thing. And the more you do, the more you see what you don't know. And so it may sound very big, but I think I don't feel that way, but it's good. It's good to be able to learn the tools, the techniques and also clarify your own intentions, your own missions and everything else to make a bigger and bigger difference. But it's such a small effort in what needs to get done in the humanity and the universe. That is a very humbling experience. So you're also talking about humanity, universe, inclusivity. Did you feel that the whole universe is, I mean, you're part of the whole universe and you have- Well, I haven't had the experience of every cell of my body experiencing the ecstasy, but I do have my movements of joyous periods. So I'm not quite at this stage of Satguru, but maybe Satguru will get me there someday. He taught me that one month ago. If I don't get you there, it adds to my failure. If I don't get you there, it increases my failure percentage. So Satguru, what are your thoughts? What is a key driving force to become an entrepreneur? You're also an entrepreneur. You want to change the world. You want to make the human beings better and live happily, healthily. So what's your driving force? Say nothing drives me, I drive everything, so I'm okay. This is what the significance of this culture, the significance of yogic traditions is just this, that there is no driving force in your life. You are the driving force. You are the peak of evolution on this planet. You should not be looking for any other driving force in your life. You must be in the driver's seat. So if you are not the driver and the driving force, then there is a serious problem. Because then you will imagine all kinds of things and these imaginations have led to various kinds of conflicts, various kinds of troubles and the level of violence and atrocities that we have committed upon each other is, we are not even seeing that it is we who are driving this. See, if I'm driving a car and I think God is driving the car, if I hit you, you know, it's God's will, what can I do? If I know I'm driving the car, I don't want to hit you. It's very natural for me to look at it that way. I'm using a very basic example, but it is true in every way because the worst things on the planet have been done by claiming that I have been driven by something else, whether it's a philosophy or an ideology or a heavenly master or whatever, I've been driven by something else gives you a certain insurance to do whatever nonsense you wish to do. This has to go. The basis of this movement is this, from religion to responsibility. It's important that human beings see for every thought, for every emotion, for every action that I perform, this is my action. This is my karma. It's my doing. There's no excuse for this. There's no explanation for it. Wow, very sensible set group. So I have another question. This comes from Pawan Kumar Reddy Mintapalli from Rajiv Gandhi University of Knowledge Technologies is doing BTEC third year, is in India and this question is for Sadhguru. So how do I know what I want in my life? You should not want anything because as I said earlier, the only precious thing in your life and the greatest value in your life is life. How to enhance this life? If you see, you will naturally enhance every other life around you. If you have a technical brain, you will do something like this. If you have a agricultural mind, you will do something on the land. If you have a political mind, you will do something in the policy. If you have a spiritual mind, you will do this. That is an inclination of the mind due to certain exposures and you know, inclinations have developed because of exposures that we have. But fundamentally, it is life. Router is meaningless if it doesn't enhance human life, isn't it? It enhances human life. That is why it is valuable. The technology is valuable because it is enhancing life. So let us not misunderstand this. Technology is not the most valuable thing. Life is the most valuable thing because that's the only thing we have. We think we have many other things. We think we have wealth. We think we have money. We think we have something else. No, we have. The only thing that we have is life. See, right now we are sitting here. If the life is taken out of this, what is the use of these clothes? What is the use of this building? What is the use of the money? What is the use of the knowledge? What is the use of anything? These are all, you know, accessories to life. We are misunderstanding accessories as life. No. If you hold life as the prime thing, you will see your body, your brain will develop in such a way, depending upon where we are placed. In the times in which we are born, what we did as a previous generation, this generation need not do the same thing because so many things have been done till there, till now, that you don't have to start from zero again. So what you do, do not decide because something drives you or what drives me, what drives you, what is my ambition, what is your ambition? No. It is just that you must see if you have evolved yourself, if you strive to evolve yourself, you will be able to see. When you see, you will see what is needed. When you see what is needed, you find a solution for that. You see how to enhance that. That's all life is. As I said, if Desh was here thousand years ago, maybe you would have built a fantastic bullock cart. Absolutely. That would go really fast. Yeah, it would go really fast. Don't make it go faster than the bulls. Desh, you want to share about that? Something. Yeah, I think it's what I find is that people who have a vibrant life, countries that have a vibrant life, communities that have a vibrant life, the people there are excited about life and they see. I mean, it's not like they don't see problems, but when they see a problem, they get all excited and they want to solve it. And so as a result of that, there is a lot of excitement in those communities, in those organizations. Whereas some communities which become impoverished, essentially look at things and then they can't do anything. They feel victimized. They feel helpless. They complain. And so I think these students, they should look at themselves and say, am I a complainer or am I excited about things? If they find themselves complaining, then they will never get anywhere. They have to tell a matter even if you have problems. Even problems are exciting. Even bad situations are exciting, as long as you have a certain sense of way of looking at it. And then you get into action. You do something about it. What happens is a lot of times people get very discouraged because they know they need to go to A to B from A. A is where they are, but they don't know how to get there. And that's where you need to develop this confidence and optimism and everything else. One of the things I find about people who lead a very exciting life tend to have two characteristics. One is they're very optimistic about everything. Doesn't matter how difficult a situation is, they always feel like tomorrow is going to be better than today. And secondly, they're somewhat naive. They somehow feel like they can do anything. And so that naivete and optimism are probably fantastic assets to develop in one's life and so that you need a deciding life. Yes. See, life is full of situations and situations. It is left to us whether we want to label it as a problem or not. It's just a situation. Some situations we know how to handle. Some situations we don't know how to handle yet. We have not figured out how to handle a given situation. So now we label it as a problem and we worry about it and we break our heads on it. No, here what we have developed with Isha is this. See, we have very large banyan trees and people trees which we have grown. And we also have lots of banyan trees and people trees growing in small parts as bonsai trees. But when I look at them, the bonsai banyan is as happy as the big banyan because actually he's better nourished most of the time. Maybe his scope is limited. So we are like this. Wherever we are, we are doing our best. If the scope expands, we will just expand. If it doesn't, within that limited scope, we are fine. We are not seeing it as a problem. The scope is small right now. Right now this pandemic came. Everybody is suffering. But I think we have done wonderfully well during this pandemic. All our events are cancelled. Our revenues are seriously down. But we are doing great actually. I'm even sleeping at home. So there is no complaint. It's a different situation. So this situation we are doing and actually in terms of reaching people, because that's our main work, in terms of impact, we have multiplied in this one-and-a-half years time. We are using technology like never before, thanks to this for blinking faster. So the faster and faster they blink, the reach is bigger and bigger, because this is the first time in the history of humanity. Many great beings have come. But when they spoke, hardly ten people could hear. Out of then ten people, five people will go and misinterpret some other way. Another three people will go and say some nonsense. One or two people may, you know, transmit whatever that was said. This is the first time in the history of humanity, we can sit here and talk to the entire world. Now if we do not transform humanity, in my opinion, it simply means that we don't care. Because we have the tools, we have the technology, we have all the possibility. If we don't do it, it just shows that we don't care. Like we have all the food that we need in the world for all the 7.6 billion people. Still twenty percent of them are hungry, malnourished, whatever, twenty to twenty-five percent. This is simply because we don't care. We can transport food wherever we want. We have not cared enough. So at least transmitting knowledge, transmitting methods and possibilities for human well-being, if we don't do it now, with all the means on our hands, now that is shows that you lack humanity. Because human beings are suffering their own minds, their own bodies, their own emotions. They don't need any external torture. They're on self-help. So if they can be on self-help of misery, they can also be on self-help of blissfulness. Definitely they can be. So there are only situations in life, situations and situations. But the only thing that we possess is life. As long as life is here, everything is fine. Or maybe today we are... Somebody is you know, maybe eating this, tomorrow they may eat something less, today they may be in a palace, tomorrow you may be in a hut. But the important thing is these are all accessories. The main thing is this, as long as this is there, there's really no problem. Just situations. Either you have learned to enjoy your situations or suffer your situations, that's up to you. If you're enjoying your situations, you will always see how to improve it. If you're suffering, you see everything as a closure, as a barrier and you suffer that. And in a way, essentially cripple yourself. Yeah, thank you, sir Guru. So while we... We had such a wonderful conversation, fifty-five minutes already passed, so it's a closing time. So Desha, you said entrepreneurship two common attributes. They are naive and they're optimistic. So after today's session, I'm very, very inspired to solve a coming rare earth material shortage that would be happening because of electric vehicles and batteries demand taking off. If I have another life, I would like to build an efficient transport mechanism to go to asteroid named 16 Psyche, to mine trillions of dollars worth of nickel, cobalt and precious metals like platinum and gold. Here is, I have a plan for next life. I like to be born in St. Louis. St. Louis was the hotbed of space engineers for Moon mission in 60s and 70s. I like to enroll into inner engineering at age 17 to establish stable mind and body. And I will leverage Desh Foundation's E for all ecosystem, entrepreneur for all ecosystem to get the mentorship, funding and all that to solve small local problems to make money and invest that money into fusion research to build cheaper and portable energy systems to go to asteroid 16 Psyche, mine the rare earths and bring them back to earth. Once I'm done with this, I would like love to colonize all human habitable planets in our solar system. Then in our nearest stars, Proxima Centauri, Alpha Centauri, A and B. I do hope that our next generation is inspired by these immense possibilities that exist in our solar system and in our Milky Way Galaxy. Thank you, Sadhguru. Can I say something on that? Absolutely, Sadhguru. You're saying about this asteroid, whatever, bringing lithium, whatever, you're only talking in terms of dollars, but you're not looking at the millions of tons that you will bring into this planet. If you bring millions of tons of external material on this planet, we will ruin this planet. So I bless you that you should not… Because it'll be like an asteroid hit. If you bring millions of tons of material onto this planet, the very rotation and revolution of this planet will go off-sink and that'll be the end of it. Please, may you not succeed in this mission. Let us learn to live on this planet well using what we have here. Otherwise, this will lead to disasters. Regions of today, tomorrow should not be disasters of tomorrow. It's very important. Yeah, at least what I felt is the future… But at the age of seventeen, you will come to Inner Engineering. I like that. So, Satguru, Inner Engineering, I took it very late. When I was 60 years old, I took it. It transformed my life. I mean, I have learned to live happily every moment of life. I don't have anger. And my health has improved. My relationships have improved. Satguru, I don't know what it is. It works. It worked for me. And we had Harvard Medical School Associated Hospital come in and do the research on our employees. The stress level went down by 50%. They were happy. And that's why the stress level, whatever they measured, perceived stress score has gone down 50%. In fact, today, all employees and interns joining my Hyderabad office, as part of the onboarding program, we have Inner Engineering as a compulsory onboarding course. Why would I… Why would I invest my life on something that doesn't work? Absolutely. I think people… I mean, seeing this program, I would say one thing I would say is Inner Engineering works. It has worked. It has scientifically proven. And it has helped me personally. My employees and my employees went through the pandemic very, very joyfully. They didn't really get worried and concerned. And this program has amazing way to transform and be inclusive and think of the whole universe as ourselves and solve the bigger problems that we have using problem-solving mindset and innovation. So we can make this whole planet better. And Desh has a wonderful plan to do this E for all entrepreneurship for all. And he likes to build an entrepreneurial ecosystem in every university, college, and school or any town. And I would love to see, especially the IITNs who are in the United States who came. We got so much from our country, India. So let's see whether we can team up with the Desh Foundation and roll out this E for all for our universities, our villages, our hometowns. So that the entrepreneurs have the tools and the mentorship and the funds available to make this planet a better planet. That's fantastic. Most needed in India right now. Thank you very much. Namaskaram. Thank you very much. Namaskaram.