 Densu India was the most awarded agency in 2022 at Cannes. They also managed to bring home the coveted agency of the year which had eluded India. I have with me a very senior leader from Densu, Chukh Chang who is the CEO of Creative APEC. Hi Chukh. Hello, great to be here with you. Were you under immense pressure to perform this year after the glorious return last year? Look for us, I think the main challenge for us as a group this year was to show that we could deliver breadth. So last year there was quite a lot of success based on really one fantastic campaign, great work done from India. And if anything, what that campaign did was inspire the rest of Densu Creative across the world to really up its game with innovation and great creativity. And what is the secret sauce for winning at Cannes? Because this year has not been as sensational as last year. So what, what did, where did you go wrong and where do you think you still have hopes? Look, I wouldn't say that this year has not been as successful because we've come out already with two Grand Prix and it's only two days in. So I think it's been a very successful year. I mean from India perspective. Only for India. Look, India, we still have a chance. We've still got three particular campaigns that are up for medal and one of them is actually one of bronze already. So I would say it's already successful because winning a bronze is incredibly hard in Cannes. Okay, I don't think anyone can forget that. I think when you raise the bar and you say that you've achieved a Grand Prix, that is once in a lifetime. But even a bronze is actually once in a lifetime for any creative agency. So I don't think that we can in any, any, any way dilute the importance of that. I think it's critical for everyone to understand that even a bronze is incredibly difficult to achieve. You know, just, just like you said last year, India managed that agency of the year riding on the back of this one campaign. Yes. From an APAC perspective, which is that one campaign, which is your unfiltered history tour? Yes. Now, which is that one campaign that's really working for you this year? I wouldn't say there's one campaign. Maybe you take it from an Indian perspective. No, no, overall from an APAC perspective. From an APAC perspective, we've actually got an incredible body of work across Taiwan, Australia, India, Indonesia, India. We've got, we've got a broad body of work this year across all of our markets. Okay, another thing is Densu had dropped his international CEO designation after the departure of Wendy Club. I think after Fred, Fred left the agency, I mean, there has not been a successor in regard to the global CCO. So at this point is every region their own boss at can look, I think the thing important to understand is with Fred's departure, it doesn't mean that there's been a shift away from the importance of creativity. We've already got a way of working and a culture that is built around creativity. One person doesn't determine whether or not we are still as hungry or passionate about delivering great work and a great creative product. So we've already had that in place already, as you can see by the breadth of work that we've had this year in terms of short lists. But another thing is, even at the India level, after Ajay's departure, there's not really been a CCO. Just trying to understand, I mean, is it okay or healthy for an agency to not have top leadership positions or have it vacant for this amount of time? Look, having a CCO there to provide that leadership and that guidance is very important for any organization. But that said, something that is equally as important is ensuring you have a very strong creative culture and you have a very clear way of working that helps you get to great work. And we've got that. We've got a very strong proposition around modern creativity. What that means is that for us, we evaluate our work based on a creative scale. And the aim for us is a creative scale of six things. Now, four, five and six is what we evaluate our work against. So it's work that either creates culture, change society or events the future. So we've got a very clear proposition, but a very clear set of guidelines that helps us determine what great work is. Now we use those guidelines to help elevate the quality of the work. With or without a CCO there, the entire team is focused on elevating the quality of the work. Also, the other thing I want to also say is this, having a great leader there is very, very important from the point of view, guiding the team, particularly through the iteration process. But great creativity can come from anyone. Great creativity can come from a junior team, as long as you've got the right approach and the right vision. You know, our favourites seeing so many digitally led ideas coming from dance. Even all the entries this year have been so digital focused. So is that the new dance suit in the sense, I mean, of course, you've always been digitally focused. But is that really taking precedence over, I mean, like technology over good old creative scripts, you know, good old filmmaking and all of that at the moment. But I think the thing to understand is, you know, when you're talking about good old-fashioned script writing and so forth, I think that's still grounded in what we do. We are storytellers. Okay. And the heritage of dance suit has got a lot of strength in storytelling. It's how you tell the story today and how you connect branch with consumers that is different. And that's where we use technology to connect brands with consumers. So whether or not we're using mixed reality, virtual reality, the metaverse, Internet of Things, using that technology to connect brands with consumers and also tell stories is done in a very different way today in a very much more modern way, which is going back to what I say before about inventing the future and modern creativity. As far as India is concerned, I mean, this year, I don't know a very funny note in the sense there was that controversy about dance suit having or campaign, which is very similar to VML, YNR. Do you think that in any way has, I mean, effective dance suits, especially that particular campaign's prospects? Surakshaka Kalatika. Yes. But the thing I want to say about this is that great creativity, they say is never original. Okay, it always comes off the back of some other great ideas. That said, however, this is one solid campaign that has been executed against a real product. Okay, so if you compare ourselves to the other campaign, the product hasn't even launched. This is actually against the real product for a real client. So it has a lot of credibility in that. Now, the ideas aren't exactly the same. Okay, but back to my point is no creativity is ever really original, as they say, it's how you execute it. It's grounded in a very similar area, but it's not exactly the same. Okay, you know, Densu has built on this, the new proposition is modern, creative. Yes. And the restructuring in, you know, the philosophy was executed last year, you know, in a very big way. What is the best thing that has come out of the changed proposition and that having that one Densu creative brand? I'd say it gives us a very clear competitive proposition against our other very, very good strong competitors. We have a very clear proposition now to take to market. It allows us to be very focused. It allows us to evaluate what great work looks like. And, you know, they generally say awards lead to great clients, you know, more work. So I really want to understand last year was Densu in India's best year. Did it really lead to a lot of new clients coming on board? It did. I mean, we had growth in Indian market. And it's come off the back of obviously the reputation that that's been built. You know, has it allowed us to scale in a way it does? It doesn't always. Okay. So when you're doing great creative work, creative work helps you build that reputation and then you work off that reputation to then grow the business. But in our case, yes, the reputation actually has helped us win new clients and new business. Would you like to name some? I mean, at India level? At an India level? Yeah. Look, I don't know the exact list of new clients. But yeah, you can circle back that and with our local business. And just one last question. If you have to really rate the Densu markets in APAC? Yes. The countries? Yes. Which one would be in the top three? Look, I think you'd have to look in that way. For me, every market is important. Okay. And it depends on how you look at it. You can look at it from a scale of revenue. You can look at it from a talent point of view. But most importantly, you've got from a work point of view. Now, having evaluated against all three, I would say that we are pretty even across a lot of our APAC markets. But because I'm talking to you, I think it's very important to say that India has got some amazing talent. As you can see from the great body of work that we've had shortlisted this year and can't. Super. And I'm very glad to hear that India is number one on the list. Also, not just because you're talking to me, I'm sure deep down you don't want to believe that. Yes, indeed. Super. Thank you so much. Pleasure. It was a pleasure talking to you. Thank you so much. Thank you.