 Welcome to the 21 convention podcast. I'm Steve Maeda and today we have two of our most requested Podcast interviewees that is Sasha day game and James Marshall. It gets fun. It gets exciting goes all over the place And of course it gets very very real gonna have to definitely take notes listen to this one Don't forget to subscribe follow us on Facebook YouTube Twitter all that sort of stuff Leave a comment down below and we'll get back to you. Let's get into this interview and man some awesome stuff on the way What is happening I am here with Sasha day game James Marshall the 21 convention podcast. What's happening gents? This is gonna be the most quiet it's gonna be for the next hour we just I just want to say that Well, I mean we should really just for the first time ever lost for words James over here he's feeling a little bit intimidated because as usual I'm dressed up all fancy and he just likes to take it easy And he doesn't really he doesn't really think it matters what you wear as long as you've got it really Well, I think it matters. I just haven't figured it out yet. I'm just you know, I'm working I've been modeling you for quite a while and incrementally. I think you've slowly been here and there putting on the fashion Yeah, sometimes What stimulated this change in you James Well, I think we've stimulated quite a lot of changes in each other over the last few years Sexually emotionally Fuck on all levels. Yeah, I mean we're more or less the same brain in two slightly different bodies now So, yeah, you know, we've been talking about this a lot with the different podcasts, but how does that happen? I mean, there's a certain level of influence and connection I mean, we're all working in the seduction dating realm And so there's this hyper level of empathy hyper level of connection hyper level of sexual exchange But and competition and gossip as well. Yeah, yeah, totally. That's like the ante. That's the disconnect but in all of that like how is your process happened because both of you guys have been in sync on Many different levels and then maybe disappear for a few months and come back together like how is that kind of ebb and flow, you know Worked for you guys Well But first let me just say we were joking about the fact obviously if anyone there's like this doesn't make any sense James dresses better than Sasha then you're stupid and you should have realized we're iron. I already maybe you need some social dynamics training to get You didn't get that joke. You need joke training joke training getting jokes 2016 year after neck, I'll be there Yeah, I mean we just you know We're just sort of we started out as polar kind of opposites of me being like super crazy fucking running around I'm bad and James and that's changed somewhat yeah, definitely and then and then James was just like really fucking quiet. I'll show him what I used Go ahead. You do your move. Yeah, there it was. I'll do I'll do it with James's impression of me No, I'm pushing you use like what's I think you're fucking hot. Yeah See three years ago James wouldn't have been that animated. No, there's no he wouldn't have done any of that He just would have been like yeah Sasha's funny. That would have been it So yeah, we just started off that way and ever since we met for the first time at actually We all met together at 2011 21 convention that's right in the bathroom and the catacombs of that Well, you know, there was that that underground hallway. Yeah, yeah, yeah Bumped and then we like me and I was like dudes. I'm really depressed my business is going down the drain sessions Like I want to get out of London. Well, no, but this is something which is is crazy because a turning point for everybody You know what you wanted at that moment what you wanted that moment turned into different things And there was like man, what am I gonna take a chance on? You know, what am I gonna do and that is so important for the roles of you know What you teach and coach and what you teach and coach could only come from that root of like, you know doubt and question within yourself in taking the chance the You know the path that didn't always look great, you know And having faith in it and I've I've even seen you guys process through that but like what what happened 2011 to 2014, you know, where'd the adventure take it? Well shitloads happened. We've we've circled the world Multiple times together and separately since then but yeah, that really was a turning point because although probably to the outside world When they're looking at our YouTube videos and stuff. They're like those guys have got it sorted. They figured it out They got chicks and fun awesome. Yeah, maybe the ideal. I mean shit You know, which was to true partially But it was also true that we were you know struggling and trying to make a living and having our own personal stuff And for me at that time that was that was the darkest time of my of my adult life really You know broken up with the love of my life and business wasn't great And I took a really big gamble going over to that convention when I was living in Australia at the time And it was one of those things we just had to step into the abyss knowing that it might not pay off Yeah, then it definitely did same exact thing for me but just different scenarios in London and Was madly in love with this girl like just completely head over heels and like the like the girl for me It was it was crazy And then I meet this guy and we have this great thing and we're just like wow This could be so much fun what we're gonna do and whatever and he's like, yeah You got to come do this, you know He's got this you're to a program where he just goes around Europe teaching these courses. He's like yeah You're gonna come with me. It's gonna be awesome And I'm gonna hustle and I'll bring some clients and do this thing and make money and have a great time and whatever and It came to this ultimate choice because what people don't realize is I was actually living completely illegally In England at the time. I didn't have a visa nothing. I was just there so my choice was do it's got one yard right now But anyway, so the choice was do I stay with this girl Illegally and try and make it work with her or do I pursue my fucking dream of just like traveling the world and yeah Take it to the next level of seduction and basically follow my life Where it was taking me or just do the thing with a girl and it was fucking brutal And of course I chose walking the path that I had to and it was fucking excruciating You know, it's it's funny because I remember you saying at that 21 convention you had said You would sit like man. I don't know if this was worth it for me You know because in the the immediate results, it was a big investment I mean if you look on a map the opposite side of the world, you know It's the opposite hemisphere. You know, so it's the wrong way for Australian We're supposed to go from merry old England to Australia and stay there because we've been naughty boys Yes Fuck it and jumped and I'm like Jump That's usually what attempted suicide patients do, you know, but No, but yeah, you know, it's interesting because it did work out that was a crazy Like if you just looked at the points on the map of 21 convention speeches, it would be like 2011 then 2012 London and then 2012 Melbourne There's like a huge progression man and and even for yourself too, you know, it's like 2011 London 2011 or 12 London very very big difference. Yep, you know crazy transition and think about the time that transpired in between there of You know, you talk about the hero's journey, right? I hear you guys mention it. It was a lot of pumping Yeah, people were busy doing things we were all there in the same apartment Sometimes listening to sounds anyway Beating off in the corner or You guys like giving me a round of applause when oh, yeah, I remember that there was James had a particularly good performance We won't name the country and we won't name any details But yeah, it was just an excellent show and I was screaming and it's some kind of sound of just something hitting the wall And it was so good. I just decided let's make this funny and awkward for James because that's what I do It's kind of my thing awkward well, and I just started fucking clapping very loudly And I think you join in here's the thing Okay, is what you guys may not understand is the girl appreciated apparently She's ever involved in the seduction scene and you are a coach Okay, and you room with someone else which is inevitable because you're you're always room with people You're going to hear your buddy boning another chick, right? And it you want to talk about awkward when you're the guy sitting outside of the room. That's the awkward master Because then you have nothing to do, you know, because you're like But my favorite thing is actually to take my condoms and then leave them in pockets I did that I did that to you When you brought that Russian girl home, and then we put the banana under your pillow I Went out and I had this basically I went to not like I'm an expert with strippers But I happen to pick up a stripper one time and she was coming over with me and they all knew she was coming over with me And then I and I come upstairs and everyone's sitting around in their underwear around the table And I'll just look over with a coffee. I had my shirt tied up like this and and Gareth Jones was in his leopard print underwear Of course, he would have Just sitting there drinking tea. We're like, oh, I didn't realize he had company. Yeah And then at some point there was a banana with a con wanted as well Yeah, and then we went and we did our thing. Well, I did that because that was the sort of thing that you would do That's exactly what I would do and I wanted to get revenge in advance in advance. Yeah That's the morphine of still looking different on the outside, but James Marshall and always adapting the Sasha prankster stuff Yeah, that's the evolution. He knows sometimes now Sasha is quiet That's right that this comes back to your very first question I was sort of trying to lead into so when we met he was depressed and quite quiet and just he was just very good at You know sexual pressure and intent, but he had this real presence to him So when I came up to him at the 21th dimension, I was like, hey man, I really liked your speech I was like crazy and I just started yapping and he just kind of went Yeah, and he was he was doing his staring trick on me and then of course throughout the years I just realized that of course, you know, even though I'm a comedian. It's fun for me I can just totally mellow out and come up to girls and just be totally sexual and more just chill down whatever and actually Through through James influence and Johnny Soporno and other people, you know as I came more into kind of loving me and accepting Who I am and just being okay with myself You know because part of that comedy was really just me proving hey look how funny and look how great personality I am part of that was you know Trying to try to find myself and after a while I just you know in this process of pick up and hanging out with all these really amazing people I just came to a point where you know, I don't have to prove shit to anyone I really think I'm a great person. I love me people love me and and I can I can just as easily be hilarious and funny Or I'd be sitting in a corner totally chilled and I'm still the same cool dude And it doesn't matter and that's a huge huge transition and in a way people it's sort of funny for me Because it's public because you can see me on YouTube going from So just being there making videos chill and chill don't like hey guys, you got to love you You got to just be you know, so it's a really big thing and it's kind of in public, you know I think that's cool. It's an interesting thing because a long time ago I mean I I started out in theater and did a lot of that and one thing that I always realized was theater people were It was just a really tough template to explore yourself But stand-up comedy more so theater you're like film actor one thing, you know, you watch it There's like some narcissism there all sort of stuff. You're watching yourself on the screen But in theater, it's constant feedback, but in the stand-up comedy it's instant feedback, you know And it's just a hard thing to like build either way. It's gonna affect you You know, but what I hear you saying is that the world in seduction getting out there socializing, you know being sexual with people That's stabilized that, you know, it put it into a realm where it Morphed into this other thing. So what would you call like the root of seduction then? Self-acceptance. Yeah, you know, it's almost like you have to seduce yourself first It's like you have to figure out, you know, what do you really want? Who are you? What are you really comfortable? Who are you and what are you comfortable doing? And it really it really took from like me being like 17 years old and doing stand-up comedy Develop, you know getting to a certain point up till when I was like, you know Whatever late 20s and then getting in a pickup and then really going much much deeper in the lessons And I think it's really just shows you that it doesn't matter where you are You're always developing. Yeah, but you just have these points where you just go Oh, I'm a different person now or this has changed or this has changed I think it can be I can have a dark and a light side because we've certainly seen plenty of guys who got into seduction and coaches still today who it's really reinforced masks and Actually made them lose their soul essentially because even if they become effective at kind of hustling drunk girls into bed or You know having some basic level of yeah results They've they've totally lost their personality and it's it's just buried under this pickup Yeah, I had a guy come up to me today. Well, not today yesterday yesterday last night In in tears like he was trying to tell me something He was you know, he's on the verge of tears and there were a couple of tears And he was just saying hey dude man I used to do all this really weird Routine-based indirect shit and and I and I would get late and I'd feel fucking horrible because I wasn't being me And then I saw your video of you just running around being a dick and just doing your thing and he said and I just You know just to complete, you know, he just he was crying telling me this that he just changed his life And he just realized he could just go and be himself and just not fucking do all that shit They didn't like and it's like That was really powerful, and I've never had a fucking cry before so it was kind of cool We sing plenty of tears. You've seen me cry. Yeah, sure sure I was jealous once because at the first directing summit somebody came up to Alan Roger Curry and said to him that he was their father figure And the guy's father had actually been killed by You know because he had an affair and some dude literally he had an affair with some dude's wife And somebody came and fucking killed the guy's father No seriously and then he and then he never had a dad and Alan and Alan had been this guy's father figure for years And he like broke and he told a story and I was like, holy fuck. This is crazy That was I kind of forget any crying guys coming up to me. So I'll finally have some at some point You'll probably be sick of it. He was like, okay, we have that on well There's always there's always a couple on euro to a breakdown because they realize that they've been living a lie essentially Yeah, I mean, I think that's that's something to be wary of in any kind of personal development pursuit because you see that in like Kind of hippie circles or sure spiritual circles where this spiritual narcissism that happens where I'm so spiritual Or you know in in worlds of personal development where it's like I'm positive I'm positive positive I'm always effective and these kinds of things where people layer on top of themselves The modality in the method and then and then lose sight of what the point of the method is Which is always to come back to understanding yourself and developing yourself from a you know a deep core internal place And then when if seduction has done well or personal development has done well then yeah, it's going to be raw It's going to be heavy because you're going to have to face your demons before you you know You step into the light That's the thing and that's that's what I think sucks about the the way most people get into this Which is like reading the game or something like that. There's no depth. There's no deep It's it's just like here's a bunch of great There's just no real depth and and I think real coaching and real You know it really comes down to dealing with deep internal fucking shit and getting through it and becoming a better person And when you really again accept yourself and you're like, okay, I've dealt with that It's cool and you move on then only can you really go out there and have amazing experiences with other people? But if you if you don't accept yourself and you're hiding this shit and you feel guilt and shame You can only you just can't really progress. So I think that's man. I hate to say we got to take a quick break We will be right back and finishing this discussion and quite quiet and just he was just very good at the you know sexual pressure and the tent but yet Really big time that's something like that So crazy if you're not already More understanding of your mortality and so that was a big thing Trust are becoming normal against that are already kind of being docked. Yeah, we And make money at it. So why wouldn't I do that? So some so a same thing getting my book out got a couple of products lined up and As I came more into kind of loving me and accepting who I am and just being okay with myself If I had that on my balls, I'd be telling you your present in London and Was madly in love with this girl like just completely head over heels and like right the girl for me It was it was crazy and then I meet this guy and we have this great thing and we're just like wow This could be so much fun. We're gonna do and whatever