 So hello everybody and thank you for joining us today, wherever you are in the world. My name is Brian Motherway from the International Energy Agency, and we're delighted to welcome you to the next in our series of webinars on teams related to people sent to clean energy transitions. We've been holding a number of these events and we have plenty more plans, you can find the details of those on our website. But today's one I particularly pleased about I must say in terms of the topic but also the really excellent speakers, we have lined up. So I'll be telling you more about those in a few minutes. It's a particular honor for me to introduce to say some opening remarks, the Deputy Executive Director of the IEA, Mary versus Warwick. So Mary, thank you for joining us today in the floor of now yours. But thank you so much, Brian. It's, I'd like to begin by saying a very warm welcome to all of you from all around the world who have taken the time to join our event. I really want to thank all of the panelists for joining us today for this very important discussion. The IEA believes that the clean energy transition is a opportunity to address long standing gender disparities in energy deployment access, and many other dimensions of energy and climate. Open dialogue and exchanges such as the one we are hosting here today are really vital to ensure that we're actively proactively working to address these issues. I believe it's vital that we put a stronger focus on examining the evidence as to how clean energy policies affect both men and women, and what policies have been most successful in addressing gender issues in particular. Here at the IEA we've undertaken a number of steps to ensure our agency, along with our member governments and partners can be at the forefront of narrowing the gender imbalances in the energy sector. The IEA, for example, has established a high level gender advisory council is occurred in June of 2021. And since that time the council's met five times, it has helped bring together our members to help put a clear focus on gender issues. The council was established with the core objective to provide the IEA with an official platform and framework to discuss and advise on gender equality diversity and mainstreaming both at the IEA secretariat and in energy policy making systems and environments for all of our member governments. Another aim of the council is to strengthen collaboration across related international initiatives, including the Equality in Energy Transitions Initiative, which is an IEA technology collaboration program, and Clean Energy Ministerial Initiative, and the Equal by 30 campaign. The council has enabled us to explore and advise on issues across the full spectrum of gender policies in the energy sector. Of course, as a data driven organization, we are avid supporters of ensuring that there is accurate data collection and tracking progress to enable evidence based policy analysis. And as a direct result of our gender advisory council and the collaboration with the Equality in Energy Initiative, we've been able to develop our gender and energy data explorer. The explorer contains a broad range of the available gender related data for the energy sector. From the rates of gender balance in decision making entrepreneurship and innovation to whether men and women face similar employment opportunities through our analysis of wage gaps. Our explorer shines a light on these issues to help policymakers strengthen their policies and measures. The explorer has received very positive feedback and I encourage you all of you to take a look at it. And in order to develop the content and robustness to our data we're always looking to expand our dialogues, not only with countries, but with partner organizations, such as the UN, the World Bank, the ILO, and of course our OECD colleagues. We believe that proactive cooperation is key to ensuring that we can access all existing gender data and collectively work together to look at new methodologies that will enhance the data availability on gender oriented outputs for the energy sector. But beyond data and metrics we at the IEA are actively encourage all governments to mainstream gender equality and diversity in their energy policy making. We question, for example, what are the key policy levers that drive an inclusive and gender equitable energy transition. And we ask how do policies impact men and women differently, and what can governments do specifically to better enhance gender parity in the labor force. Now to address these pressing issues we've recently begun a new initiative, which gathers knowledge and data to develop policy recommendations and assist governments in their ambitions to improve gender diversity in the energy sector. This information combined with our gender and energy data explorer not only enables us to track the progress on gender mainstreaming within energy policies, but it allows us to release periodic updates and develop policy recommendations for governments and industry. Now as a part of the IEA's work stream on people centered clean energy transitions. We're hosting today's webinar to help draw upon the experiences of our panelists. Of course, who are very much at the forefront of these issues, examining and implementing gender mainstreaming energy practices within their communities organizations and the governments. As clean energy transitions progress around the world, we should not lose sight of the major opportunities they present to address some of these historical imbalances based by our societies. Through hosting sessions such as today's event, we at the IEA hope to provide a platform which shines a light on some of the many gender dimensions and key people centered issues at the heart of the transition of our energy systems. At the IEA, we truly are serious about addressing this topic and we aim to provide our member countries and partners with the necessary information to take tangible steps towards mainstreaming gender parity in the energy sector and in all aspects of clean energy transitions. I'm really very much looking forward to today's discussion to hearing from our panelists and their insights when it comes to building inclusive and gender equitable energy futures. Thank you so much and welcome once again. Thank you very much, Mary. Thank you for those opening remarks and as Mary has said, friends and colleagues, this is a part of a part of ongoing dialogue and exchange which we really value in terms of getting a better understanding of these issues of public like gender equality, which gets mentioned a lot in clean energy transition, but what does that really mean what's actually happening on the ground. What are we learning from real experience and we have a range of perspectives, very deep experience and knowledge from different parts of the world that we're going to benefit from hearing from today to probe that. And I'm going to just say as well that if any of the colleagues joining us on zoom wish to input into the debate or ask a question feel free to do that in the chat. We'd love to hear from you. And if we have time, certainly we can put some of their questions to the panelists as we proceed. Our style is discursive here so we're going to go to the panel as I'll introduce you to them as we turn to them and we will hear from them all. Hopefully a number of times during the course of a fluid discussion over the next little bit more than an hour we have. So, let me turn straight away to our first speaker, let's go to Zambia where we have a face that's probably familiar to many people here because she's a doyen of this sector for many years, and a real global leader in this sector with Sheila Aparocha, who is the director of energy, the international network on gender and sustainable energy. And a lot of you will know this network it operates in African Asia looking at energy access human development questions and of course putting women at the center of this network. Sheila we're delighted to have you with us today. And maybe because of your broad experience in this sector. I can ask you to help us for everybody frame these questions so what what do you think are the key gender issues at the heart of clean energy transition. Thank you so much and greetings to all. Thank you to the IA for inviting me to join this distinguished panel. Let me just compliment the intervention from the previous speakers and also what you have said yourself, Mr. moderator. I do feel that it is important that there is agreement on what type of energy transition we're aiming for. The initiative of the gendered energy compacts that is a multi stakeholder coalition convened by Unidio Energy and the global women's network for energy transition that brings together 10 governments and over 75 civil society, private sector, academia, youth and international organizations. It is clear to us that the energy transition has to be one in which women have equal opportunity to lead, participate in and benefit from. So if this is our end goal, let us be clear from what we are trying to transform. For us, this is an important point because a transition pathway that does not transform the lives of those left behind is one that will only exacerbate inequality. So we're not just talking about transition. We're talking about transformation. The IA informed us that on average there are 76% to fewer women than men working in the energy sector and women working in the sector and 50% less than men, even when controlling for skill level. The UN statistics gender snapshot 2022 states that affordable and clean energy key to life saving care and productivity remains out of the reach of millions of women's and girls in Asia and in sub Saharan Africa. A report by Sustainable Energy for all that tracked energy finance commitments from the gender equality marked flows were a dismal 9% of the total development finance for energy project projects and 93% of this funding came from only 10 government agencies. And for me, the most embarrassing is that SDG 7 is one of the one of the only six out of 17 SDGs with no specific gender indicators, according to reports by UN women presented that the review of SDG 5 at the 2022 high UN high level political forum. So the quick question then becomes, if we do want to power a gender just and equitable inclusive energy transition, what do we have to do? The gender and energy compact translates this question into a roadmap with six key outcomes. The first and paramount to us is to end energy poverty by increasing women's access to and control over sustainable energy products and services. Most importantly for off grid and King cooking solutions, but also by providing equal access to social protection mechanisms that minimize the risk to women for not being part of the energy transition. The second is to provide equal opportunities for women's career advancement in the energy sector. So they enjoy decent and productive employment by energy firms and institutions adopting gender responsive workplace practices. Third, and this is where policymakers convened by a play important role is to formulate and adopt inclusive and gender responsive transition pathways strategies and policies and to facilitate gender parity in decision making platforms. Fourth is to exponentially increase gender smart investments and financing from governments, multilateral financing institutions and private sectors to prime to climate and energy pro programming, but also to women owned and land businesses. Fifth is the creation of partnerships at local and international level to galvanize collaboration that accelerates and expand scale and scope of inclusive bold energy impacts. Lastly, but definitely not least, and this is where I'll conclude my first intervention is to use gender transformation as a guiding roadmap for change and accountability. And making mandatory to collect sex disaggregated doctor tracking and reporting on gender KPIs in all energy and climate transition interventions for which gender and the energy data explorer hosted by the at formulated and hosted by a provides an excellent example and the is to be congratulated for. Thank you. I'll stop here. Thank you. And maybe could I just ask you a first question because you're framing the issues very well there, but with your focus on Africa and Asia. Would you see that a lot of the issues you're talking about our global or do you feel that the gender dimensions are clean energy transitions differ in different parts of the world. We're looking at the statistics. The data the statistics are clear that gender disparities in the energy sector across the globe. You know, affect each and every, each and every continent and each and every context. However, when implementing solutions, you do have to contextualize. So they are differences. We do have countries that are reaching for instance 100% electrification where the issue is maybe less energy access but more how to engage women in the energy transition continent such as myself in Africa. The issue is still ending energy poverty. A lot of women and other disadvantaged groups living in my continent just don't have energy access so you can't even start talking about the name transition. So indeed, when we look at gender disparities, they are across the globe. We don't see any continent. This is even in Europe that are really performing well, but their context specifics in Europe. For instance, in Eastern Europe, there's energy poverty. You might be surprised to know that women do cook with traditional biomass and a lot of Eastern European countries, particularly with globing with the with the crisis is that we're now having with fuel fuel and crisis as well. Thank you. Thank you Sheila and I think you're right the framing of the current crisis has exacerbated a lot of issues and I'm sure that will come up during the course of the conversation. Thank you. Let's turn now to Sharra. So, Sharra, I hope I haven't wrecked your name too much of my pronunciation but I'm really grateful that you're here with us. Thank you for joining us. Sharra is the deputy director of inclusive green growth department at the Dutch Ministry of Foreign Affairs. And this department is responsible for Dutch foreign policy and a number of issues including climate water food security and energy so really relevant to our discussion today so Sharra maybe I can turn to you just to start by saying maybe you could tell us a bit about what you are prioritizing in the Netherlands in terms of the issue of gender in the context of clean energy transitions please. Yes, thank you very much, Brian, also for inviting me to this to this panel, a very interesting discussion and topic. We face multiple similar challenges that we work on nationally and internationally. We need to address the gender gap in clean energy access. I fully agree with the previous speaker. This is not only a priority in the Netherlands where high energy prices, especially impact women, but also in our foreign policy. The Netherlands has set an ambitious goal for SDG 7 where we aim to facilitate access to renewable energy for 100 million persons in developing economies by 2030 and clean cooking is a very important part of this objective. This is one of the most fundamental energy needs, which is neglected by most gender blind policymakers. Because around the world, a daily cooking responsibilities are largely held by women and girls, and clean cooking can ease health problems and economic problems that disproportionately affect these women and girls. So it's an important part of our SDG 7 portfolio, but it's our aim to mainstream gender across our SDG 7 programs. Another example of the Dutch commitment is the Netherlands energy compact, which recently was set up by 30 Dutch private and public organizations focused on SDG 7. The Netherlands energy compact also focuses on increasing job opportunities for women and girls, which brings me to the second challenge. And it was also referred to, I think by the previous speaker, there is also a gender gap in the energy labor market. If we look at the Netherlands, women represent only 22% of the working capacity in the energy sector. Above the age 45, it's only 16%. And we haven't had the intention to do something about it, and we have a human capital agenda to stimulate employment and education opportunities in the energy sector. So hopefully we feel there is a gap, we see a gap, a gender gap in the energy in energy related education. Research shows that this is partly caused by stereotyping men as technicians and the absence of female role models, which is something that we can and should work on. And we see there's a gender gap in decision making that women should be involved in all the decisions that affect their lives. And, but unfortunately, women holding decision making positions in the energy sector are far too low in the Netherlands to it's only 4%. We should actively give voice to women in international national and local discussions. And from a foreign policy perspective, this is also a strong message of the Netherlands in multilateral discussions, such as the G20 and here at the International Energy Agency. And we are, we are of course very happy with the fact that a gender advisory council was established. To conclude, we can, we cannot reach net zero and address these four challenges, unless we consider the specific needs of women and involve and empower them to be the drive of transformational change. It needs to be transformational. I fully agree with the previous speaker on that. Thank you and looking forward to the discussion. And maybe I could just ask you a question if you didn't mind because I asked Sheila there about about how much these issues were global and she wisely said that the issues are often quite similar across the world and maybe the solutions differ. And so, from your perspective, working in the foreign ministry in the Netherlands, what connections are there between your work on addressing these gender dimensions within the Netherlands itself and your international work on the same topic. It's not always easy to interlink, to link them, but there are very similar issues. And sometimes at the foreign ministry, we're so much focused on our programs and interventions abroad that we do forget about our own situation at home. And we can also learn from that. There's also a lot to learn from home. And there's like I said, I mentioned a couple of data, which are not good for the Netherlands as well. So there's also a lot that we have to do at home. And so it should make us maybe also a bit modest in what we do abroad. There's also something that we need to need to solve at home. And I fully agree that it's at the same time it's very localized. We do have a feminist foreign policy since 2000, since last year. And one of the key things there is that we use the 4Rs, the 4Rs, rights, representation, resources and reality check. And reality check is very much focused on it should be tailor made. It should be linked to the local context in which you work. Thank you, Cheryl. Sheila, you wanted to come in on that. Yes, I just wanted to compliment what you said. And I have the advantage of actually living both in the Netherlands and in Zambia. I'm married in the Netherlands and I work in the Netherlands, but I come from Zambia. And indeed they're interconnectivities. And I think where my own personal experience is where this is very real is in the care economy. Living in the Netherlands, when I went to the Netherlands, I thought it might be different, but I found that women still do take the main responsibility for care of the household and at home. And that has a key impact on your productivity and your work. So the solutions can be slightly different, whereas in a country like mine in Zambia, we're really looking at labour saving technology. For a lot of our women still living in rural areas and using their own energy for that. In the Netherlands, we are looking for policies that are really going to ensure that more resources go to ensuring that we have childcare and that allows women to re-enter into the workforce faster and not take the full burden, for instance, for part-time work when you are trying to raise your children. So issues are the same, but the solutions can be slightly different. And the energy sector, the numbers that we see in the energy sector for the lack of participation has a direct link to the role that women play in the care economy. Thank you. Thank you very much Sheila. Let's turn now to Irana Geena Reischel. Irana is the co-founder and senior advisor of the Global Women's Network for Energy Transition, which was established in 2018 to connect and empower women working in sustainable energy across the world. Before that, in her career, Ms. Geena Reischel has held many positions, including Austrian ambassador to the People's Republic of China and to Brazil, as well as director general in charge of the Austria's development policy and cooperation. So Irana, it's great to have you with us. And with that depth of experience, maybe you could tell us a little bit about the Global Women's Network, but also tell us why you felt having all the senior roles you took that there was time in 2018 for this global network to come into existence. Thank you very much for having me at this webinar and congratulations to the International Energy Agency for all the groundbreaking work they are doing, especially also in this area that we are discussing. Well, as the name says, the Global Women's Network for the Energy Transition. One of the reasons why we founded this network was that we were looking at the energy transitions that had been started by a number of stakeholders around the globe by the time of 2017. And we saw many political commitments and many good statistics, why renewable energy and energy efficiency are the way forward, etc. And yet we saw that the energy transitions were not really gaining momentum, gathering up speed, the kind of speed that they need in order to really make a difference. And one of the reasons we thought was that the talent that humanity has is not fully employed to drive those transitions. And humanity's talent comes embodied in women and in men. And as previous speakers have said very, very well already, we have this underrepresentation of women in the energy sector, which also makes it very clear that they cannot contribute with their life experience, which is different than different from the life experience of men. They cannot contribute fully to driving this energy transition. This is an issue of human rights women are entitled to participate fully and on a par with men in all societal endeavors in economy and political decision making as a human right, but it's also something that should have an interest in as a society, because energy transitions are deep societal transformations, they are much more than just shifting from fossil fuels to renewable energy. And therefore they require a rethinking of how we work as a social fabric, and this rethinking has to be able to draw on the best innovation that is available in a particular society. And as I said, that innovation and that capacity for change and for driving the change is important in women and in men. So that's why we started the global women's network for the energy transition. And we are very happy to say that in five years since its founding, we have a lot of international members roughly 1000. We are working mainly in the area of mentoring of creating networks of networks, we connect regional and national networks, we do knowledge transfer, and of course we do advocacy to make this sector in general more inclusive and more diverse. Thank you very much, and it sounds like really interesting work and I have a number of questions, which I hope we'll get to eventually but first of all, let me start with one which is because of your framing of the nature of the gender inequalities in clean energy of course are quite unfortunately in the world we live in quite similar to a description of gender inequality in many parts of the fabric of society. I think that the gender dimensions and the gender challenges we face in clean energy are, shall I say, typical of societal gender inequalities or do they have unique attributes would you say in clean energy. I don't found anything that is particularly specific to energy that wouldn't be present also let's say in disarmament or in diplomacy or in some other fields where there is a male dominance in terms of the numbers of people employed in it. What makes it different is that the energy transition in the context of climate change, but also in the context of national sovereignty and and human security is an endeavor that all countries need to engage in. So, we do not have the leisure of saying well if this sector that sector is a bit more unequal is bad but nothing about it. Here, it's an area it's an endeavor that humanity as a whole has to embrace. And if we are not correcting the imbalances that are in the sector present today, we will carry over those imbalances into the future. We are now talking about skilling and skilling people that are employed in the energy sector. Right. Now, if we are not bringing in new talent, people who are currently not employed in the sector quickly and swiftly and effectively. And that's mostly women and youth. Then we will carry over the imbalances that we currently have into the new situations, and that will really be a lost opportunity for making our societies more equal and more just and more inclusive and more sustainable and more. Steve. Thank you very much, your honor. Thank you for that. Let's turn next now to hear from our next panelist, who was Cherub Soy. Cherub, thank you very much for joining us. I really appreciate it. Cherub is the gender thematic focal point of the SDG seven youth constituency and we've heard of course SDG seven and sustainable development goals in general referred to several times. It's great to hear about it more directly. Cherub is also currently documenting her own transition to green lifestyle as well as working with elementary school children in Kenya to be more aware of energy and lifestyle choices. So, Cherub, I know we're going to learn a lot from you. And again, let me just start with a question because this is something you look at a lot. So in your perspective, what do you see as a state of the art of research about the gender impacts of clean energy policies. Thank you, Brian, for having me. It's a pleasure to be among certain insightful panel and I'm very much looking forward to this discussion. So something that maybe might not have mentioned is currently I'm an analyst at Kamco, which is climate and impact fund manager and my day to day activities and responsibilities are centered around supporting the multiple investment platforms we have which are in that financing innovative solution to address climate change and deliver positive impact within the emerging markets. So this includes conducting research that is country and market research, which involves taking a deep dive into the country's political, social, economic environments coupled with a thorough assessment of its energy policies. The recurring challenge that I have experienced is that there has been limited this aggregated gender data in the national and energy policies. We need this data to show the interlinkages between gender and energy and how these two play out in the employment sector, the finance sector innovation sector and so on. My observation and experience so far have been that when it comes to energy policies, particularly within this emerging economy, a majority of the time, gender is not included. And if it is included, it is mentioned as a core benefit arising from the national policy plan. So this should not be the case, especially when gender plays a crucial role in actualizing the goal of universal energy access as the previous panelists have mentioned. Data does form the foundation of the research and when data is missing, when it's not easily accessible, or if it's not up to date, then how can we then rely on this data to actually inform the company strategies and national policies. Therefore, I think regular collection of the data, together with public consultations should be taken into account and made available for policymakers to be able to assess the situation and develop appropriate evidence based responses and policies. And as Miss Irene rightfully mentioned, if we do not address their current imbalances, we cannot make this suitable change that is required. So gender and energy data explorer that was mentioned during the opening remarks could be one of the ways to address these challenges. So I'm looking forward to exploring this tool. I really do hope it's accessible and free. So yeah, when it comes back to my research findings, I can then provide an accurate baseline in the gender gap assessment to propose accurate solutions that the company has taken solutions that actually match the society's real need gaps and opportunities in relation to the energy sector. Thank you very much, I'm very happy to confirm that the gender data tool is freely available to everybody you can find it on our website. And share just talking about your work as an investment analysis, and of course the importance of data, how much just when you're when in your experience of investment analysis, how much is gender coming up as an explicit part of the discussion part of the analysis. Like I previously mentioned, it doesn't come up a lot quite a lot. It is touched on as a core benefit so that means when you come when you analyze the policies. The gender aspectivity and as the beneficiary, as opposed to being an integral part of the full cycle and the full process to make an overhaul of the change that is required to be implemented within the energy transition that's just an inclusive. Okay, thank you Sheriff and I look forward to following up in just a minute but before we do that, let's go to and hear from one more panelist who is mini govindan who is joining us from India and I think many you're on the road so we're delighted to that you're able to connect with us. I'm sure there in India mini is a senior fellow at Terry, which is the energy research institute a daily based not for profit policy research institution I'm sure many people are aware of specializing in energy environment and sustainable development. There's a lot of experience working as an energy justice and energy gender nexus researchers so many were delighted to be with us. And having heard what you have heard but maybe just based on your own experience as well, especially regarding this issue in the context of a country like India, or other emerging economies. Maybe you can tell us a bit about how you see the implications of gender mainstreaming in energy policies. I'm glad to be part of this very interesting panel and and also very glad that the previous speakers at certain wonderful context and and I think by and large we all agree that the differentiated energy needs of women and men, you know, a couple with the inherent disparities in the social cultural stance and the condition general gendered roles create the need for gender responsive measures for equitable welfare. This is something I think, which all the previous speakers has talked about and we all have a very common understanding and then coming, you know, to the Indian context. It would be very inappropriate or incorrect to say that, you know, the gender mainstreaming aspects has not been considered at all. And the importance of this mainstreaming aspect in energy projects or programs or policies has been acknowledged, I know to improve the benefits for both men and women. And also, over the years, you know, the whole concept of energy transition, energy justice, just transition. So the buzzwords and it has caught the attention of, you know, policymakers, academia, civil society, even the private players as a means of achieving, you know, greater inclusivity and empowerment. And you know, to quote some of some examples and to, you know, kind of explain it a little more better. I would like to quote some of the flagships program that's been undertaken by the government and one being a very important program, you know, which in which gender mainstreaming is something which has been considered. It's called the Rajiv Gandhi, the Ramin Vidyut Karan Yojana, that's the rural electrification policy. And then we also have another, you know, an important policy called the Saubhagya scheme, you know, which is, you know, which talks about providing clean cooking solutions to the Indian population. And in both of these schemes, you know, one of the important aspects is the gender mainstreaming. And this is something which has been very importantly considered in this policy. Even in Saubhagya, you know, it's mandated to give connections to women from underprivileged households, from women headed households. So this are some of the very important aspects that's been considered by the government, even if you look at the more, you know. We've lost your sound, Damini. Can you still hear us? Yeah, I can. Please go ahead. Sorry, you're back now. And you know, even in this state of Maharashtra, it's the whole aspect of gender mainstreaming has been very effectively considered where, you know, women are mainstreamed into holding, you know, technical jobs through reservations, through more proactive measures in terms of reservations and training. And even if we look at the skill council of green jobs in India, which is, again, undertaken by the government of India, which has trained, you know, quite a significant plot of women into a technical training. And this also includes something like a Suryamitra Solar Skill Development Program, where around 25% of the trainees are women. And in some of the batches are, you know, having more than 50% of the female attendees. And in addition to the downside of having a speaker on the road, sometimes the signal is good and sometimes the signal is not so good. We need to mute Mini there for a second at the end so we can come back to her when we do a better signal. I think we better, we better move to another speaker and come back to you Mini when we can hear you a bit better. So, Sheila, I might go back to you if that's okay. Because Mini was mentioning a couple of the examples there and maybe, I think it would be useful if we, if you had a couple of examples, maybe if I put it this way, of your favorite policies where gender has been properly considered in the context of transition. We'd love to hear those. Thank you. And so I'm going to use an example that I consider an energy of considers this practice approach. And that is taken from a Cherub's country. The Ministry of Energy in Kenya in 2019 launched the gender and energy policy. And this is the first of its kind policy in Africa where ministry has at the, at the, at the ministerial level has a standalone gender and energy policy. And if you allow me, I'd just like to take us through the journey of how this was, how this came about. I think this is really important because we read a lot of text and, you know, I myself have a master's in gender and rural development. So it's in the books it tells you know what you have to do but how does this really roll out in reality. The first step that was undertaken by the ministry was to do a gender audit. And what they did is really just review agenda auditors that you do a gender assessment of the energy policy. They've made it quite comprehensive. They looked at different organizations in the energy sector. They also looked at their strategies and they looked at the programs. And they did this so that they could understand, you know, what are the gender gaps and then what are the strategies that we need to do to address the gaps. What's different from this is that this audit was done not by a consultant or by an NGO, which most gender audits are conducted by, by the ministry's own staff. And yes, it did take much more time because we, there was a need to build capacity and understanding of how to do a gender analysis. But the outcome of this was the real ownership and prioritization of the findings and recommendations coming out from the audit on the way forward. So I think for me that's really one, identifying, you know, really what is the, if you want to use an evidence-based approach, you really have to do your research, identify what the issues, but make sure who's doing it is really important and that ownership is built. But we recognize that changing policies and changing mindsets takes time. It's not that you do your audit and tomorrow the policy is adopted, no, it does take time. So what do you do in between so that you don't lose that momentum? Well, what happened in Kenya is that they, two key elements of their approach is that they established the Kenya Gender and Energy Network, and this provided a multi-stakeholder platform with NGOs that were involved, Governments involved, private sector, but they used this platform to disseminate and share with a wider audience, you know, the findings from the audit. The second, very importantly, was to identify and support champions within the ministry. And these champions were at sufficient level of decision-making to be able to convene and advocate for change from their principals and for their fellow colleagues and for others in the sector. Very importantly through all this was really the messaging was key, and a key message here was that the current energy policy was likely to increase energy poverty among women if it continued to have had to lease cross criteria and ignore social culture dynamics. The third thing that was done, which I think was really important, is that they didn't want the gender roadmap that they had proposed to be standalone. So they needed to demonstrate that it could be mainstreamed into conventional energy planning, and also they needed to build the evidence that taking a gender approach in implementation could really deliver on impact. So at the time there was the sustainable energy for action planning, those of us who have been along here in the energy sector for long enough will remember this and investment perspective. So really they tried to integrate gender into that process, and they also launched the women economic empowerment program to show impact. Finally, all these efforts accumulated into the ministry appointing agenda focal points. There was a lot of collaboration here with the Ministry of Gender. Unfortunately, in a lot of our countries the gender machinery is underfunded doesn't really get engaged in the sectors. But in Kenya, they really tried to engage it in the sector because the Ministry of Gender actually has the mandate to ensure gender mainstreaming across all other sectors. So they engaged in them and a gender focal point was seconded from the Ministry of Gender to the Ministry of Energy. And through that collaboration as well as building on all the other efforts, a gender energy policy was launched in Kenya in November 2019. Currently what's happening with the policy, well what's happening is that a step has been taken to translate the energy policy which remains at that central level into county energy plans and budgets so that really it translates now into implementation. Again, translating into implementation is to use the energy policy as a platform to mainstream gender into other key implementation angles of the agencies of the policies. For instance, into the Kenya power, the utility, into the rural electrification agency and also very important crossing over to the climate and environment side into Kenya's NDCs. Very importantly also was getting the funding, commitment and funding from budget. But because of the ownership, the level of ownership that was shown by the Ministry, donors then came on board to support the implementation of the policy. And other actors are also the government of the Netherlands supports the energizing development program in Kenya, a very important program in Kenya on energy access. And they are also building on the intervention areas that are in the energy policy to roll out their programs. Thank you, I'll stop there. Thank you, Sheila, but let me just ask if I make it. It's really interesting story you're telling us but what's behind a success like that is it just a government has a particularly strong focus on gender or one or two individuals to you but what makes it happen there when it doesn't happen in other places. So I think that all of what you've said, I think the ownership by the government because of the approach that was used, it's not a consultant flying in flying out. It's really getting government to do their own analysis, make prioritize their, make their own priorities and to drive it so I think ownership by government. Institutions are important but at the end of the day it's one what is an individual so indeed getting those champions and individuals is really important. The government cannot do this alone policies cannot be done so building those partnerships with other stakeholders with NGOs and civil society, etc, to support that is really important. Building political will and through lobby and advocacy which NGOs are very important I think it's really, it's really important. Data and the evidence, but evidence that really shows the impact. So if you use a gender approach you are indeed going to improve the development effectiveness of your energy programs because you're reaching the ones that need, you know, the, the, that are most left behind was really important. So I think that was also really key. So not just having a policy, but ensuring the policy is translated into implementation. And most importantly, not just remaining at the central level that it has to be decentralized. It has to go to the local authorities. It has to go to the local level and getting them engaged, having the financing and budget behind that to back it was really, was really important. I think that's what has really made this a success. Thank you, Sheila. Sharon, I might come back to you on a similar theme because you mentioned that the Netherlands has a principle of feminism in its policymaking in this area. And maybe you could tell us a bit about that and how it goes from a statement of principle to actually influencing how policies are designed and as she emphasized implemented as well. How do we go from that being a statement to really changing what happens on the ground. Yes. Thank you very much, Brian. Yes, I must say, it's not always easy to do so to go from that level and make it a reality. But we have, we try to apply a gender lens in all new policies and programs. And when it comes to programming, we use a gender marker system. And then we have to assess whether a certain program is contributes in a significant or principle way to gender. So people within our ministry, my colleagues, they are obliged to think about it and ask themselves some questions to what extent does it in does this program indeed benefits men and women in the same way or. And so doing these gender analysis and knowing how to do it is very important. And we have a task force focused on women and gender equality and they help us. They advise us to do these analysis. We also try to make steps in terms of gender budgeting and making analysis to what extent do our programs actually is are the funds really going to women or men. We invest in capacity and knowledge development. And we try to ensure a meaningful participation of women and civil society organization so then we get back to the point of involving women in decision making processes. Maybe another important aspect is our own organization. We should also really look at our own ministry and that's where we also have set some targets in terms of representation. How many female ambassadors do we have a female directors, etc. And that's that's also still something where we have to make a progress. So not only looking at programming and things we do but also looking at our own organization and how we could could transform that. That's that's really important. I would say. And getting back to also some some previous speakers I think chair mentioned the importance of data and and research. And I would really like to underline the importance of that it's not only making general analysis at the start, but also the importance of monitoring evaluation and learning throughout that implementation. Is this program indeed having the effect that we aimed for, or should we adjust programming and our assumptions, perhaps, so monitoring evaluation and learning is very important. And also when we get to the Netherlands, we have an institute which is called 75 in queue it's a center of expertise on gender and energy in the Netherlands. Which provides us with a lot of interesting research and data to inform our policies nationally and also internationally. And I think we should aim for really practical tools that can help us and maybe also our partners. And one of the the the examples is get invest it's funded by the Dutch Ministry of Foreign Affairs and it recently launched an online toolkit and research publication. Building the business case for gender inclusive financing in last mile renewable energy markets in Sub-Saharan Africa. The purpose of this toolkit is to provide practical guidance for renewable energy companies, financial service providers, international development organizations, impact investors and donors to develop gender inclusive financial products and services. So I think those kind of tools really help us to make a difference. Thanks very much and that toolkit sounds really interesting but so can I ask you then just you know in the same vein. Yeah, you're talking about a lot of kind of, let's say, shall we say procedural changes or structural changes where you where you're building in better gender and the thing. Yes, can that fix the problem or is there still always a danger that it slips off the prioritization agenda. How much do you think it needs this kind of constant political leadership constant focus or how much kind of be hardwired in. I think it needs constant political leadership indeed, because I think a lot of people they subscribe to the idea of having gender as a priority, but to make it really happen. It needs really attention and conscious decisions. It doesn't happen by itself. So leadership is extremely important. And that's why I think this like this feminist foreign policy to which our Minister of Foreign Affairs our Minister for Foreign Trade and Development Corporation, they have committed themselves to it. I think that's already very, very important that really from the top level, the message is being given. This is what we want and we think this can make a difference. And it doesn't only make a difference in terms of gender, but our intention is also to like have a more systemic change in which also other groups or groups that are that may be marginalized or that it will also have a positive change on them. So, yeah, political leadership is extremely important. And I would say at all levels it's important to make sure. And in that sense it should also, it may also be needed to make it part of like job profiles and also performance appraisals, etc. Thanks, Sharon and Raina I see you nodding there so I might go back to you on a similar question in terms of where you think the key intersection points if you like art where we can make best practice more normal here. I think it can be done on on a long list of interventions and all the stakeholders have their role to play. Since we are talking about systemic discrimination, which often is unconscious, but it is still systemic rules and frameworks obviously play a role and they have to be set at the appropriate risk by the government by the corporations by the head of the the corporation, etc. And then they have to cover all the areas of the of the value chain if you want in sustainable energy so it has to do with how recruitment takes place it has to do with how women are able to advance or not in once they have entered a company. We have lots of statistics that show that at the entry level, women are doing quite well together with men, but then as as men are promoted through the ranks of organizations and of corporations. Women are left behind for whatever reasons because there is a difficulty to reconcile family obligations and work obligations or because, you know, the, the, the system kicks in whereby a man hires again a man when it comes to a promotion. This is very widespread and it's not restricted to any cultural area to any region, whatever we see this in in in all areas. The, the, the issue of making work and family responsibilities more compatible I think is a very important one, because in practically all the cultures that I know it's it's women who do the major caring work in in in society care for kids they care for their the old ones, the sick ones, etc. And that has been reinforced by the corona crisis even even further. So, to create work rules that allow a better sharing of these workers responsibilities is is a very important, a very important issue. We also have to take measures to specifically promote women and to help them develop their potential to catch up basically in those situations situations of institutional unlevel playing field. And we also have to bring in new talent and we have to make sure that the pipeline is filled with new talent, which means that we need to go to students we need to go to young girls before they make their career choices. And we need to present the sustainable energy sector as a sector that is attractive for women and has something to offer for women. Thank you very much. Can I ask you a follow up question, because we're talking about things that should be done but often aren't done so it would it be if this is not too general a question arena to say, and when we see gender not adequately addressed in in some of these clean energy is it that we're making design failures we're not using good data or was simply is simply not occurring to those policymakers to to put a specific focus on gender where do you think the the the failing comes in most you're on mute there arena sorry. If a lot is being done, simply not enough, a lot is being done and all kinds of stakeholders from all kinds of ends, but it's not systematic and it's not deep reaching enough. Thank you. Sheriff, could I go back to you because because interview role with the SCU seven youth constituent it seems to me when I hear a statement like we're not thinking enough about the effects of these policies on women, or we're not consulting women's voices enough in the in these debates, I could replace the word women with young people. So do you see that these issues are quite similar in terms of the under representation of women and youth in these discussions. I feel like, yes, it's true to say that there is under presentation, but on the flip side there is also lots of great efforts and, yeah, from the young people and the women together so maybe I can just highlight the importance of gender in the youth agenda and maybe it can paint a clear, clear picture that first, the importance is to build capacity for just an inclusive transition. It's hard being mentioned in the previous intervention that we need a new pipeline of fresh talent, and this is sort of to bank on the future so we need to shift the narrative and have a qualified workforce that can take up the challenges and channel resources in building the innovative language and the new ways of thinking required to address not only the gender gaps, but also the energy transition. And we also need to continue to raise awareness on not just the pending progress, but the ongoing contributions that are making a difference and discussion about this, like bringing different contexts and different perspectives in highlighting probably the learnings in the Netherlands, the 75, thank you, and network such as the global women's network on the energy and also Sheila's elaboration on what contributed to the success on the policy agenda policy in the future. So, as young people and as young females who are looking to get the entry point into the sector or like take the next level within the sector, it is important to hear from different voices and see what the gaps are present presenting themselves as and also to see how we can align ourselves with the opportunities, depending on where we want to be at the end. Thank you, Cheryl, for that. Mini, I'd like to go back to you and I want to check if you can hear us okay there. Mini, are you hearing us? Yes, I am. Am I audible? Yes, we can hear you very well. Thank you. So sorry, we lost you a little bit earlier, but I hope you've been hearing the discussion and I wanted to come back to this theme about what are the let's say drivers of success versus lack of success because we've heard a couple of really interesting examples from different parts of the world. And when we heard you last, you were telling us about some of the interesting work done at national and state level in India. So maybe you could, whether it's about saying, you know, why has worked in some cases, not in others, why some states are doing better than others. But what you see is the difference in driving success versus failure when you look at different approaches. Yeah, I mean, that's quite interesting. And that's something, you know, which we have also been trying to understand. And very often it is said that, you know, lack of women in technical positions in technical education is one of the reasons, you know, for their non representations in major energy decision making bodies, but a very closer look into the data shows that India has the highest number of women as STEM graduates that's in science, engineering, you know, technology, mathematics, and you know, which is surpassing several nations, even if you look at the data from the National Institute of Wind Energy, it clearly shows that, you know, women in research fields, especially in emerging areas like data analytics, and you know, and some of the decision making. There are around 65% of women researchers in the area. So the obvious question that comes is even that even with so much progress happening, you know, why is women's visibility and their active role in this entire, you know, energy transition debate is so elusive? And why is it debatable? You know, we have so much of data to say that, you know, so much of capacity building has been done, awareness has been done, women participation has been high in skill development. But then where are they? So we started, you know, analyzing this and started going and even talking to all this, you know, training institutes, government bodies to try and check where are the women who have undergone all this training, who bodies and all those things. Analysis, unfortunately is condensed into a very narrow definition of gender binary approach, where everything is just used to, you know, number of men participating, number of women participating, number of women trained, number of women who have benefited from training policies, projects, education, entrepreneurship, and you know, I mean, all of this. But when, but you know, and another thing is, there are no data, I should say there is no data to see that the women who have utilized this training, this capacity buildings, have they put that training into any practical use? And what are the, have they put that to pursue a livelihood? Have they put all the capacity building to in any of the decision making mechanisms? So our own analysis shows that, you know, many a times women after undergoing all this training skill development are not able to utilize the opportunities, you know, due to structural barriers. And that's something which we also see in terms of, you know, energy developers and implementers, you know, most of them are faced with the requirement of gender inclusion. I mean, perhaps it is mandated by donors, you know, and they most often, you know, opt for easy route of turning women into namesake beneficiaries. I mean, and though they cannot be blamed entirely for this, because they also work with, you know, constrained timelines and limited budgets and limited margins, and you know, so that leaves very less room for additional investments for actual gender mainstreaming across the project cycle. So this whole notion of, you know, gender binary is something which is where we personally have, you know, problem with. And this gender binary also endorses certain, you know, concepts where, you know, men possess oppositional and complimentary identities. And while women are, you know, as all other speakers have said that, you know, they're more into caring and homemaking. And so this kind of a binary is something which promotes gender essentialism. And that's something I think we have been problem because for instance, you know, in India, it's the common notion of a progressive society, you know, that promote women empowerment also encourage women to be a solar engineer. But at the same time, it will also constrain women from traveling to remote areas for work, because they think, you know, it might compromise their duties as a homemaker. So on one hand, you are a progressive society encouraging a woman to be a solar engineer. But when a woman actually becomes a solar engineer, you have other barriers by saying that, oh, you should not travel to, you know, far off areas that will compromise your duty at home, you can't care for the children, elderly, so women are technically qualified but still not being able to put their qualification into proper use. So this is something I would like to highlight because a lot of things on paper is gender mainstream, but in practice or actually on ground, you don't find them. Yes. Thank you very much, Mini. And I must say I'm hearing in many responses, the interconnectivity of these gender issues, you know, that come up in many parts of society and structural and practice ways as well as, you know, issues that might be specific to clean energy but that many issues that are specific or unique to clean energy, but they touch on the wider dimensions of gender disparity and gender inequality. So colleagues, we just have a few minutes left so I'm very happy to hear from any of you if you have particular points you want to make or respond to anything you've heard. I'll also try and squeeze in a question or two from our audience but first I'll go to you Sheila please. Yes, no, I just wanted to bring something in from our real life experience and maybe just first to say that the toolkit that our colleague from the Netherlands mentioned was actually developed by Energy with support from Get In Vet. So we're really pleased to see that it's been read and it's been acknowledged and we're quite excited with the findings coming from it being used. But one of the key things that we found from Energy's own practical experience because we work with policymakers but we also work with big programs like ENDEV. We're currently working with the Netherlands Enterprise Agency in their big clean cooking program to support the energy ecosystem in clean cooking. And one of the challenges that we find is where gender comes in that unfortunately it does not come necessarily in at the beginning, it comes in later on. And so there's a lot of resistance from those that are going to implement to take it on board because budgets have already been set, plans have already been made, resources have already been allocated. So the gender is really coming in as an extra. And this is why within Energy we're becoming much more vocal in saying let's make gender KPIs within the energy sector mandatory. The climate sector is doing this. In the climate investment funds they have a gender action plan. It is mandatory for whoever is receiving funding or engaging in climate investment funds to have gender KPIs. In the energy sector and very much in the energy transition, let's start making this mandatory. If you don't measure something it's forgotten, it's not visible and it's forgotten. When it starts being measurable you need to be responsible for it in delivering on it and you need to allocate resources. So for us one of the key challenges is where it comes in that it tends to come in much later and it's not necessarily set as, and also it comes in more as a voluntary, a voluntary commitment you have to do it. And yes, and I think for those of us working in the energy sector including with energy it's maybe how we package it. I think really making, building the business case and a lot more is happening like we heard from other speakers. There's a lot more evidence being put about how to package it. I think the toolkit is a very good example where we really specifically targeted the toolkit for financial institutions and for investors. So we engaged and tried to understand what they need, what their work is doing and what is going to be the business case to get them on board. So I think packaging our messages, our tools, making them much more hands-on specifically targeted for different skillsets, for different senses is really going to be important. Thank you. Thank you very much Sheila. Thank you Brian. I mean after listening to all these interventions and the different perspectives, I think I would like to re-emphasize the youth perspective and this I can share through the give context using my personal journey from a youth perspective and also agenda perspective. And this starts with the history of the SDG7 youth constituency and how it came about and also its role in progressing the youth agenda as it progresses the energy sector. So the constituency emerged from the gap where young people needed a central engagement mechanism for them to take action and gain experience within the sector. So there was already action taking place but it was happening in isolation. So in 2020 the constituency came to be and provided that much needed space. Almost immediately we could see the interest in the membership and the numbers as it consistently grew and the work streams were active all year round. But what was striking to observe was that 60% of the leadership team at that time was female which is very different from the statistics that Sheila I think initially gave during her first intervention on women's participation and this was like a reflection of what the youth frame is that. So it expressed that within the youth circles young females are not shying away from taking even the leadership positions and when you have a gender balance at the coordination levels you get this more diverse range of opinions and strategies. And that's exactly what happened. So initially I was part of the 60% and started out as the energy access focal point. This capacity I got to understand most of the challenges which we've mentioned just during this discussion about the unique region specific obstacles that we're getting in the way of actualizing universal energy access. But as the first two years went by, and from the look of things we had significant progress in the constituency, according to its mandate we had youth engagement we had youth publications were gathering the best available scientific data to support the work of youth movements but in our community there was something missing, especially after actively working on energy access. We had the gender topic, but it wasn't like fully ingrained. So it was clear enough to us that adjust an inclusive transition would require all hands on deck. And this meant the voices of the young people, the women, the indigenous communities and so we came to the conclusion that despite the gender related topics that we had on the stage, there was still a lot of pending progress which is why we dedicated an entire working stream towards gender related topics at all levels so I've had like most some of the panels asking where do we find this young talent but we find this fresh perspective so if you're ever in need to find young talent. Please reach out to the SDG7 youth constituency. Thanks, Brian. Thank you, Sarah, but I can certainly attest from our interactions with the SDG7 youth constituency, we benefited a lot from the wisdom and commitment of many people around the world so I think it's a really excellent platform of congratulations. So, Sarah and Mini, I just want to check if there's any last remarks or input you'd like to make before we close up. Yes, if I may. Yes, there are two other things that I would like to mention. And for the energy transition towards renewable energy, I would like to point out that this requires other competences and skills. Then used to be the case in the fossil era. And so we need to focus our education on that and that's I already referred to the human capital agenda in the Netherlands which is really focused on adjusting our education and mobilizing the right skills. Another important issue is mining and we haven't referred to it for renewable energy, a lot of raw materials are needed. And in the mining sector, we also need to look at the roles of women. There are a lot of women involved, especially in arsenal mining, and women are more likely than men to experience negative effects from their work in the mining sector. Exclusion from jobs, sexual harassment, dealing with water, land and air pollution caused by mining. And we're also working on that and together with the organization Women's Rights and Mining, we are organizing a session. We will be organizing a session on this at the OECD Minerals Forum on the 26th of April. So I'm not quite sure to whom it will be open or whom will be there, but it might be an interesting meeting. Thank you very much. Thank you, Sharon, both really interesting points and both topics we hope to return to in this series and in our discussions around skills and particularity, but I think what you're saying there about mining and the particular issues around informal workers where women are much more heavily represented, I think are really important. Thank you. Mini, I got to give the last word to you. Thank you. So I would like to say one thing is like we need to somehow break this compartmentalized, you know, binary views that perpetuate a non egalitarian gender ideology. And as Sheila has been emphasizing, you know, we need to come up with a more stronger tools, more stronger guidelines and frameworks where we need to capture the actual, you know, gender impacts and outcomes and which goes beyond, you know, reporting in terms of numbers. Yes. Thank you. I think that's a wise point to end on and I think, you know, we certainly heard across from all the speakers we've heard some really good interesting examples emerging of good practice but we've heard a lot of emphasis on the importance of data, and that we build up better data sets we have better evidence and I think the role of discussions like this where we exchange experience are really important and certainly from my perspective, I've learned a lot from all of our speakers Sheila share a chair up arena and mini I want to thank you all it's been really excellent discussion, and to all of us who join us online. Thank you for spending the time with us I hope this has been interesting and useful to you. I hope you'll join some of our future events, and do please get in touch with the team at the IEA, if you want to engage, share your experience and data with us and then continue in this conversation. With that, we'll close our webinar today. Thank you everybody for joining us. Thank you in particular to our speakers for your time and your inputs. Thank you.