 Daily Tech News show is made possible by its listeners. Thanks to all of you including Mark Gibson, Reed Fishler and Larry Bailey. Coming up on DTNS, should you trust Anchor's Yuffie cameras? We'll explain. The EU is going to let 5G onto airplanes and why I believe the children are the metaverse. This is the Daily Tech News for Friday December 2nd, 2022 in Los Angeles. I'm Tom Merritt. From Columbus, Ohio, I'm Rob Dunwood. Drawing the top tech stories from Cleveland, I'm Len Peralta. And I'm the show's producer, Roger Cheng. You know, a lot of people think we're too Ohio-centric, but Roger and I are here to balance it out. So, you know, it's... Fight you. Guys know Ohio was awesome. I used to vacation in Ohio as a young lad. There you go. So yeah, I agree. Ohio is pretty great. Sarah Lane's out today, but we have got a great show. So let's start with the quick hits. Thursday around 2 a.m., a man traveling by Snow Machine in Northwest Alaska, wasn't Amos. He was in New York, activated his Apple iPhone Emergency SOS, the Apple Emergency Response Center and the Northwest Arctic Borough Search and Rescue Coordinator worked together with Alaska State Troopers and local volunteer search and rescue teams who did a lot of the local work to locate the man using the GPS coordinates provided by Apple. The man was found and brought to Cutsabue. No injuries were reported, and it's the first reported use of Apple's Emergency SOS feature for rescue purposes. Google announced it will start rolling out end-to-end encrypted RCS group chats to the Google Messages beta over the next few weeks. Previously, only one-on-one RCS chats were end-to-end encrypted. RCS is a successor standard to SMS, which is supported by Android and most major phone carriers. It is not supported yet by Apple. I wonder if anyone's talked to them about them. You know, I think maybe. Yeah, another day, another game mastered by an algorithm. Researchers at Alphabet's DeepMind published a paper in the journal Science detailing Deep Nash. That is the name of an algorithm that can best human players at Stratego. Because a player cannot see what type of pieces an opponent has in Stratego, it's a much more incomplete information problem than, say, something like Texas Holden poker. Researchers trained Deep Nash with reinforcement learning, playing 5.5 billion games against itself. It's designed to find Nash equilibrium, if you ever watched A Beautiful Mind, you might have heard that, and a set of strategies such that no player benefits by changing strategy on their own. After 50 matches on the game platform project Gravon, Deep Nash now ranks third among all players since 2002. The payment processing company Stripe announced it's launching its own fiat to crypto on-ramp widget, which will let customers easily exchange dollars for cryptocurrency. Stripe will handle fraud, compliance, and know your customer checks as part of the transaction. These kinds of widgets are often used by cryptocurrency companies offering dApps and NFTs so that customers can use their preferred currency without involving a cryptocurrency exchange. You know, like FTX. Privacy-focused Brave software announced it has begun its test of privacy-preserving ads in its search engine. So Brave uses the content of your search query, what you typed in, the country the request appears to be coming from, I'm guessing by IP address, and then the device type. Is it a laptop? Is it an iPhone, etc. And they use those three types of information to determine what ad to show you. None of that information is stored. They don't build a profile. They just look at those three pieces of information, pick an ad, show it to you, and then throw it all away. If you don't even want that amount of tracking, and you don't want to see any ads, Brave Premium is now available for $3 a month. All right, let's talk about the future of being annoyed on airplanes. The BBC reports that the European Commission can provide 5G service aboard airplanes. The EU has reserved certain frequencies for airplane service since 2008. Member States have until June 30th to make the frequency bands available for in-flight 5G service. The EU uses different 5G frequencies than the US and at lower power, so they don't have the concerns that the 5G interfering systems like RADALT have with US carriers. Once those frequency bands are made available, flyers in service areas would not need to put phones in airplane mode. So Tom, does this mean that we'll be subject to planes full of loud on-call? In Europe? Possibly. My hope, my thought, my expectation even, might be that while 5G on the plane is going to allow you to not have to put it in airplane mode, you'll be able to just keep, you know, saying funny things on Twitter as you're waiting to take off all the way into the air that you will have policies put in place by the airlines about what you can do on those that would not disturb your neighbor. I would imagine some airlines might just say like, hey, you can use 5G all day long on your phone, you can stream your video, do whatever you want, but don't talk on the phone. Don't talk, and don't talk loudly on the phone and disturb the other passengers. I mean, do you think I'm naive to believe that? Well, Tom, I think it's going to be a combination of that and people actually talking on the phones because if you think about big international flights, particularly in first class and business class, those pods have phones in them. You are already able to make phone calls on airplanes. You have been able to do this for quite some time. It's ridiculously expensive to do it. And I think that that's going to be the barrier for a lot of folks. They're just not going to pay the price to have a, you know, a phone call in the air. And then when you're thinking about, you know, if this is just contained within the EU, those flights, you know, in many cases aren't very long. So those aren't the flights where people are going to just be having long phone calls. At least I don't think most people would have long phone calls on those types of flights at the expense that they would probably have to incur to have them. I don't know, man. I've been on some flights where folks just keep talking on the phone and the cabin door is closed and the flight attendants leaning over and like, please wrap up your call. Please wrap up your call. If they don't have to wrap up the call, right? If there's not a policy, like a security policy, right now they can be like, you have to have that thing in airplane mode. They don't have to do that. I feel like there's going to be some people take advantage and just talk from, from the minute they're on the plane till landing. So, so this is the question for me though. When you are using that in flight 5g is that's, that's a different bill. I think, you know, I don't know. I don't know how this is going to work in my cost more. Yeah, you're right. You know, how are you going to be built for that? Is that going to be like a roaming charge that you would get? I would imagine it would because I don't see airplanes or, you know, airlines doing this because they don't think they can make money from it. I mean, I think that this is something that we, you know, we can service our customers and give them something that they want and we can also build them ridiculously for it as we service them. No, you're right. It'll, it'll be a charge. There'll be certain carriers like T-Mobile right now. If you fly on Delta, you don't have to pay for your Wi-Fi, right? There'll be certain carriers will be like, oh, if you're on our carrier, you don't have to pay, but they may limit what you can do on it. They may not, they may not route phone calls from, from an airplane. And that would just take care of it right there. Stealth Dave points out nobody talks on the phone anymore anyway. So maybe we'll just age out of that because, you know, the younger you get, the less likely you are to not just text someone or send a meme instead of calling them. So, so yeah, maybe, maybe there's hope. Maybe the children are our future is what I'm trying to say. And the other thing too, I remember, and this is back in like the blackberry and palm pod days, people would freak out when you would even use your phone on a plane, let alone be connected to data. And over time, we just kind of get used to it to where it is just a thing. Like you said with T-Mobile, you can just, you know, you just hop on a plane and you still have data. You can't make phone calls, but you still have data. I think this may just be an extension of that that over time, people will simply just get used to it. Cause I think about trains. People talk on the phone all the time on trains and it's not terribly disruptive. I mean, you know, you will have a time or two where the porter asked to go say, Hey, can you quiet down? But you already have that on plane. So I don't really see this being a big issue. Now, I think you talked to me down, social norms will develop where, yes, will you have the person who talks too loud? Sure. And then the flight attendant will come over and ask them to, you know, please keep it down. Just like you would if somebody was talking to the other person in the seat next to them too loud and disturbing other passengers. All right. All right. Overall, I think it's a good thing though. I don't want that to get lost. I'm looking forward to being able to just have 5g service and use everything on my phone the way I normally would without having to switch over to wifi and some things work and some things don't. And I won't be able to get it until we're 10,000 feet in the air. Like it's all good stuff to me. Right. That is, I think it's a good trade off. Yeah. Wall Street Journal's Sarah E. Needleman and Sarah Donaldson wrote an article called Kids Don't Want Money Anymore. Virtual currencies have become many families' preferred way to pay allowance. Can you convert this to Robux? Now, that's that's the subtitle in the subtitle. It starts with an anecdote about parents paying kids an allowance for doing chores, and then the kids handing it right back and asking them to convert it to Robux. There's some other anecdotes talking about the freedom kids have to buy virtual items. One example being a virtual Louis Vuitton purse using Robux and without needing the parents to drive them to a store to do it. Before you get outraged, virtual items are way less expensive than real life counterparts. That Louis Vuitton purse costs less than $5 and games like Robux have strong parental controls that help prevent out of control spending. Parents can down, excuse me, parents can control the money supply just like they would with a cash allowance and kids still get lessons in how to spend wisely. Yeah, so it won't cost your kids a lot in the words of Jesse to look good in your Louis Louis. That's good to know. But there's a lot of children doing this. About half of Robux's 60 million daily users are under the age of 13. There's also a lot of money for this. Roblox revenues have grown 600% in the past three years to $1.9 billion last year. You don't hear about Roblox laying off a bunch of people. It also makes almost all that money off of selling Robux. It doesn't have a lot of other certainly not anything close to bringing in as much money as Robux does. And Roblox isn't the only one doing this. Minecraft has mine coins. Fortnite has V bucks. Pokemon Go has Poke coins. There's even a company called Moonbug that sells NFTs of kids show characters from Coco Melon and Blippi. Last year, children 12 to 17 spent an average of $92 a month online. That's twice as much as they did two years earlier. Rob, I know your kids are grown now. How do you think you would deal with this if you still had youngins? No differently than how I dealt with it when I had youngins because the story is about Roblox and it's about kids wanting virtual currency to do things inside of these games. But when it comes to allowance, number one, most kids when they first start getting it, they don't understand the concept and the value of money. They just want things. They just want stuff. And in this case, if they're playing this game, and I think a lot of them got into it because they were kind of captive audience inside all the time over the pandemic, then oh, they're stuffing that game. I want it. So it's not about I want my allowance in this way. It's just that I want stuff in that game. And if my allowance allows me to get it, then so be it. So I don't see this as being any different than if your kids are in the go-kart racing, they want to use their allowance on go-kart parts. If they are into pogo sticks, they want to use their allowance on pogo sticks. I think it's just whatever your children are into. That's what they want to use their allowance on. Yeah. Kids want stuff, right? Sometimes it's real stuff. Sometimes these days it's virtual stuff. Roger, you've got youngins. What do you think of this? Honestly, when I first heard about it, this really reminded me of what they used to do when I went back in the olden days in school. When we used to sell magazines, we would collect not money, but we would collect price points. And then when you got a certain amount, you could spend them on a specific thing, whether it was a little radio or a cassette tape album of whatever band you wanted to listen to. It's just a way of taking a sort of value toward an object, whether it's in-game or whatever, and then making it so that it's just one step away from an actual money. I think we'll see a lot more of this, because they've been doing this for kids in some way or fashion for the past 40 years, whether you collect certain stickers, you collect coupons, you collect something that builds up in value that you then exchange for whatever the store offers. Bazooka Joe comics from the bubblegum that you sent in. They do it for adults when they used to let you use your points to buy things from the credit card store, buy yourself a GPS device. They still do that. That's not a gone thing. I'm thinking of Ralphie and all the stuff he had to save up to get the decoder ring from Ovaltine in a classic store. You said 40 years, this has been going on since advertising has existed. And children were the target of it. That makes me think that the point of the story may be a little bit off. The fact that kids want virtual items is just this is the latest thing that kids want. And what the allowance is, is going to let them understand how to allocate resources. If those resources are in game, I don't think there's any problem with that. You just need the parents to understand what's going on in Roblox. So there's a little learning curve there. There are also, I think, some fair concerns about things like blind boxes and such like in games. I think Roblox is really good about managing. Fortnite has gotten better about managing. So you have to be careful what platform the kids are on. But the real popular ones like Minecraft and Roblox are pretty responsible with that stuff. So my way of thinking the article here is pointing out more to me that the children are already in the metaverse. If anyone wants to know what the metaverse is going to be, look at the 12 to 17 year olds. They're living in it. They're going to grow up in it. They're going to change it as they become adults. They already kind of are as some of them have entered their 20s and nobody's going to build a metaverse. The children are already living in it and it's just going to evolve from there. That's what this tells me. No, I think that's a really good point. And I know like in lately in the news, everybody has been on Mark Zuckerberg about you really missed with the metaverse. And it's like, no, she's just really early. He's got to let these kids grow up who are actively going to be the ones using it and kind of driving where the technology goes. And it's going to be very, very consumer driven. Because what I noticed is that the kids, the parents are connected to it through their kids spending by engaging and managing what they can spend. And I think actually this is the one thing I thought was really cool. Before your parents, they might know what you were spending your coupon bucks on or whatever. But now you know, right? There's kind of parental controls. Yeah, exactly. And so I think there should be a little less resistance to it because parents do have kind of a say that they have a throttle control on where the spending is and where it goes. Yeah, Stoic Squirrel is asking if the kids are using VR or are we using a broad meaning of metaverse? I've always thought the connection between VR and metaverse is just tangential. You can have a metaverse without VR and there's plenty of VR that's not metaverse. They may or may not interact. We're talking about the metaverse in the sense of a virtual world that they live in and value and want to spend $5 on a Louis Vuitton virtual person. If they access it by VR, great. AR, great. Phone, whatever. It's still the virtual landscape that they're treating as real. And if meta wants to build the metaverse, they better start getting 15, 16, 17-year-olds into whatever they think that's going to be and Facebook is not it. Right. Well, they better allow you to take that Louis Vuitton bag that you bought with Roblox and move it to another part of the metaverse. If we're really going to get a broad metaverse, we're going to have to start seeing that. That's the next thing to look for. It's like, you know, Minecraft and Roblox come into some agreement where you can move things back and forth. I'm not saying that's going to happen anytime soon, but if you start to see, talk about that. Metaverse federation. Yeah. Yeah. The fediverse. Wait, we already took that. Mastodon has that. Never mind. Hey, folks, if you have a thought about this, if you're like, hey, that sparks a thought, I wonder if it could be this. Send it to us. Email it. We want your email. Feedback at DailyTechNewsShow.com. Anchor offers cameras under the Ufi brand. Ufi cameras promise that all recorder footage is encrypted on device and sent straight to your phone. And only you have the key to decrypt and watch the footage, aka in encrypted. The company cites ISO 2701 and ISO 2701 certification from the British Standards Institute for Information Security Management and Privacy Information Management. So it was a little surprising, given Anchor's good reputation and all of this due diligence they've done to get certified, get independently audited, when security researcher Paul Moore claimed that Ufi cameras stored faces without encryption and streamed video without authentication. Moore's statement was followed by SEC Consult, publishing a summary of two years of their research, showing that thumbnails of recorded Ufi images were transferred to an AWS instance. Ufi responded by saying, yes, those thumbnails are transferred. They are restricted by account logins and the URLs for the thumbnails expire after 24 hours unless you share them somewhere. They clarified to ours, Technica, that the thumbnails are only sent off device if you choose mobile push notification images. You don't have to do that. You can choose text notifications, but if you choose image notification, they have to get them to you and that's how they get them to you and they are server side encrypted. Ufi has updated its setup language to make that clear. They said, yep, our setup language could have been better. They've already updated that. If you choose image based notifications, which you don't have to, those images will need to leave your local drive and briefly be hosted in the cloud. So that one kind of makes sense and they've addressed what I think was the problem, which is the unclear language and setup. But there's more. Yeah, but more also claimed that he found that he could remotely start and monitor Ufi cameras through VLC without authentication or encryption. He said he couldn't release a proof of concept, but another security researcher called Wasabi said that he had posted about the problem and worked with the Verge to demonstrate the vulnerability. Now, the Verge says there were two ways that they used to get that URL that you would need in order to monitor a camera that wasn't yours. The first way you would need to log in with the username and password that was in control of that camera, which I mean, you could fish that, hack it, whatever. And then there was an undisclosed technique to get the URL. So it wasn't easy to get to you had to know how to get it, but you could get it and that would show a camera stream. Ufi has since made that technique not work. The Verge says we can't make that work anymore. They did a change in the website. So you can't even even if you get into somebody's account, you can't get that URL. However, the URL included the camera's serial number in base 64, which you could just uncalculate. If you found the serial number, you could calculate base 64 version of it. A UNIX timestamp, that's easy. A token and a four digit random hex. Now, it's possible for someone to recreate that URL without having to go into your account. They would have to have the serial number of the camera. That might be harder to get. They'd either have to get physical access to your camera, trick you into telling them it somehow, but they'd have to get that. So there's some effort involved there. They would have to brute force the hex number, but it's only four digits. So that's fairly easy. The Verge said also it did not appear the token in the URL was validated. They were able to just change it to whatever they wanted and the URL still worked. Thankfully, you fee serial numbers are long, complex and non sequential. So they're not easy to guess. It would probably take some social engineering to get it. The Verge also said that these only work if the camera is already awake. An anchor denies that there is a problem. He told the Verge and ARS Technica that it is not possible to start and monitor a stream and watch live footage from you a you fee camera without a third party player like VLC. And it told ARS Technica that it disagrees with the accusations and encourages customers to contact customer support if they have concerns. Still, Android Central has removed all of its recommendations for you fee cameras. I think the thumbnail image was a misunderstanding. They fixed it. That one doesn't bother me. I think this vulnerability is probably not going to affect 99% or more of you fee users. If you're a high value target, you probably shouldn't be using you fee cameras in this way anyway. What bugs me and I know what's going on here, which is anchor is saying, yeah, we know this is a possible vulnerability, but virtually no one's going to take advantage of it. It's really difficult for someone to use. So we're not worried about it. Why should we spend time and money fixing it? However, they wouldn't have to spend a whole lot of time and money to repair their customer relationship if they just validated that token or explain why that token can't or shouldn't be validated. But just saying this isn't a problem I don't think is going to wash at this point. Yeah. So like you said, this is not going to affect very, very many people, but it could affect some and the fixed it will cost anchor something. I think that something is less than the PR hit that they're taking if they just are not. It's not a big deal. We're not going to worry about it because people are going to say, how I can go buy the anchor is it's a big brand, but it's not the only brand. There are other there are other cameras out there that do similar functions to this. So they've got to be real careful in how they walk this line. And I wouldn't be shocked if they come back and they decide you ever just going to go ahead and you know, authenticate these tokens. Yeah. And again, I don't think it should be lost on folks. How much effort it would be if I wanted to spy on Rob, I'd have to trick him into giving me the serial number or sneak into his house and copy the serial number down or hack into a computer where the serial number was stored. Like it would take effort. This is this is not an easy hack. And I feel like anchor could just make it go away by validating that token. Maybe I'm overlooking something there. But if that token in the URL was validated and you couldn't guess it right now, it doesn't you don't even have to guess it. You just put something else in that space in the URL and it works. All you need is that serial number and then brute force the hex number. Maybe make that hex numbers long longer to to provide a little extra security. In fact, making that hex number a whole lot longer would just reduce this possibility so close so much closer to zero. That might be enough. But I don't know. It seems to me that yes, they're not wrong. This is a very low probability thing. But now that it's out there and people react into it, a little bit of effort to address it probably would go a long way. This is not one of those times where any publicity is good publicity. You know, acre needs to you know, they need to get in front of this and the fix, although it will cost them something will be less costly than the lack of sales of these devices if they don't fix it. All right, folks, we know flight delays and cancellations are a frustrating price to pay for traveling. And we know a lot of you are traveling sometimes for the first time in a couple of years these days. But Chris Christensen is here with a tip that might just help ease that burden. This is Chris Christensen from amateur traveler with another tech in travel minute. There's a new resource that's come out for US domestic carriers from the US Department of Transportation called the airline customer service dashboard. And what it shows you is by airline by carrier, what kind of opportunities will you have if there are cancellations or controllable delays? And so will they for instance, rebook you on a partner airline? Will they give you a meal cash? Will they give you complimentary hotel accommodations if they cancel your flight? So check that out. The easiest way to find it is to Google airline customer service dashboard. I would take it with a grain of salt because I know that I've twice been stranded this year. And by one of the airlines who I shan't call out JetBlue and they did not offer me any hotel credits and they did not do what this document says that they would do, but take it with a grain of salt, but it's a useful resource. This is Chris Christensen from amateur traveler. I think what Chris is trying to say Rob is your frequent flyer mileage may vary. He said they're very eloquently. He didn't call any companies out except for what? Except for the one that sounded like he sneezed to me. Do it. Yeah, I don't know. Are you traveling? JetBlue. Yeah, you know what? That was a sneeze. That was a sneeze. Yeah, that was a bless you. Thank you, sir. Chris Christensen. All right, let's check out the mailbag. So this message comes from Jason Pallado where he says, the other day my slack blew up on me. It's vital to my work. Turns out it was because I use 1.1.1.1. That's I believe that it's cloud flare changing over to open DNS, fix the issue. I was wondering, do the DTNS team use a specific DNS or stick with the default one through their ISP? I know for me, I use the Google one. What is that, you know, 808.8888. So I use that. I've used cloud flare before. My gut tells me that this is not a cloud flare issue. It's just a cloud for may have had an issue at the time that he, you know, that he had. Yeah, they're pretty reliable usually. Yeah, I'm sure if Jason switched back to 1.1.1.1, slack would work fine. I also understand that moment where you're like, I need slack to work right now. And I'm not going to wait for the fix that I'm switching to open DNS. I get that I use 1.1.1.1. And I had forgotten. I had to go look it up because I'd forgotten what I had put in there. And I have not had issues with that. So yeah, it's another your mileage may vary situation. But yeah, I think most of us here, actually, I think it was Roger, were you saying you use 8.8.8.8. I think he was saying that. Yeah, I use the Google. I used to use open DNS, but I found Google just to have less issues over like a eight year period. So if anybody doesn't know what we're talking about, you can go into your network settings, either on your computer or sometimes in your router, people do it. And say, when you're looking up a domain name, don't go to my ISP to look it up. Go to this address to look it up. And one of the reasons you might want to do that is because ISPs sometimes track and monetize that information. Other times people are like, you know what, I just want a more reliable domain name system, one that's putting in all the latest DNS second security things. It's not something you have to do, but a lot of people do it just as one more step towards being secure. And they're easy to remember. All ones always. They're just easy to remember. Indeed. All right. Len Peralta has been busily illustrating today's show. And Len, I'm very curious to find out what you drew for us today. You know, I'm just getting old. I, you know, we're talking about the story about the Robux and, you know, I have a young child, you know, 10 year old, 11 year old son, who hasn't got into it yet, but it's scaring me. Anyway, thinking, talking about this brought up like, you know, the next wave, you know, Rob talked about the metaverse being a little bit too premature. But hey, why can't we, why can't we do something fun like this? This is a, an image of a TV show that's coming out, I would say, probably January 1 called Meet the Rebellionaires. And, you know, I can just see these, you know, it's about two fun loving kids or a group of fun loving kids who are spending their Robux and in fun ways and taking over the world. Yeah, they've got their virtual Balenciagas and tuxedos. Oh, man. Yeah. Maybe, maybe not the Balenciagas, but the Louis Vuitton's for sure. Yeah, if you, if you want to take a look at this, if you want to actually get this print, you can go to my Patreon, patreon.com forward slash Len, where if you become a backer, you automatically get this print or you can go the traditional way and go to my online store and get it there, which by the way, I am selling my custom drawn holiday cards. And I've got an open commission line. So, so hit me up and, and, and get, you know, celebrate the holidays. There's, there's three levels. You could have three levels of Len in your holiday. If you're, if you're a DTNS patron, you may have already got your holiday card drawn by Len. You can also go to our store and buy holiday cards designed by Len. But the best way to do it is to go to Len yourself and say, draw exactly what I want for the holidays on this card. I love the three levels of Len. That's like, it's not quite Dante's Inferno, but it's close. It gets you out of Dante's Inferno. Exactly. Correct. Yeah. Don't let your holidays turn into Dante's Inferno. No, that's, that's probably good advice for anybody. So, and so that's LenPeraltaStore.com. LenPeraltaStore.com. Fantastic. Thank you, Ray. Also, thanks to our brand new boss, Petey, who just started backing us on Patreon. Thank you, Petey. Yeah. Petey gets it. Petey is a, it's a wave. I would call it a Patreon wave sweeping across the nation that Petey is the leading edge of right now. You could be you tomorrow, Patreon.com slash DTNS. Patrons, stick around for the extended show. We are going to continue along with the folks. I'm sorry. I'm trying to find, I changed my sound board around and now I can't find anything. All right. Here we go. We are going to stick around and we're going to talk some more. So if you're a patron, you're going to get that. You can also watch the show live Monday through Friday, 4pm Eastern, 2100 UTC. Find out more at dailytechnewshow.com slash live back on Monday. Talking about what we can do about our imperfect understanding of AI with Andrea Jones Roy. Talk to you then. This week's episodes of Daily Tech News Show were created by the following people, host producer and writer Tom Merritt, host producer and writer Sarah Lane, executive producer and Booker Roger Chang, producer, writer and host Rich Stratholino, video producer and Twitch producer Joe Coons, technical producer Anthony Lemos, Spanish language host writer and producer Dan Campos, news host writer and producer Jen Cutter, science correspondent Dr. Nikki Ackermans, social media producer and moderator Zoe Deterding, our mods, Beatmaster, WS Goddess One, BioCal, Captain Kipper, Steve Gadarama, Paul Reese, Matthew J Stevens, aka Gadget Virtuoso and JD Galloway, modern video hosting by Dan Christensen, video feed by Sean Wei, music and art provided by Martin Bell, Dan Looters, Mustafa A, ACAST and Len Peralta, live art performed by Len Peralta, ACAST ad support from Tatiana Matias, Patreon support from Dylan Harari. Contributors for this week's shows included Nicole Lee, Scott Johnson, Justin Robert Young, Rob Dunwood and Chris Christensen. Our guests this week included Bodie Grimm and Jim Thatcher, and thanks to all our patrons who make the show possible.