 Well investors aren't giving thanks for what's been going on on Wall Street this year and with the Federal Reserve set to hike rates again next month Are we looking at more pain before things turn around? Let's talk to our all-star money panel most RMOs with this along with Scott Martin Scott. I'll start with you 2022 has been one of the roughest years in history Maybe the roughest by some accounts when you started to talk about stocks and bonds both being devastated to this degree Any line at the end of the tunnel There's some the problem is the tunnels really close by so the light is probably going to be a little dimmer than maybe we'd hope because it didn't start early enough But you're right Charles a little souvenir of a terrible year is 2022 But that means good things going forward if you can believe it I'm always kind of a positive guy, and I think there's some positive things going on with respect to Future expectation of S&P returns which are going to go up because we've had such a down year it reverts to the mean over time So that's a good thing and also the fact too Charles as we've seen with this Recessionary take that's out there whether it's the companies the analysts consumers, etc. People on TV The reality is this The fact that companies are cutting jobs. They've cut outlook Consumers have cut spending those are kind of the last steps to the end of the recession So where we go from here is likely up it just may take a little while, but I don't think it gets much worse Well, let's see She's Saying that my time frame is a little bit different than Scott's so I think we have more downside younger too So you can afford that extra time. Well, I mean, I basically think that we're not going to see any changes until possibly after the next Presidential election, so we're talking two years out, and I I'm gonna say it right here I don't think the market makes another brand new all-time high in 2023 So we would be two consecutive years when we're so bullish for so long from really even 2016 up to 2022 and that's shocking for people even that we didn't make new eyes this year What is the reason we're gonna rally give me one reason? I mean come on Scott just talked about a few things he thinks first of all It's overdone Valuations have come down the markets made adjustments businesses are making adjustments So we'll go to this little trough at the beginning of next year where earnings are down year over year And then they start to pick back up with the market move ahead at something like that No, because again the Fed is going to raise rates. They're gonna keep up their pace They're not gonna back off if anything they're gonna over correct this time around because they know that they kept rates too low for too long So everyone is cheering up and down that the market rally the last few weeks because they think that the Fed is only gonna raise Them 25 basis points or half It's gonna probably see be 75 and then we're gonna sell off and have a dip in December And then maybe a eke out a Christmas rally towards the end of the year Christmas New Year's Eve rally And again overall you're gonna look at this year and you're gonna say oh my gosh Where where we started the year from where we're down more than a hundred points on both the QQQs and the spy Which is devastating for a long-term investors particularly people that are in retirement actually not gonna say the 6040 portfolio This is the worst year ever for that But you know we always these conversations got always come back to the Federal Reserve right and we are hearing some members of the Fed Little less hawkish than than Jay Powell was the last time we heard him right now Wall Street sees More rate-high similar to points, but they see red cuts some point next year a couple of cuts Which to me indicates they're gonna crack the economy Overdo it to her point and once they realize that they'll become more accommodative with the market rally and something like that Exactly the market always preempt stuff like that It always preempts the economic recovery because it's a forward-looking indicator and in my old age I forget about the times when the Fed actually cuts rates Charles But remember that's a huge boon to markets and Melissa's right like the sentiment is exactly what she noted But guys when the sentiment goes this far when everybody knows something is gonna happen It probably won't happen So I'm just telling you the boat is getting loaded to the side of everybody saying another down year next year blah blah Even if we get an 8% average annual return year as typical for the S&P 500 next year That's still a positive number from where we were this year So I think that outlook Charles alongside the Fed alongside all those downgrades and earnings means we go up from here Real quick. We got a minute and a half. I want to switch gears a little bit here. Melissa to the FTX saga You know, it's it's it's it's ugly It involves a lot of key players a lot of famous people a lot of rich people political donations political influencing This has everything. I mean, what do you make of it? I think it's terrible because obviously a lot of regular normal people lost money and they buy into this they buy into the hype And then you have celebrities out there now They're getting paid on a social media to do these advertisements on Instagram on Facebook It's actually a way that people are making money now that are famous and I think it hurt regular investors You can't believe everything you see because just because it's a celebrity that's endorsing something that it's necessarily true And it'll be interesting to see if really something happens with this what the outcome is Yeah, I mean there's a lot of layers this Scott and listen I know the celebrities that Tom Brady's of the world and maybe not a crypto expert But there were some financial people very smart that tons that did nothing to help this along and regulators They looked the other way and maybe even politicians We're still got to sniff that out because millions of dollars are sprinkling into that last election. Where do you see it going? Oh, I mean this the fallout of this could be massive Charles where it's going is Man, maybe nowhere in the sense of like this deep stuff keeps happening over and over again just in kind of a different tenor The one thing I have to ask though, too is where is Sam Bankman? I mean, we haven't seen the guy we don't know exactly where he is We got to bring him in somewhere and get a talking to I mean the fact that this thing is going on and on and they're finding Out more and more we know this is bad. Let's get the guy in there Get him incarcerated get him at least a talking to you know an interview something and figure out how bad it really goes Because you're right all the political influence and everybody that's at the higher levels that got involved with this Yeah is stark. Yeah, it really really really makes these things remember Maddof It makes even Maddof like that. It's dwarfed now by when you have things like this the the scale that these things happen on now It's amazing. Absolutely amazing guys. Thank you both very much Great seeing you both Melissa and Scott well with temperatures cooling down the