 Okay, I don't want to make this long and drawn out, but I just want to tell you, about 11 years ago, I met Robin through a mutual friend of ours, Joe Navarro, and when I met Robin, we kind of hit it off right away. We're amazed at how we were doing the same thing, but for way different reasons. You know, the things that I were doing were never going to result in getting dead, arrested, or being an enemy of another state. That wasn't the case for him, but we were still, like, pretty surprised at how similar our paths were. And I took one very core lesson away from Robin that I have made the mantra of all of my training for anyone who's been there, and all of the SE villages for the last 10 years. And that is, leave them feeling better for having met you. And Robin's really personified that mantra throughout the years, and all the work that he's done. And the two books that he has out was his third coming out shortly. Well, shortly, is it? It's done. It's done. January. So shortly, shortly. And you kind of get that sense that that's his mantra forever. If you don't know Robin, he ran the behavioral analysis program for over 20 years for the FBI. He's recently retired. And I'm really proud of this fact. He's joined us on the Innocent Lives Foundation to become a board member and really spearhead. Yeah, thank you. Thank you. Thank you. And Robin uses his knowledge and his charisma and his name to go out into the news and the media and help bring awareness to our mission. And what it is that we're doing and bring awareness to parents that can help protect their kids. So having someone like Robin as a part of that has been just a true honor and a blessing as well as calling him a friend has been really a great part of my life for the last decade. And it all culminates into something which is kind of crazy to me to have Robin here judging for the SECTF, which is fear a little bit, I think, for him. And then also to have him speaking here, this is something we talked about a decade ago. About a decade, we sat together. We were training together in Bristol, UK. And we talked about actually starting a conference together, doing things like this, like speaking and sharing our knowledge. And not only is he speaking here, but I'm really, really happy to say that if you haven't heard, we're starting our own conference called SE Village Orlando. And it's going to be in February in Orlando, Florida. And it's all social engineering. And there won't be any lines, I promise. Okay, there'll be no lines. But Robin is going to be there giving a training out. And I'm really excited about having to be part of all of this. So without any further ado, if you would help me in welcoming my friend, Robin Dreek. Good afternoon, everyone. And wow, yeah, what a crowd. I've done crowds before, but I've never had people picnicking in the front. So I appreciate that much. I know it's not for me because we have an amazing lineup of speakers today. And yeah, everything Chris said is absolutely true. It's, matter of fact, the greatest thing I mentioned in the Anderson Lies Foundation. And it's hands down the coolest thing I've ever been part of. And literally the day I retired is the day he called me and said, board member, right? I said, yeah, of course. So it's a great pleasure to be part of that. And so if you want any more information, we've got a booth over there. So I'm basically going to give you a synopsis of my entire last 50 years of my life in 50 minutes. And those of you all that know me, yes, I'm originally from the Northeast. I'm an extrovert. So stand by. It's going to be death by Robin in 50 minutes. And it's fun because this is where it all started. I remember when I first did the podcast with Chris back and we were trying to figure this out. It was actually November of 2008, I think. And he called me on the phone to do the podcast. He goes, Robin, I do social engineering. And I go, dude, I don't know anything about that. It's all that cyber stuff. He goes, no, no. He said, what do you do? I said, well, primarily my job for my entire time with the FBI was recruiting spies. And if I wasn't recruiting spies, I was recruiting people around spies to tell me about the spies. And he goes, oh, you're social engineering. I go, what? And so basically came down to that. And so very briefly, we'll kind of show where I love framing my background to show where it all came from. Because basically, and he mentioned, I have books out on this and another one coming. These are my manuals on how not to be the moron I was born to be. So with no further ado, my background, very simply. I'm a United States Naval Academy graduate, Marine Corps officer. Came in the FBI in 1997. Literally had a two week break and got assigned in the New York field office. In the New York field office, I was assigned to work counterintelligence. I worked against the Russians. As a matter of fact, specifically Russian military intelligence, the GRU. My job every day of my life and career was to recruit Russian intelligence officers. And I'll tell you about how challenging that is in a second. And so from New York, after I did that, I got on behavioral team in 2001. Then I got transferred to Norfolk, Virginia. Continued to work counterintelligence in Norfolk, Virginia. Norfolk, Virginia FBI headquarters. I went up to headquarters in management, actually in counterintelligence division up there. I ran the entire program on the East Coast. In 2008, I went down to Quantico to teach counterintelligence interviewing and recruiting. That's when Chris and I met and I took over all that. And then I took over our behavioral analysis program in 2010. I ran our team for a number of years until sequestration hit the government. And they eliminated the team in position from counterintelligence division, which is actually personally the best day of my life. Because I then stepped out of management and literally did all this stuff that I'm going to share with you back on the street again the last five years of my career. In Fredericksburg, Virginia, five miles from my house. I went home for lunch every day. My boss is 65 miles away and I was in heaven. Until the day I retired and I got even better. And so does that all not scream at you one hardcore thing? Yes, I am a hardcore type A. No doubt about it. Especially if anyone ever take the Myers-Briggs type indicator or anything like that. Head nods, yes. ENTJ, Exaverted Intuitive Thinking Judger. Yeah, all right. You know what that is when you're 20 years old? Narcissistic Manlumenic Ass. And now here's the fun part. If you want to work in the world of counterintelligence and you have that behavior, you're going to fail majestically. Luckily for me and my squad in New York, we had these Jedi masters that had this art form down. And just like in everything in life, these are natural born leaders. They had no idea what they were doing. They're just doing it. Just like we saw, you know, some of the conversations going on today in the booth. Some people just have this conversation art form down. This moron did not. But luckily I was surrounded. So let me tell you about the challenge of working counterintelligence. So my job is to recruit Russian spies. Basically I have the hardest sales job and position I think in the entire country, possibly the entire world. Because my job is to sell a concept. My job, my product I'm selling is patriotism in the United States. And I'm trying to sell that product to foreign intelligence officers. Number one challenge. Second challenge, who are foreign intelligence officers? 99% of them are under diplomatic cover at the United Nations, whereas in New York. It is illegal by treaty for me to walk up and have a conversation, initiate a conversation with the person I'm trying to sell my product to. So that's the second challenge. Third challenge, in law enforcement. Now granted, here's the funny thing about law enforcement. I was in the bureau for 21 years. Last time I used handcuffs was in Hogan's alley doing the make-believe stuff, going through New Age and training. I never made an arrest. I never went to court, never any of that stuff. My entire career was about operations. My job every day was create opportunities to sell my product. And so the third thing that law enforcement generally has is compulsion why people have to talk to you because they've done something wrong. And how often do you think foreign intelligence officers actually commit a crime, a lot or a little? No, very, very little. What's their job? Their job is to collect intelligence. What's intelligence? Intelligence is something that they have an information gap in their country on. 99% of it can be found open source. And what they do is they research it, they find it open source, and then they create contacts and people of knowledge. Everyone in this room is a person of knowledge with the things you do, the company you work for, and they bring you out to lunch. Nice dinner. They say, hey, what do you think about this that I just read in the paper today? I now get a thought and opinion. It's now source and it's now intelligence. Is that illegal? Not much. Nope. If it's proprietary, possibly. Very, very rare. And so if my job is to recruit them, they've done nothing illegal. I can't talk to them and I'm trying to sell a product they don't want to buy. And that's a great challenge. And my last rhetorical question I love to ask is, so how do you actually recruit a foreign intelligence officer? Money is one thing. But you know the thing about money? What's money do? It's a means to the ends. Money gets you resources. What do you do with resources? Well, you want to buy a house. You want to take care of your family. Provide things. For what purpose? What's the end result in that? You're trying to provide one thing with every single human being. I love doing this. I can predict what everyone in this room is going to do. No magic. Everyone in this room is genetically and biologically coded to provide for their own safety and security and prosperity. Everyone in this room will always act in their own best interests. If you're a little more altruistic, your friends and family, a little more altruistic, your community, country, all these things. Also, some things that are in people's best interests is philanthropy, taking care of animals, dogs, the environment. That's in their best interests. All you have to do is figure out what they think is their own best interests. You provide resources, they're going to do it. Because that's the bottom line in truth. Every human being is hardwired to want to belong to meaningful groups and organizations and affiliate with them and to be valued by those groups and organizations. There's a few things I'm going to say throughout this entire thing and it's very simple. How do you demonstrate value in affiliation to others? I mean, hey, when I was in the Marine Corps, I sucked at this really bad. I got ranked last out of all second lieutenants. Fourteen, I was ranked dead last. I remember going up to the major and said, all right, sir, I'm doing something wrong. What? And he goes, you need to be a better leader. Okay. Keep going. How? He goes, you need to make it about everyone else but yourself. Thought I was. Okay. Keep going. How? And he goes, okay, welcome to the world of subjective leadership. Some people have the art form down. It became my life's mission to make that art form of pain by number because I didn't have it. I wanted it. I had this natural drive to want to be this great leader. But luckily for me, I had these great people around me. And so what I came to learn, long story short, is how do you demonstrate that value in affiliation? How do you make a conversation about everyone else but yourself? It's elusive. I call these the elusive obvious. It's really simple. If I seek your thoughts and opinions about what you think, I'm demonstrating my value. If I talk in terms of your priorities, what's important to you, your needs, dreams and aspirations, personal, professional, long-term, short-term, that's completely about you. If I validate everything you just said and everything you are as a human being and all the choices you've made in life, are your shields up or shields down? Completely down. So non-judgmental validation is a third thing. And finally, you empower people with choices. Because we do not give people choices unless we value them and want to affiliate with them. Everyone in here has got at least one strong relationship, yes? Tell me this. During the last course of your conversations and interaction with that individual, how often did you seek their thoughts and opinions, talk in terms of their priorities and what's important to them, validate all those things about them without judging them, and or give them a choice? I roughly say 5 to 10 percent. You imagine the power and strength of that relationship and trust if you brought it up to 100 percent. That's what I learned. That's what I'm going to share with you all today. So where I came up with this Code of Trust that I was going to share with you while sizing people up was this process and basically came down to creating labels and meanings behind things. Because as soon as I get labels and meanings and things, I start understanding, I start recognizing them. I call it the Toyota Tundra Effect. Toyota Tundra? Yes, Toyota Tundra. The day I bought my truck, I swear 300 people in my town bought the same dang truck. You have that? You buy that same make and model, and also you start seeing that make and model everywhere? Yes, because now it has meaning. So if you can do the same thing with behaviors, you give a label and a meaning to the behavior, you'll start recognizing it and start actually being able to use it for yourself. So breaking this down to what we're going to do? My, I sit down. I can't see. Anyway. So introduction and personality assessment. We just did it. Every single thing you saw, whether you're watching people in the booth or whether you're interacting or any social engineering or sales or anything, it comes down to one simple thing. Human beings are hardwired to want to belong to others, groups and affiliations, and to be valued by those. People love it when you seek their thoughts and opinions. You talk in terms of their priorities and you validate them without judgment. And you build in a choice in there, you got gold. And I'm listening to all the great conversations going on today. All those elements of those things are going on throughout this entire conversation. So that's it. Understanding human beings, you build that into your conversation, your dialogue, I guarantee you're going to have trust. Next, we're going to talk about ourselves. How can we, our behavior ourselves, how can we develop trust with others? Because one thing I found out on my team, when I stepped down from our own team, they asked me to do an article for the law enforcement bullet again. And I said, what can I write about? And they said, do it on counterintelligence. I said, okay, what can I write about? And I said, oh, let me write about what my team does. I had no idea what we actually did. I mean, we did it. You know, we'd get a request come in from a case agent somewhere in the country. We did roughly 80 or 90 assessments a year, some double agent operations, false flags, dead drops, interviews, all the hooky-spooky spy stuff. Yep, goes on all over the place still all the time. And the one thing I realized in all those assessments, when I took that step back, I said, what am I actually doing in all these things? And that's when it hit me like a ton of bricks, more fog clearing. I was strategizing trust. You know, when any one of you all, if you're a social engineer, is what are you actually doing? When someone's doing a fish, when someone's doing an interaction, you're actually strategizing, even for a short period of time, you're strategizing trust because no one will take actions, no one will divulge information, no one will do anything without some semblance of trust. So that's all the citizens. I came up with these five steps of trust. So first I'm going to share that with you. And then what I started realizing is that the more I focused on understanding trust and what was doing it and understanding what's trust, well, how to predict people. Because if I know you're always going to act in your own best interest and I know that you all want to do things that's in terms of your own priorities, bless you, bless you again. And I offer you things in terms of those priorities, my resources, I know exactly what you're going to do. You're going to do it. And so when it comes to recruiting spies, my main answer is you don't. You find people around them that know them, their sources, and they share with them, and I find out what their priorities are. And if some of their priorities is that they're dying wish of their mother and father and grandfathers with their children, don't go up on that regime without the freedoms and liberties they want and they want them to live in a better place like this, well, I have resources for that. And so that's how. You're all you're trying to do, and that's the same thing in sales, the same thing in anything. All you're trying to do is discover the priorities of individuals and see if you have resources you can offer. And that's as simple as it is. There's no complication to this. I don't use any trickery. Matter of fact, I'm the counterintelligence guy. I don't lie. I don't use sub-diffuse. You know, elicitation, yeah, a piece of cake. But you know what? What got you the elicitation? What got you the information? Assembling to trust. And everything I've ever done had to always be long-term. And so I'm always going for the hardcore trust. Oh, and so who can you trust? Basically, I started redefining trust at some point because a lot of times trust is more about morals and ethics that people have. And I'll tell you what, yours could be completely different from yours and yours, and it has nothing to do with trust. Trust to me is predictability. If I can reasonably predict what every individual is going to do in a situation, I can now manage my own expectations. Because if I can manage my expectations, I'm going to set them here and you're either going to meet them or you're going to exceed them. That way I'm going to have a healthy relationship because here's another guarantee in life. No one in this room got here by yourself. Ever. Everything you've achieved in life came from a relationship, a mentor, a guide, and then someone of inspiration. That is exactly what happened. And I thought getting in my career, the way to have a successful career was to make myself look good by being successful. I was oblivious to the fact that in order to be successful, you need strong, healthy relationships. And that was the bedrock of all what we're going to share with you all today. And finally, the elusive obvious. Given labels and meanings, all of these things, and here's what I guarantee, you're going to walk out here and you're going to see, hopefully, so much more and understand so much more. And there's not going to be any epiphanies. It's going to have labels and meanings behind what's been successful in your life already. So Chris said, leave him better for having met you. Yes, that is my gold mantra for everything. And how do you do that? Well, you do it by getting their brain to reward them for engaging with you. Back in April of 2012, Harvard did this great study and they found when they wired up people's brains, on average, people talk about themselves and share their own thoughts, opinions, and priorities 40% of every day. And every time they're sharing the thoughts, opinions, and ideas, it was basically testing, hey, do you accept me through where I am? Dopamine starts flowing. Because basically our ancient tribal brain, which is hardwired for survival, and survival means I need to belong to a tribe. I need to affiliate and be valued by that tribe. Our brain will reward us chemically. Dopamine, serotonin, oxytocin, and bloodstream. Our pleasure centers are firing when people are accepting us non-judgmentally for who we are. That's why validation is so key and critical. And validation doesn't mean I necessarily agree with you. Validation is I'm seeking to understand who you are, why you are, without judging it. And I guarantee you, that's what's going on in the brain. So sex, drugs, rock and roll, chocolate, and non-judgmental validation. It's all doing the same thing in the brain. So that's how you leave people better for having met you. And so how do you build that into a conversation? It's easy. You seek their thoughts and opinions. You talk in terms of their priorities. You validate them without judging and give them choices. If you include at least one of those things in every statement you say live or in every email you write in every single sentence, that means every single sentence is about them and their brain is rewarding them chemically for engaging with you. And now, if you do that without subterfuge or deception or manipulation, it's skyrockets because then you're going to have congruence between what's coming out of your mouth and the motions that you have in human beings pick up on those non-verbals of incongruence. Not saying it won't work. I'm saying in my line of work, I can't, I don't have room to fail. So next, this is a big step in my life as well. I realize there is actually a difference between trying to convince someone of something as opposed to how can I inspire them to want to? Because convincing someone of something, that's about me. That's about me trying to do something. Inspiration means I'm actually hopefully inspiring you to want to do something and how do you only inspire someone to want to do something? You got to make it about them. I have to discover your goals and priorities. And again, this keeps coming full circle if you can't see it. If I understand your goals and priorities and now I offer your resources to be successful and move forward on that, it'll work. And this is why social engineering and the booth works so well. What's the goal and priority of 99% of human beings on earth? An assistance, what? Yeah, an assistance theme, absolutely. Because human beings are hardwired to render assistance, commensurate to the level of relationship you have, because hey, can I have a kidney? It's not going to work. But hey, can I get a thought and opinion on something? Because I'm trying to do X. In other words, I'm using an assistance theme, but I'm also seeking your thoughts and opinions. We've got to double go. And so every time that was something successful going on the booth, it's because someone is seeking thoughts and opinions and help me, an assistance theme of some sort. And it's built in because that way you're inspiring them to want to do it because an assistance is a priority of most human beings. That's why it works. That's why it's effective. So with that the background, that is literally, that's it for understanding human behavior. When I first took over the team, we roughly had a 20, 25 page questionnaire. And the gold standard was that if a case agent couldn't fill out at least 20, I mean 70% of that questionnaire, we didn't have enough behavioral information to strategize good healthy engagement with another human being. I took over the team and said, nope, I know these principles of life. If I understand exactly what my goal is, now I started thinking things, how can I inspire you to want to do it? Well, it's easy. I'm going to seek your thoughts and opinions. I'm going to talk in terms of, see what I mean? It keeps coming back. And you can do that with any human. By the way, this is cross gender, cross ethnicity, cross everything. Because why? I'm not taking any of my context and placing it on you. I'm trying to understand yours without judging it. I've got to tell you what, 21 years of muscle memory, do it on the street, you get really good at learning how not to judge. I can give you an argument for every single point of view every human being has. Because I've listened to them all without judging it. Because when you stop judging and you allow your brain to hear why they think the way they think, because walk a mile in their shoes, now you're going to understand. Doesn't mean you necessarily agree, but understanding is what people are looking for. So the code of trust, it's moving beyond manipulation, basically demonstrated value and affiliation and making it all about them. So how do you do it? Step one, very simple. What's your goal? Now, that's the very directive part that keeps you leadership in the, you know, leader in the position that keeps you understanding what we're trying to do, whether you're an SE or a mother and a father with your kids. I mean, I use the code of trust in every aspect of my life. Now, the second part of this, so how can I inspire them to want to? So that's where we flip it. Step one keeps me walking down that thing because this is also a very altruistic, humanistic way to engage people. So people often say, so Robin, aren't you just being a carpet to be walked on? Never. Because I always know the path I'm walking. I know exactly where I want to go. I am strategizing how to inspire you to see if you want to come along with on the ride with me. Now, that says, you didn't hear me say, convince you to come with me. It's inspire you if you want to. Empowerment with choice. Last line, I always leave someone with it when I ask, you know, someone to do something patriotic for their country. I always say, if that's something you're comfortable with and if it's not, please let me know. You know, I've never been told no. You know why? When was the last time that everything that came out of someone's mouth made them feel awesome about who they were as a human being? That entire conversation. That's me. I will give it everything. I will give it everything I can to make that entire conversation about you with no lying. The gold standard I stick to. So, step two in the pro... Oh, by the way, when you start giving labels and meanings to the things you're trying to achieve, what starts happening? Green tundra effect. You start seeing opportunities to facilitate those things because you give the label of meaning. And where do you see them? In people and relationships. Step two, what are the priorities of the individuals you want to interact with? Needs, ROMs, dreams, and aspirations, short-term, long-term, personal, professional. What makes this person want to get up and live another day? If they don't, why not? Give it label and meaning because what happens when you give it label and meaning? You're going to start recognizing opportunities to be a resource for these people's prosperity and success because my three anchors I utilize in every engagement I do is number one, I will leave this relationship and interact so that I will have a healthy professional relationship. I'm about to say, right or do, going to help or hinder a healthy relationship because nothing will move forward without it. Number two, open honest communication transparency. If I can't have that, I will not have a healthy relationship. And number three, I make myself an available resource for the success and prosperity of others with no expectation of reciprocity because if I put an expectation of reciprocity in there, who's it about now? Me or them? Me, they're going to pick up on it. It's not saying it's going to be a showstopper, but when you understand their priorities, you understand your priorities, your brain naturally starts overlapping resources for each other and I guarantee you, all these resources come through people and relationships. That's why you want good ones. I mean, look at Chris and I, I would literally do anything for Chris. I mean, just throwing in this relationship thing. So my father-in-law passed away suddenly about five years ago now, four or five years, and I used to tell the story about how I recruited my wife. Same school since fifth grade on, and she thought I was some dumb jock and I thought she hung out in the library all day and cried or something, you know, so diverse. But I met her, we met her at a mutual friend's party over Christmas of December of 93 and three months later we were married. That's what Marines do, see the hill, take the hill, man, just go charge. But I remember one of the first questions I asked her, used to be a fun game, and she gave me an answer that I've never heard any human being ever guess and ever get again. And she said carnival food. Carnival food, like what? And she goes like candied apples, cotton candy, I was thinking like burgers, or we'll go out to Italian, Chinese, no, carnival food. And it was a comfort food that her and her dad used to have together when they used to go to racetrack in Saratoga, New York, and so candied apples was her thing. And that's what my wife would say in New York with a condolence card for my wife. That's what you call thoughtfulness. Thoughtfulness goes in a hell of a long way to build a good healthy, strong relationship. From that point on, my wife says, anything Chris asked you to do, you can do. Hence I'm here and Chris is working for me for free. So, next, she asked to take other individual orientation, all these things, because this is where you're going to start to have possibilities of building affiliation, but also what do they see when they see you? Fourth, how do we make it about them? So we take this knowledge and we start building in the four things I said, when we start strategizing this conversation, we're going to seek their thoughts and opinions, talk in terms of their priorities, validate their priorities and context, empower them with choice. Because when you start doing this and you offer people those resources to further those things, they're going to take advantage of it. I guarantee it. Now here's a really cool thing. If they don't, it means you don't know all their priorities and they're hiding things from you. So you might have unhealthy. So now you just reassess. That's what's really great about this. I guarantee what people are going to do. And if they don't, it means there's something that you don't know. So now you have a choice. Find out or don't engage. So that's what I mean. I love human beings because I love interact. It's very cause and effect. And also, with all this I've learned, there is no right or wrong. There just is. I can just guarantee what people's reactions will be in every situation. You judge, shields up. You don't judge, shields down. And if you're going for shields down, that's what will happen. So step five is like how do you craft that encounter, make it all about them? Easy. I always start out with a nonjudgmental validation of strength, attribute or action. Because that's why I'm always seeking people's strengths. Here's another guarantee. Every single person in this room has insecurities and you're all working on something. We are born perfect. The world messes us up for 19 years and we spend the rest of our lives trying to undo that crap. So stop trying to figure out what's wrong with everyone in Pocone at it because I guarantee you're not building any trusted relationships doing it. Find their greatness. And it might not even be in the professional world, it might not even be at work. I worked around with a lot of morons in my last couple years in the FBI. Horrible case agents. So was I. I'm lazy as hell. I was good. But you know what? These were some of the best fathers, best husbands, best parents, best community leaders I've ever known in my entire life. I found their greatness because everyone's got it. Find it because if you want to start out of the conversation with someone and start building trust, start it with that. In most situations we're trying to inspire people to listen to things we want to tell them anyway. So how do we inspire someone to listen to us? Easy. We seek their thoughts and opinions regarding their priorities next. Because again, I'm talking in terms of your priorities and seeking your thoughts and opinions, your dope means flowing. Next, I'm going to validate the things you just said. Now here's where I'm going to inspire you to want to listen to me. I'm going to seek your thoughts and opinions about things I wanted to tell you. Matter of fact, you know, the world is very political these days, but I don't like talking politics. It's much easier talking news stations. So say you watch Fox and I watch CNN. And you have your point of view. What's the natural reaction? Oh, that's not what I think. Here's what I think. Is he going to listen? Nope. Shields up. What's the what's the probability of me convincing him of my point of view? Zipponara. As opposed to how can I inspire him to want to listen to me? He shares his thoughts and opinions again. Instead of saying that's not what I think, here's what I think. I said, ooh, I never heard of quite what that way before. Help me understand. How did you come up with that? He shares his thoughts and opinions because I was asking it. And now after he shares his thoughts and opinions, I validated by saying, I got to tell you what you gave me a lot more to think about. I appreciate that. I'm curious. What do you think about this? And now I ask his thoughts and opinions about what I want you to tell him before. What's the likelihood he's going to hear it? Guaranteed. You don't plant seeds with people by telling them what you think. You plant seeds with people by asking them what they think. It's a guarantee. That's why I do this. So finally, you know, their priorities, you know, your priorities, when you people choices, they're going to naturally overlap. And finally, if appropriate, empower people with making choice about maintaining contact or assistance. Last line I left with every human being I first on first contact was, please, first of all, ask me any questions you have because if I leave you feeling I wonder what he really wanted, I have totally failed you. Second, if you don't want to ever have contacted me again, please tell me now I'll make a never note. I'll make a note to never bother you again. How many, again, how many times in the last five years that ever happened to me? Zero. Sometimes I didn't want to do exactly what I was hoping to do. They said, probably I really don't want to go to conferences and talk to Chinese guys overseas. I said, that's okay. No problem. He said, but I'm willing to do this. I said, okay, we'll do that. Because what's my ultimate goal? Healthy relationship, open arms communication, be a resource for the success and prosperity. Another anchor I had, protect natural security. That was it. Because if not you, you, someone else, I mean, it really didn't matter because I know exactly what I'm doing. My goal is always healthy relationships. So that's the code of trust. That's what we do in our behavior if we want to inspire people to want to align with us and want to build relationships with us. Now, for the new part, which is the book coming out in January, which is friggin' done, sizing people up. Again, it's not about sizing people up and judging. It's sizing people up and really, what can I reasonably predict you're going to do? And I came up with these six signs and there's, I don't have time to go in all these sub-signs and the tells I have for these things. But these are six behavior signs that I was basically using throughout my career to understand what, what are you going to do? Can I, can we have a healthy relationship? Because these are signs I'm looking at in other people to see are going to have a healthy relationship. And number one, vesting. I'm looking for signs in the vest. Now, granted, you don't have to have all six signs in an individual. I mean, most people in my life have like one and it's really spiked really high. But that's okay. So I'm looking one sign is vesting. In other words, they see, do they see themselves helping you to move forward in things that, of your pride is important in you? In other words, are they willing to, to give their resources freely and willingly with no expectation or reciprocity for your success? That's a sign of vesting. That's healthy. So I'm looking for signs of that. My second one, longevity. Do they see this relationship as being long term? Or is it just something they're going to do short time? I think this is a great example, you know, the difference between the things I had to do for my career and maybe social engineering kind of get bits of information. That's a not, there's no longevity sign when we're doing social engineering because we're trying to get limited bits of information over a short period of time. Doesn't mean it's unhealthy. Doesn't mean anything else. It's just there's no sign for it. So I'm happy to be part of your company. My lifelong goals is to, you know, like Chris, Chris, when he started social engineering, his lifelong goal was to build the company and continue to do these things. That's someone's got longevity and the things, you know, him and I talked about back in Bristol, you know, it feels like, feels like a hundred years ago. That was science longevity because we're talking about doing things that took 10 years to manifest. And also on this first sign of vesting, any time I ever needed anything, any time he ever needed anything, whatever resources you need, Chris, whatever I can take care for, I'm there for you. I mean, I'm just even talking about getting ILF going. I mean, it was, it's, there's no holds barred except legals, of course. We don't do anything illegal. Nothing like that. But so vesting, longevity, third sign I'm looking for is reliability. And this takes a little time sometimes, but basically can they do what they say they're going to do? Do they have the energy? Do they have the talent? Do they have the skill? Do they have the willingness to commit to these things? So basically I'm looking for a reliability. So I'm looking for a reliability, reliability, reliability, so basically I'm looking for reliability. But here's the other thing too. There's certain signs that are more important to me than others to have, reliability. That's good, but there's a lot of things I can teach you to do as well. So it's an important one to have. It is a sign, but if you don't have some of the other signs, that might not work out. Sign four is actions. This is one of my ones, by the way, I suffer proud parent syndrome. I always talk about it, so that's why you see pictures of my kids in here. I went to the Naval Air Force, I was like, legacy. My daughter is a senior at George Mason University being a nurse. Hey, oh Mason. So yeah, we cover both ends of the spectrum of my family. So actions, I love actions. Basically past patterns of key behaviors. This is the, you know, don't do stupid and what's stupid? If you do the same thing again and again and again, but expect a different result, that's crazy. This is this one. If I can observe you in your activities, your actions, your behavior, two, three, four, ten, 20 times, I now know exactly what you're going to do next time. Here's what's really awesome about it. If all of a sudden, your patterns of behavior shift, well something changed in your life, now I want to know what that is, because in other words, a priority change in your life that causes you to have it shift in your behavior pattern. Again, no judging, just trying to figure out because you're just observing what normal is for the human being. This is one reason why people get so frustrated with people. Because they ask you to do something, and I like you to do it, and I like you and you're a good person, but you set that bar up here. I'm a pilot. I do angel flights. I volunteer as an angel flight pilot out of my own pocket and everything, and it's the same thing with flying. I don't know if you're a pilot, but you know, I like you, so I trust you to fly my plane. I throw your keys to the plane. That's a dumb thing to do. I'm not going to do that. But if I've seen you fly a plane, I know you have a couple hundred hours, a thousand hours, well I can reasonably say that you haven't crashed in a thousand hours. You're probably not going to crash on this flight either. Again, it's looking for those past patterns to keep behaviors. Language. This is where we're going to bring some of the elements of the code of trust in the first part into this. So, one thing that we're trying to do with human beings to keep their voices. Now what I'm looking for is, are you doing that with me? People sometimes say to me, Robin, so hey, if you're around someone that's actually done your training or rolls like this with you, what's that like? Poetic. So I have a very good friend, my best friend that I've come to know later in life, he's a little bit older than me, we do a lot of things together. He's a chief flight instructor and he's an engineer and so he's like me. He wasn't born doing this so he was a pilot and he had older made me a promise to do a few things related to aviation. He brought me out to lunch and he was, I mean in the first three minutes he's seeking my thoughts and opinions, talking in terms of my priorities, giving me a lot of choice and I said, Jim, you've got to stop right now. I shook his hand and said, you are rocking this conversation. Keep going, brother. So I'm always looking for our strategy. I'm doing my best to do it to you. Are you going to do your best to do it to me? Again, no expectation, but man if you throw, if I've seen people throwing that in there, absolutely love it. In sign six, this is the other one. So past patterns of key behavior, really key with me and this is the other one. Emotional stability. I don't do crazy brain. Crazy brain meaning I don't like emotional hijacking and I'm trying to do a thing. I'm trying to accomplish this and you're not a thing, you're a person but you're trying to get this thing done and you start beating your head against the wall and getting what happens when it's not working. I get a smash in that door harder and you get resentment, frustration, discontentment, anger, emotional hijacking. Are you thinking clearly? And you ever get to that point where you get emotional hijacking and crazy brain going, you now become oblivious to every other relationship that could bring you that answer. The second I get my own emotional instability going I immediately back up and say I give a little knock on the door that might be closed and say hello and it's closed, I immediately step back and I go to every single healthy relationship in my life and say guys, folks, I'm trying to get over there. Any ideas that I can get through relationships? So if I see someone that's constantly getting emotionally hijacked unable to regulate, I kind of take a step back because you're not ready to have a healthy relationship today and also I get very particular on it. Maybe just in this one lane you're just really angry about this stuff but over here if we talk about this you're completely happy good guy. Okay then we'll just deal right here. So I'm very, very in other words just because we're in different areas. Here's the other thing too. Is anyone in this room the same person you were five years ago? Ten years ago. How about a month ago? We start getting closer. Life's a journey not a destination. I never held yesterday against you for today because again that's resentment, that's anger, this is condemnant. I do not do emotional just crazy because it just brings no nothing, nothing of trust, nothing of relationships. So just always one of those emotional hijacking moments ask yourself is what I'm about to do or say going to help or hinder me moving forward. I can tell you it never worked for me. So I did the impossible. I finished a little early and I wanted to. So I'm going to talk about a few things coming up and also I want to leave times for any questions you all might have. So Chris mentioned sizing people up to one coming out next year the other two resources it's not all about me. He pumped the essay so I'll go look at it. I don't want to make money off of even at $299 a copy. That's the first one that came out all those years ago. The Code of Trust that's kind of what I talked about today half of it and sizing people up so it's coming out. But more importantly I've gotten asked a lot of times over these years to hey Robin do you do anything online can you come do this and so I worked literally for over a year to take my content and have this online course. I know if you follow me on Twitter and LinkedIn I just put it out. I'm actually going to put a cohort together if you want it. You can actually text people to that text code and I'll send you information on it just coming from me. I work with a company on this but it's purely me and I believe me I don't have time and or the technology ability to endate people with lots of garbage or you can email me at my email website robinatpeopleformula.com and that's also my website if you didn't get enough death by Robin for this lots of YouTube videos lots of resources follow me on LinkedIn and Twitter I do not do a lot of that either and guys that I generally put out science stuff on relationship building and if you ever ask me to take a side in politics or anything else I'll laugh at you because what happens when you take a side here's another guarantee half the world will line up against you and I don't like that it's not nice. So with that any questions doctor yes right so so here's the question yeah I'll repeat the question so here's the question if you don't have time and you have all these things you're trying to find out about the other individual what do you do about it the deeper stuff well here's another gold standard if I'm trying to control time I'm trying to manipulate you and I won't do it some people you just have to have patience and now if I am on a time constraint or I do need to find things out from you in a short time I'm gonna tell you I need it and I'm gonna tell you why I throw transparency into offset it because some people are just more guarded they're more insecure they've been burned and so the way I do it is very simple I will keep demonstrating all the things I talked about and at some point if you're ready to open up and have a relationship great if not then I just have to assess is the energy here or isn't it and if it's not again that's just today I need to shift over here I just don't force it but here's the other guarantee when you're doing these things these things are accelerators it's just a guarantee accelerator because there's another, so Jack Schaefer wrote the like switch another guy on my behavioral team with me he's very big on language and so relationships accelerators are very simple on time in other words how much time are we spending together closeness in other words are we doing it via Twitter we doing it email we doing texting and we're meeting live and then intensity intensity is the content of the conversation dialogue if you you can start increasing those three elements and they are relationship accelerators if the other person is open to it and again you got to keep building there seeking their thoughts and opinions talking in terms of their priorities and what not go ahead NLP I ask what I think about NLP there are beautiful elements of NLP because it's using language science on it has been bunked as not solid if you're looking at scientifically but when it comes to practicality here's what I will never say anything is wrong I'm going to get into a lot of things it's framed for some of the things I do I have people come up to me this sounds like you're talking about this okay yes I am there's elements of NLP that are very strong what's it doing it's using words to try to make it about the other person yeah thank you you interact with another human being that has similar things and techniques right so the question is basically have I ever basically in my world in counterintelligence going against someone another operative with these kind of things and skills believe it or not very rarely there's actually in only one instance that I go to a meeting offering my resources because I was told by one of my sources this guy was looking for a better opportunity for him and his family and I was the guy to provide it for and he's trying to offer me an opportunity for me and my family and I was like you recognize it right away and I said Sergey I got to tell you what this is a great conversation but obviously I came here to offer you an opportunity and you came here to offer me an opportunity how about we do this let's keep sharing this beer you go home and think about the opportunity I have for you in three months if you want to get back in touch great if not have a great career never saw him again and I'll tell you what though it's actually extremely rare to have a lot of counter people doing this very often because there's elements of this that require a lot of self-awareness and having a type A aggressive personality but with the self-awareness to understand I know exactly where I suck you know I'm the most transparent human being that I try to be because I told you at the very beginning narcissistic mangalomanic ass he's buried in here he is still in here I've cascaded new behaviors on top of that because like an emotional intelligence EQ you can't change your genetics, your biology experience you have between ages 9 and 19 that forms your generational outlook on the world you can't change that but you can add behaviors to it to soften some things that might be to the extreme and that's what I've spent my life doing is adding behaviors to soften the other ones because all these behavior traits everyone has there's great strengths to them all when they're used in an appropriate situation you know but not 24 or 7 sometimes understanding the behavior traits that incorporate into yourself to mitigate those things so it makes you a lot more you know what it actually is in life it's called maturity your ability to maneuver around every situation, every human being again not because I'm trying to gain on you but I'm trying to make it about you so we can have a healthy relationship because the whole point always in every interaction is I have resources to make you feel good you have resources that make me feel good right so the question was there's moments in a conversation you might sense when things are going wrong can I rephrase it and see if I'm accurate are there times when people have tried to manipulate me actually I have never been attempted to it never gets to the point of trying to manipulate me because here's why so what I pick up on since I'm always going for transparency and offering transparency if someone is posing things to me and I'm asking questions for transparency and they're not giving transparency so what I do is I'll be back there all I do is back up and say alright we're not being transparent here so we're not going to have a relationship right here and what I'm looking for a lot of times is incongruence between the words being said and the emotion human beings we pick up on this everyone at work knows when someone is having a bad day do you not you know Chris talks about nonverbal slot I was trained by Joe Navarro he was a good friend of mine I was a nonverbal guy before I shifted this way because basically what we're picking up on when cops pull someone off on the side of the road they immediately know their spider senses start going off before they even get out of the car because something deviates from a baseline what normal looks like and so what I'm looking for is if all of a sudden I'm getting incongruence and I'm getting that creepy car salesman thing back here because there's incongruence and I'm going to see what's causing the incongruence because normally what's doing that you're getting that creepy car salesman from someone because they're saying the right things but there's not an emotion that's being congruent with saying hey I really wanted to just provide a comfortable safe environment and car and vehicle for you and your family but in here he's saying I want your money and I gotta get as much of it as I can that's the incongruence so I pick up on those and everyone does I just don't blow by it I engage it and if someone doesn't want to have the transparency to help assuade my senior incongruence I just okay not today not now it's okay without judging either because everyone's got the reasons for doing what they do yeah so the question is how do you suspend your judging of others so I'll give you a great example so here's another guarantee I've worked a lot of espionage investigations and when there's actually espionage being committed where someone's actually knowingly working on behalf of another foreign government purposely posing sharing information with people that shouldn't have it and it's classified nature I guarantee you this it's not the only thing going sideways in their lives as a matter of fact I'd say 80 to 90 percent of the time that's why I love the ILF these cases but 90 percent of the time these people are also pedophiles and child abusers in some way and so here's a here's a story about understanding because you gotta understand what the goal is so I was posed with this one case a number of years ago this guy was picked up because he had about 64 images of children on his computer when the images computer they found out that this guy had all these classified documents from all these three letter agencies he shouldn't have on there he also had a journal about how he sexually assaulted 64 kids my office comes to me my team comes to me says we need a strategy how do we get no names how do we inspire this guy to share the name so we can go save kids here's a guarantee if you sit across that table and judge that guy is he going to share the names guaranteed not what's the goal so luckily we got when someone this is how I don't allow people to bother me I start to understand why if someone is off putting to me or off sending to me I dive deep to understand what made you like you are and this guy in this guy's case he was sexually assaulted by his Cub Scout master when he was nine years old and raped by the Cub Scouts from the age of nine to nineteen he wrote a poem about this it was tragic it doesn't condone it it makes you understand it when you understand it you're able to have a dialogue and validate I understand your steps in your life and you're not judging it I know you're not getting it I'll tell you it's not easy so the thing is keep folks on the ultimate goal not everyone can do that and it's okay if you can't if you can't sit across this table and interview this guy and not judge him then you can't be the one doing the interview because what's the goal we got to save 64 kids we'll get someone else it's not a big deal so that's how it's not like saying everyone should be able to do this find someone you can I'm sorry for the dark story on that one I use it because it's an example of the difference between agreeing with someone and validating someone big difference so I said I recruited my wife does these skills make me a manipulative instance here what is it but what is one of the anchors in the entire process I have checks and balances in this thing open house communication transparency no I have full transparency there's no fake so that's the other thing too some people say so Robin if people know you do this aren't they guard just up you want me to stop I'll do that too and so what happens with me like on a first contact because I do all these things on first contact or last contact I don't change engagements what happens is over a period of time when they see I have no expectation of reciprocity that makes it non-manipulation I have full transparency I'm not doing anything there's nothing I ever do for gain now we all have heard from Chris and I have reciprocal altruism I mean that human condition to want to repay a kindness and value someone it's huge but if you start expecting it now you're doing it for you I have zero expectations and people say well how do you do that muscle memory you gotta do it well you don't have to I'm just saying if you don't it's gonna be manipulative yeah so how do you de-escalate a conversation or engagement that goes south in any situation yes so there's lots of different ways depending on what caused the escalation in other words if I pick up on a non-verbal that I induce stress in some way where I see an eyebrow compression lip compression, pull back, blading, blocking any of these things that are coming in the first thing I'll say to them I'll recognize alright I did something to induce the stress and I'll immediately say let me understand please what did I do off what did I do wrong because again who did I just make it about just made it about them I validated the emotion and I sought their thoughts and opinions about what I can do and took ownership of my problem so I always make it my issue, my problem, I caused it on you and so again what I just I just made the entire conversation about them de-escalation in other situations where people are maybe emotionally hijacked and reacting to the world around them kind of bouncing off the walls and asking simple questions say understand you know you told me last week that your priorities and goals are this help me understand is what you're doing here, here and here is that helping or hindering you trying to get there again people don't like being told what to do they like to find their own path so if you understand what path they're trying to walk and you maintain objectivity this is also incredibly empathetic if you haven't noticed lots of empathy here because I understand a human being but you maintain objectivity and they're hindering going from there to there to there and they start asking themselves huh maybe it's not I said well what other ideas you have to do that have you talked to so and so I saw their resume they did X, Y and Z they might have a good idea for you and what you start doing is aligning relationships you know might be a resource for them instead of just reacting negatively to the world around them, does that help I have 33 seconds why is the Russian so hard to work with why is anyone so hard to work with I don't know oh this is a great question what a success rate with turning people over how often do you think we actually recruit foreign intelligence officers a lot or a little little you're right it's like hitting mega millions that rare that beneficial and but so my job I got it my job every day was to buy that Lotto ticket and the guy that I worked with that had the greatest humility and if you read my book Dakota Trust he's Jesse Thorne in the book John I never knew the success and awesomeness of John Sapinara until I went to his house and I opened up the shoe box in the corner and I saw three directors awards in there one from the CIA and two from the FBI he hit Lotto 14 times in 21 years that's who I learned from and he had no idea what he was doing he was just doing it I made a manual how to be the guy like John so success rate depends on who you are and also opportunity I am done guys thanks a lot