 Hi, gosh. Hello, Lord. How are you? How are you doing? Hello. Hello. Let's give it another minute here. I've dropped a link to the meeting notes. Zoom chat. All right. Let's get started. So let's start it like this. So this is the CNF working group we meet weekly. I know folks here already know this. Important thing. This call is being recorded. And we upload the videos to YouTube. So if you have an issue with the recording or don't want to share something, then please take that in mind. And if you don't want to share something, then please take that in mind. For some reason, the last video got pulled by YouTube. From the last session, which is kind of frustrating. It was a good session. Maybe it was the one before, but anyways, we can get started. So please add your. Name and any agenda items to the. Shared notes. I don't have that screen if I can, I think I did. So there's a. Cloud native. Focused. Virtual conference to talk on TVs, putting on in September. It's probably an interesting one for us. Have some folks attending and. Maybe pulling some information back from there. I think it would be good if we can get. Directly engage the working group. Maybe for some future ones, if we can see it. Submit CFPs. Scheduled announcement. Let's see one summit regional day. This is. I guess like a co-located event for. One summit is going to be at the open source summit Europe. I'm not sure what the virtual is, but I imagine that at least. The one summit usually has some way to. Be engaged with that. This nephew. Developer summit. Victor, do you have any input on that one? Yeah, basically. Lucy send us. Form to go for. Two particular weeks. One of the weeks has come. It's making conflict with. The one summit. So I guess. So I don't, I'm not sure she's going to change. The options, but. If I remember correctly, it's like. September. So I don't know if it is September 11 or something like that. I was just looking for the email where. She was making on the phone for. But yeah. This is. Like the first week. And maybe the second week of September. So I don't. I'm not sure she's going to change. The options. But. If I remember correctly, it's like. September. So I don't know if it is September 11 or something like that. I was just looking for the email where. She was making on the phone for. September. But we are still deciding. Which date. The only thing that is not meant to change probably is going to be the location. In the. Google offices. Sony veil. But yeah, we, we haven't decided by. It's actually the date on that. All right. Well. We've, we were talking about before doing a. I, and I guess we submitted a CFP actually for. Highlighting best practices from FIO. And I know that we're wanting to. Look at things that we could pull into the working group. Around deployment. Get ops patterns. Configuration. Best practices. That are. In KPT and stuff. So it might be. If you can find out some more info about it, I'd like to consider being more directly involved in that one. Okay. KCD, Texas. Probably. Because I'm, I'm located in. Austin, Texas and may look into doing this one. It's a. Probably about a four hour drive, but. Let folks know if we're going to do like a CFP or something. It'd be related to what we're doing. Okay. So. About cube con Chicago. Since we have the cloud native telco day. Colidicated events now officially happening. And we haven't. Been promoting or trying to organize the. Telco. Community event. After we're partly because we're playing a little catch up on the cloud of telco day. We thought it wasn't happening. And then it got enough going that they decided to make it happen. So. We needed to focus on getting. That together. We needed to focus on getting the cloud native telco day. We needed to focus on getting the cloud native telco day. CFPs and everything else. What. What do you think as far as. Trying to have anything else. For this event. I feel like there was a lot more happening and people wanting to do more in the EU. So that's partly why. We push for the community event. There was an overflow. People couldn't sign up for cube con. But what we need to is there a big desire. To have a cloud native. Telco community. In the afternoon like we had before. From my perspective was a really good success. I mean. But yeah, that's happening in Europe and Europe. So I don't know that it's going to be the same. But maybe we can do a certain a survey. To our channel. And. Try to collect some. Some feedback from there. Maybe. Okay. Ask a question Taylor like I didn't, I didn't attend EU. So I mean, generally what would you see these community? I mean, I get it. I'm just wondering like kind of. How it might be used. Is it like kind of, okay, we're all we're actually here physically together. Let's do some of the work that we typically do. Or would you see it just being additional topics that would be outside of like the cloud native telco day. I mean, I realize that the cloud native telco day is a little, it's kind of, you know, it's a set of talks. Where the community is maybe more discussions. Is that kind of the thinking. More towards, have you done any and conferences? No. So a little bit. Less structured. So the cloud native telco day is just structured presentations. Set times everybody needs to get done within those times and move off the stage. For the community, you know, we could set up whatever, but we did have a. Amount of time set for what was supposed to be lightning talks like five minute type talks. So you're just going through and then we had. A good amount of the time that was just open discussion, which could dig into one topic. One of them was. A networking related topic that came out of. Power DNS talking about. The issues with the current networking and Kubernetes. And so that kind of dug into some things. So it would be. Something like that, probably. I think the other good thing that we have in the gathering event was like the opportunity to hear from. Project leads about projects like a silver and nephew. And they did a quick overview and they were. Like, I don't know what its name of those sessions like ask me anything about. And this particular care about. Silver and nephew nephew. So. It was nothing prepared for them. So people were just asking general questions, requirements. More, more, more close discussion about those things. I think that's, that was a good class. My, for my point of view. Yeah, I think there's, I mean, I guess, without doing too much thinking, I'm sure there's a number of. You know, potential interesting discussions that could be part of that. Community gathering. So. And to your point, I mean, there's a lot of different than I, I almost in my head think. You know, all these different initiatives and sort of. I don't want to call it aligning them, but you know, just kind of understanding what everyone's doing and what, what, you know. Because there's no shortage of different efforts. And just kind of understanding how they relate to each other. I think that's a, that can be very useful because to your point, I mean, I can, I can almost take Silva as an example where if you, if you look at Silva and pointing, it's pointing back to things like an etiquette and elephant. It's pointing back to CNF test suite is pointing to nephew, even though there may not be, you know, at the moment, maybe not anything concrete because we've obviously, you know, just. You know, release one is just kind of being finished up, but I think there's a lot of intentions to leverage things from there. So, you know, I think, you know, I think it would be good to, you know, I think it would be good to, you know, I think it would be good to use some kind of relationship between them. It would be good to sort of sound out some of that. And how, you know, in other words, basically how do you help each other. In your different. Objectives, you know, how do you, how do you help align that. And the thing Oliver is, you're not the only, the one who are suffering with all these, the same questions, right? Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. So, you know, I'm not going to sidetrack the conversation, but as an example, I mean, if you read, you know, Selva and they talk about a CNF certification, then you kind of go, oh, there's another place to go certify. Whereas, but they're pointing to the CNF certification, sort of CNF test suite as an example. So then you go, well, you know, how can, you know, does a discussion in the community maybe help? How do we again, you know, leverage some of the things that we do have. So you're not, you know, avoiding to repeat. Or redo things. I think that could be it. And I'm not saying that's the only topic, but it could be certainly useful to try to see how all of these things are fitting and how we can help each other, right? Because I mean, at some point, nephew will have a conformance program. And, you know, in my head, I think, well, they're, they're, they're focusing slight on different things. And, you know, what's a good CNF, but they probably intend to say, you know, we're trying to orchestrate, deploy and orchestrate and manage the, you know, CNFs as well as the infrastructure. How do, how do we leverage stuff that's being done already within the open source community? Right. Like for example, pointing to the CNF certification saying, you know, that's a prerequisite, you know, to any conformance program within nephew might, you know, for CNFs could be leveraging what the CNCF is offering today. I mean, these are the kind of things that would be interesting to have a conversation around, I guess. Yeah. I guess the answer is yes, Taylor. It could be interesting. I don't know how many other people, you know, my matrix is intending to participate working. I'm actually meeting this week with Sam from engineering to start talking to basically formulate our submission, but you know, we may have some additional attendees as well. So, I mean, we probably will be a vendor that's part of those conversations or that community meeting if there is one. All right. So, we, you know, I'm asking now so that we can start really thinking about it. We didn't have much response to the form that we put out about the Togo gathering. We were sending it out to quite a few places for a few weeks, trying to get response and interest for that, but there was very little response. And then we just stopped. I think in fact, the form might be taken down now because of we switched to focus on cloud native Togo day, want to make sure that we get a lot of people there. And ideally we get sponsors for cloud native Togo day. And the other part would be if we're focused on a cloud native Togo day and make sure it's successful, which is, I think, if it's successful, then we get more, we get more focused from Kubecon and everything else. So I think that could even if we're going to have a Togo gathering, it's, we want to make sure it's successful. The other part though is doing the Togo gathering is, means it's all on us by us. I mean, not Kubecon. So, you know, Victor helped a little bit and Tom with when we were talking about this is a working group. So what is a format we want? But the idea for the gathering is completely up to us. We don't have the Linux foundation event team or anything else. So we're going to have to do the same thing. Last time Volk sponsored it, we found the location, doing research, figuring out like where can we be, what's available, what's large enough, what's within a reasonable walking distance. So we'd need to do the same thing. If it's something where people are going to have to drive in Chicago. I think it would be more likely to be a, if we were going to go, we were able to find something where we had a large group. In fact, it was overflow, Oliver at the gathering in EU. More than what we allocated for. Luckily the place was fine with helping with that. But we'd need to do the same thing. So I'd want to see like, do we have a very strong interest if we're going to put the effort out? If we want to help with that effort, whether it's, you know, helping some with the cost, helping some with finding places, whatever we want to do to make that happen. Yeah, I'm curious, because I mean, if I, I guess two questions, one is where do we, so for example, it sounds like EU was very successful. Were you able to sort of estimate that you were going to have that kind of, it sounds like the answer is no, but my question is just for, for helping me. Did we, were we able to estimate that there was going to be a high turnout? In other words, I guess right now you're saying that what we've, and I'm trying to remember which mail this was or where, where you were announcing, but I probably did not respond to the, you know, the community. You know, we had, we had events, you know, survey, I'm guilty, but you know, I guess I'm trying to understand where do we generate the interest from, right? Because this group is fairly small, you know, and it sounds like there's a fair amount of work, but where would we generate that interest for the community gathering? I mean, CNF working group, what are the other places where we could generate interest? I mean, there's tons. We had, so we had a, I guess going back to answer the first part, we had enough response on the forms, the Google form that we put out to indicate that we, we would have a large enough group to make it an interesting gathering, you know, if it's going to be Victor and you, if it's going to be Oliver, then I'll just say, let's just go mate for lunch. Yeah. Yeah, well, I, yeah, exactly. I get that. That's, I guess what I'm, and I'm, I'm the form that you sent out. And again, just remind me, where did we, where did we basically put this out? I mean, it's essentially through Slack primarily. Without me going back and looking and listening, I might be able to just say, I think it was on Twitter, it was on LinkedIn, it was on Slack and it was on emails. Yeah. So we can missed pretty much all the good places to go. Yeah. You know, the other part would be, you know, Oliver, if you posted on your LinkedIn and your Twitter. Yeah. And we get other people to do this. Victor is, you know, a lot of retweets and I know we've seen a retweets for other folks. You probably seen it even for matrix posting stuff. So that sort of thing would get it, but you know, we need to market it wherever you think, if you think here's a place to market it all over, then, then we do it. Yeah. And I, and I'm mainly trying to, you know, just for my, get my head around, you know, like, I mean, it's summertime right now, you know, or people thinking currently right now. They're not thinking about, you know, cube, I mean, they should be right, but I mean, generally speaking, I guess people start thinking seriously about when they're all coming back from vacation. So it sounds like we went out with this. You know, in good time, I'm just wondering if we didn't get response, not if the reason why people didn't respond was not because I'm not interested, but it's just, you know, it's so far away and then they've kind of just forgotten about it. You know what I mean? Maybe I don't know. I just thought that I have, and I guess, you know, everyone can say what their experience is. I've seen more. Response from the EU. Telco related orgs. Benders everybody. Then I have from. Those in America's. Just in general, I mean, like, I, you know, you look at telecom TV, there's a lot of it, but that's not like real visible. I'm saying to conversations like what we're having, but whenever we did a you like the silver stuff that was mentioned and then having these good silver conversations, it was a ton of people from different groups like orange and other places just did that, you know, and then we had a bunch of other groups that came in. And you know, I don't, I don't know what that's about, but that's just what I've, I've seen. And I don't know if we're posting to the wrong places. Maybe, you know, people are there. I'd like to get all the, there's a lot of America's based telco companies that are involved with elephant. And we are trying to increase by the way all over, like direct, some direct collaboration on the elephant. We've been having more conversations, but if there's a place where they are, you know, and we can get it there in front of these other groups, then maybe they're just not seeing it. Yeah. I mean, my guess is, yeah, I think you, you know, I think we've hit a lot of the places that I would, you know, at least for me, I mean, I don't, I don't have any new, any idea. Oh, how did you not post here? You know what I mean? It's not that it wasn't any critique either. I just, I'm just trying to get my head around whether or not, you know, it's, is it because it was too early or, you know, because most people don't, you know, like, like to be given plenty of time, right? But, but it may have just, it may be that people, it was too far out. I don't know. And then the other thing is to, I think what you just mentioned, you know, if we, if we were to, could we potentially do it again? And if we did, then I think maybe coordinating where we actually do help, you know, specific, you know, companies can help retweet, re, you know, reshare. Certainly, I know matrix would be happy to do that normally. I just got to get out in front of it and make sure that people know it's coming and then they can work on it. But yeah, all right. So, I mean, and that's going to, that's basically going to answer the question whether or not we, there's enough interest, right? Because otherwise it's, you know, we're not going to grab the interest strictly from people. This call that's not going to be enough to, to motivate a community gathering, then it's just a tailor, the scene of Victor or whatever. Let's meet up for coffee afterwards and go that route. Yeah. Just two things. So, and number one, we don't actually know if cloud native telco day is morning or afternoon yet. So that could be, you know, some difficulty in trying to organize this. It worked out really well with the co-working space that we found to do afternoon because then you know they're definitely going to be there time wise, but how do you do a morning one? And is that going to be convenient for people to go off of the conference area and then come back and sign in or whatever. So we got to figure that out. The second thing is just cost on this. So there's, there's a cost for the gathering and then there's the time to help with things. If, if, you know, we can get some commitment from some folks to help with whatever marketing it, trying to find a location, just whatever all the logistics are and then cost. So cost in EU was, I think it was, I don't remember the exact, but it, all of this would be under a grand for the total. If we're talking like space and we, we got a drink tickets or whatever for people to use, you know, you could use some coffee or whatever they have wine, whatever they had. So this would be kind of like your, your after evening type event as well. So I guess we were trying to make it where it made it a little bit more informal and loosen things up in the conversations. I think that format worked well like Victor was saying as well. So anyways, that's what we'd be looking at. We don't know what it's going to be in Chicago. But I don't think we're talking about this is going to be five or 10,000. This is going to be, in my opinion, for most orgs and helping on that would be a low cost type thing. So we're going to be putting it out there to keep in mind. And if someone says, yeah, we can help or we'll foot the whole build. And that's, it's a little bit different from. You know, this, we can't say this is the same thing as sponsoring the. Cloud. If telco day, which is going to get, you know, you're going to have sponsors that are going to be shown on the website. And they're going to be showing you like. Different websites and related to cube con. And so when things come up on that. And of course that's one of those costs one. But you get a lot of other benefits there, which are still one, of course. Anyways. We'll maybe look in and. Take a little bit of look and see. What we think that gathering could be. I think we should move on though. Conversations and then come back to this. And y'all. Just maybe Oliver go. Think about it internally. And if. Talk to some folks, if we can. Get some interest or. Then we'll move forward on it. Same for you, Victor. If. If you can think of some ways to either market or. Gather some interest or we need to post. Sure. Sure. What? Okay. So do we need to close this? What is. 47. Oh, I just, just put it because someone was making a comment. Probably he was trying to get. Maybe he was trying to work on. One of the. In this particular issue. Oh, I guess. He was mentioning that everything has been moved. So. Maybe. So user stories, use case. And CBB. Let's go. Take a look at that. That looks fine to me. I can close it. Yeah. Yeah. Can you close it for me? I'm on a new phone. I don't want to mess with that right now. I think you should be able to check mark all of these two. Today's, but. I can't do it to a lot of logged in. You should be able to as an editor. An admin on the repo. Okay. Yep. Okay. Now it's closed. And the next, the next thing. Well, last, last week I was reading about. One article about comparing. Unicernals. With containers. And one of the. Major things have captured my attention was. The best lead it. Unicernals. One of the fantasies that you can. Do. Or just focus to one single process. So. That particular thing captured my attention and that's why. For. To the group, like, where we have the. For category per. Container. I'm not sure if. You can also consider like. Unicernals. In this particular discussion. I think. Rich made a good point about like, well, maybe it's a good point, but. But if we know, like. In someone is using Unicernals to develop CNF. Like. Fortunately, I found these. Other article, like. Or like a paper. And in this particular paper was exploring that. But just case they were using. Unicernals develop a CNF. Just. Just presenting the results like. Like. The performance results like. The benefit. The different. The different frameworks that they use for. For achieving that. CNF. And even they were calling like. Making the distinction between. Unicernals. In Bermuda. Unicernals. On a VM. I think. I think it was. Good paper to read it. So. Probably. Probably the question is still. Still going like a. So should I include all this information. In the issue that we have open. Expansion or extending. Not only consider containers for. For CNF also. Like. Use case for Unicernals. And. I might also make a distinction between Unicernals. CNF. Or. Or just like. Or just consider CNF. In general. In. Unicernals. It's, it seems like it's a. Maybe a use case. Or a context where you're doing it. And then we talk about how that's affected. If you're doing it, I don't, I mean, I don't. Do you have a specific example where you're using a. Unicernal and then how that would be used. Oh, that example I found in this particular article in the last link. If you. Click on that one. And maybe that way you can share the article and go down to the section that you think is important. I opened it on a different screen, but I'm not sure what you're referring to. Yeah. That PDF like. It is the article that I found like. In the last link where. Go ahead and share your screen and then scroll down to the section you're talking about. Okay. Just let me. Well, all these things are like, all this introduction is just making. It's just providing context like. Trying to understand the performance and they were using. To the specific cases like. PCP. And if you see, and saying like a. If he sees requires more performance and that's why they tried to base. This article in. In the. In the core network use case. So in the corner. Cornelware use case they were like. Talking about especially performance. And obviously isolation. And the problems like what. Containers can have in this or like all this evolution. So, and eventually they introduce. Unicornals. In the picture and they were saying well. Unicornals can be benefit like. To use. In the, especially in. In the core network. Because it has a good performance. It has good isolation. And. And then. In this particular section of the article. Like they were discussing about performance. Performance and how they achieve that. So. I mentioned before they were saying like. For unicorns, they split. Into particular scenarios where they have. Unicornal rain on top of a PM. Or on top of a. And they were. Using a different. Acronym for, for, for those. To make a. More terminal terminology on this. And obviously. They were. Doing a small case. Or on. A benchmark where they were just getting these, these graphs. And interesting thing. They were at least mentioning. Few of the technologies that they were. Using. Think. One of them is this one include. And. Giving a little. I didn't think too much about that, but at least they, they. They, they, they put some conclusions on that. Like saying, well, it's an algae. We use this and we perform. It's a small scenario. So. I think. For. A quick overview and. Remote possibility. That will give a little bit. A little bit of an introduction, but it's not. Very. Very technical or very. Deep on the. Now this is. But I start exploring like the policy to use. Unicernals in the telco space. And obviously. Exposing why, why they wanted to do. Why, why they consider like. The. When I try to investigate, especially to include OS. It's not that. Very easy to replace like that, because I guess. Plus requires. That you. Application is written in C. Or C++. I don't remember exactly. And there's a lot of attempts to provide. Unicernals. So, so even when they. Explore that, I still feel like a. It's a little. Hard to go. In terms of implementation or. Real. Real. Real use cases. So that's pretty much. So it seems like. There may be. And I did. I'm not seeing it in here. Just best practices on. When you're building. UNS. That. That could be. I mean. The idea of a UNF. For VMs. Has. Been around for a pretty long while. I was seeing it. Zen and stuff. And. It seems like there would be best practices. That maybe we could look at. And then. I want to adopt. Adjust maybe as another word. To look at them for maybe inspiration of what. Would be in. A Santa. It doesn't seem like they're all directly translatable. Some of the stuff in the article is. Maybe not. Native. But. How to. How you would run. UNS in general. Yeah, probably that's that's my point. Like, I mean. I don't know if we haven't considered like UNF. On the. On the scope of the group. So the first question is, should we need to include it as part of the best practice. The spaces, whatever. And if the answer is yes, like which one we have to. Consider like which part of the discussions or like which. These cases maybe, or. That's practices. Because probably this is what just maybe just like a study. Nothing. Maybe just an academic paper. Nothing. Really good real war. Or at least like. Mentioning the idea or like. Pointing to someone. You know, I think. Going to explore more in that particular path would be. It would be a good thing, I think. I would like. The. Use cases and user stories are fine. Ideally we could have a. A UNF example. To. Be able to explore. Versus. Just the general idea of a UNF. But if we could say, here's a UNF. That would be used. Or is being used. For a specific. Toca use case. The ones that come to mind or what would come to mind for me. And you know, I don't know if it's out there, but would be something for like a. A ran. But I don't know about other. You know, what other. What would be a CNF that's using a unicolonial. The private 5G stuff seems like a place where you would maybe use it. But I, I don't know of an actual example. Here's a real thing that's using it. Yep. Which maybe has the unique. Requirements for doing that. Like probably. A security requirements or performance requirements. It's just. Unique for that particular use case. Right. I just brought a topic. I don't know. I found interesting. I don't know if you, you also consider like, you can also provide your feedback or try to investigate about the topic and. Maybe. We can expand it. Sounds good. Let's see on the. The best practice that we were drafting. One process for category. I think that Oliver, you may have added some comments. Yeah, they're, they're minor comments, but. Yeah, they're minor comments. They should be fairly. Are those directly on the Google doc? Yeah. I don't think that comment is controversial because I just, I'm thinking back to the issue. This is the draft, obviously, but. You know, the draft is a CNFs container should have one process category. You know, in parentheses type. So maybe here in the summary that we should be just because it says only one process or set of parent child processes. I'm just thinking if we can make it even more clear by saying, you know, it's one process type or category, you know, I don't know. I'm just, it just, when I read it, I just go, oh, so I'm going to comment on this later. Who may not have read the issue. Oh yeah. And then I had only one other comment, I think, which was. You can close that comment if you want to do that, that makes sense to me. And then the other one is was just, there's some sentence. Okay. So long as this is a template that we did we take a previous best practice and there's some stuff left in here from the old one. That we're removing as we're going. This one. Yeah. So there's it in the, you know, the heading there is motivation. So the best practice benefits, you know, I think that first paragraph or first sentence. You know, it makes sense, but the next two are more like talking about how it's testing and I didn't really understand if that really needs to be part of the motivation. I know this is a testing. I forget what the section down below is not called purely testing. It's called testing something else. I have to go look at it, but I'm just thinking this next two sentences probably don't belong here. At least I don't understand why they would be motivation. So probably better would just be, I don't know how to. What color this should be, but I'm going to make it blue. I don't know what color this should be. I don't know what color this should be. That's, that's actually too hideous even for my own eyes. How about that one? So this should all be. And I think I just put it here replace the Lauren Mipson filler content. So this is all filler content. Okay. All. Content. Content. Another. A. Different. So all of this is from a previous best practice. So none of it is. For this one. So the reason why this would be, and I. That's the first part. This is all just. Example content. All of it should be replaced with something that's. Directly relevant to this practice. And then the other part was, why is this section here? So for. The other best practice, it was a motivation. So the reason why this is a motivation is. On an SC Linux based system. So red hat open shift. You're expected to drop root privileges. So any SC Linux based environment. Whatever that would be. Is going to expect the containers to drop root privileges. So if you're designed to not use root privileges. Then you're going to be more ready to run on the system. So that's a motivation. Yeah. That's all. Okay. Yeah. Yeah. But anyways, it's all for. Motivation. Do I need to say anything? Are you good? We're good. We're going to resolve it. But we do need to replace it. And. We got six minutes. Anyone have a. Thoughts on writing the motivation. I know there's content elsewhere or anything else. We want to add content and get this closed out really is what we want to do. And move on. I will try to take a look and. My feedback. All right. If there's a practice that's like. Align with what you're doing. If you're trying to get people to adopt. Daily, your main work or whatever, then. Here's something that we are trying to get people to adopt. Because we, we've found it to be a good thing. Then. Please put that forward. It's, I think it's easier to get something. Finished. If, if it's already something that. You care about on your daily, on your daily basis. This one was related to. Microservice. Best practice adoption. Like how do we get that forward? And that's why this was getting. Put forward. I do want to complete it. I think we have enough content. That, you know, we just need to put the effort in. But for other best practices. And Oliver this, you know, you. I, I, I don't know. I don't know. I don't know. I don't know what would be of interest to contribute. And I. I don't want to just point you all at a specific. Here's, we got a bunch of issues. But if there's something specific where you all are. Here's an area where we really care about. And what's. You know, it could be. Highlighting something that you all find relevant. Then that would be. You know, I don't know what that's on. Maybe there's some existing, but if we don't have one, then it could just be an idea. Put forward. I know Victor, we've been talking about the. Deployment practices and stuff. So maybe. That should be the next one that we start working on a draft. If we can go find. A KPT or get ops pattern or something that we. Start writing about. All right. Does anyone have anything else? I don't know. Have a good day, everyone. And we'll see you next week. All right. See you next week. Thank you. Thank you. Bye.