 Hello and welcome to NewsClick. Today we are joined by Viju Krishnamdhi, All India Kisan Sabha and we are going to be talking about an issue which has had farmers, organizations, trade unions, agriculture workers organizations protesting for many days now. These are the three ordinances issued by the central government recently. One is of course an amendment to the Essential Commodities Act. The other is the farmers produce trade and commerce ordinance and the third is the farmers agreement on price assurance and farm services ordinance. Now these farmers organizations have said that these ordinances would really affect the farmers and Viju is going to talk about how. There have been many protests on the 10th of June we saw copies of the ordinances being burnt on July 23rd in August 9th. There are going to be more protests. Viju, thank you so much for joining us. So could you first tell us what exactly these ordinances, what would be the implications of these ordinances for farmers? Actually the three ordinances which have been brought will in effect lead to freedom for the agribusinesses to exploit the farmers and push the farmers into a situation of slavery. That is what will happen. However the minister very audaciously claimed that while India gained freedom in 1947 the farmers have gained freedom only with these three ordinances. What is going to happen here is more of the same set of policies which have led to the distress of the farmers. In 1991 when the neoliberal economic policies were initiated it was claimed that it will get farmers the world market prices. Now the same set of policies much more aggressively are being pursued and being shown or it is being claimed that this will ensure better prices for farmers and farmers will actually be empowered by this. Actually what is going to happen is the big agribusinesses so-called aggregators, sponsors and processors and so on they are going to dictate the prices. There is not going to be any control over them. The earlier system had a price support mechanism and also a mechanism of price support mechanism for the farmers and a price control for the consumers. These are being totally dismantled by these ordinances. So what is happening one is the APMC Act dilution of that earlier itself there have been efforts in that direction. Now they are very clearly just ensuring that that is done away with and the state governments will have no control over the agricultural produce and its marketing and so on. So any kind of protection that the farmers would have had as far as price support is concerned that is not going to be any longer there. By the Essential Commodity Act amendment earlier this was actually brought in to ensure that there is no hoarding and so on so the consumers would also get the agricultural produce whether it is cereals, pulses, oil seeds and so on at affordable prices. Now those controls have been removed and even foreign players as well as big agribusinesses it promotes hoarding in a way and also there is no control, there is no limits on how much they can keep. Even in times of emergency it says that these exporting companies and so on whatever their limits that much will they still can retain. So in effect even in times of an emergency in times of a war or a natural calamity these agribusinesses the amount that they can hoard or they can procure from farmers there is no difference in that. So they are getting total freedom in this regard also. Along with these three things there is also the electricity act amendment which is being brought that will lead to further increase in electricity costs and irrigation costs for the farmers that is another danger which is there. So in these three ordinances we find very clearly the earlier effort to promote whether it is contract farming or total liberalized markets. They are talking about one country, one market and so on, one nation, one market and such things but in no way it ensures the farmers will get remunerative prices. The problem here is not the question of markets as far as farmers are concerned more than the issue of market it is that the fact is that they are not getting the prices. While MSP is announced even that there is no procurement happening now and with these changes which are happening where they are trying to paint a rosy picture that these big agribusinesses will pay higher prices to the farmers that kind of a campaign is being done that is not going to actually translate on the field. The small farmer would not have the bargaining power with these big companies and once they establish their monopolies they totally dictate the terms and these three ordinances in effect will also lead to farmers it also talks about contract farming it talks about some sponsors. You see even in terms of legal if there is some dispute they are talking about conciliation being the first step or you can go to the district sdms so the jurisdiction of courts also the lower level courts that is totally being removed and how can the farmers engage in these kinds of dispute settlement mechanism with these big companies very clearly it is an unequal system they are strengthening that and they are promoting the corporate interest that is what is going to happen. Could you also talk a bit about the last aspect you are mentioning in terms of contract farming so what is the situation currently regarding that and how is that likely to change with this audience? See there are a few if you look at what the CEO of NetEIO mentioned that this is an opportunity which is never going to come again so grab it with both your hands and bring about changes in labor loss in land loss and also market so-called market reforms these kind of suggestions that and they are resorting to the ordinance route in all these cases the ordinance route they are also asking the states to make amendments to the land reform laws of those states market reform market apmc act and so on so in the companies as far as they can take by the land of the farmers directly they can lease in land for a long period from from the farmers and they determine what will be cultivated in terms of contract farming also contract farming we have had experiences before you have the a lot of hype was there around the kupam model in Andhra place where Chandrapapu Naidu and others promoted gerkin cultivation in Chittur districts kupam region in in the initial period this is really American company was engaged and the farmers did benefit in terms of a higher price compared to the crops they were growing then but gradually the company started saying these gerkins don't meet the specifications so the price is reduced or there has been overproduction in some countries like Ghana and so the price is reduced and in a systematic manner the farmers end up losing the land also so it these mechanism is only going to further lead farmers into distress and dispossession of they would be dispossessed from their land that is the direction in which these policies are going right and finally with you I understand that the farmers organizations including the AIKS the AIW you you have of course opposed these amendments but you're also placing fresh demands to the government right now considering the state of the economy the state of agriculture during this COVID-19 crisis so could you talk a bit about what the key demands are see one is the losses in harvesting and we have already spoken compared to the last year 53 lakh tons of wheat lesser than last year is what has arrived in the market so while there was a 11% increase in acreage of wheat so despite that the arrivals in market are so drastically it has reduced so in such a circumstance where all sections have lost income income support is something required we had initially demanded 7500 for all non tax paying poor people including tenant farmers agriculture workers farmers and so on later all organizations of farmers decided 10000 at least per month that is one loan waiver is another and under the NREGA at least 200 days of work with 600 rupees wages or when there is no work unemployment wage should be given these have been if you say three major demands these are the demands that we have put across we have planned a series of protest actions on these owns there have been some protests earlier maybe I can speak about some of those right so could you talk a bit about those also because especially at this point of time how are farmers and agriculture workers coming out when there is even it may not be a full lockdown but there are two restrictions in place see in the utilizing the lockdown scenario the government is pursuing anti-farm or anti-worker bills and ordinances are being brought in so we have also as organizations of the peasantry and with the working class we have in a united manner decided to mobilize the peasantry and the working class against these attacks big onslaught on the likelihood of peasantry and the working class so we from April 21st onwards initially at the doorstep we had protests in which across the country more than 10 lakh people are reported to have participated so now we had along with the 250 other organizations the all-india kishan sangha's coordination committee we have had protests and the trade unions have had protests in which we have actively supported now we are planning in the end of july a campaign before that and letters would be sent to the president of india prime minister and others with the enlisting our demands and on august 9th we are planning for a militant protest across the country august 9th is the quit india anniversary of the quit india resolution and the quit india day programs so we have earlier had in 2018 also on quit india day we have had nationwide jail borough program now we are planning to have a militant program on august 9th we have also burned the three ordinances and the electricity act this happened in more than 3000 centers across the country earlier if you remember the land acquisition ordinance was brought that was also we began by burning the ordinance the government was dismissive of these protests but in the end after trying to bring the it in the parliament three times they had to finally withdraw it we are confident by building up this united struggles we will ensure these conspiracy against the present cultivation against the working class we will successfully defeat this this plan of the government thank you so much juju for talking to us that's all your time for the day keep watching news game