 We will go over to another centre. Is Bhagwan Parshuram College? First I would like to congratulate you to bring out a platform for almost 10,000 teachers all together for effective learning. But sir, I have a request that kindly put up the session according to learning because something has been messed up during the course of this one week. Learning procedures should also be there with the active learning of the teacher. Because teacher fatality that are being there are not coming all together from IITs. So there is a lot of discrepancy in terms of learning among the teachers as well. It's a good point that you make. Do you have any suggestion on how should we go about it? Over to you again. Yes sir. Sir, last time we had a workshop on databases. Now similar type of workshop could be arranged for programming where the session could be multitude with the active learning. Because most of the teacher are coming through the platform where they had the traditional learning. So to imbibe the active learning may not be possible all together. Sir. Thank you so much. I think we will try to see how we can combine. I will be requesting process either a year and process Hanna Murthy in fact to help us fashion our future workshop such that we include active learning in the workshop for teachers themselves. Good suggestion. Thank you so much. Annamacharya Institute of Technology. I am Lakshmi Narayana from Annamacharya Institute of Technology and Sciences Rajamped. You are conducted a very good program and sponsored by M.H.R.D. This program is very useful for engineering college students, engineering college faculty and students. And I am asking the question sir. Having disadvantage with Gotu, why still Gotu is used in C programming? That is my first question sir. And second question, why pointers are eliminated in Java programming? Interesting questions both. The first question is it is wrong to say Gotu is used in C programming. It is the correct statement to make is Gotu is available in C programming language. But the availability of a feature need not mean that it is used as a matter of fact. For many years now, I have not come across a single C or C++ program which has a Gotu statement used. So, while this statement exists, number one, we should try and avoid discussion of that statement at all. Because as you have seen now, construction of most algorithms does not require us to use that Gotu. Gotu in fact is useful only to illustrate how an iteration work, how the control moves around and so on. However, if you will notice, there is a series of statement such as continue statement, break statement. These are effectively Gotus. You may not know it, but many, many years ago when there was a huge debate on structured programming versus efficient programming, Professor Diestra wrote his famous paper called Gotu statement considered harmful. And to that, Professor Donald Kanuth of Stanford responded saying that A, if you want to write efficient code, then without using Gotu statement, it is impossible to guarantee better efficiency. Of course, in those days, we are talking about reducing the number of executions of instructions in a program which was so critical because computers were so slow. That does not hold good now. But Professor Donald Kanuth also pointed out an important thing. He said that while people say do not use Gotu statement, they use things like continue, break, etcetera, etcetera. It appears to me that people want to go to places without saying Gotu. That was a very interesting observation. Coming back to your question and the current status, I think it is not correct to tell our students that Gotu statement is used in C programming language. It should generally be avoided. If at all it is to be mentioned, you should say that it exists, but its usage is not recommended. That is at least the current way of looking at programming. Thank you so much. Tejpur University, Tejpur. Sir, on behalf of the all participants, we congratulate you and just we propose our sincere thanks to coordinate this program and that program was very helpful for us. And even we have learned so many things related to active learning teaching methods. And really it was very useful for us. Our colleague Dr. Dojit Das is having one question for you, sir. Yes, please go ahead. Hello, sir. I am Dr. Ruzi Sharma. And the question that I had is it is related to turtle. Because whenever we want to draw something in simple CPP, what happens is that turtle comes up. Is there a way that we can hide the turtle or change, also change the shape and size of the turtle? That's a very interesting observation. I think Professor Ranade and his team designed that turtle because they wanted it to look like a turtle. But suppose we want to make it only a dot or some red circle, small circle or something. Is that what you had in mind? Exactly, sir. And also can be hide it also sometimes. Okay. So modify turtle shape and hide turtle shape. I will tell you, you can actually make an interesting project to do this itself. Because the simple CPP package has been open sourced by Professor Ranade. We shall actually be putting it up on the JIT hub and will be announcing it in this forum also. So that the entire source code will be available to you. And you and your students who don't like the present turtle shape can make it into a circle, make it into a lift, make it look like a joker or make it disappear. It's all your choice but you will have to modify the code and recompile simple CPP. What I will try and do is, I think the point you make is excellent because sometimes when our students are executing simple CPP program and they are looking at the graphics as the pictures are drawn, their eyes and mind may wrongly get focused on that red rectangle rather than the shape that is being drawn. So you are very right. Thank you for this observation. I will see if we can give at least alternate choices of shapes in the simple CPP package so that it could be parameterized. You could choose a parameter and then it will show that shape. Making turtle disappear is interesting. I don't think Professor Ranade is going to like his favorite turtle disappearing completely from the package. But we will see how exactly we do that. Thank you so much for your input. Loyola ICAM College of Engineering. Sir, we are very happy with this workshop, sir. And I thank NAMI City and MHRD for providing this workshop. And I thank you and Professor Ranade, Professor Tannan Mogudale, Professor Mukta Atre, Professor Jayatandayatanday and technical team like Sachin Dixit and Sushant. And the outcome of the workshop is very excellent. And many participants have did many animations in simple CPP like insertion sort and swapping up to numbers like that. Many applications have developed by our participants. And what my suggestion is we need to have more team assignments. Like I have attended the coordinator workshop. In that coordinator workshop, the team assignments has been presented throughout the projector. Likewise, I need my participants to in future workshop. So we will ask the participant to present their projects. I am actually very pleasantly surprised and very happy to note that your participants have gone out of the way to do more things than what was expected officially. It is very good that your people have tried to build small animations and so on. What I would like to do is to take this opportunity to suggest all participants across the country. Please note the following. The submissions, etcetera, requirement which are being defined here are primarily being defined to fulfill two things, two requirements. One is that formally completing defined tasks such that we can officially issue people the certificate is one requirement. The second requirement is as part of the workshop people should indeed do some activities like this together. That was the second issue. However, what input has come from Loyola is that like in Loyola, there will be at many other places participants who would have tried something fancy on their own, who would have come up with something and they would like to formally continue doing that. So let me think of how to do it. I will probably announce a separate forum on the Moodle for all such participants or all the groups which want to go beyond their brief and do something more. I would request all participants at Loyola if they have built some small interesting animation, they will be excellent sample programs for all of us teachers. So if you feel like you can work for a few days more collaboratively spanning across teams if required and put that up as an additional submission, I will create a link by today evening which is called bonus submission link. The bonus submission link is for participants of the type that he mentioned. They either individually or in teams can submit any interesting thing that they have done either an example or a problem or a program that they have solved and that they should submit on this so-called bonus link. I will consolidate all such submissions over the next one month and put them for the benefit of all of you. It's an excellent suggestion. Thank you so much. Kurukshetra University. Myself Chandradivakar, on behalf of RCID 1300, I want to thank you and your team for organizing such innovative and qualitative workshops on programming. Each participant have enjoyed art of teamwork, activity like EPS and peer instruction will be helpful for all participants from effective or effective teaching learning process. Through a view, I also want to thank two more workshop coordinator, Dr. Sovik Viswas from Kolkata and Dr. Vinod Kumar Upalapu from Kakinada. Thank you for the compliments. I am happy that your colleagues and participants there enjoyed this workshop. Let's go over to Apex Institute of Technology. I am Siddharth Neelavani. There is a little confusion about the course topic. Instead of it being computer programming, had it been programming pedagogy or computer programming teaching methods, something like that, then a lot of confusion would have been removed because most of the participants were expecting something about programming teaching methods like that kind of thing. And one of my colleagues is also having a question. Hello, sir. Good morning. I am Ajay Anand. And I was just looking at what we have all studied in this workshop. Like we started with MOOC. We wrote transcripts. We learned how to dub video lectures. We reviewed presentations, test questions, active learning and peer-to-peer interaction. We set questions on various complexity, including a project proposal. We studied simple CPP to introduce students to programming, pointers, file input, output, et cetera. Overall, the workshop was good. And I was particularly impressed by simple CPP and how it can really ignite interest in the students. Still, I don't see an imminent objective in this. I'm not able to connect these individual dots. Can you help me with that? I'm happy you point this out. This course, this workshop was constructed by us to convey to all of you a large number of different experiments that we are doing. And many of us are trying to do them together. The connecting of the dots, as you rightly point out, is a work in progress. It is not something that we have perfected already. But we were so enthused by the results that we got after doing each of these things individually. Some faculty member trying a fifth classroom. Some faculty member trying simple CPP. Some faculty member like me trying take home test that we felt that as we go ahead and experiment with these things collectively in our own courses starting from the next semester, it may be useful for a large number of participants. Please also appreciate that teaching itself is a creative art. And we would like every teacher to follow one's own method of teaching. So while you are very right that there is something missing in terms of connecting these dots. But my answer again I will reiterate, connecting these dots is an unfinished work. It is a work in progress. The objective here was to expose all the colleague teachers across the country with various useful experiments that have been done with various useful techniques that have been tried. And then let it be with the teachers individually to decide what they think can be best used in their own teaching. So that is the limited objective that we had today. But I believe that in about 6 months to a year from now when different teachers like you have tried something and given us their feedback. Plus the large scale MOOCs initiative that the government of India is taking, within one year we should be able to see a connected picture of all these things. So that is my answer to it. I hope that is satisfactory. But I appreciate your observation that there are a lot of dots. But it was by design. It was not by default. It was by design that we wanted to discuss a variety of things which we felt were useful in teaching programming. Srisanth Gajarnan Maharaj College. This is Dhotri from Srisanth Gajarnan Maharaj College of Engineering, Shehgaon. Sir, we are really happy that you have conducted this workshop for all our teachers. And really we enjoyed this pedagogical technique and definitely I assure you that, on behalf of our colleagues, that we are going to use these techniques in the classrooms. Especially, sir, I think we are sure the technique is very nice and definitely it will be very useful to for the students as well as to convey the concept to the students. Thank you. Thank you, sir. Thank you very much. Say Ramakrishna Institute of Technology. I am Professor K. T. Varadarajan, HOD IT department of Sri Ramakrishna Institute of Technology. My question is that regarding the compiler, where is it, where it is being stored, whether it is in the HOD disk or in the RAM? Second question is you have given a fantastic the morning you have given the fantastic lecture by Kuduram Tumbo method that indicates what is happening inside the processor. That is adding process what is happening like that for each and every program we are able to give an animation that is C program and C plus program how it is acting inside the processor it will be giving a very good knowledge to the students, the first year students. So, in future if it is possible you can adopt this method for teaching process and I also appreciate your activity you are tireless you have worked for 3 hours to 4 hours daily and you are able to communicate almost all the things which are relevant to the C and C plus program on behalf of the SRIT staff members and behalf of the management and principal I thank you very much Professor and these are the questions my questions please answer to my questions thank you Thank you Professor Varadrajan as far as your first question is concerned a compiler like any other program ordinarily resides on the desk but whenever compilation process has to happen the compiler is loaded inside the memory the compiler then reads your program compiles it and leaves the memory for your program to run so the compilers where it is residence is not important ordinarily like any other file it is a executable file which resides on the desk but during compilation process it resides in the memory so that is the answer to the first question I really I am pleased to see that you like the dumbo animation for introducing the architecture of the computer I have found that very useful in my earlier offering decades ago I used to draw this dumbo as a hand drawn caricature on a piece of paper and show it but today the technology is available by which I can create an animation I do agree with you that such animations are useful but when it comes to discussing the behavior of slightly larger C++ or C programs or for that matter programs in any language this kind of animation through a caricature may or may not be very useful instead what we are trying to build is animation showing what happens to the data for example when an array is sorted you write a sorting program when you go through steps of that sorting program what is happening to different array elements it is nice if people can visualize it many people have written such animations and what I will do is combine your suggestion of using a dumbo like caricature and the need for people to understand how for example elements move in an array during the sorting algorithm and try to put a composite animation where dumbo is standing on the background he is moving elements of the array and the elements are taking shape becoming sorted and on the right hand side you show the C++ program where a pointer shows which instruction is being executed and what is happening to it to some extent this kind of thing can be actually shown in an in an integrated development environment for example in simple CPP itself if your colleagues explore it further there is a debug option and there is a step option in the debug option you can set certain variable values to be shown at every step and then if you ask the student to step through that algorithm it will execute one by one exactly like dumbo does and in that window you can see the changing value of the variable but I agree with you that a full-fledged animation is a far more powerful tool for people to understand easily I'll keep that in mind and try to construct some composite animation thank you we go over to Maulana Azal National Institute good afternoon sir this is Atal Gupta so as you have mentioned many times that C language has not been designed to teach as an introductory program language and what I know about that is in other universities are offering this Java as an introductory program language so I would like to know about your opinion that which language should be used to talk for the pressures in the first year well first I will give you my personal opinion and then I will give you what is I call the common wisdom my personal opinion is C language is somewhat inadequate in introducing computer programming to students then use of Java is actually more horrible and I'll tell you the reason why I feel so Java is a beautiful language by the way and very large practical code is written in Java and most probably it is very essential for all of our students to learn Java eventually but here we are talking about the first course in programming the first course in programming and this is not only my opinion but the opinion of a very large number of expert teachers I am not talking about programming expert but expert teachers that the first course on programming should emphasize learning of procedural programming Java is an object oriented programming language you cannot even start talking about Java without talking about objects without talking about classes and without talking about method if you start with that kind of lingo it often would confuse students in fact invariably wherever good computer science computer programming teaching happens the first course is always a course which emphasizes procedural programming now the fact that C has a very cockeyed syntax is the only problem but in so far as teaching basic concepts is concerned you can use that I do not know in fact I do not understand how some universities even in India have Java programming as the first course I really wonder how students make mental model of basic algorithms in their minds when they learn using that so that is my answer this is notwithstanding anything about Java as I said Java is a beautiful language by the way I just remember one thing there was a question which was asked by some other colleague and which I did not answer this was about why there are no pointers in Java I will take this opportunity to answer that question for all of us explicit usage of pointers is always considered a very dangerous thing and that is because of the reasons that many of our colleagues have mentioned time and again there are dangling pointers there are pointers which are null pointers and all kinds of problems ensue and that is because not there is something wrong with pointers but it is not easy to handle pointers professionally and meticulously you have to be very careful while handling pointers Java programming language from the inception to ensure that such difficulties are not faced with a programmer that is why the pointer does not exist in Java is not an accident it is a design the designers of Java programming language felt that it is an arduous responsibility on the heads of programmers to keep worrying about the pointers what they rightly said is people want to deal with objects directly why do they need something to point to something to point to something they should be able to do it without the inconvenience of pointers that is the reason I see professor Gupta that you have something additional to comment on please go ahead I came to know that ID Bombay has taken a lot of initiative to develop open source software for example Sylab which can substitute Matlab which is very costly software and I think this is the right platform where you are interacting with so many people across the country to tell about something about those initiatives and to encourage them to use this kind of software so this is just my comment and I really hope that this such an effort should be highly acknowledgable and we should say we are giving purchasing these very costly software Thank you so much Professor Gupta this is IPS Academy at Indore Very good afternoon sir I have two questions you talked about conditional execution and sequential execution the question is how they are related to if and go to statement which we use in Fortran are they similar analogous to those two statements are different Thank you sir There are exactly analogous in fact the conditional execution paradigm of C and the syntax of C is different in Fortran you would implement the conditional execution using F and of course unfortunately you have to use go to by the way I think you are talking about the old versions of Fortran which both of us used in our early days if you look at the Fortran as it exists now Fortran provides complete facilities for a fully structured programming and in fact it is not essential for you at all to use any go to statement so I will conclude my interaction with that