 happening with human rights around our world on Think Tech Live, broadcasting from our downtown studio in Honolulu, Hawaii in Moana, New York. Today we're looking at South Sudan's driving for justice, looking at the Universal Declaration of Human Rights Article 17, right to property and land. Today I'm joined by students' organization for liberty and entrepreneurship, SOHO, and very excited to be able to meet with the executive director, as well as the communications of public relations officer. David, could you tell me why this issue is so important and what inspired you to first get involved in South Sudan on this important topic? Thank you so much, Jiswa. To be honest, the emblem of South Sudan looks at justice, liberty, and prosperity. When you look at the flag of South Sudan, that's what it entails at all. The human right is also one of the things the country fought for, for the cessation from Sudan, my dad, from South Sudan. So it's a way back story of South Sudanese fighting for the right to be independent. And on that matter, I look at the human right in South Sudan not being respected. I look at that aspect of individual liberty, which is not yet granted in the country, land ownership. These are issues that when you move to any court, you get them frequently on the court cases. This prompted me to contribute to the liberation of the country by promoting human rights in the country. And for sure, that has been what has been behind, the motive behind me joining this movement, so that I can accomplish the ideology that was put in place for this country to succeed from Sudan to South Sudan, and of which I have to also do my contribution. When this was happening, I had no chance of contributing to this new nation of South Sudan. And I thought that instead of asking more from South Sudan, I have to do something from South Sudan. And that is the reason why I have to join this movement. Thank you so much. Moving to my colleague, John, we know that the Universal Declaration of Human Rights provides the power of ideas to initiate change in the world, but also cultural and historical conditions challenge understanding of universality until deeper dialogues include and involve all of humanity, including most importantly, directly impacted people around the table for transformation. Can you share with us what inspired you to focus on this important issue, and why is this issue so important in international human rights law? Thank you so much for having me on this show. I'm so happy and glad to be here. First of all, it's very important that not only the human, the Universal Declaration of Human Rights, which stipulates that everyone has their own property, but even in the Constitutional South Sudan Part II, which is on the Human Rights Bill, Article Number 15 is also saying every woman has the right to own property in South Sudan. So both the Universal Declaration of Human Rights, also the Constitution of South Sudan, clearly tell us that women have the right to own property. But the most important, the very shocking thing which is happening in South Sudan is, regardless of this in the Constitution, the cultural practices and beliefs in South Sudan overrides the Constitution of South Sudan and even the Human Rights Declaration in the way that women in South Sudan are restricted according to the culture from owning the property. So you find that if a woman has stayed with her husband for many years and they get divorced, so there is no law in South Sudan that tells how much of this property the woman should take home. Or even if the husband dies, all the property belongs to the families of the deceased. So the woman is supposed to leave the house and go empty-handed. So imagine if the woman has stayed with her husband for 30 years, that's most of her active life. And eventually after the death of the husband, she leaves the house empty-handed. That means she is going to start life from zero. So with this, it's a contributing factor to promoting poverty in Africa. So that's why, for me as a women's rights activist, I do not sit down and see women being restricted. So that's why we have to stand up and then fight against these cultural beliefs and educate women so they can understand their rights and advocate for those rights so they can enjoy their rights. Thank you because Article 417 focuses on the important right to own property alone, which is significant, but also as well as an association with others. It also points out no one shall be arbitrarily deprived of one's property. And Article 17 ensures equality and an ability for people to have land to exercise self-determination and be able to provide for one's self-family and community necessities for a life of dignity. Can you share with us a bit how SOHO actualizes this article and what actions you're involved with Benjamin to promote and protect this right in South Sudan? Thank you so much, Yossia Coppa. The way SOHO engaged and promotes this right, we looked at occupying the women with the knowledge because if they don't have the knowledge, that is the basic. If they don't have the knowledge of their basic rights, they will not be able to claim for their rights. Like what John was saying, these are things that have been happening and even the men in power or the people in power know very well this is not supposed to happen. The constitution is very clear on this, but you still find these women are exposed and are subjected to this kind of counter on dehumanization, which of course SOHO has taken up an initiative of empowering these women to understand their human rights on land and property. And after owning land, what can they get them from this land to growth? And SOHO has come up with that initiative of giving capacity building to these women, not only to these two women who are being victims of this situation, but also to the authority, the men in power, the people in power to understand this is what they're supposed to do so that these women are protected. The sole responsibility of the authority government is to protect the right and properties of its civilians and that is one thing we know in them. We bring up this as a reminder that this is what we are all supposed to do. We keep these women, know their right to owning land and to use this land to generate wealth from it and that will lead to human growth and the economic growth of the country has went. So that's actually basically what SOHO is being to engage the victims, the people who are victims, to also make sure that we have these testimonies. These are people who are not heard, people who are not talking about what is happening to them. They are able to stand bold and say, this is what belongs to me because of the knowledge. We believe that knowledge is power. When we have the knowledge, we have the power and we can stand a chance of asking. And to be very honest on this matter, the judiciary system here which is supposed also to be a kind of an institution which is supposed to be giving the rights of the people is also has that oversight on that particular aspect of land property. And it allows us then to continue the conversation with John. You talked about it being outlined in the Universal Declaration of Human Rights but also in your own constitution. Can you share with us with South Sudan as one of the newest nations and members of the UN? How South Sudan still faces fundamental challenges to guarantee all human rights for all and how SOHO is organizing to be able to assist to make sure this is possible. Thank you so much. Currently in South Sudan, the problem is both the government knows very well that the rights of human rights on property is being violated. But yet it is nothing to be done on the ground, the side of the government to rectify this creation. So because of this, because of the sense of the government on this issue, that's why SOHO has set up a task for its children to stand together with some of the international organizations and some human rights activists as a wireness, also persuade the government to realize the intent of the rise of women which is being violated so that they can also stand up and defend the women's rights and property. So because of this, we as the members of SOHO, Student Organization for Liberty and Interpretation, we have created a very serious matter to bring to the attention of the government, to the attention of the world so that they can understand that the violation of property rights is still happening in the 21st century, even in a democratic country like South Sudan. So this is what we are doing at the moment, trying to raise awareness so that people can clear the risk of the women to whom their rights to property is being violated. Just as what David has said, we are also to empower these women so that they can also raise their voices. Not only the women, we are also trying to empower the men champions. We are forming some men channel groups who are also unknown women, supporting them to raise their voices so that the world and even the government can understand their pain and come to their decision. That's really important. And then of course that really builds on what we're sharing here, is that there's education, mobilization, and then realization to ensure this right. Can you share with us David, what are some of the campaigns to be able to change the conditions so that women are able to exercise the right to own property? And how is that being coordinated? Thank you so much, Kopa, for giving me this chance again. In South Sudan, there have been a lot of campaigns going on, one of which is run by a certain organization called the Guwata Mara. The Guwata Mara is an Arabic word which says the power of a woman. We also have the Mara base, Mara Saki. She's just a woman. Such campaigns are being done in South Sudan to empower women so that they can be able to stand and say, I also have the same power. It goes back to the gender equality, the equality we talk about always whereby we give that a woman should recognize that she has the power to do something. She has the power to claim for what the righteous belongs to her. And she has the power to do it, has also the other counterparts like the male partners do it. So that is, these are some of the campaigns going on in South Sudan in particular to empower women. And according to the constituents, the women have been given 25 percent sometimes. And now it is 35 percent where they have to be represented at all levels. And such campaigns are there to boost them, to give them that morale. And it gives them the space to talk on behalf of other women. That is, these are some of the campaigns going on in South Sudan. And if this is taken into consideration like having more women in power or having more women in events and exercises like this, it will lead to a better world where women are empowered and are able to demand or to claim for their rights. Excellent point. And we know that women hold up half the sky. And the points that you're sharing then are examples of empowerment that really in a way achieve the UN 2030 agenda as well of global goal number five of gender justice. John, can you share some more examples of these campaigns and coordinated actions to guarantee that women are full contributors to the community and to the new country of South Sudan? Thank you so much. Just like what the colleague there just said, those are some of the campaigns that happen in South Sudan and of which role is also part of it. One part I think that I would wish to put across is we are also to put a low proposal because this is a cultural aspect that particularly we are in our next move, we are writing a proposal that is supposed to be signed by the local leaders expressing their desire to support the rights of women. So we are working with a lawyer and also some of the key local leaders so that they can draft up a law expressing their position that they will submit to own property. And this is possible and if it is signed to law that means in every country South Sudan that violates the rights of women will always be referring to this document and upholding it to their best. The way we are coordinating this activity is we know that as so we cannot do much. What is we are trying to coordinate with some of the international organizations that support the property women property rights. We have been recently working with Atlas Network who are also one of our key partners supporting us in campaigning for the rights of women to own property and also conducting some TV shows like what we are doing currently one way of raising awareness, coordinating activities so the world can know what's happening in South Sudan. And also we have a strong radio connection that we basically focus on radio talk shows. Because with the radio talk shows we are able to reach wider audience and when we conduct workshops and the same so we have a strong relationship here with the radio stations where we go to normal radio stations and try to raise our awareness regarding the property rights of women and to have. Thank you and that builds of course very much so what was being mentioned earlier about the different activism and advocacy to really guarantee the listeners and with this we have been able to reach a very good audience on the radio. That's how we are to the media, the media of the media. We also coordinate with the media so that's what we are doing at the moment. In South Sudan we are doing the campaigns to raise more awareness regarding the property rights of women and we believe that is all we are able to do. That's why we bring in some international organizations, media so that we can be able to provide that community. Just as I said we are also working with partners like Atlas Network who are supporting us in raising awareness and also conducting TV shows like what we are doing at the moment in one way of coordinating the activities and trying to raise awareness so that we can know what's happening regarding property rights of women in South Sudan. Thank you and I know David you want to add something immediately before we get into the next aspect so please. Thank you so much. I just want to add something on what John was saying about our coordination mechanism and who we work with. We also leverage on the existing structures like the Royal Family Police where we have better connections with the queen of the land because in this part we have still a kingdom existing. We have about two kingdoms which are still existing. We leverage on such existing structures because they are vocal in the community and they also advocate for similar things which we together with them make sure that we voice it out and not only the kingdom we also look at existing structures that are influential in the community. People who are promoting such ideas in the community. We have a lot of structures like the First Lady herself is also leading campaigns that promote women in South Sudan. She has also been an avenue for us to make sure that we reach more women and give them capacity building and that's that. Thank you so much. We know the UDHR calls for a coalition of conscience sent around trust and transformation while honoring values, voice and vision and on the 75th anniversary it's important to reflect on the role of human rights in our daily lives and world affairs. Exploration of the right to property in Africa does into fundamental issues important to all around our planet and David if we continue on with what you were sharing you talked about parliament and people having seats in government to secure and also your colleague John shared about municipal actions to guarantee that local laws are in effect. Can you share in some ways the champions that are now creating a culture of human rights in Sudan and how you're able to partner together? Thank you so much. That's before we move ahead. I have to make a correction in the South Sudan. We already separated from Sudan. We have Sudan and then we have South Sudan. Like we said earlier, we have champions in parliament. We have champion in government where who are representing women in South Sudan and some of these women are holding executive positions in the government and are very vocal talking about the human right, more especially women right in conjunction with other UN agencies and other non-governmental organizations. They are really very vocal and they have pushed the country of South Sudan to also have a fair representation of women in the parliament and all even in the judiciary executive. They have pushed for this and at least now we have 35% of women representation in those positions in the government status. That is about South Sudan. Even when you look at the regional level like Uganda, other like Rwanda, Ethiopia, you find there's a lot of women in politics who are playing politics and they are encouraging gender equality and also the issue of women right and the right of women on property. It's something we have a lot of champions that we are able to mention like for South Sudan. The speaker for parliament is a woman and she's very vocal about women participation in politics. She leads the country in terms of empowering women to own property and more precisely the women right everywhere she goes and that is what is there and you find there are some governors who are women who are leading and are very vocal about this kind of activism we are talking about. So we have, I will call them hidden heroes because we have not published most of them in the country yet. Those are the ones that are already there and are being great thing for this country. Thank you and as we're talking about South Sudan it also reminds me how it's also a similar situation in the South Pacific where people in countries such as Tonga, the same situation happens where a woman is not allowed to inherit land yet her son would inherit the land if something happened to her partner and so even though we're talking about Africa and Oceania and different sides of the world John you can share how it's a common struggle for these basic rights and maybe expand a bit on the importance of women's rights around the world and how women's rights are human rights John. Thank you so much for helping me. Women's rights is very important on the one because one when we uphold the rights of women it's one way of encouraging upholding their dignity you know if a woman has the rights on the property and she holds the property and has the title deed to it so it promotes her dignity and also it allows her not to be very to give to the honorable because she knows that she has property and she can use this property to be able to put some food on the table for her kids so it's very important for us to promote her the property rights and also that when we promote the property of women rights around the world it's one way of empowering them to be self-reliant because in most cases in Africa women are looked at like people who dependant on men but when women own property so we find that the woman is able to stand on her own take care of her kids and even a partner and she is able to stay or to be on her own rather than be independent so that's why it's very important for us to promote the rights of women around the world so that not only men to get into the livelihood of the government of the family but both men and women are supposed to contribute to the livelihood of the community so that's why it's very important for us to support the property rights of women. Thank you so much and we know the UDHR article 17 ensures all are not arbitrarily deprived of property and all are able to own property alone and then associate with others to create that vital community shared and article 17 is one way people exercise their engagement for equality and guarantee good governance in every nation and global democracy for a collective planet. The people do desire dignity and are part of this global family for freedom and we appreciate you both sharing. Can you provide briefly a little bit about the future of the right in South Sudan? Thank you for having me again. I am seeing a bright future in human rights in South Sudan because everyone is talking about it everyone is getting empowered. One important thing that I believe is the people who are victims of these situations now are getting to understand and that is shaping already the future. We are predicting that there will be a good future because people will be informed of their basic human rights right to own land and their right to own properties. When they are informed they will be well prepared for the future. I appreciate that so much. It begins with being informed and then being able to influence the institutions and then having an impact in everyone's daily life. John, can you share with us your vision for the future of the right? The vision of the rights of the land in South Sudan is bright because one is they are just owning the project. They are the victims and they know how thankful it is to live with that property. So we believe that as we are involving them we are creating more awareness, we are educating them and also the fact that we are using other stakeholders like the law enforcement agencies, other international organizations, government organizations. We are trying to raise awareness that we are involving them in these activities. So because of these we believe that these stakeholders will understand why it's important for us to have the rights of women to be at hand in South Sudan. So as soon as they understand it and they are empowered and because of the champion groups that we are forming they will be able to stand on their own and advocate for rights to own property and we believe once they own their property they will use this property as collateral to start their own business and then they will be able to stand on their own. So it's one way of encouraging them to know their rights to property and also one way to empowering them to be a self-reliant. Thank you so much and we know it's so vital that South Sudan was able to gain its independence becoming one of the newest nations at the UN but that the struggle does not end with that act of self-determination but that we're all committed to still make sure that human rights are for all in your country when men and women are treated equally and that everyone has this important right of Article 17 the right to own property. Thank you both for sharing and more importantly what you do on a daily basis in South Sudan for a bright future for this new nation. Thank you.